Optimist rig/sails, Why not? Options

[Speng]

IODA class has design comp for new sails at http://www.optiworld.org/sailcompetition.pdf
my question is what's wrong with the "How it will not finish!" rig/sailplan?OK maybe it is a bit extreme but why is is that the most popular intro class in the world chooses such an anachronistic rig? A kid'll probably never sail a gaff rigger again so why chould the first boat they sail have one.

Thoughts, comments?

[JimC]

my question is what's wrong with the "How it will not finish!" rig/sailplan?

Sure its a stupid rig, but if you change it radically the whole Oppy world has to throw away all their existing spars and sails within a few weeks of each other because there's no chance you'd be able to come up with a more conventional riig that wouldn't be seen as either faster or slower. If it were slower it would have to be made compulsory else no-one would migrate, if faster then everyone would feel it necessary to migrate immediately anyway.

[European Bloke]

The boat sits upside down in the dinghy park, without a cover and doesn’t seem to get old and the spars and sail fit in the car.

[Peacefrog]

I say leave it alone!

[Captain Graybear...]

I don't understand why you'd want anything different. My 6 year old loves her opti and the gaff rig sail won't overpower the boat so I don't have to worry about plucking the kids out of the water when they flip over. Sure the class has really gone overboard with the liquid cooled turbo charged spars and (this is the one that I really like) a carbon hiking stick (WTF?), but the boat is a very simple, safe, reliable tool to teach the wee ones.

Besides, the competition is for a new SAIL design not a new rig design. The new sail has to be of woven cloth and fit on the existing spars too, so I don't think it will be that much of a radical departure from the present.

And SPENG, my kids just sailed on a gaff rig this winter......stern steerer iceboat. How bout that, a gaff rig that'll do 50!

[BeachbumII]

Hmm. Gaf rig is not the only odd thing in optimist. Why not change the hull so that the kids dont have tho bail out water all the time. While we are at it we could also change the hullshape so that the boat would go dry upwind.

And European bloke got it NAIL on.

[edboat]

As I recall Clark Mills designed the boat to be built out of 2 sheets of plywood. This was to keep the cost down to $50. It was meant to be an inexpensive boat for the local Optimist Club is use for kids. I also recall Clark donatated the design and never got a dime for it.

[us7070]

the gaf rig twists and depowers extremely effectively, and in that sense is more "modern" than you might think. look at the various "square-top" sails, including windsurf race sails, the top batten is effectively a gaff.

the main problem i see with the rig is the non-one-design nature. there are so many different spars and sails available - some of which are quite expensive - that the boat is not a one-design class.

a kid's first racing boat should be a strict one-design.

[michael-compwest]

........I beleive the competition is just for a updated SAIL to fit the existing spars,no??

[oldskool]

........I beleive the competition is just for a updated SAIL to fit the existing spars,no??

That's how I read it.

LEAVE IT THE SAME!! it's worked for the history of the boat, why f@ck with it?

[Andy P]

The oppie rig is very tricky to set up and use properly - but if you can sail an oppie well, and understand rig tune, this knowledge transfers to almost every other boat.

[Laser180481]

To answer your question, How it will Not Finish! is wrong because there have been major modifications to the exsisting spars which is clearly stated as a restriction in the competition.

I think Optis are great boats and there are a ridiculous amount of them anywhere you go which is why they've never been replaced. A kid almost anywhere can find an Opti and join a local fleet. We need Optis to get kids into racing if we want our sport to grow. Afterall, the youth is our future and blah blah blah...


However, I think that the Optimist class is one of the loosest OD classes ever. There are a ridiculous amount of upgrades and a world championship winning optimist can hit 5 figures! These are kids we're talking about! Do they really need anymore changes??....

[Kevlar Edge]

new Radial sails were introduced this year, nice improvement, leave everything else alone, it ain't broke............... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[twister]

The oppie rig is very tricky to set up and use properly - but if you can sail an oppie well, and understand rig tune, this knowledge transfers to almost every other boat.

Agree 100%. This is the reason nothing should be changed.

[Captain Bastard]

Take a plunge into the A Scow thread to see why you shouldn't depart from OD.

[Altered Egos]

new Radial sails were introduced this year, nice improvement, leave everything else alone, it ain't broke............... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Radial sails are not new, I had one in the late 80's!

[Guest Anarchist 32057_*]

Opti class insists on fixing things not broken. If I read the proposal correctly they are trying to one design the sail design.
Most classes have a very small wiindow of crew weight that is competitive. An Opti is expected to carry kids weighing between 60#s and 120#s and have them compete equally. That's a lot to ask.
Sails are designed fuller or flatter to provide more or less power as needed. Spars are designed to be stiffer or softer for the same reason. That is the way one boat can handle so many different sized kids.
One sail design will be too full or too flat for someone.

[Kiss my RS]

new Radial sails were introduced this year, nice improvement, leave everything else alone, it ain't broke............... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Radial sails are not new, I had one in the late 80's!

Radial sails are changing all the time. The latest switch to a much softer leach (than the previous mark 5 sail) pushed me out of radials for good - became too heavy. I also had a mark 4 sail before the mark 5 and I think all they changed from that was the material of construction.
The mark 6 is I believe still the current sail and has many neat features to lower the competetive weight needed to sail the boat.

Anyway the sail changes; but they don't change its size or how many battens it has and stuff. Why bother with the oppy? With around 300 or so boats at their UK nationals alone it seems to be in no need of updating!

[Speng]

Just throwing it out there. I have no vested interest in Optis aas I'm too big to sail one and have no kids. From the doc they mentioned that the rig has recently been modified (thru a similar process to what they're doing now for the sails) has this made a lot of difference or are old boats still competitive?

Anybody have experience with or links to information about building an Opti and info about how expensive etc? I've been thinking about proposing to my sailing club that we build a bunch of optis for our youngest sailors. I'd also heard that there's a variety of options, parts, builders etc that can take for mild to wild in terms of cost/complexity.

[Vachon]

http://www.optiworld.org/epoxy.html

[Damn Yankee]

new Radial sails were introduced this year, nice improvement, leave everything else alone, it ain't broke............... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Radial sails are not new, I had one in the late 80's!

Radial sails are changing all the time. The latest switch to a much softer leach (than the previous mark 5 sail) pushed me out of radials for good - became too heavy. I also had a mark 4 sail before the mark 5 and I think all they changed from that was the material of construction.
The mark 6 is I believe still the current sail and has many neat features to lower the competetive weight needed to sail the boat.

Anyway the sail changes; but they don't change its size or how many battens it has and stuff. Why bother with the oppy? With around 300 or so boats at their UK nationals alone it seems to be in no need of updating!

The problem with radial sails is that they are more expensive to build.

[Kevlar Edge]

yeah $400 for an opti sail is kinda silly (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

[Guest Anarchist SeaDrive_*]

I thought they were going to a brigantine rig:
http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/05/design...ntine/index.cfm