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      A Few Simple Rules   05/22/2017

      Sailing Anarchy is a very lightly moderated site. This is by design, to afford a more free atmosphere for discussion. There are plenty of sailing forums you can go to where swearing isn't allowed, confrontation is squelched and, and you can have a moderator finger-wag at you for your attitude. SA tries to avoid that and allow for more adult behavior without moderators editing your posts and whacking knuckles with rulers. We don't have a long list of published "thou shalt nots" either, and this is by design. Too many absolute rules paints us into too many corners. So check the Terms of Service - there IS language there about certain types of behavior that is not permitted. We interpret that lightly and permit a lot of latitude, but we DO reserve the right to take action when something is too extreme to tolerate (too racist, graphic, violent, misogynistic, etc.). Yes, that is subjective, but it allows us discretion. Avoiding a laundry list of rules allows for freedom; don't abuse it. However there ARE a few basic rules that will earn you a suspension, and apparently a brief refresher is in order. 1) Allegations of pedophilia - there is no tolerance for this. So if you make allegations, jokes, innuendo or suggestions about child molestation, child pornography, abuse or inappropriate behavior with minors etc. about someone on this board you will get a time out. This is pretty much automatic; this behavior can have real world effect and is not acceptable. Obviously the subject is not banned when discussion of it is apropos, e.g. talking about an item in the news for instance. But allegations or references directed at or about another poster is verboten. 2) Outing people - providing real world identifiable information about users on the forums who prefer to remain anonymous. Yes, some of us post with our real names - not a problem to use them. However many do NOT, and if you find out someone's name keep it to yourself, first or last. This also goes for other identifying information too - employer information etc. You don't need too many pieces of data to figure out who someone really is these days. Depending on severity you might get anything from a scolding to a suspension - so don't do it. I know it can be confusing sometimes for newcomers, as SA has been around almost twenty years and there are some people that throw their real names around and their current Display Name may not match the name they have out in the public. But if in doubt, you don't want to accidentally out some one so use caution, even if it's a personal friend of yours in real life. 3) Posting While Suspended - If you've earned a timeout (these are fairly rare and hard to get), please observe the suspension. If you create a new account (a "Sock Puppet") and return to the forums to post with it before your suspension is up you WILL get more time added to your original suspension and lose your Socks. This behavior may result a permanent ban, since it shows you have zero respect for the few rules we have and the moderating team that is tasked with supporting them. Check the Terms of Service you agreed to; they apply to the individual agreeing, not the account you created, so don't try to Sea Lawyer us if you get caught. Just don't do it. Those are the three that will almost certainly get you into some trouble. IF YOU SEE SOMEONE DO ONE OF THESE THINGS, please do the following: Refrain from quoting the offending text, it makes the thread cleanup a pain in the rear Press the Report button; it is by far the best way to notify Admins as we will get e-mails. Calling out for Admins in the middle of threads, sending us PM's, etc. - there is no guarantee we will get those in a timely fashion. There are multiple Moderators in multiple time zones around the world, and anyone one of us can handle the Report and all of us will be notified about it. But if you PM one Mod directly and he's off line, the problem will get dealt with much more slowly. Other behaviors that you might want to think twice before doing include: Intentionally disrupting threads and discussions repeatedly. Off topic/content free trolling in threads to disrupt dialog Stalking users around the forums with the intent to disrupt content and discussion Repeated posting of overly graphic or scatological porn content. There are plenty web sites for you to get your freak on, don't do it here. And a brief note to Newbies... No, we will not ban people or censor them for dropping F-bombs on you, using foul language, etc. so please don't report it when one of our members gives you a greeting you may find shocking. We do our best not to censor content here and playing swearword police is not in our job descriptions. Sailing Anarchy is more like a bar than a classroom, so handle it like you would meeting someone a little coarse - don't look for the teacher. Thanks.


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About Steveromagnino

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  • Birthday April 28

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    Bangkok, Thailand
  1. We have raced against a First Class a few years ago a few times, that is right on the cusp of being too slow to really be a sportsboat except on a tight reach; it carries an asym kite, maybe it has the ability to use a sym kite as well, it probably would need it downwind as it can't really get up and plane unless the wind is quite decent (maybe 18?+) The j80 is also pretty conservative too. However, it all depends on the people and the conditions, if you get at least 18 knots then either will be fun, and anyhow, one design is always fun.
  2. Cool achievement, Thailand has a very strong opti program (former world champion Noppakao Poonpat beat all the girls and boys in the worlds a few years back)....particularly the girls are relatively small so they are able to stay in the class a little longer than the western countries tend to, and the cost of the boats is not so high, so there is high participation. Sadly, that kind of falls away a bit as the kids end up in more expensive classes after the opti so a lot of the good sailors (who tend to be from the Navy families in Sattahip) start to fall by the wayside a bit, as is common in most countries, but maybe even more common here. it is sailing across the Gulf of Thailand, so that's completely open water out there, it's nowhere near the coast, often prone to big rain squalls, and the seas can be pretty monsterous out there, His Majesty did it originally in the OK Dinghy he built himself, an optimist is so much smaller and slower....it's a pretty decent undertaking. There have been a few sails back and forth (I know people who have done it on windsurfers etc) and there was a sail across with many dinghies a few years ago, but I don't think anyone did it in an opti before. Congratulations N'June!
  3. Fiery Cross designed by Jim Young was a 45 foot long canter built and raced in 1957. Young says he got the idea of Herreshoff, but anyhow MINIs were the first to really start using them a lot though, as Fiery was not allowed to race with the keel canted after she showed how much faster it was to do so. No Aussie, Young is a fair dinkum Kiwi. Same designer was the first to produce a fast 12 foot cat (raced as a 12 foot skiff until it was banned) in the Qs; first mega wide sportsyacht (extreme); probably the most prolific of the skiff style sportsboat/race yacht designers a true legend.
  4. the one with the foil in the water type was sailing when we were in Switzerland commissioning a couple of the 650s there a few years back. It is either the Quant 28 one above or another one I recall was 30 feet long and super narrow, very well thought out - I doubt a 650 could hold onto it (with or without the foils), it looked (we never lined up against it specifically) faster on the water than what we were in a bit of breeze. As you would expect, it's a much longer boat with a big rig on it. The earlier Brace Brace Brace Welbourne 25 one off boat from HK, the time we raced it in Pattaya which was a relatively windier regatta (12-30 knots) we were able to finish ahead of it some of the time (sometimes 1, sometimes all 3 shaws in front of it on line), mostly because upwind it has a lot of righting moment with the wings and and would usually be pretty quick to the top mark, but downwind the short chop meant it would regularly be going down the mine then due to the tiny bulb, took them a while to get it back upright again. In a 2 sail reach side by side, we sailed past it more than once between races, because that's one of the angles the 650 is fairly quick at. Mostly though, it was as quick or quicker side by side, as you would hope for a boat that is 1m longer and with more righting moment, but I'd imagine a larger 650 (like Custard Truck or Animal Biscuits) would have been quicker again. In those conditions, I suspect the DSS foil on that boat was making the boat slower with it than without in those steep sea conditions downwind for sure, and maybe even upwind as well, the owner is a tinkerer and a pilot so for him I think it was the academic challenge to make it work. The later DSS foils I am told were much better at handling these conditions. The 23 full flying one though I think it a different category, not sure you'd expect the 650 to be competitive against it once it was foiling, it's running traps and is a full carbon build plus it's a little longer. However, sail it in the same conditions as Brace Brace Brace and again it would be a question of whether you could keep the boat on its feet. The moths and AMCUP boats now seem to have it mastered. In terms of cost and simplicity, though, the 650 and the DSS foiler are very different. Both awesome boats IMHO but quite a lot more 'stuff' I would imagine to handle in the foiler. Price also very different. I suppose it would be possible to use a 650 as a platform to foil with a bit of strengthening and changes to the internals, however the easier things to make a 650 faster some of which the Quant already has would be reduce the bulb, run wires and put 3 crew on them. That then makes the boat faster...but then you start to get to the point where it reduces the boat from sportsboat to beach dinghy with the potential to capsize, regatta elibility, rating eligibility etc. I disagree with that concept, if you want the full foiling experience the Quant 23 is there. But its a different market, same as a foiling moth and the musto skiff are different markets.
  5. keen as! Hope we can have an ok rating system and a decent number of boats to enjoy some good sailing and fun :-)
  6. Would guess it's probably going to be made in Thailand, alongside the other RS boats, by renowned builder CMI who build Nacras and RS dinghies. It's a very interesting boat for sure, could be something that would make me consider dinghies again....lots to like about it!
  7. depends on the brand and source; the Shaws in Australia are raced (in one case Indecent Haste) 3-4 days a week consistently almost the whole year for 2.5 years now, and the EVA is still mostly fine (from what I know). but I would say changing it every 3 years is probably ideal The newer stuff we are using which is identical in pattern to Starboard windsurfers (same supplier) with a heavier density should last even a little better than that. Because the Shaw 650s are designed to have an EVA deck from the beginning rather than it being a retrofit, it's maybe easier since the panels are all cut and planned out so even a moron like me can lay them down. I can imagine some other boats might be more difficult to handle Also it is fair to say our boats you don't have to run around and move all over the show, because it is only a short little boat, everything controlled from the cockpit and sailing only with 3 or 4 and hiking legs in, plus the boat doesn't go bow down downwind; less well balanced/more crew/ bigger boats the amount of wear and tear on the deck would increase as you have people running around all over the place Also people doing idiot stuff on board dragging engines, anchors, multitools, etc across the deck, wearing golf shoes on board, being from Australia*, that sort of thing - will tear the EVA up a fair bit more quickly. *why? because Aussies are well known for being abrasive (for all non Aussies to laugh) * why? because Aussies are very sharp (for all Aussies to feel proud that they are sharp, or an 'ideas man')
  8. We use EVA decking on the Shaw 650s; so far the owners seem pretty happy with it; I cannot comment on other boats, but for us, the stuff lasts fairly long (several seasons), is comfortable and helps with reducing deck denting a little while also being more sticky to stay on your feet than typical production boat gelboat pattern attempts at antislip which mostly are slipperier than you would want. As we build the boats with EVA from the start, the decklayup also has some ways to save minor minor amounts of weight too; although I'd say foam is heavier than paint equivalent. Foam also is good on the shaws for helping protect the wings a little more as well, since these tend to rub wharves and other boats and so on. Peeling it off and replacing it probably less work than repainting antislip. Plus the amount you save on fewer pairs of torn trousers is money in the pocket right there.
  9. I don't often look too much at Multihulls, but this is sex on water. Lovely.
  10. From what I can remember in another thread. Failed as a S/V, sitting in a yard still somewhere planned to have keel removed permanetly and converted to M/V I think Mr Pong has more than just 3 boats, he has a couple of 72 footers (Jelik being 1 and another of similar dimensions), at least 1 and possibly 2 TP52s (one of which at one point was called Mui Mui and another from memory was the Foxy Lady IV, possibly V) and some motorboats of various types). Mui Mui I think was supposed to be a TP52 except being from JK it didn't measure as one, or something to that effect. Not that it matters up here since TPs in Asia are IRCed to race mixed fleet. The burden of being super rich and really passionate about sailing I guess. Lovely guy. Maiden was raced just once in some sort of HK-Boracay type long distance race, I think from memory it was a gift from his wife to him, designed by JK and with canting rig, water ballast in the wings, hiking wings and so on - apparently quite tricky to tack/gybe due to the complexity of operating the whole thing's various moving bits (this came from one of his crew when we were hanging out eating Frank's food and having him tow us around at one of the Asian regattas). Now with various other 90 footers showing up, it seems like it would be a good time to pull the Maiden back out to race, if only you could figure out how to make the thing go around corners a little easier.
  11. Interesting. My boat is a bit smaller in the rig, and a little lighter, so I might see how long it lasts with just 1 set. Always a pleasure to support other sportsboats; I know the U20 guys were pretty happy with their C-Tech rigs too - it's a great company to deal with.
  12. what is the windiest guys are using the single spreader c-Tech style rigs with masthead kites in? - single spreaders - forestay lower than the cap shrouds - top section of the mast not supported except by the leech of the main Curious as I am building a boat with a similar rig set up (Shaw 550) and having introduced you guys to C-Tech, I am now likely to use a similarly set up rig (as Rob designed from the beginning with single spreaders) - just want to know how funky the rig is going to look in bigger breeze - C-Tech claims (and I believe them) it's all no problem but curious to hear from actual experience on the sort of limits and how you guys are setting things up. Hoping that the 2 i550s under construction in Samui get finished so we have someone to race against other than the IRC 3 fleet!
  13. Bit hard to compare a 5.5m with 3 crew built to a ply budget to the quickest 6.5m boat with 4 crew built to a composite budget. At a guess would be something like 7-10min slower per hour? Maybe more in certain conditions? 650 is doing 6.2-6.7 knots upwind, and other than arms racer one off boats would be the first to plane and the quickest once up and planing. The i550 is a lovely boat and a very cool concept, but I guess if you really wanted an answer could compare the Manic vs. the open 570 in Narrangsett or Monkey Business/Audi Penfold Racing vw. the i550 death to Snooki (or some name like that) in Melbourne. I'm also building a Shaw 550 (one of the first ones as a fun little boat for messing around) so would guess that would be a lot closer to i550 pace, more similar to an open 570 but should be quicker by the time I put a proper kite on it (compared to an open 570 with its hankerchief). There were a couple of i550s started here in Thailand, but nothing has happened on them in a while.
  14. @ Mr Clean Not sure I'd describe Custard Truck as 1/2 a cat as it is one of the quickest sportsboats of its size in NZ and a good benchmark to see if this idea of canting lead works on a boat this length. Given Shaw yacht Design's experience in canters (9m, 10.6m, etc) and the decision to run a small fixed bulb with max righting moment from bodies, I am not entirely sure that the speed dream small size approach is the quickest way to make a sportsboat fast. Of course...you cannot scale up the crew to each be 5000kg so perhaps speed dreams' appoach is spot on for a big keel boat though.
  15. That's a really different boat- it's double the weight so at least double the cost, sails 4 up instead of 2, etc. It'd be just as rational to compare the VX to a Viper... Shaw 650 weighs 400kg (880lb) including engine, cat 5 safety gear, etc; weight of boat including rig, foils, deckgear etc is around 750-780lbs. So no, not double, slightly more for a boat that would be 1m longer. Speed is quicker than all similar sized boats, and the boats rate around 95 under usa phrf, and are quicker on water than melges 24, viper, open 570, sb3 etc - they are indeed quite different from an i550 sailed 4 up or 3 upbut I need to correct any misconception.