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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  


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About willp14335

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    Things that float.

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  1. Robert Perry Gaff Cutter

    Looks iffy to me.
  2. Sense 51 or 57

    Sense 57 is almost certainly quicker than an HR 53 (and the Beneteau 49), listed SA is almost the same (1593 vs 1560), but the DWL is much longer and the displacement is lighter. Like many old boats our HR has a 130% genoa which bumps the SA/D to around 18.6. Offshore we can also fly a staysail, which bumps it to 22, so comparing the actual sail area to newer boats with a modern 100% fractional sail plan can be confusing. The beneteau we sailed against was the Oceanis 50, which is probably a lot slower than the sense 57, and very similar to your 49. The Sense 57 seems to be marketed as an offshore cruiser actually shows a rendering for a staysail as well, uncommon in new boats.
  3. Sense 51 or 57

    You need displacement and volume for cruising. By modern standards all displacement cruisers are heavy including the Beneteau. With the right person on the helm even a heavy boat will surf. We've have Evenstar up to 14 knots before off waves. Most cruisers don't want to surf however. Even on a reach, power to carry sail matters.
  4. Sense 51 or 57

    While I agree this is true to an extent, I believe with slow (displacement) boats, righting moment has more of an impact on performance than displacement. In 2012 Evenstar out-sailed a brand new 50' Beneteau upwind. It was not a gradual crossing either, the speed difference was about half a knot. She is a 20 year old Hallberg Rassy 53, and was fully loaded for live-aboard cruising at the time, so probably weighed twice what the Beneteau weighs. Thus, the speed difference mainly stemmed from stability. We had deeper draft, more ballast (30% vs. 39% BR), allowing us to carry a lot more sail area (10' higher rig). As a result, we went faster, our heel angle was smaller, and we pointed higher despite being heavier. Both boats were floating roughly on their lines in this instance, as the Bene was new and the HR is designed for world cruising. The same goes for boats that are faster than us. Sailing upwind the same time as a Swan 53-2, we were slower by almost a knot, and about 5 degrees lower. Evenstar displaces 50,706 lbs. The Swan displaces about 48,500 lbs. Both hulls are from the same designer. The main difference again was the draft and righting moment of the two boats. The Swan could support a more efficient, higher aspect rig with her deeper draft and bigger RM.
  5. I went racing with my roommate on her Laser 2000 last weekend. It was a little cool, but the UK is fairly mild in the winter. In the pic we're being rolled by a musto skiff.
  6. "Brainwashing" my wife into cruising!

    My parents went cruising when I was 15 and my sister was 12. I got a few years living aboard from it and it was definitely worthwhile. I think most cruising kids will get more out of it at an older age (perhaps 10 or older) than they will while young. You remember a lot more and are willing to try more when you are a little older. If I was in your position I'd try coastal cruising for a while before going bluewater. It will give your wife a chance to try sailing and decide whether she likes it or not, and your son time to grow up a bit. That being said, I'm still very young (20), so my advice should be taken with a grain of salt...
  7. Sense 51 or 57

    I haven't sailed either, but it is my impression that the Sense line is meant to be substantially faster than the Oceanis line. They are not as quick as the First series racer/cruisers though.
  8. Hallberg Rassy Launched a new 57 Footer

    Actually, now that I've looked more at the picture, I believe that is a temporary work ladder. The two bits of wood either side are handholds for wider companionway steps. Look at the steps on the predecessor HR 55.
  9. Hallberg Rassy Launched a new 57 Footer

    HR uses a rub-rail just below the windows to protect them, and it makes a handy toehold to get aboard. Mechanically fastening the deck seems like an unusual way to do it with today's adhesives. I was under the impression from the build section of the HR website that they drop to single skin a few cm below the sheer and laminate the hull to deck joint together from inside the boat, but this section of the site looks very old, and that seems to be a laborious and uncomfortable way for workers to make the hull to deck joint. The companionway ladder reminds me more of a Swan than a Hallberg-Rassy. Nautor is my favorite production builder, but I've never really cared for their companionway steps. http://www.hallberg-rassy.com/resources/how-a-hull-is-built/
  10. Hallberg Rassy Launched a new 57 Footer

    Hallberg-Rassy released some production photos of the boat today on their Facebook page. I love looking at stuff like that. One thing that struck me as interesting was the massive transverse ring frame going up to the sheer, knowing that HR uses core above the waterline. I suspect it's to support the hull windows and eliminate the partial bulkhead that is located at the edge of the galley on the older boats, opening up the space. The build seems to be progressing quickly.
  11. Hallberg Rassy Launched a new 57 Footer

    Yes, a carbon HR would be silly, as I mentioned above weight savings would be minimal. I didn't mention cost, but it would be very high. I still like a traveller for the ability it gives you to shape the sail. We have a big hydraulic vang on Evenstar. We have hydraulic furling and back stay and autopilot as well. Every one of those systems has failed at least once since going cruising, although the furlers just needed new hoses. When the vang broke in the middle of the Pacific, I used the traveller to help pull the boom down. It's small so it didn't make much of an impact, but it did help get a little speed. The HR 57 has big loads and will almost certainly use hydraulics. When those inevitably stop working 20 years down the road it would be nice to have a traveller to work with.
  12. Hallberg Rassy Launched a new 57 Footer

    Carbon would be interesting with this boat, you'd probably have very good stability, but it won't reduce displacement much as most of the weight is in systems, tankage and interior joinery. Performance gains would only be moderate. Looking at the rendering it seems there is space for a traveler in that "cutout" around the teak if the customer wants one. I don't like the lack of a traveler, and I also think that undersized/missing travelers have been the one major failing of Hallberg-Rassy's deck fit out for a long time. I also dislike the placement of the mainsheet winch.
  13. Hallberg Rassy Launched a new 57 Footer

    This boat does not have a dinghy garage, those are lazerettes. The beam is very far aft, with a very wide transom. I am working on a similar hull for my dissertation (but with chines), and in maxsurf stability the boat trims and lifts a fair amount of the aft quarters out of the water, which could pose a problem with one rudder. Two rudders may not really be needed, but one would probably have to be further forwards to avoid aeration and grip issues when the boat heels. This would put the bearing shelf right in the middle of where HR installs their batteries, so those would have to move somewhere else, which might have an impact on the general arrangement, as the tankage takes all the space under the cockpit sole. As for heeling and grounding, the rendering is deceptive. The similar HR 44 looks to have the same deep rudder draft issue (see the rendering below), but the profile drawing of the same boat clearly shows the rudders to be considerably shallower than the keel. Personally I prefer the aesthetic look of a more moderate hull (and the simplicity of one rudder), but this shape should be faster downwind than the predecessor, and it offers a lot more interior volume for the LOA, which seems to be in demand in 2018.
  14. Hallberg Rassy Launched a new 57 Footer

    Hallberg-Rassy gets around this issue with bow and stern thrusters. Not that I think this is necessarily a good solution, but it is a solution. Having driven the HR53 under power, I do agree the prop wash has a big effect on steering at low speed.
  15. Hallberg Rassy Launched a new 57 Footer

    I think while two rudders are more exposed, if one is damaged by debris the other one may remain undamaged. Depending on the nature of the damage and how the steering system is set up, it might still be possible to steer the boat, which wouldn't be possible if a single rudder was destroyed. When it comes down to it, most articles I've read about the subject suggest the odds of hitting something like a partially submerged container are very low. The risk doesn't increase appreciably with two rudders rather than one, as most floating debris and containers are at the surface and will hit the hull (which has a larger beam than the rudder spacing in most cases) before striking the rudder anyways.