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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  


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About Oceanconcepts

  • Rank
  • Birthday 12/14/1952

Profile Information

  • Location
    Seattle, Washington, USA
  • Interests
    Electronic instrumentation and user interface design, Scuba diving, rowing, sailing, boat design, new technology.
    Curent custodian of Pathfinder, a Brin Wilson built S&S one tonner.

Recent Profile Visitors

293 profile views
  1. Prior owner

    Definitely have experienced this on my prior boats, but I'm trying to do better. I'm less than two years into my latest project, but the boat has had almost 50 years worth of prior owners. More often that not what I experience is gratitude- for installations and modifications well done, well thought out stainless drip pans under all the oily bits and filters, maintenance that was not neglected, a first class rewiring job, and on and on. The few odd decisions (plumbing for the head sink is very, um, interesting) and less than perfect work are the exception. The inspiration from the prior owners and the memory of my own misdeeds helps keep me from the sometimes very strong temptation to cut a corner or say "good enough for now". But it does slow down the pace of my work.
  2. Check Your BoatUS Policy.

    I didn't get an email reply, so I called. The representative confirmed that they will only cover repair bills subject to the depreciation schedule- after 20 years they will pay 10% less of any repair claims per year for every year of the boat's age, and at 28 and over they will pay a maximum of 20% of the cost of any repairs less the dedcutible. So if you have an older boat insured with Boat US, you effectively have only liability coverage and coverage for a total loss. I never had a claim, but I'm pretty sure Boat US did not work this way in the past.
  3. Check Your BoatUS Policy.

    Seems reasonable- my boat's market value per survey is more like 7% of what the survey listed as replacement cost to build new. But since I have an "agreed value" policy the language seems clear that a total loss will be paid on the basis of that agreed value, not in relation to a % of replacement cost or original cost. This is where I had my question- so If I lose the mast, or get T-boned by another boat while sitting peacefully at anchor, the policy pays only 20% of the actual cost of repairs, less deductible? I can understand if the maximum repair they would pay would be 20% of the replacement value, but that doesn't seem to be what the language says. I called just now and gave my hypothetical example of 10,000 in damage. The representative confirmed that the maximum my policy would pay would be $2.000 less my deductible, or in my case $1250. At total loss would be covered to the agreed value. Basically I am uninsured for anything other than liability and total loss. That's what I thought I had- the policy specifies "agreed hull value", and the numbers are there right on the page. They would only allow the agreed value to be the actual purchase price, since that was less than the surveyor's "estimated fair market value". This policy was put in place prior to the change to GEICO, however. I've heard that, but the cold molded wood did not seem to be an issue except that they required a out of the water survey prior to writing the policy. I'd expect the same would be true of a FG boat that old as well, though. But come to think of it they required only an in water survey on my prior FG boat.
  4. Check Your BoatUS Policy.

    I've sent an email and may call tomorrow if I don't hear back right away. I looked at my policy, and this exact language is there, copied below. I don't know how to interpret it other than if you have a boat older than 20 years, you coverage for damage is dropping 10% per year to the point of covering only 20% of any partial loss (less deductible) after your boat's 28th birthday. If this is correct, that would seem to put a lot of people (like me) in the position of paying for next to no insurance on anything short of a total loss. Like many I have just sent checks to Boat US for many years on a variety of boats, never made a claim, and assumed the coverage was comparable with the recent change. Kudos to Sail 69 for bringing this up. Any insurance pros that could weigh in on this language? Any hints on a good company to insure a 47 year old, rock solid cold molded wood boat with a good recent survey?
  5. Check Your BoatUS Policy.

    I have some trouble understanding what the Boat US link is saying. If it’s what I think it is then I need to shop elsewhere for insurance. I had to get a survey before they would write any policy. There was an “agreed value” derived from that survey. But based on what I read here this 10% per year depreciation would be based on the year built- 1970, in my case? And has no relation to the “agreed value”? So, since I have long ago passed the maximum depreciation, a 10K repair would be covered for only 20% of the repair cost, i.e. insurance would cover 2,000? This seems completely unreasonable in that the condition and the age of a boat are independent variables. I’m asking them for clarification.
  6. Teak Sources

    Thanking you already- I had not seen those blades. This looks like the powered, multi-tool version of the blade I had intended to use. The trim router with a bare bit stub suggestion upthread is interesting as well. I'm not sure when I will tackle this- there are many projects ahead in the queue, and the decks are pretty good, with most of the original thickness. But I can see some places where the seams are breaking from the edges of the boards.
  7. Coolboats to admire

    Thanks for that- I have a hot molded Finn dinghy built by Fairey Marine in 1954, I always wondered what the wood was. I looked up alba and it appears to be the stuff.
  8. Teak Sources

    Is that built by Bianca? My old Aphrodite 101 had teak decks riveted and glued as you describe. They held up nearly 40 years, not covered- though the last few they looked pretty bad and were worn to nothing in spots. No leaks from the rivets, either, which was my big worry with balsa cored decks. The adhesive was brutally strong. I also drilled and filled the rivets when they showed above the teak. You probably have a few years to figure it out before it's critical. But Sloop is right, plugs will not hold. Can you live with it and focus on other things for a while, rather than try to level or fix it temporarily? That could be a slippery slope. I will be renewing the seam caulking on Pathfinder using a reworked hoof knife to seam out the old caulking. But I have more thickness left, and it's wood all the way down, so the teak will stay. Im redoing the cockpit seats in cumaru, though.
  9. Teak Sources

    When weathered all these tropical woods look a lot alike- silver-gray. Otherwise, I think cumaru looks more like teak than ipe, it’s even been marketed as “Brazilian Teak”- though it is in no way botanically teak. The disadvantage it has is that is is less dimensionally stable, and will shrink and expand with moisture. That’s not so much of an issue on a boat if you are filling gaps with a poly sealant. I believe ipe is a bit more stable. I’ve rebelled against teak pricing and am enjoying the contrast of my deck with some jatoba (reddish) handrails and cockpit trim I made to replace worn out teak. That’s another extremely hard, rot resistant wood that is very attractive and fine exposed to the weather.
  10. Teak Sources

    You might consider checking out alternative woods. See post #16 here for pictures of Kris Kringle’s rebuild of a cockpit with ipe. I have used ipe for cabin top decking in a former boat, it was still in great condition after 14 years when I sold it and was virtually indistinguishable from the teak decking alongside. More recently I’ve used Cumaru from Advantage Lumber (online)- it’s mostly sold for household and commercial decks. It’s harder than teak but slightly less dimensionally stable, looks very similar, and holds up spectacularly in the weather. If $ were no object and I could find great quality, I’d still use teak, but these alternatives are in my view better than substandard teak at a fraction of the cost. An excellent thread on WBF detailing Kris’s cockpit rebuild: http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthread.php?202605-Building-a-new-cockpit-off-the-boat&p=4830221&highlight=#post4830221
  11. The Discarded- Rescuing a Tartan 33

    That would be a tough call for me between a router and a bandsaw. But as far as portable tools for woodworking go, the router would win easily.
  12. The Discarded- Rescuing a Tartan 33

    Routers are incredibly useful tools, but they are also easy to lose control over if everything is not held down well. Ideally you want things set up and held firmly in a way that makes it essentially impossible for the cutter to go anywhere you don’t want it to, or for the workpiece to move. Clamp the workpiece down. Always feed into (against) the rotation of the cutter to avoid having it grab the work. Thinking in terms of using jigs and templates increases the value of the router exponentially and greatly increases safety to both you and the work. These are most often simple things you make up in a few minutes from scrap wood- as simple as clamping a piece of wood as a guide to keep the router from going off course. And what Ishmael says- take a series of shallow cuts, increase depth gradually, you will develop a sense of how much depth of cut to take but there is no harm in going slow.
  13. The Discarded- Rescuing a Tartan 33

    Would definitely not recommend using a router freehand, but with a simple template that would take 5-10 minutes to make and a top bearing pattern bit (useful for many tasks, there are plenty of mortising jobs on a boat), the risk of damaging the floorboards approaches zero. http://www.rockler.com/1-2-pattern-router-bit Make it just like the black plastic one in this picture, but the full shape of the fitting. You can't cut outside the template boundary, and you have precise control over depth, so the fitting sits completely flush. That's the low anxiety-low stress way I'd approach this job. Spending some extra time in the setup, and making the cutting part as foolproof as possible.
  14. The Discarded- Rescuing a Tartan 33

    For installing latches like that it depends on how many you have. For a couple, a sharp- really sharp- chisel and some practice on scrap will work fine. You have mentioned limited woodworking skills, and you are dealing with expensive materials. The risk to the chisel approach is chipping or tearing the laminates. Cut down carefully around the perimeter and shave out chips slowly. A router with a template and a pattern following bit (top bearing) is more precise and less likely to result in an “oops” moment. Cut the template in wood or plastic to the exact fit of the latch, stick it to the floorboards (double sided carpet tape will work), and cut the recess. If the latch has square corners you will still need to finish those with a sharp chisel, how much depends on the diameter of the router bit. While I have larger routers, I recently got an inexpensive trim router that I find very useful for working on the boat- it’s light and small diameter to fit in small spaces and close to bulkheads and other barriers. http://www.grizzly.com/products/Trim-Router-Metal-Body/H7790?utm_campaign=zPage&utm_source=grizzly.com
  15. Fwd/Aft Moving Pedestal

    The Lady Washington is listed as 210 tons displacement and IIRC from my few short days aboard the tiller is about 11' long. I know in a breeze it could carry me right across the deck easily if I was not careful. The tackles were useful. In most situations the rudder had less influence on direction than the sails. Photo is our late lamented friend Jim, blacksmith, teacher, and musician extraordinaire, taking a turn at the tiller during what looks like mealtime, about 16 years ago.