Wess

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About Wess

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  1. Wess

    Laser vs Highlander?

    Laser is by far the best of the two to learn to race. You have to do it all (trim, drive, tactics) by yourself and your will learn far faster than on a boat w crew. OD fleets everywhere also aid the learning process. The Highlander is a big boat. Needs crew beyond a 6 and 4 year old kid. Tye loads on the boat are likely not something that either kid could handle and actually be a part of the team versus just along for the ride. All that said the sailing and racing with your kids is about as fun as fun can be. Its special. My suggestion would be to look into Snipes if they are at all active in your area. Super affordable and the kid (generally races with 2 not 3 people) can have a meaningful role. I sailed Snipes with both my daughters when they were young and it was a blast. Great people and great boat and reasonably active on US east coast.
  2. Wess

    bluewater multihulls

    I noticed Cape Horn self steering gear on your list. That surprised me. How well does it work?
  3. Thanks; the sailing was a blast. Indeed force 4 from the west. Got out both in the foiler and the tri (not the Laser this time). I hope your hockey was fun too. My resting heart rate is 75 as we speak (when/how did this become a thing???). My Monday and week look to be a mess so this will be quick and I may have to correct it later as I do not have the list in front of me. If I am following you, you seem to be at about $225 total. To answer your question; my total was in the $250-$500 range of the poll. But honestly I am more interested in the list of all the fees from ILCA if that ever comes out. Think you are saying that WS went from 0.4 to 1.4%. WS then proposed another 1%, no? Not sure if that went into effect yet and if the total would be 2% or 2.4%. Also not recalling if that was on retail or the transfer price. But yea, around $112 if the further 1% is not added on top. Possibly as high as almost $200 if it is. And I gotta tell you I sure like ILCA way more than I like WS or think they (WS) do a damn bit of good for grass roots sailors. Would love to see them collapse but it ain't gonna happen. The ILCA stuff is far more interesting. My general sense is that everyone who is anyone in this mess is BSing a bit to a lot so what I have may not be accurate or current. That is why I wanted to see the actual ILCA list if they publish one. What I have includes fixed fees as well as the per unit fees and plaques etc... How to deal with the fixed fees and covert them into per unit is certainly open to argument. I assumed a reasonable pay back period of 3 year and modest market uptake/penetration rate into historic unit sales following that trend. We also need to make an assumption about what territory a new builder tries to enter (impacts fees and total boats sold from assumed market penetration rate). This was adding up to a not small number. Now... you can argue that if it was so, the builder could not pass it on as they couldn't price higher than the market would accept. So... what's the market acceptance limit? Well in the US we could use the PSA boat retail prices and add in the costs to ship it here. Basically a new (non PSA) builders fee total pass through could not exceed PSA's boat shipping costs or in theory that new builder's pricing is not viable. Anyway that is way too many words to say how to deal w fixed fees is open to argument and for sake of simplicity I used an assumption that the fee pass through could not exceed the costs to ship a PA boat to the US. Using the list I have (like I said I don't know if its accurate) and the caveats above it appears ILCA collects more than WS. I am curious if Robbie ever got a quote for a PSA boat. What is their local retail price (converted to $US) and how much to ship it or buy same landed in US. Again this is open to argument. PSA if they have adequate build capacity (doubt they do but its possible given the market decline) may want to eat the shipping costs and price low in the US in order to drive penetration into both EU and US markets. The point of all that is even if we had two lists of all fixed and per unit fees collected by ILCA and WS reasonable people may still disagree on the absolute amount per boat because of all those factors. Thus my desire to see the ILCA list published and see if the list of fees imposed is complete and matches up. And finally hockey? Really?? Why not an ice boat???
  4. That is not a list of fees, its an amount. Question: Is it your amount or one provided by ILCA? My amount is different than yours (for ILCA), though we have same for WS. And I am headed out sailing so have a nice day!
  5. And you think that’s OK? Even at half that?
  6. Nope; I will patiently await the list you promised. With occasional notes of frustration with ILCA pick pocketing tendencies posted.... soon. Hint - I think that word means something different than ILCA management apparently does. Three hundred plus days and counting to that US based builder.
  7. No Bill for the 234th time I mean ALL (Clean loves when people do that) the fees! There are various WS fees and various ILCA fees all piled onto a Laser hull, sail, rig or other equipment. Some are variable (unit based) some are fixed. Some are on new and some are on existing builders. I have a list and have reason to believe it accurate but am keeping an open mind. I am curious to see if ILCA ever publishes an accurate list and amount of ALL of the fees placed on the sale of a new Laser. I also have the background and experience to do the economic analysis to covert them all into per unit $ costs and have done so. I gotta tell you the amount per hull (or unit) is not insignificant. No I have not included optional (non contractually obligated) that any builder might do (Aero, Laser, whatever) to support a class (such as supply event boats etc..). We can talk (seriously LOL) further if and when and you Laser lemming folks ever produce a full and complete fee list. Or maybe we should do a poll to see how much folks think it all adds up to per unit. What says you... - less than $50 - $50 to $100 - $100 to $250 - $250 to $500 - more than $500 My point is and has been ILCA and WS should fund themselves from members that want to join; not by imposing fees on people who are not members.
  8. I already answered that; canntt you read? And yes so many of your posts here on SA seem geared towards "promot(ing) the Laser for the good of the sport." Hah hah ha. You realize there is this whole quote and cut and paste thing right? You just happen to not like truth and that I have a different opinion than you re ILCA actions in this instance. Make you a deal. Fund ILCA out of members pockets ONLY and stop putting hidden fees onto non members and I will STFU. Dare you. And it looks like it stopped raining and I need to go run so you can even have the last word!
  9. You seem to be on the internet... just sayin. Pot meet kettle. You lemmings seem top have a problem with truth.
  10. Because I am a procrastinator and right now my options are go running in the rain and train for the half marathon or annoy you and stupid people that sail Fireflys. For sure this is more fun. I mean if you got a puppet you have to pull the strings no? Anyway, tomorrow I am going sailing so will give you a short break. And I already won it @tillerman. The cheating bums just wont pay it!!
  11. I don't get it Sosoo. Robbie had ample time to call Tracy and Andy and get the inside line. Why ain't he following through on his proposed double or nothing bet?? And what's up with Bill. He knows I love talking about all the ILCA hidden fees they are pick-pocketing from non members. Wasn't it almost 2 weeks ago that he said ILCA was going to list and publish ALL the fees. Still waiting for that too. They keep using this word "soon" when I think they mean "once in a blue moon." And not even then...
  12. Wess

    Corsair Trimaran

    Thanks Pete. How much weight do you figure you were able to take out with the floor sole removal? Likely a decent savings as well from the rudder swap.
  13. Wess

    bluewater multihulls

    I don’t want to take this good thread down a rabbit hole but I would say talk to the many many owners who regularly sail offshore with them. I did before I bought mine. If you are serious - nobody will want to waste time with tire kicker - drop me a PM and I am happy to chat. And assuming you are where your name says you are and and you sail what you say you sail you will know a local Corsair and Seawind dealer (maybe even 2 of them) who could set you straight. If it helps my wife and I have twice put our money where our mouth is. First when we bought the boat. Second time is when we were struck by lightning and would have made a $50K profit if we let insurance total it and buy us out. We didn’t because we loved and still love the boat. It’s the best bang for the buck, most versatile cruising trimaran I have ever come across. Again, this thread ain’t about me and my wife and our boat so if you are serious drop me a PM. But it sounds like you got a Seawind and I presume happy with it so....
  14. I am just waiting for you to confirm the date for the double or nothing bet you proposed.