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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  


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About Rubadub1

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    babes and boats

    Its hard to put context in a post. And walk a mile in my shoes before you get too critical. In the i have learned a great deal from all of you so thanks a bunch. Much appreciated.
  2. Ajbram and swabbie. Thanks it somehow makes it easier to deal with knowing others have similar issues. Appreciative .
  3. 2savave. What you say is very true. When i am up with the top 3 which is becoming more and more often the exchanges civil and usually contain cross or dip, you have overlap etc. No bs cause we all know. Thanks for reminding me.
  4. Sounds familiar. Maybe its just the way it is and i will have to accept it or leave it. I really love racing sailboats but the rest is getting too me. I dont use our club anymore. Moved my boats to a different neighboring marina.
  5. sorry d'ranger. i keep forgetting caps to some mean yelling! i am old enough to remember seeing the jfk incident on tv and to me caps are just for emphasis.
  6. Whats your experience in general terms? My club has many nice people. but the cliques are bad and many. old vs. new. phrf vs. one design. spinnaker vs, white sail. rudeness and yelling matches occur too often. relationship affairs happen and build walls. many good people have quit. Despite this our grand old lady 200 years old still exists and is run by volunteers with the exception of a paid bar steward. must do work committees get things done but optional ones always fail as bickering stalls them. is this the life of a yacht club??

    I really appreciate everyones input. i am aware and usually very intelligent about using rules. the more experienced racers in my one design fleet have taught me you can win the battle but lose the war. my confusion was around rule 44.1b. i thought at the time yellow and black should be forced to retire because they had gained clear advantage by not going up when i pushed them(they were still flying chutes while i had dropped mine and was under headsail.) if they had gone up they would have been a tangled mess of chute and i would have been long gone to the mark. THIS WAS MY MISTAKE IN UNDERSTANDING. i DID NOT PROTEST as i beat them anyway and tried to talk it over with a beer at the club with yellow. he was agitated that i was going to protest him. it was the NEXT DAY AT THE DOCKS that BLACK YELLED AND SWORE at me, when I tried to talk to him about it. This combined with many other Yacht Club racing and otherwise BS is starting to make me feel its time to sell my one design boat and get out of racing. I am hoping you will all provide me with your club experiences (general not specific). My club has some nice people! But the club is very cliquey, phrfers hate one designers old hates new sexual affairs cause walls ,back talking and outside our community members have a rep. as being drunks. on the good side we are an original over 200 year old club, run by volunteers, and have a vibrant racing group and strong junior sailing program. My next post will be ARE CLUB RACERS AT BEST HARD TO GET ALONG WITH, AT WORST AHOLES?

    Alene22 thanks for clarifying 44.1b. I still think it's a flaw that a gross foul of the most basic rule rule 11 ends up this way. What I have learned from you all... black and yellow are fairly new to new skippers. I will in the future stay away from them. There heading to the mark would have caused them to virtually stall their boats around the mark. I should have stayed away and rounded faster leaving them in my wake. As to the dock incident I am still pissed. Not sure what I am going to do? Thanks everyone for being so informative. I really appreciate it.

    BRASS. Thanks for your reply. Unfortunately you missed the part that I called for both boats to go up 15 lengths before the mark 2x. I then hailed protest well outside the mark for all to hear. At the dock there is no excuse to take hard feelings off the water swear where 5 and 7 year old little girls play on their parents boat. I was nicely trying to explain my thoughts and as to why I sailed as I did. Anyone that gets that upset over a club race is a baby. As to the rules, I now do agree I should have given mark room. But I am confused as to why 44.1b exists? In tight one design racing,(we currently have the reigning world champion in our fleet), that rounding could have been the difference between a 4th. And a 6th. To me it's a flaw in the rules when someone can clearly foul you outside the circle ignore penalty turns continue to foul you then gain a clear advantage at the mark rounding. Then when I should be eating a hamburger and drinking a beer I'm instead filling out paper work and playing lawyer to a bunch of people who wish they were eating burgers and drinking beer too.

    And rule 44.1B states you must resign if your foul gives you a clear advantage? A lead sloop on a windward leg just has to cover to maintain the lead. Pretty significant I'd say.

    Hi Chris walter. the initial call to go up occurred outside the circle. Second green arrow. yellow tried to respond calling black to go up. black just kept sailing their course. I hailed windward leeward go up again a second time. no response. I then hailed protest. this all occurred outside the circle. Yellow refilled their luffed chute and led to the mark. black just kept going straight the whole time. later in the club yellow claimed it all happened in the circle yet had called black up and did not ask me for mark room?. Black is just an ahole and will not listen to anything yelling at me for all to hear at the docks i need to fn learn how to sail . i have raced for 20 years 7 in the very competitive and large one design fleet. He has sailed 3 years in the fleet only. i have launched 5 protests and won all in my 20 years. i have never been protested and lost, i have taken 3 sets of penalty turns.

    TJSoCAL: thanks. the problem I was having was the most windward boat was not responding outside the circle or to the protest, i was trying to get to the inside before the circle but could not. this continued into the circle. this is why I am wondering if I would have been exonerated over 18,2. he did not respond and had a clear advantage and would have been able to cover me on the windward leg up. thats why i feel 44.1 would apply. please respond. i would like your opinion on the 69 incident too. thanks

    Thanks Plumber. in the past I would have responded just short of putting the guy in the water. But people didn't seem to like it when I did that and i got labelled the ahole. Also my trawler yacht is on the same dock theirs families around, i WOULD THINK rule 69 does apply. Trust me no one thinks of me as a nancy. But i hate reporting to other bodies too because others will say BS TO THAT. allene222 thanks for you input. could you further consider... and reply...22.2 a boat taking a penalty shall keep clear of one that is not. 44.1 Taking a Penalty A boat may take a Two-Turns Penalty when she may have broken one or more rules of Part 2 in an incident while racing. She may take a One-Turn Penalty when she may have broken rule 31. Alternatively, sailing instructions may specify the use of the Scoring Penalty or some other penalty, in which case the specified penalty shall replace the One-Turn and the Two-Turns Penalty. However, when a boat may have broken a rule of Part 2 and rule 31 in the same incident she need not take the penalty for breaking rule 31; if the boat caused injury or serious damage or, despite taking a penalty, gained a significant advantage in the race or series by her breach her penalty shall be to retire. 44.2 One-Turn and Two-Turns Penalties After getting well clear of other boats as soon after the incident as possible, a boat takes a One-Turn or Two-Turns Penalty by promptly making the required number of turns in the same direction, each turn including one tack and one gybe.

    So i was leeward and slowly being overtaken on a downwind leg. 15 lengths from the mark i dropped the chute and moved to close hall calling 2 boats up on windward. the closest hailed the farthest to go up he was being pressed by me. i recalled go up as we were closer to entering the circle. They did not go up. i then hailed protest windward leeward . the first fell off filling the chute and rounded first. the outer boat kept sailing to the mark. i hollered no room and rounded before him cutting him off at the mark. after rounding i re hailed protest to both boats and launched my flag. my protest argument would be, windward leeward plus overtaking boats on windward side can be taken up. i was protecting my mark rounding position. My second argument would be boats not doing turns at the earliest available time. no boats were near us. my third argument would be a boat that fouls and gains advantage because of that foul should disqualify themselves. thats why i gave no mark room to the outer boat. i ended up beating both boats so I did not follow through with the protest as it would not affect results. it gets worse. at the club the closest skipper was agitated saying we were in the circle. wasnt even close. he never asked for overlap rights and hailed the outer boat to go up? he made me feel very unwelcome. the next day at the docks the second skipper walked past. i said hello and smiled but was greeted with a dagger like stare. i turned to him and asked are you upset with me? H he turned and said you Fn cut me off at the mark. turned and walked away. i called out do you want to discuss it. he turned walked back very pissed put his nose up to mine and yelled i should fn learn how to sail with the harbour looking on. he turned and walked away. i called his name twice to get him to come back and was greeted with the finger. Stupidly i yelled out your a baby. if your going to race stop being a baby. Now im thinking of asking our fleet captain sail to invoke rule 69. i have been victimized many times at our club by this type of behavior and am tired of it. ? am I wrong? if yes I will apologize and disqualify my results? what do you all think? specifically if a foul outside the circle continues into the circle do mark rounding rules still come into effect? with the offending boats. thanks fore your thoughts.