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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  


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  1. 1968 Flying Dutchman Help needed

    Here is a photo of a vang winch, yours may look slightly different, and the Holt Allen vang key that will fit the bracket on your boom. The second photo shows how the differential winch was used in the boat. The vang winch is the top one with the reel to starboard; it's a bit hard to see. The photo is from Rodney Pattison's Olympic boat. Here is a photo of a vang winch, yours may look slightly different, and the Holt Allen vang key that will fit the bracket on your boom.
  2. Navtec finished?

    Having been in engineering for generations -- oil, refrigeration, aerospace, software, sails, rigging -- my family has learned over and over that service business beats the living hell out of creation business. Service is parts and labor, and the last customer engagement has a big impact on the next engagement (you own your future). Creation requires risk, and the last customer engagement has surprisingly little influence over the next engagement (you don't own your future). I wish that I had learned that 43 years ago. I guess that I liked sailing too much.
  3. Craigslist Finds

    Ballenger did the decks on the first few Vanguard FDs. Augie Diaz had one. I am not sure if this is one of those boats, but the spi chute fairing looks the same, as does the deck knees, etc. . It is much earlier than 1993. Mike Loeb used a wooden decked Mader in 1984. That boat still exists.
  4. Navtec finished?

    You can still get Dyform, it's now called Hammerpro or Hammersmith. Just re-rigged with it. Compact Strand is essentially the same product. We've used lots and it is just as good or better than Dyform and readily available. Hayn is building common rod parts and doing a nice job with it. It has been years since Navtec has been able to provide a consistent supply of rod and parts so most distributors have found alternate sources. BSI makes a quality product, but they are more expensive than Navtec was. They are really busy since Navtec's demise, so lead times are getting longer. It will be interesting to see what shakes out. I know of at least one company that is interested in what remains of Navtec.
  5. Can Anybody Identify This Mast Section?

    It is a Hall 232, but the measurements are 9.19" X 4.86". The moments are 63.7 x 15.6 in4. Ballenger Spars built the mast from the 232 section for 'Zeus' a custom Mac 65 owned by Hal Nelson in 1988. Also, the masts built in the 80's were usually much heavier than current spars. The thought back then was that small masts with lower windage were faster. Small masts had to be extensively stiffened to make them meet the required moments. Also wall thicknesses were heavier than now. When IMS started there was a rating advantage to larger tubes and we were able to make extrusions that were larger and lighter for the same moments. The equation for moments is the area times the distance from the neutral axis squared, so the advantage is definitely on the larger sections. For example a recent spar replacement on a 44' sloop with an older IOR style mast replaced with a slightly larger tube saved almost 140 lbs.
  6. Advice on Flying dutchman floatation

    It's been plenty of years since I've seen a FD with bags since most of the boats after about 1983 are double bottom. As I remember about the old boats, the most common layout was a large bag under the foredeck, several on both sides of the cockpit and another large one under the aft deck. The idea is to have the boat float relatively level when it is on it's side. I don't know who makes good flotation bags now. I have seen some restored boats with blocks of foam, but unless it is truly closed cell, which most available foam is not, it will get quite heavy through time. I think that the bags are much better, but you have to be careful that all protruding fasteners and sharp fiberglass are kept away from the bags for obvious reasons. FDs with bag flotation float really low in the water and I remember seeing some old boats that had the bags strapped as low as possible in the boat so that it would come up with as little water as possible. You might think about joining the US FD class since you are a two boat owner. I own a couple myself, it seems that one isn't enough. Good luck on your project. Post photos or questions or both.