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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  

loop

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  1. Did Rainmaker have electric motors? Don't think so. Pretty sure the G4 was the first Gunboat with electric propulsion. G60 Moonwave had electric drives, other G60 not sure
  2. Crossed the Pacific with 65 loa / 10 draft. Very few places where less would have been more. Also, anchoring further off helps with better breeze, less bugs ... less crowds and noise in some places as well
  3. I think the name is worth a lot personally. Any new product will be met with a lot of excitement. Gb always had lines around the docks at boat shows. Everywhere I go people ask "is that a Gunboat?" We had a whole village in BC come down to check out the boat, to the point the dock master had to close public access to the docks. Flip through a copy of Multihull Magazine. Everyone and their mother has a concept design for a cat. My wild ass guess was the brand was worth $2m. I think they got a deal. But the true cost is over $2MM depending on how they deal with the debt they acquired, no? Like the half finished boats they now own (I think)... I gather you assume they can be sold for a profit eventually? No argument from me; I was assuming otherwise. Anyway; its all academic. Will never know what the true cost is or how they valued goodwill. The numbers just surprised me is all. Wish them the best regardless. true cost depends on how many cents they actually paid per nominal dollar of debt the bought, I guess ...
  4. New listing today by Just Catamarans in Ft.L on their facebook page @ $15m offers invited
  5. According to AIS data now called FLASH - renamed again?
  6. no news posted on the Oyster page yet, but a quote appeared on YW: http://www.yachtingworld.com/news/oyster-yachts-explain-the-keel-failure-that-lead-to-the-sinking-of-oyster-825-polina-star-iii-70414
  7. Coyote, thanks for that interesting and informative photograph. I have a follow-up question, if I may. You note that this board was not fully down (as can indeed be deduced in the photo). So I take that this boat was one that had 'short' boards - meaning that the boards never stuck up above deck level. I believe that I once read that this shortness was for the sake of aesthetics above deck. But the consequence is that they weren't braced up at deck level, with "grounding structures" up there as well as down on the hull bottom. Which make me wonder if the boats that subsequently switched over to taller boards (e.g., Elvis, Phaedo, the conceptual new series) would be able to absorb even more impact without notable damage to the boat? Would the added bracing, and the distribution of the impact forces / leverage across a much bigger 'height' of the boat, make a meaningful difference? Do you know of any situations where Phaedo or Elvis had a similar grounding with their taller boards? More to the point, what was that outcome? Proof is in the pudding, as they say (well, at least until I eat said pudding ). Next line of questioning: might you know if the cost of the repair for the damage that you showed was more or less than the added incremental cost of getting longer boards to begin with? I suspect that to withstand the hydraulic forces involved would require that the boards be very, very strong (conversely, I seem to recall that Slim's rudders disintegrated in its first race, because they weren't strong enough). And I further suspect that longer boards would commensurately be very, very expensive. Is this a balancing act? Or is there another, functional reason why one would in fact prefer short boards? 6 out of 11 of the original GBs have done the board upgrade now (above deck, short chord, deep draft). I don't think anyone likes the stumpy original boards, they just haven't gotten around to doing the upgrade. There's been one hard grounding with the new longer boards. The board took virtually all of the damage. The deeper boards represent the best bang for the buck, ie best % performance increase per dollar. I don't think there's any reason to entertain building a boat with stumpy boards. The longer boards aren't significantly more expensive. Did they upgrade the rudders as well ?
  8. The only large cat with centerboards I am aware of is (or better: was) the 84' Sun Tenareze, composite built in 2004 by JFA. Half way around the world in Australia, they dropped the boards and glassed the slots over. I was told they lost some pointing ability, but gained 1,5kn under power due to reduced drag from the now closed cb slots, and were happy with that modification.
  9. I don't agree that it's a failed concept the 62 and 66 are awesome boats and if one came on the market today, it would probably sell right away The 62 and 66 are good boats, but is this the right time for new hype? At least the 62/66 brokerage sales I am aware of took their time, and price adjustments to facilitate a sale. I think that if they had stayed with proven designs, they could have been built somewhere with good skilled craftsmen at a profit. The more they built, the more efficient the build process would have been. These were always going to be really expensive boats.., but i don't think the buyers are all that price sensitive - they want something good.., not something cheap. Look at the money being poured into the refits of the 62 and 66. Were most of those refits not the finishing jobs of boats left behind in Cape Town, when GB took off for China? And fixing lingering engineering problems with boards and rudders?
  10. Thanks for that explanation. I expected to read the filing and laugh out loud at how highly they valued their own assets. I was pleasantly surprised by how reasonable the values for the unfinished hulls were. Now I know why. If you read the entire filing Gunboat somehow borrowed over $400K from a bank shortly before running to a judge to declare the situation hopeless without relief from the creditors. It could be interesting to compare the stories told to the bank and the story told to the judge and creditors. PJ is a codebtor to the bank loans, see Schedule H. While he has $$$ banks are off the hook anyway does that mean he guaranteed the loans with his personal assets? that's my understanding; what the banks can't collect from GB, they will collect from PJ as a codebtor. Banks may even have asked PJ for additional collateral for those final lendings.
  11. Thanks for that explanation. I expected to read the filing and laugh out loud at how highly they valued their own assets. I was pleasantly surprised by how reasonable the values for the unfinished hulls were. Now I know why. If you read the entire filing Gunboat somehow borrowed over $400K from a bank shortly before running to a judge to declare the situation hopeless without relief from the creditors. It could be interesting to compare the stories told to the bank and the story told to the judge and creditors. PJ is a codebtor to the bank loans, see Schedule H. While he has $$$ banks are off the hook anyway
  12. G4-02 contract terminated 09 Nov 2015, see top of page 66
  13. Wreck still @ yard in Cartagena this afternoon
  14. To Ensenada, according to the load sheet ...
  15. here is the link: http://www.yacht.de/panorama/news/oyster-825-krasse-bilder-eines-wracks/a103137.html