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    Can you make a "PHRF cheater"?

    PHRF has no rating formula, there is no secret algorithm that they punch in the specs of your boat and come out with a number. The process is have other PHRF regions rated this type of boat? Answer="Oh good we don't have to make a decision" Do we have ratings for other models similar, define similar? Answer= Is the boat fast looking? 20 guys have a quick chat and someone proposes a rating, the group votes on the rating. ...and now you are stuck with a bad rating. If you come in and make a good case based on the boats attributes, ratings from other rating systems (that do have formulas), sister boats results (not yours), Sail Measurements that may differ from specs found on internet, Mast Measurement... Don't come in and say we get beat so we need a better rating when your crew can't get the spinnaker set without a calamity on deck or you are never on the on the lifted tack. I voted against every rating protest based on their own results, but if there was merit to their argument I was more open to changing the rating. As far as protesting a rating I agree it is ugly work but you can also protest the boat during a race. If a boat has a OD PHRF rating and that rating includes only 100% jib only and you see him fly a 150% during the race, protest! Get him tossed on the race, that makes a much louder statement than belly crawling into the PHRF committee. Never make a solo attempt to protest another boats rating in front of the committee, get a few boats involved. Now this won't help for a boat with a gift rating... As far as your comment that "this is a thread about the boat and not the rating", not so. The tread is about cheating under a rating system, you need to include and analysis of the system. There are many ways of cheating. FRENZY

    Can you make a "PHRF cheater"?

    Again, a good crew can make up the difference but the majority of the Tripp 33s did not do well under PHRF. Don't get me wrong I am not bashing the Tripp, I actually like the boat, I am bashing the rating and rating system. I always thought the Tripp 33 would have made a brilliant OD travel fleet but they just never sold in numbers to make up the OD fleet. The outboard rudder gave it a huge handling advantage in tight quarters. Although I am still confused why the traveler was so far back. I would have liked to see the traveler 2' forward so the helmsman could also move forward, this would help getting weight out of the butt and improve her light air performance. Cheers! FRENZY
  3. On my boat you leave your Religion, Political, Sexual and Music Preference at the dock! But do not expect me to be politically correct when the kite goes in the water. You don't like my opinions get your own frigging boat. But I guess you will have to become a capitalist before that will happen.... FRENZY

    Can you make a "PHRF cheater"?

    Unless it is an established boat with many sister yachts with the same rating. What most people do not take into consideration is that in PHRF you are not winning because your boat is faster, it's because you and your crew didn't screw up somewhere on the course. I am a former PHRF rating volunteer and it becomes very obvious that some boats are just sailed better than others. You can take your crappy old boat and switch with the best sailed yacht int the fleet and that crew will probably beat you with your own boat, soggy core and all. I was a sail rep and would sail with a lot of boats that did poorly 90% of the time but when someone was there to make the decisions for them they would do amazingly better and sometime win or at least be competitive. Go race one design, there are always crews and skippers that wipe the fleet on a regular basis even though all the boats have good sails and are prepped. The one thing I am against is PHRF docking a boat because the crew wins, I saw this happen often. They would race the boat for a few years and pick up a pickle dish here and there. Next thing you know they start getting docked by the club or the local PHRF. How many guys have purchased winning PHRF boats but found they could not sail them to the rating? Why? It ain't the boat! ...and try to get the rating adjusted then, not happen'n.. Sure there are owners that do cheat with larger sails, smaller rudders, over faired keels, drastic weight reductions, and oversized riggs. My feeling for these people is if you have to cheat in PHRF racing you must really suck as a competitive sailor. This is amateur racing with boats that are well past their prime, work on your skills man! It's like the dad that cheats when making his kid's pinewood derby car. IT"S FOR FUN! To answer the question, can you build a cheater? Why bother there are so many boats with gift ratings because there are only a few in the country. The trick is is if the boat looks fast it gets a shit rating. Look at the J/27 and the J/33 they both have fair rating bit don't look fast sitting at the dock. Look at the Tripp 33, good designer, built by Carol Marine, looks fast sitting still, PHRF = 81, anybody ever remember this boat wining even once? Another one was the Catalina 37, looked fast but I always thought they never sailed to their rating. PHRF is not a formula it is a somewhat of a guess, you will be surprised how many owners don't bother the protest their rating. Every meeting we would get maybe two protests, if we did it more and backed it up with data it may become more accurate over time. FRENZY

    Looking For a Lindenberg 22

    Please ask around, Thanks,

    Looking For a Lindenberg 22

    The 26' is a good boat but I am looking to be able to beach the boat, I can easily beach the 26 (once) but getting it back off may take some doing... I need a super simple design that will sail above it's rating and can sail into shallow water. I did the bigger is better progression over the years starting with a J/24 and continually moved up to a 38'. To be honest the smaller boats got more use for almost no cost. Good Lick selling yours, FRENZY

    Looking For a Lindenberg 22

    I see a few 26' but no 22 footers...
  8. Hey All, I am looking for a Lindenberg 22, I don't know know many were built, I bet it was under 30 so I would consider any condition. I know this is a odd request considering all the boats I have previously owned. Thanks, Frenzy

    what is it?

    Easy, they couldn't fit it in the door so they cut it in two. It just has not dawned on them yet the finished hull won't fit either.... I am assuming it is the limitation of their 3D printer.
  10. FRENZY

    inexperienced couple buy a p.o.s. catamaran

    It will be on Craigslist by spring...
  11. FRENZY

    Chicago Area III

    OK who lost the Rhodes 19 on the side of route 30 in Valparaiso Indiana this weekend? There was no tow vehicle just the boat on the trailer in a ditch...
  12. FRENZY

    Chicago Area III

    Ding, Ding, Ding, we have a winner!
  13. FRENZY

    Jib cleats on j24

    Whatever you do you will still be better than these guys... FRENZY
  14. FRENZY

    Jib cleats on j24

    If you use Lopez Blocks and cross sheet the sheets, that would put the sheet and cam next to your forward hip if the traveler is between your legs. Or you can use those self tailing things but still cross sheet. The real fun don't start till the the kite goes up... FRENZY
  15. FRENZY

    Chicago Area III

    Nope, Your racing, your crew is racing, your misinformed that you need the best boat to win and it sounds like your crew is more into the experience than the competition. That said I am not knocking you or them, shit they are on the water and have made an attempt to learn the sport. Even if all of your crew decided tomorrow to buy boats there is not enough interest to get active crew to fill the new boats in the fleet. There is no bull pen of people itching to be out yacht racing. Sure part of it is perceived economics that people can't get into yachting because it is a rich guys sport but the other part is that the sport has done almost nothing to introduce non-boaters to sailing. Also the potential masses that would get involved now have a ton of other water activities that didn't exist when many of us got into sailing. The truth is we need a feeder program that would naturally have crew and potential owners graduate into other classes. We need publicity to events to attract people that may have interest not boat shows that show them they can't afford the sport. Our publications need to stop only doing stories on the elites in the sport. Our clubs need to start nurturing sailing schools, meet n greets, one design fleets and we need to have events that we bring on new crew. Maybe a Lemons Race like they do for auto racing... ...and we need to change our attitudes. Unfortunately there is no quick fix for this, there is no effort collectively to energize the sport. BTW; 1) There is no excuse for a dirty bottom, get your but in the water and clean it. 2) Practice often, it is rarely the fastest boat that wins, its the boat that screws up the least with sail handling and tactics. I have seen many new sails ripped to shreds buy poorly practiced crews. 3) Once your crew wins a few they will start weeding out the "winning isn't everything" attitude. 4) Force your crew to watch the movie Wind and memorize the lines, underdogs can win... Get the Whomper! Frenzy