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864 F'n Saint

About shanghaisailor

  • Rank
    Super Anarchist
  • Birthday 09/17/1955

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  • Location
    Shanghai, China
  • Interests
    Sailing in all its forms & most other watersports

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  1. shanghaisailor

    Going Paperless......

    Well the "F" is that most plotters don't interface with almanacs, tide tables and planned passage dates to provide tidal offsets when planning a passage. XTE is a 'live' function which tells you that you are already off track because you didn't get your pre-passage PASSAGE PLANNING correct. The reference to plotters is a bit of an old school argument when preaching electronics as the go-to solution for navigation as most SERIOUS offshore sailors are passage planning, navigating and routing using on board computers with the weapon of choice normally being the Panasonic Toughbook. Usually these guys use Expedition or Adrena software. We use Adrena on our boats and it will accept all sorts of plug ins like GRIBS, AIS, polars etc. It takes quite a bit more learning than a plug and play plotter but provides much more in the way of information. The lack of requirement to carry paper quoted up-thread is very much a local thing. From the US Government website §164.33 Charts and publications. (a) Each vessel must have the following: (1) Marine charts of the area to be transited, published by the National Ocean Service, U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, or a river authority that— (i) Are of a large enough scale and have enough detail to make safe navigation of the area possible; and (ii) Are currently corrected. So in Australia you don't need the charts, in the USA you are breaking the law if you don't. Key word is "MUST". It then goes on to state you should have the pilot of the area, tide tables etc etc. Each to their own I suppose but paper doesn't have batteries, electronics or electrics that could fail or zoom levels that could go un-noticed. (just ask Vestas!) Just being devil's advocate as I/we generally run on electronics but the paper chart will 99/100 have been checked before heading out and they live under a bunk cushion, always ready, just in case. Besides, being a cynical bugger, if the sh*t hits the fan, it is always another potential get out for the insurance companies. Just surmising SS
  2. shanghaisailor

    Going Paperless......

    The fact that our electronics are somewhat closer to the wet stuff than the average commercial vessel’s bridge might have something to do with it
  3. shanghaisailor

    How about a The Ocean Race thread?

    You are right - I did forget that one but when Mark left so did the energy and drive on that project and having seen (and still having on file) much of the info on that, they would have been weapons in my view, AND strong enough to be driven like they were stolen (as Volvo crews generally do) which is doubtful with a converted (read strengthened) IMOCA 60,even with pit stops.
  4. shanghaisailor

    How about a The Ocean Race thread?

    Rennmaus, it would have been a great injustice if Den Haag hadn't been selected again. A fantastic finishing point, The city (people and government) certain took part enthusiastically, from the boat numbers on the water, the crowds in the village, even the waiters in the restaurants joined in the fun. We walked into one with our DFRT gear on and they put "We are the Champions" (Queen) on the P.A. Correct Understand the confusion Mad.They were working on a new One Design "Super 60" when Mark Turner was at the helm, then the Volvo Supervisory Board did a U-turn that most politicians would have been proud of and canned it. From the material I saw at the time the three primary differences between the Super 60 and what will be going round with The Ocean Race are a) instead of 60 footers designed for fully crewed that could be used for short-handed, they will be 1 or 2 man boats beefed up for fully crewed, b) they will be bought and paid for by the teams instead of built by The Race and chartered and c) they will not be one design. So basically the idea for the foiling 60 footer was Mark Turner's not Johan & Richard's By the Way - don't read anything into the picture below regarding Dongfeng's participation in the next Race
  5. shanghaisailor

    Going Paperless......

    I started off by saying 2 problems with electronics but there are more than that First one is obvious - a bucket of water and you could be fucked Second one is the datum. On a chart it is obvious - printed in the corner.On a plotter it is not nearly so obvious if at all. Good example of the ramifications would be the Clipper yacht running up through either Philippines or Indonesia (I forget which)Crew told to miss Island 'X' by a mile. Trouble was chart wasn't WGS84 - BANG! Scratch one yacht but fortunately no crew. If I remember correctly the skipper got the chop over that one. Thirdly - Scaling & detail loss - we all know what happened to Vestas 2 VORs ago. Fourthly - bigger picture. It is rare on most of the yachts we mere mortals can afford to have plotters bigger than 10". I actually have been experimenting with my iPad Pro just because it is a little bigger than the average plotter and certainly a lot bigger than my own plotter but the detail is 'miniaturised' when zooming out to any decent sea area while a chart it huge by comparison and one can move from up close detail to wider areas literally in a blink. I generally navigate electronically but also have sea area charts on board as well if for no other reason I find it is more accurate to plot tidal current and leeway on paper when passage planning. I used to have a Yeoman Plotter. Fr those who don't know what I am talking about it was the size of a 1/2 folded chart with a substrate of a grid of wires. It had a wired in puck and connected to the GPS. When you put a paper chart on it you had to 'initialise' the chart with about 3 clicks and position input. Then little LED arrows pointed you towards your position on the chart to give you a GPS fix but on a paper chart. It had the waypoint plotting functionality of a potter but with the advantage that if your electrics went down as long as you had the good habit (from paper only nav) you at least still had a position that was only minutes old. Sadly long gone as even that system was too much for many modern sailors. And now we have enhanced reality coming in - sorry augmented reality. Where the fun and challenge in that, we will be spending more time upgrading software soon instead of trimming our sails.. I'm not a luddite, far from it but diving straight into electronics without understanding the data source is not wise in my view SS
  6. shanghaisailor

    Stay with the boat.

    Chances of being found when separated from the boat diminish alarmingly. WE had an issue on our lake here in China must be 10 years or so ago. One of our members came up to me and told me the cat that occupied the vacant space had been out for a long time. We went to the lake wall - nothing. We then took two powerboats out in separate directions and the 2nd one found the cat with the crew (son) clinging to it. They had capsized and the helm (father) had lost his grip on the mainsheet. Within seconds the boat drifted out of reach We instructed the other boat to take the son towards where he estimated the helm lost contact. WE charged back to the harbour and thankfully within a matter of minutes had seven (7) boats heading out t the estimated point of capsize and then added 100m or so upwind for good measure. We then commenced line search with approximately 100m between each boat and slowly motored downwind at a little over drift speed. The helm had grabbed a piece of flotsam and as the line of boats approached he waved it in the air and was spotted and recovered. Thankfully several things weighed in his favour. 1. Although he had been in the water for around 1.5 hours he was wearing the right sort of kit. High waisted trousers that trapped warmth along with a quality waistcoat buoyance aid that not only helped keep his torso warm but also meant he didn't expend a lot of energy trying to keep afloat. 2. There was another survivor that could assist with the search start point by directing the 'fleet' there. 3. We had a lot of boats, 9 in all to conduct the search. 4. The 'casualty' was aware and had just crossed his arms, floated and assumed that people would come looking for him. 5. It was summer in a semi-tropical setting (Shanghai) 6.It was arelatively small lake (only 76 Sq Km) Although he said he wasn't cold, he didn't stop to think twice when offered an offshore sailing jacket to put on. Simple fact is that it took 2 boats looking to find the capsized catamaran about 10 minutes to find it; it took 9 boats in an organised line search with knowledge where the incident likely took place led by someone who actually had received a bit of training in such matters over half an hour to find one person. - The cat was actually drifting on her side at an estimated 1.5kts+ The lesson - ALWAYS stay with the boat if possible, the chap above would have had no chance otherwise. SS
  7. shanghaisailor

    from deleted post about pointing higher

    Older sails with the draft further aft (baggy) certainly does have an effect on pointing ability
  8. shanghaisailor

    Brexit, WTF

    Except the deficit is running at twice the amount allowed for new membership of the EU. The heyday of oil revenues is way past, the cry of "It's Scotland's Oil" comes from decades old campaign material around the time Gordon Wilson was elected MP for Dundee East defeating Labour's George Machin. I campaigned for Mr Wilson (that was 45+ years ago and I was still at school) and he turned out to be a very good constituency MP for Dundee. Talk about opening up "West of Shetland" has been just that for decades, talk. I would also be interested how we would protect "our oil". A Navy isn't cheap, perhaps one of our golf club owners would lend us some of his country's ships?
  9. shanghaisailor

    Here is the future, like it or not

    The fact is (big word, fact) most sailors like to cruise and potter, even a dyed in the wool racer like me. over 90% of sailors never race. Many like to be able to spend a few nights on board, often with family or friends, accommodations are heavy with weight being the foilers biggest enemy. I completely agree with 'Curious' in post 24. There have been multiple "this is the futures" in the past and yet the vast majority of sailing is still done on fixed keel, non-foiling, non canting, non movable ballast monohulls. I too love speed, my personal record is 22kts on an offshore sailing boat and 44kts on a RIB but I also love the challenge of sneaking into a tricky mooring hole at a couple of knots with just fractions of a metre under my keel. Foiling boats and cats are great in a straight line but often not so clever on the corners and are absolutely useless in a match race pre-start. I have said this before on other threads, but the real future of sailing in boat terms would be a youth boat (or boats) that meant we didn't bleed our future quite so much when they got into their later teens - now there's the real challenge. SS PS I do agree though, this latest generation IMOCAs starting with Charal are chuffing awesome and Alex Thomson has, as usual gone that extra yard.
  10. shanghaisailor

    How about a The Ocean Race thread?

    No-one on Dongfeng complained about approaching Hainan in the dark two races ago(well they were hours ahead of the fleet having led almost all the way from Abu Dhabi). When news of the lead boat approaching the finish, the media 'fleet' roared off south east into the night - all except one that is, the Hainan TV RIB. The helm was our PRO at an event we have run in China and I managed to convince him to head due south so when the others were searching in the murk we had the happy situation of having Dongfeng all to ourselves as she was clearly "rushing towards an inshore finish at night" at Sanya "Hainan". Isn't it incredible how effective that retro-reflective paint is.
  11. shanghaisailor

    How about a The Ocean Race thread?

    I wouldn't disagree there Jack. Perhaps they were not sold the benefits properly. Certainly for almost the first 2/3 of its history they seemed OK with that. If I remember correctly the race started in the UK all the way up to 2005. The Welsh however were not so tight fisted last time round. :-) Funny that with all the up thread comments about going to Asia or Middle East no-one has mentioned that for the last few editions it started in the Med. Money talks right enough. And to follow through with your comment, what if a stopover IS willing to put up the cash? Should they be castigated because it means more Equator crossings? Just being devil's advocate ;-) SS
  12. shanghaisailor

    Country Bumpkin

    So this means Aussie terminology is stuck in the 1800's while the rest of the world has evolved ;-) No worries, just being a bugger - they are right though, a bumkin was 'in the old days' considered as sticking out in any direction :-)
  13. shanghaisailor

    How about a The Ocean Race thread?

    Completely agreejb5. This was something that DFRT did quite successfully, primarily in China but it is worth noting that Charles Caudrelier in a non- French event was voted French Sailor of the Year on the back of his VOR success as skipper. And rightly deserved I would say as he took a multi cultural and language crew to 2 podiums in the Volvo, perhaps even a more consistent performance than the victory itself. And here in China Horace and Black became celebrities during the race and at Guangzhou were mobbed and in Hong Kong what appeared to be hundreds wearing Horace t-shirts turned up and China is still a non sailing nation. In China they love when Chinese are doing well or doing things not considered 'normal'. This is evidenced by the Chinese media figures surpassing every other country in the VOR except the hotbed of sailing that is GBR and in the current SailGP China is, I am reliably informed, right up there in the numbers of followers of the event. The boat is important for the sponsor as it is that which is most visible, even from a distance and shows off their corporate logo but I think those teams that have (or make) celebrities from amongst their crews have (or miss) a great opportunity both for their team and the race as a whole. Witty was much maligned but his shoot from the hip comments raised the events profile. We all remember Blakey and Dalts - well those of old enough do and the younger ones read about their exploits, Tracy and her determination that brought about the first all women crew, Magnus, perhaps the greatest character of them all, the never give up man -Bowwe, or relatively young gun Charlie Enright, on camera stating his commitment to being an 'ocean racer'. The race needs them and I am sure non would begrudge the race 'wheeling them out' as characters that have helped build the legend that is The Race because theirs are real HUMAN stories that underpin whatever the race is viewed as. In some ways the building of those stories is more important than whether the race does 10 miles or 10,000 miles in the Southern Ocean or whether it goes to Asia or not - at least to the general NON-sailing public. Some wouldn't know the sharp end from the blunt end but easily recognise Ian Walker's bloodshot eyes as stress or 10 days growth and an unkempt look as someone who has been through the wringer. And how many women would relate to Tracy Edwards comments in Freemantle - and I quote "From when you are knee high to a grasshopper if you are a woman you are told you have to look like this, be like that, you have to use this, use that, you are told to do this, wear go into the Southern Ocean and for 28 days you don't have to wash, you don't have to dress properly, you don't have to do your hair - it was great" She was enabling women WAY before any of these so called campaigns. The race needs characters, in fact it needs AND SHOULD use every avenue to build interest in what we, as sailors, know is probably the toughest, and certainly the longest sporting event in the world (OK for the purists the toughest team sporting event) BUT even after 45 years it is still relatively unknown - are so bad at promoting our sport? Certainly less than double figures this century in the VOR would suggest that.
  14. shanghaisailor

    How about a The Ocean Race thread?

    Agreed regarding Auckland Sailbydate but Southampton as the home of the start & finish of the race for many 'Whitbread' editions would be hard to beat. It looked at times as if the whole of the Solent boat population was on the water seeing them off in sights that even made the Boxing Day Sydney Hobart crowds seems sparse. Portsmouth Harbour, while being the UK's primary Naval base would not be a terrific site for a race start with the associated spectator fleet as the entrance is narrow which can have quite a nasty sea state with the wind and tide in the wrong relative directions. (I've sailed it) Les Sable d- Olonne is really a fishing village in the Vendee Region (but you knew that) and the huge visitor numbers are just that - visitors which shows more to the strength of following for short handed sailing in France than the venue. The actual town (hardly a city) has a population of under 50,000 which just proves the attraction of the Vendee Globe as that means around 1.4m over the 3 weeks leading up to the start actually travel there to see the event - who'd be a traffic cop there at that time in the cycle. Perhaps the TOR could examine what the Vendee Region does or perhaps what the VG Race does to try and tap into this level of popularity. True fans will go out of their way to see their chosen sport. I extended a trip to our then head office in Bournemouth to be in Ocean Village to witness Steinlager2's triumphant return and more recently a friend of mine drove from Bournemouth to Cardiff for the stopover there. SS
  15. shanghaisailor

    How about a The Ocean Race thread?

    The Gothenburg - Den Haag leg last race was already short, Aarhaus was around the halfway point so a Denmark to Holland could even be a day sail and an even further dumbing down that so many people are shouting about unless they did a double lap of the North Sea first. Having said that Den Haag provided quite a circus for the Volvo Ocean Race, kilometres outside the city they had signs to the 'Volvo Ocean Race Car Park' and it appeared the whole city knew about the race and turned out in so many thousands that it took 15 minutes+ just to get from one side of the race village to the other. Even the waiters in restaurant knew about it, and not just a passing knowledge. When we walked into one to join some of our Chinese friends who had done the Legends Race (at some time after midnight) with our DFRT gear on they put on Queen's 'We Are the Champions' at full volume. (I can't quite recall when we left but it was approaching dawn) Regarding Ireland, it would be one hell of a party with the reported visitor numbers of over 1/2 a million (although how they fitted them all in goodness knows) when Green Dragon was an entrant in 2008-9 with many, including Puma's Ken Read stating it was the best stopover they had been involved with. One thing is for sure, the Celts know how to party. The Irish & the Dutch have provided excellent stops in the past and both would, in my opinion would be good choices for the next edition. It is a shame though that, having invented the damn thing, once again that would mean no involvement from GBR. SS