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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  


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About sclarke

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  • Location
    New Zealand
  • Interests
    Americas Cup

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  1. Team NZ

    They are arguably further along than most, if not all of the other teams. They have shared design data with ETNZ for 2 cycles now and no doubt have insight into what worked last time with ETNZ. I would say Luna Rossa is possibly one of strongest teams in terms of foiling. To say "they're nowhere near what any of the other teams got done last cycle" is clearly fantasy.
  2. Team NZ

    Quantum racing, possibly, but Luna Rossa are NOT new to foiling.
  3. Oracle Team USA

    If you've previously been convicted of Arson, and you're standing next to a burning house with a can of gas and a lighter in your hand and there's no one else around, and you have no alibi, then it is only reasonable that you would become number one suspect. Then its up to you to defend yourself. But if you have a history of Arson, it doesn't look good for you. Especially if there is supporting evidence pointing to you.
  4. Oracle Team USA

    It is irrelevant, absolutely irrelevant! If you cheat once in sport, there is absolutely no reason, none at all, to believe that you will not continue to do it again, especially when the stakes are as high as they are. Welcome to the real world! All they had to do was not cheat once, and there would have been no reason to suspect they had cheated again. No one else was caught cheating, just them, and they won the regatta they cheated in. It is absolutely reasonable to suspect that since they won this regatta, that they might do it again. Lance Armstrong cheated, does anyone really think he won't do it again? No. He brought it all on himself, he made his own bed and now he has to lie in it. Oracle must do the same.
  5. Oracle Team USA

    Difference is...there is valid points on both sides. It depends whether you believe it or not. Indio makes some perfectly valid points. Those who believe Oracle won fair and square just don't believe the evidence proves that. Those who believe Oracle cheated believe it proves they continued cheating into the Americas Cup match. Its like being in court. Just because evidence is deemed in-admissable in court, does not mean that evidence doesn't exist. There may or may not be evidence that Aliens exist, skeptics believe the evidence brought forward proves nothing, believers think the evidence is undeniable proof. The evidence exists, depending on what you want to believe.
  6. Oracle Team USA

    Flawed logic. All you're saying is...I think they cheated, I don't know why or how, I have no proof, and nothing to back up what I'm saying but I still think they cheated and they should not have won. That's called being a sore loser. The difference between what happened in San Fran and what happened in Bermuda is...in San Francisco, one team had been caught red handed cheating, which automatically brings any accomplishment they have achieved afterward into question. You can't get caught cheating, then pull off a "miracle" and not have that miracle questioned. That's just what happens when you cheat in sport. Once a cheat, always a cheat. What happened in Bermuda was a pure demolition job from one team who were just better than everyone else.
  7. Team NZ

    Still a pretty shitty thing to say. Blakes boat was boarded by guys with guns who weren't afraid to use them.
  8. Oracle Team USA

    Doesn't change the fact that Oracle Team USA were/ are and always will be, and rightly so, labelled as cheats. When, why and how they cheated is irrelevant, the only only relevant fact is that they DID cheat.
  9. Oracle Team USA

    The thing is... until something is proven, and is officially announced as "Cheating" in the Americas Cup match itself, it will always be speculation. It was the perfect storm scenario of a sequence of events that fueled the speculation of cheating. It started with Oracle being caught red handed cheating in the ACWS. Now they can say "Oh it was just a few rogue guys" But those guys were employed by the Oracle team, so the Oracle team were at least, at very least, associated with the cheating. They happened to win the regatta they cheated in and then were forced to hand back the trophy and were disqualified from the regatta and docked 2 points in the Americas Cup match. Then they were again caught infringing the "Spying" rules where they were inside the surveillance zone taking photos and video of the ETNZ AC72 in Auckland. They were then handed a punishment for that infringement as well. They knowingly, willfully and officially infringed two rules (one majorly) and were punished for both. This was the start of the Grant Dalton v Oracle feud. GD stated after the official announcement "They had to cheat to beat us" and he was correct, because they did. Later ETNZ were crowned champions of that ACWS regatta after the Oracle DQ. Fast forward to the AC, and Oracle, after being caught cheating not once, but twice, then attempted to change the rules mid series in the name of safety (Ruddergate) when clearly the rules weren't the issue, but the extremely unsafe Artemis design that was, then pulling off a "miracle" made the whole thing look extremely dubious and fueled speculation of once a cheater, always a cheater. At the end of the day, know one knows (or will confirm or deny) that they actually did cheat in the match itself, and it will always be seen as some sort of miracle comeback, but anyone who cheats in sport deserves to have the "Cheaters" label attached to them, and they undeniably cheated, that is a FACT, so they deserve to be seen as the cheaters they are. But they were demolished, destroyed and are now dead and buried. The AC will be a better event without Oracle Team USA involved.
  10. Team UK

    The difference being that Oracle chose a class of boat similar to what they had previously designed/ constructed and sailed in An Americas Cup previously. Oracle chose a multihull with a wing sail, so they already had gained a wealth of knowledge and data which no one else except Alinghi had(but they did not use a wing sail). That was the design advantage Oracle had. It was an obvious advantage. They knew how to design a multihull, they had tested a wingsailed multihull, and raced a wing sailed multihull, so they knew what worked and what didn't. Their crew and skipper were experienced in how to handle a wing sailed multihull. No other team had that knowledge, not even ETNZ. Oracle had a huge head start simply because they had done it before. Just because they did not know how to capitalise on that advantage does not mean it wasn't an advantage. NO ONE has successfully designed, constructed or sailed, let alone raced, a foiling monohull around a set course before. Like I said, it is closer to real sailing than foiling 50 foot, wing sailed catamarans with bikes and x-box controllers will ever be. Yes computers and lithium batteries may control fly height, but crews will ultimately be responsible for the majority of other functions, including grinders which will be used predominantly for trimming functions instead of oil pumps.
  11. Team UK

    I never said I was against stored energy/ engines. In fact I'm all for it, as long as it is only for the foil control systems. I would rather see the boats consistently flying while crew focus on tactics and trimming functions. Every other function (e.g trimming sails, hydraulic functions) should be manually controlled. Boats like Rambler 88, Wild Oats XI, Speedboat/ Perpetual Loyal/ Infotrack and even Comanche when configured for it, all use stored energy/ engines. It does not make the racing any less exciting. The entirely new, radical and untested aspect is what makes this cycle as level a playing field as it could ever be.
  12. Team UK

    Haha The BOR90 had an engine (Yes, Alinghi introduced them, but that doesn't change the fact that it still had an engine) Yes, it foils, but as ETNZ have proved to continuously be the only team that innovates in the Americas Cup, it shouldn't surprise anyone that only they have managed to come up with a design which incorporates the leading edge of foiling technology and innovation, as well as keeping with a somewhat traditional approach. No other team has managed to develop a reputation of innovation like ETNZ has. In terms of ETNZ introducing the X-Box controller and bikes in Bermuda, which was necessary to beat the likes of Oracle, they also have banned the bikes, and have taken a step away from the automated approach they developed for the Cats, which arguably has effectively nullified any advantage in that area they may have gained and has put all teams on a level playing field.
  13. Team UK

    You're absolutely right! It does amaze me how delusional you are!
  14. Team UK

    Big boats (larger than 50 feet), with full crews racing a boat with one hull with traditional soft sail configurations. This is closer to round the cans Wednesday night racing than 50 foot foiling cats with bikes and x-box controllers will ever be. Foiling or not, at least (at this stage anyway) ETNZ are committed to focusing on a more traditional AC, more traditional than it has been for the last 3 abominations anyway.
  15. Team UK

    Great preview for whats in store in the Americas Cup. This is sailing!