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    • UnderDawg

      A Few Simple Rules   05/22/2017

      Sailing Anarchy is a very lightly moderated site. This is by design, to afford a more free atmosphere for discussion. There are plenty of sailing forums you can go to where swearing isn't allowed, confrontation is squelched and, and you can have a moderator finger-wag at you for your attitude. SA tries to avoid that and allow for more adult behavior without moderators editing your posts and whacking knuckles with rulers. We don't have a long list of published "thou shalt nots" either, and this is by design. Too many absolute rules paints us into too many corners. So check the Terms of Service - there IS language there about certain types of behavior that is not permitted. We interpret that lightly and permit a lot of latitude, but we DO reserve the right to take action when something is too extreme to tolerate (too racist, graphic, violent, misogynistic, etc.). Yes, that is subjective, but it allows us discretion. Avoiding a laundry list of rules allows for freedom; don't abuse it. However there ARE a few basic rules that will earn you a suspension, and apparently a brief refresher is in order. 1) Allegations of pedophilia - there is no tolerance for this. So if you make allegations, jokes, innuendo or suggestions about child molestation, child pornography, abuse or inappropriate behavior with minors etc. about someone on this board you will get a time out. This is pretty much automatic; this behavior can have real world effect and is not acceptable. Obviously the subject is not banned when discussion of it is apropos, e.g. talking about an item in the news for instance. But allegations or references directed at or about another poster is verboten. 2) Outing people - providing real world identifiable information about users on the forums who prefer to remain anonymous. Yes, some of us post with our real names - not a problem to use them. However many do NOT, and if you find out someone's name keep it to yourself, first or last. This also goes for other identifying information too - employer information etc. You don't need too many pieces of data to figure out who someone really is these days. Depending on severity you might get anything from a scolding to a suspension - so don't do it. I know it can be confusing sometimes for newcomers, as SA has been around almost twenty years and there are some people that throw their real names around and their current Display Name may not match the name they have out in the public. But if in doubt, you don't want to accidentally out some one so use caution, even if it's a personal friend of yours in real life. 3) Posting While Suspended - If you've earned a timeout (these are fairly rare and hard to get), please observe the suspension. If you create a new account (a "Sock Puppet") and return to the forums to post with it before your suspension is up you WILL get more time added to your original suspension and lose your Socks. This behavior may result a permanent ban, since it shows you have zero respect for the few rules we have and the moderating team that is tasked with supporting them. Check the Terms of Service you agreed to; they apply to the individual agreeing, not the account you created, so don't try to Sea Lawyer us if you get caught. Just don't do it. Those are the three that will almost certainly get you into some trouble. IF YOU SEE SOMEONE DO ONE OF THESE THINGS, please do the following: Refrain from quoting the offending text, it makes the thread cleanup a pain in the rear Press the Report button; it is by far the best way to notify Admins as we will get e-mails. Calling out for Admins in the middle of threads, sending us PM's, etc. - there is no guarantee we will get those in a timely fashion. There are multiple Moderators in multiple time zones around the world, and anyone one of us can handle the Report and all of us will be notified about it. But if you PM one Mod directly and he's off line, the problem will get dealt with much more slowly. Other behaviors that you might want to think twice before doing include: Intentionally disrupting threads and discussions repeatedly. Off topic/content free trolling in threads to disrupt dialog Stalking users around the forums with the intent to disrupt content and discussion Repeated posting of overly graphic or scatological porn content. There are plenty web sites for you to get your freak on, don't do it here. And a brief note to Newbies... No, we will not ban people or censor them for dropping F-bombs on you, using foul language, etc. so please don't report it when one of our members gives you a greeting you may find shocking. We do our best not to censor content here and playing swearword police is not in our job descriptions. Sailing Anarchy is more like a bar than a classroom, so handle it like you would meeting someone a little coarse - don't look for the teacher. Thanks.


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  1. But Bob, we all know designers dont sail - something to do with ego's being water soluble. I have told the North guys to be sure to note down that this thread is all your fault. They will charge you double next time you get a price. A good woven Dacron sail, is hard to beat value for a boat like yours. If you want to spend a bit more $ for a bit more 'performance' Go radial for main, and laminate for jib . . . but dont feel you 'need to'.
  2. The info I had, said it was more reliable/durable than Ultegra (which was the alternative). Functionally I doubt I would know the difference in a blind test.
  3. nothing super fancy - Trek Domane frame with dura-ace. Just a nice relatively comfortable bike for long rides on country roads. ^^ and yea, fufkin, the Domane frame has a damping system also - "Front and Adjustable Rear IsoSpeed decouplers" - they felt good on my test ride. ^^^^ Fast, the gear thing has changed since I last bought a bike - I had 3 cogs in front and now only have 2 (11 in the back). That and the disk brakes seem like the big changes (other than the frame refinements). I'm obviously way out-of-date on developments.
  4. I dont think I ever scratched my mast with it, but I'm not 100% sure - my mast was not aesthetically perfect to start with. I did go up at sea a couple times solo with this gear, and it is just all about getting comfortable (and wearing a bit of padding). It is scary the first couple times, and I dont particularly like heights, but you pretty soon realize you are not going to die and you just need to get the job done. If you think you might do this at sea - go up and down a couple times the week before you leave for passage (yea, I know you will be busy). I did get and use a set of the foot ascenders, but I never really felt as secure with them - probably did not use them enough. But they sure were fast at the dock. That unicender is neat - will have to get one and see if it is as good as it looks
  5. jfyi, I saw this "The expected lifespan from the date of delivery is: 5 years for North Panel Cloth Coastal and Radian sails, 4 Years for North Panel Laminate Tour sails and 3 years for 3Di Endurance Sails." in North's Cruising Sail Quality Guarantee What I was looking for was some current detail on how 3di is doing the leach edge detail. qwerty123's comment about the scarf not being a stress riser is really a red herring because panel seams (even very blunt ones) typically dont fail due to stress riser fatigue at the edges. Perhaps a few have, but that is not the majority failure mode - which is that the join simply comes apart (a close review of their warranty data would confirm this. I had a very typical example with a North paneled spectra mainsail. Some abrasion on the stitching from a spreader, and the seam just peeled open for several feet). However the issue he brings up (stress riser edge fatigue failure) is a real failure point on leaches - where the doubled over leach tape creates a hard point which the sail flutter hinges on and weakens the fabric right in front of it. I was curious how this was currently handled in 3di - if that construction solved or reduced it it at all. The photos seem to show that they are still using a doubled over tape (but perhaps a narrower one than normal?) to constrain the leach line - and the edges dont look like they are staggered (as is best practice on 'regular' sails). But it may be that they are able to step the cloth there to smooth the transition and create less of a hinge? It that is actually the case, they would have a detail that is specific honest and productive to talk about (but obviously not if the leach transition is not actually significantly smoothed by the normal tape layout).
  6. another quick thread drift . . . . can anyone suggest decent road bike riding (rides not necessarily racing) forum or sites? I just ordered a new bike - should be delivered sometime next week. Currently doing "3 a days" so I will not embarrass the new bike. Have a suitably balanced life atm - spending some lovely time with my mother, coffee table conversation with bob and North, and the 3 a days (oh yea, and play time with the cat)
  7. LOL . . . I would not be happy if someone sold me a 'seamless' rope or piece of webbing, and I discovered it had a splice in it - even a 'tapered one'. Same with a long piece of teak for say a toe rail - if it was sold as 'seamless' I would not expect to find a scarf join. Also, your (I am presuming you are from North) 3di sails have broken just exactly at these seams - when the adhesive got f&^ked up - opened up, tore clear across - there are public photos. If you only want to compare to a rolled goods simple overlap seam - yes I agree there is less of a stress riser - but there are ways to make a rolled good seam better than that. And at least when I was involved, the 3di seam did in fact add some bulk (to get zero bulk you would have to exactly match a one tape step down/step up by hand placement across the entire width of the sail, which I dont believe you have the qa to do, nor actually would want to do) . I suspect these are going to be pretty decent sails, especially if you keep the price to competitive Dacron levels. But I think we can both agree that a total lack of structural panel joins (used just to avoid the semantic game you are playing) is not one of the benefits. You don't need to be slime balls - you actually have good products.
  8. ^^ fine bob. You and I have a different perspective on how far one should 'push' a client. (and on other things as we have discussed elsewhere). I would comment that 'unusually experienced' clients, were often the ones I felt I needed to push out of their box hardest. And yea, I actually think I do understand the custom consulting design process - both in boating and elsewhere. Both our approaches obviously worked for each of us. They have different 'failure modes' - and for sure neither is 100% successful. There is no criticism intended or implied in any of this. It is just 'coffee table talk'. I'm just sitting around killing time waiting for my mom to die
  9. lol - I dont know you AT ALL. But I do know #1 that the visibility from fb are really nice, and as bob says above . . . people tend to gravatate to to the best visibility spots, and I have several friends who felt the way you do now and after a while they bought another boat with better FB (despite most of them still not really liking the aesthetic). and #2 I know from my business marketing experience that most consumers dont really know in advance what they actually want. They only know after the fact. Part of the genius of Steve Jobs was giving people things they did not know they wanted, and part of the failure of Detroit is just giving people what they asked for. If you do actually rate aesthetics way way way over functionality, then no FB and you may be the rare duck that sticks that way And no-stress here, you can always get another boat if you learn something new about yourself from this one. regarding remote joysticks . . . . if you have an autopilot installed, it is super easy to accomplish and mostly a 'no-brainer' (I hate that phrase but it is sometimes useful). And (from just below) . . . yea Bob, I totally get 'know the client' . . . I was a decently successful consultant back in my corporate days. But I also felt it my responsibility to sometimes push the client quite hard into something they initially resisted and felt uncomfortable with. We discussed this a bit with your PS ketch. Yea, it is a tricky balancing act . . . I once convinced a Swedish board to hire a french CEO. That was a tough push - way out of their comfort zone But it worked out well after all was said and done.
  10. yes, but I imagine you could make a hollow 'fit over' external sleeve end fitting for your solid rods. You have all the machining capability to do something clever here. as I said above - the french g-class guys must have this sorted out. If you get to know a top french pro or two . . . it is interesting . . . they both have all sorts of really top contacts . . .and they have access to 'warehouses' just full of spare stuff from finished french programs - all sorts of exotic stuff just lying around. It is a different world that suddenly opens up.
  11. ^^ yes, agreed, we certainly had 'spare' headsails, but never carried a spare main - pretty damn big and difficult to wrestle on at sea. We used our trysail as a 'spare' a couple times when there was a problem with the main I did not want to fix. Another southern ocean situation we had was one of the harken bat cars broke, spilled all its balls and gouged the track so we could not raise or lower other cars past that spot. had a spare section of track, but we actually used the trysail until landfall that time because I did not want to replace the track section at sea. a total aside, but . . . about repairs at sea and in remote places . . . . there are a very few people in the industry who actually really know their shit inside and out at the top pro level (there are a lot of pretenders - I could count on my fingers and toes the real deals and still have a few fingers left). It is really nice to have these few people on sat phone speed dial - I had two sailmakers, a B&G guy and a yanmar guy who all saved my bacon a couple times.
  12. for sail repair - if you have a problem you can't glue, and you can't sew, I guess you are left with mechanical - rivets, thru bolts, grommets and such . . . . is there a fourth major alternative/approach I am overlooking?
  13. ^^ yup, I can'f find a pic of our batten end fittings, but they were sort of a combinations of these two: They screwed into the batten back like this: and then held the webbing a bit like these, except with a bit more rounded edges
  14. ok bob. But I predict if you give kim a minimal one, he will later wish it was bigger But then you can design him another boat. And IR/joystick remote control will be 'the future'.