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oldbitd

New 40 footer OD by FYD

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Its confirmed, the Dubai based builder Premier Composites has teamed up with FYD to design and build the next 40ft one design. Still in development, but looking pretty awesome from what I have seen.

 

Some details:

full carbon

milled molds and plugs

lifting keel (2m up and 2.9m down)

huge retractable sprit

SA up 102, SA down 235

Disp 4200

Ballast 2460

Grinder attached to primaries TP52 style

Inboard gennaker retrieving system

8 crew

splitable mast for transport

twin backstays

fits in open container

CAT 2

 

4 boats already sold.

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So MKF was right when he mentioned it a month ago.

Looks like the Soto gets some serious competition.

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So MKF was right when he mentioned it a month ago.

Looks like the Soto gets some serious competition.

 

Of course he was. He started this whole thing.

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Its confirmed, the Dubai based builder Premier Composites has teamed up with FYD to design and build the next 40ft one design. Still in development, but looking pretty awesome from what I have seen.

 

Some details:

full carbon

milled molds and plugs

lifting keel (2m 1.8m up and 2.9m down)

huge retractable sprit

SA up 102, SA down 235

Disp 4200

Ballast 2460

Grinder attached to primaries TP52 style

Inboard gennaker retrieving system

8 crew

splitable mast for transport

twin backstays

fits in open container

CAT 2 Cat1

 

4 boats already sold.

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So MKF was right when he mentioned it a month ago.

Looks like the Soto gets some serious competition.

 

Of course he was. He started this whole thing.

 

Word.

 

This isn't exactly news.

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Tuffie and doghouse how nice it is to be on the inside occasionally

 

BTW I am racing Melges 20 in Lake Garda and 40fters don't look too appealing right now !

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Tuffie and doghouse how nice it is to be on the inside occasionally

 

 

Sometimes you just fall into it, eh? :)

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Tuffie and doghouse how nice it is to be on the inside occasionally

 

BTW I am racing Melges 20 in Lake Garda and 40fters don't look too appealing right now !

 

Hey! You were "inside" right with me like a dirty shirt fella. Don't gimme any crap eh... ;)

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Its confirmed, the Dubai based builder Premier Composites has teamed up with FYD to design and build the next 40ft one design. Still in development, but looking pretty awesome from what I have seen.

 

Some details:

full carbon

milled molds and plugs

lifting keel (2m 1.8m up and 2.9m down)

huge retractable sprit

SA up 102, SA down 235

Disp 4200

Ballast 2460

Grinder attached to primaries TP52 style

Inboard gennaker retrieving system

8 crew

splitable mast for transport

twin backstays

fits in open container

CAT 2 Cat1

 

4 boats already sold.

 

I have a little hard time understanding why it makes sense to go through the hassles to have a lifting keel and then not make it fully retractable. Same thought I had about the Farr36. Seems like a lot of extra expense without realizing the full potential benefit.

 

Its confirmed, the Dubai based builder Premier Composites has teamed up with FYD to design and build the next 40ft one design. Still in development, but looking pretty awesome from what I have seen.

 

Some details:

full carbon

milled molds and plugs

lifting keel (2m 1.8m up and 2.9m down)

huge retractable sprit

SA up 102, SA down 235

Disp 4200

Ballast 2460

Grinder attached to primaries TP52 style

Inboard gennaker retrieving system

8 crew

splitable mast for transport

twin backstays

fits in open container

CAT 2 Cat1

 

4 boats already sold.

 

Your pop's one of them?

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The aim on this is different than the F36. The F36 did it just so you could trailer the boat as is, unlike say the 1D35 which had to take off hardware. The F40 will actually retract underway along with the rudder to get into shallow harbors.

 

Edit: I don't know who the guy that posted that is and if he is counting us or not. Not sure who the 4th would be either, maybe the poster.

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The aim on this is different than the F36. The F36 did it just so you could trailer the boat as is, unlike say the 1D35 which had to take off hardware. The F40 will actually retract underway along with the rudder to get into shallow harbors.

 

Edit: I don't know who the guy that posted that is and if he is counting us or not. Not sure who the 4th would be either, maybe the poster.

 

My point is that once you go down the route of a retractable keel (and rudder in this case) it would make trailering a hell of a lot easier if they retract all the way

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So MKF was right when he mentioned it a month ago.

Looks like the Soto gets some serious competition.

If the early numbers are accurate the Soto won't even see where this thing went.

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So.....purely a guess but:

 

- boat is 380k

- engine & etc gear is 35k

- sails are 60k

- electronics is 35k

- transport (to the US) is 35k

- commissioning is 10k

 

All up = 555k USD

 

Is that close or no cigar?

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I don't have a scale here at home, but I would guesstimate about 9.5 feet ish.

 

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There you go. I guess my eyes need checkin eh?

 

EDIT: Actually it's 8.06. Should have just some maths to start with instead of guessing now that I think about it. Ah well.

 

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7.5 feet

 

That seems a little short for a 40 footer - hell My Vipers sprit is longer than that

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With all these new 40ft OD threads I thought we may as well start collecting the data somewhere central.... I've added a few reference boats on the right hand side... feel free to edit at will and add what ever fields etc.

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With all these new 40ft OD threads I thought we may as well start collecting the data somewhere central.... I've added a few reference boats on the right hand side... feel free to edit at will and add what ever fields etc.

 

Excellent initiative. Will do my best to add data.

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How would the engine not be included in the boat price?

It seems like a lot of the "high end" race boats come as a base boat and that everything is added on after that. The McConaghy 36 is an example of this:

 

PRICING & ORDERING

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

McConaghy One Design Grand Prix Race Yacht excluding Sail, Engine and Electronics

$226,000 USD

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sail

$50,000 USD

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Engine

$4,500 USD

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Electronics

$7,000 USD

 

But it does look as if my pricing was maybe a bit high so I'll bring it down to 500k USD all up once you get everything in including labor & installations.

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How would the engine not be included in the boat price?

It seems like a lot of the "high end" race boats come as a base boat and that everything is added on after that. The McConaghy 36 is an example of this:

 

--snip--

 

Almost all boats, regardless of "end", come ex sails and dials. Whatever insanity you want to come up with for those is your business, but I'd call it $230k plus sails and dials for the 36...

 

Without measurements it's hard to peg sails, but a full set of 3DL (Main, 3 jibs, 3 kites) for an X-35 is just shy of $40k, so $50k might be a little spendy.

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That's the only time I have seen the engine priced separately that wasn't an outboard. You are still high regardless.

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That's the only time I have seen the engine priced separately that wasn't an outboard. You are still high regardless.

Think so? Even after all the stuff you have to add on after the purchase? Sheets, sails #'s, shackles, hiking pads, winch, wheel & sail covers? Autopilots, safety gear, cup holders and.....

 

I really think you're looking at around 500, but don't know what the word on the street is.

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Drawing and performance predictions look great. This is really the make or break design for Farr; if it is as good as their office can deliver and premier and other builders deliver the product it should see the new young guns there along...

 

They really seem to have done the right thing and reverse engineer from prospective owners what they want. In the short run IRC may be harsh on the carbon construction, but I firmly believe this is the way to go. Really hope the one design rules stick with eight crew max, but with a north american average weight...these boats do not need 10 people to race, also costs will kill it! One issue I am not sure about is the grinder for a 40 footer, sure it is cool; but is it really needed? If the long term maintance is not to high will be ok...but realistically is it 20K USd faster...latest porsche I have has carbon trim with all sort of go fast stuff, realistically the extra 30K it cost me doesn't get me to the office or end of the drive way any faster, just feels good....

 

Few guys have questioned the partnership with PC, like lots of start up builders over the past few years they have had their challenges, biggest issue has been about getting the right guys to Dubai. Being on the ground here, their cost base has been dramatically reduced (living costs) in the last 18 months, and this place is now almost afordable for most evryone to live in. This should facilitate them attracting some decnet boat builders, who lets face it will not be getting any AC or Volvo stuff at historical sorry should that be histerical pricing levels. Shipping should not be more that 8k in a 40 foot open top container anywhere in the world...

 

Lets see how this boat develops, there are some other fantastic boats in this size zone, but if the Farr team delivers this will be the boat in this size range which becomes the global 40 foot one design. What I actually wish is the Soto and Kerr were in a similar rating bucket so a sort of level 40 class ala the one tonners could be created to really attract participation.

 

Lets see what happens, but I have faith in Farr design and know the builder will deliver a quality product, but planning and control will be needed to ensure a delievry schedule is set and meet!

 

MKF

 

One more thing, really wish I had the time to be at the levels this weekend...Don, keep on delivering a great regatta..what is it almost 40 years now?

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That's the only time I have seen the engine priced separately that wasn't an outboard. You are still high regardless.

Think so? Even after all the stuff you have to add on after the purchase? Sheets, sails #'s, shackles, hiking pads, winch, wheel & sail covers? Autopilots, safety gear, cup holders and.....

 

I really think you're looking at around 500, but don't know what the word on the street is.

 

 

If you want to add cup holders and autopilot to this puppy you should be banned from any dock where a F40 is berthed..........what the F... do you think this is? Another hunterbenelina?

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How would the engine not be included in the boat price?

It seems like a lot of the "high end" race boats come as a base boat and that everything is added on after that. The McConaghy 36 is an example of this:

 

PRICING & ORDERING

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

McConaghy One Design Grand Prix Race Yacht excluding Sail, Engine and Electronics

$226,000 USD

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sail

$50,000 USD

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Engine

$4,500 USD

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Electronics

$7,000 USD

 

But it does look as if my pricing was maybe a bit high so I'll bring it down to 500k USD all up once you get everything in including labor & installations.

Probably because the C36 uses an outboard

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Drawing and performance predictions look great. This is really the make or break design for Farr; if it is as good as their office can deliver and premier and other builders deliver the product it should see the new young guns there along...

 

They really seem to have done the right thing and reverse engineer from prospective owners what they want. In the short run IRC may be harsh on the carbon construction, but I firmly believe this is the way to go. Really hope the one design rules stick with eight crew max, but with a north american average weight...these boats do not need 10 people to race, also costs will kill it! One issue I am not sure about is the grinder for a 40 footer, sure it is cool; but is it really needed? If the long term maintance is not to high will be ok...but realistically is it 20K USd faster...latest porsche I have has carbon trim with all sort of go fast stuff, realistically the extra 30K it cost me doesn't get me to the office or end of the drive way any faster, just feels good....

 

Few guys have questioned the partnership with PC, like lots of start up builders over the past few years they have had their challenges, biggest issue has been about getting the right guys to Dubai. Being on the ground here, their cost base has been dramatically reduced (living costs) in the last 18 months, and this place is now almost afordable for most evryone to live in. This should facilitate them attracting some decnet boat builders, who lets face it will not be getting any AC or Volvo stuff at historical sorry should that be histerical pricing levels. Shipping should not be more that 8k in a 40 foot open top container anywhere in the world...

 

Lets see how this boat develops, there are some other fantastic boats in this size zone, but if the Farr team delivers this will be the boat in this size range which becomes the global 40 foot one design. What I actually wish is the Soto and Kerr were in a similar rating bucket so a sort of level 40 class ala the one tonners could be created to really attract participation.

 

Lets see what happens, but I have faith in Farr design and know the builder will deliver a quality product, but planning and control will be needed to ensure a delievry schedule is set and meet!

 

MKF

 

One more thing, really wish I had the time to be at the levels this weekend...Don, keep on delivering a great regatta..what is it almost 40 years now?

 

M,

agree with most all of what you are saying here, which you pretty much already know from our earlier exchanges. One thing I do think though is the pedestal is absolutely mandatory. It's a game changer for gybing these big assyms.

 

The 8 man crew is a great idea, one of my favorites.

 

That's the only time I have seen the engine priced separately that wasn't an outboard. You are still high regardless.

Think so? Even after all the stuff you have to add on after the purchase? Sheets, sails #'s, shackles, hiking pads, winch, wheel & sail covers? Autopilots, safety gear, cup holders and.....

 

I really think you're looking at around 500, but don't know what the word on the street is.

 

 

If you want to add cup holders and autopilot to this puppy you should be banned from any dock where a F40 is berthed..........what the F... do you think this is? Another hunterbenelina?

 

Ha.

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Smackity smack smack smack.

 

Okay, so I don't know what I'm talking about. What do you think the all inclusive price will be? I still think 450-500 USD is accurate.

 

This is a totally carbon boat, isn't it?

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You keep taking 50k off every time you post.^_^

That's about right the DH, it's the same rate his 10R depreciates! :o:P:lol:

 

You meanie.:P

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Smackity smack smack smack.

 

Okay, so I don't know what I'm talking about. What do you think the all inclusive price will be? I still think 450-500 USD is accurate.

 

This is a totally carbon boat, isn't it?

 

Why does that matter? It these things are really going to produced in numbers, carbon will not be more expensive to build - in fact, might actually be cheaper.

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One thing I do think though is the pedestal is absolutely mandatory. It's a game changer for gybing these big assyms.

 

+1. While we are at it, can we get an overdrive box please :rolleyes:

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You keep taking 50k off every time you post.^_^

That's about right the DH, it's the same rate his 10R depreciates! :o:P:lol:

 

Mean, but funny. Not sure about that rate, though - well maintained cruisers tend to hold value better than race boats.

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You keep taking 50k off every time you post.^_^

That's about right the DH, it's the same rate his 10R depreciates! :o:P:lol:

 

Mean, but funny. Not sure about that rate, though - well maintained cruisers tend to hold value better than race boats.

Thanks captain obvious!

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You keep taking 50k off every time you post.^_^

That's about right the DH, it's the same rate his 10R depreciates! :o:P:lol:

 

Mean, but funny. Not sure about that rate, though - well maintained cruisers tend to hold value better than race boats.

Thanks captain obvious!

 

You completely missed my point. It's all good though - let's get back on topic and talk about the new Farr 40OD.

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You keep taking 50k off every time you post.^_^

That's about right the DH, it's the same rate his 10R depreciates! :o:P:lol:

 

Mean, but funny. Not sure about that rate, though - well maintained cruisers tend to hold value better than race boats.

Thanks captain obvious!

 

You completely missed my point. It's all good though - let's get back on topic and talk about the new Farr 40OD.

 

Any details released yet??

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Little bird mentioned that a trial IRC of 1.234 with metal fin was given and 1.248 with fabricated metal fin...

 

Seems competive.

 

Grinder is great, will change hoists and gybes; wonder if you could even get down to seven crew? Coutts 44 uses 8 and has runners....

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You keep taking 50k off every time you post.^_^

That's about right the DH, it's the same rate his 10R depreciates! :o:P:lol:

 

Mean, but funny. Not sure about that rate, though - well maintained cruisers tend to hold value better than race boats.

Thanks captain obvious!

 

You completely missed my point. It's all good though - let's get back on topic and talk about the new Farr 40OD.

 

I was just joking.;)

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"Grinder is great, will change hoists and gybes; wonder if you could even get down to seven crew? Coutts 44 uses 8 and has runners...."

 

1. Tactician / twin back stay, same effort as runners

2. Helmsman

3. Main trimmer

4. Jib /kite trimmer

5. Grinder

6. Pitman

7. Mastman / Grinder at hoist and gybes

8. Bowman

 

everyone got work to do......

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^

That's about right the DH, it's the same rate his 10R depreciates! :o:P:lol:

 

Mean, but funny. Not sure about that rate, though - well maintained cruisers tend to hold value better than race boats.

Thanks captain obvious!

 

You completely missed my point. It's all good though - let's get back on topic and talk about the new Farr 40OD.

 

I was just joking.;)

I knew that.

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Little bird mentioned that a trial IRC of 1.234 with metal fin was given and 1.248 with fabricated metal fin...

 

Seems competive.

 

Grinder is great, will change hoists and gybes; wonder if you could even get down to seven crew? Coutts 44 uses 8 and has runners....

 

Seems like a decent rating. Hope FYD are getting more reliable trial certs these days (as opposed to for the 11s)?

 

Pedestal will be huge for gybes, but wonder whether it will make much of a difference for the hoists - I remember that on the 1G TPs we often still just jumped the kite halyard at the mast and did not bother putting it on a winch (different in the newer boats with dual pedestals, of course).

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Little bird mentioned that a trial IRC of 1.234 with metal fin was given and 1.248 with fabricated metal fin...

 

Seems competive.

 

Grinder is great, will change hoists and gybes; wonder if you could even get down to seven crew? Coutts 44 uses 8 and has runners....

 

Seems like a decent rating. Hope FYD are getting more reliable trial certs these days (as opposed to for the 11s)?

 

Pedestal will be huge for gybes, but wonder whether it will make much of a difference for the hoists - I remember that on the 1G TPs we often still just jumped the kite halyard at the mast and did not bother putting it on a winch (different in the newer boats with dual pedestals, of course).

 

Personally, I think it's probably a zero sum game for the hoists. under 15-18 knots, hand over hand, over that, probably driven. Having only 8 crew though may make it a bit more appealing, not having to have a mast guy up there.

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factor in a wet kite on the 2nd hoist of the race or a kite with water in its belly from sailing a long beat in waves.....

 

on the 52 we use the primaries all the time...overkill sometimes, but otherwise it helps lots..

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factor in a wet kite on the 2nd hoist of the race or a kite with water in its belly from sailing a long beat in waves.....

 

on the 52 we use the primaries all the time...overkill sometimes, but otherwise it helps lots..

 

It's a pretty massive leap. We use driven hoists exclusively on the 52's also, but a 40 footer is completely different. The GP 42 is the closest comparison, and it's around 18-20 knots where you cross from hand to driven.

 

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yeah, gotcha, apparently I only focused on the hoisting discussion and not on the actual boat being discussed...

 

 

i say just rig up some blocks, line and sand bags at mast head that're tied to the kites....trip em and the kites will go right up.

 

 

 

what?

 

 

 

 

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