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Blur

SeaCart 26

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Hi Bush Sailor--

 

Nicely specific and useful comments. What kind of boat?

 

 

"a couple of comments from my boat:"

It is a self designed 7m tri called The Experiment Tilt 7

There is an old thread in here on it.

Cheers

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Hence why everyone puts the foils into race boats.

Its been proven for the last 10 years.

 

i cant even be bothered listing all the racing tris that have been launched without foils id be here all night!

 

 

 

The last racing trimaran without foils in the floats and only a board in the mainhull is the Seacart 30 as far as I know. Are there others more recent than this? I thought this thread was about owners of older boats contemplating a refit and redesign for foils in the floats but now it seems to be taking a turn towards questioning what is already the norm for race boats and no doubt will become standard on cruising boats soon. For example, a lightweight trimaran like the Seacart 30 might benefit in performance overall by substituting its centerboard with foils in the floats and certainly the gain in interior volume would make the boat more cruising friendly.

 

 

The thread is purely about the new SC26. There is no question on the viability of curved boards or canting masts for that matter. We know they both work and all their benefits. SC26 chose no mast cant for whatever reason, end of story.

 

BTW....I would also like to know the curved board (1) weight of the sc26 as someone mentioned 20kg but that could only be the solid steel versionbiggrin.gif

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Not really much more to be said about the SeaCart 26 is there? It's a rather expensive daysailor with fancy attachments that make it go faster. It's an interesting foray into making a one design boat but it's difficult to see it gaining much traction except for a small and select group with pockets stuffed full of cash. Personally I think we are more likely to see succesful one design racing coming about in Ian Farrier's F22 particularly if he can bring it to market with the price expectations he has mooted. It's not as sexy but it's a much more practical option for more sailors with normal sized budgets and good sized fleets are a possibility.

 

More to the point we are going to have to consider how best to integrate the SeaCart26 into mixed multihull fleets where it will most likely see most of it's racing. Henry Kaye's results on his SeaCart26 will provide some useful information on that front. At present the OMR handicap system in Australia does not penalise lifting foils if they become more common we might have to look at how best to handicap to a point where the best sailor will have a chance of winning on handicap not just the best equipped. The problem is in some conditions the foils equal a race winning advantage and in others they dont so perhaps the handicap will have to be based on a combination of wind strength and seastate or percentage performance above a certain benchmark?

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The problem is in some conditions the foils equal a race winning advantage and in others they dont so perhaps the handicap will have to be based on a combination of wind strength and seastate or percentage performance above a certain benchmark?

 

Please don't go down that path - it leads just leads to disagreements.

 

One number and go racing. Every dog will have its day that way and we all know where everyone else stands at the start of the regatta.

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The problem is in some conditions the foils equal a race winning advantage and in others they dont so perhaps the handicap will have to be based on a combination of wind strength and seastate or percentage performance above a certain benchmark?

 

Please don't go down that path - it leads just leads to disagreements.

 

One number and go racing. Every dog will have its day that way and we all know where everyone else stands at the start of the regatta.

 

 

totally agree !

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Some one said the average gain from foils is 5 percent. If you Penalise foils by 5 percent do you think they'd all get left on the dock? I bet they would! Prob better to see how it goes im a few more regatta's before getting too worried? There weren't any all out race boats at the last event were there?

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Some one said the average gain from foils is 5 percent. If you Penalise foils by 5 percent do you think they'd all get left on the dock? I bet they would! Prob better to see how it goes im a few more regatta's before getting too worried? There weren't any all out race boats at the last event were there?

 

Agreed it's good to build a knowledge base. Penalising by 5 percent or any percentage might be an overreaction when looked at over the scope of a series. The SeaCart26 did not dominate the regatta like the SeaCart30 had previously and it is the closest to an exclusive race boat of any of the multihulls at the regatta.

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I think we'd need to get into a lot more detail about specific geometry to determine this, but firstly I'm talking about loads on the beams, not the root of the foil.

 

 

No need to get into the geometry. Hopefully bush sailor worded it in a better way for you.

 

Just looked at the latest pics of the SeaCart26 on their website, sure is a sexy little boat.

Bushsailor specifically referred to loads generated by curved foils. My first post said that if you want to avoid these loads, use T-foils. Two completely different geometries and hence loads. Does this mean you were referring to curved foils all along?

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The problem is in some conditions the foils equal a race winning advantage and in others they dont so perhaps the handicap will have to be based on a combination of wind strength and seastate or percentage performance above a certain benchmark?

 

Please don't go down that path - it leads just leads to disagreements.

 

One number and go racing. Every dog will have its day that way and we all know where everyone else stands at the start of the regatta.

 

 

totally agree !

 

Totally agree, look at larger centerboards and measure them. they make a massive difference to windward.

 

 

 

 

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The problem is in some conditions the foils equal a race winning advantage and in others they dont so perhaps the handicap will have to be based on a combination of wind strength and seastate or percentage performance above a certain benchmark?

 

Please don't go down that path - it leads just leads to disagreements.

 

One number and go racing. Every dog will have its day that way and we all know where everyone else stands at the start of the regatta.

 

 

totally agree !

 

Totally agree, look at larger centerboards and measure them. they make a massive difference to windward.

 

 

 

 

 

Agree 1000% Been down this road.......leave it.

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Anyone know if a SC-26 has made it to U.S. shores yet?

 

Would love to check one out (East Coast)....my Lottery tickets have to pay off one of these days. ;-)

 

Regards,

 

**R. Thompson**

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Big question is if straight foils are faster and safer around a tight course when fleet or match racing. AC45 designers seemed to think so. The Seacart 26 was designed not as a lake or coastal racer but a one design buoy racer. So first to suggest a canting rig for a boat like this is ridiculous. Not sure curved, J, T or any other foils will be easily and rapidly adjusted on short courses. Will be interesting to see how the 72' AC boats with 11 crew manage to tune exotic foil profiles.

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Big question is if straight foils are faster and safer around a tight course when fleet or match racing. AC45 designers seemed to think so. The Seacart 26 was designed not as a lake or coastal racer but a one design buoy racer. So first to suggest a canting rig for a boat like this is ridiculous. Not sure curved, J, T or any other foils will be easily and rapidly adjusted on short courses. Will be interesting to see how the 72' AC boats with 11 crew manage to tune exotic foil profiles.

Ummm, the AC-45s are one-design, curved foils are not allowed.

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The Orma 60s have hydraulic rams on the shrouds. Do you know if the MOD70s adjust the rigs on each manuever during their >30 minute inshore races? As to under 60' inshore racers I hope the boat you mentioned has a crewmember with a prehensile tail if they are actively canting the rig while doing laps around the cans weeknights. Neither the AC45s nor the 72s will have canting wings if that means anything.

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Do you know if the MOD70s adjust the rigs on each manuever during their >30 minute inshore races?

Yes they do, just open the valve before the tack/gybe, let the rig flop over under wind pressure/gravity (a few seconds), then turn.

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Do you know if the MOD70s adjust the rigs on each manuever during their >30 minute inshore races?

Yes they do, just open the valve before the tack/gybe, let the rig flop over under wind pressure/gravity (a few seconds), then turn.

 

As Hump says...canting the rig on anything is basic and easy. So BS, I don't know why you think canting on the SC26 is as you say, ridiculous. If i have spent $100,000 on the boat, it would be one of the first things I do.

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It is sc30 hull no 2 "Morticia" recently imported from Sweden. Pittwater will be her new home.

 

 

Thanks for the info is the new owner intending on racing the boat?

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Yep, main focus at the moment is BtoG then Airlie after that. Will be racing around pittwater until then.

 

Have you been introduced to the guys at RMYC, is that bengalla's mooring, I can see her (not at night) from my place, do you need a caretaker :)

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NZ 8.5 rules. With some good will it might be possible. She is not made for long offshore races though. The guys at MOCRA UK granted dispensation for headroom (1,1m in UK) and berth when measure the SeaCart 26 for Cowes Week 2011 mainly because they think the future will feature more day racing boats - still capable of a tough beating (plenty of +20 knots days the Solent 2011). Mast is 100mm to 200mm to high. Engine 8 hp - we normally use 2,5hk (need plenty of more power in a blow)... Small differencies to the rule that can be granted and/or adjusted to fit the rule. She miss length and width... So it might be possible!?

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imho

 

the 8.5 rule came about to encourage close racing with an existing set of cheap, race/cruise boats

 

"old" boats, which are "cheap", can be "grand-fathered in" if their "out of class" measurement doesn't increase performance

 

so if the design is older than the rule, lack of headroom won't kill it's chances

 

but that wouldn't work for a new design

 

and a taller rig would have to be made shorter

 

but the real killer for the sc26 is the price and performance

 

if the boat costs over nz$100,000/us$80,000?

 

it's not cheap enough to fulfill the intention of the rule

 

so why would the current class sailors vote to allow in boats that would probably decimate them on the course?

 

seacart would have to make the boat fit the rule as it is now and avoid the need to vote it in

 

or buyers would have to buy an expensive new boat and then chop the mast and sails and raise the cabin roof

 

or simply sail in the auckland multi fleet but outside the 8.5 class rule competing on handicap with boats like this

 

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/boats-marine/yachts-sail-boats/moored-boats/auction-540667736.htm

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Multi Cup 2013 race calendar. Minimum 5 GP, last GP are the final including price ceremony, therefore a must! Calendar is also published in Search Magazine, January issue. Welcome to join the fun!

post-9770-0-02736400-1357814013_thumb.jpg

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