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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  
kimbottles

Perry Sliver Class Day Sailor

13,217 posts in this topic

Just noticed. 132 Pages both, for Origami and Sliver. Pardon my French; WTF. 

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On 20/05/2017 at 6:34 AM, IStream said:

Davidson shut his shop a couple of years ago. Not sure what he's up to now but probably not welding Ti.

Very very late to this. 

West Engineering make Ti (+carbon etc) stanchions. (And other stuff) http://www.westengineeringltd.co.uk/lifelines.aspx

Just really posting for ref purposes.

main_636348537271635077_3-various-stanch

Ti rail: 

main_636348535730979077_3-Southern-Wind-

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9 hours ago, Bob Perry said:

By the way:

You call that a "wake"?

Pathetic, innit? ;)

No wake at all.  I blame the designer.  :P:D

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9 hours ago, Tanton Y_M said:

Just noticed. 132 Pages both, for Origami and Sliver. Pardon my French; WTF. 

Well, given that you appear to be French I think we can easily pardon you Yves-Marie for your expletive.

The fact you point out about the 132 pages each does really showcase the diversity of these forums.

We would love to take you sailing if you ever find yourself in the Seattle area!

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42 minutes ago, kimbottles said:

This is very useful for me, thank you for giving me that link Ed!

If you're going to add boat jewellery, might as well do it properly. 

Do like these. Also from West. Ti fairleads. 

main_636343359936820746_deck-fittings-Fa

 

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Those are very nice Ed

 

Yves-Marie:

Good idea. Come on out. My shack is your shack!

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We are investigating the best way to add lifelines to FRANCIS.

We are looking at the Douglas Fir sheer clamp and composite toe rail configuration to figure out how best to mount the stanchion bases.

It looks like we will need to have custom bases made, I can't find any standard bases that will fit. I think we might want to have the bases wrap up and over the toe rail.

Any ideas out there? 

IMG_9073.JPG

IMG_9072.JPG

IMG_9071.JPG

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Kim: It would be nice if you could  retain the sweep of the toe rail unbroken. At least on the outside.

Have you exhausted the idea of having a pipe socket in the deck running down inside the hull w/ G10 stub rod to slide the stanchion over. You'd have to shim out to it from the hull but it would be clean and no leaks, no fastenings. We did it this way on the carbon cutters.

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11 hours ago, Tanton Y_M said:

Just noticed. 132 Pages both, for Origami and Sliver. Pardon my French; WTF. 

"La guerre n'est pas une aventure. La guerre est une maladie. Comme le typhus."

Saint-Ex

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How about having the stanchions welded to an L shaped base that would bolt to the deck flush against the toe rail with lateral bolts through verticals of the L and the rail? That would keep the sheer line unbroken and minimize the loss of deck space as well as having them braced in two planes.

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19 minutes ago, SloopJonB said:

How about having the stanchions welded to an L shaped base that would bolt to the deck flush against the toe rail with lateral bolts through verticals of the L and the rail? That would keep the sheer line unbroken and minimize the loss of deck space as well as having them braced in two planes.

That's pretty much what I was thinking about, I like the two planes, but I want to investigates Bob's comment too. I plan to visit Jim Betts and talk to him about it. He seems like an expert in these sorts of things.

 

Of course in the end it has to make Both Kim & Bob happy. She is as much Bob's boat as she is mine.

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Ironically, my initial post included a system pretty much identical to the system Jon proposes. But as I typed out the socket and stub suggestion it sounded so much cleaner and better I deleted the other system, I don;t c are for Jon's idea of having the stanchions welded to the base. Pretty easy to bend a stanchion and need to replace it. Maybe a stub welded to the base and the stanchion slides over it as in my suggestion.

Jim Betts did some testing to destruction on the socket and stub method and found it very satisfactory.

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1 minute ago, Bob Perry said:

Ironically, my initial post included a system pretty much identical to the system Jon proposes. But as I typed out the socket and stub suggestion it sounded so much cleaner and better I deleted the other system,

 

Jim Betts did some testing to destruction on the socket and stub method and found it very satisfactory.

If it is good enough for Bob and Jim who am I to question it?

Now I just have to go up to Betts Boats and see what they are talking about.

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I'll be there Weds morning again Kim. And the next Weds and the next Weds etc. Doctor's orders you know. " You should spend more time at the boatyard!" No Lie.

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I'd agree with either 

(a) L shaped s.s. brackets inboard with stanchions welded to them. You should have a short stub of round bar or flat bar between so you can get a decent weld (welding a vertical tube to a flat vertical plate directly is ugly and doesn't allow a nice weld)

(b) I'd strongly recommend the G-10 stub rod poking through the deck with your deck construction. Leaks into a wooden boat (especially the toerail) would be a big headache. With the G-10 stub you only have 1 penetration and you then glass it in to the deck structure. Very strong and pretty leakproof. Considerably more work on the inside but since you have quite vertical topsides the inside bracket doesn't have to be that obvious. Depending on the deck skin laminate (pretty thin because she is cold molded right?) it might be wise to have a small painted G-10 donut around the base of the stanchion to provide a bit more local stiffness.

It is quite common raceboat/custom boat practice and is well proven. It gives a very clean look too. And you can use composite stanchions if you want too.

http://csparnz.com/why-composite-stanchions/

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Zonks:

Thanks. There is a "clamp" of sorts that would help strengthen the deck there. And you are right, the topside are quite slab and that would make the interior work easier.

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Something like this? (slow monday morning at work):

stancion%20base_zpsatgql4an.jpg

Could be a socket for the stancion itself, or glue your pultruded rod in there and slip the tube over it.  Shown at 100 degrees included angle, would need to measure and match to the deck/toerail angle.

Ordinarily I'd recommend a 3D print of the part which could be used as the pattern for casting, but not for Frankie.  Could also 3d a mold for a composite part. 

 

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Kir:

Yes, they now want $399 a year but I am liking the results I get on Flickr better. I can still access my library on Photobucket but I can't download any new pics.

I'm getting the hang of Flickr.

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I tried Flickr this morning, and it doesn't like my Chrome browser.... something about cookies, but I can't find the setting to change it. 

So I just threw that on my photobucket account - does it not show up? 

How about this one: (my boat is the one on the far left, taken on the 4th)

Angel%20island%202_zpsbqfkkq3d.jpg

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1 hour ago, Kirwan said:

I tried Flickr this morning, and it doesn't like my Chrome browser.... something about cookies, but I can't find the setting to change it. 

So I just threw that on my photobucket account - does it not show up? 

How about this one: (my boat is the one on the far left, taken on the 4th)

Angel%20island%202_zpsbqfkkq3d.jpg

I see nothing, on either post.

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Let's keep this reasonable - I think the only alternative is to have the stanchions retract into the deck...

Or - (just a consideration) do like they did on the later SC70s ?  - They'd take the bottom of the stanchion tube, flatten it a bit and weld it (perfectly smooth-finished) to the top of a large diamond padeye. - but I think they also used inboard struts...nevermind - but,  it sure looked clean on the sleds - who used the padeyes as outboard lead locations.

As humbug for a post-construction detail,  but yes - doing them like the stubbed-ones on the Biecker-designed Shilshole27 would seem the most leak--free manner  ( see:   http://shilshole27.blogspot.com/  )   - stanchion base details shown near bottom of second-page ( one OLDER than current )

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Pictures by Alex Kimball from aboard Gypsy Wind from yesterday.

IMG_1801.JPG

IMG_1804.JPG

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Bob, go ahead and post that video from Alex, I can't seem to make it work here.

Much too good of a video not to share with our pals here.

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1 hour ago, kimbottles said:

I see nothing, on either post.

Wierd, because your quote appears to me to include the photo... I'll have to try another go with Flikr.

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Trying photobucket again.... 

The stanchion bracket

stancion%20base_zpsatgql4an.jpg

My boat at Angel Island (farthest left):

Angel%20island%202_zpsbqfkkq3d.jpg

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Well, my shots aren't really worth all the trouble, but here goes anyway (from flickr);

A quick stanchion base:

35805676916_c849736f86_m.jpg

 

My boat from the 4th at Angel Island.. (It's no FL, but at least it's a Perry - far left);

35714411711_3feb2b8925_c.jpg

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Kir:

Finally, the images came through.

Nice stanchion base but I'm going to push for the Betts style. I just want to see a stanchion magically rising from a clean deck.

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14 minutes ago, Kirwan said:

Well, my shots aren't really worth all the trouble, but here goes anyway (from flickr);

A quick stanchion base:

35805676916_c849736f86_m.jpg

 

My boat from the 4th at Angel Island.. (It's no FL, but at least it's a Perry - far left);

35714411711_3feb2b8925_c.jpg

Cute boat, I like her.

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That's kind of what I originally had in mind for the bases, but now I need to go see what Jim Betts is doing. Might as well go look at what the best builder around is doing. And he is a nice guy too which is rather handy.

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One of my best designs.

I just went through my photos, on both computers. I was sure I had a pic of that stanchion detail. I remember them having some of them in place. But unfortunately I can't find a pic.

 

This is the best that I can do for now. This pic shows the end of the tube that extends down into the hull about 6". Into this tube goes the G10 stub rod. Over that rod goes the stanchion. If the stanchion is damaged it can be easily replaced. If the G10 rod is damaged (unlikely) it can easily be replaced.

On the cutters these tube ends will be buried in the teak cap rail.

tube 1

 

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4 hours ago, Kirwan said:

Trying photobucket again.... 

The stanchion bracket

stancion%20base_zpsatgql4an.jpg

My boat at Angel Island (farthest left):

Angel%20island%202_zpsbqfkkq3d.jpg

What we see is this:

bwe.png.d6e4129b816c973d3415b17ec6eaf782.png  

Having been burned by Dropbox (they disabled their convenient '/public' folder which removed ~1000 images I had included in SA posts over the years), I think now that the best way to handle media is to let the SA forum host it.  Use "Drag files here to attach" to posts or the "Gallery" feature at the top of the page.

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Kim, your stanchions / vessel are a difficult decision to pull the trigger on. I assume you have ruled out a 1" sch 40, 42" high full perimeter top rail.

Using the toe rail to support the stanchion base may introduce a deficiency we might not be aware of, if a stanchion was hit or stressed. I would personally despise trapping water or debris along that nice toe rail. One quick with a hose from the bow should send it all the way to the stern and overboard. As much as also hate inboard stanchion braces, I do believe you have some room for them. Take a little load off the single post stanchion concept, maybe a combo.

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Kims could also be removable. Remove the stanchion and remove the G10 rod and you'd have a 1" pipe exposed. But I suspect that once you get used to the security of the lifelines they would stay. Take them off for the wooden boat show.

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I think we would only remove the ones around the cockpit for daysailing. The ones forward are mainly to offer a good place to tie down the furled asymmetrical kite when beating so they would rarely be removed. 

Maybe all off for shows like Bob says. Maybe not, depends on how they look for real.

 

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As my latest drawing shows, I have dropped the lifelines in way of the cockpit to avoid interference with winch handles..

Check out post on this thread. 12992.

I think it would be a mistake to try to run the lifelines past the cockpit.

 

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4 minutes ago, Bob Perry said:

As my latest drawing shows, I have dropped the lifelines in way of the cockpit to avoid interference with winch handles..

Check out post on this thread. 12992.

I think it would be a mistake to try to run the lifelines past the cockpit.

 

Yes, that is how I would generally have her lifelines configured, only adding the cockpit section when required for a race.

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Kim:

Did I send you a .dwg file for that lifeline drawing?

I can't find it on ether computer here.

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Took FRANCIS out to the beercan race off Eagle Harbor.

managed to get most of the crew off a very competitive vessel to join us.

staggered start, first start at 6:00pm we start at 6:15.

nice breeze 8-15 up and down.

used the Harken Top Down Furler for the A2

race goes through the ferry course so some dodging required.

caught every boat except one by the weather mark

caught the first starter half way down the run

Rounded the leeward mark and thundered to weather finishing far enough ahead of second place we aren't even sure which boat got second.

a very good time was had by all! (Nothing like 9-10 knots boat speed to weather to bring out the smiles.)

Anyone recognize the dude in the last photo?? (He was a very good main trimmer despite the fact that sailing is not the sport he is famous for.)

 

IMG_9079.JPG

IMG_9080.JPG

IMG_9081.JPG

IMG_9077.JPG

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dont know who he is, but does look a little like Peter Sagan with a haircut.

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Kiel Reijnen of the Trek Segafredo Pro Tour team. (Top level of world cycling for you non cycling fans.)

http://www.treksegafredo.com/team/riders/kiel-reijnen

He is from Bainbridge Island and I rode along with him Monday when he was taking it easy (I had to work hard to stay with him.) I asked him if he wanted to go sailing as we rode along and he was happy to say yes.

I suggested he bring his dad. His dad is a very good sailor, so I let him drive.

Kiel leaves later this week to go back to racing. He was only home for a short break.

 

IMG_9074.JPG

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Now this ^^^ is good stuff that we like to hear about in this thread!

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2 hours ago, Bob Perry said:

Congrats on the win Kim. Thanks for making me look good!

It ain't me that makes you look good, it is FRANCIS that makes you look good!

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From the foredeck crewman whose name happens to be "Francis"!!IMG_9086.JPG.4b97d543e0246c377081bff52bf63e6b.JPGIMG_9085.JPG.ea025434476b018bc0ae00c46749d346.JPG

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2 hours ago, A horse, of course said:

Do you ever sit her out? Or need to get the crew forward? I think the answer maybe no ....

We try to keep the crew centered fore and aft in the cockpits. We do sit on the high side in the cockpit. Rarely does anyone sit on the rail. She doesn't seem to notice weight on the rail. We had a mob aboard yesterday. Eight of us. Usually race with six. More room that way. Could race with four given how well the Harken top down furler works.

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Crew weight on Frankie will be more about fore and aft placement.. The boat is too narrow with way too deep  VCG to benefit from a few puny humans  moving around.

We are in the rel of the Gods here.

There should be a Wagner opera , FRANCIS LEE. Libretto by Bob perry.

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Yep - not unlike that (narrow, very deep-keeled)  Swarbrick/Admiralty 30/JS9000 - once you heel over about 8 degrees the ballast package is outboard of the sheer - go ahead and hike if you want,  but....it ain't doing much. 

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Bob,

You might want to give Allied Titanium a call for the lifelines. I haven't worked wi them for years now, but they used to make custom titanium G9 lifelines for about $75 a piece. About the same price as Ronstans 304 stainless. Half the weight, and have a lot more spring before being deformed, and unlike carbon they won't shatter if pressed. 

I am not sure if Francis is carbon, but titanium won't have corrosion issues with a carbon skin either.

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Stumble:

Great idea! Kim would like the idea.

No, Frankie is composite wood, that kind of carbon. Still, weight is always the enemy.

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If you go to their website and just search for stantiones and associated bits (caps, rollers, etc) they have a couple hundred options available. Just don't trust the prices as listed. Because it's mostly custom work some of the prices may not have been updated in years. 

Fwiw. There are two alloys I would suggest G2 and G9. G2 will be cheaper, and with about the same strength as 304 it's basically a size for size swap. G9 is an aerospace allow used for tubing, and is roughly twice the strength of 304 (though about half as stiff) so you could go much thinner and save even more weight but at a cost premium, but the stantions would flex a good bit if heavily loaded. So each of the stantions acts a littl like a spring, and will flex to absorb impact loads instead of deforming like stainless does. 

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23 minutes ago, StumbleNola said:

If you go to their website and just search for stantiones and associated bits (caps, rollers, etc) they have a couple hundred options available. Just don't trust the prices as listed. Because it's mostly custom work some of the prices may not have been updated in years. 

Fwiw. There are two alloys I would suggest G2 and G9. G2 will be cheaper, and with about the same strength as 304 it's basically a size for size swap. G9 is an aerospace allow used for tubing, and is roughly twice the strength of 304 (though about half as stiff) so you could go much thinner and save even more weight but at a cost premium, but the stantions would flex a good bit if heavily loaded. So each of the stantions acts a littl like a spring, and will flex to absorb impact loads instead of deforming like stainless does. 

Interesting!!

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Stumble,

Do you know what titanium grade is used for those eyeglass frames that can be darn near tied in a knot?

The eyeglass stuff might be a little to rubbery for stanchions.  Or perhaps not?

Steve 

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On 11/07/2017 at 2:04 AM, kimbottles said:

We are investigating the best way to add lifelines to FRANCIS.

We are looking at the Douglas Fir sheer clamp and composite toe rail configuration to figure out how best to mount the stanchion bases.

It looks like we will need to have custom bases made, I can't find any standard bases that will fit. I think we might want to have the bases wrap up and over the toe rail.

Any ideas out there? 

IMG_9073.JPG

IMG_9072.JPG

IMG_9071.JPG

What's the thickness of the top? Bore a 35mm hole through, glue in a composite 32mm socket. Stanchion fits socket.  Plug fits socket when stanchions are not in 

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35 minutes ago, Spoonie said:

What's the thickness of the top? Bore a 35mm hole through, glue in a composite 32mm socket. Stanchion fits socket.  Plug fits socket when stanchions are not in 

Not sure that would be strong enough unless we also fasten to deck. That toe rail is foam core.

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I might get myself in trouble here, and it would be a PITA to install, but don't some Morris yachts have retracting lifeline stanchions?

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Jamhass:

Go to the back of the class.

See that tall, pointy hat?

Pu it on and sit in the corner for two weeks.

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8 minutes ago, Bob Perry said:

Jamhass:

Go to the back of the class.

See that tall, pointy hat?

Pu it on and sit in the corner for two weeks.

Welcome!   And don't worry Jamhass - it's not too bad back here. :D

Bart1

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I knew this would happen, and I went ahead and did it anyway...  it hit 105 here today, but likely not an acceptable excuse. 

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1 minute ago, jamhass said:

I knew this would happen, and I went ahead and did it anyway...  it hit 105 here today, but likely not an acceptable excuse. 

Go easy on him Bob, he has a Valiant 40!!

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On 7/16/2017 at 6:42 PM, Panope said:

Stumble,

Do you know what titanium grade is used for those eyeglass frames that can be darn near tied in a knot?

The eyeglass stuff might be a little to rubbery for stanchions.  Or perhaps not?

Steve 

They are primarily G2. The ability to flex like that is just down to size. Because Ti is so springy it's hard to apply enough force to a glasses frame in a small enough spot to deform the metal. But with tubing the diameter is really what provides the stiffness not the metal, so a pretty springy alloy can be used and you get the best of both worlds. The shape (really the diameter) provides the stiffness, but if someone hits the lifelines hard instead of deforming like stainless will or tearing like aluminium, the titanium will bend, a lot more then spring back into shape. I

This can actually be an issue when working with Ti. When bending tubing there is something called springback, which is how much a bend will relax after the part is released from the bending machine. For steel and aluminium 5 degrees is on the very high end with 1% being more common, for titanium up to 25 degrees is realistic so it takes some getting used to. But for lifeline stantions being able to bend them far past normal before being permanently deformed is a bonus so long as they are stiff enough to do the job (and they are). 

This springback was why G9 was developed in the first place. G5 is just too strong to bend reliably without elevated temperatures (as in over 600F elevated). G9 is just week enough it can be bent at room temperatures with standard shop equipment. 

As Ti prices keep falling off a cliff I expect to see it replace stainless as the go to metal for most marine applications. In some places it really isn't suitable, but for most things it really is. As for pricing... if you call a fab shop like Allied and ask for a bulk order, and in Ti fabrication 10 parts is considered bulk, you can often see a massive price decrease. 

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The Perry Sliver Class Daysailer project has been interesting in that it has connected us with some very nice people from all over the world. I was a bit surprised in that I figured not that many people would understand the fascination I have for long narrow light vessels, but the project attracted a remarkable amount of interest. (Neil's various magazine articles about her might have contributed to the attention she gets.)

Yesterday I was in our front yard fixing the newspaper boxes which had become loose from their mountings when a CA member from out of state I had not met before strolled up and engaged me in conversation. Turns out he has a second home here on the island.

And then the mail came while I was out there and there was a package addressed to me that did not look familiar. Inside was a painting of my vessel done by someone I did not know who has followed this thread and apparently wanted to show his appreciation with the painting. The painting is quite good, so using the return address I looked him up on the Internet. Turns out he is a well respected professional artist.

Knock me over with a feather!

(And the card he enclosed had another of his paintings on the cover of a LFH Rozinante, one of my favorite boats.)

I have no idea if he posts on CA or what his "handle" might be. Amazing stuff.

IMG_9328.JPG

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Frankie brought a lot of folks together. As my geologist professor friend used to say about others:

Those aren't people. They're Non-People! Vanilla, Vanilla, Vanilla.

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Ok, I know who it is.

One of the regulars, (who knew he could paint?)

I will let him ID himself if he feels the need.

We agree it should hang aboard and because it is done in oil it should survive ok in the moist environment.

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That is so great!  I have greatly enjoyed the entire process of this thread, and yes I have read all 13,184 posts, as have many, many others.  Thanks for sharing Kim & Bob (and everyone else involved).

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On 7/13/2017 at 8:12 PM, kimbottles said:

 She doesn't seem to notice weight on the rail. 

That's what we thought till the jr race team and the coaches showed up, 32 of them will heel the boat.

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1 hour ago, Bryanjb said:

That's what we thought till the jr race team and the coaches showed up, 32 of them will heel the boat.

Sorry, they can't come aboard, don't have enough PFD's for that many.......

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8 hours ago, kimbottles said:

The Perry Sliver Class Daysailer project has been interesting in that it has connected us with some very nice people from all over the world. I was a bit surprised in that I figured not that many people would understand the fascination I have for long narrow light vessels, but the project attracted a remarkable amount of interest. (Neil's various magazine articles about her might have contributed to the attention she gets.)

Yesterday I was in our front yard fixing the newspaper boxes which had become loose from their mountings when a CA member from out of state I had not met before strolled up and engaged me in conversation. Turns out he has a second home here on the island.

And then the mail came while I was out there and there was a package addressed to me that did not look familiar. Inside was a painting of my vessel done by someone I did not know who has followed this thread and apparently wanted to show his appreciation with the painting. The painting is quite good, so using the return address I looked him up on the Internet. Turns out he is a well respected professional artist.

Knock me over with a feather!

(And the card he enclosed had another of his paintings on the cover of a LFH Rozinante, one of my favorite boats.)

I have no idea if he posts on CA or what his "handle" might be. Amazing stuff.

IMG_9328.JPG

I am not the very talented painter, but I am the other CA member that Kim references as having stopped by to say hello.  I am sad to say that it has taken me far too long to go over and meet Kim who as many of you know is very gracious and welcoming.  We are at least for part of the year neighbors and I have been drooling over Francis Lee since it came home to Port Blakely.  Today I was fortunate enough to get a tour of FL and I really cant say anything more than all of the very appropriate superlatives that others have used to describe such a beautiful boat that is located in such a beautiful setting......sailing heaven for sure. 
 

Pat McShane

 

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Kim is top notch. So is Boomer and the list goes on but you all know who you are. Bob is a curmudgeon but his food and hospitality are very good!

I've been fortunate to stumble onto this site. There are some very cool folks here, and Francis is all that and a bag of chips. I had no words when I was on it. Just gazing at a dream made real was super cool.

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9 hours ago, kimbottles said:

Sorry, they can't come aboard, don't have enough PFD's for that many.......

Not to worry Kim, they bring there own...along with their clothing and sailing gear for a week of sailing.  Think bus moniker.  

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Bob, I couldn't find any of that Curmudgeonite stuff in the market just now to send you but I did get you a full certification as an official card carrying "Curmudgeon" with full honors and privileges entitled.

L4uGjvB.jpg

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Well, I'll think of something Bob. How about you answer my call in a couple of minutes?

     I think that certificate will look rather official on your office wall.

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Missed your call Rasper. Went to the grocery store. Thought of how lucky I was just jump ion my car and go to a fully stocked supermarket with reasonable prices. I appreciate where I live. I'm fine with the smell of dairy cattle.

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Mystery Painter Revealed

The first clue is that the painting is based on this photo posted a while back, I forget where, and I posted my admiration of it.:

59b9b75ad7896_francislee.jpg.948ab357e81127114ea06dee41513707.jpg

The second clue is that I like skinny boats with tillers, and sail one.

In the photo, I was able to ID Frances Lee's designer, and kept him in the painting. Kim, I assumed, was steering. I left out the two other boats. I imagine Frankie left them behind in short order.

So, I am the painter. During the renovation of my H-Boat, Kim very kindly sent me an H-Boat brochure that he had received years ago.

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Bull! We hardly knew ya.

Outstanding.

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1 hour ago, olaf hart said:

This place is really amazing ...

It truly is. . It's a privilege to be able to hang out with you all. . 

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