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Dick Carter design boats

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Going out on a limb, but didn't a Carter, German built, old 1 Tonner

win the Worlds or NAs at least one year? I thought and this is going

back to the late 70s, that it became the prototype for the Texas Carter

One Tons.

 

 

Ydra was built in Germany by A&R out of 1/4" aluminum. Imagine that. The Italian boat, for Mrs Spaccarelli was sailed by Beilken, the sailmaker.

She was on the way of winning the world One Ton in 72, when the forestay broke. She won the next year in Sardinia. But all eyes were on Ganbare.

The Texas One Ton came after, I think about 40 were built. Admitedly a cross between Ydra and Ganbare.

 

Whay a wonderfull design, i never seen so cute lines !!! No better quality scan ? :)

Bye the way beilken sailed Gumboots then who was the next Ganbare generation by Jeremie Rogers no ?

 

 

 

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post-32003-098338000 1302907376_thumb.jpg

Going out on a limb, but didn't a Carter, German built, old 1 Tonner

win the Worlds or NAs at least one year? I thought and this is going

back to the late 70s, that it became the prototype for the Texas Carter

One Tons.

 

 

Ydra was built in Germany by A&R out of 1/4" aluminum. Imagine that. The Italian boat, for Mrs Spaccarelli was sailed by Beilken, the sailmaker.

She was on the way of winning the world One Ton in 72, when the forestay broke. She won the next year in Sardinia. But all eyes were on Ganbare.

The Texas One Ton came after, I think about 40 were built. Admitedly a cross between Ydra and Ganbare.

 

Whay a wonderfull design, i never seen so cute lines !!! No better quality scan ? :)

Bye the way beilken sailed Gumboots then who was the next Ganbare generation by Jeremie Rogers no ?

 

Fully correct, "Gumboots" went to Germany to be sailed by Beilken, is still there, fully restored, and racing !

post-6361-061089600 1302941149_thumb.jpg

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post-32003-098338000 1302907376_thumb.jpg

Going out on a limb, but didn't a Carter, German built, old 1 Tonner

win the Worlds or NAs at least one year? I thought and this is going

back to the late 70s, that it became the prototype for the Texas Carter

One Tons.

 

 

Ydra was built in Germany by A&R out of 1/4" aluminum. Imagine that. The Italian boat, for Mrs Spaccarelli was sailed by Beilken, the sailmaker.

She was on the way of winning the world One Ton in 72, when the forestay broke. She won the next year in Sardinia. But all eyes were on Ganbare.

The Texas One Ton came after, I think about 40 were built. Admitedly a cross between Ydra and Ganbare.

 

Whay a wonderfull design, i never seen so cute lines !!! No better quality scan ? :)

Bye the way beilken sailed Gumboots then who was the next Ganbare generation by Jeremie Rogers no ?

 

 

 

 

No better quality scan. Unfortunately.

Tina has also very sweet lines. Look at the sections!

If you can stand bad scans, I can also upload the early Carter 's body plans for Noryema and Red Rooster.

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post-32003-088373900 1302986736_thumb.jpg

post-32003-098338000 1302907376_thumb.jpg

Going out on a limb, but didn't a Carter, German built, old 1 Tonner

win the Worlds or NAs at least one year? I thought and this is going

back to the late 70s, that it became the prototype for the Texas Carter

One Tons.

 

 

Ydra was built in Germany by A&R out of 1/4" aluminum. Imagine that. The Italian boat, for Mrs Spaccarelli was sailed by Beilken, the sailmaker.

She was on the way of winning the world One Ton in 72, when the forestay broke. She won the next year in Sardinia. But all eyes were on Ganbare.

The Texas One Ton came after, I think about 40 were built. Admitedly a cross between Ydra and Ganbare.

 

Whay a wonderfull design, i never seen so cute lines !!! No better quality scan ? :)

Bye the way beilken sailed Gumboots then who was the next Ganbare generation by Jeremie Rogers no ?

 

 

 

 

No better quality scan. Unfortunately.

Tina has also very sweet lines. Look at the sections!

If you can stand bad scans, I can also upload the early Carter 's body plans for Noryema and Red Rooster.

Yes please.

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post-32003-088373900 1302986736_thumb.jpg

post-32003-098338000 1302907376_thumb.jpg

Going out on a limb, but didn't a Carter, German built, old 1 Tonner

win the Worlds or NAs at least one year? I thought and this is going

back to the late 70s, that it became the prototype for the Texas Carter

One Tons.

 

 

Ydra was built in Germany by A&R out of 1/4" aluminum. Imagine that. The Italian boat, for Mrs Spaccarelli was sailed by Beilken, the sailmaker.

She was on the way of winning the world One Ton in 72, when the forestay broke. She won the next year in Sardinia. But all eyes were on Ganbare.

The Texas One Ton came after, I think about 40 were built. Admitedly a cross between Ydra and Ganbare.

 

Whay a wonderfull design, i never seen so cute lines !!! No better quality scan ? :)

Bye the way beilken sailed Gumboots then who was the next Ganbare generation by Jeremie Rogers no ?

 

 

 

 

No better quality scan. Unfortunately.

Tina has also very sweet lines. Look at the sections!

If you can stand bad scans, I can also upload the early Carter 's body plans for Noryema and Red Rooster.

Yes please.

 

+1

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Noryema VII (or VCX)

 

Was a wonderful cruising boat in the Med for two super joint-owners, secluded low depth anchorages ... if a bit "oily"

 

Now fully rebuilt in Sweden and gracing baltic waters.

 

 

No slouch eh !

 

Noryema VII. Sections.

Deriveur integral. Vertical lifting keel by a hydraulic crane. Lifting outboard rudder.

Built in steel by Mulder. Finished by Frans Maas. Owner.post-32003-063340000 1303068789_thumb.jpg Ron Amey.

Great looking design. Glad to see her in great condition.

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Between races 75 SORC (we were sailing a Carter 36..Crocodile), we visited this Tanton to look at the layout. Memory a bit foggy her, but I think it rated just below 1 Ton.

 

scan0009.jpg

 

oh god, the old ior winch farms :D .

 

good times.

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Could that possibly be David Bongers in the hatchway of the Tanton? Or not enough hair?

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Pics of a 1972 Carter 33 built in Turkey and the venerable Morgan built NA40. If you are interested I have enough NA40 pics to keep this thread going for years.

post-1091-083199400 1303102239_thumb.jpg

post-1091-017840300 1303102261_thumb.jpg

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Could that possibly be David Bongers in the hatchway of the Tanton? Or not enough hair?

 

Looks like missing 10/15 further cm :)

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Noryema VII (or VCX)

 

Was a wonderful cruising boat in the Med for two super joint-owners, secluded low depth anchorages ... if a bit "oily"

 

Now fully rebuilt in Sweden and gracing baltic waters.

 

 

No slouch eh !

 

Noryema VII. Sections.

Deriveur integral. Vertical lifting keel by a hydraulic crane. Lifting outboard rudder.

Built in steel by Mulder. Finished by Frans Maas. Owner.post-32003-063340000 1303068789_thumb.jpg Ron Amey.

Great looking design. Glad to see her in great condition.

 

Very interesting ! thanks ! Was the lifting-keel heavy ?

 

She had a good life, after Amey she was long co-owned by the Thomson-Thales' CEO and the COMEX's (deep-sea contractors) founder-owner, cruising and the occasional racing week with cheerful owners and a bunch of very good old-timers such as the ever-smiling Yves Guegan.

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Noryema VII (or VCX)

 

Was a wonderful cruising boat in the Med for two super joint-owners, secluded low depth anchorages ... if a bit "oily"

 

Now fully rebuilt in Sweden and gracing baltic waters.

 

 

No slouch eh !

 

Noryema VII. Sections.

Deriveur integral. Vertical lifting keel by a hydraulic crane. Lifting outboard rudder.

Built in steel by Mulder. Finished by Frans Maas. Owner.post-32003-063340000 1303068789_thumb.jpg Ron Amey.

Great looking design. Glad to see her in great condition.

Nice lines! I did a quick rendering in ACad to get a better perspective:

 

post-420-093199200 1303145655_thumb.jpg

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Frog:

I have to agree with you. RED ROOSTER was ,I think, the sexiest boat of it's day. The lines were drawn by Jim Hartvig Anderson just before Yves-Marie Tanton began doing all the hulls. As I recall.

I also thopught FROGATE was a great looking boat. Wish someone would dig up a pic of FRIGATE.

Red Rooster sections.

Noryema VII had over 3T of lead inside the lifting keel. Red Rooster had a 3000lbs. centreboard. What I like best about the keel configuration was the curtain, rolling like a Kodak film to cover the slot when the board was raised.

I remember trading a few tacks half way up the Fastnet rock. I was on the 54' Pacha. It took a while to pass the smaller red boat. I was impressed.

post-32003-090966300 1303181893_thumb.jpg

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Could that possibly be David Bongers in the hatchway of the Tanton? Or not enough hair?

 

Looks like missing 10/15 further cm :)

 

 

No,

Unlikely to be David Bongers. The guy in the hatch is way too well dressed to be Bongers. The hair is not wild enough to be Bongers either.

 

I clearly remember the first and only time I sailed with him. He came onboard carrying nothing but a banana.

 

Regards,

Multisail.

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A great thread. I have often wondered what passened to Dick Carter. When I resided and sailed in Hong Kong there were a number of Carter designed yachts including White Rabbit a one off which sailed in the 1977 Admirals Cup. A Carter 30 copy was also built around that time in Manila, Philippines.

Regarding Ydra [one of my all time favourites], does anybody know what became of her?

,

regards 5*

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Interesting that you mention "White Rabbit", IIRC she was pretty much in the spirit of the latest Carter guise, started with the 3/4 ton "Ragtime", including a very nice one-ton "Lancer", and a few others.

 

Since this thread started I've been looking for pictures of this later Carter school, to no avail.

 

They were attractive, even if they were never allowed to shine and at the time much was put on the crews, only "Ragtime" was granted with a very good crew, in the '76 worlds, but suffered from a late launch and ironing-out the Stearn rig/North Sails combination (something totally new to Northern Europe at the time).

 

I always thought that Carter had been very close to a come-back at that point, and it's interesting to note how difficult come-backs are for designers, whatever their latest offerings are, just because they are not on the strong campaigns' radars.

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Here's an old pilfered photo of White Rabbit, I would guess prior her first launching. Do you know what became of her. John Ma her owner went ton to race larger machines.

post-52142-041144800 1303429628_thumb.jpg

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Could that possibly be David Bongers in the hatchway of the Tanton? Or not enough hair?

 

Looks like missing 10/15 further cm :)

 

 

No,

Unlikely to be David Bongers. The guy in the hatch is way too well dressed to be Bongers. The hair is not wild enough to be Bongers either.

 

I clearly remember the first and only time I sailed with him. He came onboard carrying nothing but a banana.

 

Regards,

Multisail.

 

I think it's Chris Seaver, but I could be wrong.

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Carter 39 built in 2 versions in Greece - flush deck & doghouse. The doghouse rated better IOR and hence won more silver, I believe.

Love the tumblehome. Photographed in New York, long ago.

 

Carter 39. Tumblehome in sections.post-32003-072884500 1303433141_thumb.jpg

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Does anyone remember Camille?

 

I think there was a Carter 42 called Camille in the 1988 Pacific Cup?

 

If so, we sailed parallel to them for over 12 hours. You couldn't have found two more equal boats in one design.

 

We lost them at sundown. Days later we got to Kaneohe and they weren't there. Days later they showed. Story we heard was there was a fire on board and DR'ed the rest of the way with no coms or electronics. They saw the southern most island off the starboard side with binoculars. Island hopped up to Oahu.

 

They hit the dock, there was a scuffle and the boat sat half put away for days.

 

I don't rmemeber much, I was holding down a lawn chair by the pool for days and KYC treated me too well.

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'Village Idiot'asks

Does anyone remember Camille?

I think there was a Carter 42 called Camille in the 1988 Pacific Cup?

 

CAMILLE= (Bob)Stewart 42

 

]

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'Village Idiot'asks

Does anyone remember Camille?

I think there was a Carter 42 called Camille in the 1988 Pacific Cup?

 

CAMILLE= (Bob)Stewart 42

 

]

 

Thanks.

 

That sounds right.

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Carter 39 built in 2 versions in Greece - flush deck & doghouse. The doghouse rated better IOR and hence won more silver, I believe.

Love the tumblehome. Photographed in New York, long ago.

 

Carter 39. Tumblehome in sections.post-32003-072884500 1303433141_thumb.jpg

 

YMT thank you for posting these scans of hull sections. I've always been fascinated with boat plans and these shapes are so different from anything we see nowadays.

 

FB- Doug

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I remember racing against a Carter 33 when I was little..I guess that would be a 3/4 Ton boat?? Dark green..named Decoy.

 

Great thread...thanks!

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Thanks all for the info on the German/Texas one tonners

Carter Designed. I was specifically thinking of what I

thought was a German built Carter One Tonner in Chicago

named Escape. It was a long time ago, and I could be

pretty far off.

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Whatever happened to Dick?

 

I remember the first time we sailed Rabbit. We were going upwind in about 8 knots and he kept looking at the quarter wave and then his watch. Finally, I asked him what he was doing. He replied that the boat was overweight. I never got an answer I could understand about the relationship between the frequency of the quarterwave and displacement.

 

The skeg, in front and above the articulate part of the rudder ended at the waterline. If the skeg was a little under water, the boat was heavier.

 

I found this picture of the 44' Naif, designed for Raoul Gardini. If you look at the skeg and rudder, this is what I am talking about.post-32003-023304700 1303705061_thumb.jpg

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Fivestar posts on the Middle Sea Race, in the IOR thread, re-ignited some fully aslept brain-cells.

 

Here is "Benbow" a large early seventies Carter by Huisman, which was very well sailed and won the Middle Sea in elapsed time on 3 consecutive years (and '77 corrected overall); twice beating Gitana VI (then Med champion), to which she also disputed the elegance trophy.

 

She never left the med IIRC but had a looong and succesful career.

 

Shots courtesy of the Royal Huisman website.

post-6361-098907900 1303735369_thumb.jpg

post-6361-030369300 1303735388_thumb.jpg

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Whatever happened to Dick?

 

I remember the first time we sailed Rabbit. We were going upwind in about 8 knots and he kept looking at the quarter wave and then his watch. Finally, I asked him what he was doing. He replied that the boat was overweight. I never got an answer I could understand about the relationship between the frequency of the quarterwave and displacement.

 

The skeg, in front and above the articulate part of the rudder ended at the waterline. If the skeg was a little under water, the boat was heavier.

 

I found this picture of the 44' Naif, designed for Raoul Gardini. If you look at the skeg and rudder, this is what I am talking about.post-32003-023304700 1303705061_thumb.jpg

 

A superb website

 

http://www.morodivenezia.it/naif/naif_home.htm, with build and launch photographs, drawings and even a letter from YMT to the builders !!

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I had a close-up look at a Carter 33 on the hard at my club. Goofiest looking rudder, with an enormously flared top that fairs into the bustle. A great place for zebra mussels to hide, I'm told.

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That "golf tee" rudder was a result of trying to maintain a constant foil throughout the entire rudder and skeg, a nice idea. Brit Chance did some similar skeg/rudder combos.

The only way to avoid it was to distort the foil so that the thickness at the rudder stock was constant from top to bottom.

We eventually did all of them that way. It was far easier to build.

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Fivestar posts on the Middle Sea Race, in the IOR thread, re-ignited some fully aslept brain-cells.

 

Here is "Benbow" a large early seventies Carter by Huisman, which was very well sailed and won the Middle Sea in elapsed time on 3 consecutive years (and '77 corrected overall); twice beating Gitana VI (then Med champion), to which she also disputed the elegance trophy.

 

She never left the med IIRC but had a looong and succesful career.

 

Shots courtesy of the Royal Huisman website.

 

Carter Offshore design #19. Body Plan.

The 65' Benbow was designed for Dottore Recchi. Built by Huisman, she is a good looking boat with an interesting accommodation plan. Last I saw her, she was post-32003-043573700 1303775738_thumb.jpgin Porto-Vecchio on her mooring, sporting a new triple spreader rig. It was good to have boats built by some of the best builders in the world.

 

Fivestar posts on the Middle Sea Race, in the IOR thread, re-ignited some fully aslept brain-cells.

 

Here is "Benbow" a large early seventies Carter by Huisman, which was very well sailed and won the Middle Sea in elapsed time on 3 consecutive years (and '77 corrected overall); twice beating Gitana VI (then Med champion), to which she also disputed the elegance trophy.

 

She never left the med IIRC but had a looong and succesful career.

 

Shots courtesy of the Royal Huisman website.

 

Carter Offshore design #19. Body Plan.

The 65' Benbow was designed for Dottore Recchi. Built by Huisman, she is a good looking boat with an interesting accommodation plan. Last I saw her, she was post-32003-043573700 1303775738_thumb.jpgin Porto-Vecchio on her mooring, sporting a new triple spreader rig. It was good to have boats built by some of the best builders in the world.

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Its great to hear that a number of these boats are still around and being maintained.

How about YDRA, its strange that where ever one looks one can find no references after the entry in the 1975 Middle Sea race.

 

ciao - 5*

 

Fivestar posts on the Middle Sea Race, in the IOR thread, re-ignited some fully aslept brain-cells.

 

Here is "Benbow" a large early seventies Carter by Huisman, which was very well sailed and won the Middle Sea in elapsed time on 3 consecutive years (and '77 corrected overall); twice beating Gitana VI (then Med champion), to which she also disputed the elegance trophy.

 

She never left the med IIRC but had a looong and succesful career.

 

Shots courtesy of the Royal Huisman website.

 

Carter Offshore design #19. Body Plan.

The 65' Benbow was designed for Dottore Recchi. Built by Huisman, she is a good looking boat with an interesting accommodation plan. Last I saw her, she was post-32003-043573700 1303775738_thumb.jpgin Porto-Vecchio on her mooring, sporting a new triple spreader rig. It was good to have boats built by some of the best builders in the world.

 

Fivestar posts on the Middle Sea Race, in the IOR thread, re-ignited some fully aslept brain-cells.

 

Here is "Benbow" a large early seventies Carter by Huisman, which was very well sailed and won the Middle Sea in elapsed time on 3 consecutive years (and '77 corrected overall); twice beating Gitana VI (then Med champion), to which she also disputed the elegance trophy.

 

She never left the med IIRC but had a looong and succesful career.

 

Shots courtesy of the Royal Huisman website.

 

Carter Offshore design #19. Body Plan.

The 65' Benbow was designed for Dottore Recchi. Built by Huisman, she is a good looking boat with an interesting accommodation plan. Last I saw her, she was post-32003-043573700 1303775738_thumb.jpgin Porto-Vecchio on her mooring, sporting a new triple spreader rig. It was good to have boats built by some of the best builders in the world.

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I loved Benbow. What a seriously studly boat.

 

When I was living in Portofino in the late 70s, Benbow was the 'premium' fixture in the port at her own fore-aft mooring out in the middle. This was well before the influx of mega-motor-yachts vying for stern-to positions outside the Pitosforo.....

 

I have photos. Need to dig and scan.

 

Also pix of Naif in the AC. A serious experiment, and so many new ideas.

 

Last, re Gardini, I must admit a serious enchantment with the first Il Moro. Designed by German Frers, built by Sangermani in cold-moulded timber, with a huge Med rig, she was just perfect. However not such a perfect ride in the 79 Fastnet. But we did finish.

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I loved Benbow. What a seriously studly boat.

 

When I was living in Portofino in the late 70s, Benbow was the 'premium' fixture in the port at her own fore-aft mooring out in the middle. This was well before the influx of mega-motor-yachts vying for stern-to positions outside the Pitosforo.....

 

I have photos. Need to dig and scan.

 

Also pix of Naif in the AC. A serious experiment, and so many new ideas.

 

Last, re Gardini, I must admit a serious enchantment with the first Il Moro. Designed by German Frers, built by Sangermani in cold-moulded timber, with a huge Med rig, she was just perfect. However not such a perfect ride in the 79 Fastnet. But we did finish.

 

Not only was Benbow beautiful but she was often (always) very well sailed, It was impressing to see her topping the MSR results, while, for exemple, Gitana V (by then Gitana K in Greek hands) a same era Carter (but I guess without the flat bottom) sailed all the '78 North Sicily leg a few lengths from our Swan 47.

 

The first Il Moro was impressive, her arrival in Cowes, in between races, after her launch raised a few eyebrows, I had a friend onboard and a quick visit set me in awe, so neat, clean and effective she looked.

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That was my view also.

Whilst not a Carter design, do you know what became of Fabry's Revolootion? I believe she also did a middle sea Race in was nit 1975.

 

Interesting link for the Flush Deck Carter 39, built by Olympic Yachts.

 

http://sailboatdata....p?class_id=2439

 

5*

 

Must be Sammy Sampson's Mersea Oyster in the pic !

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Thanks all for the info on the German/Texas one tonners

Carter Designed. I was specifically thinking of what I

thought was a German built Carter One Tonner in Chicago

named Escape. It was a long time ago, and I could be

pretty far off.

 

Ydra, the original. Body Plan.

Later built in production in Greece.

If I remember correctly, Escape was a Texapost-32003-024288600 1303877337_thumb.jpgs One Ton.

 

 

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The "fatty" rudder was what we called a "golf tee" rudder. It was a natural shape to draw if you had a skeg and tried to keep the same foil throughout the entire depth of the rudder and skeg. It was a nightmare to build.

Maybe Yves-Marie could explain it better. Thse rudders were long gone before I arrived. They do look funny.

 

Bob.

The golf tee rudders gave a longer waterline by distributing the volume further aft. Fairing the bustle and skeg in the process. This was an advantage in the first issue of the I.O. R rule, because, by placing the Aft Girth measurement to the flat top of the rudder theGirth was made shorter, while the waterline underneath was made longer. A newer version of the Rule corrected this advantage by placing a Buttock at 4% of the beam, where the reverse curve of the Tee, would have made the girth measurement longer. I'll post one of the old drawing showing the configuration.

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Tx YM for that body plan of Ydra and comments. ALways nice to speak direct with the architect :)

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post-32003-052594500 1304172402_thumb.jpg

Let's talk big boat...

Yes, let's talk.

Imagine this...

We had 6 months to design and build the lighest 128' boat possible. for Jean-Yves Terlain. With a turn key contract of only $360,000.00. Wow!

 

The only few things I know from V13 are the endless stories from a close friend who, as a young designer, was chief-foreman or whatever at the building yard.

Having later become a top composite specialist he could go the whole night about Tecimar early sandwich process, and (IIRC) infusing resin with big syringes.

Whenever we worked on a new project, references to V13 would come every now and then.

Quite a benchmark apparently !

 

Nice shot of a 128' Dinghy. Sorry about he crease on this very old brochure.post-32003-052594500 1304172402_thumb.jpg

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post-32003-052594500 1304172402_thumb.jpg

Let's talk big boat...

Yes, let's talk.

Imagine this...

We had 6 months to design and build the lighest 128' boat possible. for Jean-Yves Terlain. With a turn key contract of only $360,000.00. Wow!

 

The only few things I know from V13 are the endless stories from a close friend who, as a young designer, was chief-foreman or whatever at the building yard.

Having later become a top composite specialist he could go the whole night about Tecimar early sandwich process, and (IIRC) infusing resin with big syringes.

Whenever we worked on a new project, references to V13 would come every now and then.

Quite a benchmark apparently !

 

Nice shot of a 128' Dinghy. Sorry about he crease on this very old brochure.post-32003-052594500 1304172402_thumb.jpg

 

Seems like I remember JYT lost one of the jibs overboard when making a change, and it took something like half a day using halyards and winches to get it all back on deck.

 

Thanks for the info you guys, very interesting stuff.

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Pics of a 1972 Carter 33 built in Turkey and the venerable Morgan built NA40. If you are interested I have enough NA40 pics to keep this thread going for years.

 

Hey, that's my boat! (The NA)

 

Photo taken yesterday:

 

na05012011.jpg

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What a cute new designed DC flush Deck on that time, we got one in France too, moored some time at La Trinité sur Mer, the owner was a horse race "gourou"

At that period S2 designed a wooden admiraler to E.Heath with the same cockpit (Morning Cloud) wrecked during fastnet and racing now in a very good shape !

Interesting link for the Flush Deck Carter 39, built by Olympic Yachts.

 

http://sailboatdata....p?class_id=2439

 

5*

 

Must be Sammy Sampson's Mersea Oyster in the pic !

 

 

post-50842-079883700 1304354410_thumb.jpg

post-50842-078813500 1304354511_thumb.jpg

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What a cute new designed DC flush Deck on that time, we got one in France too, moored some time at La Trinité sur Mer, the owner was a horse race "gourou"

At that period S2 designed a wooden admiraler to E.Heath with the same cockpit (Morning Cloud) wrecked during fastnet and racing now in a very good shape !

Interesting link for the Flush Deck Carter 39, built by Olympic Yachts.

 

http://sailboatdata....p?class_id=2439

 

5*

 

Must be Sammy Sampson's Mersea Oyster in the pic !

 

All top boats of that era were flush-deck.

There were 2 S&S wooden Morning Cloud N°2 which sank in a delivery from Cowes to Burnham and N°3 later "Opposition" has just been restored. Then an other aluminium S&S, then a Ron-Holland which actually finished the 79 Fastnet.

 

Funny that you link both boats, as Sammy Sampson moved on to become a key member of the Morning Clouds' crew.

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I suggest reading The Leading Edge by Sandy Weld which is a 1971 book about the successes of Dick Carter's early designs in Europe with abundant photos and commentary by one of his younger crew members. Lots of coverage of his innovations and out of the box thinking.

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Tu I ordered it right now :)

 

I suggest reading The Leading Edge by Sandy Weld which is a 1971 book about the successes of Dick Carter's early designs in Europe with abundant photos and commentary by one of his younger crew members. Lots of coverage of his innovations and out of the box thinking.

 

 

 

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I suggest reading The Leading Edge by Sandy Weld which is a 1971 book about the successes of Dick Carter's early designs in Europe with abundant photos and commentary by one of his younger crew members. Lots of coverage of his innovations and out of the box thinking.

 

Hi Osprey, thks for the head-up, your post rang some bell and here is the book sitting iddle on one of my library's shelves: a mine of info, while we have endlessly been discussing on this forum.

Talk about uselessness of too large libraries ;)

 

Next to it was a book by Dick Kenny "To win the Admiral's Cup" which displays most of what we have been discussing in this and the IOR thread !

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Thanks, do you by any chance have any theories where Ydra may be residing these days. Iwould have to guess somewhere still in italy?

 

Right man, its a profile of Frigate, D.Carter, UK Admiral's Cup.

Godd shot :)

 

 

 

Is that a sectional of a Dick Carter yacht at the top left corner of the demi-coqu site?

5*

Tribute to Richard E. Carter

Ydra, : http://www.demi-coqu...6&limitstart=11

NoryemaVII : http://www.demi-coqu...6&limitstart=10

 

 

 

YdraCopyright.jpg

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The "fatty" rudder was what we called a "golf tee" rudder. It was a natural shape to draw if you had a skeg and tried to keep the same foil throughout the entire depth of the rudder and skeg. It was a nightmare to build.

Maybe Yves-Marie could explain it better. Thse rudders were long gone before I arrived. They do look funny.

 

Bob.

The golf tee rudders gave a longer waterline by distributing the volume further aft. Fairing the bustle and skeg in the process. This was an advantage in the first issue of the I.O. R rule, because, by placing the Aft Girth measurement to the flat top of the rudder theGirth was made shorter, while the waterline underneath was made longer. A newer version of the Rule corrected this advantage by placing a Buttock at 4% of the beam, where the reverse curve of the Tee, would have made the girth measurement longer. I'll post one of the old drawing showing the configuration.

 

Drawing of the 60' Gitana's rudder. Like Bob's said, a difficult piece to build , never mind to drop!

 

The boat built for Baron post-32003-061700500 1304731101_thumb.jpgEdmond de Rothschild by Abeking in Germany.

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The "fatty" rudder was what we called a "golf tee" rudder. It was a natural shape to draw if you had a skeg and tried to keep the same foil throughout the entire depth of the rudder and skeg. It was a nightmare to build.

Maybe Yves-Marie could explain it better. Thse rudders were long gone before I arrived. They do look funny.

 

Bob.

The golf tee rudders gave a longer waterline by distributing the volume further aft. Fairing the bustle and skeg in the process. This was an advantage in the first issue of the I.O. R rule, because, by placing the Aft Girth measurement to the flat top of the rudder theGirth was made shorter, while the waterline underneath was made longer. A newer version of the Rule corrected this advantage by placing a Buttock at 4% of the beam, where the reverse curve of the Tee, would have made the girth measurement longer. I'll post one of the old drawing showing the configuration.

 

Drawing of the 60' Gitana's rudder. Like Bob's said, a difficult piece to build , never mind to drop!

 

The boat built for Baron post-32003-061700500 1304731101_thumb.jpgEdmond de Rothschild by Abeking in Germany.

 

At the other end of that steering system !

 

A tribute to an extremely nice, highly passionated and stylish owner.

One of the very best in that era.

 

(as found on the net)

post-6361-015105300 1304763774_thumb.jpg

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Hi,

 

This is our Carter 33 Passage.

 

I believe the Passage is unique in that it was built in Sydney, Australia using the hull/keel/rudder from the original Carter 33 Aft cockpit 3/4 IOR boat.

 

The Passage has an aft cabin and there are quite a few of them still around.

 

They are still quite competitive in the handicapped club racing scene.

 

We have had ours for three years and have totally refurbished it.

 

A very capable yacht for the 42 degree latitude we live and sail in. (Southern Ocean, Hobart, Tasmania)

 

KenM

post-52553-087240100 1304765971_thumb.jpg

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Hi,

 

Another photo.

 

The yachts name:- Get-a-Life

 

KenM

 

post-52553-069395200 1304766412_thumb.jpg

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Hey nice ass .... Maybe for something of D.Peterson ass design is not it ?

 

 

Hi,

 

Another photo.

 

The yachts name:- Get-a-Life

 

KenM

 

 

 

 

 

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Quite the same one, except compensation, in photo attached :)

 

The "fatty" rudder was what we called a "golf tee" rudder. It was a natural shape to draw if you had a skeg and tried to keep the same foil throughout the entire depth of the rudder and skeg. It was a nightmare to build.

Maybe Yves-Marie could explain it better. Thse rudders were long gone before I arrived. They do look funny.

 

Bob.

The golf tee rudders gave a longer waterline by distributing the volume further aft. Fairing the bustle and skeg in the process. This was an advantage in the first issue of the I.O. R rule, because, by placing the Aft Girth measurement to the flat top of the rudder theGirth was made shorter, while the waterline underneath was made longer. A newer version of the Rule corrected this advantage by placing a Buttock at 4% of the beam, where the reverse curve of the Tee, would have made the girth measurement longer. I'll post one of the old drawing showing the configuration.

 

Drawing of the 60' Gitana's rudder. Like Bob's said, a difficult piece to build , never mind to drop!

 

The boat built for Baron post-32003-061700500 1304731101_thumb.jpgEdmond de Rothschild by Abeking in Germany.

 

 

post-50842-090007000 1304848327_thumb.jpg

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What a cute new designed DC flush Deck on that time, we got one in France too, moored some time at La Trinité sur Mer, the owner was a horse race "gourou"

At that period S2 designed a wooden admiraler to E.Heath with the same cockpit (Morning Cloud) wrecked during fastnet and racing now in a very good shape !

Interesting link for the Flush Deck Carter 39, built by Olympic Yachts.

 

http://sailboatdata....p?class_id=2439

 

5*

 

Must be Sammy Sampson's Mersea Oyster in the pic !

 

All top boats of that era were flush-deck.

 

 

There were 2 S&S wooden Morning Cloud N°2 which sank in a delivery from Cowes to Burnham and N°3 later "Opposition" has just been restored. Then an other aluminium S&S, then a Ron-Holland which actually finished the 79 Fastnet.

 

Funny that you link both boats, as Sammy Sampson moved on to become a key member of the Morning Clouds' crew.

 

The flush deck of Naif was made of a seamless teak veneer overlay. Built by Carlini, she was like a Stadivarius.

Her exact sistership Carina, excelently built by Burmeister in Germany; had the appearance of a Tiger tank. Amazing, post-32003-081337400 1304906744_thumb.jpg how two of the best Builders can make the same product appear so different.

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What a cute new designed DC flush Deck on that time, we got one in France too, moored some time at La Trinité sur Mer, the owner was a horse race "gourou"

At that period S2 designed a wooden admiraler to E.Heath with the same cockpit (Morning Cloud) wrecked during fastnet and racing now in a very good shape !

Interesting link for the Flush Deck Carter 39, built by Olympic Yachts.

 

http://sailboatdata....p?class_id=2439

 

5*

 

Must be Sammy Sampson's Mersea Oyster in the pic !

 

All top boats of that era were flush-deck.

 

 

There were 2 S&S wooden Morning Cloud N°2 which sank in a delivery from Cowes to Burnham and N°3 later "Opposition" has just been restored. Then an other aluminium S&S, then a Ron-Holland which actually finished the 79 Fastnet.

 

Funny that you link both boats, as Sammy Sampson moved on to become a key member of the Morning Clouds' crew.

 

The flush deck of Naif was made of a seamless teak veneer overlay. Built by Carlini, she was like a Stadivarius.

Her exact sistership Carina, excelently built by Burmeister in Germany; had the appearance of a Tiger tank. Amazing, post-32003-081337400 1304906744_thumb.jpg how two of the best Builders can make the same product appear so different.

 

Stolen from Dick Kenny's book on that Admiral's cup (thks Osprey 17 for making me look) a photograph of Naif, showing the Uber-comfort of the afterguard cockpit which were the talk of the docks.

Peculiar armchairs ! Particularly given the very modest attitude of Raul Gardini's at that time (a crew-member brought in by the luminaries onboard, in Genoa, told me he had mistaken him for the B/N for 1/2 a race without any denegation from RG)

The second shot has -according to the book- Dick Carter helming.

 

The running of the genoa sheets through the deck to the primaries is "interesting" (not too ergonomic for tailing and grinding), as is the positioning of the crew and helmsman downwind in a lot of wind !

 

photo-credits John Blomfield and Jonathan Eastland

post-6361-021232600 1304955556_thumb.jpg

post-6361-065956700 1304955603_thumb.jpg

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What a cute new designed DC flush Deck on that time, we got one in France too, moored some time at La Trinité sur Mer, the owner was a horse race "gourou"

At that period S2 designed a wooden admiraler to E.Heath with the same cockpit (Morning Cloud) wrecked during fastnet and racing now in a very good shape !

Interesting link for the Flush Deck Carter 39, built by Olympic Yachts.

 

http://sailboatdata....p?class_id=2439

 

5*

 

Must be Sammy Sampson's Mersea Oyster in the pic !

 

All top boats of that era were flush-deck.

 

 

There were 2 S&S wooden Morning Cloud N°2 which sank in a delivery from Cowes to Burnham and N°3 later "Opposition" has just been restored. Then an other aluminium S&S, then a Ron-Holland which actually finished the 79 Fastnet.

 

Funny that you link both boats, as Sammy Sampson moved on to become a key member of the Morning Clouds' crew.

 

The flush deck of Naif was made of a seamless teak veneer overlay. Built by Carlini, she was like a Stadivarius.

Her exact sistership Carina, excellently built by Burmeister in Germany; had the appearance of a Tiger tank. Amazing, post-32003-081337400 1304906744_thumb.jpg how two of the best Builders can make the same product appear so different.

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Thanks, do you by any chance have any theories where Ydra may be residing these days. Iwould have to guess somewhere still in italy?

 

Right man, its a profile of Frigate, D.Carter, UK Admiral's Cup.

Godd shot :)

 

 

 

Is that a sectional of a Dick Carter yacht at the top left corner of the demi-coqu site?

5*

Tribute to Richard E. Carter

Ydra, : http://www.demi-coqu...6&limitstart=11

NoryemaVII : http://www.demi-coqu...6&limitstart=10

 

 

 

YdraCopyright.jpg

 

I do not think so. Frigate has a sweep back keel, larger skeg rudder. Also the engine was not forward of the mast.

post-32003-049386300 1305086145_thumb.jpg

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Sry YM, "frigate" was the title of this penciled design i got on the net some times ago...

Do you have any idea of who she was ???

 

I do not think so. Frigate has a sweep back keel, larger skeg rudder. Also the engine was not forward of the mast.

post-32003-049386300 1305086145_thumb.jpg

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Sry YM, "frigate" was the title of this penciled design i got on the net some times ago...

Do you have any idea of who she was ???

I do not think so. Frigate has a sweep back keel, larger skeg rudder. Also the engine was not forward of the mast.

post-32003-049386300 1305086145_thumb.jpg

 

For Y-M, a few shots taken from the same book as above -credits John Blomfield and Roger.M Smith.

 

Frigate was noted for her excellent Norh sails (Ian McDonald-Smith, on board, was launching the UK branch) but the book's author makes a special mention of the flattening-reef, as something very new ! I did not remember it came in that late.

The bowman in the last photograph is no other than Sir Robin Knox-Johnston. Add the co-owner as an olympic medallist and David Arnold navigating: that was some crew.

post-6361-045892300 1305132006_thumb.jpg

post-6361-017640200 1305132029_thumb.jpg

post-6361-053494800 1305132053_thumb.jpg

post-6361-086019200 1305132086_thumb.jpg

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Frigate. Sections.post-32003-095961000 1305154436_thumb.jpg

 

Adding Ydra's lines (a year earlier) from a previous YM post and looking at the keel immediate vicinity, we can see why the talk was that Robin Aisher and Tony Boyden had been shy ! ;)

post-6361-021556100 1305195761_thumb.jpg

post-6361-028944600 1305195840_thumb.jpg

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Polish built Carter 30 1/2 tonners are still popular in ex-USSR countries. Two of them sailing on reservoir near Moscow.

post-30696-058093400 1305198971_thumb.jpg

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Arg, so sorry to state her sails came from asia probably ............

 

Any Carter design needs better purchase :)

 

quote name='Nail_S' timestamp='1305198990' post='3261678']

Polish built Carter 30 1/2 tonners are still popular in ex-USSR countries. Two of them sailing on reservoir near Moscow.

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With great help YM archives..... Tribute to Richard E. Carter

post-50842-073308500 1305289471_thumb.jpg

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Would Blizzard have been a Carter too ? (She looks too like a Frers...)

post-50842-049591800 1305468600_thumb.jpg

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Looks more like a sister ship to Eclipse, the Contessa 39 designed by Doug Peterson

 

5*

 

Would Blizzard have been a Carter too ? (She looks too like a Frers...)

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Vendredi Treize. Sections.

Hard to believe that the boat is 128' long.

With a dinghy shape, the displacement is only 89,000 lbs. at launching.

post-32003-046567000 1305594297_thumb.jpg

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Vendredi Treize. Sections.

Hard to believe that the boat is 128' long.

With a dinghy shape, the displacement is only 89,000 lbs. at launching.

 

And that was 40 years ago ! Forward thinking !

 

Y_M; I had mentioned earlier in the thread a close friend who was deeply involved in her build. Strangely, at about the time of your above post, he gets to the famous Front Page ! (3 floors down) with his latest design. That generation definitely does not seem like ageing ;)

post-6361-066124300 1305620557_thumb.jpg

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Interesting article by Dick Carter in the July 1979 issue of SeaHorse titled THE PROPER YACHT

post-52142-025919800 1305632219_thumb.jpg

post-52142-048861600 1305632250_thumb.jpg

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Interesting article by Dick Carter in the July 1979 issue of SeaHorse titled THE PROPER YACHT

 

Some seeds of IMS in there. Good read.

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Interesting article by Dick Carter in the July 1979 issue of SeaHorse titled THE PROPER YACHT

 

Thanks for posting that. 33 years ago, I hadn't begun sailing. Today, I have a 33 y/o NA 40, which is, apparently, a proper yacht. IOR was before my time. If well sailed, the boat did well in IMS, does well in ORR, and in PHRF, every dog has it's day. I actually got the boat more to take my kid cruising after the Mac races, but find I am racing it more than I intended. There is still a small but active OD fleet of these in Detroit.

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For me, the Carter 39 was the most comfortable boat I have ever steered. The little dual wheels were at the perfect distance from my short arms when I rested my head on the stern pulpit. I never felt like the boat was overpowering to steer and it never spun out suddenly. I do envy the seats on Naif though.

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From Vendredi 13 to Star. Rather than rebuilding the old yacht, a totally new hull has been created modelled exactly on the old one.post-32003-029305700 1306007707_thumb.jpg

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"Someone please save the rabbitt".......The rabbitt has been up in the San Juans for the last 10-15 years on the hard with no care. Michael at Deer Harbor Boat Works....360-376-4056 now owns the boat because of back rent. This boat could be aquired for less than $20,000. For someone who wants to do their own work, it would be a very fun project.

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Did'nt u were involved in that project ???

 

From Vendredi 13 to Star. Rather than rebuilding the old yacht, a totally new hull has been created modelled exactly on the old one.post-32003-029305700 1306007707_thumb.jpg

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Did'nt u were involved in that project ???

No. re-construction by post-32003-028665200 1306159204_thumb.jpgLes Constructions Mecaniques de Normandie en 1993.

 

From Vendredi 13 to Star. Rather than rebuilding the old yacht, a totally new hull has been created modelled exactly on the old one.post-32003-029305700 1306007707_thumb.jpg

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