No skiff at 2016 Olympics

[punter 0]

From twitter:

 

DarrenBundock Darren Bundock

ISAF Executive Committee recommendations are out. Supporting Star, mixed Multi, 2x470 but No Skiff!! Holly shit!

 

Rather crazy news from the idiots at ISAF.

[Windward Mark 0]

What is the point of having all of these committees if they don't get listened too??

[GSJ 0]

Absolute jokers

[JimC 652]

No skiff at all (controversial) or no women's skiff (very reasonable as virtually no-one sails one now)?

[skiffman 0]

No skiff at all...

[l4k 0]

It sounds like there is still a way to go on this - although ISAF have made some odd decisions in the past, surely they won't manage to remove skiffs altogether?? I suspect a slate with minimal changes will emerge - something like 2 x boards, 2 x laser, finn, 49er, star, 2 x 470, mixed multihull. But this ISAF, so they could easily fuck ther whole thing up...

[JimC 652]

What is the point of having all of these committees if they don't get listened too??

You can listen to someone and take on board everything they have to say without agreeing with their conclusions. The exec committee and events committee have different terms of reference and different viewpoints, so its scarcely a suprise that they come up with different conclusions, especially in this situation where there are no good answers. Both committees are small largely self selected groups containing mostly people from first world countries. Council on the other hand is a much more representative body.

 

Lets face it, if there was a good and obvious answer to the class selections everyone would be shouting out a consensus. As there isn't everyone comes up with their own answers, all with a healthy dollop of personal or national prejudice... There is a huge rich first world bias to the particpants online, and I wouldn't expect Council, which has a much more varied makeup, to come up with a decision we'll like.

[learningJ24 293]

If we can't agree on classes on a pretty homogeneous board, how can committees that have more greatly varying interests agree? Everyone here agrees that Olympic sailing ought to promote the sport however a percentage of the decision makers are concerned with TV and revenues.

 

Personally, there should be a mix of the tradlitional and cutting edge in the Olympics. A high speed skiff (fun to watch) as well as a multi-crew keelboat (what most people sail) would be an appropiate mix. The more the Olympics (and the America's Cup) move toward the cutting edge of design, the less relevant they become to the majority of sailors.

[sosoomii 426]

It's the lacknof consistency that gets me, more than the choice of events itself. Why do they have to change the events so frequently? The equipment may change over time, but the actual events ought to be virtually unchanged from one Olympiad to the next. And yet here we have multis out, multis in, womens skiff as a real prospect and then possibly no skiff at all. Shambles. Utter shambles. Feel very sorry for the guys campaigning, especially those who may miss out for 2012 but may be realistic prospects for Rio. If you don't know whether your event, let alone specific class will be at the Olympics in 5 years time how are you supposed to plan and prepare?

[jimbo_hobie16 0]

http://www.sail-world.com/Australia/2016-Olympics:-Hang-your-heads-and-weep!!!/83208

[JimC 652]

I usually agree with Richard Gladwell, but I reckon he's off the plot there. I don't reckon the Exec Slate is any better (or any worse) than the Events slate. Neither, to my way of thinking is anywehere approaching least worst option. I do wish people would get off this TV slate. Sailing doesn't do television well, and we need to live with that. Arguing about classes is a bit like arguing over whether gloss paint, acrylic paint or emulsion is the most entertaining to watch dry...

[Steam Flyer 4,743]

It's the lacknof consistency that gets me, more than the choice of events itself. Why do they have to change the events so frequently?

 

Because we have a committee empowered to do so, and they will change the event in exercise of that power even if the change makes no sense or is outright destructive. That's what committees do.

 

 

 

If you don't know whether your event, let alone specific class will be at the Olympics in 5 years time how are you supposed to plan and prepare?

 

Good question... ... ... ... ... ... ...

 

FB- Doug

[sosoomii 426]

Agreed. But a consistent slate from oneOlympics to the next would be nice.

[JimC 652]

Agreed. But a consistent slate from oneOlympics to the next would be nice.

 

In practice that's what you usually get and probably will this time. Just shut your ears while all the politicking and posturing is going on. But frankly if you can't cope with a change of boat what on earth makes you think you're a world class sailor. Everyone's in the same position.

[82brady 1]

No skiffs is unacceptable... Its not in the best interest of the sport at its highest level.

[mustang__1 291]

man i sure hope this is some sort of a sick joke. the women's skiff is not surprising....but dropping the 49er? i love sailing 470's, but they arent that interesting to watch in less than 25kts....

[MR.CLEAN 3,813]

I think that ISAF should require every Class to release exact numbers on how much they've spent to lobby the Exec for their Olympic inclusion. This business seems dirty as fuck - the epitome of back room dealings and power plays with no transparency at all.

[cantp1 3]

From twitter:

 

DarrenBundock Darren Bundock

ISAF Executive Committee recommendations are out. Supporting Star, mixed Multi, 2x470 but No Skiff!! Holly shit!

 

Rather crazy news from the idiots at ISAF.

 

 

Just plain terrible... Really hope they don't go ahead with proposition 29 from Puerto Rico...

[surf nazi 91]

I think that ISAF should require every Class to release exact numbers on how much they've spent to lobby the Exec for their Olympic inclusion. This business seems dirty as fuck - the epitome of back room dealings and power plays with no transparency at all.

 

So because skiffs may not be in the olympics the whole business is dirty ? I guess if skiffs were in , you would not be calling for transparency and would not be accusing people of back room dealing ?

 

You and many others assume that faster boats means more people watching the sport on TV. Well, the skiffs have been in the olypmics for a quite a few years now. Are their ratings any higher than any of the other classes ? I doubt it. Simply going faster and maybe having more crashes does not equal fannies in front of the TV/computer. Yes, we need to market the sport better but simply pushing skiffs and similar boats isn't going to do it.

[Reht 6]

This is either a terrible joke or they're trying to get sailing cut from the Olympics, either way, not cool guys... A little bit of thank-you for putting back the multi (though, without that this would be a total joke), but withdrawing the skiffs in favour of the 470, Star and Elliot 6m, that's a down-right dumb decision.

 

I pray that this isn't the final slate of events, already there's not much compelling me to watch (or hardly even follow) the Olympics as it is. If this is the final slate I think I'll go watch paint dry, that ought to be more exciting...

[skiffman 0]

So what do people think is the Olympics about?

 

Bringing together the best athletes from all over the world to crown a champion?

 

So does that mean that the boat needs to be athletic or not?

 

 

Personally the events/boats in the games do not need to be representative of what is sailed around the world. How many people that go running for fun or to keep fit go and do 100m on a track? At the same time some do and badminton etc is the same game just higher skill level.

 

I think that sailing in the olympics should bring the best sailors, be athletic, be relatively affordable and as fun as sailing can be to watch.

 

 

The other problem is when does it stop? The whole process needs changing, a revolution is needed.

 

We have been trying to look into the next high performance boat for 2020, which would be a 2 person foiler capable of 18 knots upwind and 30+ knots downwind. The idea came about because we thought the 49er was getting old, especially in 2020. But there is no chance of this ever happening if the 49er can not secure a spot. Surely that would be more fun to watch than a star.

 

And for those of you who think sailing is never going to be a spectator that is what you think, but I hate watching football but enjoy playing it. Where is the difference? Sailing may not be a spectator sport for everybody that sails but if sailing wants to stay in the games then it has to be a spectator sport. Its that simple. there will be no sailing if its not good to watch, it does not need to be good to watch all the time. F1 is pretty boring when they just follow each other round like last year but some of the time like when its wet its awesome. The 49er medal race in china was awesome to watch if you like watching sailing, some of you will never want to watch sailing thats a fact. But hopefully in 2012 a lot of people will sit down to watch a few races or medal races, I wonder which will get the most views...

[cantp1 3]

So what do people think is the Olympics about?

 

Bringing together the best athletes from all over the world to crown a champion?

 

So does that mean that the boat needs to be athletic or not?

 

...

 

The 49er medal race in china was awesome to watch if you like watching sailing, some of you will never want to watch sailing thats a fact. But hopefully in 2012 a lot of people will sit down to watch a few races or medal races, I wonder which will get the most views...

 

I agree... DID NO ONE WATCH THE 49ER MEDAL RACE IN 2008? TALK ABOUT EXCITING! The arguably best 49er crew ever was not able to win because of all the crashes and then the Danes come out of nowhere in the Croatian boat to take it. Crikey! Come on, ISAF, get your head screwed on!

 

PS - Clean is right... Good bye TV! The 49er is the most "photographic" of all the existing classes.

[EthanB 0]

god forbid they have less than two single-handed men's dinghy classes.

[Sticky Icky 0]

remember the latest sensation in tv ratings in winter olympics is curling, not everything is about speed

[MR.CLEAN 3,813]

So because skiffs may not be in the olympics the whole business is dirty ? I guess if skiffs were in , you would not be calling for transparency and would not be accusing people of back room dealing ?

 

You and many others assume that faster boats means more people watching the sport on TV. Well, the skiffs have been in the olypmics for a quite a few years now. Are their ratings any higher than any of the other classes ? I doubt it. Simply going faster and maybe having more crashes does not equal fannies in front of the TV/computer. Yes, we need to market the sport better but simply pushing skiffs and similar boats isn't going to do it.

 

No, it's dirty because this is now the second time the Events Committee - the group charged with doing the heavy lifting on research and recommendations - was ignored by the Executive Committee, which just happens to be made up of a group of people whose conflicts of interest would exclude them from this kind of decision under the most basic corporate or professional responsibility rules in almost any modern nation. It's also dirty because there is no disclosure of who's lobbying whom, of who has interests in the classes, or of how much is being spent by the various Class members to lobby the ExComm.

 

ISAF is a fucking banana republic, and the ExComm is going to look like retards yet again and ISAF's credibility will continue to fall into the ground as it did when the multihull decision was made in contravention to the Events Committees recommendation.

[rtrs 0]

So because skiffs may not be in the olympics the whole business is dirty ? I guess if skiffs were in , you would not be calling for transparency and would not be accusing people of back room dealing ?

 

You and many others assume that faster boats means more people watching the sport on TV. Well, the skiffs have been in the olypmics for a quite a few years now. Are their ratings any higher than any of the other classes ? I doubt it. Simply going faster and maybe having more crashes does not equal fannies in front of the TV/computer. Yes, we need to market the sport better but simply pushing skiffs and similar boats isn't going to do it.

 

No, it's dirty because this is now the second time the Events Committee - the group charged with doing the heavy lifting on research and recommendations - was ignored by the Executive Committee, which just happens to be made up of a group of people whose conflicts of interest would exclude them from this kind of decision under the most basic corporate or professional responsibility rules in almost any modern nation. It's also dirty because there is no disclosure of who's lobbying whom, of who has interests in the classes, or of how much is being spent by the various Class members to lobby the ExComm.

 

ISAF is a fucking banana republic, and the ExComm is going to look like retards yet again and ISAF's credibility will continue to fall into the ground as it did when the multihull decision was made in contravention to the Events Committees recommendation.

 

+1

[Tcatman 124]

My take.., will go the other way...

 

Two keel boats (M/W).... Star popular world wide, Match Racing essential to the women's sailing. Keel boat racers are the sports stars, Keel boat racing represent the largest number of racers in the world. Keel boat facilities serve double duty because they are needed for the handicap Olympics. Yeah... I would choose a more modern boat then a Star but basically this gets a check... (BUT Not Cheap)

 

Two classic dinghies (470 M/W) .... Same equipment... (good)... Long standing use world wide so popular (good)... obvious step up program from youth boat c420 to i420.... good , represents pinnacle for sailors on every dinghy made. Cheap! Check

 

Two Boards... (M/W).... let the kites and boards sort it out. Cheap! Check!

 

Individual Sailing:

 

Lasers M/F Suits the ultimate Olympic ideal of individual excellence. World wide acceptance, cheap. Check!

 

So the remaining issues are... High Performance Sailing with max visual appeal to represent the sport to the lay public and the physics problem in that you must fit the body type for laser and so large men cannot compete.

 

 

Multihull, Foolishly punted the last time... Highest performance option for two man boat. Good! the Multi discipline is in alignment with the pinnacle of the sport, The America's Cup. Good! The Tornado always won the most visually exciting award from the Olympic media powers. Check!

 

Finn... solves the men's physics problem. popular world wide... entrenched politically. deals with the number of male sailors > then the number of female sailors.

 

I can buy this slate.

 

49ner versus Multihull... Both High performance. No doubt...multihulls are more popular world wide... Just see Hobie 16 numbers 120,000 boats made over 40 years. It sucks to lose your ultimate level of competition. But the chips fall where they fall

 

My real issue is the MIXED bastardization... Gladwell sumed it up well

.

Multihulls... should be OPEN... You can choose a boat to skew the demographics any way you want between the 16 footer up to a 20 footer. Bottom line... female participation in the high performance niche of the sport (skiffs or multihulls) is pretty low. Forcing the discipline to be mixed is just not right..... Set it up so that women can play fairly. Accept that it won't be 50 50 participation and that reflects the world as we know it.

 

Correct the Mixed bastardization of political correctness and the slate represents the sport and is a fair Compromise!

[MR.CLEAN 3,813]

Going up on the front page. Cheers punter.

[asumpton 0]

 

 

We have been trying to look into the next high performance boat for 2020, which would be a 2 person foiler capable of 18 knots upwind and 30+ knots downwind. The idea came about because we thought the 49er was getting old, especially in 2020.

 

 

May I ask: who is "we"? Are people doing real work on this, actually building and testing, or more like "I drew up the new design on the back of this napkin here..."?

 

Would "we" be a Bethwaite?

[benner 0]

Totally biased view (as I competed in 49er Olympics in 2008) but WTF!

 

Heavy lifting done by events committee for 4+ years, ignored.

Heavy lifting done by Phil Jones committe, ignored.

 

A bunch of old white (white haired and bald) men talking in back rooms and making the decisions for the sport is unacceptable.

 

I know for a fact just how much of the 49er World Council budget is spent on lobbying, and it is ridiculous... all this money on ISAF conferences and nobody growing the sport!

 

As for growing the sport, just who is in charge? Nobody, because everyone is busy choosing what the events will be constantly. Volunteers are great, but where is the the professional CEO leading and guiding sailign forward, making things happen? All the responsibility without accountability lies in a volunteer executive who's best interest could be anywhere, instead of in ISAF.

 

Slow vs. Fast - What's better for TV? Great arguments either way.. done right I wouldn't doubt either could be popular... but they are just arguments because ISAF can't even get organized enough to start covering the World Cup! Where is the World Cup webpage that has gps tracking on every boat, live TV broadcast (internet) on every course, commentary, pundits, photo's prizes, celebrities, scandals, role models? Then we could debate something real instead of something theoretical.

 

Instead, all the money is spent on taking delegates to conferences... ignoring them, and it's no wonder sailing isn't getting on TV... nobody is fiming!

 

In a parliamentary system (sorry, I'm Canadian), if the leading party puts a platform together and it is rejected by the parliament, the ruling party is ousted and there is an election. Does that mean tomorrow, that if the Executive Council slate is voted down (fingers crossed) we get to kick them off the Executive Council and start over?!!!

 

It's time for a total reset!

[Presuming Ed 188]

It's time for a total reset!

 

Absolutely.

[MR.CLEAN 3,813]

+ yep

[doesitfloat 0]

Don't you guys know the plan.

 

As soon as skiffs are out of the Olympics.

 

The Next Americas Cup will be held in badass skiffs, prompting massive interest in the sport.

 

Showing once again the Olympic Committee is ass backwards.

[skiffman 0]

 

 

We have been trying to look into the next high performance boat for 2020, which would be a 2 person foiler capable of 18 knots upwind and 30+ knots downwind. The idea came about because we thought the 49er was getting old, especially in 2020.

 

 

May I ask: who is "we"? Are people doing real work on this, actually building and testing, or more like "I drew up the new design on the back of this napkin here..."?

 

Would "we" be a Bethwaite?

 

We - a few people from the UK only. At the moment we are just looking at trying the get the project started. To be honest nothing apart from some planning/designing will be happening until next year. But then again nothing will happen if ISAF can not even keep the current high performance skiff in the games.

 

1+ for benners post!

[petelane 0]

Want to know what is killing sailing in the US?.... ISAF is killing it.

 

I bet a smart person around here has the participation numbers and we would see big declines when NAYRU became USYRU became US Sailing and then ISAF took over everything from all the national/regional bodies.

 

Monopolies are bad and ISAF is a monopoly - but only because we let it be. Stop insisting on ISAF approval for everything, hold a "Worlds" or "National" event and tell them to go fuck themselves when they tell you they own every word in the dictionary. Time to secede. Who wants to start the petition?

 

I know this site is called Sailing Anarchy, but some real organizational independence/anarchy would be great for the sport. I think we should stop bitching at each other because the man is making it all fucked up, and just vote with our feet. I am sure Clean and Crew can get us list of non-ISAF events that we can support. Who the fuck cares if there are a group of old cheese eating surrender monkeys taking a fully paid vacation on my dime just to watch me do what they can't and "judge me?"

[johnnysaint 4]

So, based on a rumour, Clean writes a story on the front page with the words " ISAF’s Executive Committee looks close to deciding" without anything to back this up. Is it fact or, to use your words " ISAF’s Executive Committee looks close to" just a wild guess based on somebodies Twitter with that somebody NOT being on any ISAF committees.

You can tell when Scott is away can't you.

[sail_like_a_girl 0]

Totally biased view (as I competed in 49er Olympics in 2008) but WTF!

 

Heavy lifting done by events committee for 4+ years, ignored.

Heavy lifting done by Phil Jones committe, ignored.

 

A bunch of old white (white haired and bald) men talking in back rooms and making the decisions for the sport is unacceptable.

 

I know for a fact just how much of the 49er World Council budget is spent on lobbying, and it is ridiculous... all this money on ISAF conferences and nobody growing the sport!

 

As for growing the sport, just who is in charge? Nobody, because everyone is busy choosing what the events will be constantly. Volunteers are great, but where is the the professional CEO leading and guiding sailign forward, making things happen? All the responsibility without accountability lies in a volunteer executive who's best interest could be anywhere, instead of in ISAF.

 

Slow vs. Fast - What's better for TV? Great arguments either way.. done right I wouldn't doubt either could be popular... but they are just arguments because ISAF can't even get organized enough to start covering the World Cup! Where is the World Cup webpage that has gps tracking on every boat, live TV broadcast (internet) on every course, commentary, pundits, photo's prizes, celebrities, scandals, role models? Then we could debate something real instead of something theoretical.

 

Instead, all the money is spent on taking delegates to conferences... ignoring them, and it's no wonder sailing isn't getting on TV... nobody is fiming!

 

In a parliamentary system (sorry, I'm Canadian), if the leading party puts a platform together and it is rejected by the parliament, the ruling party is ousted and there is an election. Does that mean tomorrow, that if the Executive Council slate is voted down (fingers crossed) we get to kick them off the Executive Council and start over?!!!

 

It's time for a total reset!

 

+1

[JimC 652]

So, based on a rumour, Clean writes a story on the front page with the words " ISAF’s Executive Committee looks close to deciding

If Clean possessed a clue he'd know that the Exec committee can't decide anything of the sort: its down to Council...

[sail_like_a_girl 0]

Want to know what is killing sailing in the US?.... ISAF is killing it.

 

I bet a smart person around here has the participation numbers and we would see big declines when NAYRU became USYRU became US Sailing and then ISAF took over everything from all the national/regional bodies.

 

Monopolies are bad and ISAF is a monopoly - but only because we let it be. Stop insisting on ISAF approval for everything, hold a "Worlds" or "National" event and tell them to go fuck themselves when they tell you they own every word in the dictionary. Time to secede. Who wants to start the petition?

 

I know this site is called Sailing Anarchy, but some real organizational independence/anarchy would be great for the sport. I think we should stop bitching at each other because the man is making it all fucked up, and just vote with our feet. I am sure Clean and Crew can get us list of non-ISAF events that we can support. Who the fuck cares if there are a group of old cheese eating surrender monkeys taking a fully paid vacation on my dime just to watch me do what they can't and "judge me?"

 

+100

[ccp_merc 0]

Want to know what is killing sailing in the US?.... ISAF is killing it.

 

I bet a smart person around here has the participation numbers and we would see big declines when NAYRU became USYRU became US Sailing and then ISAF took over everything from all the national/regional bodies.

 

Monopolies are bad and ISAF is a monopoly - but only because we let it be. Stop insisting on ISAF approval for everything, hold a "Worlds" or "National" event and tell them to go fuck themselves when they tell you they own every word in the dictionary. Time to secede. Who wants to start the petition?

 

I know this site is called Sailing Anarchy, but some real organizational independence/anarchy would be great for the sport. I think we should stop bitching at each other because the man is making it all fucked up, and just vote with our feet. I am sure Clean and Crew can get us list of non-ISAF events that we can support. Who the fuck cares if there are a group of old cheese eating surrender monkeys taking a fully paid vacation on my dime just to watch me do what they can't and "judge me?"

 

+100

 

+1

[ccp_merc 0]

Totally biased view (as I competed in 49er Olympics in 2008) but WTF!

 

 

 

It's time for a total reset!

 

+1

 

+1

[TheMinister 0]

Anybody up for organizing an ISAF (the anarchy kind) regatta down in Weymouth next summer?

[benner 0]

So, based on a rumour, Clean writes a story on the front page with the words " ISAF's Executive Committee looks close to deciding" without anything to back this up. Is it fact or, to use your words " ISAF's Executive Committee looks close to" just a wild guess based on somebodies Twitter with that somebody NOT being on any ISAF committees.

You can tell when Scott is away can't you.

 

I'm not at the conference, but that twitter (by a world champion who is at the conference) is not based on rumor... it is based on what the Executive Council presented as their selection. They don't have the final say... but they do make up about 40% of the people that do have the final say.

[johnnysaint 4]

So, based on a rumour, Clean writes a story on the front page with the words " ISAF's Executive Committee looks close to deciding" without anything to back this up. Is it fact or, to use your words " ISAF's Executive Committee looks close to" just a wild guess based on somebodies Twitter with that somebody NOT being on any ISAF committees.

You can tell when Scott is away can't you.

 

I'm not at the conference, but that twitter (by a world champion who is at the conference) is not based on rumor... it is based on what the Executive Council presented as their selection. They don't have the final say... but they do make up about 40% of the people that do have the final say.

Don't think he's at the conference. He said he's babysitting or something like that. Anyway....

 

The ISAF Exec haven't voted yet. Clean's front page story, and this thread, are based on what a few people THINK might happen. Wait till they vote then criticize.

[Tcatman 124]

So, based on a rumour, Clean writes a story on the front page with the words " ISAF's Executive Committee looks close to deciding" without anything to back this up. Is it fact or, to use your words " ISAF's Executive Committee looks close to" just a wild guess based on somebodies Twitter with that somebody NOT being on any ISAF committees.

You can tell when Scott is away can't you.

 

I'm not at the conference, but that twitter (by a world champion who is at the conference) is not based on rumor... it is based on what the Executive Council presented as their selection. They don't have the final say... but they do make up about 40% of the people that do have the final say.

Don't think he's at the conference. He said he's babysitting or something like that. Anyway....

 

The ISAF Exec haven't voted yet. Clean's front page story, and this thread, are based on what a few people THINK might happen. Wait till they vote then criticize.

So this report by Gladwell posted 6.40 PM Friday is wrong?

 

The latest news out of the 2011 Mid-Year Meeting of the International Sailing Federation in St Petersburg, Russia is that the Executive Committee has met and decided not to support the recommendation of the Events Committee made yesterday.

 

The decision called for both Keelboat classes to be dropped, and instead for a second two handed dinghy event, for Men and Women, sailed in the 470 class, to be inserted into the ten event card for the 2016 Olympic Regatta in Rio de Janeiro.

 

Instead the Executive Committee, which consists of the top echelon of the ISAF - the President, Presidents of Honour, Vice Presidents and Treasurer has opted for a Submission 29 lodged by Federación de Vela de Puerto Rico which favours the reinstatement of both the the Star and Womens Match Racing events at the expense of the two High Performance skiff Events for Men and Womens.

 

Are you saying that an exec comm vote is not recorded but this recommendation will be forwarded and taken up by full council Saturday and that will be the final decision?

[johnnysaint 4]

So, based on a rumour, Clean writes a story on the front page with the words " ISAF's Executive Committee looks close to deciding" without anything to back this up. Is it fact or, to use your words " ISAF's Executive Committee looks close to" just a wild guess based on somebodies Twitter with that somebody NOT being on any ISAF committees.

You can tell when Scott is away can't you.

 

I'm not at the conference, but that twitter (by a world champion who is at the conference) is not based on rumor... it is based on what the Executive Council presented as their selection. They don't have the final say... but they do make up about 40% of the people that do have the final say.

Don't think he's at the conference. He said he's babysitting or something like that. Anyway....

 

The ISAF Exec haven't voted yet. Clean's front page story, and this thread, are based on what a few people THINK might happen. Wait till they vote then criticize.

So this report by Gladwell posted 6.40 PM Friday is wrong?

 

The latest news out of the 2011 Mid-Year Meeting of the International Sailing Federation in St Petersburg, Russia is that the Executive Committee has met and decided not to support the recommendation of the Events Committee made yesterday.

 

The decision called for both Keelboat classes to be dropped, and instead for a second two handed dinghy event, for Men and Women, sailed in the 470 class, to be inserted into the ten event card for the 2016 Olympic Regatta in Rio de Janeiro.

 

Instead the Executive Committee, which consists of the top echelon of the ISAF - the President, Presidents of Honour, Vice Presidents and Treasurer has opted for a Submission 29 lodged by Federación de Vela de Puerto Rico which favours the reinstatement of both the the Star and Womens Match Racing events at the expense of the two High Performance skiff Events for Men and Womens.

 

Are you saying that an exec comm vote is not recorded but this recommendation will be forwarded and taken up by full council Saturday and that will be the final decision?

 

Read that report on Sailworld also.

 

I'm not saying anything except that the vote and final decision has not been made yet.

[Tcatman 124]

So, based on a rumour, Clean writes a story on the front page with the words " ISAF's Executive Committee looks close to deciding" without anything to back this up. Is it fact or, to use your words " ISAF's Executive Committee looks close to" just a wild guess based on somebodies Twitter with that somebody NOT being on any ISAF committees.

You can tell when Scott is away can't you.

 

I'm not at the conference, but that twitter (by a world champion who is at the conference) is not based on rumor... it is based on what the Executive Council presented as their selection. They don't have the final say... but they do make up about 40% of the people that do have the final say.

Don't think he's at the conference. He said he's babysitting or something like that. Anyway....

 

The ISAF Exec haven't voted yet. Clean's front page story, and this thread, are based on what a few people THINK might happen. Wait till they vote then criticize.

So this report by Gladwell posted 6.40 PM Friday is wrong?

 

The latest news out of the 2011 Mid-Year Meeting of the International Sailing Federation in St Petersburg, Russia is that the Executive Committee has met and decided not to support the recommendation of the Events Committee made yesterday.

 

The decision called for both Keelboat classes to be dropped, and instead for a second two handed dinghy event, for Men and Women, sailed in the 470 class, to be inserted into the ten event card for the 2016 Olympic Regatta in Rio de Janeiro.

 

Instead the Executive Committee, which consists of the top echelon of the ISAF - the President, Presidents of Honour, Vice Presidents and Treasurer has opted for a Submission 29 lodged by Federación de Vela de Puerto Rico which favours the reinstatement of both the the Star and Womens Match Racing events at the expense of the two High Performance skiff Events for Men and Womens.

 

Are you saying that an exec comm vote is not recorded but this recommendation will be forwarded and taken up by full council Saturday and that will be the final decision?

 

Read that report on Sailworld also.

 

I'm not saying anything except that the vote and final decision has not been made yet.

Ah.... the 49ner lobby money may come in handy tonight... Time to shoot the wad boys! Tornado sailors understand how this plays out...badly!

 

I thought they changed the ballot rules for this cycle ... The structure of the balloting created choices that screwed the T class the last time... US Sailing has not recovered their reputation from that situation.

 

Very little public discussion this cycle about how the council will go about voting. Sounds like they want to avoid being smoked when this call is made this time. It's natural to assume that the exec comm point of view will carry the day. ISAF just wants to make sure that no names are attached to the vote.

 

Still your point is... It ain't over until the fat lady sings. Are you betting on a late night change?

[johnnysaint 4]

 

I thought they changed the ballot rules for this cycle ... The structure of the balloting created choices that screwed the T class the last time... US Sailing has not recovered their reputation from that situation.

 

Very little public discussion this cycle about how the council will go about voting. Sounds like they want to avoid being smoked when this call is made this time. It's natural to assume that the exec comm point of view will carry the day.

 

Still your point is... It ain't over until the fat lady sings. Are you betting on a late night change?

 

I don't follow this shit much as I don't sail Olympic class boats and it's none of my business.

 

As far as I know, the vote & decision will not be made for 6 months. Any damn thing can happen in that time. The fat lady isn't even in the room yet.

[Fireball 11]

Olympic sailing in a boat like a 470 is like running a motor race in Toyota Corallas. Sure you have to be a very good sailor (or driver) to do well, but nobody really cares who wins.

 

The result is that getting an Olympic medal doesn't make you one of the top dogs in the sailing world. It's really just a training exercise. You have to go on and do something in a more prestigious class or forum (AC, VOR, WMRT) to be able to claim to be one of the best sailors in the world.

 

Maybe sailing should be like football, where the Olympics are for young athletes, and the main competition in the sport is held elsewhere.

[Tcatman 124]

 

I thought they changed the ballot rules for this cycle ... The structure of the balloting created choices that screwed the T class the last time... US Sailing has not recovered their reputation from that situation.

 

Very little public discussion this cycle about how the council will go about voting. Sounds like they want to avoid being smoked when this call is made this time. It's natural to assume that the exec comm point of view will carry the day.

 

Still your point is... It ain't over until the fat lady sings. Are you betting on a late night change?

 

I don't follow this shit much as I don't sail Olympic class boats and it's none of my business.

 

As far as I know, the vote & decision will not be made for 6 months. Any damn thing can happen in that time. The fat lady isn't even in the room yet.

 

No... there I think you are wrong... events will be voted on tomorrow ... Equipment will be finalized after trials and that vote will be in 6 months.

[johnnysaint 4]

 

I thought they changed the ballot rules for this cycle ... The structure of the balloting created choices that screwed the T class the last time... US Sailing has not recovered their reputation from that situation.

 

Very little public discussion this cycle about how the council will go about voting. Sounds like they want to avoid being smoked when this call is made this time. It's natural to assume that the exec comm point of view will carry the day.

 

Still your point is... It ain't over until the fat lady sings. Are you betting on a late night change?

 

I don't follow this shit much as I don't sail Olympic class boats and it's none of my business.

 

As far as I know, the vote & decision will not be made for 6 months. Any damn thing can happen in that time. The fat lady isn't even in the room yet.

 

No... there I think you are wrong... events will be voted on tomorrow ... Equipment will be finalized after trials and that vote will be in 6 months.

Given that the events depend upon the equipment, it ain't decided yet. Both the 470 & 49er are 2 person dinghies.

[Tcatman 124]

Olympic sailing in a boat like a 470 is like running a motor race in Toyota Corallas. Sure you have to be a very good sailor (or driver) to do well, but nobody really cares who wins.

 

The result is that getting an Olympic medal doesn't make you one of the top dogs in the sailing world. It's really just a training exercise. You have to go on and do something in a more prestigious class or forum (AC, VOR, WMRT) to be able to claim to be one of the best sailors in the world.

 

Maybe sailing should be like football, where the Olympics are for young athletes, and the main competition in the sport is held elsewhere.

No... I disagree... you ARE a great sailor. and representing your country would be a huge rush. More so then a pro career in sailing. So, just like winning the 100m dash makes you the fastest man in the world. Now... if you go play pro football your prestige will increase. Likewise, an Olympic Sailor can move onwards to those other pro classes and your prestige/notoriety will increase.

 

ISAF knows that these superstars can jump back into a keel boat campaign and increase the prestige and exposure leading up to the games. They believe they need the keel boat for this purpose. Building notoriety through the Olympics has been a key to a sailing career... the women trade anything to have match racing. Obviously they believe that this format increases their exposure and paves the way for the next step as pros.

 

I always forget... if the Olympics drop sailing... the ISAF has no money...I remember the number as something like 70% The whole thing will collapse. Moreover, The IOC won't strike a deal with any other upstart Sailing organization either.... they save money (sailing is expensive especially after you add in the venue and security issues They can easily bring in another cheaper sport. So... ISAF is operating for their survival... The good of the sport.... well your mileage will vary.

[Tcatman 124]

 

I thought they changed the ballot rules for this cycle ... The structure of the balloting created choices that screwed the T class the last time... US Sailing has not recovered their reputation from that situation.

 

Very little public discussion this cycle about how the council will go about voting. Sounds like they want to avoid being smoked when this call is made this time. It's natural to assume that the exec comm point of view will carry the day.

 

Still your point is... It ain't over until the fat lady sings. Are you betting on a late night change?

 

I don't follow this shit much as I don't sail Olympic class boats and it's none of my business.

 

As far as I know, the vote & decision will not be made for 6 months. Any damn thing can happen in that time. The fat lady isn't even in the room yet.

 

No... there I think you are wrong... events will be voted on tomorrow ... Equipment will be finalized after trials and that vote will be in 6 months.

Given that the events depend upon the equipment, it ain't decided yet. Both the 470 & 49er are 2 person dinghies.

True, but that is why the proposals add trial after the event to note the equipment is open. I would bet that the demographics of the 49ners don't match up with the demographics of the 470 class. They did not leave the event with equipment open for that reason.

Fast, visually exciting and different then laser and keelboat sailing may not trump countries interested / able to compete for medals.

 

How much money did the 49ners commit to lobbying? Shoot the wad boys... shoot the wad!

[Fireball 11]

Olympic sailing in a boat like a 470 is like running a motor race in Toyota Corallas. Sure you have to be a very good sailor (or driver) to do well, but nobody really cares who wins.

 

The result is that getting an Olympic medal doesn't make you one of the top dogs in the sailing world. It's really just a training exercise. You have to go on and do something in a more prestigious class or forum (AC, VOR, WMRT) to be able to claim to be one of the best sailors in the world.

 

Maybe sailing should be like football, where the Olympics are for young athletes, and the main competition in the sport is held elsewhere.

No... I disagree... you ARE a great sailor. and representing your country would be a huge rush. More so then a pro career in sailing. So, just like winning the 100m dash makes you the fastest man in the world. Now... if you go play pro football your prestige will increase. Likewise, an Olympic Sailor can move onwards to those other pro classes and your prestige/notoriety will increase.

 

ISAF knows that these superstars can jump back into a keel boat campaign and increase the prestige and exposure leading up to the games. They believe they need the keel boat for this purpose. Building notoriety through the Olympics has been a key to a sailing career... the women trade anything to have match racing. Obviously they believe that this format increases their exposure and paves the way for the next step as pros.

 

I always forget... if the Olympics drop sailing... the ISAF has no money...I remember the number as something like 70% The whole thing will collapse. Moreover, The IOC won't strike a deal with any other upstart Sailing organization either.... they save money (sailing is expensive especially after you add in the venue and security issues They can easily bring in another cheaper sport. So... ISAF is operating for their survival... The good of the sport.... well your mileage will vary.

 

The winner of the 100m dash is a superstar making huge amounts of money (Usain Bolt makes something like USD10M pa - not as much as some sportsman, but enough to set him up for life).

 

An Olympic Gold Medal winning and multiple World Championship winning 470 sailor here in Aus barely covers his costs and has to sail in Pro sailing events like the Farr 40 to earn enough to get by. The whole Olympic 470 thing is a joke - they are basically amateurs and they are nowhere near the top of the sport.

 

The same can be said about some of the other events. For example, the Olympic boardsailors are nowhere to be seen on the pro tour. They are basically amateurs in a professional sport.

[Steve AUS 0]

Olympic sailing in a boat like a 470 is like running a motor race in Toyota Corallas. Sure you have to be a very good sailor (or driver) to do well, but nobody really cares who wins.

 

The result is that getting an Olympic medal doesn't make you one of the top dogs in the sailing world. It's really just a training exercise. You have to go on and do something in a more prestigious class or forum (AC, VOR, WMRT) to be able to claim to be one of the best sailors in the world.

 

Maybe sailing should be like football, where the Olympics are for young athletes, and the main competition in the sport is held elsewhere.

 

Olympic sailing in a boat like a 470 is open to all sorts of people with opinions.

 

Seriously, have you ever met any of these people, or even had a glimpse of how they do a campaign?

[Steve AUS 0]

Sorry fireball, I read your last post, whatever.

[Fireball 11]

Sorry fireball, I read your last post, whatever.

 

The 49er and the 470 cover similar demographics. The 470 guys are lighter, but the 49er guys are not heavyweights at all - so it doesn't make much sense to have both.

 

IMHO this is a no-brainer: the 49er is more modern, faster, more fun, more entertaining to watch and has a much higher standard. They should have dropped the 470 when they introduced the 49er into the Olympics in 2000.

 

But no - the current proposal from the ISAF Executive Committee drops the 49er and retains the 470 for men. This is madness IMHO.

 

These guys have a crappy track record. The 2 most exciting classes in 2008 were the 49er and the Tornado. They dropped the Tornado from the 2012 games only to reinstate it in 2016 (possibly) and now they want to drop the 49er for 2016. It would be almost comical if not for the fact that their decisions stuff up the lives of many athletes.

[skiffman 0]

M10 gets it, no keelboats for 2016 but skiffs and cat are in.

 

Still a shame to see the star go, lets hope ISAF can get an 11th medal back to put the star in as Paul Henderson did

[Rohanoz 44]

Still don't get why they don't go:

1 men's board

2 women's board

3 men's singlehanded

4 women's singlehanded

5 men's double hand mono

6 women's double hand mono

7 men's multihull

8 women's multihull

9 men's keelboat

10 women's keelboat

 

Done. 10 events. Equal men/women. All usual sectors of sailing covered.

 

Then, fill in the blanks.

1/2 windsurfer

3/4 laser

5/6 49er (women can deal with it)

7/8 F18

9/10. Elliott 6 sports

 

Stagger the dates, share the equipment.

[FishAintBiting 1]

Still don't get why they don't go:

1 men's board

2 women's board

3 men's singlehanded

4 women's singlehanded

5 men's double hand mono

6 women's double hand mono

7 men's multihull

8 women's multihull

9 men's keelboat

10 women's keelboat

 

Done. 10 events. Equal men/women. All usual sectors of sailing covered.

 

Then, fill in the blanks.

1/2 windsurfer

3/4 laser

5/6 49er (women can deal with it)

7/8 F18

9/10. Elliott 6 sports

 

Stagger the dates, share the equipment.

 

Disagree with some of your blanks.

 

Way I see it:

 

1/2 windsurfer

3/4 laser

5/6 49er

7/8 F18 single manufacturer or tornado

9/10 kitesurfer

 

 

The olympics are no place for keelboats. Too ken heavy, too ken expensive, and too ken boring!

 

Happy sailing,

 

Fish

[Steve AUS 0]

Problem with that Rohan is that they are all around the same weight. Very few over 80kgs sailors in there.

[FishAintBiting 1]

Problem with that Rohan is that they are all around the same weight. Very few over 80kgs sailors in there.

 

I can't see the problem with this. There aren't many runners over 80kgs competing at the olympics either. How about fencing and over 80kg athletes?

 

The olympics is all about the spectacle and media. Nothing more. What boats, that requires crew weighing over 80kgs, would the public want to see? Actually based on the media coverage over the past few editions why show sailing at all?

 

If the need is there these sailors you're referring to would be able to drop the kgs. Look at how many finn sailors have been sailing laser previously.

 

Fish

[Fireball 11]

Still don't get why they don't go:

1 men's board

2 women's board

3 men's singlehanded

4 women's singlehanded

5 men's double hand mono

6 women's double hand mono

7 men's multihull

8 women's multihull

9 men's keelboat

10 women's keelboat

 

Done. 10 events. Equal men/women. All usual sectors of sailing covered.

 

Then, fill in the blanks.

1/2 windsurfer

3/4 laser

5/6 49er (women can deal with it)

7/8 F18

9/10. Elliott 6 sports

 

Stagger the dates, share the equipment.

 

That would be much too simple and sensible for the clowns in the ISAF.

 

I would have the 29erXX for the women though - the 49er is too much of a handful in a breeze.

 

The current proposal (which changes every day it seems) really wastes 2 events by having the 470 and the 49er and whatever the women's evaluation trial comes up with.

[sail7seas 1]

http://www.sailing.org/35891.php

 

The ten events selected by the ISAF Council for the 2016 Olympic Sailing Competition are:

 

Men's Board and/or Kiteboard - evaluation

Women's Board and/or Kiteboard - evaluation

Men's One Person Dinghy - Laser

Women's One Person Dinghy - Laser Radial

Men's 2nd One Person Dinghy - Finn

Men's Skiff - 49er

Women's Skiff - Evaluation

Men's Two Person Dinghy - 470

Women's Two Person Dinghy - 470

Mixed Two Person Multihull - Evaluation

[Tornadosail2012 3]

So because skiffs may not be in the olympics the whole business is dirty ? I guess if skiffs were in , you would not be calling for transparency and would not be accusing people of back room dealing ?

I do not think this is about the skiffs. This is about the process and the way these things happen at the ISAF level. While I was not there for the multihull vote, I do know a couple of people who were in the meetings that led up to that vote. What sailors are saying is that this process should be handled differently then it has been. Additionally I would have to question what the IOC response will be if their recommendations are not followed. This would be the third time that ISAF has flouted the IOC directives. If memory serves correctly, the IOC money makes up 60-70% of ISAF's annual budget. Should that disappear, what will make up the difference?

[Trevor B 69]

Everybody has to remember that ISAF is evil and anti-sailor. If you keep that in mind then it's actions are fairly predictable.

[17mika 154]

Good to see women's skiff and cats in !

 

It will be fun to see if it's gonna be the XX, rebel or something else.

[couchsurfer 206]

Good to see women's skiff and cats in !

 

It will be fun to see if it's gonna be the XX, rebel or something else.

...is that the final line-up then??

 

...it used to be said that the best thing for finns were th'Europe's,,

that'd probably apply to the skiffs too

....definitely looking forward to seeing women skiffies in action on that level,,

DEFINETLY hope it's the 9er,,,what other boat -could- it be??

[couchsurfer 206]

...this from 'DOGWATCH' on the other thread........sounds official.

......looks like the expected changes,,,sorry no lead!.........

 

Well I guess you can't believe everything you read on Twitter.

 

http://www.sailing.org/35891.php

 

 

The International Sailing Federation (ISAF) has confirmed the ten events for the 2016 Olympic Sailing Competition at 2011 ISAF Mid-Year Meeting in St Petersburg, Russia. ISAF President Göran Petersson led the ISAF Council in more than three hours of debate and discussion before the ten events were decided. Over 50 Submissions were received for consideration following the changes to the process for selecting events and equipment that was agreed in November 2010.

 

The ten events selected by the ISAF Council for the 2016 Olympic Sailing Competition are:

 

Men's Board or Kiteboard - evaluation

Women's Board or Kiteboard - evaluation

Men's One Person Dinghy - Laser

Women's One Person Dinghy - Laser Radial

Men's 2nd One Person Dinghy - Finn

Men's Skiff - 49er

Women's Skiff - Evaluation

Men's Two Person Dinghy - 470

Women's Two Person Dinghy - 470

Mixed Two Person Multihull - Evaluation

[skiff_girl 0]

Women's skiff LET's GO!

Crossing my fingers for the 29erXX personally...

 

http://29erusa457.blogspot.com

[couchsurfer 206]

Women's skiff LET's GO!

Crossing my fingers for the 29erXX personally...

 

http://29erusa457.blogspot.com

 

..nice blog,,looks like you guy(ettes) are all ready t'go!

...in the 'san fran invasion'on your blog,are those boats privately owned or 'demo' boats??

[skiff_girl 0]

Women's skiff LET's GO!

Crossing my fingers for the 29erXX personally...

 

http://29erusa457.blogspot.com

 

..nice blog,,looks like you guy(ettes) are all ready t'go!

...in the 'san fran invasion'on your blog,are those boats privately owned or 'demo' boats??

 

 

 

There were 3 demo rigs, 4 private rigs, all privately owned boats with the exception of one or two Richmond Yacht Club boats, I believe.

[couchsurfer 206]

Women's skiff LET's GO!

Crossing my fingers for the 29erXX personally...

 

http://29erusa457.blogspot.com

 

..nice blog,,looks like you guy(ettes) are all ready t'go!

...in the 'san fran invasion'on your blog,are those boats privately owned or 'demo' boats??

 

 

 

There were 3 demo rigs, 4 private rigs, all privately owned boats with the exception of one or two Richmond Yacht Club boats, I believe.

..good t'see the boat getting some traction finally!--have at it!!

..oh yeh,,and WELCOME to SA

[Dag-Sabot 0]

-what happened to the 49'er?

[couchsurfer 206]

-what happened to the 49'er?

The ten events selected by the ISAF Council for the 2016 Olympic Sailing Competition are:

 

Men's Board or Kiteboard - evaluation

Women's Board or Kiteboard - evaluation

Men's One Person Dinghy - Laser

Women's One Person Dinghy - Laser Radial

Men's 2nd One Person Dinghy - Moth

Men's Skiff - 49er

Women's Skiff - Evaluation

Men's Two Person Dinghy - 420

Women's Two Person Dinghy - 420

Mixed Two Person Multihull - Evaluation

[sailorwillis 0]

-what happened to the 49'er?

The ten events selected by the ISAF Council for the 2016 Olympic Sailing Competition are:

 

Men's Board or Kiteboard - evaluation

Women's Board or Kiteboard - evaluation

Men's One Person Dinghy - Laser

Women's One Person Dinghy - Laser Radial

Men's 2nd One Person Dinghy - Moth

Men's Skiff - 49er

Women's Skiff - Evaluation

Men's Two Person Dinghy - 420

Women's Two Person Dinghy - 420

Mixed Two Person Multihull - Evaluation

 

not sure how moth worked its way into your list...

http://www.sailing.org/35891.php

[couchsurfer 206]

..wishful thinking!

[skiffboy 0]

Good to see women's skiff and cats in !

 

It will be fun to see if it's gonna be the XX, rebel or something else.

...is that the final line-up then??

 

...it used to be said that the best thing for finns were th'Europe's,,

that'd probably apply to the skiffs too

....definitely looking forward to seeing women skiffies in action on that level,,

DEFINETLY hope it's the 9er,,,what other boat -could- it be??

I saw such an awesome design not too long ago. To be honest, I'd lmost consider a sex change to sail one.

[johnnysaint 4]

So are we going to see a retraction by Clean and all the other "premature ejaculators"?

 

Talk about a bad rerun.

[sadolph 2]

The absurdity and comedy of the last race in 49ers may have something to do with it? Maybe?

[17mika 154]

The absurdity and comedy of the last race in 49ers may have something to do with it? Maybe?

 

that was fun actually (even if I'm Italian.. ouch)

 

anyway get up to date. 49er is in, and I honestly don't get how it could have been out; it's the only decently tv whatchable sailing event in the olympics.

[couchsurfer 206]

The absurdity and comedy of the last race in 49ers may have something to do with it? Maybe?

 

that was fun actually (even if I'm Italian.. ouch)

 

anyway get up to date. 49er is in, and I honestly don't get how it could have been out; it's the only decently tv whatchable sailing event in the olympics.

...yeh,when a boat's designed for planing in 8 knots,of course it's going t'be totally over the top when it's nukin',,still love watching that vid!

 

....with a gal's skiff fleet,,we'll have some pedigree skiff babies in a few short years

 

[LucaBastos 0]

Hi

 

Nothing against skiffs and catamarans but it will be very bad for the sailing sport in Brazil to host 2016 Olympics in Rio without Star where shine the brazilians Robert Scheidt (Star ranking #1 and 4 Olympic medals) and Torben Grael (Star ranking #10 and 5 Olympic medals).

[couchsurfer 206]

Hi

 

Nothing against skiffs and catamarans but it will be very bad for the sailing sport in Brazil to host 2016 Olympics in Rio without Star where shine the brazilians Robert Scheidt (Star ranking #1 and 4 Olympic medals) and Torben Grael (Star ranking #10 and 5 Olympic medals).

...at least they won't have t'fight for the spot!

[Fireball 11]

The absurdity and comedy of the last race in 49ers may have something to do with it? Maybe?

 

that was fun actually (even if I'm Italian.. ouch)

 

anyway get up to date. 49er is in, and I honestly don't get how it could have been out; it's the only decently tv whatchable sailing event in the olympics.

...yeh,when a boat's designed for planing in 8 knots,of course it's going t'be totally over the top when it's nukin',,still love watching that vid!

 

....with a gal's skiff fleet,,we'll have some pedigree skiff babies in a few short years

 

 

The full 49er rig is too big for this sort of conditions. They need to use the "sports rig" which has very little roach if they want to race in the sort of wind and waves in the video.

 

This is the same for many other skiffs: 12s, 16s and 18s all have multiple rigs. If you don't have a small rig for windy days then you have to cancel the racing.

 

Multiple rigs is better than the conventional dinghy approach of having a small rig and sailing around underpowered most of the time.

[Lake Shark 7]

The absurdity and comedy of the last race in 49ers may have something to do with it? Maybe?

 

that was fun actually (even if I'm Italian.. ouch)

 

anyway get up to date. 49er is in, and I honestly don't get how it could have been out; it's the only decently tv whatchable sailing event in the olympics.

...yeh,when a boat's designed for planing in 8 knots,of course it's going t'be totally over the top when it's nukin',,still love watching that vid!

 

....with a gal's skiff fleet,,we'll have some pedigree skiff babies in a few short years

 

 

The full 49er rig is too big for this sort of conditions. They need to use the "sports rig" which has very little roach if they want to race in the sort of wind and waves in the video.

 

This is the same for many other skiffs: 12s, 16s and 18s all have multiple rigs. If you don't have a small rig for windy days then you have to cancel the racing.

 

Multiple rigs is better than the conventional dinghy approach of having a small rig and sailing around underpowered most of the time.

 

 

that is what makes it fun though, no one watches nascar for the racing, they watch it for the crashes. Same thing is going to apply to sailing. tv viewers are going to want to see guys full out on the wire haulin ass down wind. Yes a lot of people tipped but not everyone tipped, keeping your boat upright is part of sailing.

[smc 0]

The full 49er rig is too big for this sort of conditions. They need to use the "sports rig" which has very little roach if they want to race in the sort of wind and waves in the video.

 

Yep, I've got a sports set of sails, we find in the 15kt+ area the smaller jib and kite are great (you can actually bear away) but we still use the full main as it's easier to depower. Probably an issue at the Olympics is the race could be won and lost in sail selection hours before the race?

[Smithy 4]

So are we going to see a retraction by Clean and all the other "premature ejaculators"?

 

Talk about a bad rerun.

 

People don't seem to get the ISAF process. Proposals ("submissions") are put forward, the ultimate decision on everything is made by the Council, but the other committees get to make their recommendations to Council first on how they (the other committees) think Council should vote

 

So we understand - and if accurate this should be confirmed in the minutes which will be published in the next few weeks - that despite all the work done by the Olympic Commission and the Events Committee and the well-thought through proposals this has led to, that the Executive Committee attempted to overturn the whole shebang by recommending a completely different framework which seems explicable only by the national self-interest of certain members of that Committee

 

So unless they are factually incorrect as to what the Executive recommended, those who reported that have nothing to apologise for - indeed if their contribution helped focus attention on what the Exec were doing they should be thanked. Reporting that "the Executive C'tee have recommended" something is not the same as saying "ISAF (ie Council) have decided..." that. In this case (thankfully) Council ignored the Exec recommendation

 

The serious issue is that while the Council is explicitly structured along the lines of country/regional representation, that is not the role of the Executive Committee. The Executive is supposed to "execute the policy decisions of Council" and make operational decisions. For Executive Committee members to base their decisions on their own respective national interest ought to be entirely inappropriate and to make their position on that Committee - and role as ISAF officials - untenable. But I'm not dumb enough to think that's actually going to happen...

[Fireball 11]

The full 49er rig is too big for this sort of conditions. They need to use the "sports rig" which has very little roach if they want to race in the sort of wind and waves in the video.

 

Yep, I've got a sports set of sails, we find in the 15kt+ area the smaller jib and kite are great (you can actually bear away) but we still use the full main as it's easier to depower. Probably an issue at the Olympics is the race could be won and lost in sail selection hours before the race?

 

Rig selection is a big part of the racing for a lot of skiff classes. But if this is unacceptable for the Olympics then you could have the race committee specify the equipment for the day.

 

I think it's silly to have the best sailors in the world crashing all over the course because the equipment isn't suitable for the conditions. They usually cancel when the wind is over 25kts, but the waves in Qingdao were huge and 20kts would have been a more realistic limit.