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      A Few Simple Rules   05/22/2017

      Sailing Anarchy is a very lightly moderated site. This is by design, to afford a more free atmosphere for discussion. There are plenty of sailing forums you can go to where swearing isn't allowed, confrontation is squelched and, and you can have a moderator finger-wag at you for your attitude. SA tries to avoid that and allow for more adult behavior without moderators editing your posts and whacking knuckles with rulers. We don't have a long list of published "thou shalt nots" either, and this is by design. Too many absolute rules paints us into too many corners. So check the Terms of Service - there IS language there about certain types of behavior that is not permitted. We interpret that lightly and permit a lot of latitude, but we DO reserve the right to take action when something is too extreme to tolerate (too racist, graphic, violent, misogynistic, etc.). Yes, that is subjective, but it allows us discretion. Avoiding a laundry list of rules allows for freedom; don't abuse it. However there ARE a few basic rules that will earn you a suspension, and apparently a brief refresher is in order. 1) Allegations of pedophilia - there is no tolerance for this. So if you make allegations, jokes, innuendo or suggestions about child molestation, child pornography, abuse or inappropriate behavior with minors etc. about someone on this board you will get a time out. This is pretty much automatic; this behavior can have real world effect and is not acceptable. Obviously the subject is not banned when discussion of it is apropos, e.g. talking about an item in the news for instance. But allegations or references directed at or about another poster is verboten. 2) Outing people - providing real world identifiable information about users on the forums who prefer to remain anonymous. Yes, some of us post with our real names - not a problem to use them. However many do NOT, and if you find out someone's name keep it to yourself, first or last. This also goes for other identifying information too - employer information etc. You don't need too many pieces of data to figure out who someone really is these days. Depending on severity you might get anything from a scolding to a suspension - so don't do it. I know it can be confusing sometimes for newcomers, as SA has been around almost twenty years and there are some people that throw their real names around and their current Display Name may not match the name they have out in the public. But if in doubt, you don't want to accidentally out some one so use caution, even if it's a personal friend of yours in real life. 3) Posting While Suspended - If you've earned a timeout (these are fairly rare and hard to get), please observe the suspension. If you create a new account (a "Sock Puppet") and return to the forums to post with it before your suspension is up you WILL get more time added to your original suspension and lose your Socks. This behavior may result a permanent ban, since it shows you have zero respect for the few rules we have and the moderating team that is tasked with supporting them. Check the Terms of Service you agreed to; they apply to the individual agreeing, not the account you created, so don't try to Sea Lawyer us if you get caught. Just don't do it. Those are the three that will almost certainly get you into some trouble. IF YOU SEE SOMEONE DO ONE OF THESE THINGS, please do the following: Refrain from quoting the offending text, it makes the thread cleanup a pain in the rear Press the Report button; it is by far the best way to notify Admins as we will get e-mails. Calling out for Admins in the middle of threads, sending us PM's, etc. - there is no guarantee we will get those in a timely fashion. There are multiple Moderators in multiple time zones around the world, and anyone one of us can handle the Report and all of us will be notified about it. But if you PM one Mod directly and he's off line, the problem will get dealt with much more slowly. Other behaviors that you might want to think twice before doing include: Intentionally disrupting threads and discussions repeatedly. Off topic/content free trolling in threads to disrupt dialog Stalking users around the forums with the intent to disrupt content and discussion Repeated posting of overly graphic or scatological porn content. There are plenty web sites for you to get your freak on, don't do it here. And a brief note to Newbies... No, we will not ban people or censor them for dropping F-bombs on you, using foul language, etc. so please don't report it when one of our members gives you a greeting you may find shocking. We do our best not to censor content here and playing swearword police is not in our job descriptions. Sailing Anarchy is more like a bar than a classroom, so handle it like you would meeting someone a little coarse - don't look for the teacher. Thanks.
    • B.J. Porter

      Moderation Team Change   06/16/2017

      After fifteen years of volunteer moderation at SA, I will no longer be part of the moderation team. The decision to step aside is mine, and has been some time in the works but we did not wish to announce it in advance for a number of reasons. It's been fun, but I need my time back for other purposes now. The Underdawg admin account will not be monitored until further notice, as I will be relinquishing control of it along with my administrative privileges. Zapata will continue on as a moderator, and any concerns or issues can be directed to that account or to the Editor until further notice. Anyone interested in helping moderate the forums should reach out to Scot by sending a PM to the Editor account. Please note that I am not leaving the community, I am merely stepping aside from Admin responsibilities and privileges on the site.

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Jon

AC Outlet has 1.5 Volts with Breaker Off

16 posts in this topic

New to me old boat has 3 110/120 volt AC outlets with GFCI receptacles. Today I stuck my voltmeter into one of them and noticed that with the breaker off I was getting a reading of 1.5 to 1.7 volts. With the breaker on I was getting 122 volts. When I flipped the main AC panel breaker off, the meter reading went to 0 volts. It appears that some voltage is getting into the circuit even with the circuit breaker off.

 

I assume with the breaker off it should read 0 volts as well. Anyone have any experience or ideas on what is going on? How would you go about tracking this down?

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New to me old boat has 3 110/120 volt AC outlets with GFCI receptacles. Today I stuck my voltmeter into one of them and noticed that with the breaker off I was getting a reading of 1.5 to 1.7 volts. With the breaker on I was getting 122 volts. When I flipped the main AC panel breaker off, the meter reading went to 0 volts. It appears that some voltage is getting into the circuit even with the circuit breaker off.

 

I assume with the breaker off it should read 0 volts as well. Anyone have any experience or ideas on what is going on? How would you go about tracking this down?

 

I got a similar reading from a kitchen range outlet with the breaker off, was told that's pretty routine. Intriguing.

 

 

 

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ground loop back thru the neutral. your grounds maybe terminated in different locations causing a potential difference.

 

up here in canuckistan for transport canada certified vessels the neutral and hot are terminated on a two pole breaker. kills the circuit dead.

 

you probably have a metal thru hull or the like in the middle of the grounding/bonding system that is causing the small voltage.

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many countries now require an inductive link between supply and boat

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New to me old boat has 3 110/120 volt AC outlets with GFCI receptacles. Today I stuck my voltmeter into one of them and noticed that with the breaker off I was getting a reading of 1.5 to 1.7 volts. With the breaker on I was getting 122 volts. When I flipped the main AC panel breaker off, the meter reading went to 0 volts. It appears that some voltage is getting into the circuit even with the circuit breaker off.

 

I assume with the breaker off it should read 0 volts as well. Anyone have any experience or ideas on what is going on? How would you go about tracking this down?

Wouldn't worry about it if you are measuring the voltage with a digital meter, I've seen much higher voltages just because the cable I was measuring was running close to a cable that was still live.

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Thanks all for the info. I went to a seminar on a corrosion this summer not knowing what to expect and found out that most of what was covered was problems in the electrical circuits. Something I need to learn more about.

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Phantom voltage... Very common especially on long run circuits when parallel feeds are live. I've measured as much as 20 volts before on a 'dead' circuit. You won't see anything on an analog meter. On a DC circuit however you might want to take a closer look!

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Could be capacitance in the wire. You can measure a voltage on spool of duplex wire that's not even connected to anything. A good DMM can even measure an inrush of current when you first connect it.

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check to see if the neutral bus in the ac panel is bonded to ground. if so, i believe it's not supposed to be. the enclosure should be if it's metal tho. if you have a ground loop thru your bonding system it will at least stop coming into the ac system now. but then you'd have to track down the problem in the bonding. when we had this problem on a 120' yacht tracking it down was easy. we found several thru hulls were badly scorched. there was enough current flowing between the thru hulls into the bonding system to burn them.

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New to me old boat has 3 110/120 volt AC outlets with GFCI receptacles. Today I stuck my voltmeter into one of them and noticed that with the breaker off I was getting a reading of 1.5 to 1.7 volts. With the breaker on I was getting 122 volts. When I flipped the main AC panel breaker off, the meter reading went to 0 volts. It appears that some voltage is getting into the circuit even with the circuit breaker off.

 

I assume with the breaker off it should read 0 volts as well. Anyone have any experience or ideas on what is going on? How would you go about tracking this down?

 

AC or DC? The answer is very important as AC ill not cause galvanic corrosion and DC will eat any metal in the water on your boat. Breakers, as they age, can leak small amounts of current but if any load is placed on it the voltage will disappear. You could also have what is know as a "leak to ground", usually from older equipment with electric motors and a neutral that is connected to the bonding system.

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Nope -- Leakage path with high impedance.

 

Try this:

 

Plug a lamp into the plug you are testing, or something that will draw current.

 

Now, go turn off the breaker and measure the voltage.

That 1.7 volts probably dropped to 0 or pretty close.

 

When you put a multimete across a plug, it does not provide any load, just measures a voltage.

 

If you have high resistance connected to power, you will see some voltage appear.

However if you load the plug down the high resistance path back to the power will drop most or all of the voltage.

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Induced voltage by running close to another live wire, no amps, just enough volts to make you ask the question.

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Induced voltage by running close to another live wire, no amps, just enough volts to make you ask the question.

 

Either induced voltage (think transformer) or resistive leakage, either can cause it.

Try the loaded line trick I suggest up above. If the voltage largely goes away its not a problem.

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I agree with earlier responses regarding induction or "no load" voltage.

 

Keep in mind that the galvanic potential of copper-zinc is 1.10 volts.

 

Also keep in mind that electrical potential follows the path of least resistance. The voltage that you measured could be tracking from another source far, far away.

 

It's no joke. It could fry expensive equipment or start a fire.

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