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sarah0809

Artemis?

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little known fact but much of NZ's 19th and early 20th c. population originated from convictlandia, they've been pretending otherwise ever since

 

A statement that says far more about the person saying it than the people it is being said about.

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little known fact but much of NZ's 19th and early 20th c. population originated from convictlandia, they've been pretending otherwise ever since

 

Back to the books please.........or maybe travel a little more.

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little known fact but much of NZ's 19th and early 20th c. population originated from convictlandia, they've been pretending otherwise ever since

Sure you're not looking at a map of the Western Pacific?

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^

 

Actually he is quite correct. A lot of out early population did come to NZ via Australia (Convictlandia)

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look on the good side

 

if AR stay in

 

some supporters may sex up the LV

 

swedish-girls-demotivational-poster-1212

 

LR gonna need more help than kiwi girls can provide

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I think English is the second language for many native English speakers <_<

 

Deer Jaisper, your Grammer Nazi's.

Their is here one soiler speeking perfectlly amerikan inglish on SA.

Im playcing this hear to spacifikally to distroy your intire massage.

May be the onely thing you thinc abowt all weak

Have a neece soiling day.

SSW

Thats Engrish, k?

Nah - lame attempt at Snagglespeak.

Only the snags can make it work.

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^^^ The one single amendment which made it possible for AR to plan to forfeit the RR races without sanction is the removal of the $100k penalty: in this regard, I don't believe LR thought through the implications of their proposal (removal of $100k fines) properly. We've seen in one of their earlier applications to the IJ (unsupported by ETNZ) that they are susceptible to impetuosity. I suspect ETNZ voted against it but was passed with Ian Murray's vote. The same voting pattern may have been responsible for the reduction in the LVC RR races from 7 to 5. Lets face it, ETNZ gets no advantage by agreeing to both, so why would they vote for them?

 

GGYC/ACEA/ACRM seem quite content to let AR take the brunt of the criticism for "vetoing" the ETNZ-LT proposal when the reality is the questionable propriety of their employee Ian Murray getting to vote in the Challenger Selection Series which enabled the changes to be forced through.

 

As much as I don't want AR in the LVC, they are taking advantage of the double whammy of the removal of the fines system and the coincidence of only 3 Challengers effectively giving them a life to the SF.

 

Artemis is funded by a very wealthy guy, and if a $100k fine per missed race day was the cost of safety to him, it would be cheap in the long run. So it was a couple of million bucks? This all just happened to be a lucky circumstance for Artemis.

 

Trying to get Artemis out of the game now is probably more about putting the hurt on ACEA than it is anything else. All of those event sponsor obligations would require some sort of make-good/refund if the racing schedule was radically reduced.

 

In the end, the global sponsorship community can look at Grumpy as the miserable prick that couldn't be reasonable about trying to make the event work, when he is the clear leader.

 

Grumpy would be well advised to take a longer view of things.

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^^^ The one single amendment which made it possible for AR to plan to forfeit the RR races without sanction is the removal of the $100k penalty: in this regard, I don't believe LR thought through the implications of their proposal (removal of $100k fines) properly. We've seen in one of their earlier applications to the IJ (unsupported by ETNZ) that they are susceptible to impetuosity. I suspect ETNZ voted against it but was passed with Ian Murray's vote. The same voting pattern may have been responsible for the reduction in the LVC RR races from 7 to 5. Lets face it, ETNZ gets no advantage by agreeing to both, so why would they vote for them?

 

GGYC/ACEA/ACRM seem quite content to let AR take the brunt of the criticism for "vetoing" the ETNZ-LT proposal when the reality is the questionable propriety of their employee Ian Murray getting to vote in the Challenger Selection Series which enabled the changes to be forced through.

 

As much as I don't want AR in the LVC, they are taking advantage of the double whammy of the removal of the fines system and the coincidence of only 3 Challengers effectively giving them a life to the SF.

 

Artemis is funded by a very wealthy guy, and if a $100k fine per missed race day was the cost of safety to him, it would be cheap in the long run. So it was a couple of million bucks? This all just happened to be a lucky circumstance for Artemis.

 

Trying to get Artemis out of the game now is probably more about putting the hurt on ACEA than it is anything else. All of those event sponsor obligations would require some sort of make-good/refund if the racing schedule was radically reduced.

 

In the end, the global sponsorship community can look at Grumpy as the miserable prick that couldn't be reasonable about trying to make the event work, when he is the clear leader.

 

Grumpy would be well advised to take a longer view of things.

 

a longer view???? This is the America's Cup, don't you know everything goes back to zero when a new team wins?

 

In other words, there is no longer view than September 21, 2013...

 

LE and RC tried to get more people to sign up to their longer term vision, but they've been rebuffed by many, not least by the most likely challenger to face them. They even want to go back to leadmines for heaven's sake...

 

So yes, this brand new AC72 class is expensive, but if they develop further, they will reach a stage where the development budgets become more reasonable.

 

Let's see what happens when (if, of course) they come up with brand new AC90 or whatever monoslug, canting keels and all, just see how the budgets would look then...

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^^^ The one single amendment which made it possible for AR to plan to forfeit the RR races without sanction is the removal of the $100k penalty: in this regard, I don't believe LR thought through the implications of their proposal (removal of $100k fines) properly. We've seen in one of their earlier applications to the IJ (unsupported by ETNZ) that they are susceptible to impetuosity. I suspect ETNZ voted against it but was passed with Ian Murray's vote. The same voting pattern may have been responsible for the reduction in the LVC RR races from 7 to 5. Lets face it, ETNZ gets no advantage by agreeing to both, so why would they vote for them?

 

GGYC/ACEA/ACRM seem quite content to let AR take the brunt of the criticism for "vetoing" the ETNZ-LT proposal when the reality is the questionable propriety of their employee Ian Murray getting to vote in the Challenger Selection Series which enabled the changes to be forced through.

 

As much as I don't want AR in the LVC, they are taking advantage of the double whammy of the removal of the fines system and the coincidence of only 3 Challengers effectively giving them a life to the SF.

 

Artemis is funded by a very wealthy guy, and if a $100k fine per missed race day was the cost of safety to him, it would be cheap in the long run. So it was a couple of million bucks? This all just happened to be a lucky circumstance for Artemis.

 

Trying to get Artemis out of the game now is probably more about putting the hurt on ACEA than it is anything else. All of those event sponsor obligations would require some sort of make-good/refund if the racing schedule was radically reduced.

 

In the end, the global sponsorship community can look at Grumpy as the miserable prick that couldn't be reasonable about trying to make the event work, when he is the clear leader.

 

Grumpy would be well advised to take a longer view of things.

 

Bingo. That's what I've been trying to say. For the head of the most commercial team, he is doing more than anyone else to hurt the potential for AC35 to be more commercially viable AT THIS STAGE. AFTER the end of the AC finals, the next big step to help commercial viability will be to immediately nail down the class rule for AC35, AND set up some kind of cirquit like the ACWS, with whatever logical changes that need to be done. But for now, to get interest up for the AC in general, and commercial sponsors in particular, I do not believe GD is helping the cause. I would understand more if his actions truly helped the ETNZ cause, but I don't see where his actions are doing that at all.

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^^^ The one single amendment which made it possible for AR to plan to forfeit the RR races without sanction is the removal of the $100k penalty: in this regard, I don't believe LR thought through the implications of their proposal (removal of $100k fines) properly. We've seen in one of their earlier applications to the IJ (unsupported by ETNZ) that they are susceptible to impetuosity. I suspect ETNZ voted against it but was passed with Ian Murray's vote. The same voting pattern may have been responsible for the reduction in the LVC RR races from 7 to 5. Lets face it, ETNZ gets no advantage by agreeing to both, so why would they vote for them?

 

GGYC/ACEA/ACRM seem quite content to let AR take the brunt of the criticism for "vetoing" the ETNZ-LT proposal when the reality is the questionable propriety of their employee Ian Murray getting to vote in the Challenger Selection Series which enabled the changes to be forced through.

 

As much as I don't want AR in the LVC, they are taking advantage of the double whammy of the removal of the fines system and the coincidence of only 3 Challengers effectively giving them a life to the SF.

 

Artemis is funded by a very wealthy guy, and if a $100k fine per missed race day was the cost of safety to him, it would be cheap in the long run. So it was a couple of million bucks? This all just happened to be a lucky circumstance for Artemis.

 

Trying to get Artemis out of the game now is probably more about putting the hurt on ACEA than it is anything else. All of those event sponsor obligations would require some sort of make-good/refund if the racing schedule was radically reduced.

 

In the end, the global sponsorship community can look at Grumpy as the miserable prick that couldn't be reasonable about trying to make the event work, when he is the clear leader.

 

Grumpy would be well advised to take a longer view of things.

 

a longer view???? This is the America's Cup, don't you know everything goes back to zero when a new team wins?

 

In other words, there is no longer view than September 21, 2013...

 

LE and RC tried to get more people to sign up to their longer term vision, but they've been rebuffed by many, not least by the most likely challenger to face them. They even want to go back to leadmines for heaven's sake...

 

So yes, this brand new AC72 class is expensive, but if they develop further, they will reach a stage where the development budgets become more reasonable.

 

Let's see what happens when (if, of course) they come up with brand new AC90 or whatever monoslug, canting keels and all, just see how the budgets would look then...

 

Who wants to go back to leadmines? Source?

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In the end, the global sponsorship community can look at Grumpy as the miserable prick that couldn't be reasonable about trying to make the event work, when he is the clear leader.

In what specific way is he stopping the event work? Other than not being chirpily Californian in attitude.

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Let's see what happens when (if, of course) they come up with brand new AC90 or whatever monoslug, canting keels and all, just see how the budgets would look then...

 

Here is the big difference between OR and TNZ.

 

Although OR said they would consult others, LE & RC thought they knew everything, cooked-up the silly Flintstones/Facebook false dichotomy and created AC72s with AC45s as the warm-up act.

 

Grant has not yet decided what boat to use in AC35. Because, between here and there, it is necessary to win the trophy.

 

However, he and the rest of TNZ are committed to two principles - 1. Consultation 2. Lower costs to get more competitors.

 

Whether it becomes an AC60 catamaran or AC90 mono will greatly depend on what potential competitors say.

 

Grant will have his own ideas but, unlike know-it-all "success-driven" comrades at Woodside or other parts of California, will LISTEN to what others have to say.

 

For the sake of good order in the British Empire, he might even ask poms and Aussies about their preferred craft.

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For the head of the most commercial team, he is doing more than anyone else to hurt the potential for AC35 to be more commercially viable AT THIS STAGE.

Given the manifest omnishambles AC34 has become, the best thing GD can do for his team's prospects to raise $$$$ in AC35 is to distance himself from AC34 in every possible way.

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However, he and the rest of TNZ are committed to two principles - 1. Consultation 2. Lower costs to get more competitors.

 

Whether it becomes an AC60 catamaran or AC90 mono will greatly depend on what potential competitors say.

I'm staying out of a mono- versus multi debate but no way in the world is the AC90 a low-cost option.

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^^^ The one single amendment which made it possible for AR to plan to forfeit the RR races without sanction is the removal of the $100k penalty: in this regard, I don't believe LR thought through the implications of their proposal (removal of $100k fines) properly. We've seen in one of their earlier applications to the IJ (unsupported by ETNZ) that they are susceptible to impetuosity. I suspect ETNZ voted against it but was passed with Ian Murray's vote. The same voting pattern may have been responsible for the reduction in the LVC RR races from 7 to 5. Lets face it, ETNZ gets no advantage by agreeing to both, so why would they vote for them?

 

GGYC/ACEA/ACRM seem quite content to let AR take the brunt of the criticism for "vetoing" the ETNZ-LT proposal when the reality is the questionable propriety of their employee Ian Murray getting to vote in the Challenger Selection Series which enabled the changes to be forced through.

 

As much as I don't want AR in the LVC, they are taking advantage of the double whammy of the removal of the fines system and the coincidence of only 3 Challengers effectively giving them a life to the SF.

 

Artemis is funded by a very wealthy guy, and if a $100k fine per missed race day was the cost of safety to him, it would be cheap in the long run. So it was a couple of million bucks? This all just happened to be a lucky circumstance for Artemis.

 

Trying to get Artemis out of the game now is probably more about putting the hurt on ACEA than it is anything else. All of those event sponsor obligations would require some sort of make-good/refund if the racing schedule was radically reduced.

 

In the end, the global sponsorship community can look at Grumpy as the miserable prick that couldn't be reasonable about trying to make the event work, when he is the clear leader.

 

Grumpy would be well advised to take a longer view of things.

 

Bingo. That's what I've been trying to say. For the head of the most commercial team, he is doing more than anyone else to hurt the potential for AC35 to be more commercially viable AT THIS STAGE. AFTER the end of the AC finals, the next big step to help commercial viability will be to immediately nail down the class rule for AC35, AND set up some kind of cirquit like the ACWS, with whatever logical changes that need to be done. But for now, to get interest up for the AC in general, and commercial sponsors in particular, I do not believe GD is helping the cause. I would understand more if his actions truly helped the ETNZ cause, but I don't see where his actions are doing that at all.

Grant's longer view depends on one thing: It all starts in NZ. If his vision is to succeed, basically everything about the event (except maybe Liveline) gets changed. Grant has no interest in helping anyone if it doesn't help his team get what he believes they need.

 

Everything you read from Grant has one of two goals in mind: (1) Attract attention and/or (2) ensure he has an equal or better than equal chance to win.

 

Anything else is irrelevant.

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AFTER the end of the AC finals, the next big step to help commercial viability will be to immediately nail down the class rule for AC35, AND set up some kind of cirquit like the ACWS

 

Sorry mate ... hard to believe you are in the marketing business. Because what you propose is WRONG!

 

If TNZ win in SF they will not "immediately nail down a class rule."

 

Instead, they will do what Oracle DID NOT do!

 

Go on the road and talk with potential competitors.

 

This is the time for respectful consultation. It does not call for immediate action.

 

After the regatta Grant and Shoebie might have had enough of airports. Even so, they might even have to stop in ... err um ... Geneva!

 

Rehabilitating the AC now needs respectful consultation. No more know-it-all ego-driven California big display.

 

It is a job for a small country which eschews a cult of celebrity in favour of getting the job done.

post-29902-0-65998500-1371056127_thumb.jpg

post-29902-0-69893400-1371056181.jpg

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^ X, that's the one that my auto-corrector f's up the most often. Bugs me, because I also take pride in proper punctuation.

 

But it's funny, and admirable, how non-native English posters like yourself and Rennie are the most pedantic. It must come from the effort it takes to learn the horribly difficult language that English is. Salutay! :)

 

It's harder for non-native speakers to read wrong spelling or grammar and try to understand the meaning. However, I'm as pedantic with German because I agree 100% with this:

 

Totally OT, but in my opinion, bad grammar and spelling are two things that have caused communication to become so poor in today's society.

 

Not being able to express yourself coherently and intelligibly diminishes whatever it is you are trying to communicate. Is it really that much to ask that you take an extra 3 seconds of your time to ensure what you write is legible and 'correct'.

 

Old man rant over.

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Totally OT, but in my opinion, bad grammar and spelling are two things that have caused communication to become so poor in today's society.

 

Not being able to express yourself coherently and intelligibly diminishes whatever it is you are trying to communicate. Is it really that much to ask that you take an extra 3 seconds of your time to ensure what you write is legible and 'correct'.

 

Old man rant over.

 

How many people glanced back over every word of that post to try and find an error? (I agree with everything Rohanoz is trying to articulate and in 200 years the human race might have mittens as hands; thumbs to touch the screens and "fingers" to hold the devices.)

 

The only problem I can find is the fact that "old man rant over" is not a complete sentence. I would have said, "This old man's rant is now over." :ph34r:

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^ Indio - Do you really think that if the RD voted to keep the status quo format, he was disfavoring anyone?

 

If he had voted for GD, then would he not have been favoring ETNZ - illegal by the Protocol?

 

Simple call by IM. Keeping the status quo disfavors ~nobody~ since they ~all~ still play by the already-established format.

 

This IJ flyer will go nowhere.

 

 

IM and RD are not the same - you need to fact check yourself.

 

 

edited bits...

ETNZ is a great operation, winning on the water looks to be the far better chance than via all this horseshit.

 

" ..all this horseshit" makes "winning on the water" quite a bit harder - and that is what has upset pretty much everyone with any sense of fair play.

 

Simple or?

 

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Let's see what happens when (if, of course) they come up with brand new AC90 or whatever monoslug, canting keels and all, just see how the budgets would look then...

 

Here is the big difference between OR and TNZ.

 

Although OR said they would consult others, LE & RC thought they knew everything, cooked-up the silly Flintstones/Facebook false dichotomy and created AC72s with AC45s as the warm-up act.

 

Grant has not yet decided what boat to use in AC35. Because, between here and there, it is necessary to win the trophy.

 

However, he and the rest of TNZ are committed to two principles - 1. Consultation 2. Lower costs to get more competitors.

 

Whether it becomes an AC60 catamaran or AC90 mono will greatly depend on what potential competitors say.

 

Grant will have his own ideas but, unlike know-it-all "success-driven" comrades at Woodside or other parts of California, will LISTEN to what others have to say.

 

For the sake of good order in the British Empire, he might even ask poms and Aussies about their preferred craft.

 

Ok, so I am always hesitant to agree with TK due to the likely flaming that it will attract.

But....in this case I believe he is spot on.

 

If ETNZ were to win the AC, you can look at the process for coming up with the IACC class rule as a model for what will happen.

The IACC was a very collaborative affair where probably nobody got everything they wanted, but at least got something they wanted.

 

You can bet your bottom dollar ETNZ would lead it and LR would be their right hand "man" as it were, but every credible interested party would get a say and would have visibility over the process.

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Totally OT, but in my opinion, bad grammar and spelling are two things that have caused communication to become so poor in today's society.

 

Not being able to express yourself coherently and intelligibly diminishes whatever it is you are trying to communicate. Is it really that much to ask that you take an extra 3 seconds of your time to ensure what you write is legible and 'correct'.

 

Old man rant over.

 

How many people glanced back over every word of that post to try and find an error? (I agree with everything Rohanoz is trying to articulate and in 200 years the human race might have mittens as hands; thumbs to touch the screens and "fingers" to hold the devices.)

 

The only problem I can find is the fact that "old man rant over" is not a complete sentence. I would have said, "This old man's rant is now over." :ph34r:

 

"...now over." would be redundant... :rolleyes:

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You can be sure that input from other interested parties will be sought to maximise future entrants. This will happen for AC35 regardless of the winner given the total f*** up this AC cycle has been.

 

However, whoever wins will still get to write the rules and there will always be the incentive to skew the rules to the defender's strengths and relevant agenda (ETNZ included). I would ! Who wants to lose the AC?

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You can be sure that input from other interested parties will be sought to maximise future entrants. This will happen for AC35 regardless of the winner given the total f*** up this AC cycle has been.

 

However, whoever wins will still get to write the rules and there will always be the incentive to skew the rules to the defender's strengths and relevant agenda (ETNZ included). I would ! Who wants to lose the AC?

 

Yup and you can already see ETNZ doing this with Dalts on about cost reduction and nationality rules.

The only thing I can't figure out is why is he talking about this now, cos he aint even close to winning the cup yet.

 

Everyone (including me) goes on about what a total fark up this cup is and it certainly is.

But the vision was actually really good, they just executed it badly.

I just hope in the rush to get as far away from this AC as possible, they don't throw out the good with the bad.

 

Personally, I'd love to see the ACWS kept, but run in the same class as the AC.

I'd also like to see the AC contested along the water front in Auckland (or even better, Wellington :D )

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In the end, the global sponsorship community can look at Grumpy as the miserable prick that couldn't be reasonable about trying to make the event work, when he is the clear leader.

 

Grumpy would be well advised to take a longer view of things.

 

Bingo. That's what I've been trying to say. For the head of the most commercial team, he is doing more than anyone else to hurt the potential for AC35 to be more commercially viable AT THIS STAGE. AFTER the end of the AC finals, the next big step to help commercial viability will be to immediately nail down the class rule for AC35, AND set up some kind of cirquit like the ACWS, with whatever logical changes that need to be done. But for now, to get interest up for the AC in general, and commercial sponsors in particular, I do not believe GD is helping the cause. I would understand more if his actions truly helped the ETNZ cause, but I don't see where his actions are doing that at all.

 

Ummm. TNZ are in SF, with a functioning boat and team and can clearly make the start date of the RR series, so essentially he's making the event work.

 

AR have no functioning boat (has anyone seen Big Purple Haze yet), AR can't make the start of the RR series or even give a definite date when they will be ready - is this making the event workable?

 

Please tell us - WHEN WILL AR BE READY - This month, next month, the month after that?

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^ Indio - Do you really think that if the RD voted to keep the status quo format, he was disfavoring anyone?

 

If he had voted for GD, then would he not have been favoring ETNZ - illegal by the Protocol?

 

Simple call by IM. Keeping the status quo disfavors ~nobody~ since they ~all~ still play by the already-established format.

 

This IJ flyer will go nowhere.

 

IM and RD are not the same - you need to fact check yourself.

 

edited bits...

ETNZ is a great operation, winning on the water looks to be the far better chance than via all this horseshit.

" ..all this horseshit" makes "winning on the water" quite a bit harder - and that is what has upset pretty much everyone with any sense of fair play.

 

Simple or?

IM ~is~ the RD. how about checking the facts for yourself before making critiques like that?

 

And how does AR's vetoing GD's change proposal, and the horseshit to come where GD appeals it, to try to still force AR to a new and earlier date, make ETNZ's life better? It doesn't, it hurts AR. It's horseshit, let them race, let's see it won on the water.

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^^ AR has already said they expect to be race-ready by the start of the Semi's; and unless Dalton can get the rules changed well then AR is playing by the rules -like them or not.

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It's horseshit, let them race, let's see it won on the water.

 

Do they have a boat yet?

 

If not when is it coming?

 

Where are they actually up too?

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It's horseshit, let them race, let's see it won on the water.

Do they have a boat yet?

 

If not when is it coming?

 

Where are they actually up too?

Read what they said.

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Starting on Monday, June 3 the team resumed its preparation in earnest to compete in the 34th America’s Cup.

The team is now working to ready its second AC72, which it expects to launch in a few weeks and which will undergo a rigorous testing regime. When the sailing team is satisfied that the boat can be pushed hard in race conditions, it will join the competition.

“We are working around-the-clock to get our new boat ready, in the water and to prepare our team to race” said Paul Cayard, CEO of Artemis Racing. “We still have a mountain to climb, but our plan is to launch our new boat in early July and get ourselves in a position where we can race by the end of the month.”

 

 

It's all opened ended..........................

But according to PC splash down should be 17th-24th June?

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Starting on Monday, June 3 the team resumed its preparation in earnest to compete in the 34th America’s Cup.

The team is now working to ready its second AC72, which it expects to launch in a few weeks and which will undergo a rigorous testing regime. When the sailing team is satisfied that the boat can be pushed hard in race conditions, it will join the competition.

“We are working around-the-clock to get our new boat ready, in the water and to prepare our team to race” said Paul Cayard, CEO of Artemis Racing. “We still have a mountain to climb, but our plan is to launch our new boat in early July and get ourselves in a position where we can race by the end of the month.”

 

 

It's all opened ended..........................

But according to PC splash down should be 17th-24th June?

I think you just answered your own question mate.

Will you stop asking it now?

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It doesn't matter to what format the next AC is going to be in. There is no such thing as a low budget americas cup. Not in relative terms and not in absolute terms.

There Will be few who spend a lot, and a few That spend a little less Than that.

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It doesn't matter to what format the next AC is going to be in. There is no such thing as a low budget americas cup. Not in relative terms and not in absolute terms.

There Will be few who spend a lot, and a few That spend a little less Than that.

 

And many that will complain they can not afford it...

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However, I'm as pedantic with German

Grin... maybe you can simply drop "with German" from that line and it wouldn't make a difference ;)? sorry for taking the proverbial piss at you and all the other lingo-feldwebels (another word was on my mind but left it out for the sake of Moore's law avoidance), but the other side of the story is that if you have to concentrate too much on how you speak or write your mind you tend to get sloppy or sidetracked on the content or meaning you wanted to deliver, no?

Anyhow, at school my points for latin, french and english were always higher than those for my mother tongue, and going by what I see and hear from my english friends it's mor or less a general tendency.

 

 

Sorry for hijack, back to your regular program.... whatever that was :)

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if you have to concentrate too much on how you speak or write your mind you tend to get sloppy or sidetracked on the content or meaning you wanted to deliver, no?

Anyhow, at school my points for latin, french and english were always higher than those for my mother tongue, and going by what I see and hear from my english friends it's mor or less a general tendency.

I might be more convinced by the proposition in the first sentence if I had a clue what the second sentence was attempting to communicate.

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if you have to concentrate too much on how you speak or write your mind you tend to get sloppy or sidetracked on the content or meaning you wanted to deliver, no?

Anyhow, at school my points for latin, french and english were always higher than those for my mother tongue, and going by what I see and hear from my english friends it's mor or less a general tendency.

I might be more convinced by the proposition in the first sentence if I had a clue what the second sentence was attempting to communicate.

 

He's saying the English are dumb, right?

 

No, that can't be right. Maybe he's saying that English speakers with the tenacity to pick up other languages pay attention to how the words go together more than when speaking their native language. So in English, those same people have a tendency to say any idiotic thing about sailboat racing that comes to mind and not be concerned with the niceties such as grammar, or logic, or especially common sense.

 

Like me?

 

See above for multiple examples.

 

Koukel

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if you have to concentrate too much on how you speak or write your mind you tend to get sloppy or sidetracked on the content or meaning you wanted to deliver, no?

Anyhow, at school my points for latin, french and english were always higher than those for my mother tongue, and going by what I see and hear from my english friends it's mor or less a general tendency.

 

I might be more convinced by the proposition in the first sentence if I had a clue what the second sentence was attempting to communicate.

He's saying the English are dumb, right?

 

No, that can't be right. Maybe he's saying that English speakers with the tenacity to pick up other languages pay attention to how the words go together more than when speaking their native language. So in English, those same people have a tendency to say any idiotic thing about sailboat racing that comes to mind and not be concerned with the niceties such as grammar, or logic, or especially common sense.

 

Like me?

 

See above for multiple examples.

 

Koukel

Well, if dogwatch didn't understand then your first theory might be the right one .. but I rather assume he was taking the mickey at me in his sophisticated interloctual pommie way :)

Of course the issue is that people tend to get more sloppy in their mother tongue than when having to pay attention when speaking another lingo, as simple as that.

 

Apart from which, if this is the Artemis thread... pity for them, but what chance do they stand and how fair is it for the others if they're allowed to join when it suits them... oh, wait, it's the AC, has nuttin' to do with fairness

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Well, if dogwatch didn't understand then your first theory might be the right one .. but I rather assume he was taking the mickey at me in his sophisticated interloctual pommie way :)

Nope. I read that second sentence several times and was none the the wiser. You've explained it now.

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FCOL you guys, why don't you all meet one evening down on Washington Mews in NYC for a group circle jerk? At the very least, please sponsor a new forum called Snob Anarchy, and and leave this forum to a discussion of all things Artemis.

 

Speaking of which, any news from the team or the shed?

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Let's see what happens when (if, of course) they come up with brand new AC90 or whatever monoslug, canting keels and all, just see how the budgets would look then...

Here is the big difference between OR and TNZ.

 

Although OR said they would consult others, LE & RC thought they knew everything, cooked-up the silly Flintstones/Facebook false dichotomy and created AC72s with AC45s as the warm-up act.

 

Grant has not yet decided what boat to use in AC35. Because, between here and there, it is necessary to win the trophy.

 

However, he and the rest of TNZ are committed to two principles - 1. Consultation 2. Lower costs to get more competitors.

 

Whether it becomes an AC60 catamaran or AC90 mono will greatly depend on what potential competitors say.

 

Grant will have his own ideas but, unlike know-it-all "success-driven" comrades at Woodside or other parts of California, will LISTEN to what others have to say.

 

For the sake of good order in the British Empire, he might even ask poms and Aussies about their preferred craft.

Hastings,

 

Will you please just shut the fuck-up for once in a while?!

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Speaking of which, any news from the team or the shed?

Slow news day. As was yesterday. Capiche?

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Speaking of which, any news from the team or the shed?

Slow news day. As was yesterday. Capiche?

My little AR underground reports that an AC45 went out the other day with a different looking wing.

Maybe someone can confirm.

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Speaking of which, any news from the team or the shed?

Slow news day. As was yesterday. Capiche?

Capisco benissimo.

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Speaking of which, any news from the team or the shed?

Slow news day. As was yesterday. Capiche?

My little AR underground reports that an AC45 went out the other day with a different looking wing.

Maybe someone can confirm.

Shame AC34 isn't racing in the AC45 class - in which case AR might have a better than average shot.

 

No wait...maybe they'd need more time. Ahhh, no...that's right, they didn't have to do bugger all actual designing, so they would probably make the start. ;)

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FCOL you guys, why don't you all meet one evening down on Washington Mews in NYC for a group circle jerk? At the very least, please sponsor a new forum called Snob Anarchy, and and leave this forum to a discussion of all things Artemis.

 

Speaking of which, any news from the team or the shed?

 

Some indication of hulls arriving next week(?).

 

Anyone have a good idea of time required to put all the pieces n pieces together?

 

Obviously the Farr office will need to complete the load calcs for the beams.

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FCOL you guys, why don't you all meet one evening down on Washington Mews in NYC for a group circle jerk? At the very least, please sponsor a new forum called Snob Anarchy, and and leave this forum to a discussion of all things Artemis.

 

Speaking of which, any news from the team or the shed?

 

Snobarchy? That is so not true. In this very thread I've made fun of people with cogent, intelligent, well thought out points as well as posts like yours.

 

As for talking about sailboatin' then show us what you got that isn't rehashed, derivative drivel. I will applaud the effort.

 

Koukel

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FCOL you guys, why don't you all meet one evening down on Washington Mews in NYC for a group circle jerk? At the very least, please sponsor a new forum called Snob Anarchy, and and leave this forum to a discussion of all things Artemis.

 

Speaking of which, any news from the team or the shed?

 

Snobarchy... intelligent...cogent...well thought out points...derivative....

Asinus asinum fricat. :lol:

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In the end, the global sponsorship community can look at Grumpy as the miserable prick that couldn't be reasonable about trying to make the event work, when he is the clear leader.

 

Grumpy would be well advised to take a longer view of things.

 

Bingo. That's what I've been trying to say. For the head of the most commercial team, he is doing more than anyone else to hurt the potential for AC35 to be more commercially viable AT THIS STAGE. AFTER the end of the AC finals, the next big step to help commercial viability will be to immediately nail down the class rule for AC35, AND set up some kind of cirquit like the ACWS, with whatever logical changes that need to be done. But for now, to get interest up for the AC in general, and commercial sponsors in particular, I do not believe GD is helping the cause. I would understand more if his actions truly helped the ETNZ cause, but I don't see where his actions are doing that at all.

 

Ummm. TNZ are in SF, with a functioning boat and team and can clearly make the start date of the RR series, so essentially he's making the event work.

 

AR have no functioning boat (has anyone seen Big Purple Haze yet), AR can't make the start of the RR series or even give a definite date when they will be ready - is this making the event workable?

 

Please tell us - WHEN WILL AR BE READY - This month, next month, the month after that?

Its is an interesting point about who is doing more damage. As an earlier posted noted, this is an omnishambles already, so what is the best way to salvage something from it?

 

AR are not going to win any races they enter, so the result of their entry is pretty much a foregone conclusion.

 

The question therefore is how to make the July/early August as interesting as possible for the general public. The current format will have 5 races between ETNZ and LR spread out over a month. There may even be the spectacle of those two boats being forced to do the course on their own to earn the points. This format is therefore not looking good from a public point of view.

 

The proposal that GD is proposing would compress the racing into a shorter time period, with the intent that public interest would be better sustained. The LR/AR semi would effectively be subsumed into this shorter round robin. The problem from AR's point of view is that they would have less time to get competitive. But looking at it from an event perspective, they are only making up numbers so in reality the extra few weeks will make sweet FA difference. So GD's option does have some strong arguments for it.

 

From my point of view the ideal would be where GD's format is adopted, but the first week was LR vs ETNZ, with the AR races coming later in the schedule. Ain't gonna happen, but dreams are free!

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BIg trouble in little Sweden.

Enough cryptic.

 

Beans. Spill.

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^ Why not compress only the ETNZ v LR series, with it starting and ending closer to when the loser has to take on AR in the SF's?

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Obviously the Farr office will need to complete the load calcs for the beams.

 

JK must be thrilled with having to buggar off while Farr people crawl over the boat.

 

First the Volvo (favouring Farr); now this (favourijng Farr).

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^ Why not compress only the ETNZ v LR series, with it starting and ending closer to when the loser has to take on AR in the SF's?

 

Still favours AR.

If they MUST shift the racing, then have instant knockout round starting in August

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There's some talk about the numbers for the main beam for boat 2 not quite adding up.

 

Not sure you're going to knock up a new front beam in 2 weeks.

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^

Was waitjing for somethjing like that to come out.

Maybe there will be a new rule passes that ETNZ have to give AR their spare beams so that they can race in November.

 

Shame it's not 6 weeks back. NO could have called in a few of his mates from the Lake, maybe even McConaghys, and got one knocked up!

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^

Nah, they will be forced to give AR boat 2 and race boat 1 themselves.

Its only fair cos they deserve to be in the race.

 

I will wait for the rumours to become reality. But if they do, colour me surprised

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There's some talk about the numbers for the main beam for boat 2 not quite adding up.

 

Not sure you're going to knock up a new front beam in 2 weeks.

 

IF true, it would be a monumentally bad indication of incompetence, IMO, for the design team. I can't imagine making a 2nd mistake of being weak on the same beam after the 1st broke last summer, and again in the disaster (although that would have been after the beam was constructed and I think delivered).

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^ Why not compress only the ETNZ v LR series, with it starting and ending closer to when the loser has to take on AR in the SF's?

Still favours AR.

If they MUST shift the racing, then have instant knockout round starting in August

But even as the current rules stand, AR is heading into a knockout series.

 

I hope from just a fan's POV that GD is not successful in his apparent attempt to call all the shots by using LR's poodle vote to simply eliminate AR before they have a chance to even hit the water. But it may happen, he seems bent on pursuing exactly that.

 

GD's change is one that would very obviously ~disfavor~ AR, which is likely the reason that the RD (ask nav who that is) could not agree it.

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Obviously the Farr office will need to complete the load calcs for the beams.

 

JK must be thrilled with having to buggar off while Farr people crawl over the boat.

m1607_crop19_360x240_13208143525FD5.jpg

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Ah, if Artemis had worked with VPLP and HDS, they could have won the cup. The worst is that they have HDS (Devaux) in their team, not sure they used his talent properly.

ClassC.jpg

We’ve been waiting for that to happen, the first boat ever built in TPT, a C Class made in Switzerland by Decision shipyard, designed by Hydros Team along with VPLP and HDS. Light, large, with a beautiful wing sail, the Swiss team has been sailing for the first time this week end in La Grande Motte, in the south of France. The team will be sailing the International C Class Championship in Falmouth in September 2013. Lookin’ forward !! – Anarchist Florent.

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One of the many AR-related jihads (among the many other targets) resulting from the Auckland based shit-blowing fan is against JK. Has Schnacks been fired yet? Why would he be above question?

 

GD has smeared LE, RC, SB, PC, JK, IM, who's left - is it the IJ in his targets next?

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^ Why not compress only the ETNZ v LR series, with it starting and ending closer to when the loser has to take on AR in the SF's?

Still favours AR.

If they MUST shift the racing, then have instant knockout round starting in August

But even as the current rules stand, AR is heading into a knockout series.

 

I hope from just a fan's POV that GD is not successful in his apparent attempt to call all the shots by using LR's poodle vote to simply eliminate AR before they have a chance to even hit the water. But it may happen, he seems bent on pursuing exactly that.

 

GD's change is one that would very obviously ~disfavor~ AR, which is likely the reason that the RD (ask nav who that is) could not agree it.

 

I'm not sure of his motivation, so won't comment.

However, I am a strictly "the rules are the rules" kinda guy and don't want ANY of the rules to change.

If that means having to tolerate AR's continued intrusion in the cup, then so be it.

 

But I think they should just withdraw and I am still thinking that they will most likely be forced into doing just that.

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+1 on that; but yes, while they may not make even the SF's BY THE RULES they do have a shot at it and I really hope they can pull it off nicely.

 

Unless GD is successful in overturning the rules to effectively kill AR without allowing them to even race, then I still think NO and crew will sail Blue into a start box, with serious intent.

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AFTER the end of the AC finals, the next big step to help commercial viability will be to immediately nail down the class rule for AC35, AND set up some kind of cirquit like the ACWS

 

Sorry mate ... hard to believe you are in the marketing business. Because what you propose is WRONG!

 

If TNZ win in SF they will not "immediately nail down a class rule."

 

Instead, they will do what Oracle DID NOT do!

 

Go on the road and talk with potential competitors.

 

This is the time for respectful consultation. It does not call for immediate action.

 

After the regatta Grant and Shoebie might have had enough of airports. Even so, they might even have to stop in ... err um ... Geneva!

 

Rehabilitating the AC now needs respectful consultation. No more know-it-all ego-driven California big display.

 

It is a job for a small country which eschews a cult of celebrity in favour of getting the job done.

 

 

That quote did not come from me. It was no doubt an posting error with the way the quote system works.

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One of the many AR-related jihads (among the many other targets) resulting from the Auckland based shit-blowing fan is against JK. Has Schnacks been fired yet? Why would he be above question?

 

GD has smeared LE, RC, SB, PC, JK, IM, who's left - is it the IJ in his targets next?

 

Give it rest SR, you're starting to lose the plot.

 

To GG, IF (and that's a big if), Farr determines the beam calcs don't stack up and new beams need to be constructed, where too next?

(just on that, the Farr office has to sign off on these - so I would presume the beams would need to exceed the tolerances by quite some margin???)

 

You just get the impression that there's very little sand left in the hour glass.

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One of the many AR-related jihads (among the many other targets) resulting from the Auckland based shit-blowing fan is against JK. Has Schnacks been fired yet? Why would he be above question?

 

GD has smeared LE, RC, SB, PC, JK, IM, who's left - is it the IJ in his targets next?

 

Give it rest SR, you're starting to lose the plot.

 

To GG, IF (and that's a big if), Farr determines the beam calcs don't stack up and new beams need to be constructed, where too next?

(just on that, the Farr office has to sign off on these - so I would presume the beams would need to exceed the tolerances by quite some margin???)

 

You just get the impression that there's very little sand left in the hour glass.

 

Simply, if the beams built for Boat-2 (Blue) can't be used, Artemis is done. There is no "where too next?", no more sand.

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to simply eliminate AR before they have a chance to even hit the water.

 

but they have hit the water

 

and the dive path only got steeper

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One of the many AR-related jihads (among the many other targets) resulting from the Auckland based shit-blowing fan is against JK. Has Schnacks been fired yet? Why would he be above question?

 

GD has smeared LE, RC, SB, PC, JK, IM, who's left - is it the IJ in his targets next?

 

Give it rest SR, you're starting to lose the plot.

 

To GG, IF (and that's a big if), Farr determines the beam calcs don't stack up and new beams need to be constructed, where too next?

(just on that, the Farr office has to sign off on these - so I would presume the beams would need to exceed the tolerances by quite some margin???)

 

You just get the impression that there's very little sand left in the hour glass.

 

Simply, if the beams built for Boat-2 (Blue) can't be used, Artemis is done. There is no "where too next?", no more sand.

 

wasn't PC asking for a delay until next year at 1 stage?

 

wonder why....

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One of the many AR-related jihads (among the many other targets) resulting from the Auckland based shit-blowing fan is against JK. Has Schnacks been fired yet? Why would he be above question?

 

GD has smeared LE, RC, SB, PC, JK, IM, who's left - is it the IJ in his targets next?

Give it rest SR, you're starting to lose the plot.

 

To GG, IF (and that's a big if), Farr determines the beam calcs don't stack up and new beams need to be constructed, where too next?

(just on that, the Farr office has to sign off on these - so I would presume the beams would need to exceed the tolerances by quite some margin???)

 

You just get the impression that there's very little sand left in the hour glass.

 

 

Simply, if the beams built for Boat-2 (Blue) can't be used, Artemis is done. There is no "where too next?", no more sand.

 

 

Just stick a fork in Cayard his goose is cooked

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One of the many AR-related jihads (among the many other targets) resulting from the Auckland based shit-blowing fan is against JK. Has Schnacks been fired yet? Why would he be above question?

 

GD has smeared LE, RC, SB, PC, JK, IM, who's left - is it the IJ in his targets next?

 

Give it rest SR, you're starting to lose the plot.

 

To GG, IF (and that's a big if), Farr determines the beam calcs don't stack up and new beams need to be constructed, where too next?

(just on that, the Farr office has to sign off on these - so I would presume the beams would need to exceed the tolerances by quite some margin???)

 

You just get the impression that there's very little sand left in the hour glass.

 

So this quote was pure speculation from ET, is that correct ?

 

"There's some talk about the numbers for the main beam for boat 2 not quite adding up".

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^ yes, according to one report from NZ AR did propose a delay until '14.

 

I doubt that anyone else were supportive including OR.

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As a point of reflection - I just had a read of an old Seahorse (Issue 371 January 2011). Head article was called 'Frantic - Paul Cayard'. http://www.seahorse.co.uk/shop/products/product_details.php?code=B166&add=View+Issue

 

Key PC quotes:

 

Transporting these 72ft cats along with the infrastructure needed to run these events, to as many as eight destinations around the globe each year, will be a logistical challenge for the teams and event organisers.

But putting exciting racing in front of the public is key to increasing the commercial value of the event.

 

and

 

This all sounds very exciting. Then I put my CEO hat on and say, 'Holy $%*#'!

Here is what is in front of us just in the next 12 months: train 20 sailors to sail multihulls this winter; get a 45ft cat with a 22m wing ready to sail in March 2011 and to race from July to November at four venues in four countries. And at the same time race an Extreme 40 on that circuit all through 2011... So eight events minimum. Research, design, build a 72ft cat with a 40m wing and have that ready to go by 31st December 2011. And create a marketing programme to raise sponsorship dollars and hit the trail with presentations. Oh yeah, I forgot, we have to manage, control and somehow coordinate all this stuff. Busy? Yep, Very. But I love it.

 

and

 

It will all be over in three years' time. The early start that we have may be our biggest advantage. Time will be the most valuable resource in this cup. Truth told, it always is. And we won't be able to take on everything that comes to our minds. I find this all very interesting and stimulating. Time to roll up the sleeves.

 

Also a great interview with Grant Simmer BEFORE heading to OR. Shows how in 2 short years, how far off the understanding of the 72's capabilities (including foiling) was, let alone the timeframes required just build a centreboard, and that already the signs were there that the wind limits were 'incredibly ambitious'!

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Im surprised TT hasn't already pulled the plug on this campaign and started preparations for the next one. It seems a costly and futile exercise to participate in this Cup. especially if the boat isn't up to it. That team deserves more than getting an a$$ kicking every race. Andrew deserves a better send off than that also. They should do the right thing, throw in the towel and look at AC35. Come back bigger and better. Let ETNZ and LR go at it then give everyone what they wanna see. Oracle vs ETNZ.


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Im surprised TT hasn't already pulled the plug on this campaign and started preparations for the next one. It seems a costly and futile exercise to participate in this Cup. especially if the boat isn't up to it. That team deserves more than getting an a$$ kicking every race. Andrew deserves a better send off than that also. They should do the right thing, throw in the towel and look at AC35. Come back bigger and better. Let ETNZ and LR go at it then give everyone what they wanna see. Oracle vs ETNZ.

 

 

And if there's to be a new AC class rule for AC35, AR had better hope it has learned some lessons about how to hire a credible design team, the second time around.

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I wish Artemis could be there, but surely the fat lady has not only sung but is on her way to the airport by now??

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I wish Artemis could be there, but surely the fat lady has not only sung but is on her way to the airport by now??

Agreed ufulx, I too wish Artimes could race. As bad a situation as AR find themselves in, the event will be worse off for them not participating. Even having them turn up for bogus quasi semi finals would be better than nothing.

Come AR, get it togeather would you.

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I wish Artemis could be there, but surely the fat lady has not only sung but is on her way to the airport by now??

Agreed ufulx, I too wish Artimes could race. As bad a situation as AR find themselves in, the event will be worse off for them not participating. Even having them turn up for bogus quasi semi finals would be better than nothing.

Come AR, get it togeather would you.

 

It's beginning to become apparent that trying to accommodate AR is generating issues that have a much higher level of complexity beyond simple safety.

 

I can't see either LR or TNZ wearing the above, IM will need to call this very soon as it's starting to destabilize the entire regatta.

 

The IJ could be very busy indeed.

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I wish Artemis could be there, but surely the fat lady has not only sung but is on her way to the airport by now??

Agreed ufulx, I too wish Artimes could race. As bad a situation as AR find themselves in, the event will be worse off for them not participating. Even having them turn up for bogus quasi semi finals would be better than nothing.

Come AR, get it togeather would you.

 

It's beginning to become apparent that trying to accommodate AR is generating issues that have a much higher level of complexity beyond simple safety.

 

I can't see either LR or TNZ wearing the above, IM will need to call this very soon as it's starting to destabilize the entire regatta.

 

The IJ could be very busy indeed.

 

Yep. We would be having NONE of these problems if they had put the kid with "special needs" in his own class and let the regular kids play on their own.

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I don't know about the beam issue but I did hear that the boat is overweight, can't confirm that however. Probably shouldn't relay rumours but hey that's what SA's all about right?

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I don't know about the beam issue but I did hear that the boat is overweight, can't confirm that however. Probably shouldn't relay rumours but hey that's what SA's all about right?

 

There was a rumour about that for boat 1. Heard nothing about boat 2.

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I don't know about the beam issue but I did hear that the boat is overweight, can't confirm that however. Probably shouldn't relay rumours but hey that's what SA's all about right?

I read somewhere on the Internet that they misread the rules and built a Tri instead of a cat .

 

Might not be 100% accurate though :)

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I don't know about the beam issue but I did hear that the boat is overweight, can't confirm that however. Probably shouldn't relay rumours but hey that's what SA's all about right?

I read somewhere on the Internet that they misread the rules and built a Tri instead of a cat .

 

Might not be 100% accurate though :)

 

Nah, built a Quint. Totally new and revolutionary class of boat. Also has inboard motors

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Shows how in 2 short years, how far off the understanding of the 72's capabilities (including foiling) was, let alone the timeframes required just build a centreboard, and that already the signs were there that the wind limits were 'incredibly ambitious'!

It's an interesting observation. The original proposal was for ACWS to be in 72s in 2012. Nobody even managed to launch one until July 2012. A year after that, none of the 2-boat teams has yet managed to run 2-boat racing. It's remarkable that, with (presumably) the best advice money can buy, the original plans were utterly impractical.

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GD has smeared LE, RC, SB, PC, JK, IM

Really? What are these "smears" against IM? Come to that, I can recall nothing he's said about half the people in your list.

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I wish Artemis could be there, but surely the fat lady has not only sung but is on her way to the airport by now??

Agreed ufulx, I too wish Artimes could race. As bad a situation as AR find themselves in, the event will be worse off for them not participating. Even having them turn up for bogus quasi semi finals would be better than nothing.

Come AR, get it togeather would you.

 

It's beginning to become apparent that trying to accommodate AR is generating issues that have a much higher level of complexity beyond simple safety.

 

I can't see either LR or TNZ wearing the above, IM will need to call this very soon as it's starting to destabilize the entire regatta.

 

The IJ could be very busy indeed.

 

Yep. We would be having NONE of these problems if they had put the kid with "special needs" in his own class and let the regular kids play on their own.

:D

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if eddie had fallen off his skis

 

eddie2222.jpg

 

and bust his glasses

 

would they have started changing the rules and held back the heats?

 

fortunately that difficult question didn't arise

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if eddie had fallen off his skis

 

eddie2222.jpg

 

and bust his glasses

 

would they have started changing the rules and held back the heats?

 

fortunately that difficult question didn't arise

Is that Eddie the Eagle? Man that guy could fly. :)

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^

 

That's Eddie. He was a national hero in Britain, for endearing uselessness.

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