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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  

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Bob Perry

Group Finot and Gate's lines drawing

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Rap

 

I'm amazed...I was going to ramble on for a couple paragraphs, but it still gets down to...I'm amazed.

 

Welcome to WLYDO. You get the corner office with the view of Elliot Bay. If you need me, I'm in the basement.

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No better place for this.

 

A month or so ago I emailed Gate about a half model of my beloved Sparky. He responded immediately asking for photos.

 

I'm over a month into the oil well from hell. I'm 40 days from rig move, 28 days from spud on (what should have been) a 16 day well, I'm only at 7,000' on a 9,400' well. It's horrible, the rig keeps breaking, the hands are useless, my cost estimate for the well now looks like an absurd fantasy. I have some new partners in this well who participated based on my reputation, I'm embarrassed to send out morning reports, embarrassed to report another day of slow progress at exorbitant cost. I want to play Polish Roulette (like Russian, but with a full revolver), or go pull wings off kittens. In 34 years as an engineer in this business, this is the worst rig I've ever had. I can't take my problems home, it's not fair to the family, but my office crew have wisely been steering around me for weeks now. I'm working days in the office, spending nights at a crappy trailer at the rig, getting almost no rest, missing my family,trying to teach these lazy, addled kids about drilling and getting cranky as hell. The oldest toolpusher (rig manager) for this rig was born after I started drilling wells.

 

I never responded to his request for pics. I just haven't had time.

 

We got a box yesterday. I opened it tonight. A beautiful, incredible halfmodel, correct to the white-red-white bootstripe that is unique to Sparky. From my best friend Boomberries via Gatekeeper.

 

Thanks BoomBoom. Thanks Gate. It's beautiful. I love it. If either of you guys ever want to borrow a shabby, used up, worn out version of KDH's boat, she's yours for the asking.

 

I love this place.

 

Booms is pretty special, it is difficult to find them as good as she is.....

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I don't really have much to add here. I'm just sitting back, basking in the awesomeness of this thread and the participants.

 

I'm glad I found this place.

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Maybe we should move this to Egg Anarchy.

 

Put a keel on an egg and it kinda looks like a new Hunter.

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Just had my eggs, and want to get these lines off to GK. I see Bob's here so maybe everyone can take a final review before I flatten this 3d work out and get something ready for GK to print and start making sawdust. I went ahead and modeled the keel and rudder so GK can do a 3/5th's mount like I saw him do on the Sliver model. I was pretty impressed with the attention to the cove stripe details that were on the PDF from Tim Kernan of the SC 37, so I carved it into the hull according to the GA I've been using. A couple of ports and some bottom paint and quick mounting board and lables and I'm pretty pleased with the look, hope it goes over well with the Office.

 

If you don't have CAD, then I highly recommend downloading the Rhino3D evaluation and use it as a viewer, GK (and any one else if interested!) It is a big download but will run fairly well even on relatively low powered laptops and is a full version. McNeel have been begged to to a Lite version or a pared down viewer, but they insist everyone try the full version and it is good for 25 saves. Well work messing around with, but be careful it can be addicting! I'll post this model for you and it would be useful as to shape the hull by being able to rotate and zoom and give you a better feel of the proportions and scale. If you send me an address perhaps I can just go ahead and prepare the waterline lifts as mentioned and email a cut file to a local InstaPrints or the UPS Store and they can print and you just drop by and pick them up. The largest lift should fit on a tabloid size sheet of paper so if you have an inkjet at home (or next door) just do it yourself.

 

I've got a couple more ss's to post, I've reached my 1MB limit here.

 

post-33902-010191900 1328115036_thumb.jpg

post-33902-018682700 1328115055_thumb.jpg

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Raps...as previously stated "I'm amazed" ...still.

 

Can you transform these so I have simple hull lines to work with? Simple lifts and water lines??

 

(I think I have a business proposition for you)

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I just knocked together a Q&D (quick and dirty) hull model of the B 331 Oceanis in Rhino that might be a good starting point for your loft model.

 

If finot-conq architectes calls and asks for a copy of the lines, charge them $500.

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Very nice work Raps.

Did you just eyeball the hull shape from profile and plan drawings?

 

Hi Bob,

 

I seached Google images and found the highest res GA and then bring it into rhino using the 'picture frame' feature. I scale it and then slice the profile and deck plan apart and rotate into their 3d world space orientation. Then I pick out the canoe body keel line and trace out a stem from the forefoot. Go to top view and then trace out the sheer in plan and do the same for the sheer in profile. Then there is a wonderful command called 'curve from 2 views' that will make the 3d sheer line from oplan and profile! I just eyeballed a aft section from photos from the search and then copy it to the mid-section (in order to keep the same point count) and scale and point edit it to suit. I needed one more copied section up towards the bow to keep the entry from getting too hollow and then the 'network surface' command will generate a hull half based on the sheer, keel, 3 sections, and stem! Rhino5 has history now so if it is turned on, then you select and point edit any of the input lines and the surface updates. Fun stuff to do and pretty quick when you get the hang of it.

 

Gates, I'll 'flatten' the stuff you need and get a print file together for you today. I know you want to make sawdust...

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Gates, I'll 'flatten' the stuff you need and get a print file together for you today. I know you want to make sawdust...

 

 

 

I'm not in a rush to cut them...I'm in a rush to see them. I have a Santa Cruz to do next, but I'll cut both boats at the same time. You have solved a big problem for me.

 

The boat owner will be very happy.

 

(my email address is on my blog)

 

 

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That's is pretty damn cool! Way to go Rap!!

 

 

 

Got that GK. Is this just a half hull model?

 

Yup..., a simple half hull with no coach.

 

GK,

I've reworked the hull to try and fair out things a bit more and here are some ss's just for review. Still a few issues with a slight hollow in the entry at the bow but I won't obsess with that as I'm sure you can sweeten things up with 40 grit and a rasp or whatever you do to work your majik. I'll scale and slice to your specs tommorrow and try and get something to you, perhaps a print file to a local printer near you. I'm sure you have a UPS store nearby that could just print to scale and then you can tranfer to your lifts and go to work with the band saw. I can even mark for dowel holes down through the lifts to index the sucessive layers in place if that helps. Here is a peeks for now... Good night!

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Raps:

Right. That's exactly the way I would have done it if I could have done it.

 

I have Rhino and we used it when I had helpers. But I have never learned it. Why don't you fly on out and stay a couple of days and get me started. I'll feed you very well.

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Very nice work Raps.

Did you just eyeball the hull shape from profile and plan drawings?

 

Hi Bob,

 

I seached Google images and found the highest res GA and then bring it into rhino using the 'picture frame' feature. I scale it and then slice the profile and deck plan apart and rotate into their 3d world space orientation. Then I pick out the canoe body keel line and trace out a stem from the forefoot. Go to top view and then trace out the sheer in plan and do the same for the sheer in profile. Then there is a wonderful command called 'curve from 2 views' that will make the 3d sheer line from oplan and profile! I just eyeballed a aft section from photos from the search and then copy it to the mid-section (in order to keep the same point count) and scale and point edit it to suit. I needed one more copied section up towards the bow to keep the entry from getting too hollow and then the 'network surface' command will generate a hull half based on the sheer, keel, 3 sections, and stem! Rhino5 has history now so if it is turned on, then you select and point edit any of the input lines and the surface updates. Fun stuff to do and pretty quick when you get the hang of it.

 

Gates, I'll 'flatten' the stuff you need and get a print file together for you today. I know you want to make sawdust...

 

GA = Graphic Array?? Sorry, I don't speak this language very well. Oh, and yeah, Rap, I'm impressed. Big time. Wow. PM sent. cool.gif

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No better place for this.

 

A month or so ago I emailed Gate about a half model of my beloved Sparky. He responded immediately asking for photos.

 

I'm over a month into the oil well from hell. I'm 40 days from rig move, 28 days from spud on (what should have been) a 16 day well, I'm only at 7,000' on a 9,400' well. It's horrible, the rig keeps breaking, the hands are useless, my cost estimate for the well now looks like an absurd fantasy. I have some new partners in this well who participated based on my reputation, I'm embarrassed to send out morning reports, embarrassed to report another day of slow progress at exorbitant cost. I want to play Polish Roulette (like Russian, but with a full revolver), or go pull wings off kittens. In 34 years as an engineer in this business, this is the worst rig I've ever had. I can't take my problems home, it's not fair to the family, but my office crew have wisely been steering around me for weeks now. I'm working days in the office, spending nights at a crappy trailer at the rig, getting almost no rest, missing my family,trying to teach these lazy, addled kids about drilling and getting cranky as hell. The oldest toolpusher (rig manager) for this rig was born after I started drilling wells.

 

I never responded to his request for pics. I just haven't had time.

 

We got a box yesterday. I opened it tonight. A beautiful, incredible halfmodel, correct to the white-red-white bootstripe that is unique to Sparky. From my best friend Boomberries via Gatekeeper.

 

Thanks BoomBoom. Thanks Gate. It's beautiful. I love it. If either of you guys ever want to borrow a shabby, used up, worn out version of KDH's boat, she's yours for the asking.

 

I love this place.

CA, Gate, Booms, this was one of the first things I read this morning. Great story. It put me a a real good space for today and I'm still in it. I'm really glad you guys don't mind me hanging around here, you're a pretty cool bunch. cool.gif

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Pogs:

Yes. This is an anti Groupe Finot thread. I want an international incidfent.

Fucktards!

 

 

I'd definitely stick with this. You want to curse at them in English just to add to the humiliation, underscoring the fact that you can't be bothered to learn any French whatsoever.

 

(Oh, and up your price. Think of the WLYDO overhead keeping 100+ employees on the payroll!)

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a very gracious reply.

But no action.

 

ah, mais oui. c'est la vie, non? pour les francais....

 

ou peut'etre, seulement oour les fucktardes...

 

vive le WLYDO

 

 

 

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Smackers:

If you go back in the thread you'll see we made our point and got a very gracious reply.

But no action.

 

About what you would expect, really.

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Smackers:

If you go back in the thread you'll see we made our point and got a very gracious reply.

But no action.

 

Yeah - I finally came across it and was tempted to delete that prior post. But I thought that would be a very panzy-ass thing to do. And I'm a Texan - so there are standards you know.

 

So, I'll hold off until gracious action is forthcoming from our Francopals. If we end up with none, I hereby reserve the right to let fly.

 

(Please note that the number of letters in "Francopals" perfectly matches the nom de guerre version in anomoly's post above. So this could easily go either way.)

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Smack:

I think we got what we are going to get and Raps picked up the ball and made a touchdown after the French fumbled.

I do appreciate the fact that they at least posted their explanation here. It makes me wonder how they knew about the thread.

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I do appreciate the fact that they at least posted their explanation here. It makes me wonder how they knew about the thread.

 

I wasn't me.... I've written to JM-F and have gotten no response.... :(

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So this could easily go either way.)

 

Ou [in case the fucktardes are still following along],

 

comme ci comme ca

 

but, as Bob noted, WLYDO has solved the problem, Gates can get on with building another beautiful model, Ajax can make us puke with jealousy, Bob's a confirmed stern man, and ND can contemplate 2 (why stop there?) stoves/ovens.....

 

All is right with the world, n'est pas?

 

 

 

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So this could easily go either way.)

 

Ou [in case the fucktardes are still following along],

 

comme ci comme ca

 

but, as Bob noted, WLYDO has solved the problem, Gates can get on with building another beautiful model, Ajax can make us puke with jealousy, Bob's a confirmed stern man, and ND can contemplate 2 (why stop there?) stoves/ovens.....

 

All is right with the world, n'est pas?

 

 

 

 

...and raps freakin' rocks.

 

Oui.

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I'm a star maker.

 

wink.gif

 

(kinda-sorta....probably not)

 

 

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It makes me wonder how they knew about the thread.

 

Bob

 

I think we all underestimate the power of Anarchy

 

Remember when we were ragging on Morris and then What's her name shows up?

 

Considering some of the celebrities we have here and who knows who's lurking...maybe even Steve Wozniak - I hear he likes boats - you never know who might show up.

 

Notice they only show up when people bitch about their stuff.

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who knows who's lurking...maybe even Steve Wozniak - I hear he likes boats -

 

Wait, Woz has the Group Fucktarde lines?

 

Say it aint so......

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Sons, Rap and Bob...amazing work these guys could put together.

 

Bob may never let out of the basement (sigh)

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Smack:

I think we got what we are going to get and Raps picked up the ball and made a touchdown after the French fumbled.

I do appreciate the fact that they at least posted their explanation here. It makes me wonder how they knew about the thread.

Might have been my bad. In my email to le groupe fucktardes I threw in a link.

To whit:

"

Monsieur,

200 euros for line drawings is outrageous. Do you really need revenue that badly? Make it 50 euros and we will talk.

http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?showtopic=131063&st=25"

And the reply:

" bonjourexcuse mefor drawings for modellers for oceanis331 minimum 4 hours is necessary.1 . I have now no time2 . what is normal price for one hours for yacht designer ?3 . what is more important: - use maximum time for design yacht ,and give maximum pleasure in the wind and the sea for navigators.. - use time for other question , is usely, but not essential sincerely yours "

^^^^ that is a classic gallic shrug in print right there.

 

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It makes me wonder how they knew about the thread.

 

Considering some of the celebrities we have here and who knows who's lurking...maybe even Steve Wozniak - I hear he likes boats - you never know who might show up.

 

Notice they only show up when people bitch about their stuff.

 

Just don't threaten to SPAM the Woz. He could counterattack with massive technological forces.... :)

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Smack:

I think we got what we are going to get and Raps picked up the ball and made a touchdown after the French fumbled.

I do appreciate the fact that they at least posted their explanation here. It makes me wonder how they knew about the thread.

Might have been my bad. In my email to le groupe fucktardes I threw in a link.

To whit:

"

Monsieur, 200 euros for line drawings is outrageous. Do you really need revenue that badly? Make it 50 euros and we will talk. http://forums.sailin...ic=131063&st=25" And the reply: " bonjourexcuse mefor drawings for modellers for oceanis331 minimum 4 hours is necessary.1 . I have now no time2 . what is normal price for one hours for yacht designer ?3 . what is more important: - use maximum time for design yacht ,and give maximum pleasure in the wind and the sea for navigators.. - use time for other question , is usely, but not essential sincerely yours " ^^^^ that is a classic gallic shrug in print right there.

 

 

Holy fuck that is some serious Engrish right there. you'd think someone in the office spoke the language enough to talk to a customer?

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Looks like GateKeeper and I have worked out the details for getting the waterline lifts he needs to start on the Oceanis 331 model and I've had some other inquiries for lines re-engineering for some other boats that fell in between the cracks during the CAD transition years. Keep em coming folks, we can archive the whole fleet!

 

Thanks for all of the positive comments and encouragment, I'm proud to be initiated into the WLYDO in such a manner and it is great to contribute. Just to keep the juices flowing, I'm doing a few renders of the 331 model as the stuff I had posted earlier were just screen captures from the working enviroment within Rhino. I use a rendering engine called Octane to add more realistic materials and lighting and want to share some of these images. BTW, if anyone is interested, I can output a Adobe Acrobat 3D file of the model that anyone with Acrobat Reader can open and play with. Pretty neat way to turn clients on to the power of 3D so if there is interest I will create the file and post.

post-33902-033078500 1328137237_thumb.jpg

post-33902-034672400 1328137252_thumb.jpg

post-33902-024453500 1328137268_thumb.jpg

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Raps,

 

Not to quibble, but to my eye it looks like you need a little more reverse slope at the stern. (One can hardly say "at the transom.")

 

post-5724-009609800 1328141322_thumb.jpg

 

It's also hard for me to judge how flat the counter is, i.e. how sharp the tuck of the bilge is at the stern.

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David:

I have already thought of contacting Beneteau North America but I suspect they will not be able to provide the drawing either. Thanks for at least filling us in.

 

I have a big stack of files for storing rolled drawings I did by hand many years ago. They are a PITA to work with but I keep them all available for moments like this when a guy wants to build a model or just have the original deck plan for his boat. I think it is my responsibility as the designer to have these drawings available. But I am just a guy in Seattle so maybe I am a bit strange that way.

 

Enjoy working on the FEA of the 100'er.

I have to go too.

My dogs need a walk. I'll do a FEA on what I pick up after them.

 

This is a reminder that the WLYDO is a force to be reckoned with.

 

this is what i would call " high quality sarcasm"

 

and i thought that was a lost art!

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Raps,

 

Not to quibble, but to my eye it looks like you need a little more reverse slope at the stern. (One can hardly say "at the transom.")

 

post-5724-009609800 1328141322_thumb.jpg

 

It's also hard for me to judge how flat the counter is, i.e. how sharp the tuck of the bilge is at the stern.

 

Quibble? It wouldn't be SA if there weren't some quibbling going on would it? Good eye! I'm not quite happy with the stern and transom and discovered today that my reference photo from a google search for Oceanis 331 had returned an image for a larger model, the 393! There is a lot more camber across the transom on the 331 and I was bothered by that. Gate says not to bother for his sake as he glues up his lofts run long past the transom and does his shaping before trimming the transom. Much like I do in the 3d model. He will get what he needs tommorow and if FInot and Co want to complain, they can show me their GF's tits!

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Raps,

 

Not to quibble, but to my eye it looks like you need a little more reverse slope at the stern. (One can hardly say "at the transom.")

 

post-5724-009609800 1328141322_thumb.jpg

 

It's also hard for me to judge how flat the counter is, i.e. how sharp the tuck of the bilge is at the stern.

 

Quibble? It wouldn't be SA if there weren't some quibbling going on would it? Good eye! I'm not quite happy with the stern and transom and discovered today that my reference photo from a google search for Oceanis 331 had returned an image for a larger model, the 393! There is a lot more camber across the transom on the 331 and I was bothered by that. Gate says not to bother for his sake as he glues up his lofts run long past the transom and does his shaping before trimming the transom. Much like I do in the 3d model. He will get what he needs tommorow and if FInot and Co want to complain, they can show me their GF's tits!

 

Excellent skills to bring.

 

And I'm always up for French titties.

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I'm really such an addict for Octane, just love dialing in a project to get 'the look' and it has turned into one of my biggest time wasters. But if it gets me that big job that needs the 'money shot' then I guess it wasn't a waste of time. Still fooling around with this 331 half model as if it were a small thing to hang over the mantle has been fun. Funny thing is that when I scaled it down to 18" from 33 feet to output Gates lifts, the camera settings in Octane forced me to reset the aperture and field of vision to get the proper results. That is because Octane is a un biased render engine and is physically correct in its depiction of the scene. All the technicalities aside, I thought I'd post a few more images as I explore the software and the possibilites. I think I need a boot top to cut down on the bulk of the topsides, but I'm pretty happy with the gloss and sheen of the gelcoat and bottom paint and just love the satin varnish look on the backboard. Feel free to add your comments as this is all very subjective and will help in my full scale yacht renders in the future. I'll try and dig up some examples to share with you guys here as well.

post-33902-015884900 1328150504_thumb.jpg

post-33902-007097300 1328150520_thumb.jpg

post-33902-090284000 1328150535_thumb.jpg

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I'm really such an addict for Octane, just love dialing in a project to get 'the look' and it has turned into one of my biggest time wasters. But if it gets me that big job that needs the 'money shot' then I guess it wasn't a waste of time. Still fooling around with this 331 half model as if it were a small thing to hang over the mantle has been fun. Funny thing is that when I scaled it down to 18" from 33 feet to output Gates lifts, the camera settings in Octane forced me to reset the aperture and field of vision to get the proper results. That is because Octane is a un biased render engine and is physically correct in its depiction of the scene. All the technicalities aside, I thought I'd post a few more images as I explore the software and the possibilites. I think I need a boot top to cut down on the bulk of the topsides, but I'm pretty happy with the gloss and sheen of the gelcoat and bottom paint and just love the satin varnish look on the backboard. Feel free to add your comments as this is all very subjective and will help in my full scale yacht renders in the future. I'll try and dig up some examples to share with you guys here as well.

 

Nice.

Still no tits, eh?

 

I'm Canadian, gotta say eh. Eh?

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Here all along I just thought you put your mouth up to the exhaust and blew hard to get that shape.

 

That's Peking Duck. Don't get that confused with Flying Sneaker.

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This is fucking humiliating.

 

Wait just a gol'darn minute. You mean if I learn Rhino I'll be able to draw fat, ugly French boats too?

 

Well, that could be. But I can draw pretty boats in Rhino too. Just don't get the opportunity as often as I'd like. I know what you mean though, I find myself putting lipstick on a pig so often... Reminds me of the bumper sticker that I think Landing School of Yacht Design was handing out at IBEX several years ago... 'Life is too short to design ugly boats!' I'm nominating this as the WLYDO official slogan, we all know that it is true!!!

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We have a slogan...google HTFU!!

I'm not sure what happened to "ass hat"

 

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OK Forgive me for usurping the slogan, I just though it was appropriate. And Gate, I apologize for having too much fun with your model. I'll quit making love to it in Octane and get you your lift for building tomorrow, 11 x 17 like we discussed, but right now I'm having fun with this!

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Have all the fun you want...I'm enjoying the whole process.

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Uhm, well, I don't know how to say this Gate, but I am having a monitor mounted on my wall and will just display Rap's electronic half models on it. I'll hand out 3D glasses at the door.... Sorry. :(

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Well I must have been getting greedy and showing off to you guys too much because I was just posting my latest renders out of Octane and crashed the whole flipping computer.Probably because I have to keep a photo editing program open to convert the mandatory Octane png output to jpeg in order to post within the 1MB SA limit. Anyway, I'm back to tease you guys,if you are still watching... I'm such a exibitionist when it comes to this kind of stuff, sorry... Bob has already expressed his disgust.

post-33902-094610300 1328153963_thumb.jpg

post-33902-083232000 1328153976_thumb.jpg

post-33902-024138100 1328153993_thumb.jpg

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Thanks, I'll check that out. Look at this that I just found on a designers site in relation to this whole post. They spell it out pretty well

 

model-builders.pngAlmost every week, we receive requests from model makers to provide plans for one of our most recent designs. Unfortunately, it is our policy to not provide design documentation to modellers for any vessels which are less than ten years old. This is simply a matter of protecting our investment in new designs, and also protecting our competitive position in the marketplace. Regardless of whatever assurances may be offered, we have no control over what may happen to plans once they leave this office.

 

 

 

 

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BTDT

That goes for any intellectual property that you might try to use to make money. Make it for your own use or to give away (within reason), no one will bother you...probably.

On another forum I'm on, we had put together a calendar for charity. Somehow Porsche got wind of it and sent a nasty gram. There were pictures in the calendar that had the Porsche logo either front and center on a car in the pic or unbeknownst in the background on a poster in a garage. No pics allowed which contained any visible sign of the Porsche name or logo. Never mind that you could tell the car was a Porsche.

Ain't capitalism great? I guess it depends on which side of it you're on.

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So, the renders are pretty cool, but if you're going for a "virtual half model", the ports should be flat black painted rectangles, not resized ports.

 

And the text on the plaque doesn't look right; it's much better on the latest renders, but it still just looks off. Are you looking for a raised brass look? Because it looks a little like it's raised off the plaque like the model is. Raised brass (or bronze) would work with the look, but not brass raised up off the backing.

 

And forget image resizing - get an imgur or flickr account and upload the full size images there, then link them in your post. No limits that way.

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Here all along I just thought you put your mouth up to the exhaust and blew hard to get that shape.

 

That's Peking Duck. Don't get that confused with Flying Sneaker.

 

 

Did somebody say Peking Duck?

 

 

 

Oh, and great work Rasp.

post-2611-087585100 1328162654_thumb.jpg

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I'm really such an addict for Octane, just love dialing in a project to get 'the look' and it has turned into one of my biggest time wasters. But if it gets me that big job that needs the 'money shot' then I guess it wasn't a waste of time. Still fooling around with this 331 half model as if it were a small thing to hang over the mantle has been fun. Funny thing is that when I scaled it down to 18" from 33 feet to output Gates lifts, the camera settings in Octane forced me to reset the aperture and field of vision to get the proper results. That is because Octane is a un biased render engine and is physically correct in its depiction of the scene. All the technicalities aside, I thought I'd post a few more images as I explore the software and the possibilites. I think I need a boot top to cut down on the bulk of the topsides, but I'm pretty happy with the gloss and sheen of the gelcoat and bottom paint and just love the satin varnish look on the backboard. Feel free to add your comments as this is all very subjective and will help in my full scale yacht renders in the future. I'll try and dig up some examples to share with you guys here as well.

 

Great work. I'm lusting after those software tools !!

As for the Gallic tools..... WLYDO just blew their doors off B)

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model-builders.pngAlmost every week, we receive requests from model makers to provide plans for one of our most recent designs. Unfortunately, it is our policy to not provide design documentation to modellers for any vessels which are less than ten years old. This is simply a matter of protecting our investment in new designs, and also protecting our competitive position in the marketplace. Regardless of whatever assurances may be offered, we have no control over what may happen to plans once they leave this office.

 

 

Silly...we are not asking for anything but simple hull lines, which can be obtained from the boat (or any sister ship) on the hard. Nobody is asking for anything that might even be vaguely construed as secret, proprietary, magical, based in voodoo or handed down from Poseidon.

 

I was considering doing a hull of a Southerly 38 and contacted the builder in the UK...they almost seemed to take it as a compliment that someone cared enough for their design to want it on their wall. Nice folks.

 

Frankly I think they should have a basic set in electronic form that would pacify people like me with a simple mouse click.

 

Gotta go now...I'm flying to Istanbul to meet the Dark One...the password is "ass hat"...I'm hoping to score a set of lines for a Bayfield Buccaneer on micro film. Wish me luck.

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In order to burn them in a dark magic ritual intended to curse any and all remaining examples in the world? Man, Gate, your work and its startling beauty and geerosity to this world is kind of humbling to observe.

 

EDIT: oh, BAYFIELD Buccaneer. Right. Gotta be more careful about these things...

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I'm really such an addict for Octane, just love dialing in a project to get 'the look' and it has turned into one of my biggest time wasters. But if it gets me that big job that needs the 'money shot' then I guess it wasn't a waste of time. Still fooling around with this 331 half model as if it were a small thing to hang over the mantle has been fun. Funny thing is that when I scaled it down to 18" from 33 feet to output Gates lifts, the camera settings in Octane forced me to reset the aperture and field of vision to get the proper results. That is because Octane is a un biased render engine and is physically correct in its depiction of the scene. All the technicalities aside, I thought I'd post a few more images as I explore the software and the possibilites. I think I need a boot top to cut down on the bulk of the topsides, but I'm pretty happy with the gloss and sheen of the gelcoat and bottom paint and just love the satin varnish look on the backboard. Feel free to add your comments as this is all very subjective and will help in my full scale yacht renders in the future. I'll try and dig up some examples to share with you guys here as well.

 

Looks awesome. But as a woodworking snob I have to point out that the backboard looks cheap, like formica. Actually, come to think of it, the backboard looks like the "woodwork" you might find inside a Beneteau!

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It has to look synthetic...it's cut from an electronic tree.

 

Don't they teach you guys anything out there?

 

 

tongue.gif

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post-5724-009609800 1328141322_thumb.jpg

 

I'm having a little trouble figuring out the lines at the stern - above water part. There are three lines running southwest to northeast. Working forward to aft, the first one is the end of the topsides. (This one may have slight inflection point at half height rather than a smooth curve all the way.) The second one is the corner between the rim of transom and the walk-in step area. The third one is....I don't know. And, I don't know why the second one is visible; I would have guessed it was identical with the first in projection.

 

It's almost as if the lines show a view slightly from aft in this area. Would designers do that in order to make the the image more informative for anyone just taking a quick look and not doing an analysis?

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Another quibble with the backboard: on the top and bottom bevels (that you can just see in some of the shots) the grain of the wood is the wrong direction, like the core of a veneered piece of ply.

 

Amazing stuff! Do you choose the species of wood for the backboard? Did you switch from cedar to mahogany with a switch?

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I see what you mean about those curves at the transom. Your image is cleaner that the one I used to start this thing and has different line weights for clarity, but the aftmost line at the transom seems to me to represent the center line of the transom surface if it hadn't been trimmed away for the swim platform. That line would determine the amount of camber across the surface. I need to wrap up the lofts for Gate and get those off and then perhaps I'll go back and rebuild the transom with the swim platform cutout from your reference drawing. I wish I had a better photo of the fore foot and entry at the waterline as I'm not quite happy with the model shape in that area, but as far as Gates needs, I'm going to call this 'Mission Accomplished'. Just for fun, I opened the model in another render program that I'm learning more about. Keyshot as it is known is pretty handy in product and automotive visualization but I'm still partial to Octane for its realism and speed. I couldn't resist putting the Beneteau in its native environment, check the background...

 

Have to agree with the comments about the wood looking like Formica. I'll work on that...

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Another quibble with the backboard: on the top and bottom bevels (that you can just see in some of the shots) the grain of the wood is the wrong direction, like the core of a veneered piece of ply.

 

Amazing stuff! Do you choose the species of wood for the backboard? Did you switch from cedar to mahogany with a switch?

 

Man you guys do pay attention! Got me there with the grain direction. Yes that can be dealt with and is important to make the grain consistent and avoid that 'veneer' type of mapping. There are different mapping modes such as box, planar, cylindrical, and custom but one would have to have an image of end grain wood that was a match for the flat or qtr sawn wood and apply that end grain to the appropriate face. This sort of thing is what I call playing "Where's Waldo" and an important part of my rendering work. I had a boss at the last NA firm that I worked who had an excellent eye for that sort of thing, but would get so hung up on reflections and shadows the it would drive us both nuts sometimes. I appreciate any such comments here, but keep in mind that this has just been a Q&D attempt to help Gate out and I'm thinking that time spent making the hull surface more representative of the actual vessel would be better spent than chaising down grain orientation. I can reload the image files for different woods and there are controls for gloss, bump, clearcoat, that have a great deal of influence over whether it looks like real wood or plastic.

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Looks awesome. But as a woodworking snob I have to point out that the backboard looks cheap, like formica. Actually, come to think of it, the backboard looks like the "woodwork" you might find inside a Beneteau!

 

Hey Gate, you might want to keep your client away from this thread, he might be disappointed to hear what the WLYDO thinks of his fat ugly boat.

 

As for me, I think the 331 a pretty nice looking boat. And yes like mine the joinery is not the same quality as on a Sabre. But they have found a way to make good looking, good performing mid-level boats and still stay in business. That has to count for something.

 

Now I gotta get off this soapbox before I fall down....

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He has a great sense of humor...and I'm not telling him just the same.

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I can hardly believe what just happened on this thread in the last few days. Haven't checked in for a while. Blown away by what Raps is able to do. The whole thread is amazing actually starting with ragging on the French guys, the response, everything. Raps skills are kinda humbling. I sure couldn't do it. I better stick to sailing and working on boats. That I can do. In fact I have a race this weekend.

Smack:

I think we got what we are going to get and Raps picked up the ball and made a touchdown after the French fumbled.

I do appreciate the fact that they at least posted their explanation here. It makes me wonder how they knew about the thread.

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That's interesting that they don't give model makers lines. Some design offices have simplified lines plans specifically for model makers.

If it were the latest Farr or Juan K. race boat I could totally understand why they guard the hull lines. But a boat like this has no "secrets" and once you see the boat hauled out it is all revealed anyway. We can just get Rap on the job and do it our way. We'll teach them to fuck with the WLYDO.

 

My attitude has always been that if somneone needs to copy my hull lines then he is just following what I have done and I have nothing to fear. The guy I fear is the guy who doesn't want to copy my hull lines.

 

I was joking. It's a fine looking vessel.

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I worked with Michael Peter ages ago and he has gone on to become very well known for his powerboat designs, especially really fast ones. He does pretty good in the gin palace department too. I recently spoke with him about a concept design I had done for a 60' fast 'commuter'; if you could call Caracas to Isla Margarita in Venezuela a commute. I apologized for it being a pretty blatant rip off of an 84'er that he had done a few years earlier, 'Jariya' for which he won Best of the Year from one of those big glossy boat mags like Showboats International. His comment was, 'If one is going to copy someone else's design, then he should at least choose to copy from someone who knows what they are doing...' Just another way of saying 'Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery'

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Looks awesome. But as a woodworking snob I have to point out that the backboard looks cheap, like formica. Actually, come to think of it, the backboard looks like the "woodwork" you might find inside a Beneteau!

 

Hey Gate, you might want to keep your client away from this thread, he might be disappointed to hear what the WLYDO thinks of his fat ugly boat.

 

As for me, I think the 331 a pretty nice looking boat. And yes like mine the joinery is not the same quality as on a Sabre. But they have found a way to make good looking, good performing mid-level boats and still stay in business. That has to count for something.

 

Now I gotta get off this soapbox before I fall down....

Not intending to insult you or your boat Jackdaw! And one can't argue with success. But they seem to be going further down the road to cheaper interiors - at the Toronto boatshow I was totally unimpressed with the interiors of the Beneteau boats. One thing they are now doing is only making one deck liner (interior) for all the cabin configurations, so there are the slots for all the possible bulkheads formed into the liner! Looks like hell to my eye. I'm sure it makes scheduling the things much easier, but at an esthetic cost.

 

And it is not as if my boat is a perfect work of art. I'm working on it, but she was a project boat when I bought her and she hasn't let me down. Previous owner actually applied Cetol to some of the interior woodwork! Son of a $#@$@#$@#...

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