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pitchpoledave

Nacra F20c vs Caanan this weekend

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I dont know, I bet upwind the C wins but down I bet the nacra is faster and deeper.

 

Nacra will win over all.

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why not put purchase cost on the stats?

 

Good idea..Anyone want to hazard a guess what the cost of Caanan is? $1million?

 

Ya can't put a price on passion.

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It will be fun to watch these boats this weekend. Having been on the same race course as a C Class Cat (in 2008) and the Carbon 20 (last year), I can tell you that both boats are much faster than any other 2-person catamaran. The Carbon 20 is way faster than a Tornado Sport.

 

The 25 foot C Class with it's wing sail will no doubt be fast upwind in flat water, but in chop or downwind, the Nacra F20 Carbon may have an edge. In any case, it will be fun to watch. The Nacra F20 Carbon is easily the best performing production sailboat of any size and the C Class Cat is the coolest looking thing on the water.

 

Looking forward to watching these guys pull away from us slow pokes on our F18's.

 

 

 

 

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Its David vs Goliath but you never know what can happen. At the Water Rats regatta this weekend in Toronto.

 

Tale of the tape again:

 

 

 

 

Updates to Tale of the Tape for Canaan:

Length = 25 feet

Weight = approx 345 Lbs, everything included

Mast Height = CLASSIFIED

Curved Daggerboards - no (technically a minor curve)

Cost = about $450k on the start line

 

 

We're looking forward to a fun event.

 

Fredo

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Canaan is certainly a beauty, but $450K... yikes. I guess I'll stick with my pseudo C.

 

Are we going to see this rumble on youtube afterwards? That would be great.

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Canaan is certainly a beauty, but $450K... yikes. I guess I'll stick with my pseudo C.

Yeah, well, I could have bought a custom IRC or TP 52 - except that I couldn't afford either of them, and I might not have had as much fun, or learned as much.

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Mast Height = CLASSIFIED

 

This might be tongue in cheek - but you know that I could walk up and take a picture of the wing and immediately know how tall it is :P

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Mast Height = CLASSIFIED

 

This might be tongue in cheek - but you know that I could walk up and take a picture of the wing and immediately know how tall it is :P

 

Seeing how you're in Fla. and Fred's in Canada, that'd be a long walk up.

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Mast Height = CLASSIFIED

 

This might be tongue in cheek - but you know that I could walk up and take a picture of the wing and immediately know how tall it is :P

 

It was tongue in cheek. The answer is 43 feet.

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I am sure we'll have a few go pros on board, and I would imagine a cam or two on the chase boat.

 

We have tried to self handicap by not sailing at all together this year, onlymy second time on the water etc etc.

 

Should be a fun day

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Yes, please! Sorry, couldn't help myself......

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Fred/Magnus,

 

Would you like a separate start for the C and the F20?

 

Ed

 

Might not be a bad idea, if only because we might be a bit slow off the dock, and we wouldn't want to hold up anybody elses start. I am planning on registering and doing the skippers meeting at 10, then bomb back to the club, wing up, launch the boat, sail or tow to the course as required.

 

Now if it was seperate start, would that indicate that you are intending to use match racing rules?

 

B

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Fred/Magnus,

 

Would you like a separate start for the C and the F20?

 

Ed

We will be happy starting with the whole Low Portsmouth fleet, but if it makes your regatta easier we can start seperately.

 

Our experience at past regattas has been that other crews are pretty considerate about not hitting the C on the start line and we have not tried to push any rights. It has kept everything safe for us, so we are happy with a group start.

 

If the outcome is so close that people are suggesting that the starts were decisive, then we will have a chance for some more good training as the year goes on.

 

 

Fred

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Fred/Magnus,

 

Would you like a separate start for the C and the F20?

 

Ed

 

Might not be a bad idea, if only because we might be a bit slow off the dock, and we wouldn't want to hold up anybody elses start. I am planning on registering and doing the skippers meeting at 10, then bomb back to the club, wing up, launch the boat, sail or tow to the course as required.

 

Now if it was seperate start, would that indicate that you are intending to use match racing rules?

 

B

 

If it's more convenient for you not to attend the meeting, we can get any relevant details to you by other means. We can process your registration after the fact, as well.

 

Fleet of 2; no match racing rules. We want to see a drag race, not a wrestling match.

 

We'll probably be doing 3 lap windward leeward races (with offset, but no leeward gate) with the Start/Finish line positioned 100 metres or so below the leeward mark. The committee boat will be a PDQ 26 catamaran. If the wind is light we may do 2 lap races, but the plan is for the high performance cats to do 3 laps and the non-spinnaker non-daggerboarded cats to do 2 lap races.

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Oskar on the NACRA? Ok then, you want it like that I see....

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What happened guys ? My quess is Cannan was quicker up and down wind but i live to be surprised!

Reports in - At Mark 1 it's Canaan by 5 minutes.

Canaan now around bottom mark.

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What happened guys ? My quess is Cannan was quicker up and down wind but i live to be surprised!

Reports in - At Mark 1 it's Canaan by 5 minutes.

Canaan now around bottom mark.

Leading holding steady. Canaan on third (last) upwind, F20 going downwind well.

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What happened guys ? My quess is Cannan was quicker up and down wind but i live to be surprised!

Reports in - At Mark 1 it's Canaan by 5 minutes.

Canaan now around bottom mark.

Leading holding steady. Canaan on third (last) upwind, F20 going downwind well.

At final windward mark, Canaan's lead is growing. Both boats headed downwind now.

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What happened guys ? My quess is Cannan was quicker up and down wind but i live to be surprised!

Reports in - At Mark 1 it's Canaan by 5 minutes.

Canaan now around bottom mark.

Leading holding steady. Canaan on third (last) upwind, F20 going downwind well.

At final windward mark, Canaan's lead is growing. Both boats headed downwind now.

Delta at finish: Canaan by 8:50.

Looks like F20c took back 1:40 on final downwind leg.

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Great job Canaan

How long overall? What were the conditions?

Conditions reported: 4 kts at start.

Sea State: Calm

Course: Start,W,L,W,L,W,Finish

Length: legs approx 0.8nm

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[Conditions reported: 4 kts at start.

Sea State: Calm

Course: Start,W,L,W,L,W,Finish

Length: legs approx 0.8nm

 

Congratulations Fredo & Blunted!

 

Are you going to bring the boat down to Bristol & Newport to play with Steve during the upcoming AC event? If so I hope to see you there.

 

Thanks for the race report!

TTS

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Great job Canaan

How long overall? What were the conditions?

Conditions reported: 4 kts at start.

Sea State: Calm

Course: Start,W,L,W,L,W,Finish

Length: legs approx 0.8nm

 

Final score: Canaan 4, F20C 0

Canaan wins all races comfortably, as in by most of a leg. Last race Canaan wins by a leg.

Conditions light all day.

We will concede that the F20c was faster downwind today, gaining 1:30 to 2:00 per leg, although Canaan did manage to win some downwinds.

 

Thanks for the challenge!

 

Fredo

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Its David vs Goliath but you never know what can happen.

 

Further comment:

 

This challenge was interesting for us. The last time we raced this race, in 2008, we brought Orion which we had just launched. The whole field was slower. If we had brought Orion back this year the races would have been close. Canaan is significantly faster than Orion.

 

So, while the F20c raised the bar a lot compared to a couple of years ago, it's worth remembering that the C's are getting a lot faster too, year by year.

 

Once again, thanks for the challenge and a fun day.

 

Fredo

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whats it rate ?

 

any experts care to calculate a PN number for the C

based on the times it smacked the hobycat by ?

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Hard to base a rating on one low wind event with just two boats with one of them being the world champion.

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ballpark ?

 

agree it would be a minimum estimate as the Raceboat would get quicker downwind as breeze rises

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thanks

 

very interesting

 

who was flying a hull more often and for how long?

 

any guess as to what the results would have been like in 8knots of wind?

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Hard to base a rating on one low wind event with just two boats with one of them being the world champion.

The other was sailed by a two time Tornado Olympian, so the crews were not badly matched.

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thanks

 

very interesting

 

who was flying a hull more often and for how long?

 

any guess as to what the results would have been like in 8knots of wind?

From our side we saw 8-12 Kts as our best scenario, since it's a bit hard to get the C downwind in 4 or less with only 300 sq. ft. We viewed wind over 16 kts and waves as an equalizer downwind.

We could be wrong and it may be worth further test later this season, but it was our guess.

 

Fredo

 

[Conditions reported: 4 kts at start.

Sea State: Calm

Course: Start,W,L,W,L,W,Finish

Length: legs approx 0.8nm

 

Congratulations Fredo & Blunted!

 

Are you going to bring the boat down to Bristol & Newport to play with Steve during the upcoming AC event? If so I hope to see you there.

 

Thanks for the race report!

TTS

We will not be bringing the boat to Bristol, but we might watch from the RIB.

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We had only 5 knots in the first couple of races, so the C was much faster upwind and fast downwind as well. Seeing the C fly a hull downwind with both crew on the leeward side, with only one lightweight hull creating righting moment, was plenty impressive.

 

The Carbon 20 is a very fast boat, but it was no match for the C in these 5 knot conditions and I doubt that it would be until the wind and sea state get high enough for the C to be tricky downwind. In 8 knots, the F20c would be powered up upwind, but the C would be able to sail deeper downwind, so I don't thing that would change the results much.

 

The whole thing was a lot of fun to watch and having the C Class Cat and Tornado Olympian Oskar Johansson at the event created a great vibe. And Beata says thanks for the ride on the C Cat between races.

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Race 1: C = 51:00, F20c = 1:00:53 5 knots

Race 2: C = 49:02, F20c = 51:22 4-5 knots

Race 3: C = 39:55, F20c = 43:22 5-7 knots

Race 4: C = 18:41, F20c = 23:00 6-8 knots

 

Wind speeds are my best guess.

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Race 1: C = 51:00, F20c = 1:00:53 5 knots

Race 2: C = 49:02, F20c = 51:22 4-5 knots

Race 3: C = 39:55, F20c = 43:22 5-7 knots

Race 4: C = 18:41, F20c = 23:00 6-8 knots

 

Wind speeds are my best guess.

 

Also, the first 3 races were 6 leg windward/leewards. The 4th race was only 4 legs.

 

Some picture from the first day of our regatta are here: http://waterratssailingclub.wildapricot.org/Default.aspx?pageId=1333401

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Hard to base a rating on one low wind event with just two boats with one of them being the world champion.

The other was sailed by a two time Tornado Olympian, so the crews were not badly matched.

 

We bow to the greatness of Caanan and maybe next time we can get 15 knots of breeze and some big chop!

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Hard to base a rating on one low wind event with just two boats with one of them being the world champion.

The other was sailed by a two time Tornado Olympian, so the crews were not badly matched.

 

We bow to the greatness of Caanan and maybe next time we can get 15 knots of breeze and some big chop!

 

Thanks guys we had fun, It's nice to play with others once in a while. Indeed we do need to line up in some more breeze to get some more data points.

 

The F20 was enjoying their whomper downhill and reeling us in on many occassions. Once the breeze came up over 6 knots we felt a little more comfortable against them downhill.

 

Good times, good peeps.

 

B

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thanks to all!

 

more money really does buy better kit

 

i guess i already knew that

 

but , you know...

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WD Fredo & Blunt

 

Now come to Newport next week and have a go at the 45's

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WD Fredo & Blunt

 

Now come to Newport next week and have a go at the 45's

 

 

Gooday 'PL3' - Sure wish I had the money to get them all together - now that would be a blast & a half. Just haven't got a spare 1/2 a mil to spare. Bloody shame that.

 

I still can't figure out why/how a 'C' class can't finish in front on a Nacra.Yes - I know that they did - but I thought that - - that was a 'given'

 

Don't know the sail area vs weight ws lwl & how that compares ???

 

All these - each and everyone of them - is sure a 'blast' Thanks for all the 'posts' & pic's ! ! ! Ciao, james

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WD Fredo & Blunt

 

Now come to Newport next week and have a go at the 45's

 

 

Gooday 'PL3' - Sure wish I had the money to get them all together - now that would be a blast & a half. Just haven't got a spare 1/2 a mil to spare. Bloody shame that.

 

I still can't figure out why/how a 'C' class can't finish in front on a Nacra.Yes - I know that they did - but I thought that - - that was a 'given'

 

Don't know the sail area vs weight ws lwl & how that compares ???

 

All these - each and everyone of them - is sure a 'blast' Thanks for all the 'posts' & pic's ! ! ! Ciao, james

 

Well we did finish ahead of them, four times in a row.

 

Sail area etc, read the whole thread, all the facts are there.....

 

B

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WD Fredo & Blunt

 

Now come to Newport next week and have a go at the 45's

 

 

Gooday 'PL3' - Sure wish I had the money to get them all together - now that would be a blast & a half. Just haven't got a spare 1/2 a mil to spare. Bloody shame that.

 

I still can't figure out why/how a 'C' class can't finish in front on a Nacra.Yes - I know that they did - but I thought that - - that was a 'given'

 

Don't know the sail area vs weight ws lwl & how that compares ???

 

All these - each and everyone of them - is sure a 'blast' Thanks for all the 'posts' & pic's ! ! ! Ciao, james

 

Well we did finish ahead of them, four times in a row.

 

Sail area etc, read the whole thread, all the facts are there.....

 

B

 

 

"Corrected time" is irrelevant in this case. The PN numbers are not based on enough data to be meaningful in any way whatsoever.

 

The point of this match-up was to see how the world's fastest production boat would do against the world's most efficient sailboat. Despite one semi-close race, this C Class cat dominated.

 

I am not sure if other C's sailed by other crews could have maintained the downwind VMG in 4 knots of wind that Dan and Magnus were able to achieve on Canaan. They were both sitting on the leeward hull teetering downwind...incredible sailing touch to make that work.

 

I think in the mid-range (8-12 knots) this C (Canaan) would win by a greater margin. Above 15 knots in chop, the F20c might start to close the gap again. It would be fun to watch, no matter what the outcome.

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watching that start

 

is like watching dozilla destroy cheesezilla

 

only in this race the mismatch is apparent MUCH earlier

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thanks to all!

 

more money really does buy better kit

 

i guess i already knew that

 

but , you know...

 

For sure the boat is a big portion of the equation but don't sell Mags and Fredo short either. As you can see from the comments in the thread their BH is pretty slick too (downwind technique especially). They have many many hours of training on Cs (far more than anone on a F20C) and are pretty talented sailors from the get go.

 

Oskar is no slouch to say the least, but again the comments above speak to his lack of time on the F20C and still getiing dialed in - give them more time and they could have made the F20C faster.

 

But even with comperably sailed boats, the C will win. And lastly, let's not forget that the F20C design is now a point in time whereas the Cs are being tweaked and redesigned every day - the gap will only be bigger in a year.

 

Cheers,

Giles

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For sure the boat is a big portion of the equation but don't sell Mags and Fredo short either.

 

f'sure

those guys know how to sail their boat

 

 

 

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Hate to say I told you so but!

 

So an off-the-cuff remark that I made on January 27th got all this started and led to a show-down of the world's best C Class Cat and a Nacra F20 Carbon driven by two-time Olympic Tornado sailor Oskar Johansson--and it all happened at a small, club-level regatta I was organizing...I think things worked out very nicely. Fortunately I wasn't stupid enough to place any wagers on this match-up.

 

Thanks again to the C Class guys (Fred, Magus and Dan) for adding excitement to our event, to Pitchpoledave for lending his boat to Oskar, and to Oskar for bringing some star-power to the event. It was definitely a day to remember.

 

Ed

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Hate to say I told you so but!

 

So an off-the-cuff remark that I made on January 27th got all this started and led to a show-down of the world's best C Class Cat and a Nacra F20 Carbon driven by two-time Olympic Tornado sailor Oskar Johansson--and it all happened at a small, club-level regatta I was organizing...I think things worked out very nicely. Fortunately I wasn't stupid enough to place any wagers on this match-up.

 

Thanks again to the C Class guys (Fred, Magus and Dan) for adding excitement to our event, to Pitchpoledave for lending his boat to Oskar, and to Oskar for bringing some star-power to the event. It was definitely a day to remember.

 

Ed

 

No losers and sailing is the winner. Sounds about right.

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watching that start

 

is like watching dozilla destroy cheesezilla

 

only in this race the mismatch is apparent MUCH earlier

 

Watching the start doesn't tell the whole story. It only shows what the C does best and that is accelerate fast and in light wind. Downwind was a different story with the F20c reeling in the C as much as 2 minutes per downwind leg..but it wasn't enough to offset the upwind performance.

 

There was some power boat wake that went through the course and Caanan stopped completely after hitting that so I suspect the achilles heel of Caanan is rougher sea state.

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Fantastic! Thanks have to go to everyone that made this happen, it really puts what the C-class guys are doing in context.

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There was some power boat wake that went through the course and Caanan stopped completely after hitting that so I suspect the achilles heel of Caanan is rougher sea state.

 

I am sure Mags and Fredo will add to this but the answer is not really. At least not a huge amount more than burying the bow on any other boat – at least not normal wind generated waves. As someone who was sailed the Cs only a few times I can say it does feel weird as the wing weighs a lot more than a normal mast/soft sail setup so the pitching moment is very different when moving through waves. This is noticed far more at slow speed when wetted area is providing the lift rather than at speed when dynamic lift kicks in and the platform gets more stable.

 

2007 was a windy I4C. The biggest problem with sea state at that regatta was staying attached to the boat – both going upwind at 15kts and downwind at 20+. As Mags described it – Junior Club style trapeezing with feet waaaay apart. Much of the hull refinement in Fredo’s subsequent boats (they used Alpha in 2007) has been to deal with sea state but particularly at speed.

 

Orion – went at this by trying wave piercing bows – proved to be wickedly fast in certain conditions but not all around and also locked in too much when going downhill and the bows submerged (more than a few butt puckers along the way).

 

Caanan – ditched the revolutionary approach and went evolutionary from Alpha – higher freeboard, particularly for the crossbeams (beams were catching the waves) and refinements to both bow and stern to improve movement through waves.

 

I was not out on the weekend and did not see the race. If it was big square power boat waves they might affect the Cs more due to the wing. Sailing the C and particularly upwind it is not so much about power (they have that in abundance) but low drag so at surprisingly low windspeads you start flattening out the wing and focusing on less drag rather than more power. My guess is that if they stuffed it into powerboat waves noticeably more than the F20C it was likely that Mags had the wing set up for low drag (hence less power) and lost flow ashtey could not power through. In other words, it was Magnus’ fault. :lol:

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watching that start

 

is like watching dozilla destroy cheesezilla

 

only in this race the mismatch is apparent MUCH earlier

 

Watching the start doesn't tell the whole story. It only shows what the C does best and that is accelerate fast and in light wind. Downwind was a different story with the F20c reeling in the C as much as 2 minutes per downwind leg..but it wasn't enough to offset the upwind performance.

 

There was some power boat wake that went through the course and Caanan stopped completely after hitting that so I suspect the achilles heel of Caanan is rougher sea state.

 

I recall that wake now, it was ridiculous, half way through it I took my foot off the gas to give the boat a break, we could have plowed on and survived but at a risk to the boat for sure. In part it was concern for the boat, and I also took a moment to stand up to leeward so as not to be drowned. Dan and I could not actually fugure out what had kicked up such a stupid size wave. So yes we stopped on that one, intentionally, yes Giles, it was indeed my fault.

 

Oh and for the record, I tihnk as soon as the wind was above 6 knots, we were not longer giving anything away downhill. But alas, we'll have to line up some day to sort out that particular issue with facts and not conjecture.

 

B

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Big thanks from me for sharing all this, great reading.

I grew up in Melbourne and remember the Cuninghams and there great work on early C's and cats in general, got the buzz then and still sail cats today.

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watching that start

 

is like watching dozilla destroy cheesezilla

 

only in this race the mismatch is apparent MUCH earlier

 

Watching the start doesn't tell the whole story. It only shows what the C does best and that is accelerate fast and in light wind. Downwind was a different story with the F20c reeling in the C as much as 2 minutes per downwind leg..but it wasn't enough to offset the upwind performance.

 

There was some power boat wake that went through the course and Caanan stopped completely after hitting that so I suspect the achilles heel of Caanan is rougher sea state.

 

I recall that wake now, it was ridiculous, half way through it I took my foot off the gas to give the boat a break, we could have plowed on and survived but at a risk to the boat for sure. In part it was concern for the boat, and I also took a moment to stand up to leeward so as not to be drowned. Dan and I could not actually fugure out what had kicked up such a stupid size wave. So yes we stopped on that one, intentionally, yes Giles, it was indeed my fault.

 

Oh and for the record, I tihnk as soon as the wind was above 6 knots, we were not longer giving anything away downhill. But alas, we'll have to line up some day to sort out that particular issue with facts and not conjecture.

 

B

 

That was a big wave. I moved all the way back and out to the hull so I wouldn't be swept off the tramp. I think something big did a turn and we happened to be passing through the center of where waves were converging.

 

And I'll back magnus up, when it was over 6kts we were much more comfortable downwind. That was only my second time driving Caanan and its been about two years since I've been in a C in that little breeze. Once it got windier driving was much easier. I think Fred would have made it look easy.

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whats it rate ?

 

any experts care to calculate a PN number for the C

based on the times it smacked the hobycat by ?

If you can come up with a working UK to US PY conversion factor, there's a conversion factor for SCHRS (which you should be able to calculate from the formula) to UK PY. Double conversion factor though will only ever give a badly fudged number.

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I lined up against the C cats last LAC down in Newport on my Tiger, we totally smoked Caanan upwind, although Im pretty sure they were having a sandwich or something... They are amazing boats, but give me 6 ft seas and 20 knots, and an F18 will smoke a C cat, as they have taken their carbon bits and headed for home!!!

 

Cant wait to get on the water next to the AC45s this weekend, then race before them next weekend, its going to be pretty friggen epic, lets just hope the breeze shows up!

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yes one day I will beat Vettels F1 car in my Subaru over a motocross course, totally smoked them last time tho they stopped in the pits for something or a sandwich

 

can't wait to for this weekend when i will line up against an Indycar and race before them, its going to be pretty friggen epic, lets just hope the berms and bumps stay up

btw, if you pull your noodle any harder you'll get blisters

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So, the spinnaker boat got slaughtered in what beforehand were being advertised as good conditions for it. Colour me surprised - not. People get very excited about the big rags, but you only have to look at published handicap numbers for the platforms that are available in both configurations to realise that they make a lot less difference than most people seem to think. Ultimately much of what they do is entertainment value for those that want it - and of course there is absolutely nothing, but nothing wrong with entertainment value: its why we do it.

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So, the spinnaker boat got slaughtered in what beforehand were being advertised as good conditions for it. Colour me surprised - not. People get very excited about the big rags, but you only have to look at published handicap numbers for the platforms that are available in both configurations to realise that they make a lot less difference than most people seem to think. Ultimately much of what they do is entertainment value for those that want it - and of course there is absolutely nothing, but nothing wrong with entertainment value: its why we do it.

 

 

 

Not exactly true. Only the first two races were sailed in very light conditions. The first race was a write-off, as it was Oskar's first time sailing this boat and even he needed about 30 minutes to adapt to the boat. The rig on the Carbon 20 (particularly the mast) is a lot different than a Tornado.

 

In the Second race, the wind was still light and the C won by just 2 minutes in a 50 minute race. That is less than the time difference between the first and second place F18s.

 

The final two races saw more moderate wind with flat sea-state, where we always knew the Carbon 20 would have no chance.

 

As for Spinnakers, they are not just for "entertainment value". Unless you are sailing an ultra-light catamaran like an A or a C, the spinnaker is necessary to get the boat going in wind below 10 knots and also makes a catamaran easier to handle in stronger wind, especially in waves.

 

 

 

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yes one day I will beat Vettels F1 car in my Subaru over a motocross course, totally smoked them last time tho they stopped in the pits for something or a sandwich

 

can't wait to for this weekend when i will line up against an Indycar and race before them, its going to be pretty friggen epic, lets just hope the berms and bumps stay up

btw, if you pull your noodle any harder you'll get blisters

 

:D

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I lined up against the C cats last LAC down in Newport on my Tiger, we totally smoked Caanan upwind, although Im pretty sure they were having a sandwich or something... They are amazing boats, but give me 6 ft seas and 20 knots, and an F18 will smoke a C cat, as they have taken their carbon bits and headed for home!!!

 

Cant wait to get on the water next to the AC45s this weekend, then race before them next weekend, its going to be pretty friggen epic, lets just hope the breeze shows up!

 

My keen sense of intent tells me this post is either pure sarcasm, or retardation.

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Hey, Great to see that this has actually taken place after all this time. Always great to see a C-class back in action too. It sounds like it was pretty light so it was good for the C-class to be represented by the best light wind example ever in Canaan. For what it's worth, I think that the C will just get more impressive as the wind builds. Let's face it, upwind it well and truly trumps the Nacra on every front and in some cases quite substantially. They ARE two two different boats but the point here is still to do a comparison between two different boats just to get an idea of performance levels and how they have developed over the years. The C-class is a pretty clean ship upwind with the length and beam to go with it. She'll just keep going faster and higher. The deadly duo. Another advantage once the wind picks up (which Moth sailors often mention) is the ability to hit the marks without slowing down for kite hoists and drops. Once the wind is up the C starts to get pretty rapid downwind and that extra 5' will always help. That first day of the last LAC was pretty top-end and I was very impressed by how hard the boys were sending Canaan and Alpha... especially down wind. After Steve's unfortunate incident there were two boats racing hard whilst the rest of us survived. It was great to watch and demonstrated that these boats could take it. There was nothing slow about that show. Damn I wish Steve had of completed at least one lap. That three boat tussle in those conditions could have been truly epic.

Rough seas would of course slow them down. Of course a version of a C could be made to be hammered in any conditions within reason... but these ones you see today are made as the best compromise for likely event conditions. A Nacra or F-18 is built where it is expected to race in many top-end conditions throughout its life. Another factor that would slow a C down in rougher sea states... as it already did with Blunted and that boat wake... is the consequential awareness that comes with sailing/paying for/building/repairing the C-class boats. If they are built for the LAC... then it is worth the risk to push them hard in that event if it is required but not to make a point in a side-show event.

The Nacra is a superb boat and the ideal representative of the evolution of high performance, production beach cats. This comparison had to be made sooner or later perhaps more so for the relevance of the C-class. I hope there are many more races so we can get some more 'points on the graph'. Personally I hope the C-class can remain at the top so that it can remain the object of efficiency and let's face it, desire that it always has been. Something sure has to make it worth all the time, money and effort!

I bet that somewhere in that fleet of cats that Canaan mixed with, maybe not up the front, there was someone whose passion was ignited to the point where one-day action will follow. It was an event like that where a C came and played with our state of the art cats (Hobie 18's, Nacra 5.8's, QB2's etc) that set the course for my life.

Great stuff.

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I bet that somewhere in that fleet of cats that Canaan mixed with, maybe not up the front, there was someone whose passion was ignited to the point where one-day action will follow. It was an event like that where a C came and played with our state of the art cats (Hobie 18's, Nacra 5.8's, QB2's etc) that set the course for my life.

Great stuff.

 

One of our newer racers who was sailing a community club-owned Nacra 500 hopped off the little Nacra and went for a ride on Canaan in between races. Her passion for cats, already strong, went off the charts.

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I bet that somewhere in that fleet of cats that Canaan mixed with, maybe not up the front, there was someone whose passion was ignited to the point where one-day action will follow. It was an event like that where a C came and played with our state of the art cats (Hobie 18's, Nacra 5.8's, QB2's etc) that set the course for my life.

Great stuff.

 

One of our newer racers who was sailing a community club-owned Nacra 500 hopped off the little Nacra and went for a ride on Canaan in between races. Her passion for cats, already strong, went off the charts.

 

Team Fredo has taken dozens of young kids for sails and even let idiots like me drive a variety of the Cs. Hugely open and trusting in the name of increasing the number of people sailing cool boats.

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I bet that somewhere in that fleet of cats that Canaan mixed with, maybe not up the front, there was someone whose passion was ignited to the point where one-day action will follow. It was an event like that where a C came and played with our state of the art cats (Hobie 18's, Nacra 5.8's, QB2's etc) that set the course for my life.

Great stuff.

 

One of our newer racers who was sailing a community club-owned Nacra 500 hopped off the little Nacra and went for a ride on Canaan in between races. Her passion for cats, already strong, went off the charts.

 

then she needs to take a ride on a F16.

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Heheheheee...

 

And no, btw,I had the Hobie tattoo lasered off when I bought my Infusion

 

yes one day I will beat Vettels F1 car in my Subaru over a motocross course, totally smoked them last time tho they stopped in the pits for something or a sandwich

 

can't wait to for this weekend when i will line up against an Indycar and race before them, its going to be pretty friggen epic, lets just hope the berms and bumps stay up

btw, if you pull your noodle any harder you'll get blisters

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Do I get retarded when Im excited about some shit, sure I do. Why the fuck not?

 

I lined up against the C cats last LAC down in Newport on my Tiger, we totally smoked Caanan upwind, although Im pretty sure they were having a sandwich or something... They are amazing boats, but give me 6 ft seas and 20 knots, and an F18 will smoke a C cat, as they have taken their carbon bits and headed for home!!!

 

Cant wait to get on the water next to the AC45s this weekend, then race before them next weekend, its going to be pretty friggen epic, lets just hope the breeze shows up!

 

My keen sense of intent tells me this post is either pure sarcasm, or retardation.

 

 

 

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Some more context.

 

Today we did some yachting, doing 12's+- upwind in 6 knots TWS and 16's downhill, while gybing through an honest 100 degrees.

 

Top speed for the day, just North of 22, We think it was a walloping 9-10 knots in the harbor when we did that just off the dock for Fredo's first sail of the year.

 

some additional data points for the debate.

 

Had 3 GoPro's on the boat, we'll try to get some vids up later.....in the week, as I know lawn boy had a drink to deal with that was literally no less than 20 liters of booze. But that's another kind of high performance tale to tell.

 

B

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"Had 3 GoPro's on the boat, we'll try to get some vids up later.....in the week, as I know lawn boy had a drink to deal with that was literally no less than 20 liters of booze. But that's another kind of high performance tale to tell."

 

I can hardly wait!

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