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moondance44

Annual Around Long Island Race Offical Thread

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this thread may have jumped the tracks here.....meanwhile, light and tricky conditions coming up, and fairly cool conditions--can't wait to see what Dacapo brings to the galley to keep us warm on Friday night!

My word! Sounds absolutely extravagant!

Hopefully something that won't make you puke on the liferaft and get tossed out of SCYC

 

#juniorsailors #puke

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Don't think Dacapo's menu selection had anything to do with the liferaft decoration....might have been his coconut bra though....needs some implants

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Don't think Dacapo's menu selection had anything to do with the liferaft decoration....might have been his coconut bra though....needs some implants

the bra is comin along..............so is a good dinner

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this thread may have jumped the tracks here.....meanwhile, light and tricky conditions coming up, and fairly cool conditions--can't wait to see what Dacapo brings to the galley to keep us warm on Friday night!

 

Anything is possible, but from here it looks like a light one.

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this thread may have jumped the tracks here.....meanwhile, light and tricky conditions coming up, and fairly cool conditions--can't wait to see what Dacapo brings to the galley to keep us warm on Friday night!

 

briannafrostjeanshorts.jpg

 

What our you jumpemg foolle?

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this thread may have jumped the tracks here.....meanwhile, light and tricky conditions coming up, and fairly cool conditions--can't wait to see what Dacapo brings to the galley to keep us warm on Friday night!

 

Anything is possible, but from here it looks like a light one.

Maybe after all these years of fluky, light, late July, early August breezes, they should think about moving this race to September. Better breeze and the water is just as warm.

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Ocean side of the race is usually powered up-plenty of years (and I hate to admit how many times I have done this race), looking at 20 plus out there --once you get in the Sound, regardless of time of year, its a crapshoot. Right now, looks like a fun night of kite work getting to Montauk and then who knows?

 

Vineyard on Labor Day weekend kind of trumps another multi-day race in the fall-and Fall has American double weekends in the mix of September and lots of other events every weekend. The three big distance races on the Sound are spaced fairly well-its pretty easy for most boats to rustle up crew around those holiday weekends for Around Block and Vineyard as most firms are basically asleep on those Fridays before the event regardless. Getting a couple days off in the middle of the summer for ALIR, when kids are off from school, vacations on the calendar, is usually easier than in the Fall when everything, especially in New York, really ramps up.

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The Official Song of The ALIR

 

"The Last Time"

 

 

Well I told you once and I told you twice

But ya never listen to my advice

You don't try very hard to please me

With what you know it should be easy

Well this could be the last time

This could be the last time

Maybe the last time

I don't know. Oh no. Oh no

Well, I'm sorry girl but I can't stay

Feelin' like I do today

It's too much pain and too much sorrow

Guess I'll feel the same tomorrow

Well this could be the last time

This could be the last time

Maybe the last time

I don't know. Oh no. Oh no

Well I told you once and I told you twice

That someone will have to pay the price

But here's a chance to change your mind

Cuz I'll be gone a long, long time

Well this could be the last time

This could be the last time

Maybe the last time

I don't know. Oh no. Oh no

Well, this could be the last time.......

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

So who is in for next year?

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A J120 and a J122 rate almost the same ... in IRC (1.089 vs 1.090), in PHRF (42 vs 27)

 

How could PHRF have got it so wrong?

Sondes licke you neede talke to Expo, he nose the innert wrkings of that org.

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What do you guys think of the 6pm start? I'd rather go with 1pm and have a full afternoon of southerly.

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Looks fun out in Montauk right about now.

 

They got there fairly quick... at least the current will be with them soon.

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Looks fun out in Montauk right about now.

 

They got there fairly quick... at least the current will be with them soon.

I bet the fast boats are counting down the minutes. The slower boats, not so much.

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Looks slow in the bay right now.

 

Flying up the sound now. Why did the Gunboat hang a right?

How come you're not out there?

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My 2 year old did not think hanging out alone last night would be cool, or at least his mom didn't.

 

I think they gybed over thinking the breeze will be better off CT as the day drags on.

The approaching thunderstorms will change that into a total crapshoot. Either side could win out. Probably not worth the lost time crossing over.

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So according to kattack, Weegie is in someone's driveway on the middle of Long Island or very near the front of the race.

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So according to kattack, Weegie is in someone's driveway on the middle of Long Island or very near the front of the race.

And with that rating, she should win the whole thing B)

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Tracker indicates Schock 40 Finishing First Mono about 1/2 Mile behind Gunboat 56

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1st in fleet 1st overall ( double handed) 1st at the party...................Shooting Star

I am whipped.

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check the elapsed times not the tracker leverage beats the gunboat across the line by 9 seconds, farr 40s oak cliff and ranger close behind and correct out 1 and 2 they both sailed great races my hats off to them.

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check the elapsed times not the tracker leverage beats the gunboat across the line by 9 seconds, farr 40s oak cliff and ranger close behind and correct out 1 and 2 they both sailed great races my hats off to them.

And you guys 2nd to last, do they give silverware for that? :P

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It's the ALIR Johnnie, everybody gets a prize.

Nice going once again!

 

Whay happened to your race tracker?

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Thanks John. Race tracker.... gosh no. If they aren't mandatory why would you want the other boats to know what you are up to?

We set a reaching kite in the ocean shortly after midnight when most everyone else was still debating what the breeze would do. Ran down a good lot of them and were not too far behind the likes of Leverage, Oakcliff, Ranger and their division going into Montauk. Put us right in the game.

Down the sound was quick until Stratford where it got real dicey as usual. Couple of deck shuffles and restarts but we managed to survive to make last call.

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Thanks John. Race tracker.... gosh no. If they aren't mandatory why would you want the other boats to know what you are up to?

We set a reaching kite in the ocean shortly after midnight when most everyone else was still debating what the breeze would do. Ran down a good lot of them and were not too far behind the likes of Leverage, Oakcliff, Ranger and their division going into Montauk. Put us right in the game.

Down the sound was quick until Stratford where it got real dicey as usual. Couple of deck shuffles and restarts but we managed to survive to make last call.

So, it sounds ike you were smarter than the rest. Where did you end up? first? What boat?

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Oh, so you finished well in your division. It sounded like you won the whole thing.

the whole damn thing

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We did okay. At least they didn't call the cops on us this year and no one puked on the life raft..... but they did make it clear that the bar closes at 4 and the pool doesn't open until 8.

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It was a fun ride on Frogger. Except that we snapped the adjustable bobstay twice, and had to finish nonspin (which still wasn't slow). I guess that low friction ring isn't so low friction anymore...

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Noice job to you Josh and your crew Mr. Keel Trimmer. We will see you at the party, eh?

porch open all night ?

Yes, but did I mention we weren't in a rush to grab the launch and get off the mooring before the flashing lights came down Cliff Way?

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great trip down the river, got to Hell Gate a little early but what the hell, had great current all the way to the start line passed Josh and Miles in the East River on the Mini --god love them --dicked around for a few hours, had some Duffy sandwiches, very tasty, thanks Duff, then got off the line in a good position, clear air, broad reaching, wondering whether we could carry the Bee but powered up with the 3di jib on the outboard lead. Wind was steady 14 to 20, big waves that got bigger and lots of waterline boats were keeping right up with us, Alex on Milky Way, Prevail, an Oceanis 48, two big Baltics....TR was sticking around but we were a bit ahead of him and knew once night fell the world would change. Dacapo meatball and eggplant parm filled our bellies for the work in the dark and we stayed powered up, surfing in the swell, picking off boats in front of us for a few hours. Boat was flying and fun to drive...wind cycled down a bit and we knew 2 a.m. or so things were going to shut down drastically so we wanted to max out what we had. Discussion back and forth....waves flattening....now, later, wait a half hour....JT sticks his head up, concurs, Bee up. Only kite we saw up for awhile and worked our way up then to the front of the fleet, only guys in front of us the Oakcliff 40's, Leverage, Ragana, Gunboat, Navy Farr and 122. Someone will have to remind me about a couple of peels and sail changes but we kept working hard. Kept the beach close, never really went out more than two, three miles, and we saw things getting shifty up to the Point, falling down to a course to the Canary Islands or jibe to the beach....didn't want to let some guy 5 miles out do an end-around but didn't see any significant breeze out there and I felt it better to cover TR and get in a little closer-could always heat up and go back to the Canaries..wind forward at this point, get around and hoist Blue, our light air runner for a pole forward , powered up reach to the Gut. Had some issues with the gas valve that were dealt with, bacon egg and cheese sandwiches with siraucha sauce got us all feeling good about the day's work. Flew to the Gut, VMG 9 plus, TR visible behind us with his giant black kite, but not moving on us as we pushed Blue. Max, the Pogo, with a monster kite ate up distance and we moved down a bit rather than get pushed to the point of kite collapse and waved him on through, and he couldn't make it, boat out of control a bit, so we headed back up and he went down below us, then started coming up, JT at the nav station ducked to the other side of the boat bracing for impact on the starboard side but we got sorted out and flew though the Gut. Blue down, 145 back up as we were on a powered-up reach again, wind steady 14 to 18 for hours, the 3Di like Thor's hammer, strong strong . TR got through and hardened up and went for the beach, we were headed for mark a little south of Stratford,but kept working up into the 260's when we could to stay in touch with him--didn't want to see another miracle finish of us out 5 miles and him walking along the beach to victory. Willie P drove a good three hours on the run from the Gut to the Light and boat was right on the edge. Not getting much out of the main, boat over-powered but flying....J120 who we had passed in the night finally runs us down, work up so he doesn't roll us, takes him about a half hour to get by, then we keep going. Will and I discuss changing to the three, JT sticks his head up and says, keep her powered and rolling boys, the leaders are all right in front of us and we could win this whole damn thing. End of discussion. Push push to Stratford and then, as we know, wind gets lighter, Bee up. We see TR who is now about 2 .25 miles behind us still coming on with his jib as the vespers disappear and we stare at zeroes across the board and a limp kite that appears full but is giving no drive to the boat. We sail current not breeze, still moving in the right direction slowly slowly. TR closer , closer, Get the jib up, something solid for this tiny breeze to attach to, its what he is doing, cocksucker, so get the boat moving again, fighting for every tiny inch of distance as he continues to come on, then breeze back, Bee back up, two idiots on the Pogo and the 120 are right there...and JT will have to give you his epic blow by blow of the battle of the 4 boats in the last five miles...

JT was brilliant driving the last few miles and eking every tiny percentage of a knot of boat speed out of SS as we put ourselves in the best current situation possible, avoiding the eddy along the beach. TR was able to sail up a tiny bit higher than us, and that probably killed him as he went a bit further in, thinking he would have a better powered up angle coming to Matinecock and we nudged just out, 100 yards making all the difference in the world, he and the Pogo and J park and we move around the Point into our own special breeze that takes us to the gun.
I started sailing this stupid race in 1997, a crew member on Black Sheep, the NY 36. The bug for distance racing bit me hard right then. I remember that first night, Paul O and me on the rail, looking at the beach on Fire Island, boat flying along with a jury-rigged spinnaker pole and a big kite up. Crew in a coma later on and me taking us up to Montauk, alone on deck with a sleeping bag wrapped around me and a shark doing circles around the boat. Two on that boat then we did it with my 285 for a few years and had our first taste of the podium. Took it to the next level with this iteration of Shooting Star. We have won our division, second in fleet couple times and last year, we could have won the whole thing....but not really-if we had won last year, it was because Honahlee had been protested and knocked off the podium. This year we won the whole damn thing the right way. We sailed harder and faster and better than every other boat out there. Thank you to my extended Shooting Star crew for helping me make that happen.

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any truth to The rumour That Schock 40 Leverge caught The Gunboat 56 right before The finish line ?

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Thanks John. Race tracker.... gosh no. If they aren't mandatory why would you want the other boats to know what you are up to?

 

What strategies are so important to hide? If it really matters, then you must agree that the current situation is the worst possible; where boats like yours can see the majority of the fleet, but you remain hidden. I enjoy replaying the race when I get home, too bad some of the best boats choose not to play.

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great trip down the river, got to Hell Gate a little early but what the hell, had great current all the way to the start line passed Josh and Miles in the East River on the Mini --god love them --dicked around for a few hours, had some Duffy sandwiches, very tasty, thanks Duff, then got off the line in a good position, clear air, broad reaching, wondering whether we could carry the Bee but powered up with the 3di jib on the outboard lead. Wind was steady 14 to 20, big waves that got bigger and lots of waterline boats were keeping right up with us, Alex on Milky Way, Prevail, an Oceanis 48, two big Baltics....TR was sticking around but we were a bit ahead of him and knew once night fell the world would change. Dacapo meatball and eggplant parm filled our bellies for the work in the dark and we stayed powered up, surfing in the swell, picking off boats in front of us for a few hours. Boat was flying and fun to drive...wind cycled down a bit and we knew 2 a.m. or so things were going to shut down drastically so we wanted to max out what we had. Discussion back and forth....waves flattening....now, later, wait a half hour....JT sticks his head up, concurs, Bee up. Only kite we saw up for awhile and worked our way up then to the front of the fleet, only guys in front of us the Oakcliff 40's, Leverage, Ragana, Gunboat, Navy Farr and 122. Someone will have to remind me about a couple of peels and sail changes but we kept working hard. Kept the beach close, never really went out more than two, three miles, and we saw things getting shifty up to the Point, falling down to a course to the Canary Islands or jibe to the beach....didn't want to let some guy 5 miles out do an end-around but didn't see any significant breeze out there and I felt it better to cover TR and get in a little closer-could always heat up and go back to the Canaries..wind forward at this point, get around and hoist Blue, our light air runner for a pole forward , powered up reach to the Gut. Had some issues with the gas valve that were dealt with, bacon egg and cheese sandwiches with siraucha sauce got us all feeling good about the day's work. Flew to the Gut, VMG 9 plus, TR visible behind us with his giant black kite, but not moving on us as we pushed Blue. Max, the Pogo, with a monster kite ate up distance and we moved down a bit rather than get pushed to the point of kite collapse and waved him on through, and he couldn't make it, boat out of control a bit, so we headed back up and he went down below us, then started coming up, JT at the nav station ducked to the other side of the boat bracing for impact on the starboard side but we got sorted out and flew though the Gut. Blue down, 145 back up as we were on a powered-up reach again, wind steady 14 to 18 for hours, the 3Di like Thor's hammer, strong strong . TR got through and hardened up and went for the beach, we were headed for mark a little south of Stratford,but kept working up into the 260's when we could to stay in touch with him--didn't want to see another miracle finish of us out 5 miles and him walking along the beach to victory. Willie P drove a good three hours on the run from the Gut to the Light and boat was right on the edge. Not getting much out of the main, boat over-powered but flying....J120 who we had passed in the night finally runs us down, work up so he doesn't roll us, takes him about a half hour to get by, then we keep going. Will and I discuss changing to the three, JT sticks his head up and says, keep her powered and rolling boys, the leaders are all right in front of us and we could win this whole damn thing. End of discussion. Push push to Stratford and then, as we know, wind gets lighter, Bee up. We see TR who is now about 2 .25 miles behind us still coming on with his jib as the vespers disappear and we stare at zeroes across the board and a limp kite that appears full but is giving no drive to the boat. We sail current not breeze, still moving in the right direction slowly slowly. TR closer , closer, Get the jib up, something solid for this tiny breeze to attach to, its what he is doing, cocksucker, so get the boat moving again, fighting for every tiny inch of distance as he continues to come on, then breeze back, Bee back up, two idiots on the Pogo and the 120 are right there...and JT will have to give you his epic blow by blow of the battle of the 4 boats in the last five miles...

JT was brilliant driving the last few miles and eking every tiny percentage of a knot of boat speed out of SS as we put ourselves in the best current situation possible, avoiding the eddy along the beach. TR was able to sail up a tiny bit higher than us, and that probably killed him as he went a bit further in, thinking he would have a better powered up angle coming to Matinecock and we nudged just out, 100 yards making all the difference in the world, he and the Pogo and J park and we move around the Point into our own special breeze that takes us to the gun.
I started sailing this stupid race in 1997, a crew member on Black Sheep, the NY 36. The bug for distance racing bit me hard right then. I remember that first night, Paul O and me on the rail, looking at the beach on Fire Island, boat flying along with a jury-rigged spinnaker pole and a big kite up. Crew in a coma later on and me taking us up to Montauk, alone on deck with a sleeping bag wrapped around me and a shark doing circles around the boat. Two on that boat then we did it with my 285 for a few years and had our first taste of the podium. Took it to the next level with this iteration of Shooting Star. We have won our division, second in fleet couple times and last year, we could have won the whole thing....but not really-if we had won last year, it was because Honahlee had been protested and knocked off the podium. This year we won the whole damn thing the right way. We sailed harder and faster and better than every other boat out there. Thank you to my extended Shooting Star crew for helping me make that happen.

Nice write up. Thanks!

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and the fact High Noon or Benj didnt do it this year

You can only sail against the boats that show up Edith. We have corrected out over lots of hot boats with all-pro crews in multiple races with a much higher level of competition than this one. And you know that-back to pruning the roses now girl, have some chamomile tea with your Pimm's Cup and dream of Churchill and his big cigar.

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Hey - thanks a lot for posting this. Really helpful. Good to see that our approach was not far off from the guys that actually know what they are doing. Congrats on a great race.

 

great trip down the river, got to Hell Gate a little early but what the hell, had great current all the way to the start line passed Josh and Miles in the East River on the Mini --god love them --dicked around for a few hours, had some Duffy sandwiches, very tasty, thanks Duff, then got off the line in a good position, clear air, broad reaching, wondering whether we could carry the Bee but powered up with the 3di jib on the outboard lead. Wind was steady 14 to 20, big waves that got bigger and lots of waterline boats were keeping right up with us, Alex on Milky Way, Prevail, an Oceanis 48, two big Baltics....TR was sticking around but we were a bit ahead of him and knew once night fell the world would change. Dacapo meatball and eggplant parm filled our bellies for the work in the dark and we stayed powered up, surfing in the swell, picking off boats in front of us for a few hours. Boat was flying and fun to drive...wind cycled down a bit and we knew 2 a.m. or so things were going to shut down drastically so we wanted to max out what we had. Discussion back and forth....waves flattening....now, later, wait a half hour....JT sticks his head up, concurs, Bee up. Only kite we saw up for awhile and worked our way up then to the front of the fleet, only guys in front of us the Oakcliff 40's, Leverage, Ragana, Gunboat, Navy Farr and 122. Someone will have to remind me about a couple of peels and sail changes but we kept working hard. Kept the beach close, never really went out more than two, three miles, and we saw things getting shifty up to the Point, falling down to a course to the Canary Islands or jibe to the beach....didn't want to let some guy 5 miles out do an end-around but didn't see any significant breeze out there and I felt it better to cover TR and get in a little closer-could always heat up and go back to the Canaries..wind forward at this point, get around and hoist Blue, our light air runner for a pole forward , powered up reach to the Gut. Had some issues with the gas valve that were dealt with, bacon egg and cheese sandwiches with siraucha sauce got us all feeling good about the day's work. Flew to the Gut, VMG 9 plus, TR visible behind us with his giant black kite, but not moving on us as we pushed Blue. Max, the Pogo, with a monster kite ate up distance and we moved down a bit rather than get pushed to the point of kite collapse and waved him on through, and he couldn't make it, boat out of control a bit, so we headed back up and he went down below us, then started coming up, JT at the nav station ducked to the other side of the boat bracing for impact on the starboard side but we got sorted out and flew though the Gut. Blue down, 145 back up as we were on a powered-up reach again, wind steady 14 to 18 for hours, the 3Di like Thor's hammer, strong strong . TR got through and hardened up and went for the beach, we were headed for mark a little south of Stratford,but kept working up into the 260's when we could to stay in touch with him--didn't want to see another miracle finish of us out 5 miles and him walking along the beach to victory. Willie P drove a good three hours on the run from the Gut to the Light and boat was right on the edge. Not getting much out of the main, boat over-powered but flying....J120 who we had passed in the night finally runs us down, work up so he doesn't roll us, takes him about a half hour to get by, then we keep going. Will and I discuss changing to the three, JT sticks his head up and says, keep her powered and rolling boys, the leaders are all right in front of us and we could win this whole damn thing. End of discussion. Push push to Stratford and then, as we know, wind gets lighter, Bee up. We see TR who is now about 2 .25 miles behind us still coming on with his jib as the vespers disappear and we stare at zeroes across the board and a limp kite that appears full but is giving no drive to the boat. We sail current not breeze, still moving in the right direction slowly slowly. TR closer , closer, Get the jib up, something solid for this tiny breeze to attach to, its what he is doing, cocksucker, so get the boat moving again, fighting for every tiny inch of distance as he continues to come on, then breeze back, Bee back up, two idiots on the Pogo and the 120 are right there...and JT will have to give you his epic blow by blow of the battle of the 4 boats in the last five miles...

JT was brilliant driving the last few miles and eking every tiny percentage of a knot of boat speed out of SS as we put ourselves in the best current situation possible, avoiding the eddy along the beach. TR was able to sail up a tiny bit higher than us, and that probably killed him as he went a bit further in, thinking he would have a better powered up angle coming to Matinecock and we nudged just out, 100 yards making all the difference in the world, he and the Pogo and J park and we move around the Point into our own special breeze that takes us to the gun.
I started sailing this stupid race in 1997, a crew member on Black Sheep, the NY 36. The bug for distance racing bit me hard right then. I remember that first night, Paul O and me on the rail, looking at the beach on Fire Island, boat flying along with a jury-rigged spinnaker pole and a big kite up. Crew in a coma later on and me taking us up to Montauk, alone on deck with a sleeping bag wrapped around me and a shark doing circles around the boat. Two on that boat then we did it with my 285 for a few years and had our first taste of the podium. Took it to the next level with this iteration of Shooting Star. We have won our division, second in fleet couple times and last year, we could have won the whole thing....but not really-if we had won last year, it was because Honahlee had been protested and knocked off the podium. This year we won the whole damn thing the right way. We sailed harder and faster and better than every other boat out there. Thank you to my extended Shooting Star crew for helping me make that happen.

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and the fact High Noon or Benj didnt do it this year

Watch it Edith... I know where you live girlfriend.

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Thanks John. Race tracker.... gosh no. If they aren't mandatory why would you want the other boats to know what you are up to?

What strategies are so important to hide? If it really matters, then you must agree that the current situation is the worst possible; where boats like yours can see the majority of the fleet, but you remain hidden. I enjoy replaying the race when I get home, too bad some of the best boats choose not to play.

 

 

I am not so sure I can help you with the first part because of the complexities of racing on LIS. If you don't understand what a complicated patch of water the sound is, there isn't a great deal I could say here that would shed light on that for you. Suffice it to say that somewhat small differences in track can have huge consequences in outcome.

As for the fairness of having a voluntary race tracker for this sort of event. Actually I think it is exactly right. Those that wish to participate so that friends and family can follow them around the island are free to do. Those that choose not to are free to do that too. It is a personal choice dependent on what one's goals are.

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Huh? Not in the least. It isn't something that is available only to you and/or that you solicited.

Outside assistance would be like a private weather report e-mailed to you, or calling a friend and asking, "Hey, where is the breeze out of at Montauk Point?" However, say a friend called you on the boat and said, "Hey man, what's up? The breeze here is out of the south 10-12." That is not outside assistance as you did not solicit the information even though it was only available to you.

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To limit the tactical advantages by watching your competition. Basically it is that or outlaw tinfoil.

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So it's ok to watch the competition but not allow others to see you. Sounds nice and Corinthian

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It was voluntary to participate in using the tracker app. You seem to have a problem fathoming that. Some boats had multiple phones with the app, others had none. Some turned them off or had their batteries die.

Curiously I noted that boats with multiple trackers going seemed to not accurately record their positions. While you would expect that if you had 3 phones going using the app, that you would have 3 tracks all one atop the other. Wasn't the case. So I am not so sure how valid the data is in any event.

 

Now to be clear I personally looked at it only 3-4 times and only once the skipper of the boat even brought it up on the laptop. Once when we were maybe 10 miles from Montauk to see who was around. Second time was to see how far ahead the leaders were when past Hortons. Once just to laugh about trackers being in cars or houses. Certainly didn't write down position info or anything like that.

 

Anyhow, I fail to see your point nor understand why you think it not nice nor un-Corinthian. A lot of boats now-a-days also broadcast AIS info. Our plotter program happens to display same. Is that also not nice and un-Corinthian? So you think we should not use that function of our plotter software in the off chance a competitor is broadcasting their speed and heading?

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However, say a friend called you on the boat and said, "Hey man, what's up? The breeze here is out of the south 10-12." That is not outside assistance as you did not solicit the information even though it was only available to you.

Wrong! I am ashamed of you, you incorrigible young man! Would you consider a friend calling you on a yacht race to give you wind conditions a 'disinterested source'?

 

If he said 'hey what are you doing Saturday?' Or

' I'm here with your wife' that would be allowable communication. But only on a Pacific Atoll or a Moose Hall would voluntarily blurting out wind conditions to a participant in a yacht race be considered disinterested information!

 

My heavens!

 

RRS 41(d)

 

My late husband Edgar wrote that one.

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Weegie had the best corrected time. How come he didn't win the overall?

That's ridiculous.

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double handed boats are usually not eligible , they can use autopilot.

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double handed boats are usually not eligible , they can use autopilot.

 

SI's say best PHRF corrected time. Doesn't say anything about excluding double handed. Weegie had the best time by about an hour. Pretty impressive for a double handed boat.

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or lucky with the light air weight thingie?

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or lucky with the light air weight thingie?

 

Lucky or not...they still won by an hour.

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SCORING AND PRIZES

The AROUND LONG ISLAND REGATTA TROPHY shall be awarded to the boat with the best corrected time in the PHRF

fleet (time on distance).


Wasn't Weegie the best corrected time in the PHRF division? I don't see anything in the above that excludes any boats.

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They are in the DOUBLE HANDED fleet! separate from PHRF.

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Look at the results page. There are 10 PHRF Fleets. 3 PHRF Non Spin, 5 PHRF Spin and 2 PHRF Double Handed. Then there are also IRC Fleets and Multihull Fleets.

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They are in the DOUBLE HANDED fleet! separate from PHRF.

no dogg in thiss fiite, our they ussing PHRF rattings to scorre the ZDoubel Hended fleete?

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I don't care at all, just like to get Foote upset.

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I don't care at all, just like to get Foote upset.

 

 

I am beyond UPSET!

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RC's use whatever system is in place, IRC , PHRF whatever to come up with some basis of comparison between boats in a double-handed fleet. But to take those ratings and use them as a basis against the regular fleet doesn't work-someone pointed out the use of auto-helm and there is the obvious difference between weights on a fully-crewed boat as opposed to a double-handed boat. I am sure that Columbia was loving life when the breeze was cycling down in the Sound. The YRALIS Handicap committee is wrestling with this now and I don't really know what the answer is for coming up with a valid number that works. I have double-handed Shooting Star and it is a different boat with two guys on it. Lighter breeze, give me 3 to 400 pounds of smart crew anyday...

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There is no easy way to address this with handicap. If there had been strong winds and a lot of upwind sailing, the double handed boats would have been at a big disadvantage. This is in line with all the typical shortcomings of any handicap rule. I'm not sure how it makes sense to burden the handicap committee with this issue. I say just let each RC decide how they want to handle it for their race. We can then choose to participate, or not.

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Agree, tough job to quantify. Npt. Bda separates DH division as its own entity as does Vineyard etc. DH-ORT is different than the NORT or the NELS awards from Stamford.

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This thread jumped the shark when you all started taking this race and it's OA seriously.

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RC's use whatever system is in place, IRC , PHRF whatever to come up with some basis of comparison between boats in a double-handed fleet. But to take those ratings and use them as a basis against the regular fleet doesn't work-someone pointed out the use of auto-helm and there is the obvious difference between weights on a fully-crewed boat as opposed to a double-handed boat. I am sure that Columbia was loving life when the breeze was cycling down in the Sound. The YRALIS Handicap committee is wrestling with this now and I don't really know what the answer is for coming up with a valid number that works. I have double-handed Shooting Star and it is a different boat with two guys on it. Lighter breeze, give me 3 to 400 pounds of smart crew anyday...

The ratings in the double handed fleet are no different than in the fully crewed fleet. They are standard PHRF Ratings. This isn't a handicap issue. Its a NOR and SI issue. The Notice of Race (usually written by the organizing authority) and the Sailing Instructions (usually written by the race committee) both say the same thing. They say the ALIR Trophy will be awarded to the boat with the best corrected time in the PHRF Fleet. This boat was sailing with a standard PHRF rating in the PHRF double handed fleet.

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I know some antlered types that would agree with IP

 

Talk American

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I know some antlered types that would agree with IP

Talk American

 

 

Hese sayeng theire is smaelle of Moosheade in the aire.

 

 

Mr. Snaggletooh,

If you refer to me in the masculine once more, I shall be forced to slap you with my open hand.

Fair warning.

E.B.

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I know some antlered types that would agree with IP

 

Maybe it depends on what the definition of 'is' is?

Or some local Sea Cliff dialect? You people have destroyed my language!

 

All PHRF boats are eligible for the tropphy

Weegie is a PHRF boat

Weegie used a standard rating under her rules

Weegie had the best time.

 

What is there to argue about?

The weather the day of the race? That's irrelevant.

 

All fun to discuss for next year. But under the rules stated this year, Weegie won the trophy.

It's simple.

 

Oh how I love that name 'Weegie'! I giggle liek a school girl everytime I say it!

 

E.B.

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same thing happened couple years back at the Edlu-big trophy went to the phrf spin fleet boat, not the DH

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Personally I think it is clear that Edith Bicknell would be the perfect girl for someone like Guy LaDouche. Although I strongly suspect that our old friend Moondance would take issue with that. After all, my guess is that he has a very strong attraction to old Edith.

 

As for the awarding of the ALIR trophy. Long before the addition of a DH division to the ALIR the trophy has been awarded to boats fully crewed. That was and is the intent. To argue that a DH boat should be eligible for more than what is specified for those racing DH would be like saying DH boats should also be eligible for The Windigo as well as The Ed DuMoulin. That said, I do agree that the SI's really need to be written more succinctly.

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