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    • UnderDawg

      A Few Simple Rules   05/22/2017

      Sailing Anarchy is a very lightly moderated site. This is by design, to afford a more free atmosphere for discussion. There are plenty of sailing forums you can go to where swearing isn't allowed, confrontation is squelched and, and you can have a moderator finger-wag at you for your attitude. SA tries to avoid that and allow for more adult behavior without moderators editing your posts and whacking knuckles with rulers. We don't have a long list of published "thou shalt nots" either, and this is by design. Too many absolute rules paints us into too many corners. So check the Terms of Service - there IS language there about certain types of behavior that is not permitted. We interpret that lightly and permit a lot of latitude, but we DO reserve the right to take action when something is too extreme to tolerate (too racist, graphic, violent, misogynistic, etc.). Yes, that is subjective, but it allows us discretion. Avoiding a laundry list of rules allows for freedom; don't abuse it. However there ARE a few basic rules that will earn you a suspension, and apparently a brief refresher is in order. 1) Allegations of pedophilia - there is no tolerance for this. So if you make allegations, jokes, innuendo or suggestions about child molestation, child pornography, abuse or inappropriate behavior with minors etc. about someone on this board you will get a time out. This is pretty much automatic; this behavior can have real world effect and is not acceptable. Obviously the subject is not banned when discussion of it is apropos, e.g. talking about an item in the news for instance. But allegations or references directed at or about another poster is verboten. 2) Outing people - providing real world identifiable information about users on the forums who prefer to remain anonymous. Yes, some of us post with our real names - not a problem to use them. However many do NOT, and if you find out someone's name keep it to yourself, first or last. This also goes for other identifying information too - employer information etc. You don't need too many pieces of data to figure out who someone really is these days. Depending on severity you might get anything from a scolding to a suspension - so don't do it. I know it can be confusing sometimes for newcomers, as SA has been around almost twenty years and there are some people that throw their real names around and their current Display Name may not match the name they have out in the public. But if in doubt, you don't want to accidentally out some one so use caution, even if it's a personal friend of yours in real life. 3) Posting While Suspended - If you've earned a timeout (these are fairly rare and hard to get), please observe the suspension. If you create a new account (a "Sock Puppet") and return to the forums to post with it before your suspension is up you WILL get more time added to your original suspension and lose your Socks. This behavior may result a permanent ban, since it shows you have zero respect for the few rules we have and the moderating team that is tasked with supporting them. Check the Terms of Service you agreed to; they apply to the individual agreeing, not the account you created, so don't try to Sea Lawyer us if you get caught. Just don't do it. Those are the three that will almost certainly get you into some trouble. IF YOU SEE SOMEONE DO ONE OF THESE THINGS, please do the following: Refrain from quoting the offending text, it makes the thread cleanup a pain in the rear Press the Report button; it is by far the best way to notify Admins as we will get e-mails. Calling out for Admins in the middle of threads, sending us PM's, etc. - there is no guarantee we will get those in a timely fashion. There are multiple Moderators in multiple time zones around the world, and anyone one of us can handle the Report and all of us will be notified about it. But if you PM one Mod directly and he's off line, the problem will get dealt with much more slowly. Other behaviors that you might want to think twice before doing include: Intentionally disrupting threads and discussions repeatedly. Off topic/content free trolling in threads to disrupt dialog Stalking users around the forums with the intent to disrupt content and discussion Repeated posting of overly graphic or scatological porn content. There are plenty web sites for you to get your freak on, don't do it here. And a brief note to Newbies... No, we will not ban people or censor them for dropping F-bombs on you, using foul language, etc. so please don't report it when one of our members gives you a greeting you may find shocking. We do our best not to censor content here and playing swearword police is not in our job descriptions. Sailing Anarchy is more like a bar than a classroom, so handle it like you would meeting someone a little coarse - don't look for the teacher. Thanks.

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MR.CLEAN

OPEN SOURCE - The Changing Face Of Sponsorship And The Future Of IMOCA

23 posts in this topic

MEDIA ALERT

 

As the world's economic climate continues to cool, sponsorship money and partnership support for every level of sailing is becoming tougher and tougher to find. Even proven performers like Dee Caffari, Brian Thompson, Franck Cammas, and Roland Jourdain are having serious trouble in the 'brave new world' of professionally sponsored racing, and it seems like very few people have a handle on what it takes - and will take - in the constantly and rapidly evolving world of marketing, branding, and sponsorship.

 

We grabbed an extremely qualified group of experts to discuss it all with you - live - in our first On-The-Water Anarchy 'Cocktail Hour' in a long time! With the help of our production team of Ronnie Simpson, Emma Creighton, and Christophe Launay, I'll be hosting an hour of in-depth discussion on the subject with this panel of stars.

 

Live at 1900 CET/1800 GMT/1300 EST/1000 PST (1:00 PM Eastern)

 

Host:

Alan Block, Senior Editor, Sailing Anarchy

 

Guests:

Luc Talbourdet, President IMOCA

Xavier David, Team Manager Saveol/Sam Davies

Dee Caffari, Sole Female Triple Circumnavigator

Bruce Schwab, First US Vendee Competitor in History

Stew Hosford, Team Director Alex Thomson Racing/Hugo Boss

 

Camera:

Christophe Launay

 

Research:

Emma Creighton

 

Production:

Ronnie Simpson

 

Hope you check it out! If not, it will be available online later tonight.

 

 

Hard link: http://justin.tv/onthewateranarchy

 

Embedded screen below.

 

 

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Good job Clean, really looking forward to hearing what they all have to say. Try to pin down Dee on where she may be with the SCA VOR team. Is Jourdain around? it would be cool to get an update on where he is in terms of financing and the future of his team.

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OD is sure as fuck not the answer...

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Good job Clean, really looking forward to hearing what they all have to say. Try to pin down Dee on where she may be with the SCA VOR team. Is Jourdain around? it would be cool to get an update on where he is in terms of financing and the future of his team.

 

had a chat with her last night. will try to hit her up on some info.

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Even proven performers like Dee Caffari, Brian Thompson, Franck Cammas, and Roland Jourdain are having serious trouble in the 'brave new world' of professionally sponsored racing

 

and michel desjoyeaux!

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Camera:

Christophe Launay

 

 

Oh no! don't do that!!! how can that be an SA production if the camera is not shaky, moving around and zooming abruptly, with inaudible dialogues?!!

:huh::ph34r::P

 

C.

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Even proven performers like Dee Caffari, Brian Thompson, Franck Cammas, and Roland Jourdain are having serious trouble in the 'brave new world' of professionally sponsored racing

 

and michel desjoyeaux!

 

Dee Caff, one off, Brian Thompson, great sailor, not enough desk skills or part of the incrowd to get a sponsor,.

On the other hand, Frank Cammas and MichDes know the skills to get a sponsor, not sure of Jourdain.

 

Even big names as Yves Parlier calculated it as a two year deskjob to get a sponsor. And that was in the good times.

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After spending some hours on the PC then reverting to the ipad and paying for the justin tv app (didn't work) I finally found this link http://justin.tv/onthewateranarchy/b/338573420 that streamed the interview.

 

Fantastic hour of insight, thank you...scariest thing is simply how far behind we are as compared to the mainstream sports but I guess that means there is great opportunity for those trying to get campaigns together for world ocean races.

 

It pretty clear the partnership starts as a three way with sailor, event and class working together to create a total package and if that strucuture is not in place or available for competitors to plug into then the task is almost impossible.

 

My interest is the next class40 GOR, us amatuers are going to need assistance from the race organisors and the class40 assoc to put togther a coherent story for sponsors. we have a similar opportunity to the IMOCA guys in that there are mulitple events that can be done with a boat and there is a potential for significant size fleets but we need a structure to plug into

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Posted · Hidden by MR.CLEAN, November 9, 2012 - No reason given

Lemme know if this works.

 

<iframe src="http://new.livestream.com/accounts/2607/events/1663377/videos/5911136/player?autoPlay=false&height=310&mute=false&width=550" width="550" height="310" frameborder="0" scrolling="no"></iframe>

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Even proven performers like Dee Caffari, Brian Thompson, Franck Cammas, and Roland Jourdain are having serious trouble in the 'brave new world' of professionally sponsored racing

 

and michel desjoyeaux!

 

Dee Caff, one off, Brian Thompson, great sailor, not enough desk skills or part of the incrowd to get a sponsor,.

On the other hand, Frank Cammas and MichDes know the skills to get a sponsor, not sure of Jourdain.

 

Even big names as Yves Parlier calculated it as a two year deskjob to get a sponsor. And that was in the good times.

Could not agree more, put AT in the latter category too? Longest record in IMOCA history

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Very useful stuff, Dee comes across very well.

Could everone have seats the same height next time though?

Go SA, great stuff coming through here!

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Who the fuck is Andrew from HB? God that campaign is so much like Artemis. And Clean thinks the prick will win?

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Who the fuck is Andrew from HB? God that campaign is so much like Artemis. And Clean thinks the prick will win?

There is nobody at HB called ANdrew, what are you talking about?

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Sorry Stewart. My attitude does not change. Perhaps I missed it but what was the golden bullet on Vendee and international sponsorship from STEWART

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IMO if they go one design it will still be a very cool race but it will be that crazy French race and not as worldwide as it could/should be. the solo racing sphere in Europe already has a one design series (the Figaro) and that is cool for what it is and a controlled cost class (class 40) so why do they feel the need to restrict cost/development of the once open class, and more importantly are they going about it the right way?

I believe that by restricting the rule the way they have and might continue to do might backfire on them in that new boats will have to be even more refined as opposed to someone coming out with a winning concept, restricting sail numbers also does this as you end up spending more on R&D on the 10? that can now be carried to make sure u cover the wind range, as opposed to restricting the number that can be made in a season that could allow older sails that don't get used as often be carried. By limiting righting moment to 32tonne-meters? and mast height since Pindar and Artemis were launched has really put strain on designers to take weight out of the boats, as opposed to letting natural selection take its course and skippers choose a trade-off between a boat that is harder/more punishing to sail against potential top speed in the past they have also banned canting rigs which under the rules (rightly I think) had to be canted by hand also sapping more energy out of the sailor. the fact the changes affecting these issues were implemented before these concepts were really proved or in the case of the canting mast disproved is kind of worrying to me, what if someone comes up with something that hasn't been thought of yet and builds it but is then banned from using it by IMOCA like Sobedo's canting mast was, that would be a worry for a new build would it not?

IMO the are three (should be four) major worldwide sailing events, the America's cup, the Vendee Globe and the Volvo Ocean Race (the potential fourth should be The Race) and these all have appropriate motor racing parallels (the AC=F1, VG=Dakar rally, VOR=WRC and The Race=Le Mans). However unlike motorsport the sponsorship dollars aren’t available on the same level so the events even though they are different disciplines should always be deconflicted with one another rather than fighting against each other. I also think that they should be run on a four year cycle as a three year cycle has proven hard for new teams to get to a competitive level & iron out any kinks in time and in the case of the VOR very expensive to keep a team together without any interim events such as the IMOCA fleet has

Just my two cents

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Thought this was an interesting view: http://www.yachtspon...illing-sailing/

 

The Volvo Ocean Race recently released a 133 page report into the previous edition. Much of that report was dedicated to the return on investment received by sponsors of the race. One of the findings of the report was that sponsors of sailing can get better returns than other sports because the brand-name is mentioned more than the names of the athletes.

 

The report says:

“The Volvo Ocean Race occupies an exceptional space in the sporting world as a major property that is universally referred to with a brand name in the title, while offering similar opportunities for sponsors backing individual teams. The fact that sailors on board are not generally household names across the world can actually help sponsors too. There is little option for media covering the race but to refer to several brand names whereas in other sport, news organisations work hard to avoid making such references. With the Volvo Ocean Race, such avoidance is not realistically possible.”

 

While this sounds good for sponsors, it doesn’t sound like something that is good for the sport in the long term, especially if sailing wants to create long term fans. Fans follow athletes or teams, they don’t follow brands, which makes the situation that the Volvo Ocean Race is currently in a bit strange. Race organisers have announced the first entry for the next race. The entry has a sponsor, but it has no skipper and no team – so where are the fans going to come from? The team is designated as an all female entry. The thought process presumably is that women will follow the team because of that fact only. But what happens when the sponsor doesn’t want to be in sailing anymore? What happens to the team and what happens to the fans of that team?

 

The Vendee Globe, which has the advantage of featuring just one person per boat, also suffers sometimes as the PR people stuff their releases with the sponsor’s name. But fans of Mike Golding or Sam Davies can continue to follow their favourite even if they are wearing a different company’s logo from the last time. Other teams, that benefit from the patronage of a wealthy private owner or investor can also create long term franchises, though these have the same problem of longevity if that backer decides they don’t want to play anymore.

 

Ironically, the sport of sailing has the structure to create location based teams that have long histories and traditions. The America’s Cup is based on this structure, being a competition between yacht clubs – though this is often underplayed. The sport of sailing relies on sponsorship because the business model doesn't provide many other forms of revenue, however – the balance of athlete recognition and sponsor brand recognition is needs to swing in favour of the competitors if long term fans are to be created.

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With all these references to the volvo, formula one and the tour de France, I am a bit worried that the VG might go down the pan like the Tour de France did.

 

If the financial stakes become too high, it will attract the wrong kind of people. Do we really want to witness a "Lance Amstrong" character appearing? I understand that the skippers need to make a living and that they are worried now but with the current set up, it is a real partnership between a skipper and a company and they agree on a communication plan. If they go down the route of the tour de France, it just becomes sponsors employing sportsmen to "perform" and this is when the temptation to cheat becomes hard to resist and it isn't sport anymore but just "entertainment".

 

You can't compare the VG with the VO, the volvo entries were going consistently down however the economy was doing, in the 90s the entries in the route du rhum went down with the crisis but then went up again, so although it is a good idea to tweak things for the best, they shouldn't overreact and throw the baby out with the bathwater. The VG exists now because Jeantot initially had a sound vision and knee jerk reactions could kill it. IMHO they should aim to raise their game on the event communication front to 2012 standards - the VG started when everybody was watching the 8oclock news in France, I still remember switching the TV on everyday to get what was going on - and let the rest as it is.

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