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    • UnderDawg

      A Few Simple Rules   05/22/2017

      Sailing Anarchy is a very lightly moderated site. This is by design, to afford a more free atmosphere for discussion. There are plenty of sailing forums you can go to where swearing isn't allowed, confrontation is squelched and, and you can have a moderator finger-wag at you for your attitude. SA tries to avoid that and allow for more adult behavior without moderators editing your posts and whacking knuckles with rulers. We don't have a long list of published "thou shalt nots" either, and this is by design. Too many absolute rules paints us into too many corners. So check the Terms of Service - there IS language there about certain types of behavior that is not permitted. We interpret that lightly and permit a lot of latitude, but we DO reserve the right to take action when something is too extreme to tolerate (too racist, graphic, violent, misogynistic, etc.). Yes, that is subjective, but it allows us discretion. Avoiding a laundry list of rules allows for freedom; don't abuse it. However there ARE a few basic rules that will earn you a suspension, and apparently a brief refresher is in order. 1) Allegations of pedophilia - there is no tolerance for this. So if you make allegations, jokes, innuendo or suggestions about child molestation, child pornography, abuse or inappropriate behavior with minors etc. about someone on this board you will get a time out. This is pretty much automatic; this behavior can have real world effect and is not acceptable. Obviously the subject is not banned when discussion of it is apropos, e.g. talking about an item in the news for instance. But allegations or references directed at or about another poster is verboten. 2) Outing people - providing real world identifiable information about users on the forums who prefer to remain anonymous. Yes, some of us post with our real names - not a problem to use them. However many do NOT, and if you find out someone's name keep it to yourself, first or last. This also goes for other identifying information too - employer information etc. You don't need too many pieces of data to figure out who someone really is these days. Depending on severity you might get anything from a scolding to a suspension - so don't do it. I know it can be confusing sometimes for newcomers, as SA has been around almost twenty years and there are some people that throw their real names around and their current Display Name may not match the name they have out in the public. But if in doubt, you don't want to accidentally out some one so use caution, even if it's a personal friend of yours in real life. 3) Posting While Suspended - If you've earned a timeout (these are fairly rare and hard to get), please observe the suspension. If you create a new account (a "Sock Puppet") and return to the forums to post with it before your suspension is up you WILL get more time added to your original suspension and lose your Socks. This behavior may result a permanent ban, since it shows you have zero respect for the few rules we have and the moderating team that is tasked with supporting them. Check the Terms of Service you agreed to; they apply to the individual agreeing, not the account you created, so don't try to Sea Lawyer us if you get caught. Just don't do it. Those are the three that will almost certainly get you into some trouble. IF YOU SEE SOMEONE DO ONE OF THESE THINGS, please do the following: Refrain from quoting the offending text, it makes the thread cleanup a pain in the rear Press the Report button; it is by far the best way to notify Admins as we will get e-mails. Calling out for Admins in the middle of threads, sending us PM's, etc. - there is no guarantee we will get those in a timely fashion. There are multiple Moderators in multiple time zones around the world, and anyone one of us can handle the Report and all of us will be notified about it. But if you PM one Mod directly and he's off line, the problem will get dealt with much more slowly. Other behaviors that you might want to think twice before doing include: Intentionally disrupting threads and discussions repeatedly. Off topic/content free trolling in threads to disrupt dialog Stalking users around the forums with the intent to disrupt content and discussion Repeated posting of overly graphic or scatological porn content. There are plenty web sites for you to get your freak on, don't do it here. And a brief note to Newbies... No, we will not ban people or censor them for dropping F-bombs on you, using foul language, etc. so please don't report it when one of our members gives you a greeting you may find shocking. We do our best not to censor content here and playing swearword police is not in our job descriptions. Sailing Anarchy is more like a bar than a classroom, so handle it like you would meeting someone a little coarse - don't look for the teacher. Thanks.

Archived

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Robert B

I want to break the concrete among designers ... Do I go in the right

126 posts in this topic

Look,

I'm trying to break into the market of designers with new design?

I tried to keep the tradition and even go back to what is good and already forgotten.

What do you think? What do you think of my boat BRJ 35?

Is the high side can be pretty? That will prove practical in the course of the discussion ...

 

Robert Bednarczyk (BRJ-DESIGN) www.brj-design.com

cache_2428198606.jpg?t=1350296391

 

thumb_2429062626.jpg?t=1352198748thumb_2429062630.jpg?t=1352198749thumb_2429062638.jpg?t=1352198749

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Interesting... Novel?

 

Those chains for the shrouds are going to make life interesting for your neighbours when lying alongside. And I can't imagine they'll look pretty in a seaway. Getting ashore to tie up in a marina is also going to be interesting with all that tumblehome and the high freeboard. I suppose you can step down onto the platform for the windows and then the chains.

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Don't give up your day job.

Dointe be meane! Butte seriesly... I thick the bigge holle in backe wille lette allotte of water in. :)/>

Snagy got neuw sox?

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Don't give up your day job.

Dointe be meane! Butte seriesly... I thick the bigge holle in backe wille lette allotte of water in. :)/>

 

Channeling your inner-Snaggy?

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back on topic....that's is one fuckin ugly ass boat

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Look,

I'm trying to break into the market of designers with new design?

I tried to keep the tradition and even go back to what is good and already forgotten.

What do you think? What do you think of my boat BRJ 35?

Is the high side can be pretty? That will prove practical in the course of the discussion ...

 

Robert Bednarczyk (BRJ-DESIGN) www.brj-design.com

cache_2428198606.jpg?t=1350296391

 

thumb_2429062626.jpg?t=1352198748thumb_2429062630.jpg?t=1352198749thumb_2429062638.jpg?t=1352198749

 

That's the worst thing I've ever seen. Something like this can only come from the brilliant mind of a Polish "naval architect." Does it come with a screen door on the bottom?

 

Seriously though, you know where this would fit in well? At the bottom of the ocean. It would be a perfect wreck dive, lots of areas for fish and other creatures to hide out and swim through.

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1. Legal Have I paid my public & product liability insurance

2. Design Have I paid my public & product liability insurance

3. Engineering Have I paid my public & product liability insurance

4. Build Have I paid my public & product liability insurance

5. VPP Have I paid my public & product liability insurance

5. Warranty Have I paid my public & product liability insurance

 

software is cheap. business is tough.

 

btw - please change the colour....orange is reserved for cool boats

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Don't give up your day job.

Dointe be meane! Butte seriesly... I thick the bigge holle in backe wille lette allotte of water in. :)/>

 

Channeling your inner-Snaggy?

 

busted!

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As an engineer, I can say that design is based on requirements.

 

Please tell us what the requirements were for the design of this boat, then we can evaluate the effectiveness of the design in meeting those requirements.

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No designer starts out saying "I'm going to copy everyone else." Every designer starts out thinking, I need to improve on what is out there, make something different that the market will like.

 

And you're so different, why? Sounds like a repeat of everyone else to me.

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I know that it is in compliance with the requirements. Is examined by the Authority certification in Poland. Category will receive a "B"

 

I would like to know if you like it .... Do you see in the future ...

Do I have to build it, I can show and be sure that the sales? Should I wait for the owner and then build the yacht?

 

Robert

http://www.brj-design.com/jacht-brj-35/

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I want to do exceptional yachts ... for exceptional people ... I'm an architect ... University architecture can wash your brain ... I do not want to fight an inch of the superstructure. It seems to me that if I do not do the revolution and still is enormous possibilities ....

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But my mind still a revolution ...Ernesto Guevara... of yacht design ;-))))))))))))

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Your boat is sort of weird looking. But that's ok. The boat that got me started ws weird looking too. But I liked it and in time others came to appreciate my ideas. You will have to sell this design to someone and convince them to build it. If you can't do that then that will be the world telling you that the idea is too radical or maybe just not a good design. Maybe both. When you design a boat you are hanging your entire ego out there for people to judge. As Gary Mull once put it, "You might as well run naked through the dining room at the yacht club." Or something close to that. As soimeone already said here, don't quit your day job. You have a long way to go. Thanks for showing us your work. That takes guts.

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wow 4.7t and this much sail area? by the time its loaded it will be 6. whats the draft? from carbon / foam it would be a 800k build.

 

pretty pictures - must be a nice dream. good luck with this.

 

done any vpp?

 

Yacht BRJ 35

Technical specifications for the basic version:

Length of hull: 10.5m

Beam: 3.31m

Displacement: 4.70 t

sail area

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Maybe this guy is way off the pace... Maybe he is onto something we have not yet put effort into..

 

Either way give the guy credit for trying.. Pedantic comments are harsh. Constructive criticism is the way to go.

 

Maybe its the renderings, but i do see a hull form that supports soft, but fast (relative to cruising boats) comfortable sailing... The topsides/cabin profile remind me of a Mac 26.. please please delete these.

 

Drop the 1800 style addon's and square the topsides out in the upper half to maximize interior headroom. Probably less cost.

Soften the sheer curve and get the rendering a bit more high tech..

 

Unfortunately if you wanted a real constructive discussion SA is not the place. too many arm chair critiques.

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gawd this place is gettin soft...

 

Robert B....

Fuck off Newb.. but before you do, please include some photographs of your ex girlfriends tits along with her current girlfriends tits. Together would be best... If your mom has a nice rack, include those too.. These will be judged more harshly than your boat design so only include the very best photographs.

 

Now that we got that outa the way. I sorta agree with Mr Perry. It is a weird looking boat. It reminds me of a Beneteau S42 mated with a ranger 37 and cross bred again with a Mac 26.. the only thing missing is a yamaha 250 hanging off the back.

 

The color scheme doesn't work for me either.

 

Try try again

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Bump:

Good on ya. I need some tits today.

Come to think of it, I need tits everyday. Maybe not "need" buit certainly "enjoy".

 

Robert:

Don't let anyone tell you that you can't be a yacht designer. If I had listened to those guys I would be cutting meat simewhere now. Maybe even worse. I could be designing houses.

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the catamaran looks a bit better.

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But my mind still a revolution ...Ernesto Guevara... of yacht design ;-))))))))))))

 

You'll end up dying young and but you'll get your face on a T shirt.

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DSC00573.jpg

 

Just find guys that own these, and your market research is complete!

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I agree with the Mac26 like resemblance - and we know a lot of those sell.

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Maybe even worse. I could be designing houses.

 

bob%27s%20house-thumb-400x534-379.jpg

 

That coud be scarry!! :)

 

Please reduce the Verandah area and give a single bloke a better Stabin' Cabin.

 

Also stove and a floor rug.. WTF....... Who invests in those useless things.. If her knees don't like the hard floor or she doesn't bring take away................

 

Anyway.. back to the boat...

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MSA:

Well, that's fine but I didn't design it for you. Note the title block " a house for Bob".

 

Let's not hijack this thread. This thread is about Robert's quest for a place in the world of yacht design.

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To me it looks like a triumph of design over practical usefulness.

 

First thing I noticed was the weird stays. Is it a rotating mast? Good for sailing efficiency at the expense of higher maintenance and maybe reliability issues.

 

Then I thought, "What happens when I set my beer on the side deck?" Answer: It rolls off the back of the boat. :(

 

I think the side windows accent the hogged shear, but maybe that's a design element you want. If the window shape were changed a bit it wouldn't look like the boat is trying to take a nose dive to the bottom of the ocean. In this sketch, the window stops just forward of the mast and a painted stripe carries the shape forward.

 

I also got rid of the bow sprit in favor of a more conventional bow shape -- drier boat, some reserve buoyancy, no spar to poke at boats and people or crawl out on for simple maintenance.

brj35_mod.png

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But my mind still a revolution ...Ernesto Guevara... of yacht design ;-))))))))))))

 

Revolutions tend to weed out the fat cat capitalists who can afford to build yachts. Be careful what you wish for, Che. As a "Che Guevara yacht designer," you could end up building houses to Bob's designs and not designing anything yourself. Unless you have the money to build and sail on spec, of course. But then that would run counter to the revolution, wouldn't it.

 

One of the first things an aspiring designer has to decide is whether he's going to design boats for himself or boats for customers. Think about it.

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But my mind still a revolution ...Ernesto Guevara... of yacht design ;-))))))))))))

 

As I have said before: They're pretty boat if you are looking "out" the windows. Then you have arrived as a powerboat designer. Try Sea Ray or Fexas.

 

I know aesthetics are a matter of opinion but as my Dad you say: "That boat looks like it's a dog fucking a football".

 

And sales? :lol:/> :lol:/> :lol:/> . It's hard enough for me to look at most Bunters with out getting queasy and you want to put this in production as one hit wonder? As BnG says: Don't quit your day job. And stay away from the brown acid!

 

Try "concept boats" like the Mega 30 from a very known builder that couldn't make it work and you want to produce your "concept" only? Let us know how you make out okay?

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Sailors may go for something unusual if the novel features give some clear benefit. For an example, see the thread on Gunfleet (Cruising Anarchy). If there is no benefit, sailors will go for the traditional. I can't tell from the pictures if your design is different for some functional reason, or just to set yourself apart from the fleet.

 

I think getting the first boat built is the hardest step for an aspiring designer. There are all sorts of strategies. Some get Daddy to pay for it (Olin Stephens), others build it themselves. I suspect that most work for a while with established designers. There are so many things to be worked out that doing it all from first principles would take forever. (Back in the old days, a designer could leave it vague and trust to the builder. Not so much anymore.)

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from time to time ... A shipyard really want to build it .... then everything fades ... I do not have a rich daddy .... I do not throw my work ... But I will build the yacht ....

:-)

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They laughed at Frank Lloyd Wright, they laughed at the first fiberglass boats, they laughed at the Ultra lights, they laughed at the winged sails. Like everything there are some that don't like any type of change.. And that's all they do laugh at anything that is out of the extrodinary. There are most designers that have there designs built. And then some were put on paper and didn't go any further. With the designs that you have time will tell. Ohhh. And they laughed at Lech Walesa.. If you want to see a famou,s wierd design. Look at the CCN building in Beijing, China.. That was built..then look at your ideas. Is it any different? And never stop at No.

from the pictures, it has plenty of room down below. Will it sail? Will it sell ? Sometimes one needs to be made to shut the naysayers up. Or show you your mistakes. Good luck.

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back on topic....that's is one fuckin ugly ass boat

A cross between a Spanish Gallion and a turd.

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Bump:

Good on ya. I need some tits today.

Come to think of it, I need tits everyday. Maybe not "need" buit certainly "enjoy".

 

Robert:

Don't let anyone tell you that you can't be a yacht designer. If I had listened to those guys I would be cutting meat simewhere now. Maybe even worse. I could be designing houses.

They would be well appointed houses with great kitchens and a good turn of speed.

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I think you misunderstood me when I discussed 'requirements'.

 

Is that a racing boat or a cruiser?

 

Is it meant to be single-handed or sailed with a large crew?

 

Is it for protected waters or off-shore?

 

Extended cruising or short cruises?

 

Is it meant to be suitable for sailing with children?

 

Do you want to set speed records?

 

Will it be a stable, easy-to-sail entry level boat for a beginner or a high-performance boat for an experienced sailor?

 

Tell us the purpose of the boat, who you think will buy it, where it will be sailed and how it will be used.

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Look,

I'm trying to break into the market of designers with new design?

I tried to keep the tradition and even go back to what is good and already forgotten.

What do you think? What do you think of my boat BRJ 35?

Is the high side can be pretty? That will prove practical in the course of the discussion ...

 

Robert Bednarczyk (BRJ-DESIGN) www.brj-design.com

cache_2428198606.jpg?t=1350296391

 

thumb_2429062626.jpg?t=1352198748thumb_2429062630.jpg?t=1352198749thumb_2429062638.jpg?t=1352198749

 

That's the worst thing I've ever seen. Something like this can only come from the brilliant mind of a Polish "naval architect." Does it come with a screen door on the bottom?

 

Seriously though, you know where this would fit in well? At the bottom of the ocean. It would be a perfect wreck dive, lots of areas for fish and other creatures to hide out and swim through.

 

No shit. Perhaps the concrete he talks about preventing him from becoming a yacht designer is there for a reason.

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Something tells me I'm glad it's not 1973 and I have just posted the lines of the Valiant 40 on Sailing Anarchy.

But I was 28 years old. I think I could have taken any shit you guys threw at me.

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What's it rate?

 

Derision?....

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Something tells me I'm glad it's not 1973 and I have just posted the lines of the Valiant 40 on Sailing Anarchy.

But I was 28 years old. I think I could have taken any shit you guys threw at me.

 

True, but the then the Valiant didn't have reverse sheer, and it was designed from below the waterline up, not the other way.

This looks like someone who designed those Princess Motor Cruisers had a go at a sailboat.

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Either the lifelines are solid rod, bent to shape, or they are lighter than air and can float up between stanchions.

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You guys are cruel. Try to make your comments constructive. Please.

 

Look at what the guy has for current models. It's the suppository look.

He has just taken it to a new level.

His goes to 11.

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Hats off to you for sharing - and obviously catching a lot of flak.

 

It is an interesting design - BUT - there is not enough vodka in the world.........................

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Have you ever sailed ?

 

Have you ever built a boat with your own two hands ? Even a dinghy will do.

 

These 2 things are prerequisite to you being considered serious.

 

Sorry, but reality DOES rear it's ugly head when it comes to an object being buildable, and navigable.

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Have you ever sailed ?

 

Have you ever built a boat with your own two hands ? Even a dinghy will do.

 

These 2 things are prerequisite to you being considered serious.

 

Sorry, but reality DOES rear it's ugly head when it comes to an object being buildable, and navigable.

 

On the other hand, I'll give him these;

 

1). English isn't his first language, so I'm gonna go lite on him.

 

2). And secondly, at least he's aspiring to be something more than a politician, a burger flipper or the annoying douche-scow at the gas station

who keeps bugging me to wash my windows with a bottle of gutter water and a stolen newspaper....

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the annoying douche-scow at the gas station who keeps bugging me to wash my windows with a bottle of gutter water and a stolen newspaper....

 

Woodye??

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the annoying douche-scow at the gas station who keeps bugging me to wash my windows with a bottle of gutter water and a stolen newspaper....

 

Woodye??

 

Hair-lip !

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Based on what has been submitted (which looks to be more of a styling exercise than anything) and the fact he is an architect, I think perhaps he should consider putting his focus on becoming a yacht stylist. Say what you will about the renderings, at least they show some originality, but I would have expected a yacht designer, or someone aspiring to become one, to submit more numbers and details as well as something resembling a lines plan, or at least an underwater profile and proper sail plan.

.

IMHO, he would probably become bored of the rigors of yacht design per se and from what I know, most architects are more about the art and aesthetics than the scientific and numerical end of things (right brain vs left brain). In any event, I believe there is real demand for stylists, particularly in the power boat arena, or mega yachts where it seems dockside appeal is of prime importance. I know a yard that was building yachts in the 145 foot range. They used existing molds for the basic hull and would contract a styling office to design the superstructure and GA, and believe me, the stylists were paid very handsomely.

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Based on what has been submitted (which looks to be more of a styling exercise than anything) and the fact he is an architect, I think perhaps he should consider putting his focus on becoming a yacht stylist. Say what you will about the renderings, at least they show some originality, but I would have expected a yacht designer, or someone aspiring to become one, to submit more numbers and details as well as something resembling a lines plan, or at least an underwater profile and proper sail plan.

.

IMHO, he would probably become bored of the rigors of yacht design per se and from what I know, most architects are more about the art and aesthetics than the scientific and numerical end of things (right brain vs left brain). In any event, I believe there is real demand for stylists, particularly in the power boat arena, or mega yachts where it seems dockside appeal is of prime importance. I know of a yard that used existing molds for the basic hull and the styling office would design the superstructure and GA, and believe me, the stylists were paid very handsomely.

 

My brother was the captain of this 165' zillion-dollar monstrosity for a few years. Forgot the name of the decorator but if I recall, the cost of just the interior was almost 8 figures.

 

There's alotta moola in this shit....

 

 

 

 

 

 

CHEVY20TOY20-20Saloon.jpg

 

Janie-master.jpg

 

Janie-saloon-1.jpg

 

Janie-skydeck.jpg

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You got that right!

 

And I shudder to think what your brother got paid as boat captain on a vessel like that.

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You got that right!

 

And I shudder to think what you brother got paid as boat captain on a vessel like that.

 

Don't shudder too much, but I think it was 1k @ foot @ year. And mostly tax free 'cuz they didn't do a lotta U.S. waters chartering. Not a bad gig really, but he had to put up with a lot of shit from the filthy clients (think it went for about $200k per week) and basically had to be on call 24/7 to babysit them.....

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Yeah, from what I understand, that was about the going rate, or rule of thumb a few years ago. I'm not sure if it still applies, I've been told not, but I don't really know. Pay is good, but as you say, there are certainly downsides. Mind you, I talked to a boat captain who mentioned a time the boat was chartered to to film a porno flick. He didn't have any photos, but funny nonetheless.

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Robert B....

Fuck off Newb.. but before you do, please include some photographs of your ex girlfriends tits along with her current girlfriends tits. Together would be best... If your mom has a nice rack, include those too.. These will be judged more harshly than your boat design so only include the very best photographs.

 

Try try again

 

boobs-guinness.jpg

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Something tells me I'm glad it's not 1973 and I have just posted the lines of the Valiant 40 on Sailing Anarchy.

But I was 28 years old. I think I could have taken any shit you guys threw at me.

 

yes you would have got a load of shit

 

you would have then responded explaining why you put a (for those days) fast bottom and married it to a cruisy upper section, you would have explained why the rounded stern was interesting, and how you expected the keel and rig to work together

 

you would have got even more shit, much of it from people (like me ) with an at best limited understand of naval architecture.

I hope it would not have discouraged you.

 

 

on the other hand have you ever read if I built a car, if you decided to produce a boat that was super cool based on the principles of that book,and made some really nice 3-D renderings of it, and then asked if it was pretty, on SA, what reception would you expect.

 

Robert deserves some respect for putting his ideas out there

he should (but lets be honest may not) get that respect when he justifies some of his design choices,. There are some pretty odd things on that boat than need explaining, and there is some question about how an architect living 200 miles from the coats gets a good understanding of what does and doesn't work on what I assume is a cruising boat.

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I am a sailor. I ask myself some questions .... I sail the seas. For sailing yachts which almost always am the captain. I guess that's either a new training course.

It seems to me that the sailor looking at the boat itself can answer some questions ...

Can I handle it myself?

Is convenient and comfortable is the cockpit?

Do not flood waves deck?

Is the side is not too high?

Do you prefer to have a superstructure? I prefer the freedom of communication and the flat board?

Would I sail this boat?

 

Then someone noticed that the block is not greater than the average yacht.

notice that instead of the superstructure has a deck.

Notice that the sharp courses when the boat is tilted sides surface decreases. Sides are wrapped inside ...

 

I was hoping that someone wants to think about why I drew.

I assume that someone that I might be wise

Thank you to those who they try ..... ;-)

 

I am functioning already in the market .... Someone has noticed my work in Poland

Polish newspaper "Jachting" November 2012 has been written about this boat ...

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the annoying douche-scow at the gas station who keeps bugging me to wash my windows with a bottle of gutter water and a stolen newspaper....

 

Woodye??

 

Hair-lip !

 

well played sir

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Bump-en-Grind

Nice ass .... so, as in my boat.

Is this your beautiful photo?

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Bump-en-Grind has never seen an ass like that in person.

 

Go for it Robert B. who the hell knows what the future looks like...

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I am a sailor. I ask myself some questions .... I sail the seas. For sailing yachts which almost always am the captain. I guess that's either a new training course.

It seems to me that the sailor looking at the boat itself can answer some questions ...

Can I handle it myself?

Is convenient and comfortable is the cockpit?

Do not flood waves deck?

Is the side is not too high?

Do you prefer to have a superstructure? I prefer the freedom of communication and the flat board?

Would I sail this boat?

 

Can my passengers safely sit in the cockpit on a slightly more choppy day? (Baltic has horribly short and hack-y waves)

Won't the diced light from the gratings over my skylights make for a weird lighting inside?

 

Something else I see as problematic is your companionway, first in terms of closing in a seaworthy way and second in terms of using the forward winches.

 

 

Then someone noticed that the block is not greater than the average yacht.

notice that instead of the superstructure has a deck.

Notice that the sharp courses when the boat is tilted sides surface decreases. Sides are wrapped inside ...

 

I'm not sure I understand what you're looking to say, but that sounds like an interesting road to go down. Could you maybe rephrase what you mean?

 

 

I was hoping that someone wants to think about why I drew.

I assume that someone that I might be wise

Thank you to those who they try ..... ;-)

 

Explain, and we'll be happy to listen.

 

 

I am functioning already in the market .... Someone has noticed my work in Poland

Polish newspaper "Jachting" November 2012 has been written about this boat ...

 

Congratulations, but keep in mind that an article in a magazine, especially a national niche magazine like this, doesn't mean it's an endorsement of any aspect of your design. That may sound harsh, but what I mean to say is that having someone write about you doesn't mean you're "functioning in the market".

I'm asking myself, haven't the people who were interested in that design given any input on it?

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I have worked on Valiant 40s. They are quite nice looking and seem to ask to be taken on an ocean crossing just sitting at the dock.

 

Something tells me I'm glad it's not 1973 and I have just posted the lines of the Valiant 40 on Sailing Anarchy.

But I was 28 years old. I think I could have taken any shit you guys threw at me.

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Well, you have made some unusual choices with regards to combining modern aesthetics with a desire to emulate ship design of the 18th century.

 

As has been pointed out, the chain wales are out of place, but are an interesting solution. I assume you are using them to bypass the windows and transmit the rig loads to the hull.

 

The tumblehome looks out of place to me, and I can’t see what purpose it serves other than looks. It certainly reduces the available deck and interior space.

 

The stern lights do give a sense of the “Great Cabin”, but I wonder if you end up sacrificing a lot of hull strength.

 

The lifeline stanchions look cool, but the design seems dangerous to me. Sharp corners, hard angles and flat sections will beat up your crew and gear in no time. The same goes for the stern rails. Please get rid of those sharp corners.

 

You have similar issues with the interior. It looks like a serviceable layout, but again, you’ve got all these hard corners and angles. If you’ve ever spent any time below in even moderate seas, you know how tossed about you are. Some of those angles are going to break some ribs…

 

I would like to see what the underwater profile looks like, and what foils you have chosen. I’d also like to see how the rudder is attached. It’s an interesting concept. Please let us know how it comes along.

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Don't give up your day job.

Dointe be meane! Butte seriesly... I thick the bigge holle in backe wille lette allotte of water in. :)/>

 

Sounds a little off

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How much beer will it haul?

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Something tells me I'm glad it's not 1973 and I have just posted the lines of the Valiant 40 on Sailing Anarchy.

But I was 28 years old. I think I could have taken any shit you guys threw at me.

 

After all, you take it so well now. Right on!

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Only in New Jersey need to write the manual microwave to not dry it in live animals .... In other places in the world ... people are able to have guessed.

 

These yachts are built in Poland. Polish shipyards are one of the best in the world ...

 

yachts,40,sunreef-170-ultimate-exterior-003.jpg

 

 

 

zdjecie20121025-094034.JPG

 

zdjecie20121025-094356.JPG

 

zdjecie20121108-110136.jpg

 

zdjecie20121108-104124.jpg

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Only in New Jersey need to write the manual microwave to not dry it in live animals .... In other places in the world ... people are able to have guessed.

 

That is youre oppsumtion.....coud be in orthere plaises to.

 

These yachts are built in Poland. Polish shipyards are one of the best in the world ...

Agane That is youre oppsumtion.....

 

zdjecie20121025-094034.JPG

 

Lookes to softe.....notte enuff paine and suffringe foure the sailores. :)

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[snip]

These yachts are built in Poland. Polish shipyards are one of the best in the world ... [snip]

 

Hmmmmm! And how many of them are your designs? Are you claiming credit? Or just trolling again?

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[snip]

These yachts are built in Poland. Polish shipyards are one of the best in the world ... [snip]

 

Hmmmmm! And how many of them are your designs? Are you claiming credit? Or just trolling again?

 

All he says is that Polish boatyards don't necessarily produce crap.

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I dont "get" this, but that's OK. When I work out a new concept it often helps to go "too far" and then come back. Push the "Goodness" of this design to your own limits, imagine it's use, then consider the drawbacks, then redo.

 

Repeat.

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Robert:

For a beginner you have chosen a very complex design. That is not a good way to start.

If you wanted to learn to play the piano you would not start with a Chopin Prelude ( he was Polish). You'd start with something simple.

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Robert:

For a beginner you have chosen a very complex design. That is not a good way to start.

If you wanted to learn to play the piano you would not start with a Chopin Prelude ( he was Polish). You'd start with something simple.

 

And if you do start with Chopin, please don't inflict it on us until you've worked it out.

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This is not a door ..... It is a window ... not openable ... ;-)

Windows are bulletproof .... There may be resistant windows waves ... ;-)

 

http://www.brj-desig...m/jacht-brj-35/

The ocean can easily remove bulletproof glass, often without even cracking it. WRONG concept.

 

Look,

I'm trying to break into the market of designers with new design?....Is the high side can be pretty? That will prove practical in the course of the discussion ...

Weight? Sail area? rig type? mast? ballast, how much and where? shape of bottom? shape of keel? shape of rudder?

Sailboats are not designed by decorators, they MUST first sail. Then you can make it pretty within the confines of what will work without ruining seaworthiness.

 

I know that it is in compliance with the requirements. Is examined by the Authority certification in Poland. Category will receive a "B"....

WTF is category B?

 

I'm an architect ...

Ah. Now it makes sense. Go sailing for a few years, then look at your "design" again.

 

Nothing about your posts indicate that you know anything about sailing. You seem to think looks are all that matters. Before we care one bit about looks, we need to know how it might SAIL.

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Something tells me I'm glad it's not 1973 and I have just posted the lines of the Valiant 40 on Sailing Anarchy..

 

Not so. From the drawings one could see familiar yachty shapes that give off the warm rosy glow of 'sailing boat'. Any odd details (and really, what was so different? ) add (or subtract) interest.

 

But then, SA is SA...

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Lookes to softe.....notte enuff paine and suffringe foure the sailores. :)

 

The sailors don't get to sit on those comfy lounges, that's for the owner's "nieces".

Crew must hike on those narrow side decks or at best, kneel on those benches by the winches. Helmsman must stand at all times (see location of throttle.)

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I know that it is in compliance with the requirements. Is examined by the Authority certification in Poland. Category will receive a "B"....

WTF is category B?

EU Recreational Craft Directive defines categories for boats that are supposed to specify what conditions/navigational areas the specific boat is "safe" for in terms of construction and design:

 

Category B Offshore

Offshore voyages in possible wind force of Beaufort force 8 and significant wave heights of up to 4 metres.

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I'm an architect ...

Ah. Now it makes sense. Go sailing for a few years, then look at your "design" again.

 

Nothing about your posts indicate that you know anything about sailing. You seem to think looks are all that matters. Before we care one bit about looks, we need to know how it might SAIL.

 

I am a sailor. I ask myself some questions .... I sail the seas. For sailing yachts which almost always am the captain. I guess that's either a new training course.

It seems to me that the sailor looking at the boat itself can answer some questions ...

Can I handle it myself?

Is convenient and comfortable is the cockpit?

Do not flood waves deck?

Is the side is not too high?

Do you prefer to have a superstructure? I prefer the freedom of communication and the flat board?

Would I sail this boat?

 

Then again, see posts above.

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Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. What sailors hold as beautiful is a "good" sailing boat. That "good" is comfort, or speed, or a combination of these. Vestas Speed Rocket is a beautiful boat. Functionally beautiful. Add a VOR boat, a Moth; though, classically, most would not call them "beautiful" they are most certainly "Functional". A Tartan 3700 or a Pacific SeaCraft37 are functional boats that are beautiful, pleasing classic proportions coupled with offshore or coastal functionality. Beautifully functional. We are not yet seeing the beauty of the BRJ35 and can not discern the function

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I know. look at the yachts in the wrath of the ocean ... We have bałtyt, Mediterranean Sea, Black Sea, maybe red. We have rich opportunities for coastal shipping and a possibility of avoiding the difficult conditions ... We have a different culture and hail sailing marine conditions and skills. Therefore arise boats such as this one:

 

 

Robert B

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So what you're saying is that this is a coastal daysailer? That's exactly our question: What's the design brief? What IS this boat supposed to do? What is it NOT supposed to do? Knowing that would help judge the result of what you drew up.

 

Also, if you mention all these areas, you should know that sea conditions on all oceans and seas can be horrible, and they're more likely to be challenging than being flat as a sheet. A boat of this size, with that look, probably isn't a very obvious daysailer, and people would rather look at taking it out for their holidays, anywhere they go. That will become challenging there. Also, should you ever get caught up in a certain situation where the weather is against you, you want to rather be safe than sorry.

 

That said, Esense is big enough enough and layed-out to take a beating, and it will do so rather safely.

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This category refers to the project to which I devote the yacht ...

I believe that it has no errors ... It has a convention ... It has a certain destiny ...68886_360815217348458_958931786_n.jpg

 

the safety of the crew present those boats?

is not known if the deeper cockpit?

Is it not possible to sit deeper and have easier access to the winch?

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glass? in the aft cabin ... Do not feasible? and certainly not worth it?

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I'd be dead if all my boat could stand was Category B. Just sayin'

 

BTW - I bet I am about the only person on this thread that owns a boat built in Poland :P

I don't know where Sportis got their hypalon from, but it seems not as good as what Avon uses (have one of those too).

 

I know that it is in compliance with the requirements. Is examined by the Authority certification in Poland. Category will receive a "B"....

WTF is category B?

EU Recreational Craft Directive defines categories for boats that are supposed to specify what conditions/navigational areas the specific boat is "safe" for in terms of construction and design:

 

Category B Offshore

Offshore voyages in possible wind force of Beaufort force 8 and significant wave heights of up to 4 metres.

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This category refers to the project to which I devote the yacht ...

I believe that it has no errors ... It has a convention ... It has a certain destiny ...68886_360815217348458_958931786_n.jpg

 

the safety of the crew present those boats?

is not known if the deeper cockpit?

Is it not possible to sit deeper and have easier access to the winch?

 

If you are saying that your design has no errors, then you don't have to ask for input. It has errors, and partly very questionable points, as has your 33ft design (to which you won't answer). If you're not looking for input, don't come here with it.

 

Again, what you present us here begs the question of design brief (which includes not only the category of navigation). You compare your design to Endeavour and other J Class boats? Then you should know that the design is from 1934, and was built for the purpose of coastal racing, not for long offshore passages or ocean crossings. Yours isn't a racing boat, nor is it coastal by its hull shape, or Category B, as you tell us it would receive.

 

These yachts were built to standards of beauty, and the ideas of a speedy yacht, of the 1930's. The idea of a long deep, wide cockpit wasn't born yet. The winches you may find today on some of the J Class boats are huge and can be used from deck height. Also they are not meant to be hand-winched, but are in fact electrically driven. Also, just like Esense (43m), it's huge at 40m length so you cannot compare your design to either Esense or Endeavour in terms of protection or useage for reasons mentioned above.

 

endeavour0409%20(13).JPG

 

You should read up on Endeavour here.

 

 

 

glass? in the aft cabin ... Do not feasible? and certainly not worth it?

 

eb3a4d15fb9316d1.jpg

 

There is a huge difference between these.

First: These windows on old sailing ships were high above the water, tiny, and still broke often. Yours is a huge window, and as it was pointed out before the question is not whether the glass is bullet-proof, but whether the structure can make sure it's not just popped out of the frame in one piece.

Second: Nobody says it's not feasable, as you see from Wally yachts. Nevertheless your bullet proof glass is heavy, so it will be a question of your yacht's overall weight.

 

 

Overall I think you don't want to be stuck in the design of yachts, or ships, that are at least 78 years old. Though, thinking about it, Che Guevara would be 84 years old today.

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Only in New Jersey need to write the manual microwave to not dry it in live animals .... In other places in the world ... people are able to have guessed.

 

That is youre oppsumtion.....coud be in orthere plaises to.

 

These yachts are built in Poland. Polish shipyards are one of the best in the world ...

Agane That is youre oppsumtion.....

 

zdjecie20121025-094034.JPG

 

Lookes to softe.....notte enuff paine and suffringe foure the sailores. :)

 

There will be pain and suffering alright. Just wedge your calf, lower leg under those cantilevered cockpit seats, while heeled.

 

A beginner yacht designer must either take the knowledge gained by others, by working for a master. Or, will need to learn on their own through trial and error.

There are a lot of young designers, and new designs that have obvious fatal flaws. I applaud you for putting your design up on this forum. You might get input this way that will help you.

Your design has the look of a cruising oriented coastal motor sailor. Compromised sailing characteristics, and a large volume interior, with what appears to be a very large viewing window in the aft cabin. Is the window for looking out of, or for voyeur types to get a good look at you wife, while she is changing her dress?

Sailing performance is compromised, but may not be your focus.

You should put thought into how accessible, and convenient the layout is to moving about while tied to the dock. Like at a boat show. That is where your design looks to be focused. Front end appeal, without a lot of practicality.

 

Not unlike some of the features on the boat pictured above.

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Ok ... I am aware of the need minor improvements (location winches).

But I thought that if you can meditate to do this (glass on the stern) and not, as it is impossible to do .... ;-)))) I am certain that it does not have to be armored glass. I'll say more. It will not be armored glass. And that solution is now approved by the certifying authority. I'm an architect, I mean in the middle of an artist. I have some right to say, therefore, that the body of the boat is perfect in proportion to the assumed value of. My licence master architect gives me the right ... ;-) Which one of you wants to try the yacht ... Let them come in August to Polish or to Odessa ... Depends on who gives more pieniędy for my project, if I talk to the Russians and the Poles...

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ESENSE%20-%20Courtesy%20of%20Wally%20Yachts%20(2).jpg

 

I would rub my junk on this thing for sure.

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Ok ... I am aware of the need minor improvements (location winches).

But I thought that if you can meditate to do this (glass on the stern) and not, as it is impossible to do .... ;-)))) I am certain that it does not have to be armored glass. I'll say more. It will not be armored glass. And that solution is now approved by the certifying authority. I'm an architect, I mean in the middle of an artist. I have some right to say, therefore, that the body of the boat is perfect in proportion to the assumed value of. My licence master architect gives me the right ... ;-) Which one of you wants to try the yacht ... Let them come in August to Polish or to Odessa ... Depends on who gives more pieniędy for my project, if I talk to the Russians and the Poles...

Your design reminds me of the bounty 44, aka: harden 45.

Hundreds were built, in the far east.

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Boy I'm glad that this forum isn't for clothing designers, or automobile designers. There you have thousands of new clothing and automobiles designed, and made , but just for one or two trade shows, and never will hit the stores or the dealerships. If one can't use their imagination..that is a new word for some of you. Imagination.. That is where one gets an idea, puts it on paper, and maybe gets built, maybe one, maybe millions. Do you think that computer that Mr. Hewlitt and Mr. Packard thought up, was ever the original basis of what we had after they built the first one? Or ever heard of TYLin? He is gone now, but he had an unbelievable imagination. He was a bridge engineer/ designer. The new span of the San Francisco Bay bridge was one of his. Nobody has ever done this design before. TY Lin also on paper, has a bridge to span the gap between the Aleutians and Russia. Also spanning the gap between Africa and Gibralter. Will they ever happen? Maybe, are they far fetched? You betcha. But with out imagination , you are nothing but a mind numbed robot.

This guy has an imagination also, and has put something that he thought up on paper, just like I bet Bob Perry has one or two in his archives of some off the wall boat, to join the list of his many successes. Just like any of the yacht designers that I have had the pleasure to know.Bill Lee, George Olson, Ron Moore had an imagination to build a boat that everybody thought was a death warrant. But they succeeded. Even Noah had an imagination on how to build an Ark, even with the measurements told to him.

So why don't you just give this guy a break. I know he didn't give us any tits, but they would still be nice.. But think in a positive way and use a little imagination of your own on something that is far fetched, unusual design. Because with out these navel architects imagination. ,you would still be in that hollowed out log. And that was built with some bodies imagination.

If you ever go to China, when ever there is a major building tobe built, the builders will have a world wide contest for designing t he building. They have some buildings that are questionable how they stand up. Look at the CCN building in Beijing. I still am waiting for it to fall over. Imagination.

And Robert B don't give up your imagination. One day one will be built and blow everything else out of the water. Just like Merlin did on the west coast. Putting an Imagination and your ideas on paper.. With out them, where would WE be?

 

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