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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  
blackjenner

Mocking Ads on Craigslist

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18 hours ago, Steam Flyer said:

The glacier deposited them there.

FWIW I don't think there are many more dreamers (percent-wise) in the Carolina Piedmont, gazing at far horizons in their minds..... but it seems to be a lot of them

-DSK

It's the isolation that causes it.  There are people in Appalachia that still speak English with the accent that their Scottish and English yeoman ancestors brought with them to the new world.   Wait, do you hear that banjo music?

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45 minutes ago, bmiller said:

I think this may have been listed before but it bears repeating.

Possibly the most neglected and overpriced Valiant 40 on the market.

http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1981/Valiant-40-CT-Sailboat-2922800/Richmond/CA/United-States#.WkY3BW5lBJ9

 

That's just sad.  And the price is just a bit north of delusional.

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5 hours ago, hdra said:

Am I missing something on the pricing?  I get the boat is pretty beat, but at 49,500 it is the cheapest valiant 40 listed on yacht world.

One minor thing buried in the listing..." Blister boat ". Those words applied to a Valiant 40 are usually the kiss of death.

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4 minutes ago, Ishmael said:

One minor thing buried in the listing..." Blister boat ". Those words applied to a Valiant 40 are usually the kiss of death.

  Did no one notice the large blisters cracking open ABOVE the waterline??? The blisters underwater must be huuuuge!

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That is an expensive blister job.

I'm not sure I've seen blisters above the waterline before. I'm not even sure how you get that level of osmosis above the waterline. Did it spend some time underwater or is the laminate that shitty that water migrated that far north? 

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Those Valiants made with Hetron resin have blisters so bad that the deck blisters worse than a fairly badly blistered bottom on other boats.

A bad one is a total loss - the blisters are all through the laminate - everywhere.

It was the reason Uniflite folded from what I understand - huuuge lawsuits and the boats were basically unrepairable.

 

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The nice thing about the Hetron resin is that is was FIREPROOF! I guess the idea was that it osmosed to the point that it had enough moisture to put itself out in case of fire. Just joking really about an attribute that is no joke. Uniflite was making lots of patrol boats during the Vietnam era and the fireproof resin was a requirement but why they kept using it on private boats afterward was a real bonehead move. They actually bragged about the use of the MilSpec resin until the blisters started popping up. 

Hetron is still around, Uniflite not so much...

Uniflites prior to 1973 do not blister. 

In the manufactur of Hetron resin, Dupont used liquid bromine ....when the oil crisis in 1973 increased the cost of making liquid bromine 500% they switched to solid bromine which is the cause of Uniflite blisters. 

They were sued and folded up shop in 1982." 

LIFTED From the Passagemaker board , 

After the Arabs & Jews had their tussle in '73 the resin was reduced in quality , weather FR or not. 

I was building Sub chapter "T" boats then and the price of resin went from 19c to 75c+ a pound. even after it was garbaged . 

I am constantly SHOCKED that new owners today , decades after the blister hassles, that new purchasers don't DEMAND FR (fire retardant) resin. 

The few cents a pound would hardly matter in todays fly weight boats , but the ability to survive a shipboard fire should matter to folks laying out bucks by the Hundreds of Thousands!!:?: 
 

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Considering the worlds largest source of liquid bromine is the Dead Sea and you can walk from the plant where it's made to the Jordanian border (I've done it myself), I'm not surprised the 1973 war disrupted things. I sure wish they'd put FRs in more resins just because it would be good for me personally. Did they solve the osmosis problem due to FRs? 

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44 minutes ago, Ishmael said:

Agreed. Different main hatch, no dodger, etc.

Nothing about that photo says Catalina. Also in the ad there are two different masts. One roller and one slab.

Maybe some kind of scam ad.

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13 hours ago, soak_ed said:

That's just sad.  And the price is just a bit north of delusional.

It’s a bank repo.  If marine loans are like real estate loans, the loan price may be based on fiction but the bank officers cannot admit the fiction without admitting malfeasance.   Therefore the property sits with a fictional price until somebody steals the copper and the roof leaks.    

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1 hour ago, Lark said:

It’s a bank repo.  If marine loans are like real estate loans, the loan price may be based on fiction but the bank officers cannot admit the fiction without admitting malfeasance.   Therefore the property sits with a fictional price until somebody steals the copper and the roof leaks.    

I for one have never stolen a roof leak. I'm happy to give them away.

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4 hours ago, Lark said:

It’s a bank repo.  If marine loans are like real estate loans, the loan price may be based on fiction but the bank officers cannot admit the fiction without admitting malfeasance.   Therefore the property sits with a fictional price until somebody steals the copper and the roof leaks.    

Yes, my take from that ad has always been, WHAT bank gave anybody a loan on that boat in the first place?  And can I interest them in my Bikini Inspection franchise scheme? 

BTW, the $50K Valiant 40 in PDX appears to be just about equally poxed as the one featured above, except nobody has yet opened them up with a grinder.  It's a bit cleaner, but doesn't have all the winch doilies and such.

The dilemma for the hopeless dreamer is whether to gamble that the failed copolymerization has run its course after 40 years, and that a reasonably cheap DIY repair would last another 40 years.  I am such a fool, but try as I might, $50K seems to be a bit over my risk threshold.  

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3 hours ago, toddster said:

Yes, my take from that ad has always been, WHAT bank gave anybody a loan on that boat in the first place?  And can I interest them in my Bikini Inspection franchise scheme? 

BTW, the $50K Valiant 40 in PDX appears to be just about equally poxed as the one featured above, except nobody has yet opened them up with a grinder.  It's a bit cleaner, but doesn't have all the winch doilies and such.

The dilemma for the hopeless dreamer is whether to gamble that the failed copolymerization has run its course after 40 years, and that a reasonably cheap DIY repair would last another 40 years.  I am such a fool, but try as I might, $50K seems to be a bit over my risk threshold.  

$5K might be a bit much.

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14 hours ago, hdra said:

I missed the blisters...

Huh? The decent photos of them were one of the reasons I didn't give the listing broker much shit. That and "Blister Boat" being a bullet point in the description.

He basically told anyone who was listening that they're selling a hull, and a bad one.

Why he accepted the listing is a mystery.

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1 hour ago, Uncooperative Tom said:

Huh? The decent photos of them were one of the reasons I didn't give the listing broker much shit. That and "Blister Boat" being a bullet point in the description.

He basically told anyone who was listening that they're selling a hull, and a bad one.

Why he accepted the listing is a mystery.

The broker is based in Utah and the boat is in CA. That's interesting.

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34 minutes ago, Rasputin22 said:

If the Dead Sea is so full of Bromines, then the Great Salt Lake in Utah should have plenty too. 

It's full of Mormons. They don't integrate into resin well at all.

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4 hours ago, Ishmael said:

It's full of Mormons. They don't integrate into resin well at all.

Well yeah, everybody know resin is loaded with caffeine.

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I'm a fan of repurposing things and actually have this exact walker downstairs with a broken handle. My wife told me to toss it, so of course it's going in the shed. But I don't think I'll ever do this with it.

15LongWalker.jpg

The associated ad:

https://fortmyers.craigslist.org/lee/boa/d/1992-evinrude-15hp-longshaft/6438913137.html

That's a long shaft. How the heck he got it hanging on the walker I don't know. Stand the engine on the ground and sandwich it between walker and board would be my guess.

 

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1 hour ago, Uncooperative Tom said:

I'm a fan of repurposing things and actually have this exact walker downstairs with a broken handle. My wife told me to toss it, so of course it's going in the shed. But I don't think I'll ever do this with it.

15LongWalker.jpg

The associated ad:

https://fortmyers.craigslist.org/lee/boa/d/1992-evinrude-15hp-longshaft/6438913137.html

That's a long shaft. How the heck he got it hanging on the walker I don't know. Stand the engine on the ground and sandwich it between walker and board would be my guess.

 

Where's the tennis balls? It's suppoed to have tennis balls duct-taped to the feet.

It'd be cool if they put one on the prop too, just for this ad.

FB- Doug

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That's a FL pic. Walk out of the air conditioning into the FL air and your phone lens will take pics that look that way too.

I see a fair number of these 9.9 and 15 hp motors that are long shafts. What are they for? Especially the 15's? No sailboat that takes a motor on a bracket really wants 15 hp (well, except oddballs like the big MacGregor catamaran). On a small boat, building a higher transom and putting on a longer shaft is just more weight. Good only for keeping following seas from dunking the engine. I haven't encountered a boat with a 20" transom that I'd want to put a 15 on. They're all 15" transoms.

So who was buying these long shafts back in the late 80's and early 90's and for what?

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The 9.9's are sailboat pushers to beat the 10 HP limit for not having to license your boat.

The 15's I have no idea about unless it's to push bigger boats than a 9.9 can handle - there now seem to be lots of 30 footers where an A4 inboard was yanked and replaced by an outboard.

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1 hour ago, SloopJonB said:

The 9.9's are sailboat pushers to beat the 10 HP limit for not having to license your boat.

The 15's I have no idea about unless it's to push bigger boats than a 9.9 can handle - there now seem to be lots of 30 footers where an A4 inboard was yanked and replaced by an outboard.

I'm not sure how far these engines may migrate in their lives but we've never had that 10 hp rule in FL. During the time period when these were sold new, the rule was: engine = registered boat, none = no registration required. There was some rule to register big boats without engines but did not apply to most recreational boats. The rules have become more strict and now I'm supposed to register any kayaks over 16' long, which are the only kind I own.

Someone bought that 15 long new in 1992 for some reason. I was around and playing with boats at that time and just can't figure out why they wanted it.

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3 hours ago, Uncooperative Tom said:

I'm not sure how far these engines may migrate in their lives but we've never had that 10 hp rule in FL. During the time period when these were sold new, the rule was: engine = registered boat, none = no registration required. There was some rule to register big boats without engines but did not apply to most recreational boats. The rules have become more strict and now I'm supposed to register any kayaks over 16' long, which are the only kind I own.

Someone bought that 15 long new in 1992 for some reason. I was around and playing with boats at that time and just can't figure out why they wanted it.

There are a number of smaller lakes that do have a 10hp limit on them.   I worked on the waterfront of Lake Wauberg in Gainesville for two years and that lake had a horsepower limit.

Also, longshafts under 25hp were used as auxiliary (get home motor) for offshore outboard fishing boats that either did not have the transom room for full sized twin engines or that the O did not want to pay for two large motors.

Stumbling

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I thought the 9.9 was to beat the 10hp max on some lakes. Change out the jets and change the prop and you have a 15 horse engine. Also, they were used as auxiliary along with large outboards on fishing rigs as Stumble said.

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Sounds like he got it all stripped to rebuild and then found out what the refit was going to cost.

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This boat is very well made.  Only the $# don't work out.  Please consider a low offer.

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Possibly the most over-modified MacGregor 26X ever

https://fortmyers.craigslist.org/lee/boa/d/1999-macgregor-26/6449586806.html

That's just good comedy. Generator, air conditioner, shower, hard top, mysteriously modified but unused rigging... those are pretty good.

But no one else thought to put a central vacuum system in one. 

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2 hours ago, Uncooperative Tom said:

Possibly the most over-modified MacGregor 26X ever

https://fortmyers.craigslist.org/lee/boa/d/1999-macgregor-26/6449586806.html

That's just good comedy. Generator, air conditioner, shower, hard top, mysteriously modified but unused rigging... those are pretty good.

But no one else thought to put a central vacuum system in one. 

There was a Mac26X sitting in a slip at a marina near us with one of the biggest instrument pods I've ever seen, every kind of electronic gizmo including radar; a hard dodger, autopilot, etc etc. Dunno what they added below but could easily have included A/C and marble counter tops.

If they're having fun with it, that's good.

FB- Doug

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3 hours ago, Uncooperative Tom said:

Possibly the most over-modified MacGregor 26X ever

https://fortmyers.craigslist.org/lee/boa/d/1999-macgregor-26/6449586806.html

That's just good comedy. Generator, air conditioner, shower, hard top, mysteriously modified but unused rigging... those are pretty good.

But no one else thought to put a central vacuum system in one. 

Redundancy is good. 2 fridges, 6 fans, 2 cans of WD40, 2 extra solar panels, 2 cans of Febreeze...-_-

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This Mac26 is "expedition ready", which means it has a full dodger enclosure.

It is an Alaska vet, which means they motored to Ketchikan...B)

It is stunning how much these owners put in the boats and the resale value up here.

https://vancouver.craigslist.ca/van/boa/d/2006-macgregor-26m-expedition/6448621211.html

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57 minutes ago, Norse Horse said:

This Mac26 is "expedition ready", which means it has a full dodger enclosure.

It is an Alaska vet, which means they motored to Ketchikan...B)

It is stunning how much these owners put in the boats and the resale value up here.

https://vancouver.craigslist.ca/van/boa/d/2006-macgregor-26m-expedition/6448621211.html

Considering the boat has a Yukon registration, saying "Alaska vet" is almost meaningless. They could probably tow it to Ketchikan and back in an afternoon.

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4 hours ago, Uncooperative Tom said:

Possibly the most over-modified MacGregor 26X ever

https://fortmyers.craigslist.org/lee/boa/d/1999-macgregor-26/6449586806.html

That's just good comedy. Generator, air conditioner, shower, hard top, mysteriously modified but unused rigging... those are pretty good.

But no one else thought to put a central vacuum system in one. 

That's rather amazing. Don't even think about making sense of it. If you ask "why", the answer is because he can.

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On 12/31/2017 at 3:22 PM, Uncooperative Tom said:

I'm a fan of repurposing things and actually have this exact walker downstairs with a broken handle. My wife told me to toss it, so of course it's going in the shed. But I don't think I'll ever do this with it.

15LongWalker.jpg

The associated ad:

https://fortmyers.craigslist.org/lee/boa/d/1992-evinrude-15hp-longshaft/6438913137.html

That's a long shaft. How the heck he got it hanging on the walker I don't know. Stand the engine on the ground and sandwich it between walker and board would be my guess.

 

When I first saw this and read the first line of Uncooperative's text, I thought, how nice, someone is selling a motor on a stand that is sitting underwater, how honest of them...   It took a bit to figure out that it was a humidity picture.

Stumbling

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Not CraigsList, Nice boat, but...

What's wrong with this ad, which has appeared in the last two issues of Wooden Boat?

gulfstream30_01.thumb.jpg.6f5029aac64b551897d9af909b515ed0.jpg

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9 minutes ago, Monkey Butler said:

Such a deal!

(Who do I call?)

Precisely. I was amazed that (a) WoodenBoat didn't suggest to the owner that he (or she) include contact info., and that (b) the owner hasn't figure it out yet. It's been that way for the last two issues, maybe more.

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58 minutes ago, Bull City said:

Precisely. I was amazed that (a) WoodenBoat didn't suggest to the owner that he (or she) include contact info., and that (b) the owner hasn't figure it out yet. It's been that way for the last two issues, maybe more.

Well, you just call down to the switchboard operator in Orient, Sue Ellen will know who is selling the boat, she'll put you straight through.

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56 minutes ago, Bull City said:
1 hour ago, Monkey Butler said:

Such a deal!

(Who do I call?)

Precisely. I was amazed that (a) WoodenBoat didn't suggest to the owner that he (or she) include contact info., and that (b) the owner hasn't figure it out yet. It's been that way for the last two issues, maybe more.

Heh....... Oriental is not a big city. You don't call anybody, you just go there and drive around for six or seven minutes. You'll see it. Then go knock on the door. Be careful of the next door neighbor's dog, though

FB- Doug

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9 hours ago, toddster said:

May have been noted here before, but still seems like an interesting business model:

Custom Steal Sailboat

Presumably, payment and delivery is only after he's "gotten away with it?"  Not sure what the 47 inches is about.  

Went to their website. It's very 1990's, for those who remember what websites were like back then.

http://www.dutchlove.com/about_dutch_love.htm

But it does seem like a practical boat with lots of time-proven mods. I particularly like the ability to carry a Trinka and a RIB. Great answer to the question, "Do you want a sailing/rowing dink or a fast one?"

YES!

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6 hours ago, Autonomous said:

Sad story, no happy ending in sight.

Yep. Widow is about to learn that dear departed hubby's expensive hobby was lotsa money thrown down a rat hole, she'll be lucky to get somebody to come take the boat off her hands without her paying a huge transport & disposal fee. With the thru-hulls out of it, you can't even turn it upside-down and make a decent shed.

FB- Doug

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10 minutes ago, Steam Flyer said:

Yep. Widow is about to learn that dear departed hubby's expensive hobby was lotsa money thrown down a rat hole, she'll be lucky to get somebody to come take the boat off her hands without her paying a huge transport & disposal fee. With the thru-hulls out of it, you can't even turn it upside-down and make a decent shed.

FB- Doug

Well, that's $5 worth of corks and she's good.

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On 1/6/2018 at 5:05 AM, Uncooperative Tom said:

Possibly the most over-modified MacGregor 26X ever

https://fortmyers.craigslist.org/lee/boa/d/1999-macgregor-26/6449586806.html

That's just good comedy. Generator, air conditioner, shower, hard top, mysteriously modified but unused rigging... those are pretty good.

But no one else thought to put a central vacuum system in one. 

Or a wine chiller for the Mrs.

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19 hours ago, Steam Flyer said:

Yep. Widow is about to learn that dear departed hubby's expensive hobby was lotsa money thrown down a rat hole, she'll be lucky to get somebody to come take the boat off her hands without her paying a huge transport & disposal fee. With the thru-hulls out of it, you can't even turn it upside-down and make a decent shed.

FB- Doug

I've been offered hulls for free if I removed them. They were still too expensive.

One was really tempting and I was seriously thinking about it until I got an email from a friend in NZ who'd just had 3 stents placed in his arteries. He's younger than me. I got over it at that point.

FKT

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