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    • UnderDawg

      A Few Simple Rules   05/22/2017

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    • B.J. Porter

      Moderation Team Change   06/16/2017

      After fifteen years of volunteer moderation at SA, I will no longer be part of the moderation team. The decision to step aside is mine, and has been some time in the works but we did not wish to announce it in advance for a number of reasons. It's been fun, but I need my time back for other purposes now. The Underdawg admin account will not be monitored until further notice, as I will be relinquishing control of it along with my administrative privileges. Zapata will continue on as a moderator, and any concerns or issues can be directed to that account or to the Editor until further notice. Anyone interested in helping moderate the forums should reach out to Scot by sending a PM to the Editor account. Please note that I am not leaving the community, I am merely stepping aside from Admin responsibilities and privileges on the site.

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Doug Lord

Speed Dream 27

15 posts in this topic

First, turn the sound down-very bad sound quality but the boat looks real good(have questions about the keel popping in and out) :

 

 

http://www.speeddream27.com/main.html

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no a 49er, or 79er(B8.0) for that matter is proven and fast

 

no experimental nature to them at all, or claims that haven't already been proven

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Looks like it needs racks out the back as they're already cramped in the back corner in not that much breeze.

 

The keel also seems to do a good job of making sure everyone gets soaked through.

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Needs more freeboard and wings

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It shows a nose down attitude while heeled. The windward side of the bow seems to end up with water sitting on top of it and presumably pushing the boat down. I know these are just early sails of a prototype but it looks a long way from exceeding 30kts like was claimed before launch.

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the rig looks good, wait for the capsize to windward

 

We had a hilarious boat in Sydney called Q and owned by Bob Oatley's son. The canting keel actually rotated around the boat with a complex mechanism built into the hull.

 

It came unstuck when the thing jammed and they realised that instead of the keel canting you could have the keel vertical and the boat canting instead. There's some great pictures of it capsized in Sydney Harbour with the crew standing on the upside down hull.

 

Other possibile problems include: a boat to windard takes your breeze, your boat capsizes to windward and your rig hits theirs.

 

The thing was a total waste of time and never worked.

 

I wonder if there's a reason we only see video of Speed Dream 27 reaching along with no other boats around?

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Besides Q there is a Jo Richards/Guy Whitehouse design" Stravaganza with a 180 degree canting keel. Lake racer-don't know how they're doing. pictures from Whitehouse site. Nicole Scott pix of Q:

 

Pictures-1 & 2 Stravaganza, 3-Q

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post-30-0-80426600-1369313088_thumb.jpg

post-30-0-87834700-1369313186_thumb.jpg

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Sure seems like a lot of bother to get almost multihull performance.

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Sure seems like a lot of bother to get almost multihull performance.

Mulithulls are too unsafe compared to a monohull...oh wait a minute, is swinging the bulb safer?

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I really don't see the point of these rotating keels. Surely it would be a hell of a lot simpler to have the equivalent of the old sliding plank. You could have a lump of lead or water filled container that slides along a curved plank, which itself can be extended either side of the boat. This would have higher righting moment, less mechanism and because it is out of the water all the time there is less drag, and it can have an air volume equal to or greater than the mass of lead, so the boat is less likely to capsize if it ends up on wrong side. You will then just need the minimum standard keel to make the boat self-righting and the buoyancy in the ballast enclosure would help with this as well when immersed.

 

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I really don't see the point of these rotating keels. Surely it would be a hell of a lot simpler to have the equivalent of the old sliding plank. You could have a lump of lead or water filled container that slides along a curved plank, which itself can be extended either side of the boat. This would have higher righting moment, less mechanism and because it is out of the water all the time there is less drag, and it can have an air volume equal to or greater than the mass of lead, so the boat is less likely to capsize if it ends up on wrong side. You will then just need the minimum standard keel to make the boat self-righting and the buoyancy in the ballast enclosure would help with this as well when immersed.

I think you're 100% right as did Julian Bethwaite Paul Cayard and Russel Coutts. And one of the Herreshoffs in the 1850's(?) built several succesfull race boats with on-deck movable ballast. But when a design for a dinghy using this kind of system was suggested in DA the majority "shouted it down".

You might want to check the thread out. I believe either I or someone else will prove the viability of such a system in a modern boat(already proven in the old days! ) Anyway, either I'm very wrong(I'm not) or quite a few others are: http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?showtopic=146245&st=0

 

On-deck Movable Ballast designs-1) 18 footer,2) 14 footer,3) Bethwaite/Coutts/Cayard Pterodactyl-Coutts wanted sliding lead, Bethwaite wanted water. No pictures of Herreshoffs on-deck movable ballast boats-iron on rails(!)-and very fast:

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I'd feel better about these projects if there was some discrete data being offered up as opposed to a bunch of videos showing undisclosed speeds and comments from otherwise intelligent people saying "wow, sailing the <insert version of the boat here> was really cool!" none of this helps define if Vlad is actually making progress on attaining multihull speeds in a monohull, or if it's just another 49er with more parts to break.

Im with you on this one. For some reason they seem to think they have some massive secret that everyone is out to steal, and providing any data like tacking or gybing or even any actual numbers on speed will suddenly result in 100 other people producing copies of their design.....that or its shit and isnt working as well as they hoped.

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