• Announcements

    • UnderDawg

      A Few Simple Rules   05/22/2017

      Sailing Anarchy is a very lightly moderated site. This is by design, to afford a more free atmosphere for discussion. There are plenty of sailing forums you can go to where swearing isn't allowed, confrontation is squelched and, and you can have a moderator finger-wag at you for your attitude. SA tries to avoid that and allow for more adult behavior without moderators editing your posts and whacking knuckles with rulers. We don't have a long list of published "thou shalt nots" either, and this is by design. Too many absolute rules paints us into too many corners. So check the Terms of Service - there IS language there about certain types of behavior that is not permitted. We interpret that lightly and permit a lot of latitude, but we DO reserve the right to take action when something is too extreme to tolerate (too racist, graphic, violent, misogynistic, etc.). Yes, that is subjective, but it allows us discretion. Avoiding a laundry list of rules allows for freedom; don't abuse it. However there ARE a few basic rules that will earn you a suspension, and apparently a brief refresher is in order. 1) Allegations of pedophilia - there is no tolerance for this. So if you make allegations, jokes, innuendo or suggestions about child molestation, child pornography, abuse or inappropriate behavior with minors etc. about someone on this board you will get a time out. This is pretty much automatic; this behavior can have real world effect and is not acceptable. Obviously the subject is not banned when discussion of it is apropos, e.g. talking about an item in the news for instance. But allegations or references directed at or about another poster is verboten. 2) Outing people - providing real world identifiable information about users on the forums who prefer to remain anonymous. Yes, some of us post with our real names - not a problem to use them. However many do NOT, and if you find out someone's name keep it to yourself, first or last. This also goes for other identifying information too - employer information etc. You don't need too many pieces of data to figure out who someone really is these days. Depending on severity you might get anything from a scolding to a suspension - so don't do it. I know it can be confusing sometimes for newcomers, as SA has been around almost twenty years and there are some people that throw their real names around and their current Display Name may not match the name they have out in the public. But if in doubt, you don't want to accidentally out some one so use caution, even if it's a personal friend of yours in real life. 3) Posting While Suspended - If you've earned a timeout (these are fairly rare and hard to get), please observe the suspension. If you create a new account (a "Sock Puppet") and return to the forums to post with it before your suspension is up you WILL get more time added to your original suspension and lose your Socks. This behavior may result a permanent ban, since it shows you have zero respect for the few rules we have and the moderating team that is tasked with supporting them. Check the Terms of Service you agreed to; they apply to the individual agreeing, not the account you created, so don't try to Sea Lawyer us if you get caught. Just don't do it. Those are the three that will almost certainly get you into some trouble. IF YOU SEE SOMEONE DO ONE OF THESE THINGS, please do the following: Refrain from quoting the offending text, it makes the thread cleanup a pain in the rear Press the Report button; it is by far the best way to notify Admins as we will get e-mails. Calling out for Admins in the middle of threads, sending us PM's, etc. - there is no guarantee we will get those in a timely fashion. There are multiple Moderators in multiple time zones around the world, and anyone one of us can handle the Report and all of us will be notified about it. But if you PM one Mod directly and he's off line, the problem will get dealt with much more slowly. Other behaviors that you might want to think twice before doing include: Intentionally disrupting threads and discussions repeatedly. Off topic/content free trolling in threads to disrupt dialog Stalking users around the forums with the intent to disrupt content and discussion Repeated posting of overly graphic or scatological porn content. There are plenty web sites for you to get your freak on, don't do it here. And a brief note to Newbies... No, we will not ban people or censor them for dropping F-bombs on you, using foul language, etc. so please don't report it when one of our members gives you a greeting you may find shocking. We do our best not to censor content here and playing swearword police is not in our job descriptions. Sailing Anarchy is more like a bar than a classroom, so handle it like you would meeting someone a little coarse - don't look for the teacher. Thanks.

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

waterboy42

Who owns Team NZ

14 posts in this topic

I was arguing the cause of ETNZ receiving NZ Govt funding with a friend the other day. He was arguing that ETNZ is not a New Zealand team, but a private organisation with international staff in a sport with compartively minor public participation and therefore shouldn't be supported with taxpayer contributions.

 

My argument was they are essentially a NZ team, probably in Trust format, with the express mission of returning the AC to NZ (with all the spin off benefits that brings) and probably run campaigns aiming on break-even (aside from hopefully paying the talent what they are worth) so deserve support.

 

The discussion got me thinking and researching, but I found it difficult to find any info on ETNZ's constitution.

I vaguely recall a falling out between RC, BB and Peter Blake over control and structure of TNZ which I think either Russell and/or PB mentioned in one of their Biographies as contributing to their exit to Alinghi.

 

So, interested if anyone knows the inside structure of TNZ. LLC?, Trust? Going Concern? Trustees? Shareholders? Directors?

As they are recieving Public funds, are there any Publicly accessible documents w.r.t. this?

 

 

...Got to find something to occupy the time before the 4th of July!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was arguing the cause of ETNZ receiving NZ Govt funding with a friend the other day. He was arguing that ETNZ is not a New Zealand team, but a private organisation with international staff in a sport with compartively minor public participation and therefore shouldn't be supported with taxpayer contributions.

 

My argument was they are essentially a NZ team, probably in Trust format, with the express mission of returning the AC to NZ (with all the spin off benefits that brings) and probably run campaigns aiming on break-even (aside from hopefully paying the talent what they are worth) so deserve support.

 

The discussion got me thinking and researching, but I found it difficult to find any info on ETNZ's constitution.

I vaguely recall a falling out between RC, BB and Peter Blake over control and structure of TNZ which I think either Russell and/or PB mentioned in one of their Biographies as contributing to their exit to Alinghi.

 

So, interested if anyone knows the inside structure of TNZ. LLC?, Trust? Going Concern? Trustees? Shareholders? Directors?

As they are recieving Public funds, are there any Publicly accessible documents w.r.t. this?

 

ETNZ is a company owned by a trust whose trustees are prominent New Zealanders.

It is as true blue New Zealand as you can get.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^^

That makes sense, I'd like to know who the trustees are:

 

Jim Farmer

RNZYS

Stephen Tindall?

Dalton?

Barker?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^^

That makes sense, I'd like to know who the trustees are:

 

Jim Farmer

RNZYS

Stephen Tindall?

Dalton?

Barker?

 

 

By memory Gerry Paykel is one (Like I said, prominent Kiwis)

Would doubt Barker is.

Tindall & Dalton might be

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry but Jaysper is wrong.

 

Team New Zealand Ltd has 2 shareholders, Gary Paykel and Jim Farmer, who jointly hold 790 shares. There are 3 directors of TNZ Ltd, Dalts, Paykel and Farmer.

 

The Team New Zealand Trustee Ltd has not been a shareholder of TNZ Ltd since 2005 and has since been struck off the companies register.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^Pretty sure the event you are referring to is the trust being stripped of its charitable status.

AFAIK, the trust still rules

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Things might have changed since I was last involved (although I don't think so based on public filings), but Team New Zealand itself is a limited company with Jim Farmer and Gary Paykel acting as the shareholders in their capacity as trustees:

 

http://www.business.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/582931

 

Unfortunately the trusts and societies register search function isn't as good as the companies one, but I believe the trust is called the Team New Zealand Trust.

Trust Deed.pdf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah, I see Kiwi_Jons confusion now.

 

whenever a trust buys something (company, house, whatever) the names of the trustees are placed on the deed and NOT the trust itself.

This is the same for our (my wife & I) family trust operates.

 

So the final answer it would seem is that the trustees of the trust are Paykel & Farmer.

 

So, Kiwi as.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Does it really matter? You guys (down under in NZ) should be proud about that team and what it does to your economy. Wish the German gov would be that smart but than, we might not find such a leader as you have in GD to get things rolling. No wonder our marine industry is tumbling and innovation is not coming from this end of the world. I am in the composite biz in GER since ´77 and can only say that we have lost it... Therefore I am a fanboy of the ETNZ and former NZ teams and have very good memories about all your challenges. Keep up the good work ETNZ!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Things might have changed since I was last involved (although I don't think so based on public filings), but Team New Zealand itself is a limited company with Jim Farmer and Gary Paykel acting as the shareholders in their capacity as trustees:

 

http://www.business.govt.nz/companies/app/ui/pages/companies/582931

 

Unfortunately the trusts and societies register search function isn't as good as the companies one, but I believe the trust is called the Team New Zealand Trust.

 

Thanks for that... Brilliant!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah, I see Kiwi_Jons confusion now.

 

whenever a trust buys something (company, house, whatever) the names of the trustees are placed on the deed and NOT the trust itself.

This is the same for our (my wife & I) family trust operates.

 

So the final answer it would seem is that the trustees of the trust are Paykel & Farmer.

 

So, Kiwi as.

 

Agreed...

 

 

With Paykel and Farmer at the reins (or at least backing up Dalts), there aren't many who have given more the NZ Sailing.

 

My thoughts are two very safe pairs of hands and fairly silent contributors to a first rate challenge.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think this question gets to the crux of the problem with RC. Blake had the utter respect of the trustees (and other senior backers) RC seemed to think that he had a better model but would not get support from Blake or the trustees. So RC walked.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Does it really matter? You guys (down under in NZ) should be proud about that team and what it does to your economy. Wish the German gov would be that smart but than, we might not find such a leader as you have in GD to get things rolling. No wonder our marine industry is tumbling and innovation is not coming from this end of the world. I am in the composite biz in GER since ´77 and can only say that we have lost it... Therefore I am a fanboy of the ETNZ and former NZ teams and have very good memories about all your challenges. Keep up the good work ETNZ!

 

You're right, it's great that we support ETNZ and win or lose, I'm immensely proud of the quality of their effort.

 

I think there are huge spin offs direct and indirect for NZ Sailing, Marine Industry, and wider High Tech industries profile in seeing that we can mix it with a tech billionaire in from the worlds greatest tech region in the worlds most advanced economy.

 

The profile TNZ has given NZ sailing has helped launch scores of rewarding international careers for young kiwi sailors and Marine Industry people.

 

I just like to have my facts straight so I can have a reasoned and intelligent argument against my stingey luddite mates, and a good portion of the NZ public, who can't see the value in backing winners.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So, Kiwi as.

Yup, legally murky & run by some very rich people who don't like to be in the public eye: That is certainly the Kiwi way of doing business ^_^

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites