Barnyb

Team UK

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5 hours ago, Mozzy Sails said:

BAR were always royal yacht squadron. Royal Yacht Squadron racing was always the buffer company affiliated to the RYS, presumably so the yacht club can't go bankrupt if everything goes to the wall. 

Right on! Which just goes to prove you should not get your "news" from Instagram dweebs!

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10 hours ago, Xlot said:

Wow - silky take-off, rock steady foiling! Why all the fuss about control systems? :D.

I would now say that, irrespective of a 2nd US challenger, the field is worthy of a proper AC

 

Yeah! BA just wheeled out the Big Guns.  

The stakes just got a whole lot bigger. And this vid is just a harbinger of things to come.  By far and away the best graphic explanation for sailors and the great unwashed public about the new boats and how they are supposed to operate.

As for the silky smooth, well Xlot, they're working right now on the pitching-heeling-near-capsizing-totally-out-of-control version!

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Why would somebody put up that much money when LR and ETNZ say it can be done for $50m? ;)

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110 million is a nice way to get the ball rolling and its nice to see that the company many bankrolling the team is actually from the same country as the team itself. 

Land Rover is miffed but they will get over it and perhaps put that money into a more comprehensive quality control department.

Apparently that one guy they have working there part time is not keeping up with the production line :) 

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5 hours ago, KiwiJoker said:

Right on! Which just goes to prove you should not get your "news" from Instagram dweebs!

How dare I quote the team from their release on their Instagram feed. And I don't get my news from Instagram, it was merely the first mention of the Sponsorship I had seen and was confused by the Royal Cowes Yacht Squadron Racing name, having never heard it used before.

And now back to your usual progrramming.

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7 hours ago, KiwiJoker said:

As for the silky smooth, well Xlot, they're working right now on the pitching-heeling-near-capsizing-totally-out-of-control version!

 

So you heard that too :)  I'm told "observers" were not overly impressed

 

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OK I'm convinced. I can't cheer on a team with Jim Radcliffe as the backer. Bummer. What a dislikeable collection of challengers we seem to have for AC36.

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2 hours ago, maxmini said:

110 million is a nice way to get the ball rolling and its nice to see that the company many bankrolling the team is actually from the same country as the team itself. 

Land Rover is miffed but they will get over it and perhaps put that money into a more comprehensive quality control department.

Apparently that one guy they have working there part time is not keeping up with the production line :) 

110 million pounds*

or 151 million USD

or 215 million NZD

wowza

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On 08/11/2017 at 6:59 PM, Barnyb said:

Ben Ainslie is determined to atone in 2021

BEN AINSLIE admits he cannot wait to get going with another bid to win the America’s Cup after the ‘pain’ of missing out in Bermuda earlier this year.

 

‘It’s still a bitter disappointment, despite how well it went in many ways, because we didn’t win in Bermuda and that is painful,’ the 40-year-old told Metro.

‘But if anything it’s heightened my determination to go and put that right next time. We set high standards for ourselves and everyone is doing this for just one reason, and that is to win the America’s Cup.’

‘I didn’t come back from Bermuda feeling much went our way in the luck stakes,’ said the skipper.

https://www.metro.news/ben-ainslie-is-determined-to-atone-in-2021/812017/

Translation. 

 

I’m on very good deal and I want to keep my pay cheques coming in!! 

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16 minutes ago, dogwatch said:

OK I'm convinced. I can't cheer on a team with Jim Radcliffe as the backer. Bummer. What a dislikeable collection of challengers we seem to have for AC36.

 

Don't know what your beef with Bertelli is about - if anything, I find him in character

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Bertelli is at least someone that has some principles, and sticks to them.  Also, all the people that worked with him rated him personally very highly.

Think of it this way though, two boats=twice as much chance to stuff it up even more than last time.  Running two boat programs is a lot harder than doing one and doing it properly, simply in terms of personnel and management.   Time is the enemy, not cash.

Still, would expect that BA has improved his paypacket a chunk on this deal:)  Pity about the eco stuff and green initiatives.

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Ah hmm. Theirs was a 4 or (5?) boat program last time, this should be a piece of cake. So much money, so few builds.

'Cleanest' to dirtiest campaign - in one big cheque. :D

image.png.a00e5b241c058dd934294265db2a2abe.png

"Principles? Don't be silly - that was all spin"

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+1

And you do get the A team v the B team mentality issues - and we know who the A team will be lead by even if B team proves to be the quicker one.  GB teams have form in this department.

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Whilst this news is a bit of a sorry state for a team which has focused heavily on the green/sustainability aspects to an organisation, we need to remember that the team was setup to bring the cup home back to the UK for the first time. £110 Million is a hefty investment which gives the new team what it needs to win the cup in theory.

I cant see Greenpeace putting up this amount of cash!!

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^ There might be still more to the change is looks like.

(and sure they 'hoped' to win the cup 'back' - eventually, but that was not the only motivation - it always had the look of a reward scheme for BA to be honest)

It was a bit of the 'Knights of the Round Table' last time with additional Royal patronage and access to convenient public 'development' funds, lightning fast planning permission etc. Even the UK car brands used to be 'semi-publicly supported', not sure that played any role last time though given the Tata Group ownership, maybe hung on some sympathetic board members? They sound like they were happy with what they got out of it in the end though. Even if they will be left unimpressed with the loyalty shown them. Anyway.....

This looks to have gone completely over to the dark side now, are any of those Sirs(apart from SBA)/Duchesses still involved . Or have the whole bunch been dumped/withdrawn now in favour/because of filthy new lucre?

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2 hours ago, Purple Headed Warrior said:

 we need to remember that the team was setup to bring the cup home back to the UK for the first time.

Some prices aren't worth paying.

 

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But it's ok to support a team taking money from from a "government" owned corporation, where the government is known for it's human rights abuse and makes huge amounts of money from oil?

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1 hour ago, See Level said:

But it's ok to support a team taking money from from a "government" owned corporation, where the government is known for it's human rights abuse and makes huge amounts of money from oil?

 

You're right - so I think the 2nd US team should be shut out (or were you talking about TeamFrack?)

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Ffs the nasty fracking man is supporting the team...,

 

yeah because  building £60k+ suvs that burned a shit load of fossil fuel was super green and on brand wasn’t it?

And if the bitching is being typed on a phone or a computer using rare earth metals then you can get fucked too.you think it just lays around waiting to be collected or some poor kid is clawing it out of the earth for sfa with no health cover.

 

Building and sailing big expensive carbon boats was never and will never green, if you believed it was your more stupid than the marketing dept that’s selling you the story. 

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A rich brit, living in Switzerland, having sometimes his yacht in Ireland, knowing about sailing and the AC, well, makes me think of somebody here. I might be wrong though.

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8 hours ago, JALhazmat said:

Building and sailing big expensive carbon boats was never and will never green, if you believed it was your more stupid than the marketing dept that’s selling you the story. 

Agreed, racing sailboats is not nearly as green as it might appear. So let's get that particular argument out of the way.

The assertion that unless you live in a mud hut and knit your own muesli, you cannot invoke green considerations is a flawed cliché. We all have a spectrum of changes we are and are not prepared to make.

I don't necessarily object to fracking everywhere. The issue in Southern England, which happens to be where I live, is that it is a highly populated area where 70% of the water supply is drawn from aquifers. There is no practical alternative water supply. The risk of polluting those aquifers in order to obtain a minor and marginal quantity of oil is disproportionate.  

My objections to Ineos are not only or even primarily because the company engages in fracking.

I entirely disagree with Jim Ratlcliffe's pro-Brexit stance https://www.ft.com/content/f9a55b20-2e0c-11e5-91ac-a5e17d9b4cff with its dim-witted belief that it will result in the same market access as Norway and Switzerland when that goes 100% against the maximum-Brexit agenda of the Tory backbenchers on whom May relies for her majority. It does not take a genius to link that stance to Ineos' self-serving lobbying for Britain to evade carbon-control taxation post-Brexit. https://www.businessgreen.com/bg/news/3007662/ineos-leads-industry-lobbying-to-avoid-paying-green-tax

Ineos has a questionable record on safety and environmental concerns https://www.foodandwaterwatch.org/insight/ineos-chequered-environmental-track-record-europe

Last but not least, Ineos exerts its financial clout to bring lawsuits to suppress protest against its activities. I support the traditional British right to protest and be a bloody nuisance - whether the protest is right or wrong. https://www.leighday.co.uk/News/News-2018/February-2018/Environmental-lawyers-lodge-appeal-against-INEOS-i

For me, "Ineos Team GB" triggers my gag reflex. I wish the team doom and unmitigated failure unless and until they find alternative sponsorship.

 

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At the end of the day... who really gives a damn about bad publicity (everyone). But as long as they have their wonga and making the fastest boat and winning I'm pretty sure more than a few anti fracking activists will conveniently forget that team gb is sponsored by Ineos. Besides the livery looks kewl. In formula 1, do you care whether the team is winning races and championships or whether it looks good cus' Marlboro sponsor it. I don't care about the sponsors so long as the team is winning.

God speed Ineos Team GB

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8 minutes ago, Raptorsailor said:

At the end of the day... who really gives a damn about bad publicity (everyone). But as long as they have their wonga and making the fastest boat and winning I'm pretty sure more than a few anti fracking activists will conveniently forget that team gb is sponsored by Ineos. Besides the livery looks kewl. In formula 1, do you care whether the team is winning races and championships or whether it looks good cus' Marlboro sponsor it. I don't care about the sponsors so long as the team is winning.

God speed Ineos Team GB

Good points, but I predict huge pay raises, further arrogance and a complete lack of results. 

Lets wait and see. :)

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well if that crap video was anything to go by then will be same as before, all bullshit and no results.  Wonder if they will get paid on results?  

I sincerely hope the Royal connection is chopped off too, not the sort of shonky biz HRH would want to be associated with.

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10 hours ago, Raptorsailor said:

 But as long as they have their wonga and making the fastest boat and winning I'm pretty sure more than a few anti fracking activists will conveniently forget that team gb is sponsored by Ineos.

I'm pretty sure they won't. Lots of comments on https://www.facebook.com/INEOSTeamGB/   and most are negative.

Ineos is currently suing the National Trust which is refusing exploratory drilling on its land. https://drillordrop.com/2018/02/23/yorkshire-landowners-back-national-trust-in-ineos-legal-challenge/

The National Trust has 5 million members, making it by a considerable margin the largest direct membership body in the UK. How to win friends and influence people. 

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Frack me.....BA says first test boats (theirs and other teams) will be out in the coming year - but an 'insider' or two here have assured us they already exist and have been used - who to believe?

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2 hours ago, dogwatch said:

I'm pretty sure they won't. Lots of comments on https://www.facebook.com/INEOSTeamGB/   and most are negative.

Ineos is currently suing the National Trust which is refusing exploratory drilling on its land. https://drillordrop.com/2018/02/23/yorkshire-landowners-back-national-trust-in-ineos-legal-challenge/

The National Trust has 5 million members, making it by a considerable margin the largest direct membership body in the UK. How to win friends and influence people. 

Morality level zero.    Environmental concerns zero.   Expect to see 'Sir'B on the board next as he fits the mould exactly.

 

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On 4/30/2018 at 5:31 AM, mad said:

Good points, but I predict huge pay raises, further arrogance and a complete lack of results. 

Lets wait and see. :)

 

On 4/30/2018 at 6:54 PM, Purple Headed Warrior said:

You summed up my opinion on the campaign in one short sentence...

Wow, tough audience.

Consider this. No AC team that started from scratch has ever won first time out (Alinghi bought a team so didn't start from scratch). After his first campaign as a team, Ainslie knew he needed to make changes so did so. He has brought in the most experienced and successful CEO in the AC world (most wins, most campaigns, best win/loss ratio etc). He has got one of the best designers in the AC world. He has made sure he has the budget needed. Also consider that Ainslie is now one of the most experienced AC sailors and that every major event he has set out to win he has actually won, usually ending up totally dominating. BAR has been working non stop since the end of the last campaign to improve all areas and has been paying particular attention to strengthening their design team and predictive modelling. Ainslie has been totally ruthless in his pursuit of an AC win, dumping people and sponsors to position the team as best as possible. 

What more could he do, yet despite all that, people are writing the team off straight away. There is no challenger in a better situation in terms of people, money and experience. Write them off at your peril.

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On 30/04/2018 at 9:54 AM, Purple Headed Warrior said:

You summed up my opinion on the campaign in one short sentence... Nice work!

 

Team Origin didn’t accomplish a lot either. 

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9 minutes ago, Team_GBR said:

 

Wow, tough audience.

Consider this. No AC team that started from scratch has ever won first time out (Alinghi bought a team so didn't start from scratch). After his first campaign as a team, Ainslie knew he needed to make changes so did so. He has brought in the most experienced and successful CEO in the AC world (most wins, most campaigns, best win/loss ratio etc). He has got one of the best designers in the AC world. He has made sure he has the budget needed. Also consider that Ainslie is now one of the most experienced AC sailors and that every major event he has set out to win he has actually won, usually ending up totally dominating. BAR has been working non stop since the end of the last campaign to improve all areas and has been paying particular attention to strengthening their design team and predictive modelling. Ainslie has been totally ruthless in his pursuit of an AC win, dumping people and sponsors to position the team as best as possible. 

What more could he do, yet despite all that, people are writing the team off straight away. There is no challenger in a better situation in terms of people, money and experience. Write them off at your peril.

Sounds like the AC is Ainslie's sole focus now huh?

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2 minutes ago, sclarke said:

Sounds like the AC is Ainslie's sole focus now huh?

Sole focus is very different from "the only thing he is sailing in". Everything they do is about winning the AC. He has just dropped the TP52 stuff because it has no benefit. He will be doing the AC50 events, because he believes that will help him win the AC.

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15 minutes ago, Team_GBR said:

Sole focus is very different from "the only thing he is sailing in". Everything they do is about winning the AC. He has just dropped the TP52 stuff because it has no benefit. He will be doing the AC50 events, because he believes that will help him win the AC.

Did you even watch the interview posted above? From his own mouth, No He's not lol His test boat is launching in the next 3-4 months, and from then on its all AC training, designing, building, testing and refining his AC campaign. Time to give it up, its history.

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6 hours ago, Team_GBR said:

people are writing the team off straight away. 

I am not writing off the team previously known as LRBAR. I am saying I am now hostile towards them and while I don't imagine BA is losing sleep over my personal opinions, it is clear from the reaction on Facebook that Ineos is a PR disaster.

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6 hours ago, Team_GBR said:

 He has just dropped the TP52 stuff because it has no benefit. 

Nothing to do with the previous sponsor goodwill he has just chucked overboard then? Join the dots.

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9 hours ago, Team_GBR said:

 

Wow, tough audience.

.....

 There is no challenger in a better situation in terms of people, money and experience. Write them off at your peril.

Sounds awfully familiar .....

I'm trying to think how that played out.

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3 hours ago, dogwatch said:

Nothing to do with the previous sponsor goodwill he has just chucked overboard then? Join the dots.

Actually the TP52 decision was made a while ago, before the meeting with Ineous. I understood they are not doing the F50, but they have bought Spindrift's GC32.

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14 hours ago, Team_GBR said:

 

Wow, tough audience.

Consider this. No AC team that started from scratch has ever won first time out (Alinghi bought a team so didn't start from scratch). After his first campaign as a team, Ainslie knew he needed to make changes so did so. He has brought in the most experienced and successful CEO in the AC world (most wins, most campaigns, best win/loss ratio etc). He has got one of the best designers in the AC world. He has made sure he has the budget needed. Also consider that Ainslie is now one of the most experienced AC sailors and that every major event he has set out to win he has actually won, usually ending up totally dominating. BAR has been working non stop since the end of the last campaign to improve all areas and has been paying particular attention to strengthening their design team and predictive modelling. Ainslie has been totally ruthless in his pursuit of an AC win, dumping people and sponsors to position the team as best as possible. 

What more could he do, yet despite all that, people are writing the team off straight away. There is no challenger in a better situation in terms of people, money and experience. Write them off at your peril.

I am far from writing the team off, in fact as you have well put they are in good stance to do some serious damage at the next cup.

My question is whats to like? The team hardly comes across as likeable... 

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14 hours ago, Team_GBR said:

Sole focus is very different from "the only thing he is sailing in". Everything they do is about winning the AC. He has just dropped the TP52 stuff because it has no benefit. He will be doing the AC50 events, because he believes that will help him win the AC.

I bet the TP owner Langley will be happy about that.... Re-branded all of his boats and built up a new squad prior to a busy season and now...... dropped... 

I would have thought this is the one boat you would keep, work on communication/teamwork in a mono with similar crew numbers and try people out.

Surprised as other teams have made the effort to run with a TP

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6 minutes ago, Purple Headed Warrior said:

I bet the TP owner Langley will be happy about that.... Re-branded all of his boats and built up a new squad prior to a busy season and now...... dropped... 

I would have thought this is the one boat you would keep, work on communication/teamwork in a mono with similar crew numbers and try people out.

Surprised as other teams have made the effort to run with a TP

Ben knows best. :ph34r:

....hopefully he gets recompensed for it. 

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On 4/30/2018 at 8:50 AM, nav said:

Frack me.....BA says first test boats (theirs and other teams) will be out in the coming year - but an 'insider' or two here have assured us they already exist and have been used - who to believe?

Spies tell me they've been chopping up and modifying an existing 30' sports boat for the last couple of months, so that can't be far off a splash you'd think. Sooner you get a tester out there the better and find out what the real problems are going to be.  damn sure it won't be as smooth a ride as that crappy video.

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14 minutes ago, mad said:

Ben knows best. :ph34r:

....hopefully he gets recompensed for it. 

Ben knows best... lets watch this space!

I look forward to seeing the Gladiator crew lineup for the TPs, surely he cant let him down that much... 

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3 minutes ago, GBH said:

Spies tell me they've been chopping up and modifying an existing 30' sports boat for the last couple of months, so that can't be far off a splash you'd think. Sooner you get a tester out there the better and find out what the real problems are going to be.  damn sure it won't be as smooth a ride as that crappy video.

Its going to be back to sailing school for a few years I reckon.

Cant wait to see a tack in some big breeze!

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1 hour ago, GBH said:

Spies tell me they've been chopping up and modifying an existing 30' sports boat for the last couple of months, so ...

 

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Are they in distress? Is that the reason the Union Jack is upside down on the home page and in the videos? Or does it just look that way when viewed from the other side of the channel...

 

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17 hours ago, Purple Headed Warrior said:

Who would build the big boats? 

Is Jason Carringtons new facility suitable for this? 

Jason has the shed space, but don't know how large his ovens are or if modular...then again a metric shit ton of money can solve the oven problem. 

Who knows if Jason would be willing to be tied to a cup team looking forward or whether he wants to stick to individual custom builds...watch this space 

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To me this is really sad news. As sailors we should give a shit about the planet. We don’t have to bang on about it the way that LBAR did, but this is a very ugly about turn. 

Ineos have some very ugly things linked to them, not least the pro-Brexit stance being in support of relaxing environmental law. As a UK sailing fan I find this sad news and very brazen indeed. 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/brexit-ineos-climate-change-laws-lobbying-exploiting-uk-eu-withdrawal-foi-documents-a7665136.html

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^

INEOS Team GB dockout music?  Lyrics are perfect.

Won't you take me down                  Sign with the devil                  

Right on!

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On 5/3/2018 at 11:24 AM, TANGO QUEBEC said:

Jason has the shed space, but don't know how large his ovens are or if modular...then again a metric shit ton of money can solve the oven problem. 

Who knows if Jason would be willing to be tied to a cup team looking forward or whether he wants to stick to individual custom builds...watch this space 

Mega tons of money would get me well stuck in....

There is clearly an opening to other larger projects coming up shortly due to Greens going down the pan.

Jason is a smashing chap and would do a fantastic job.... Who wouldnt want to build a winning cup boat?!

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Agreed, he’s the obvious first choice in the UK. 

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1 hour ago, mad said:

Agreed, he’s the obvious first choice in the UK. 

Good luck to that man, if him building a winning AC boat is the best that can come of the UK campaign then I will be happy.

Nice man,,,, quality builder... great innovator... A pillar in the UK boat building community!

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The quality of the build won’t be an issue. The design and sailing of it however? 

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Just now, Purple Headed Warrior said:

Just throw money at it! Thats what ETNZ did in the last cup......

Oh.... wait a minute!

i dunno, i've heard that ETNZ had more money than it appeared

you can't doubt that Dalton played the poor man a bit much even for how much money that everyone knew they had, it was a smart move though and i don't blame him at all

but i don't think that they ever accounted for luna rossa's money when announcing the budget, plus all the R and D that luna rossa practically gave them which would of cost ETNZ money had they done it themselves.

they won the cup and deserved it, but i don't think they had as little money as they made out to have.

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5 hours ago, inebriated said:

i dunno, i've heard that ETNZ had more money than it appeared

you can't doubt that Dalton played the poor man a bit much even for how much money that everyone knew they had, it was a smart move though and i don't blame him at all

but i don't think that they ever accounted for luna rossa's money when announcing the budget, plus all the R and D that luna rossa practically gave them which would of cost ETNZ money had they done it themselves.

they won the cup and deserved it, but i don't think they had as little money as they made out to have.

Unbeliever! Stone him!

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1 hour ago, The Main Man said:

Unbeliever! Stone him!

Did ETNZ spend more than Oracle?

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This got ugly fast . 

 

LONDON (#1004) – It's an embarrassment for [Sir Ben] Ainslie who was the first Olympian to win medals in five different Olympic Games in sailing, with his haul including four golds. The latest development comes after some criticism for switching his sponsorship to [INEOS Chairman and CEO Jim] Ratcliffe, a pro-Brexit businessman whose company is one of the main fracking firms in the UK. The Telegraph reported on Wednesday that [British] Olympic bosses told the billionaire they would never give up the trademark for free, with money gained from it used to back Britain's Olympic campaigns. The respected newspaper said "the row escalated with Mr Ratcliffe writing to the BOA, saying he 'naively' thought use of Team GB would be seen in a 'patriotic light', and claiming he was told he faced a multi-million bill to use the trademark. "As a result, the businessman invited BOA to 'take a long walk off a short plank' in the letter, saying he would rename the yachting campaign to 'Team UK, which I much prefer'."  –Excerpt from a Wednesday morning article on New Zealand's stuff.co.nz website. Read the full story here.

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On 4/26/2018 at 9:44 PM, nav said:

:lol: Shame the Challenging YC is not located within GB eh

image.thumb.png.6a02322961922c9c37c29a22fb96f58a.png

Might wanna think about that again maybe?

Amateurs.....

 

:D

and new Team name = thread name, so all good...

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On 5/6/2018 at 12:51 PM, inebriated said:

i dunno, i've heard that ETNZ had more money than it appeared

you can't doubt that Dalton played the poor man a bit much even for how much money that everyone knew they had, it was a smart move though and i don't blame him at all

but i don't think that they ever accounted for luna rossa's money when announcing the budget, plus all the R and D that luna rossa practically gave them which would of cost ETNZ money had they done it themselves.

they won the cup and deserved it, but i don't think they had as little money as they made out to have.

This

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2 hours ago, maxmini said:

This got ugly fast . 

 

LONDON (#1004) – It's an embarrassment for [Sir Ben] Ainslie who was the first Olympian to win medals in five different Olympic Games in sailing, with his haul including four golds. The latest development comes after some criticism for switching his sponsorship to [INEOS Chairman and CEO Jim] Ratcliffe, a pro-Brexit businessman whose company is one of the main fracking firms in the UK. The Telegraph reported on Wednesday that [British] Olympic bosses told the billionaire they would never give up the trademark for free, with money gained from it used to back Britain's Olympic campaigns. The respected newspaper said "the row escalated with Mr Ratcliffe writing to the BOA, saying he 'naively' thought use of Team GB would be seen in a 'patriotic light', and claiming he was told he faced a multi-million bill to use the trademark. "As a result, the businessman invited BOA to 'take a long walk off a short plank' in the letter, saying he would rename the yachting campaign to 'Team UK, which I much prefer'."  –Excerpt from a Wednesday morning article on New Zealand's stuff.co.nz website. Read the full story here.

Amazed that an organization with so much experience of the internal workings of Team GB and the BOA made the schoolboy error of renaming to "Ineos Team GB". It was a matter of time before they would be forced into a name change.

 

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4 hours ago, maxmini said:

 The respected newspaper said 

That's a pretty questionable description for what is very much a one-eyed right-wing publication.

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10 hours ago, MischiefBDA said:

This

A - what would either of you know?

B - who fucking cares

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8 hours ago, dogwatch said:

That's a pretty questionable description for what is very much a one-eyed right-wing publication.

The Telegraph is without doubt a respected establishment newspaper. The Guardian leans heavily to the left, but it's still respected. 

Ben sold his soul, but who honestly wouldn't for that much money?

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On 4/26/2018 at 10:41 PM, Mozzy Sails said:

 

It can be confusing with Great Britain also being the name of the mainland, but GB and UK (and GBR) are used interchangeably as shorthand for United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Island. 

It may be common slang in southern England to use GB when UK is meant (and vice versa), but don't go to Northern Ireland and say that for goodness sake.  

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What's most odd is that this is playing out between Ratcliffe and the BOA, as opposed to anyone from the actual team (for instance Ben or Grant) and the BOA.

It would be like the CEO of Emirates taking on a debate about ETNZ's name with the NZ Olympic Committee and also taking it to the press - bizarre!

Even down to his comment telling them to 'take a long walk off a short plank' and that he 'much prefer' Team UK. It's all about him, not the team. So it didn't take long for Ben's Faustian deal to manifest itself, with him now sitting silent whilst Beelzebub himself is dominating all and sundry, and shitting on Ben's life-long relationships with respected bodies like the BOA.

If it's like this now, I hate to think what will happen once Ratcliffe starts having ideas about how to compete in the AC.

I'm pretty sure we just found ourselves a new billionaire on a personal ego trip to win the cup, and he simply acquired a team to do his bidding - not simply a wealthy sponsor for Team GB. 

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  ^  Like I said, uncanny similarities with Raul Gardini. Don't know how many of you remember/understood his statements in Italian at the time of the bowsprit querelle. Fortunately, his "interpreter" (who was he? Not Cayard) omitted them

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25 minutes ago, Xlot said:

 

  ^  Like I said, uncanny similarities with Raul Gardini. Don't know how many of you remember/understood his statements in Italian at the time of the bowsprit querelle. Fortunately, his "interpreter" (who was he? Not Cayard) omitted them

Could you provide more info?

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Too long ago - what I remember was the presser after a race (must have been the one where NZ's win was canceled) and Gardini's original comments about unsportsmanship being way beyond the pale. The translation by a visibly embarassed crew member was much milder. I suppose the organizers just pretended nobody understood Italian and left it at that

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15 hours ago, MischiefBDA said:

Amazed that an organization with so much experience of the internal workings of Team GB and the BOA made the schoolboy error of renaming to "Ineos Team GB". It was a matter of time before they would be forced into a name change.

The name situation isn't quite as straight forward as it might seem. Team GB is not a name that most sailors use or are familiar with. The sailing team is formally called British Sailing Team" and is shortened by many to Team GBR because of GBR being on the sail. I have never used the term Team GB is sailing or seen it used. If they had called themselves "Ineos Team GBR" I think there would have been a huge stink from people in the sailing community, but nobody said anything. It was the British Olympic Association who kicked up a fuss, not the British Sailing Team.

You could argue that they should have made sure the name "Team GB" was available, but that wouldn't have come from having "so much experience of the inner workings of Team GB" because the name isn't common parlance in British sailing. Notice how nobody in sailing kicked off about it. In my case, if they had called it "Ineos Team GBR" I would have been seriously pissed but I actually thought they had been smart dropping the "R"!

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12 hours ago, sosoomii said:

The Telegraph is without doubt a respected establishment newspaper.

Hardly. Neither the paper nor its owners are respected.

Actually I don't think any British daily newspaper could be considered "respected" today. 

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8 hours ago, Team_GBR said:

The name situation isn't quite as straight forward as it might seem. Team GB is not a name that most sailors use or are familiar with. The sailing team is formally called British Sailing Team" and is shortened by many to Team GBR because of GBR being on the sail. I have never used the term Team GB is sailing or seen it used. If they had called themselves "Ineos Team GBR" I think there would have been a huge stink from people in the sailing community, but nobody said anything. It was the British Olympic Association who kicked up a fuss, not the British Sailing Team.

You could argue that they should have made sure the name "Team GB" was available, but that wouldn't have come from having "so much experience of the inner workings of Team GB" because the name isn't common parlance in British sailing. Notice how nobody in sailing kicked off about it. In my case, if they had called it "Ineos Team GBR" I would have been seriously pissed but I actually thought they had been smart dropping the "R"!

I assumed the name was a strategic thing linking team GBR with the Americas Cup to filter the sailors into commercial yachting....

I assumed wrong!

Schoolboy

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"...Team GB is not a name that most sailors use or are familiar with."

Blah blah....

image.png.f86e34bb703c4ec3fbb5a669e73af477.png

https://www.teamgb.com/

https://twitter.com/teamgb

https://www.youtube.com/user/teamGBtv/videos

https://www.instagram.com/teamgb/

https://www.teamgblive.com/

Team GB's victorious Olympians bask in gold medal glory as they touch down at Heathrow to be reunited with their families  

etc etc.....

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download.png.b737e69ea23a9ad3a5963518b2084581.png

12 hours ago, Team_GBR said:

The name situation isn't quite as straight forward as it might seem. Team GB is not a name that most sailors use or are familiar with. The sailing team is formally called British Sailing Team" and is shortened by many to Team GBR because of GBR being on the sail. I have never used the term Team GB is sailing or seen it used. If they had called themselves "Ineos Team GBR" I think there would have been a huge stink from people in the sailing community, but nobody said anything. It was the British Olympic Association who kicked up a fuss, not the British Sailing Team.

You could argue that they should have made sure the name "Team GB" was available, but that wouldn't have come from having "so much experience of the inner workings of Team GB" because the name isn't common parlance in British sailing. Notice how nobody in sailing kicked off about it. In my case, if they had called it "Ineos Team GBR" I would have been seriously pissed but I actually thought they had been smart dropping the "R"!

I disagree ..

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On 5/9/2018 at 8:14 PM, sosoomii said:

It may be common slang in southern England to use GB when UK is meant (and vice versa), but don't go to Northern Ireland and say that for goodness sake.  

Well, northern Ireland has it's own separate complexities, but having competed on Team GBR with sailors from Northern Ireland I know not all feel that way. And many identify as British. But i would still understand people from there, even unionists taking offence. 

But GB is certainly not slang and is used often in formal circumstances, as well as for most 'teams' representing the UK. 

But, more importantly than anything, my post was in context of Nav's somewhat veiled point that the challenging yacht had been changed and was now no longer in GB, but was in the UK. Which is wrong on both counts; the yacht club has always been RYS, based in Cowes, and Cowes is GB as much as it is UK. 

Anyway, this has all been usurped by the much more interesting conflict between Ineos Team UK (formerly GB) and BOA. 

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10 hours ago, nav said:

"...Team GB is not a name that most sailors use or are familiar with."

Blah blah....

image.png.f86e34bb703c4ec3fbb5a669e73af477.png

https://www.teamgb.com/

https://twitter.com/teamgb

https://www.youtube.com/user/teamGBtv/videos

https://www.instagram.com/teamgb/

https://www.teamgblive.com/

Team GB's victorious Olympians bask in gold medal glory as they touch down at Heathrow to be reunited with their families  

etc etc.....

I think Team_GBR is right here, even if he goes a bit far by saying no sailor would have heard of 'team GB'.

The point is, the UK sailing team, as run by the RYA, is 'The British Sailing Team' and shortened to Team GBR (on my old jackets at least). 

Team GB is definitely a BOA thing and is run separate from the RYA. It refers to Olympians only. All the commercial links are separate which I guess is of relevance here. (eg. Musto Supplies the British sailing Team, but Addidas supplies Team GB). All the links you sent above are Team GB, none are sailing specific. 

If a sailor said to me they were on Team GBR, or The British Sailing Team I would associate that with being on performance payroll at RYA. If they said they were part of Team GB, I would associate that with the one off representing GB at an Olympics. 

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GB Cycling Team, GB Rowing Team, British Sailing Team, hockey has GB Teams and compete as Great Britain... so seems most major sports, and certainly those reliant on the Olympics paycheck got the 'don't use "Team GB"' message. 

I wonder how vigorously BOA will pursue baseball, ice hockey, foosball, paragliding and obviously the kennel club... maybe they pay? maybe there use is fair enough in that they truly represent GB? Maybe they're too small fry to pursue?

Obviously someone at BOA was especially disgruntled by INEOS and thought they should get a paycheck from the guy handing out cash like it's going out of fashion / thought a fracking company was significantly 'off brand' enough to warrant a defence of the name. 

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3 hours ago, Mozzy Sails said:

 

But, more importantly than anything, my post was in context of Nav's somewhat veiled point that the challenging yacht had been changed and was now no longer in GB, but was in the UK. Which is wrong on both counts; the yacht club has always been RYS, based in Cowes, and Cowes is GB as much as it is UK. 

 

I made no allusion to the YC being changed - that part is just in your head.

You need to take some basic geography mate.

Great Britain is an island. The RYS is in Cowes - on a different island.

But it's ok, it looks like BA has figured that out now :lol:

Alles Klar?

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2 hours ago, Mozzy Sails said:

even if he goes a bit far by saying no sailor would have heard of 'team GB'.

While I agree with most of what you said, please reread my comments because I don't believe I said this.

1 hour ago, Mozzy Sails said:

maybe there use is fair enough in that they truly represent GB? 

I think this is the key. If you are the national team in a sport, it's rather hard to argue you are not Team GB.

It's funny how people who aren't British and who have never been part of the British Sailing Team tell Brits and past members of the British Sailing team that they are wrong about how we refer to the team we were in! Maybe the reason i don't associate with Team GB is because I didn't go to the Olympics, but Olympians are a very small sub set of those who are part of the British Sailing Team and what most of us refer to as Team GBR. As said above, if the team had used the term "Team GBR" I wouldn't have been happy because of all that implies, but i never even thought about Team GB because it is not a term used in sailing.

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2 minutes ago, nav said:

You need to take some basic geography mate.

Great Britain is an island. The RYA is in Cowes - on a different island.

Alles Klar?

How about an NZer stops trying to give lessons in geography and history to Brits who know a lot more than him.

Politically and historically, Great Britain was formed by the combining of the Kingdom of England and the Kingdom of Scotland in 1707 Acts of Union. In case you were wondering, the kingdom of England at that time was considered to be England and Wales. The term United Kingdom is actually short for "The United Kingdom Of Great Britain and Northern Ireland" which was formally established in 1800 as United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland and which was renamed in 1922 after The Irish Free State (renamed Ireland in 1937) left. If the Isle of Wight is not part of Great Britain and it certainly isn't part of Northern Ireland, does that mean it isn't part of the United Kingdom? In political terms, Great Britain refers to the whole of England, Wales and Scotland and includes islands such as the Isle of Wight, Shetland, the Hebrides and the Scilly Isles. It does not include the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands because they self rule and don't send members to parliament.

There is more confusion when it comes to a pure geographical definition, because some some say it is only the mainland and some say it includes some or even all islands. The use of "Great Britain" in geography is a fairly recent thing, but I personally believe it is a bullshit discussion, because what counts is the political and diplomatic use of the term.

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17 minutes ago, Team_GBR said:

How about an NZer stops trying to give lessons in [INSERT TOPIC HERE] to [THE REST OF THE WORLD] who know a lot more than him.

 

Good luck with that. That statement is basically AC Anarchy in a nutshell

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