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    • UnderDawg

      A Few Simple Rules   05/22/2017

      Sailing Anarchy is a very lightly moderated site. This is by design, to afford a more free atmosphere for discussion. There are plenty of sailing forums you can go to where swearing isn't allowed, confrontation is squelched and, and you can have a moderator finger-wag at you for your attitude. SA tries to avoid that and allow for more adult behavior without moderators editing your posts and whacking knuckles with rulers. We don't have a long list of published "thou shalt nots" either, and this is by design. Too many absolute rules paints us into too many corners. So check the Terms of Service - there IS language there about certain types of behavior that is not permitted. We interpret that lightly and permit a lot of latitude, but we DO reserve the right to take action when something is too extreme to tolerate (too racist, graphic, violent, misogynistic, etc.). Yes, that is subjective, but it allows us discretion. Avoiding a laundry list of rules allows for freedom; don't abuse it. However there ARE a few basic rules that will earn you a suspension, and apparently a brief refresher is in order. 1) Allegations of pedophilia - there is no tolerance for this. So if you make allegations, jokes, innuendo or suggestions about child molestation, child pornography, abuse or inappropriate behavior with minors etc. about someone on this board you will get a time out. This is pretty much automatic; this behavior can have real world effect and is not acceptable. Obviously the subject is not banned when discussion of it is apropos, e.g. talking about an item in the news for instance. But allegations or references directed at or about another poster is verboten. 2) Outing people - providing real world identifiable information about users on the forums who prefer to remain anonymous. Yes, some of us post with our real names - not a problem to use them. However many do NOT, and if you find out someone's name keep it to yourself, first or last. This also goes for other identifying information too - employer information etc. You don't need too many pieces of data to figure out who someone really is these days. Depending on severity you might get anything from a scolding to a suspension - so don't do it. I know it can be confusing sometimes for newcomers, as SA has been around almost twenty years and there are some people that throw their real names around and their current Display Name may not match the name they have out in the public. But if in doubt, you don't want to accidentally out some one so use caution, even if it's a personal friend of yours in real life. 3) Posting While Suspended - If you've earned a timeout (these are fairly rare and hard to get), please observe the suspension. If you create a new account (a "Sock Puppet") and return to the forums to post with it before your suspension is up you WILL get more time added to your original suspension and lose your Socks. This behavior may result a permanent ban, since it shows you have zero respect for the few rules we have and the moderating team that is tasked with supporting them. Check the Terms of Service you agreed to; they apply to the individual agreeing, not the account you created, so don't try to Sea Lawyer us if you get caught. Just don't do it. Those are the three that will almost certainly get you into some trouble. IF YOU SEE SOMEONE DO ONE OF THESE THINGS, please do the following: Refrain from quoting the offending text, it makes the thread cleanup a pain in the rear Press the Report button; it is by far the best way to notify Admins as we will get e-mails. Calling out for Admins in the middle of threads, sending us PM's, etc. - there is no guarantee we will get those in a timely fashion. There are multiple Moderators in multiple time zones around the world, and anyone one of us can handle the Report and all of us will be notified about it. But if you PM one Mod directly and he's off line, the problem will get dealt with much more slowly. Other behaviors that you might want to think twice before doing include: Intentionally disrupting threads and discussions repeatedly. Off topic/content free trolling in threads to disrupt dialog Stalking users around the forums with the intent to disrupt content and discussion Repeated posting of overly graphic or scatological porn content. There are plenty web sites for you to get your freak on, don't do it here. And a brief note to Newbies... No, we will not ban people or censor them for dropping F-bombs on you, using foul language, etc. so please don't report it when one of our members gives you a greeting you may find shocking. We do our best not to censor content here and playing swearword police is not in our job descriptions. Sailing Anarchy is more like a bar than a classroom, so handle it like you would meeting someone a little coarse - don't look for the teacher. Thanks.

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kurio99

Boat Regrets

29 posts in this topic

In theory, you should try a boat before purchasing, but sometimes the price seems too good or the excitement takes over. Have you ever bought a boat and later regretted the purchase? I'm talking about the class, rather than specific boat issues like hidden rot. What class was it and why?

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Tiki 21 Catamaran and Laser Vago:

 

Tiki 21 has cabins, of sorts, that aren't big enough to use properly. I hardly use her now, its ideal for teaching someone to sail. Wish she was bigger, get the Tiki 26! much more you can do with this. I would love to sell the 21 and get a small Cutter (mini Falmouth Cutter would be perfect)

 

Laser Vago, helped me learn to solo trapeze and use assymetric spinnaker. Hardly ever used these days since getting an RS700. Vago is a tough boat but very heavy.

 

Think carefully before buying a boat, especially if you live in an area where selling it on might be hard or impossible to do. I wish I could freight my boats back to the UK for peanuts. That's probably never going to happen, but I do take good care of them. One day some enthusiast might come along and buy.

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an RS Feva XL, although we were beginner sailors and its a good beginner boat, we were both adults at the time and it was so incredibly cramped!

 

and it was Purple too and we're both male :) but £1400 for a good used boat with road trailer and spare mainsail was just too good at the time...

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In theory, you should try a boat before purchasing, but sometimes the price seems too good or the excitement takes over. Have you ever bought a boat and later regretted the purchase? I'm talking about the class, rather than specific boat issues like hidden rot. What class was it and why?

PHRF! :lol:

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My Hobie17 wasn't the greatest choice in hindsight but it had more to do with the fact that Hobie 17's were poorly designed for areas where you get freezing temps

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Hobie 17 looked to be a good boat, heard it wasn't so good two up with adults of average weight though. I got the 16 which is a fine boat, I can solo it easily enough, I cant get experienced crew but don't mind taking a passenger to give me some extra ballast. One of the better puchases I made, good solid hulls and mast etc.

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Nope, loved every one. So many boats, so little time. Each one taught me something valuable, each one ruined a part of me. No such thing as the perfect boat, but all of them are good for something.

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In theory, you should try a boat before purchasing, but sometimes the price seems too good or the excitement takes over. Have you ever bought a boat and later regretted the purchase? I'm talking about the class, rather than specific boat issues like hidden rot. What class was it and why?

YEs, but this is the boat and not the class. I do not know if it had a class. A 14' MacGregor catamaran. What a dog. Any time the wind built the aluminum rudders would bend and you would loose much of your steerage.

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Hobie 17 looked to be a good boat, heard it wasn't so good two up with adults of average weight though. I got the 16 which is a fine boat, I can solo it easily enough, I cant get experienced crew but don't mind taking a passenger to give me some extra ballast. One of the better puchases I made, good solid hulls and mast etc.

 

How big is your fleet? Vago, rs700, cat...

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Dufour Wing. Lousy upwind, universal was frustrating, getting on a plane was, uh, difficult, defined pearling, etc etc. Hard to sell too....

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Dufour Wing. Lousy upwind, universal was frustrating, getting on a plane was, uh, difficult, defined pearling, etc etc. Hard to sell too....

Humm, that wasn't an amazing board, but I was happy with mine. My first board ever!

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...Laser,,as a boat I'd have to say I never really liked it.

 

 

 

 

 

..................slow learner I guess :mellow:

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Vanguard Vector. It was stored outside at a sail loft. Over the years the price went from several thousand to several hundred dollars. I couldn't pass up a deal.

 

By the 2nd sail I realized I overpaid. It was challenging to the point of not being fun. After 2 years I finally admitted i wasnt worthy and put it at the club and told the kids to have at it. It was used and usually resulted in story's that you hope keep kids interested in sailing.

 

So in that respect I'm glad I got it but as the 1st boat that broke me I'll always hate it.

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Vanguard Vector. It was stored outside at a sail loft. Over the years the price went from several thousand to several hundred dollars. I couldn't pass up a deal.

 

By the 2nd sail I realized I overpaid. It was challenging to the point of not being fun. After 2 years I finally admitted i wasnt worthy and put it at the club and told the kids to have at it. It was used and usually resulted in story's that you hope keep kids interested in sailing.

 

So in that respect I'm glad I got it but as the 1st boat that broke me I'll always hate it.

 

The hull shape does look like a good candidate for a log rolling contest.

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Dufour Wing. Lousy upwind, universal was frustrating, getting on a plane was, uh, difficult, defined pearling, etc etc. Hard to sell too....

Humm, that wasn't an amazing board, but I was happy with mine. My first board ever!

My first board too. Then I tried a Lightning D1. Then a(n) M1. Then a Sailboard 15 (which really was wonderful).

 

Maybe design progress was too fast then. The Wing seemed like such a great piece of industrial design when I bought it.

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I have owned something like 35 boats over the years. One that comes to mind was a 40' wooden sharpie schooner. Too much work, and the $400 a month dockage fee was just insane (for me).

 

Other than that? Not really. I think that I got something good out of them all.

 

Now, ask me if I regret selling any of them? One in particular? My first Dragon (USA121). I shouldn't have ever let her go, and she wound up being destroyed, mostly in a hurricane, but eventually she was just cut up and dumpstered. Arrggh! Makes me sick at my stomach to think of it.

 

RD

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Hobie 17 looked to be a good boat, heard it wasn't so good two up with adults of average weight though. I got the 16 which is a fine boat, I can solo it easily enough, I cant get experienced crew but don't mind taking a passenger to give me some extra ballast. One of the better puchases I made, good solid hulls and mast etc.

 

How big is your fleet? Vago, rs700, cat...

 

5 boats in all:) collected them over the years. Tiki 21, Hitia 14, Hobie 16, Laser Vago and RS700. would love to sell 3 of them but cant find any interest at all. Possibly the Tiki 21 might get sold this summer.

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RS600. Boat had such terrible dock manners that it was never going to catch on here in Texas. Lots of people here don't want to get wet when sailing. It was very fast but was a mistake. Boat has moved all over the country now and still looks perfect. Gets sailed very little by each owner. Hope I sail against it again somewhere down the road. For the right owner it will be perfect. Just not me. My skinny AC is so much more manageable.

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. Lots of people here don't want to get wet when sailing. .

Oh boy... It's a water sport for pity's sake.

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This is Dinghy Anarchy, but in 1977 I bought a new Chrysler 22. I thought it looked a bit better than a Tuna and after all, it was designed by a Herreshoff. 'Twas an utter POS.

 

 

I should have kept our old O'Day Daysailer though. Best boat for a quick sail and almost no ongoing costs. Great boat.

 

Also Banshee #515. Very fun boat and the only boat I ever re-sold at a profit. So much better than a Laser (I had Laser #1034).

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Dufour Wing. Lousy upwind, universal was frustrating, getting on a plane was, uh, difficult, defined pearling, etc etc. Hard to sell too....

Humm, that wasn't an amazing board, but I was happy with mine. My first board ever!

I still have one for use on little cottage-country lakes. It'll go in little to nothing and floats (and sails) like a boat.

 

Sure it doesn't plane easily, and it's not the best upwind machine (though I can get mine to go upwind pretty quick in flat water), but as a toy to play about in it's not bad at all...

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In theory, you should try a boat before purchasing, but sometimes the price seems too good or the excitement takes over. Have you ever bought a boat and later regretted the purchase? I'm talking about the class, rather than specific boat issues like hidden rot. What class was it and why?

YEs, but this is the boat and not the class. I do not know if it had a class. A 14' MacGregor catamaran. What a dog. Any time the wind built the aluminum rudders would bend and you would loose much of your steerage.

Haha, I had the same cat!!

I ditched the aluminum rudders, and installed a set of laser 2 rudders. Was much, much better.

After the mod, with crew on the wire, it was pretty fun.

A freak 4 foot overnight snowfall finally did it in by squashing the hulls as it sat on the trailer.

I still have 2 sets of aluminum rudders, and 2 complete rigs if anyone is interested.........

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only one... but it took a while to work out it was a boat specific issue, rather than a class one.

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My only regret thus far is not a dinghy, it is the macgregor 22 I had. It was soo slow bought it thinking it would be great during the winter but as they dropped the lake level it hit the bottom all over the place. Also in the winter rain would get in everywhere no matter what I did. Hatted that boat

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i bought 3 boats in total sofar. in general I was satisfied with all of them but they all had the same issue:

leakage into the double floor. sometimes quite a lot. and for all but one I never found the source of the problem.

 

the first boat I bought was an older contender. cost me about 1000 euros in 1999. what a great boat! lots of fun. I modified it to carry a gennaker at a minimum budget (less than 100 euros).

at the beginning the sealing was ok, not dry but ok but it started to get a lot worse to really really bad. I would come back after half an hour of sailing, empty out a lot of water and went back out again. I did at some point find the deck and hull separating in the centerboard case. I did a very poor repair job and sold it for 500 euros a little later.

 

next boat was a modified I14 Howlett 1b. that was a great learning boat. we crashed a lot! Broke the glass top of the aluminium mast at some point which was really annoying! water leakage into the double floor was also an issue but it wasn't really bad and we never found the origin. the centerboard case looked good.

there were three separate tanks and they all had more water than I thought could get in through a couple of unsealed screws or small cracks.

 

next and current boat is an older flying dutchman. I have the feeling that the leakage into the double floor is getting worse all the time. for the I14 the capsizing could be used as an excuse (unsealed screws pressed under water when capsized) but with the FD we very rarely capsize and always take on water.

there is a lot of water over the cockpit while sailing but I find it hard to imagine that a small hole could take up that much water. the centerboard case looks rock solid. I think it has to below the waterline. most probably the centerboard strips (gasket) are srewed on from underneath.

I will check these.

 

anyway, tightness of older boats is an issue. worth checking it out as It could be a show (or fun) stopper.

 

I sailed for a season on a friends 49er and even though it wasn't the newest boat (somewhere in the 600 range) it was completely water tight! when leaving it in the sun for a few minutes you could hear the pressure release when opening the tanks. sweet!

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i bought 3 boats in total sofar. in general I was satisfied with all of them but they all had the same issue:

leakage into the double floor. sometimes quite a lot. and for all but one I never found the source of the problem.

 

the first boat I bought was an older contender. cost me about 1000 euros in 1999. what a great boat! lots of fun. I modified it to carry a gennaker at a minimum budget (less than 100 euros).

at the beginning the sealing was ok, not dry but ok but it started to get a lot worse to really really bad. I would come back after half an hour of sailing, empty out a lot of water and went back out again. I did at some point find the deck and hull separating in the centerboard case. I did a very poor repair job and sold it for 500 euros a little later.

 

next boat was a modified I14 Howlett 1b. that was a great learning boat. we crashed a lot! Broke the glass top of the aluminium mast at some point which was really annoying! water leakage into the double floor was also an issue but it wasn't really bad and we never found the origin. the centerboard case looked good.

there were three separate tanks and they all had more water than I thought could get in through a couple of unsealed screws or small cracks.

 

next and current boat is an older flying dutchman. I have the feeling that the leakage into the double floor is getting worse all the time. for the I14 the capsizing could be used as an excuse (unsealed screws pressed under water when capsized) but with the FD we very rarely capsize and always take on water.

there is a lot of water over the cockpit while sailing but I find it hard to imagine that a small hole could take up that much water. the centerboard case looks rock solid. I think it has to below the waterline. most probably the centerboard strips (gasket) are srewed on from underneath.

I will check these.

 

anyway, tightness of older boats is an issue. worth checking it out as It could be a show (or fun) stopper.

 

I sailed for a season on a friends 49er and even though it wasn't the newest boat (somewhere in the 600 range) it was completely water tight! when leaving it in the sun for a few minutes you could hear the pressure release when opening the tanks. sweet!

 

Have you tried pressure testing using soap and an inflatable pump to find the worst of it?

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I bought a B3 I14. Love it and the fleet of like minded kooks.

 

My only regret is that I can't afford to race it right now and it's sitting in storage not scaring me and the crew on a regular basis.

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....yesterday was perfect for a winter sail...25-30 kts,,,sunny,,mild temperatures,,had time available,,,wind's holding,,grab gear,,rig boat,,set-up cameras,,adrenaline running,,,set rig tension,,,then set mast bender..........

 

---heard a cracking noise at the forestay mount,,realized that the two tensions compound on each other,,and it would be best to take the boat to the mancave for assessment :(

 

 

 

...reminds me of graffiti I once saw in a truck-stop loo....'hear I sit ,broken hearted---took 2 bennies and my truck won't start'' :huh:

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