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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  

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Americas Cup

Core cut to the chase...

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This article explains, in one sentence, why winning the AC will not increase NZ's boat building "export market" or local market one bit!

 

http://m.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11150678

 

"He said foreign boatbuilders were able to offer the same work for 30 per cent cheaper than New Zealand companies"

 

 

And this is from the horses mouth and backs up what i have been saying!

 

NZ is too expensive!... and the quality is no better.

 

But don't let the facts stop chokers like Barker and Dalton spinning you a line to justify the perpetual "gravy train" called -Team "private sailors" using NZ as a income source New Zealand.

 

By by another 40+ million of tax payers money...

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If we keep baiting ol' dickbreath in the inane threads he starts it might stop him infecting other threads with his bullshit. Then again pigs might fly as well.

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This article explains, in one sentence, why winning the AC will not increase NZ's boat building "export market" or local market one bit!

 

http://m.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11150678

 

"He said foreign boatbuilders were able to offer the same work for 30 per cent cheaper than New Zealand companies"

 

 

And this is from the horses mouth and backs up what i have been saying!

 

NZ is too expensive!... and the quality is no better.

 

But don't let the facts stop chokers like Barker and Dalton spinning you a line to justify the perpetual "gravy train" called -Team "private sailors" using NZ as a income source New Zealand.

 

By by another 40+ million of tax payers money...

 

 

simple really

 

cost the same as to build anywhere else

 

it's just + a 30% core charge :o:lol::lol::lol::lol:

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In some ways this provides some hope - no surprise that after the AC work has slowed. But they are merely cutting back - not closing up shop. Big difference to what was being predicted elsewhere.

 

If it was just the cost of labour the entire planet would have shut up shop and moved production to China. No doubt, China is a fierce competitor, and has changed the game in most industries, but it isn't a slam dunk. Once you move up from a pure labour cost model things start to equalise. Skilled Chinese engineers are not going to be undercutting so much, and they are still learning the skills, so the competitive advantage narrows.

 

But it seems as if Larry might have some plans for Core. A new ACWS will almost certainly need some new boats, and in the mid-term, Core may have a much expanded role in making the next AC work. At least I hope so. We will see.

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In some ways this provides some hope - no surprise that after the AC work has slowed. But they are merely cutting back - not closing up shop. Big difference to what was being predicted elsewhere.

 

If it was just the cost of labour the entire planet would have shut up shop and moved production to China. No doubt, China is a fierce competitor, and has changed the game in most industries, but it isn't a slam dunk. Once you move up from a pure labour cost model things start to equalise. Skilled Chinese engineers are not going to be undercutting so much, and they are still learning the skills, so the competitive advantage narrows.

 

But it seems as if Larry might have some plans for Core. A new ACWS will almost certainly need some new boats, and in the mid-term, Core may have a much expanded role in making the next AC work. At least I hope so. We will see.

Yes but it is not just the labor rate differences.

 

Material costs, energy costs, compliance, cost rates and taxes are excessive in NZ. The corporate, council, and government greed has created an uncompetitive environment unless of course you are a farmer or fonterra where government and local body council subsidies and assistance gets you competitive with world markets.

 

China, Europe, and America are not just competitive on labour but also have better pricing across all of the aforementioned. They also have less compliance and regulation rules and cost.

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Jayzaz Graham, for an Irish/American/Greek/ English passport holder you sure know a lot about New Zealand. Sorry I meant 'pretend' to know a lot about New Zealand. Then again you do have plenty of spare time on your hands these days. How was your weekend mate? What did you do? Another quick single handed circumnavigation?

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Not parochial but informed - thanks to many people involved in the marine scene both here and NZ.

 

Yes you are right about the support the US and Euro,s receive which backs my argument for direct support to the industries involved rather to a team that loses and fails to deliver the main goal.

 

35-90 million directed to the NZ marine industry or protection from imports would see a great marine industry... not a dead one.

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I don't think you are allowed to use protectionist measures. something about free trade etc. Its been tried before and economists would say its a failure.

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Not parochial but informed - thanks to many people involved in the marine scene both here and NZ.

 

:)

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This article explains, in one sentence, why winning the AC will not increase NZ's boat building "export market" or local market one bit!

 

http://m.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11150678

 

"He said foreign boatbuilders were able to offer the same work for 30 per cent cheaper than New Zealand companies"

 

 

And this is from the horses mouth and backs up what i have been saying!

 

NZ is too expensive!... and the quality is no better.

 

But don't let the facts stop chokers like Barker and Dalton spinning you a line to justify the perpetual "gravy train" called -Team "private sailors" using NZ as a income source New Zealand.

 

By by another 40+ million of tax payers money...

 

Well it is no surprice that the workload is low for the manifacture of AC boats for the moment as they are not building any AC boats for the moment. Same thing for the manifacturer of AR, ETNZ and LR boats.

 

No surprice there is it?????????????????

 

 

 

It is also no surprice that NZ is a bit expensive for an American company. NZ has had a stable economy and there dollars has been resonable stable the last 10 years. The US dollars on the other hand??????

 

How much has it lost in value the last 10 years? 40-50%? I do remember that we had to pay 1,6 swiss Franc for one US dollar 10 years ago and now we pay about 0.9-.0.95. I dont think that NZ is expensive at all. It is USA that is very cheap due to exchange rate and due to that it is expensive for Americans.

 

No surprice is it????????????? I am not sure what you are trying to say.

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unless of course you are a farmer or fonterra where government and local body council subsidies and assistance gets you competitive with world markets.

 

What is your basis for this statement? Compared to other countries NZ farmers get jack from the government / local authorities from my point of view, apart from increasing regulation and compliance costs.

 

And no I am not a farmer.

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The US dollars on the other hand??????

 

How much has it lost in value the last 10 years? 40-50%? I do remember that we had to pay 1,6 swiss Franc for one US dollar 10 years ago and now we pay about 0.9-.0.95. I dont think that NZ is expensive at all. It is USA that is very cheap due to exchange rate and due to that it is expensive for Americans.

 

That would be more a matter of the Swiss franc appreciating. The US$ has been more or less stable (within a range) against the € since 2005. Contrariwise the Swiss France rose steadily and markedly against the Euro 2008-2011, since when it's been fairly stable.

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The US dollars on the other hand??????

 

How much has it lost in value the last 10 years? 40-50%? I do remember that we had to pay 1,6 swiss Franc for one US dollar 10 years ago and now we pay about 0.9-.0.95. I dont think that NZ is expensive at all. It is USA that is very cheap due to exchange rate and due to that it is expensive for Americans.

 

That would be more a matter of the Swiss franc appreciating. The US$ has been more or less stable (within a range) against the € since 2005. Contrariwise the Swiss France rose steadily and markedly against the Euro 2008-2011, since when it's been fairly stable.

 

 

Lets say it in a different way.

 

The US dollars were stronger then the Euros when the Euro was introduced. In 2002 you had to pay 0.9 dollars for one Euro. Today one Euro is about 1,35 dollars and the Euro is not at its strongest.

 

In 2002 one NZ dollar costed about 0,45 US dollars. Today one NZ dollar cost about 0.83 dollars.

 

In 2002 one Swedish krona costed 0.095 US dollars. Today one swedish krona costs 0.155. Even with normal currancys. Not strong Swiss Franc the dollar has been dropping massivly

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Kiwi$ linked to aussie$ via trade, see what happens in few years, resource demaand, commoditywise

Yep NZ is our 8th state. The fuckers have been riding on our coat tails for 100 years. Australia's economy is the most robust in the world and NZ's is a basket case. But us Aussies go there on holidays to help them out and we let kiwi's come here to staff fast food restaurants and do our stoop labour for us.

 

Except Graham. He doesn't have a passport.

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Kiwi$ linked to aussie$ via trade, see what happens in few years, resource demaand, commoditywise

Yep NZ is our 8th state. The fuckers have been riding on our coat tails for 100 years. Australia's economy is the most robust in the world and NZ's is a basket case. But us Aussies go there on holidays to help them out and we let kiwi's come here to staff fast food restaurants and do our stoop labour for us.

 

Except Graham. He doesn't have a passport.

when the Chinese stop buying your raw materials Aussie will be in the shit, oh wait mining is slowing down Ford is shutting up shop, I wouldn't be too smug the world economy isn't looking that flash and if the manure goes through the fan , the Aussie economy will suffer

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Well we breezed through the GFC despite having at the time the most incompetent government in our history. The Australian business sector is diversified, robust, intelligent and innovative. The ford factory is closeing down because Governments are no longer prepared to , nor need to subsidise uncompetitive industries. Also most mine workers are driving BMW's not fords. A lesson that NZ needs to learn. To say our economy is completely reliant on China is to show your ignorance. Yes in fact the Chinese need us as much as we need them. Their incredible growth will not be a road without bumps but they aren't going away. My sailing business is hardly an essential service and we be the first to suffer in a down turn. We are literally the Canery in the mine for the mineing industry as we currently draw about 40% of our customers from that industry.

The last 3 months have been a record for our 17 years in business. NZ on the other hand is a one trick pony and you can't sustain an economy on skiing trips and bungee jumping. Just ask your number one cheerleader Graham. That is why so many kiwi's have to go aboard to earn a living. Mainly here to the big island. Except graham of course. He sits in his mothers spare room in Wellington pretending he is Greek. Or Irish. Or Americian. Winning the Cup is just a short term solution to try and kick start your economy. It wasn't sustainable last time was it?

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:D:D:D it appears , for you to be so hung up and bitter on the graham guy, that he well and truly fucked you over.

 

to go on about it in every post, while he obviously now has you on "ignore" just shows your stupidity and bitterness.

 

I, and others, think you are the big Kiwi hating tosser and not AC.

 

What did he do to you? ruin your business, life, and screw your wife?. it must be bad for you to rave on to the forum when he has, very likely, got you on ignore

 

and... before you say I am him :rolleyes: .... stop ya moaning ya little aussie fuckwit and check with mr clean.

Well we breezed through the GFC despite having at the time the most incompetent government in our history. The Australian business sector is diversified, robust, intelligent and innovative. The ford factory is closeing down because Governments are no longer prepared to , nor need to subsidise uncompetitive industries. Also most mine workers are driving BMW's not fords. A lesson that NZ needs to learn. To say our economy is completely reliant on China is to show your ignorance. Yes in fact the Chinese need us as much as we need them. Their incredible growth will not be a road without bumps but they aren't going away. My sailing business is hardly an essential service and we be the first to suffer in a down turn. We are literally the Canery in the mine for the mineing industry as we currently draw about 40% of our customers from that industry.
The last 3 months have been a record for our 17 years in business. NZ on the other hand is a one trick pony and you can't sustain an economy on skiing trips and bungee jumping. Just ask your number one cheerleader Graham. That is why so many kiwi's have to go aboard to earn a living. Mainly here to the big island. Except graham of course. He sits in his mothers spare room in Wellington pretending he is Greek. Or Irish. Or Americian. Winning the Cup is just a short term solution to try and kick start your economy. It wasn't sustainable last time was it?

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:D:D:D it appears , for you to be so hung up and bitter on the graham guy, that he well and truly fucked you over.

 

to go on about it in every post, while he obviously now has you on "ignore" just shows your stupidity and bitterness.

 

I, and others, think you are the big Kiwi hating tosser and not AC.

 

What did he do to you? ruin your business, life, and screw your wife?. it must be bad for you to rave on to the forum when he has, very likely, got you on ignore

 

and... before you say I am him :rolleyes: .... stop ya moaning ya little aussie fuckwit and check with mr clean.

 

Well we breezed through the GFC despite having at the time the most incompetent government in our history. The Australian business sector is diversified, robust, intelligent and innovative. The ford factory is closeing down because Governments are no longer prepared to , nor need to subsidise uncompetitive industries. Also most mine workers are driving BMW's not fords. A lesson that NZ needs to learn. To say our economy is completely reliant on China is to show your ignorance. Yes in fact the Chinese need us as much as we need them. Their incredible growth will not be a road without bumps but they aren't going away. My sailing business is hardly an essential service and we be the first to suffer in a down turn. We are literally the Canery in the mine for the mineing industry as we currently draw about 40% of our customers from that industry.

 

The last 3 months have been a record for our 17 years in business. NZ on the other hand is a one trick pony and you can't sustain an economy on skiing trips and bungee jumping. Just ask your number one cheerleader Graham. That is why so many kiwi's have to go aboard to earn a living. Mainly here to the big island. Except graham of course. He sits in his mothers spare room in Wellington pretending he is Greek. Or Irish. Or Americian. Winning the Cup is just a short term solution to try and kick start your economy. It wasn't sustainable last time was it?

No graham BJ either has or is about to flick your Americian cup/ Yankee Doodle identity and this one will go next. Bye bye Graham you poor sad little troll. Say hi to Allison for me. Oh. That's right, that didn't end well did it.

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SW it appears you do not know much about economics, or the NZ economy, tourism is a very small part of its overseas earnings.

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:D:D:D it appears , for you to be so hung up and bitter on the graham guy, that he well and truly fucked you over.

 

to go on about it in every post, while he obviously now has you on "ignore" just shows your stupidity and bitterness.

 

I, and others, think you are the big Kiwi hating tosser and not AC.

 

What did he do to you? ruin your business, life, and screw your wife?. it must be bad for you to rave on to the forum when he has, very likely, got you on ignore

 

and... before you say I am him :rolleyes: .... stop ya moaning ya little aussie fuckwit and check with mr clean.

 

Well we breezed through the GFC despite having at the time the most incompetent government in our history. The Australian business sector is diversified, robust, intelligent and innovative. The ford factory is closeing down because Governments are no longer prepared to , nor need to subsidise uncompetitive industries. Also most mine workers are driving BMW's not fords. A lesson that NZ needs to learn. To say our economy is completely reliant on China is to show your ignorance. Yes in fact the Chinese need us as much as we need them. Their incredible growth will not be a road without bumps but they aren't going away. My sailing business is hardly an essential service and we be the first to suffer in a down turn. We are literally the Canery in the mine for the mineing industry as we currently draw about 40% of our customers from that industry.

The last 3 months have been a record for our 17 years in business. NZ on the other hand is a one trick pony and you can't sustain an economy on skiing trips and bungee jumping. Just ask your number one cheerleader Graham. That is why so many kiwi's have to go aboard to earn a living. Mainly here to the big island. Except graham of course. He sits in his mothers spare room in Wellington pretending he is Greek. Or Irish. Or Americian. Winning the Cup is just a short term solution to try and kick start your economy. It wasn't sustainable last time was it?

Nice stuff SD. Hit the nail on the head! This guy has failed to front on every challenge I,ve put to him and is obviously full of crap.

 

The enemy,s he has developed are numerous, based on the many PM,s I get

 

Mind you, it is hardly surprising this guy is who he is considering his countries heritage.

 

The ignore function is soooo good. He can rant on, lie, and spin bullshit yarns and I am totally oblivious to him.

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Wow graham not only agrees with his own socks he even PM's them. You do take this trolling shit very seriously dont you mate. Bye bye Graham.

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Well we breezed through the GFC despite having at the time the most incompetent government in our history. The Australian business sector is diversified, robust, intelligent and innovative. The ford factory is closeing down because Governments are no longer prepared to , nor need to subsidise uncompetitive industries. Also most mine workers are driving BMW's not fords. A lesson that NZ needs to learn. To say our economy is completely reliant on China is to show your ignorance. Yes in fact the Chinese need us as much as we need them. Their incredible growth will not be a road without bumps but they aren't going away. My sailing business is hardly an essential service and we be the first to suffer in a down turn. We are literally the Canery in the mine for the mineing industry as we currently draw about 40% of our customers from that industry.

The last 3 months have been a record for our 17 years in business. NZ on the other hand is a one trick pony and you can't sustain an economy on skiing trips and bungee jumping. Just ask your number one cheerleader Graham. That is why so many kiwi's have to go aboard to earn a living. Mainly here to the big island. Except graham of course. He sits in his mothers spare room in Wellington pretending he is Greek. Or Irish. Or Americian. Winning the Cup is just a short term solution to try and kick start your economy. It wasn't sustainable last time was it?

 

I dunno about the Australian business sector being 'diversified, robust, intelligent and innovative'. I read an article the other day about how Australia's business leaders handled the mining boom. It says that rather than turning Australia into a Germany, the Clive Palmers et al turned Australia into an Arkansas.

 

When you say 'diversified', do you mean that your economy is based on more than just iron ore? Because extracting copper, bauxite and nickle from adjacent pits does not qualify as 'diversified'.

 

In fact, mining and related services make up 19% of the Australian economy and were the driver of the spectacular economic growth the country experienced from around the mid-2000s when exports more than quadrupled in value. Good on them, but it is not diversity, it is not robust, and it is also not sustainable (not in the greenie way but in the it's going to blinkin run dry soon way).

 

Comparing exports from New Zealand and Australia you see one interesting thing:

 

New Zealand:

764px-New_Zealand_Exports_Treemap_%28200

 

Australia:

769px-Australian_Exports_Treemap_%282009

 

New Zealand's trade is diversified and made up of stuff you can regenerate. Australia's international trade is three-quarters made up of finite-life mining and extraction. Australia's economy is about as diversified as the racial demographics of Adelaide (which, by the way, is almost entirely made up of stunning-looking germanic types who like to have a good time if you know what I mean).

 

So you can see there is nothing intelligent or diversified or robust about the Australian economy.

 

Looking further down the track, you guys have school leavers with internationally-recoognised poor grades and heading into run-down poorly-funded universities.

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We also used to own your largest domestic airline, Ansett, until we discovered it was just a union shell company and that the planes were held up in the air by stilts, fishing line and camera trickery.

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If they were in love with them they would keep them for them self. Not sharing them with the rest of the world :)

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Looks like sheep and other barnyard animals make up 40% of your GDP.

 

No wonder you guys are in love with them.

Oh but we do! New Zealand controls one third of the planet's dairy production. We have facilities from here to Timbuktu. I'm sure if you asked nicely enough they'd be happy for you to 'visit' your nearest branch office of New Zealand Inc. :)

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Looks like sheep and other barnyard animals make up 40% of your GDP.

 

No wonder you guys are in love with them.

Oh but we do! New Zealand controls one third of the planet's dairy production. We have facilities from here to Timbuktu. I'm sure if you asked nicely enough they'd be happy for you to 'visit' your nearest branch office of New Zealand Inc. :)
Sounds tempting,

Are condoms required?

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Well you control over half the worlds sock puppets and Internet trolls. That national inferiority complex sure makes you kiwi's bite hard but thanks for playing. Relax scared crow. Over here on the big island we are very fond of our friends from the land of the long white chip on the shoulder. That's why we prop up you economy by employing so many kiwis to clean our shithouses and sweep our streets. Sadly most of them pour their earnings straight back into the local drug, brewing and tattoo industries rather than send it home.

Can't say we don't try to help though.

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Looks like sheep and other barnyard animals make up 40% of your GDP.

No wonder you guys are in love with them.

Oh but we do! New Zealand controls one third of the planet's dairy production. We have facilities from here to Timbuktu. I'm sure if you asked nicely enough they'd be happy for you to 'visit' your nearest branch office of New Zealand Inc. :)

A nation of teat pullers and butter churners. And let's never forget sporting chokers.

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One third of the world's dairy production, huh?

 

From Wiki:

 

 

 

Looks like sheep and other barnyard animals make up 40% of your GDP.

No wonder you guys are in love with them.


Oh but we do! New Zealand controls one third of the planet's dairy production. We have facilities from here to Timbuktu. I'm sure if you asked nicely enough they'd be happy for you to 'visit' your nearest branch office of New Zealand Inc. :)

 

post-770-0-46872100-1383773984_thumb.png

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One third of the world's dairy production, huh?

 

From Wiki:

 

 

 

Looks like sheep and other barnyard animals make up 40% of your GDP.

 

No wonder you guys are in love with them.

Oh but we do! New Zealand controls one third of the planet's dairy production. We have facilities from here to Timbuktu. I'm sure if you asked nicely enough they'd be happy for you to 'visit' your nearest branch office of New Zealand Inc. :)

An easy mistake to make. New Zealand is responsible for one-third of global dairy exports (not production). In most countries, nearly all diary production is for domestic consumption. New Zealand is a notable expection.

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Don't know where those export statistics came from. Tourism is the largest export industry in New Zealand. This is sustainable, but not particularly stable since it is affected by exchange rate fluctuations and the economic conditions in the visitor countries - the main one being Australia.

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An easy mistake to make? Claiming that Nu Zuland produces 33 % of the worlds dairy when in fact it is closer to 4%? And I love your lame attempt at confusion. If your rainy little islands only produce 4% of the worlds total, and, even if not a drop of that was consumed domestically and you exported the lot, then the total global 'export market' is 12% of the global demand. In other words you control 33% of a tiny %. My lord you kiwis love to talk it up. But Graham is right when he bags the shit out of his homeland's economic woes. Give the money to the farmers rather than the chokers.

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I never claimed that we produce 33 per cent of dairy production, I said we control 33 percent, give or take.

 

And here's some info from Wikipedia:

 

Persons born in New Zealand continue to be the second largest source of immigration to Australia, representing 11% of total permanent additions in 2005–06 and accounting for 2.3% of Australia's population at June 2006.[11] Australians make up a similar proportion of New Zealand's population.[6] New Zealand citizens have a high labour-force participation rate (78.2 per cent at July 2012) compared with those born in Australia (68.0 per cent).[12] New Zealanders living in Australia also have a higher median weekly income ($760) than Australians born in Australia ($597) and immigrants in general ($538), which be partially due to working long hours (51.8 hours per week) than Australian born (45.6 hours) or immigrants in general (44.7 hours).

So basically, you are completely wrong about almost everything you have said about both your country Australia, and mine New Zealand so far. You were wrong about the 'intelligent diversified economy' carry on. You were also wrong in your assessment of the behaviour of New Zealanders in Australia. We work harder than you and longer than you and earn more money than you.

 

ps: wrt chokers, when was the last time Australia successfully defended the America's Cup? Or competed at all? And how many goes did it take to get it in the first place? IIRC, you guys started in 1962 and took the Cup in '83; 21 years of trying. We started in '88, lifted it six years later, and successfully defended it again in roughly the same amount of time it took you guys to get to first base.

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Don't know where those export statistics came from. Tourism is the largest export industry in New Zealand. This is sustainable, but not particularly stable since it is affected by exchange rate fluctuations and the economic conditions in the visitor countries - the main one being Australia.

 

They seem to be for goods only, not services.

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I never claimed that we produce 33 per cent of dairy production, I said we control 33 percent, give or take.

 

I find that quite difficult to believe. Source?

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Fark me on and on.

 

I left NZL about 10 years ago, now Australia is (whether you like it or not), more advanced, more professional and enables a far higher income and standard of living.

Above all it doesn't repetitively focus on minuta i.e Rugby, AC, Rugby, the latest bloody Maori claim for breathable air, water or whatever, oh and Rugby.

 

NZL is now simply a quint place for a holiday, except it's run down, a little depressing in parts and everybody talks funny, a bit like Darwin I guess.

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I never claimed that we produce 33 per cent of dairy production, I said we control 33 percent, give or take.

 

And here's some info from Wikipedia:

 

 

Persons born in New Zealand continue to be the second largest source of immigration to Australia, representing 11% of total permanent additions in 2005–06 and accounting for 2.3% of Australia's population at June 2006.[11] Australians make up a similar proportion of New Zealand's population.[6] New Zealand citizens have a high labour-force participation rate (78.2 per cent at July 2012) compared with those born in Australia (68.0 per cent).[12] New Zealanders living in Australia also have a higher median weekly income ($760) than Australians born in Australia ($597) and immigrants in general ($538), which be partially due to working long hours (51.8 hours per week) than Australian born (45.6 hours) or immigrants in general (44.7 hours).

So basically, you are completely wrong about almost everything you have said about both your country Australia, and mine New Zealand so far. You were wrong about the 'intelligent diversified economy' carry on. You were also wrong in your assessment of the behaviour of New Zealanders in Australia. We work harder than you and longer than you and earn more money than you.

I love it when people quote Wikipeida as their source. Clearly this isn't the only website Graham loves to troll. The only true thing you said was about kiwis working long hours. Goes with the territory for shift workers. Bouncing in pubs and digging holes in the road involve long hours mate. The other day I was with my builder doing a final inspection on a rental property. As we walked around the house he kept going to the window and yelling out 'green side up!' When I asked him what he was doing he explained he had 2 kiwi guys laying turf for him.

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Fark me on and on.

 

I left NZL about 10 years ago, now Australia is (whether you like it or not), more advanced, more professional and enables a far higher income and standard of living.

Above all it doesn't repetitively focus on minuta i.e Rugby, AC, Rugby, the latest bloody Maori claim for breathable air, water or whatever, oh and Rugby.

 

NZL is now simply a quint place for a holiday, except it's run down, a little depressing in parts and everybody talks funny, a bit like Darwin I guess.

 

This might give you some food for thought

 

2013 THE LEGATUM PROSPERITY INDEX

 

The 2013 Legatum Prosperity Index ranks 142 nations on their "wealth and wellbeing" in eight categories, including health, education, safety and security, and economy.

 

1 Norway

2 Switzerland

3 Canada

4 Sweden

5 New Zealand

6 Denmark

7 Australia

8 Finland

9 Netherlands

10 Luxembourg

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And this........

 

The sexual preference index.

This rates countries by the deviant sexual preferences of its citizens. (% of population and activity)

 

1/ New Zealand (sex with sheep) 74%

2/ Wales (sheep) 64%

3/ New Zealand (cows) 56%

4/ New Zealand (chickens) 41%

5/ Australia (New Zealand Girls) 36%

 

Food for thought.

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We also used to own your largest domestic airline, Ansett, until we discovered it was just a union shell company and that the planes were held up in the air by stilts, fishing line and camera trickery.

don't you mean you (sic) bought Ansett and sent it broke due to incompetent management? Bumbled along just fine for 30 years until you (sic) clowns got your hands on it......

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The fact that you cunts dont live here makes it a better place to be immediatly.

God I wish we Aussies could say the same thing......

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Don't know where those export statistics came from. Tourism is the largest export industry in New Zealand. This is sustainable, but not particularly stable since it is affected by exchange rate fluctuations and the economic conditions in the visitor countries - the main one being Australia.

not sure where that came from either, to quote the tourist board "Tourism is one of New Zealand's biggest export industries, earning $9.6 billion or 15.4% of New Zealand's foreign exchange earnings (year ended March 2012)"

 

so 84.6% of earnings must come from somewhere else.

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lifebuoy why is austrailia so bloody good, loads of aussies leave every year to do the Overseas thing. the place is riddled with every dangerous creature on the planet, its stinking hot, dry, has shit beer or did people shit in the beer,

 

some of the aussie exports are world famous for being crooks or sexos, Did they leave and commit these crimes in the hope that thye could get a free ticket back to the penal colony?

 

How much shit do you want to sling ? and are you really prepared for what will come back. I am beginning to wonder if you are worse than your mate Graham, and that Te Kooti fella

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Just havin a little tran Tasman fun old mate. You haven't been here long if you take me seriously! Lighten up Francis this is SA!

Que Graham with his Speed Demons hat on.......

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lifebuoy why is austrailia so bloody good, loads of aussies leave every year to do the Overseas thing. the place is riddled with every dangerous creature on the planet, its stinking hot, dry, has shit beer or did people shit in the beer,

 

some of the aussie exports are world famous for being crooks or sexos, Did they leave and commit these crimes in the hope that thye could get a free ticket back to the penal colony?

 

How much shit do you want to sling ? and are you really prepared for what will come back. I am beginning to wonder if you are worse than your mate Graham, and that Te Kooti fella

 

Interesting that you mention ta koodie, but it comes as no surprise given his history.

 

Not too many are worse than ta koodie for posting political BS, so we'll give you that no questions asked in terms of posting political garbage - he takes the cake.

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maybe there are a few fellas who are trying to take the gold medal.

 

lifebuoy why is austrailia so bloody good, loads of aussies leave every year to do the Overseas thing. the place is riddled with every dangerous creature on the planet, its stinking hot, dry, has shit beer or did people shit in the beer,

 

some of the aussie exports are world famous for being crooks or sexos, Did they leave and commit these crimes in the hope that thye could get a free ticket back to the penal colony?

 

How much shit do you want to sling ? and are you really prepared for what will come back. I am beginning to wonder if you are worse than your mate Graham, and that Te Kooti fella

 

Interesting that you mention ta koodie, but it comes as no surprise given his history.

 

Not too many are worse than ta koodie for posting political BS, so we'll give you that no questions asked in terms of posting political garbage - he takes the cake.

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maybe there are a few fellas who are trying to take the gold medal.

 

lifebuoy why is austrailia so bloody good, loads of aussies leave every year to do the Overseas thing. the place is riddled with every dangerous creature on the planet, its stinking hot, dry, has shit beer or did people shit in the beer,

 

some of the aussie exports are world famous for being crooks or sexos, Did they leave and commit these crimes in the hope that thye could get a free ticket back to the penal colony?

 

How much shit do you want to sling ? and are you really prepared for what will come back. I am beginning to wonder if you are worse than your mate Graham, and that Te Kooti fella

 

Interesting that you mention ta koodie, but it comes as no surprise given his history.

 

Not too many are worse than ta koodie for posting political BS, so we'll give you that no questions asked in terms of posting political garbage - he takes the cake.

 

Agreed, but none that come close to comparing given his extensive history and ego. Read all of his posts - he runs away with it hands down.

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The fact that you cunts dont live here makes it a better place to be immediatly.

God I wish we Aussies could say the same thing......

That's funny!

It was a goodun.

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We also used to own your largest domestic airline, Ansett, until we discovered it was just a union shell company and that the planes were held up in the air by stilts, fishing line and camera trickery.

don't you mean you (sic) bought Ansett and sent it broke due to incompetent management? Bumbled along just fine for 30 years until you (sic) clowns got your hands on it......

 

Ah yes. This is what actually happened:

 

Air New Zealand was virtually forced to purchase Ansett Australia because of yet another default by Australia on terms of ANZCERTA. In this case it was over open skies access and Australia using a non-trade barrier/terminal access/airways access to protect it's still-failing airline Qantas (the airline being run by the gay Irish dude which, I understand, has just lost another couple of slots at London?).

 

Ownership transferred during 2000 but in the lead-up to Christmas, the Australian civil aviation regulator CASA (I think) grounded significant portions of the airline's fleet because the planes were, frankly, buggered. This is not the sort of thing that happens overnight but the fact the fleet was neglected by it's overpaid pilots, engineers and managers led to this situation. Old 747s and Airbus A320 with flight engineer stations (yes, what the fuck?) fitted to them meant the airline was buggered from the start.

 

Gold-plated spanners and managers who were too busy administering their own exorbitant salaries were the problem. Air New Zealand came in and gave them a dose of reality. The guys chose to stick to their feather-bedded inspection bays working for "the best job I ever had" (which, in my experience, is usually followed by "but we were all made redundant for some reason") and went broke.

 

The only poor decision Air New Zealand made was to not simply say "Fuck ya, we'll go to Bankstown then."

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More to the point what are the 40 people that have been retained for the next 6 months at NZ$5 mill doing? Christmas a few weeks away and January a non event in the Southern Hemisphere it must be great to be "retained". I seriously wonder how many sailors have been retained because they fear they will be head hunted? Barker?

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We also used to own your largest domestic airline, Ansett, until we discovered it was just a union shell company and that the planes were held up in the air by stilts, fishing line and camera trickery.

 

don't you mean you (sic) bought Ansett and sent it broke due to incompetent management? Bumbled along just fine for 30 years until you (sic) clowns got your hands on it......

Ah yes. This is what actually happened:

 

Air New Zealand was virtually forced to purchase Ansett Australia because of yet another default by Australia on terms of ANZCERTA. In this case it was over open skies access and Australia using a non-trade barrier/terminal access/airways access to protect it's still-failing airline Qantas (the airline being run by the gay Irish dude which, I understand, has just lost another couple of slots at London?).

 

Ownership transferred during 2000 but in the lead-up to Christmas, the Australian civil aviation regulator CASA (I think) grounded significant portions of the airline's fleet because the planes were, frankly, buggered. This is not the sort of thing that happens overnight but the fact the fleet was neglected by it's overpaid pilots, engineers and managers led to this situation. Old 747s and Airbus A320 with flight engineer stations (yes, what the fuck?) fitted to them meant the airline was buggered from the start.

 

Gold-plated spanners and managers who were too busy administering their own exorbitant salaries were the problem. Air New Zealand came in and gave them a dose of reality. The guys chose to stick to their feather-bedded inspection bays working for "the best job I ever had" (which, in my experience, is usually followed by "but we were all made redundant for some reason") and went broke.

 

The only poor decision Air New Zealand made was to not simply say "Fuck ya, we'll go to Bankstown then."

Well as your sig line says' never mind the bollocks here comes the scared crow'. You bought it and you fucked it. Simple facts princess.

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It's Fun to sit ringside and watch you lot slag along at / on each other

 

then hit the hay and wake up (hopefully) in DAGO

 

the US east coasters who post before I wake are no where near as entertaining :)

 

 

And WTF with Te Kooti

 

he was supposed to getting me copies from all the UN members of my Ft Page AC-34 article of their respective Papers ?? B)

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Kiwi$ linked to aussie$ via trade, see what happens in few years, resource demaand, commoditywise

 

Yep NZ is our 8th state. The fuckers have been riding on our coat tails for 100 years. Australia's economy is the most robust in the world and NZ's is a basket case. But us Aussies go there on holidays to help them out and we let kiwi's come here to staff fast food restaurants and do our stoop labour for us.

Except Graham. He doesn't have a passport.

when the Chinese stop buying your raw materials Aussie will be in the shit, oh wait mining is slowing down Ford is shutting up shop, I wouldn't be too smug the world economy isn't looking that flash and if the manure goes through the fan , the Aussie economy will suffer

That's for sure. But back k on topic...

 

NZ,s marine industry is in the poo. Tourism is down and right now their fast broadband roll out is a pending AC Aussie defence.... fucked.

 

Thanks to Russ at least NZ successfully defended the AC.

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Oh! Look... AC and SD are on at the same time.

How can that be?... gee and they have not been removed!

 

IT APPEARS life buoy 15 has got it wrong again!

 

... what a surprise!

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Oh! Look... AC and SD are on at the same time.

How can that be?... gee and they have not been removed!

 

IT APPEARS life buoy 15 has got it wrong again!

 

... what a surprise!

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Oh! Look... AC and SD are on at the same time.

How can that be?... gee and they have not been removed!

 

IT APPEARS life buoy 15 has got it wrong again!

 

... what a surprise!

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Surprise??????????? Why would it be a surprise that American Doodle and Speed demon is awake and clicking at the computer at the same time?

 

 

What is stopping someone to log in at two accounts at the same time????????????

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Oh! Look... AC and SD are on at the same time.

How can that be?... gee and they have not been removed!

IT APPEARS life buoy 15 has got it wrong again!

... what a surprise!

Dear oh dear. I thought you had me on ignore Graham. Triple posting? Your not very good at this are you......

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Oh! Look... AC and SD are on at the same time.

How can that be?... gee and they have not been removed!

 

IT APPEARS life buoy 15 has got it wrong again!

 

... what a surprise!

I think you have got real mental issues.

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We also used to own your largest domestic airline, Ansett, until we discovered it was just a union shell company and that the planes were held up in the air by stilts, fishing line and camera trickery.

don't you mean you (sic) bought Ansett and sent it broke due to incompetent management? Bumbled along just fine for 30 years until you (sic) clowns got your hands on it......

Ah yes. This is what actually happened:

Air New Zealand was virtually forced to purchase Ansett Australia because of yet another default by Australia on terms of ANZCERTA. In this case it was over open skies access and Australia using a non-trade barrier/terminal access/airways access to protect it's still-failing airline Qantas (the airline being run by the gay Irish dude which, I understand, has just lost another couple of slots at London?).

Ownership transferred during 2000 but in the lead-up to Christmas, the Australian civil aviation regulator CASA (I think) grounded significant portions of the airline's fleet because the planes were, frankly, buggered. This is not the sort of thing that happens overnight but the fact the fleet was neglected by it's overpaid pilots, engineers and managers led to this situation. Old 747s and Airbus A320 with flight engineer stations (yes, what the fuck?) fitted to them meant the airline was buggered from the start.

Gold-plated spanners and managers who were too busy administering their own exorbitant salaries were the problem. Air New Zealand came in and gave them a dose of reality. The guys chose to stick to their feather-bedded inspection bays working for "the best job I ever had" (which, in my experience, is usually followed by "but we were all made redundant for some reason") and went broke.

The only poor decision Air New Zealand made was to not simply say "Fuck ya, we'll go to Bankstown then."

Well as your sig line says' never mind the bollocks here comes the scared crow'. You bought it and you fucked it. Simple facts princess.

 

Totally, we bought it. But we didn't fuck it. Not complaining or anything but... CASA could have picked a more reasonable time to ground the fleets than Christmas and Easter holiday periods.

 

Aviation is one of those industries where there is a lot of personnel-churn between the regulator and the companies they regulate. It is beneficial to both sides of the fence as, when senior staff migrate to the regulator, the regulator gets a better insight into airlines' systems; while in reverse, staff come back with a better understanding on how to best meet compliance.

 

The problem comes when CASA deal with outsiders or operators that the incumbent airlines are in competition with. Rather than working with them or around them, staff who come to the regulator from the incumbents (and who invariably return to that operator) use their powers to disadvantage outsiders as much as they can, hence christmas shutdowns and suchlike.

 

It's just another example of how the Australian economy is not the intelligent and robust machine many people are tricked into thinking it is. Stifling competition is great for the incumbents but on a macro scale is inefficient and wasteful. So, while I'm not complaining about it, or complaining about being called a princess (cos you never know when that might come in handy) I do think it is quite trite to say that when, it seems, your airlines are being managed and operated so poorly that they need to have the playing field tilted in their favour.

 

The amusing thing is that, despite all these advantages, Qantas the Spirit of Australia, continues to go down the gurgler while Air New Zealand goes from strength to strength.

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Read it and weep old mate. ANZ slipped from 17th to 18th this year. Qantas up from 15th to 10th. And regardless of what ever bullshit you like to make up, Qantas remains the worlds oldest and safest airline. On the other hand you incompetent clowns took over an Australian icon and sent it broke in no time flat.

 

Worlds top Airlines 2013

1 Emirates 8

2 Qatar Airways 1

3 Singapore Airlines 3

4 ANA All Nippon Airways 5

5 Asiana Airlines 2

6 Cathay Pacific Airways 4

7 Etihad Airways 6

8 Garuda Indonesia 11

9 Turkish Airlines 7

10 Qantas Airways 15

11 Lufthansa 14

12 EVA Air 13

13 Virgin Australia 12

14 Malaysia Airlines 10

15 Thai Airways 9

16 Swiss Int'l Air Lines 15

17 Korean Air 16

18 Air New Zealand 17

19 Hainan Airlines 20

20 Air Canada 19

 

Based on fatality rates alone (not including your in-flight bumps, bruises and busted doors), here is a list of popular carriers that fly in and out of Australasia. Remember the lower an airline's ranking, the safer its track record:

 

China Airlines 7.16

Air India 4.89

Thai Airways 1.60

Singapore Airlines 1.50

Cathay Pacific 1.45

Air New Zealand 0.74

United 0.31

and, still the safest airline with a total of zero fatalities ...

Qantas 0.00

 

So despite the bad press of late, the kangaroo in the sky is your best bet on arriving alive.

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Read it and weep old mate. ANZ slipped from 17th to 18th this year. Qantas up from 15th to 10th. And regardless of what ever bullshit you like to make up, Qantas remains the worlds oldest and safest airline. On the other hand you incompetent clowns took over an Australian icon and sent it broke in no time flat.

 

Worlds top Airlines 2013

1 Emirates 8

2 Qatar Airways 1

3 Singapore Airlines 3

4 ANA All Nippon Airways 5

5 Asiana Airlines 2

6 Cathay Pacific Airways 4

7 Etihad Airways 6

8 Garuda Indonesia 11

9 Turkish Airlines 7

10 Qantas Airways 15

11 Lufthansa 14

12 EVA Air 13

13 Virgin Australia 12

14 Malaysia Airlines 10

15 Thai Airways 9

16 Swiss Int'l Air Lines 15

17 Korean Air 16

18 Air New Zealand 17

19 Hainan Airlines 20

20 Air Canada 19

 

Based on fatality rates alone (not including your in-flight bumps, bruises and busted doors), here is a list of popular carriers that fly in and out of Australasia. Remember the lower an airline's ranking, the safer its track record:

 

China Airlines 7.16

Air India 4.89

Thai Airways 1.60

Singapore Airlines 1.50

Cathay Pacific 1.45

Air New Zealand 0.74

United 0.31

and, still the safest airline with a total of zero fatalities ...

Qantas 0.00

 

So despite the bad press of late, the kangaroo in the sky is your best bet on arriving alive.

 

That's only since 1970, 99 people died on Qantas planes before that. And how the hell is Garuda on a list anyhere but at the bottom. I've spent over 60 hours on their planes and they couldn't pay me to take one more flight.

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No fatalities since 1951 and 38 of the 99 were killed when they were shot down in the war. Nice try mate. No fatalities since jetliners were introduced. And Aeir Nuwzulands record since then? 264 all due to kiwi incompetence. But thanks for playing anyway.....

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Fark me on and on.

 

I left NZL about 10 years ago, now Australia is (whether you like it or not), more advanced, more professional and enables a far higher income and standard of living.

Above all it doesn't repetitively focus on minuta i.e Rugby, AC, Rugby, the latest bloody Maori claim for breathable air, water or whatever, oh and Rugby.

 

NZL is now simply a quint place for a holiday, except it's run down, a little depressing in parts and everybody talks funny, a bit like Darwin I guess.

 

This might give you some food for thought

 

2013 THE LEGATUM PROSPERITY INDEX

 

The 2013 Legatum Prosperity Index ranks 142 nations on their "wealth and wellbeing" in eight categories, including health, education, safety and security, and economy.

 

1 Norway

2 Switzerland

3 Canada

4 Sweden

5 New Zealand

6 Denmark

7 Australia

8 Finland

9 Netherlands

10 Luxembourg

 

No can't really say it does.

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I had a good laugh the other day at the airport when a Japanese guy asked we 'where can if find cuntas' .

I told him I know of one in Wellington.

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you mustn't gloat too much, one large plane into the ground and Quantas would go from no deaths to 400 or more, which would put aussie where on the safest list of airlines?

 

You can prove anything with stats, Politicians do it all the time and I hope you don't believe them

Read it and weep old mate. ANZ slipped from 17th to 18th this year. Qantas up from 15th to 10th. And regardless of what ever bullshit you like to make up, Qantas remains the worlds oldest and safest airline. On the other hand you incompetent clowns took over an Australian icon and sent it broke in no time flat.

Worlds top Airlines 2013
1 Emirates 8
2 Qatar Airways 1
3 Singapore Airlines 3
4 ANA All Nippon Airways 5
5 Asiana Airlines 2
6 Cathay Pacific Airways 4
7 Etihad Airways 6
8 Garuda Indonesia 11
9 Turkish Airlines 7
10 Qantas Airways 15
11 Lufthansa 14
12 EVA Air 13
13 Virgin Australia 12
14 Malaysia Airlines 10
15 Thai Airways 9
16 Swiss Int'l Air Lines 15
17 Korean Air 16
18 Air New Zealand 17
19 Hainan Airlines 20
20 Air Canada 19

Based on fatality rates alone (not including your in-flight bumps, bruises and busted doors), here is a list of popular carriers that fly in and out of Australasia. Remember the lower an airline's ranking, the safer its track record:

China Airlines 7.16
Air India 4.89
Thai Airways 1.60
Singapore Airlines 1.50
Cathay Pacific 1.45
Air New Zealand 0.74
United 0.31
and, still the safest airline with a total of zero fatalities ...
Qantas 0.00

So despite the bad press of late, the kangaroo in the sky is your best bet on arriving alive.

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This is from an expert on the subject, the same place where you got your information LB, you just forgot to mention this bit, so I thought it better be included! Which is the safest airline to fly?

Clearly there are some major airlines such as Southwest of the USA which have not had a passenger die in an accident and others such as United Airlines and Korean Air which have had several fatal events. Those facts don't make one airline automatically safer than the other although it does affect the public's perception of safety. The most important indicator of the overall safety of an airline is how it is regulated by its nation's civil aviation authority. Airlines operating large capacity passenger aircraft in the major industrialized countries have to follow the strictest safety regulations. While the airlines operating smaller capacity aircraft have the choice of operating under the same rules, these smaller aircraft are not certified to the same standards as larger ones. Just as importantly, the airports and air traffic control system have to adhere to similarly high standards. Beyond that, use your good common sense. If an airline is notorious for poor on time performance, lots of passenger complaints, and severe financial problems, then perhaps it is time to find an alternative airline. While there are some airlines with no fatal plane crashes, it doesn't mean that these airline is safe, since fatal crashes are very rare for airlines of every size.

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Got it bill. Just because an airline has killed hundreds of people that doesn't mean it is unsafe. And because another airline has never killed anyone that doesn't make it safe. Gosh we are lucky an expert like you clear that up for us otherwise many of us would have continued to use 'likelihood of dying ' as a barometer of safety. Also yes qantas's perfect safety record would be broken if one of their planes crashed. Did you have to think for very long to work that one out? If your aunt had balls would she be your uncle?

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Ohh rattled your cage did it, If you are using experts for your snipe try quoting the whole thing. I just used your expert to moderate your statement.

 

and I only thought about it for less time than you did, does that help?

 

you are turning into your favourite person AC, yankee diddle et al, have you to been sharing the same coffee cup? as I was wondering if this sniping is an infectious disease. I hope I don't catch it, Its not a sexually transmitted disease I hope

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Quoting crash statistic isn't really relevant. At the air nz level, the crash stats come from once in a generation event. What is relevant is the day-to-day experience you have as a passenger and in those stakes Air NZ runs circles around Qantarse. Air NZ was atw airline of the year 2010 and 12.

 

QF is not a very good example of your 'intellugent' economy.

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Read it and weep old mate. ANZ slipped from 17th to 18th this year. Qantas up from 15th to 10th. And regardless of what ever bullshit you like to make up, Qantas remains the worlds oldest and safest airline. On the other hand you incompetent clowns took over an Australian icon and sent it broke in no time flat.

 

Worlds top Airlines 2013

1 Emirates 8

2 Qatar Airways 1

3 Singapore Airlines 3

4 ANA All Nippon Airways 5

5 Asiana Airlines 2

6 Cathay Pacific Airways 4

7 Etihad Airways 6

8 Garuda Indonesia 11

9 Turkish Airlines 7

10 Qantas Airways 15

11 Lufthansa 14

12 EVA Air 13

13 Virgin Australia 12

14 Malaysia Airlines 10

15 Thai Airways 9

16 Swiss Int'l Air Lines 15

17 Korean Air 16

18 Air New Zealand 17

19 Hainan Airlines 20

20 Air Canada 19

 

Based on fatality rates alone (not including your in-flight bumps, bruises and busted doors), here is a list of popular carriers that fly in and out of Australasia. Remember the lower an airline's ranking, the safer its track record:

 

China Airlines 7.16

Air India 4.89

Thai Airways 1.60

Singapore Airlines 1.50

Cathay Pacific 1.45

Air New Zealand 0.74

United 0.31

and, still the safest airline with a total of zero fatalities ...

Qantas 0.00

 

So despite the bad press of late, the kangaroo in the sky is your best bet on arriving alive.

That's only since 1970, 99 people died on Qantas planes before that. And how the hell is Garuda on a list anyhere but at the bottom. I've spent over 60 hours on their planes and they couldn't pay me to take one more flight.

Was thinking exactly the same about Garuda??

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