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MR.CLEAN

New Cubed - First Supermaxi Since Speedboat

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I heard about it before the finish and I wasn't even in the race or involved with the crew in any way.

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Pretty sure I read about it on the race website or on Sail world.... But I could be wrong? No protests were lodged though right?

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Oh Clean, btw, slap moondog on his bald head for me.

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I'm on the couch drinking vodka. Try google.

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Pretty sure I read about it on the race website or on Sail world.... But I could be wrong? No protests were lodged though right?

 

Widely reported seems a stretch. Wish I had some vodka but the crew went shopping and found it way too fucking expensive. I don't know how the hell a bottle of shitty vodka is 50$

 

Oh Clean, btw, slap moondog on his bald head for me.

 

Moonie had a good day today, not capsizing until the final run of the final race. He then capsized about 5 times in a row, and another bunch of times trying to get to the beach

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I'm not the one stating that I may or may not have read something on some unknown website or possibly heard it third hand from the drunk dude walking down the street. If you're going to make a claim that what you're stating is fact, just back it up with a source. If you're sitting on the couch, then you're google cut 'n paste works just as good as mine.

 

In the meantime, I'm gonna call bullshit.

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Sail world an unknown website? Maybe on your planet son but not here on earth. Rather popular actually.

 

I'm too drunk and tired to go searching for a link right now, I may choose to tomorrow if I can be bothered.

 

If the "cheating" was blatant then why didn't somebody protest? Oh that's right, the alleged breach didn't help their performance, in fact it hindered them and it had the blessing of the RC.

 

So where exactly is the big stink? Sure, perhaps it would have been more noble of them to retire but when you spend several months and a hundred grand or so preparing for a race that's a pretty big call and puts a lot of weight on who ever the poor bastard was that opened the wrong valve doesn't it.

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I'm not the one stating that I may or may not have read something on some unknown website or possibly heard it third hand from the drunk dude walking down the street. If you're going to make a claim that what you're stating is fact, just back it up with a source. If you're sitting on the couch, then you're google cut 'n paste works just as good as mine.

 

In the meantime, I'm gonna call bullshit.

Actually, I read about Alive's cheating in these very forums, before they even crossed the finish line. The name of the boat was left out for awhile though.

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This discussion is getting off topic, but; not only did the rc know about it, they even delivered the water out to race course to Alive. No matter how much they spent leading up to the race, Alive should have retired from the race and if not, another competitor should have protested. By not lodging a protest the rest of the fleet are condoning those actions

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Sail world an unknown website? Maybe on your planet son but not here on earth. Rather popular actually.

 

I'm too drunk and tired to go searching for a link right now, I may choose to tomorrow if I can be bothered.

 

If the "cheating" was blatant then why didn't somebody protest? Oh that's right, the alleged breach didn't help their performance, in fact it hindered them and it had the blessing of the RC.

 

So where exactly is the big stink? Sure, perhaps it would have been more noble of them to retire but when you spend several months and a hundred grand or so preparing for a race that's a pretty big call and puts a lot of weight on who ever the poor bastard was that opened the wrong valve doesn't it.

FYI the race was started and sailed in drifting to 8 knots

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I'm not the one stating that I may or may not have read something on some unknown website or possibly heard it third hand from the drunk dude walking down the street. If you're going to make a claim that what you're stating is fact, just back it up with a source. If you're sitting on the couch, then you're google cut 'n paste works just as good as mine.

 

In the meantime, I'm gonna call bullshit.

Actually, I read about Alive's cheating in these very forums, before they even crossed the finish line. The name of the boat was left out for awhile though.
Many competitors also assumed that either alive would do the right thing and RAF, or the committee would protest, since they had all the details and we had piss all. I don't know where it was widely reported abbo, I only heard it through the grape vine and I finished that shitful race.

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I'm not the one stating that I may or may not have read something on some unknown website or possibly heard it third hand from the drunk dude walking down the street. If you're going to make a claim that what you're stating is fact, just back it up with a source. If you're sitting on the couch, then you're google cut 'n paste works just as good as mine.

 

In the meantime, I'm gonna call bullshit.

Actually, I read about Alive's cheating in these very forums, before they even crossed the finish line. The name of the boat was left out for awhile though.

Oh, I wasn't disputing what happened. I was just calling BS on Abbo's statement that he read about it on the event website or Sail World.

 

And, yes, if they received outside assistance from anyone, even the RC, they should have retired, but I don't really care and am not trying to rehash this discussion.

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Sail world an unknown website? Maybe on your planet son but not here on earth. Rather popular actually.

 

I'm too drunk and tired to go searching for a link right now, I may choose to tomorrow if I can be bothered.

 

If the "cheating" was blatant then why didn't somebody protest? Oh that's right, the alleged breach didn't help their performance, in fact it hindered them and it had the blessing of the RC.

 

So where exactly is the big stink? Sure, perhaps it would have been more noble of them to retire but when you spend several months and a hundred grand or so preparing for a race that's a pretty big call and puts a lot of weight on who ever the poor bastard was that opened the wrong valve doesn't it.

FYI the race was started and sailed in drifting to 8 knots

Well aware that it was a very light race. I was cruising on the bay all Easter, clears skies and a glass out everyday, I'll never forget it. Are you suggesting they dumped the water to improve their performance? You are aware that their only real competition in that race was a VO 70 right? Hardly a threat to them in drifting conditions. And you are aware that they had mostly freeze dried food on board right? Kinda difficult to eat that stuff without water.

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I'm not getting into an arguement over the definition of "widely", but I knew about it, before the finish, and I'm told it was on these forums before the finish. So it was hardly a secret and "swept under the carpet" as was it suggested by windwhacker. The race website has been cleansed and a few Sailworld searches have come up with a very limited number of hits so lots of articles have been removed. Who knows where I read it? I was too busy eating fresh sand crab and drinking icy cold Corona's to remember exactly where I read it. Maybe it was on these forums? Who gives a shit?

 

Most importantly, lots of people knew about it and nobody cared enough to bother to protest so its a dead issue. Bleating on about it after the fact just makes you look like a cock.

 

Can we get back on topic now please?

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looks like Comanche must be shipping out of Melbourne ?

 

Marine Traffic is showing her loaded on a ship

 

post-54587-0-23247200-1421032169_thumb.jpg

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C ya', don't let the door hit you on your way out!!

 

JOKING

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Yep. Was vertically challenged at pier35 the other day before loading. Also saw the indian put on a truck at royals, and saw the old Dolly back ready for geelong

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I'm not getting into an arguement over the definition of "widely",

 

If google can't find it, I'm guessing 'widely reported' doesn't need to be argued

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I'm not getting into an arguement over the definition of "widely",

 

If google can't find it, I'm guessing 'widely reported' doesn't need to be argued

Google found lots of links which were all dead, the pages had been removed. If the news websites have moved on, perhaps we should too.

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I'm not getting into an arguement over the definition of "widely",

If google can't find it, I'm guessing 'widely reported' doesn't need to be argued

If it were me, I'd change "widely reported" to "gossiped about in these forums."

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Clean, perhaps you need to petition ISAF to make SA Forums the official way to lodge a protest and the SA Forum participants as the official Jury for all racing.

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So Abbo why did you bring it up? lots of people who FINISHED the race found out about it after Alive was declared the winner on IRC, yes they won the race and accepted the trophy! From your comments I gather that you think it is ok to break a rule if no one protests? A few of you including a couple of brothers, one of which was escorted out of a Hobart pub seem very sensitive about the issue, there are a number of people who know about it wont ever consider sailing on that boat and to the best of my knowledge neither the REAL owner or the second IRC boat owner to this day don't know about it.

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The only boat who should really care would be the 4th place getter who could have picked up 3 trophies if Alive was protested.

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So Abbo why did you bring it up?

 

Talk about a thread hijack!

 

Fair go Change, you were the one who brought it up, not Abbo. "Anyone hear a call for water". And then Windwhacker threw in the "cheater" word.

 

I don't necessarily agree with the way it was dealt with either, but it doesn't detract from Alive's performance in the S-H, particularly when she was in front (IIRC) of Rio and a couple of VO70's!

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I'm not getting into an arguement over the definition of "widely",

 

If google can't find it, I'm guessing 'widely reported' doesn't need to be argued

Google found lots of links which were all dead, the pages had been removed. If the news websites have moved on, perhaps we should too.

 

that's convenient

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I'm not getting into an arguement over the definition of "widely",

 

If google can't find it, I'm guessing 'widely reported' doesn't need to be argued

Google found lots of links which were all dead, the pages had been removed. If the news websites have moved on, perhaps we should too.

 

that's convenient

 

On the contrary my dear Clean, I find it rather inconvenient that I can't silence these doubters with proof. Oh well I guess the official race live twitter feed will have to do.

 

https://twitter.com/B2GYachtRace/status/457049879798632448

 

It is still up on the race website and also on the race facebook page.

 

Next I guess you'll try and tell me that no one is on twitter and it doesn't count. Game set and match fuckers, time to move on.

 

Apologies for again posting OT, but I thought it was worth mentioning.

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No worries; just taking issue with 'padding', when you say something like 'widely reported' when you don't really need to.

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"Widely reported" is a shitload closer to the truth than "swept under the carpet" my friend.

 

Also worth noting that now the S2H and B2G both have clauses in their sailing instructions that allow reprovisioning due to loss of stores or damage.

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Abbott, have close read of those sailing instructions, they are quite specific on how re provisioning is to done. Also those clauses have been in S2H and B2K SIs ffor a couple of years before this "incident"

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Abbott, have close read of those sailing instructions, they are quite specific on how re provisioning is to done. Also those clauses have been in S2H and B2K SIs ffor a couple of years before this "incident"

 

Please show where in the S2H si's this is mentioned, for the last 2 yrs & for the couple of years before this "incident"?

 

Thanks

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Abbott, have close read of those sailing instructions, they are quite specific on how re provisioning is to done. Also those clauses have been in S2H and B2K SIs ffor a couple of years before this "incident"

 

Please show where in the S2H si's this is mentioned, for the last 2 yrs & for the couple of years before this "incident"?

 

Thanks

2011 S2H sailing instruction 25; and 2011 B2K sailing instruction 13.

 

Do some research of your own.

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So Abbo why did you bring it up? lots of people who FINISHED the race found out about it after Alive was declared the winner on IRC, yes they won the race and accepted the trophy! From your comments I gather that you think it is ok to break a rule if no one protests? A few of you including a couple of brothers, one of which was escorted out of a Hobart pub seem very sensitive about the issue, there are a number of people who know about it wont ever consider sailing on that boat and to the best of my knowledge neither the REAL owner or the second IRC boat owner to this day don't know about it.

I didn't dick head, you did. You've changed your tune from your whole "Lets be positive and support QLD yachting" high and mighty stance of 12 months ago you fucking spineless hypocrite. Quite clearly that only applies to your beloved Blackjack.

 

And then your muppet mate windwhaker threw in the "cheat" word. Very strong language for an action that not only had the blessing of the RC but not one single competitor thought it worthy of a protest. Not even the national authority thought it needed further action. Would it have been more noble to retire? Yes perhaps, I think very few people would argue that, I certainly wouldn't. But they didn't retire, the RC gave it the thumbs up and so did their competitors. What's done is done and nobody in the race gave a shit so get over it you shit stirring whinger.

 

As for the Customs house incident, well.... Now I have heard both sides of the story. It is very similar, but the roles are reversed. In the interests of being fair to all I have removed my comments, after all I wasn't there so I have no way of knowing where the truth lies and accordingly I will stfu on this matter. My sincere apologies to those who took offence.

 

I'm not going to even attempt to decipher the last part of your last sentence. The preferred language here is English you illiterate fuck. Why don't we get down to the real issue here Change, that your boyfriends on Blackjack were completely schooled on the water by the boys from Alive yet again. Is that what really keeps you awake at night dreaming up these conspiracy theories?

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dickhead? illiterate fuck? and in the post you removed you suggest punching someone's lights out, those responses reflect that some people in this bay are very sensitive about the "incident" and when in doubt they attack other people's opinions that they don't agree with.

My comments are nothing to do with Blackjack or any other competitor. I sleep well at night, I play by the rules.

You posted that you are going to STFU so please do

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Abbott, have close read of those sailing instructions, they are quite specific on how re provisioning is to done. Also those clauses have been in S2H and B2K SIs ffor a couple of years before this "incident"

 

Please show where in the S2H si's this is mentioned, for the last 2 yrs & for the couple of years before this "incident"?

Thanks

2011 S2H sailing instruction 25; and 2011 B2K sailing instruction 13.

 

Do some research of your own.

I have numnut. I read 2013 & 14 S2H si's & couldn't see it......

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"Widely reported" is a shitload closer to the truth than "swept under the carpet" my friend.

 

Also worth noting that now the S2H and B2G both have clauses in their sailing instructions that allow reprovisioning due to loss of stores or damage.

Arguing with clean is like competing at the special Olympics . Even if you win you are still a retard.

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Abbott, have close read of those sailing instructions, they are quite specific on how re provisioning is to done. Also those clauses have been in S2H and B2K SIs ffor a couple of years before this "incident"

Please show where in the S2H si's this is mentioned, for the last 2 yrs & for the couple of years before this "incident"?

Thanks

2011 S2H sailing instruction 25; and 2011 B2K sailing instruction 13.

 

Do some research of your own.

I have numnut. I read 2013 & 14 S2H si's & couldn't see it......

I've also read the si's you've cited. They are not "quite specific on how re provisioning is to done"

 

There is only one way to be allowed to re-provision, & that is if you act in accordance with fundamental RRS 1.1, but I guess you knew that

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dickhead? illiterate fuck? and in the post you removed you suggest punching someone's lights out, those responses reflect that some people in this bay are very sensitive about the "incident" and when in doubt they attack other people's opinions that they don't agree with.

My comments are nothing to do with Blackjack or any other competitor. I sleep well at night, I play by the rules.

You posted that you are going to STFU so please do

You might be but most of us competitors in that race don't give a fuck. Facts are they dumped their water not long after the start. Rang the race director who personally took the water out to them off Mooloolaba. Told them to put it in their declaration which they duly did and the RC decided no further action was nessecery. Fact 1 - they were becalmed when the water was given to them. Fact 2 only one boat actually witnessed the water being given to them (and therefore was in a position to protest) and chose not to protest - possibly due a commercial decision. The rest of us competitors only found out about it after the presentation. Fact 3 the incident was investigated by Yachting QLD offshore safety committee and no further action was deemed required. whilst the RC decision was controversial in hindsight I agree with their action - as the chair of the organising committee of the other QLD cat 2 event I understand that they gained no advantage from the action and the last thing a struggling sport needed was a conversation in the mainstream press about something their readership would not understand. Fact 4 - I retired from the race and thus was DNF - if I finished and knew about it I would have had them in the room in about 10 seconds. But that is me talking as a competitor not a fellow RC. The only people who really have a case to answer are the crew who witnessed it and are therefore bound under the rules to protest but choose not to.But fuck that was last years race. Time to move on and return to the topic of how WO11 handed those yanks their arse on a plate.

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I am pretty sure LifeBouy had lots to say (suprise suprise) on the matter on one of the threads.

Sniff Sniff. Is that a wiff of cock I can smell on your breath?

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dickhead? illiterate fuck? and in the post you removed you suggest punching someone's lights out, those responses reflect that some people in this bay are very sensitive about the "incident" and when in doubt they attack other people's opinions that they don't agree with.

My comments are nothing to do with Blackjack or any other competitor. I sleep well at night, I play by the rules.

You posted that you are going to STFU so please do

You might be but most of us competitors in that race don't give a fuck. Facts are they dumped their water not long after the start. Rang the race director who personally took the water out to them off Mooloolaba. Told them to put it in their declaration which they duly did and the RC decided no further action was nessecery. Fact 1 - they were becalmed when the water was given to them. Fact 2 only one boat actually witnessed the water being given to them (and therefore was in a position to protest) and chose not to protest - possibly due a commercial decision. The rest of us competitors only found out about it after the presentation. Fact 3 the incident was investigated by Yachting QLD offshore safety committee and no further action was deemed required. whilst the RC decision was controversial in hindsight I agree with their action - as the chair of the organising committee of the other QLD cat 2 event I understand that they gained no advantage from the action and the last thing a struggling sport needed was a conversation in the mainstream press about something their readership would not understand. Fact 4 - I retired from the race and thus was DNF - if I finished and knew about it I would have had them in the room in about 10 seconds. But that is me talking as a competitor not a fellow RC. The only people who really have a case to answer are the crew who witnessed it and are therefore bound under the rules to protest but choose not to.But fuck that was last years race. Time to move on and return to the topic of how WO11 handed those yanks their arse on a plate.

If you talk to the BlackJack guys they were 28 minutes in front of them at Caloundra turning mark and they were barely visible so they did not see it and they did not know about it untill after returning to Brisbane despite drinking with the alive guys after the race. Hard to protest if it's hushed up. Anyway move along folks.

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"Widely reported" is a shitload closer to the truth than "swept under the carpet" my friend.

 

Also worth noting that now the S2H and B2G both have clauses in their sailing instructions that allow reprovisioning due to loss of stores or damage.

 

'widely reported' facts are now gone from the internet? Sounds like 'swept under the carpet' is pretty fucking accurate.

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You might be but most of us competitors in that race don't give a fuck. [snip]The only people who really have a case to answer are the crew who witnessed it and are therefore bound under the rules to protest but choose not to.

Without going into the merits, I'll just pull you up on this bit LB. No competitor is "bound under the rules" to protest. Nowhere (that I can think of) is an obligation cast on a competitor - it's " a competitor may protest" not "a competitor must protest". If there was an obligation, and a competitor failed to comply with that obligation, surely a third party protest (by RC or another competitor) could be lodged against the obligated competitor for failing to comply. Let's not go down that path ffs!

 

Yeah, the all-conquering aircraft carrier snuck off without a lot of fanfare, eh! It will probably dominate everything in the Northern Hemisphere, but never again come down for the only race that REALLY matters ... :lol:

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"Widely reported" is a shitload closer to the truth than "swept under the carpet" my friend.

 

Also worth noting that now the S2H and B2G both have clauses in their sailing instructions that allow reprovisioning due to loss of stores or damage.

'widely reported' facts are now gone from the internet? Sounds like 'swept under the carpet' is pretty fucking accurate.

Please explain how posting it on the official race twitter feed, (still there btw), making a declaration, the RC reporting it to the state and national authority is "sweeping it under the carpet". I heard the skipper of Alive told the skipper of Blackjack on the dock well before they got to the bar.

 

Have you considered the possibility that many of the news articles from that time have been pulled down because they are old and no one is reading them? Or are you suggesting the RC contacted sail world and asked them to remove the articles? I'm not sure Rob Kothe would stand for that sort of shenanigans.

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^ Alive's skipper should have told the only skipper who missed out on trophies, not the skipper who didn't have anything to loose.

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many of the news articles from that time have been pulled down because they are old and no one is reading them? Or are you suggesting the RC contacted sail world and asked them to remove the articles? I'm not sure Rob Kothe would stand for that sort of shenanigans.

 


 

Now that is some funny shit. Show me one article that Sail World has ever pulled down 'because they are old'

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Right so you think that is an impossible scenario? Get a grip. A simple google search reveals plenty of dead links for sail world. Were they all conspiracies too?

 

If you are suggesting the articles were pulled at the request of the RC then get off your lazy arse and prove it. Otherwise keep your loony bin conspiracy theories to yourself.

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Right so you think that is an impossible scenario? Get a grip. A simple google search reveals plenty of dead links for sail world. Were they all conspiracies too?

 

If you are suggesting the articles were pulled at the request of the RC then get off your lazy arse and prove it. Otherwise keep your loony bin conspiracy theories to yourself.

 

I'm not the one who said it was widely reported. You post a single twitter post and a pile of unsupported hearsay and somehow I need to prove something? All I said is that I don't see any widely reported story. You run around with intellectual gymnastics to avoid the fact that you are misremembering reality.

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Ok, so posting it on the front page of the race website and their Facebook page isn't wide enough for you. Silly me thinking that twitter and Facebook has some quite considerate reach. I guess they should have taken out a full page add in the New York times. Would that meet your requirements? I have proven that is was reported on the front page of The race website and that is more than wide enough for me.

 

You are the one who suggested the missing articles were proof of a cover up, so go ahead and proven it.

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Ok, so posting it on the front page of the race website and their Facebook page isn't wide enough for you. Silly me thinking that twitter and Facebook has some quite considerate reach. I guess they should have taken out a full page add in the New York times. Would that meet your requirements? I have proven that is was reported on the front page of The race website and that is more than wide enough for me.

 

You are the one who suggested the missing articles were proof of a cover up, so go ahead and proven it.

 

please link 'widely reported' on facebook and front page of the race website. If your twitter link about 'needed water' is what you're going on, let's just be done with this.

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You could have found it yourself quicker than the time it took to write your reply. Stop being so fucking lazy.

 

I posted the direct link to the twitter post so people didn't have to go scrolling ten pages down in the twitter feed to get back to the posts during the race. I think I've done more than more than enough spoon feeding for this dead issue.

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all i see is a claim of supposedly scrubbed posts and a bunch of unsupported talk, and still not sure why you'd make up that stuff about widely reported.

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I've told you where to look, if you can't see it I can't help you.

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X-post from the "new Open 60s" thread:

 

Comanche's keel seems to have a significant "tilt" or twist to positive angle of attack when swung outward, especially when she's in her usual bow-up trim. Her ridiculous draught and beam counter the corresponding loss in righting moment.

A lot has already been said about how the angle of her daggerboards creates lift but the lift generated by her keel is also worthy of attention. Especially since VPLP appears to be applying the concept with confidence in its next generation of '60s.

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Big thanks to Kurt Oberle at High And Dry Boatworks for the shots. Kurt's the best carbon/fiberglass/paint guy in Charleston and has worked on everything from 100' cats to Open 60s to VX-ones...and everything in between.

 

 

 

 

Comanche alongside.jpg

ComancheFebMotor.jpg

HighandDRy.jpg

ComancheSavannahFeb.jpg

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Nice photos- that boat just looks so mean.

The daggers are both huge, anyone have any idea how heavy they each are??

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I might have the opportunity to get up close and personal with Comanche. Does anyone have any photo or video requests? Anything up close or specific?

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Board-up attachments, I'd love to see how they keep them fair, and any/all running rigging you can find, I have a slight obsession...

 

Also, anyone heard about the forward steering/temporary coachroof? Would be cool to see hard point for that.

 

HW

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If Wild Oats stays in its den, Comanche should compete with the other widegirl Loyal in an another venue. We need to know!

No we don't, Commanche would eat Loyal. She has less WSA, more power & sails with the bow out.

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And Comanche is 3 or 4 tonnes lighter. She is significantly faster on all angles and all breeze strengths. I don't think Loyal will travel beyond the Aussie East coast without a very significant sponsorship deal.

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And Comanche is 3 or 4 tonnes lighter. She is significantly faster on all angles and all breeze strengths. I don't think Loyal will travel beyond the Aussie East coast without a very significant sponsorship deal.

 

 

This link says otherwise.

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And Comanche is 3 or 4 tonnes lighter. She is significantly faster on all angles and all breeze strengths. I don't think Loyal will travel beyond the Aussie East coast without a very significant sponsorship deal.

 

 

This link says otherwise.

I see what you did there

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Sorry if this was posted earlier.

 

COMANCHE On-Board.first 24 Hours in the 2014 RSHYR. Agony & Ecstasy:

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great video. exactly what we thought happened in bass straight. that looked painful . great showing for its first test though.

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So no real competition then...

You can't lose that way.

 

Rambler 88 could sneak a line honours from Comanche.

Bella Mente, Robertissima and the like could easily win on handicap.

 

Edit: Didn't realise this was CSA rule event.... I am sure Rambler or Comanche will win over all. Those in charge of the CSA love getting spooged on by the latest and greatest...

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If Wild Oats stays in its den, Comanche should compete with the other widegirl Loyal in an another venue. We need to know!

No we don't, Commanche would eat Loyal. She has less WSA, more power & sails with the bow out.

 

Well, we need this showdown. Loyal has about the same righting moment with hugely more prismatic hull form. Let's get it on!

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If Wild Oats stays in its den, Comanche should compete with the other widegirl Loyal in an another venue. We need to know!

No we don't, Commanche would eat Loyal. She has less WSA, more power & sails with the bow out.

 

Well, we need this showdown. Loyal has about the same righting moment with hugely more prismatic hull form. Let's get it on!

 

We've had it… Big boat series, Sydney Harbour 2014. Loyal didn't get a look in.

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Kapteen, put down the bong son. Loyal is no match for WOXI or Comanche. She's far too heavy to be competitive and the results of the last 2 years have proven that beyond any doubt.

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