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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  
Barnyb

Team France

1,995 posts in this topic

et aux arbres citoyens !

 

pourvu qu'ils trouveront la monnaie ? on ne peut qu'esperer....

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Une euro, un yen, un dollar ou la livre

Est tout ce qui fait tourner le monde

Ce cliquetis, son cliquetis ...

Peut faire l'aller 'rond du monde

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Sacrebleu?

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Take it to Froggytalk Anarchy.

ran ran ritantez ritantan

c'est dommage que le fromage est reste sur le chauffage pendant l'orage dans la garage

 

entrance to froggytalk anarky depends on you reading the above out loud 5 times, quickly

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Il est bien ce fil, on s'y sent à l'aise.

DoRag? Tu es là?

 

If a frog can make it, it's gotta be Cammas...

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Il est bien ce fil, on s'y sent à l'aise.

DoRag? Tu es là?

 

If a frog can make it, it's gotta be Cammas...

 

DoRag. RIP.

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^^ I think they still sound very expensive . . . . Will be interested to see if the COR can afford one.

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I saw that on the television one as well. He has Groupama (French insurance company) behind him.

And the advantage of living in the county where the Multiplast yard and VPLP are housed.

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Except Artemis has VPLP.

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Les réactions des membres de Team France suite à la publication du protocole par le Defender de la 35ème America's Cup :

1/ La date du 8 août pour le règlement des premiers droits d’inscription (1.075.000 US$) vous convient-elle et aurez-vous les moyens de payer ?

Louis Noël Viviès : « Le protocole précise que les coûts de l'organisation sportive de la prochaine America' Cup devront être supportés à part égale par l'ensemble des concurrents. Ces droits d'inscription, qui peuvent paraître élevés, sont aussi destinés à avoir un arbitrage et une organisation sportive indépendants du Defender. Cela a un coût, mais qu'il faut le mettre en perspective puisqu'il ne représente que 3% du budget global d'une campagne. Si Team France se lance à l'attaque de la 35ème AC, c'est avec des moyens cohérents avec ses ambitions et ce premier versement est donc incontournable ! »

2/ Sportivement, que pensez-vous des quatre échelons de sélection :

1. America’s Cup World Series en AC 45

2. America’s Cup Qualifier (2 round robin)

3. America’s Cup Challenger Playoffs

4. America’s Cup avec 1 point d’avance pour le challenger si il est aussi le vainqueur des America’s Cup Qualifier

Franck Cammas : « Les sélections vont commencer très tôt (dès l’année prochaine, en AC45) et déjà on sera dans le vif de la compétition avec des points à gagner ! C’est plutôt positif d’être dans l‘obligation de se mesurer régulièrement avec les autres team de l’America’s Cup et donc acquérir de l’expérience et progresser lors des ces régates de très haut niveau. Cela permettra aussi de sélectionner et de former un équipage performant pour Team France qui œuvrera ensuite sur l’AC62. On a besoin pour cela de mettre les équipiers sous pression très tôt et donc cela va nous permettre d’arriver préparé pour les régates finales sur le grand catamaran, régates qui demeurent l’objectif ultime et important de cette aventure»

3/ Technologiquement, le droit qu’à le Defender de construire deux bateaux contre 1 aux Challengers constitue t’il un avantage considérable ?

Michel Desjoyeaux : « Dans l’histoire de la Coupe, le Defender, qui fixe bon nombre de règles, a pour principal objectif de conserver son titre. Beaucoup de choses dans l’America’s Cup sont basées sur ce principe. Contrairement aux challengers, il navigue seul et n’a donc pas l’opportunité de tester son bateau face à des concurrents. Il est donc assez logique qu’il s’octroie le droit de construire deux bateaux contre un par challenger. »

4/ Est-il gênant de ne pas connaître qu’en février 2015 le lieu des différentes villes accueillant les sélections et l’America’s Cup ? Est-ce là encore une manœuvre du Defender pour tirer un avantage ?

Michel Desjoyeaux : « Le projet de jauge dont nous disposons est très contraignant et la marge de manœuvre des designers est millimétrée. Le choix du plan d’eau ne devrait pas beaucoup influer sur la performance des bateaux. D’autant plus que selon les bruits qui circulent, on devrait naviguer sur une mer plutôt plate. Il faut aussi se mettre à la place du Defender qui organise ces régates. C’est un énorme travail qui demande du temps. »




The reactions of members of Team France following the publication of the Protocol by the Defender of the 35th America's Cup: 1 / the date of August 8 for the settlement of the first registration fee (1.075.000 US$) you agree and you have the means to pay?

Louis Noël Viviès: "the specific protocol that the costs of the sports organization of the next America' Cup shall be borne equally by all the competitors. '' These listing fees, which may be high, are also intended to have an arbitration and a sports organisation independent of the Defender. This has a cost, but to put it in perspective because it represents only 3% of the overall budget of a campaign. If Team France launch the attack of the 35th AC, it means consistent with its ambitions and the first payment is therefore essential! » 2 / sportingly, what do you think of the four levels of selection: 1 America's Cup World Series in AC 45 2. America's Cup Qualifier (2 round robin) 3. America's Cup Challenger Playoffs 4. America's Cup with 1 point in advance for the challenger if he is also the winner of the America's Cup Qualifier Franck Cammas: "selections will begin very early (as soon as next year, AC45) and already it will be in the heart of the competition with points to win! It is rather positive to be obliged to compete regularly with the other team of the America's Cup and thus gain experience and advance when of these very high-level regattas. This will also select and form a powerful crew for Team France which will then operate on the AC62. We need to do is put the crew under pressure early and therefore it will allow us to get prepared for the final races on the big catamaran, regattas which remain important to this adventure and ultimate objective"3 / technologically, the right to the Defender to build two boats against 1 to the Challengers is make it a considerable advantage?

Michel Desjoyeaux: "in the history of the Cup, the Defender, which sets out a number of rules, a main objective of retaining its title. Many things in the America's Cup are based on this principle. Unlike the challengers, he sailed alone and therefore did not have the opportunity to test his boat against competition. It is therefore quite logical is granted the right to build two boats against a challenger. This is already done in the past. » 4 / is it annoying not knowing that in February 2015 instead of the different cities hosting the selections and the America's Cup? Is this still a manoeuvre of the Defender to take advantage?

Michel Desjoyeaux: "gauge project we have is very binding and the room for manoeuvre of the designers is millimeter. The choice of the water should not much affect the performance of the boats. Especially as according the rumors floating around, should navigate on a rather flat sea. Also need to put place the Defender who organizes these regattas. It is a huge work that takes time. »

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Nice, no whining from the French. REALLY pulling for these guys to make it happen. Man, it would be an awesome set of challengers to have AR, LR, ETNZ, BAR, and the French. Pretty tough for any one of those five to not make it to the challenger finals, and really would make those finals much less than they could be, as for a spectacle. Here's hoping they can still adjust that component to include 6 or 8 teams (give two teams a 1st round by in a quarter-final round, then semis, and challenger finals). That would be a really nice way to go.

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A story in Le Matin from June 28 (Google Translation):

America's Cup 2017 - "hinge moment" for Team France (PAPER ANGLE)

By Hervé GUILBAUD St. Petersburg, June 28, 2014 (AFP) - Team France, the team gathered around Franck Cammas for the next America's Cup in 2017, will "by the end of July" if it has the funds to address the oldest (1851) sporting trophy in the world.

Cammas table on a total budget of 60 to 70 million euros to mount a credible challenge, according to an informed source, alongside the racing Extreme Sailing Series (ESS) St. Petersburg (Russia).

Gauge the "Cup" was published in early 35th June and the first term chopper comes on August 8, with a compulsory payment to the organizers of 1.075 million dollars (790,000 euros) in fees. A second payment of the same amount must be paid before the end of the year.

"We are still waiting for answers" to potential sponsors, said Cammas, and "we will not commit (by paying the registration fee, note) that if we made ​​good progress."

The most talented French skipper of his generation will "by the end of July" if Groupama or other partner becomes the title sponsor of Team France, allowing the team to move forward in the design and construction of its AC62. "This is a pivotal moment," said the same source.

The "ticket" of the title sponsor amounted to € 12 million per year, or 36 million until 2017. This corresponds to the amounts invested by the insurance company and bank in the general sporting and technical part of the Volvo Ocean Race 2011-2012, won by Cammas and his crew.

The partnership between Cammas Groupama and lasts for 17 years, a record for longevity between a shipowner and a skipper. "Groupama is one of the people with whom we negotiate," confirmed Cammas.

Pending balance its budget, Team France began to think about the design of his steed future, a catamaran twenty meters (22 m against the AC72 for the "Cup" 2013) equipped with a wing rigid. "We are working on a version zero, with a French research office," said the skipper, without elaborating.

According to Cammas, "performance AC62 will be very close to those of AC72", with crews of 8 people instead of 11. 'Wings AC62 will be a little shorter than the AC72, "too big," said Will there.

Eventually, explained the browser, Team France should have a staff of 70-80 people, 30% higher than the Groupama team in the last Volvo Ocean Race. Payroll represent about 60% of the overall budget.

The "Cup" is owned by Americans Oracle Team USA, who victoriously defended (9 wins to 8) in September to face New Zealand Emirates Team New Zealand (ETNZ) at the end of one of most fantastic "comebacks" in the history of sport.

The venue of the 35th Cup has not yet been revealed.

http://www.lematin.ch/sports/depeches/coupe-america-2017--moment-charniere-team-france-papier-dangle/story/10196780

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Accor has hotels all over the world on different brands Sofitel, Novotel, Ibis, Mercure, Pullman etc.

 

A participation of Airbus would probably mean they would participate in the manufacturing of foils like they did with the Hydroptere (+DCNS).

With Cammas and Desjoyaux it would make a formidable competitor.

 

Note: Gtrans misses "premier avionneur européen" = first european aircraft manufacturer

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I took it to mean the 'top' european aircraft manufacturer but thanks anyway.

 

No idea either if Airbus might pump direct cash into the campaign but supplied technology and brains could be worth a ~lot~.

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These guys have the potential to be a serious dark horse, if they can manage to get the ball rolling

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Sofitel a 5*? Ha.

 

You need to get out more. I stayed at this one a few weeks ago after the GC32 thing, if they could give it six they should!

 

http://www.sofitel.com/gb/hotel-5413-sofitel-munich-bayerpost/index.shtml?utm_source=contemporan

 

I've been there along with many other Sofitels. The Mandarin Oriental is a 5*. The Sofitel is a Euro Westin.

 

Don't get me wrong, they are solid joints, I love the one at Heathrow T5, which is pretty convenient for early flights (and make a great salad btw), but they aren't 5*s.

 

Accor is a French IHG basically, with plenty of muscle. Glad to see them in the cup.

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I took it to mean the 'top' european aircraft manufacturer but thanks anyway.

 

No idea either if Airbus might pump direct cash into the campaign but supplied technology and brains could be worth a ~lot~.

 

It would appear as if Airbus is already supplying foils to Emirates:

 

emirates

One of Emirates' latest Airbus A380s arriving overhead Auckland this afternoon. A6-EEV was delivered to Emirates earlier this year and arrived in Dubai just two months ago on 26 May 2014.

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Accor has hotels all over the world on different brands Sofitel, Novotel, Ibis, Mercure, Pullman etc.

 

A participation of Airbus would probably mean they would participate in the manufacturing of foils like they did with the Hydroptere (+DCNS).

With Cammas and Desjoyaux it would make a formidable competitor.

 

Note: Gtrans misses "premier avionneur européen" = first european aircraft manufacturer

 

Well we know they do direct sponsorship deals as well...

 

1405690703-56507900.jpg

 

 

http://www.airbusgroup.com/int/en.html

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--

#TeamFrance is supposed to be....our sources confirm

Yeah that inspires confidence!

From FV, today: not only that, but also JuanK is supposed to have a design role!! Sunstroke for Michele?

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^ From this (poor) gtran

--

It appears to also FareVela Team France would have paid the entry fee by the deadline of August 8 and will in Juan Kouyoumdjian one of the leaders of the design team.

https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&hl=en&ie=UTF8&nv=1&prev=_t&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://www.farevela.net/2014/08/20/35th-americas-cup-artemis-racing-si-presentato-stoccolma-ingaggiati-freddy-loof-rod-davis/&usg=ALkJrhh3d_BZqYTl-N33H_Grgtqw7ozW4w

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All the best multihull talent in design building and sailing is French, and they go with JK as a designer?????

 

Ils sont malade ou quoi ?!

 

Only reason I can think of is he must be paying Team France to be part of it and they really need his money...

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All the best multihull talent in design building and sailing is French

Now they are "Swedish".

 

The JuanK rumour is pretty hard to believe.

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All the best multihull talent in design building and sailing is French

Now they are "Swedish".

 

The JuanK rumour is pretty hard to believe.

 

The cause of the mess that AR got themselves into has never been published .. the design work may have been sound and they could of been let down by the builders .. The French know may something that we don't .

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All the best multihull talent in design building and sailing is French

Now they are "Swedish".

 

The JuanK rumour is pretty hard to believe.

 

The cause of the mess that AR got themselves into has never been published .. the design work may have been sound and they could of been let down by the builders .. The French know may something that we don't .

The builders surely didn't invent that stupid grinders cockpit right in the middle of the boat where all the crew had to run through in the middle of a tack...

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All the best multihull talent in design building and sailing is French

Now they are "Swedish".

 

The JuanK rumour is pretty hard to believe.

 

The cause of the mess that AR got themselves into has never been published .. the design work may have been sound and they could of been let down by the builders .. The French know may something that we don't .

The builders surely didn't invent that stupid grinders cockpit right in the middle of the boat where all the crew had to run through in the middle of a tack...

 

I was referring to the structural design .. everyone can see that the original concept of the boat did not work .

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All the best multihull talent in design building and sailing is French, and they go with JK as a designer?????

 

Ils sont malade ou quoi ?!

 

Only reason I can think of is he must be paying Team France to be part of it and they really need his money...

Complètement d'accord avec toi Alpha FB.

Perhaps most already signed with the other teams ?

JK is the worst that could happen to a french team.

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All the best multihull talent in design building and sailing is French

Now they are "Swedish".

 

The JuanK rumour is pretty hard to believe.

 

The cause of the mess that AR got themselves into has never been published .. the design work may have been sound and they could of been let down by the builders .. The French know may something that we don't .

Not officially published however both the concept of a non foiling boat, the design of the boat, and its structure were wrong.

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All the best multihull talent in design building and sailing is French

Now they are "Swedish".

 

The JuanK rumour is pretty hard to believe.

 

The cause of the mess that AR got themselves into has never been published .. the design work may have been sound and they could of been let down by the builders .. The French know may something that we don't .

The builders surely didn't invent that stupid grinders cockpit right in the middle of the boat where all the crew had to run through in the middle of a tack...

 

I was referring to the structural design .. everyone can see that the original concept of the boat did not work .

ergo the design work was NOT sound...

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All the best multihull talent in design building and sailing is French, and they go with JK as a designer?????

 

Ils sont malade ou quoi ?!

 

Only reason I can think of is he must be paying Team France to be part of it and they really need his money...

Complètement d'accord avec toi Alpha FB.

Perhaps most already signed with the other teams ?

JK is the worst that could happen to a french team.

JK is the worst that could happen to any team.

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ok so he had a bad last campaign. Utterly bad actually

but he is a proven designer.

what about all the frenchies designers? who do they work for?

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they got vplp, multiplast and they choose JK? very interesting........

 

 

Yes , a bizarre choice give the talent they have in their home country. Maybe all the other designer/builders got snapped up. It is not a long list.

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This story http://www.sail-world.com/UK/Americas-Cup---Team-France-rank-among-official-challengers/125844

 

seems to confirm 5 challengers have been accepted. There is a separate story confirming BARs challenge been accepted too.

 

No suprises TNZ, Luna Rossa, Artemis, BAR and Team France. Question is are they really going to run a series at another venue to get rid of 1 team? I thought they wanted to REDUCE costs.

 

Oops, and its on ac.com, my question still stands though.

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Translated by google




Team France, official challenger for the 35th AC


After officially announced his willingness to participate in the 35 th America's Cup at the Paris Boat Show in December, the team of France Team led by Franck Cammas, Michel Desjoyeaux and Olivier de Kersauson is now proud to be part of the five challengers officially recognized by the Golden Gate Yacht Club of the American Defender, Oracle Team USA.


Between desire and reality, there is sometimes a chasm.


The advantage in the America's Cup is that the suspense does not usually last very long. By setting an important entry fee, the America's Cup Event Authority (ACEA) wanted to ensure the will and the credibility of the challengers in order to finalize them with the format and organization of the America's Cup which will be held in 2017 USA.


According to the official list published today by the organizers, Team France represented by the Yacht Club de France and officially supported by the French Sailing Federation is in line to try to wrest the famous American Silver Ewer, their award since 1851 the team that wins the duel between the defender and the best challengers.


Suffice to say that the challenge that beset on behalf of France, three of our best sailors are high because to date there are no tricolor team reached despite numerous attempts, ranging from those of Baron Bich (1970 , 74 and 77) with those of Marc Pajot (1987, 1992 and 1994), not forgetting those of the trio Farmhouse Gellusseau and Lesquen (2000 and 2003) and the latest, conducted by Stéphane Kandler in 2007.


" It's been 18 months since we are working seriously on this project with Michel, Olivier and a tight-knit team. It's difficult but exciting. Beyond the technological and sporting aspects that are our daily lives for decades, it must gain support from the public, business leaders and convince partners. It's exciting because AC allows us to meet strong personalities and companies who share our ambition. Without them and without the Club Team France that brings us together, we would not be official challenger. Thank you to them and thank you to all those who join us in the coming months to create the conditions for sustainable competitive in sailing crew and regularly participate in the America's Cup to win it , "said Franck Cammas, skipper Team France.


Against Team France, four teams of the highest level which have recent experience of the Cup also aspire to challenge the American Defender: New Zealanders Emirates, Italians Luna Rossa, the Swedish Artemis and finally Team Ben Ainslie which marks the return of the British on the Cup after years of absence.


It was in London, on September 9, the organizers of the 35 th America's Cup challengers present and communicate certain information about its progress.






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they got vplp, multiplast and they choose JK? very interesting........

 

 

Yes , a bizarre choice give the talent they have in their home country. Maybe all the other designer/builders got snapped up. It is not a long list.

 

VPLP is already signed up with Artemis.

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Actually, the AR announcement said one or the other (VP or LP, I forget) and so it's possible that the rest of the company might get contracted by a different team.

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Prevost is with Artemis (the LP part).

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Thanks. Presumably that's amazing talent bringing VPLP technology and experience but it may not be contracting the whole company, right?

 

I'll be surprised if Team Cammas doesn't tap in somehow; perhaps into Multiplast too?

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Actually, the AR announcement said one or the other (VP or LP, I forget) and so it's possible that the rest of the company might get contracted by a different team.

Met both in Venice, VP is the cruising part of the firm

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Actually, the AR announcement said one or the other (VP or LP, I forget) and so it's possible that the rest of the company might get contracted by a different team.

Met both in Venice, VP is the cruising part of the firm

 

??????????? Haven't seen VP for years and then only a few times, but back then he seemed to be into racing; when I met him he was at the end of the OSTAR, meeting Frank and others to talk ORMA 60s.

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I thought Van Petegam was dedicating his talents to developing projects for 3rd World countries like Bangladesh (trimaran ambulance) with Whatever and sustainable education at the school he co-founded in Niece.

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they got vplp, multiplast and they choose JK? very interesting........

With their financial situation perhaps he is all they could afford ?

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I thought Van Petegam was dedicating his talents to developing projects for 3rd World countries like Bangladesh (trimaran ambulance) with Whatever and sustainable education at the school he co-founded in Niece.

 

My mistake; for some silly reason I always associate the "VP" with Vincent (Lauriot) Prevost. My apologies.

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they got vplp, multiplast and they choose JK? very interesting........

With their financial situation perhaps he is all they could afford ?

Probably doing it for free in the hope of repairing his rep.

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I thought Big Blue was actually a decent boat, had a lot more potential if they could have sailed it more.

The upside of hiring someone who has made mistakes is that they are unlikely to repeat them.

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All the best multihull talent in design building and sailing is French

Now they are "Swedish".

 

The JuanK rumour is pretty hard to believe.

 

The cause of the mess that AR got themselves into has never been published .. the design work may have been sound and they could of been let down by the builders .. The French know may something that we don't .

The builders surely didn't invent that stupid grinders cockpit right in the middle of the boat where all the crew had to run through in the middle of a tack...

 

Talking about stupid designs. Who can forget OTUSA B1's original tiler.

 

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Does anyone see any signs that France is "for real"? The other teams all have personal and assets in place and are obviously working away (with bar still looking for 50% of their budget). But I don't see the same from France - am I missing the signals?

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They're busy as hell - but not on the AC, no plans to be either it seems!?

 

http://www.team-france.org/lagenda/

 

More on Tuesday?

 

What do you suggest they have on that schedule to prove they are a real challenger? Made up events?

 

Nah, just ignore that they have apparently put $2Million up for their entry.

 

Sheesh. This is the time of a cycle that is just unbearable.

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Any one thing AC related would be a start.

 

But please, go ahead and answer Estar's question in your own way

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Does anyone see any signs that France is "for real"? The other teams all have personal and assets in place and are obviously working away (with bar still looking for 50% of their budget). But I don't see the same from France - am I missing the signals?

 

At Nav's request, they apparently put up $2Million. They have their team principles lined up (Cammas, Kersausen, etc.). They will almost assuredly use Multiplast (VPLP is out of the picture, unfortunately, for them, as they are signed up with Artemis). Cammas has the makings for the start of his team if you just look at who he has been sailing with in the ESS. Maybe it is reasonable to wait until September 9 to see what they have to announce before inferring they are not legit?

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Does anyone see any signs that France is "for real"? The other teams all have personal and assets in place and are obviously working away (with bar still looking for 50% of their budget). But I don't see the same from France - am I missing the signals?

At Nav's request, they apparently put up $2Million. They have their team principles lined up (Cammas, Kersausen, etc.). They will almost assuredly use Multiplast (VPLP is out of the picture, unfortunately, for them, as they are signed up with Artemis). Cammas has the makings for the start of his team if you just look at who he has been sailing with in the ESS. Maybe it is reasonable to wait until September 9 to see what they have to announce before inferring they are not legit?

I was asking a simple question, dont get your panties all wadded up. I just wondered if I had missed any signals.

 

Do you (or anyone) know where the $2mm came from? A potential big sponsor, or just a 2% starter stake, or a loan?

 

The rest of what you say is not news and really no different than last time - they were then also "most assuredly" going to use multiplast, and had decent name principles and a few team members. What they were missing was the money.

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Does anyone see any signs that France is "for real"? The other teams all have personal and assets in place and are obviously working away (with bar still looking for 50% of their budget). But I don't see the same from France - am I missing the signals?

At Nav's request, they apparently put up $2Million. They have their team principles lined up (Cammas, Kersausen, etc.). They will almost assuredly use Multiplast (VPLP is out of the picture, unfortunately, for them, as they are signed up with Artemis). Cammas has the makings for the start of his team if you just look at who he has been sailing with in the ESS. Maybe it is reasonable to wait until September 9 to see what they have to announce before inferring they are not legit?

I was asking a simple question, dont get your panties all wadded up. I just wondered if I had missed any signals.

 

Do you (or anyone) know where the $2mm came from? A potential big sponsor, or just a 2% starter stake, or a loan?

 

The rest of what you say is not news and really no different than last time - they were then also "most assuredly" going to use multiplast, and had decent name principles and a few team members. What they were missing was the money.

 

I don't remember any rumors, in AC34, of the French teams ever having any real deep pockets investors. This time around, the rumors are there about Accor and Airbus. Time will tell.

 

No panties in a bunch, but you have to admit your "simple question", if you go back and look, did not look so innocent, nor was Nav's response. Sorry if you really were being absolutely objective in your questioning.

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This time around, the rumors are there about Accor and Airbus.

Ok, thanks.

 

Airbus was a Thin ply prospect, and some joint testing was done (on scarf joints). They seemed "tight" with money, and I would be a bit surprised if they put up a lot of sponsorship money.

 

I don't know Accor at all - are they "high end" ( to match what I presume are the expected audience demographics)? Edit: I see they have a full portfolio from low end to luxury. I have to believe they would want to sponsor with/under a luxury brand name rather than the corporate name.

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I don't know Accor at all - are they "high end" ( to match what I presume are the expected audience demographics)? Edit: I see they have a full portfolio from low end to luxury. I have to believe they would want to sponsor with/under a luxury brand name rather than the corporate name.

It would be Sofitel.

Accor is a big and strong company, however I would'nt see them financing the campaign alone, Airbus would be more than welcomed.

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Estar, perhaps if Team France for some miraculous reason decided to open their business records to you, you'd be in some heralded position to critique their financial prospects.

 

My wild-ass guess is that, as is normal with teams, the sponosorship will be a progression. Shoebie at ETNZ has already said that the same is true for them; BA has suggested much the same for his effort too.

 

If you are waiting for Airbus to announce the details of, say, a 124M sponsorship that depends on Cammas doing x, y and z at these locations on those dates well.. I'd suggest you are high in fantasy-land.

 

The closest numbers we ever get, probably because it's public money, is the NZ govt sponsorship numbers. Most everything else is and always has been closely held.

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Estar, perhaps if Team France for some miraculous reason decided to open their business records to you, you'd be in some heralded position to critique their financial prospects.

 

My wild-ass guess is that, as is normal with teams, the sponosorship will be a progression. Shoebie at ETNZ has already said that the same is true for them; BA has suggested much the same for his effort too.

 

If you are waiting for Airbus to announce the details of, say, a 124M sponsorship that depends on Cammas doing x, y and z at these locations on those dates well.. I'd suggest you are high in fantasy-land.

 

The closest numbers we ever get, probably because it's public money, is the NZ govt sponsorship numbers. Most everything else is and always has been closely held.

 

What's a secret sponsorship worth in an event that has the objective to attract eyeballs and facilitate business relations? If/When Airbus is in we will know; their interest cannot be to spend mils without telling anyone.

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If you are waiting for Airbus to announce the details of, say, a 124M sponsorship that depends on Cammas doing x, y and z at these locations on those dates well.. I'd suggest you are high in fantasy-land.

The standard SR modus operandi: distort someone's position, then ridicule it. What Estar actually wrote:

 

Does anyone see any signs that France is "for real"? The other teams all have personal and assets in place and are obviously working away (with bar still looking for 50% of their budget). But I don't see the same from France - am I missing the signals?

 

To answer that question, they seem to have raised the entry fee. There's been no announced sponsor. Maybe there will be on Tuesday. The amount of French talent signed by Artemis tells a story, I'd have thought.

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Like Rennmaus suggested, if/when we see sponsors announced, or see them displayed as logos on a boat, then we'll know. It's apparently still too soon.

 

But yes, they have not announced many people to be involved so far either. Perhaps the choices depend on if/when sponsorship does come through.

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Whoever Team France gets for sponsors here is hoping they steal Aleph's paint scheme for all their boats. That Aleph AC45 was pretty to look at:

 

5tugi8.jpg

 

WetHog :ph34r:

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Whoever Team France gets for sponsors here is hoping they steal Aleph's paint scheme for all their boats. That Aleph AC45 was pretty to look at:

 

5tugi8.jpg

 

WetHog :ph34r:

 

France has had blue themed boats since way back with the Baron. Hopefully they continue.

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conversation is.

 

 

Everything is Free, Xlot?

 

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^^

 

I would hope I'm not a bigger cheapskate than the average Anarchist, just asking for the gist

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point is, if it's not available to all and sundry, and you're not willing to provide a summary, there's absolutely no use in posting links like that...

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^^^^^

 

Fuggadaboudit - no news / bad news (of course) from the press conference. And apparently they cannot yet afford team shirts, just a ridiculous lapel button. I'd really, really like to see a copy of the supposed $1M money order ..

 

7b4d4fadd367d39068e434208fd5c282_zpsdd56

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Let's hope the cor com can drive through changes that allow team France to give it a crack as second commercial team - this team also fading away like team australia would be a sad indictment

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Were fretting over shirts logos versus lapel buttons now?

Well it's similar to seeing team AUS heading out to practice with 8 guys in a six man rib . A premonition as it were . Can't play in the big leagues with a little league budget .

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Were fretting over shirts logos versus lapel buttons now?

 

We're talking the AC here - everything matters, their socks and underware, even white plastic chairs outside of tents.

 

What are you thinking ? - get with the program.

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Fwiw, a link to Mer Forte:

http://www.merforte.com/#!projets/clxt

 

As seen mentioned in this article at LeMonde: http://www.lemonde.fr/sport/article/2014/09/10/coupe-de-l-america-revoila-les-frenchies_4485128_3242.html

 

« C'est un monde vraiment différent du nôtre », s'accorde à dire Michel Desjoyeaux, qui surpervisera l'aspect technique et technologique avec son bureau d'étude, Mer forte, où vingt ingénieurs et techniciens s'activent déjà sur le projet. On est ici dans l'élite de la voile mondiale. Tout est très politique. C'est une lutte de pouvoir constante, avec du lobbying, des négociations, avec des unions qui se créent sur des points, se défont sur d'autres. C'est un jeu permanent. Mais ça tombe bien, je suis très joueur ! »

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Fwiw, a link to Mer Forte:

http://www.merforte.com/#!projets/clxt

 

As seen mentioned in this article at LeMonde: http://www.lemonde.fr/sport/article/2014/09/10/coupe-de-l-america-revoila-les-frenchies_4485128_3242.html

 

« C'est un monde vraiment différent du nôtre », s'accorde à dire Michel Desjoyeaux, qui surpervisera l'aspect technique et technologique avec son bureau d'étude, Mer forte, où vingt ingénieurs et techniciens s'activent déjà sur le projet. On est ici dans l'élite de la voile mondiale. Tout est très politique. C'est une lutte de pouvoir constante, avec du lobbying, des négociations, avec des unions qui se créent sur des points, se défont sur d'autres. C'est un jeu permanent. Mais ça tombe bien, je suis très joueur ! »

Thanks SR for this quote

MJ: "This world is very different from ours. We are with the elite of world sailing. All is very political. It is a constant power struglle with lobbying, negotiation, associations on some points who do not exist on others. It is a permanent game. It's good, I am a player ! "

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Fwiw, a link to Mer Forte:

http://www.merforte.com/#!projets/clxt

 

As seen mentioned in this article at LeMonde: http://www.lemonde.fr/sport/article/2014/09/10/coupe-de-l-america-revoila-les-frenchies_4485128_3242.html

 

« C'est un monde vraiment différent du nôtre », s'accorde à dire Michel Desjoyeaux, qui surpervisera l'aspect technique et technologique avec son bureau d'étude, Mer forte, où vingt ingénieurs et techniciens s'activent déjà sur le projet. On est ici dans l'élite de la voile mondiale. Tout est très politique. C'est une lutte de pouvoir constante, avec du lobbying, des négociations, avec des unions qui se créent sur des points, se défont sur d'autres. C'est un jeu permanent. Mais ça tombe bien, je suis très joueur ! »

Thanks SR for this quote

MJ: "This world is very different from ours. We are with the elite of world sailing. All is very political. It is a constant power struglle with lobbying, negotiation, associations on some points who do not exist on others. It is a permanent game. It's good, I am a player ! "

Have you heard of Mer Forte before?

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Mer Forte: given how technical IMOCAs / big tris are, most French offshore sailors have an entourage of (little, if at all, paid) young engineers hoping one day to eke out a living ..

 

But Mich' Desj's emphasis aside, he cuts no ice: plus ça change (from AC34), plus c'est la même chose - and the two entertaining Le Monde pieces can be summarized in the understatement of the week:

 

Clearly, we are not 100% operational, but we have a healthy vision of the project ..

Edit: it always strikes me how people here (but Cammas too) speak of Airbus as a French entity. Off the top of my head, it's also got German, Spanish shareholders (don't know if the perfidious Brits are still in or not), and any initiative is subject to a tug-of-war on where it should be located and who should head it. So, forget that Airbus does mainly institutional advertising, and never on the AC scale - but do you believe for one moment the Germans would agree to something called Team France?

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« Pour le moment, on dépense de l'argent pour trouver de l'argent »,

explique Franck Cammas, qui a personnellement mis la main à la poche pour amorcer la pompe à finance.

 

"Now we spend money to find money" explains Franck Cammas who spent his own pocket money to..... find money.

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Well froggie, seems like your not very bullish on your home team being such a nationalist as you proclaim - what no balls big mouth ?

 

You better hope your team is not criticized anywhere near as much as you criticize teams you don't support or you'll wind up getting flushed down the toilet in short order. .

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^

This has got to be the dumbest post in quite a while (no mean feat): the French are entitled to be proud of current sailing achievements more than probably any other country, together with NZ. The one exception is the AC, for reasons Loïck Peyron explained very well - and you cannot really blame them. Personally, I don't feel much "nationalist" pride in the fact that one billionaire happens to be Italian.

So, the critique to Cammas &Co. is that they appear too "wannabeish" - not that BA seems to be in much better shape, for that matter.

 

But I suspect both have just put in a placeholder, and are counting on the AC being revised into something reasonably cheaper.

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Thanks Xlot.

Here is an interesting piece about the "nationalist" roots of the challenge that Gtrans did not capture.

 

l'idée de départ était de constituer un team breton. Dans l'univers de la voile, la Bretagne , c'est la Nouvelle-Zélande : le même nombre de marins, la même culture nautique, le même dynamisme ! Au fil des discussions , on s'est vite rendu compte que le projet ne serait viable qu'à une échelle nationale, mais en gardant cette attache naturelle à Lorient où Team Groupama est basé depuis dix ans et à Port-la-Forêt pour Michel Desjoyeaux.

 

The initial was to create a Breton team. In french sailing, Brittany is like New Zealand, same number of sailors, same sailing culture, same dynamism. After discussing we realized that the project could only be viable at the french national level, but that we would keep our natural sailing center at Lorient where Groupama is located and Port Laforêt for Michel Desjoyeaux.

 

As you say their Talon d'Achille is money more than experience.

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^

This has got to be the dumbest post in quite a while (no mean feat): the French are entitled to be proud of current sailing achievements more than probably any other country, together with NZ. The one exception is the AC, for reasons Loïck Peyron explained very well - and you cannot really blame them. Personally, I don't feel much "nationalist" pride in the fact that one billionaire happens to be Italian.

So, the critique to Cammas &Co. is that they appear too "wannabeish" - not that BA seems to be in much better shape, for that matter.

 

But I suspect both have just put in a placeholder, and are counting on the AC being revised into something reasonably cheaper.

 

My bad, I thought you were smarter than that but your common love for EB probably taints your thinking.

 

Your assessment has to be one of the dumbest interpretations ever. Apparently you put much more credence in criticism here than you could find in a full blown nut house jam packed with lunatics and idiots. The comment was solely directed at TC, who fuels constant vile towards OTUSA, but I understand your position - you and TC both idolize EB, and I suppose you both think CNEV was legit too :) .

 

Nothing against the French - Loick continually sets an example of professionalism that grumpy could learn from. I'd love to see Cammas make a good showing in AC35 and will root for him more than TC, who hides under a rock because he's thrown so many he lives in fear of karma. Didn't think I'd have to spell it out for you.

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