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Whether BB is the right guy is a worthy debate.

 

But that Dalts isn't, in the same role he's been in since 2003, is pretty well established at this point. Grant's tough guy routine and authoritarian leadership style were just what the doctor ordered after the 2003 debacle, but it's not the right thing for the current situation.

 

Authoritarian, top-down teams do not win the Cup in the modern era. It took Oracle two cycles to learn this and ditch Dicko.

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TNZ also made two critical design choices that ultimately cost them:

 

First, they went all in on stable foiling to the detriment of other aspects of their program (namely aero). The constant fiddling with beam fairings and pie warmers were desperate attempts to claw back some of the aero deficit they had relative to OTUSA.

 

Second, they did not respond to the threat presented by Oracle's evident speed potential with their second boat.

 

All of this speaks to the kind of mistakes that are made when you have someone dictating from above, where people engage in groupthink and are afraid to point out potential problems. The reaction to Oracle's package should have been "Jesus, if they ever get that thing stable it's going to be way faster than us." Rather than, "Foiling is our secret weapon, we discovered it and nobody can possibly catch us."

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If Grant stays at the head of the table this time around I think it could work out better than last time as apparently whoever is in charge will not have the absolute power that was once afforded the head guy. He has done a great job raising funds and perhaps this time around he will be more focused on that. One thing for sure he wont be on the handles this time around.

 

As the first article mentions the team itself ,meaning the crew most likely won't stand for it and as the second story relates the board also has some new members put specifically in place to spread out some of the powers as it were. For one I think Shooby is going to have a bigger say in things which can only be a good thing.

 

The first concerns that fact that Dalton was reportedly earning a salary of $2 million and his insistence on being part of the on-board team as a grinder was queried by Olympic rowing champion and ETNZ's best grinder, Rob Waddell:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11278576

 

Team NZ’s challenge for the next America’s Cup is struggling to stay afloat. Phil Taylor discovers it’s not just about the money — there are scars from the last campaign that still haven’t healed.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11278448

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I see Ashby is smashing them in France at the A Cat Europeans. Barker not having a great start. This will get Sir Clean fully wound up, wait for it...................................

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Always good to the top mark just a shame about the finish.

 

With BAR and Artemis now run by more than evenly competent people and without the drama of ETNZ and possibly AUS I am sure BB will find not only a worthwhile job but one he was alluding to. I agree with him, same old, same old. A Board that was no different to the last. It is all very well to arrange the funding and by and large no one in NZ has a problem with Dalton on that front. They do however have a problem with Grant sailing on the boat and being so fucking autocratic.

 

He is no Steve Hansen and any comparison to the AB"s is so wrong. So technically Kevin Shoebridge is now in charge of the sailing team. Good man but I am with BB on this. Was it his insistence to get Burling and Tuke involved? What about Junior and a host od hard strong guys? I would be amazed if Kevin knew who Ian Neely was.

.

. When I went to management school the "Board" was independent thereby "negating" mis-management. Even with this board nothing has changed, other than the Board

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I does not stop being surprised by all the comments about ETNZs failure and how bad GD is. OR did win in the end and they did win on knock out. Good for them

 

Still OR was so unbelievable close to get humiliated by ETNZ and was very close to loose in big style. I can not understand how so many people can say that ETNZs AC champagne was a total failure. All this talks about being serial loosers that can not win.

 

 

How about LR. No one is complaining on them. How many times have they been in AC and how far has they gone? Lets see. 2000? 2003? 2007? 2013? Strange

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Mate Prada has long been known as the best team to work for not because they can win but you get the best clothes, beautiful boats and a coach for every position on the boat and get paid like never before. They are now pretty much fully Italian and if they make it to any quarter final I would be amazed. Sadly still Prada bot at least the housing bill will go down. Still living with the rents

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I does not stop being surprised by all the comments about ETNZs failure and how bad GD is. OR did win in the end and they did win on knock out. Good for them

 

Still OR was so unbelievable close to get humiliated by ETNZ and was very close to loose in big style. I can not understand how so many people can say that ETNZs AC champagne was a total failure. All this talks about being serial loosers that can not win.

 

 

How about LR. No one is complaining on them. How many times have they been in AC and how far has they gone? Lets see. 2000? 2003? 2007? 2013? Strange

 

LR aren't asking for any handouts from anyone, particularly government funds. If Bertelli wants to spend his money on a team that hasn't won (so far) it's his business.

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I does not stop being surprised by all the comments about ETNZs failure and how bad GD is. OR did win in the end and they did win on knock out. Good for them

 

Still OR was so unbelievable close to get humiliated by ETNZ and was very close to loose in big style. I can not understand how so many people can say that ETNZs AC champagne was a total failure. All this talks about being serial loosers that can not win.

Couldn't agree more.

There is a lot of garbage thrown around here that I get to peruse when I can get wifi, and frankly not worth the paper that it isn't written on. As it were.

It is kinda repetitious, but TNZ were the first to foil, and their foils were a new design that were copied by OR.

If they had not been copied, they would not have won.

The new foil design is the way to go for foiling cats.

 

Life is full of "ifs". As my Mum used to say - Russell - if your Aunt had balls, she'd be your Uncle.

 

If OR had not copied, TNZ would have won.

If the wind had not died and the fluffy wind race cancelled, TNZ would have won.

If OR didn't have a Dude with deep pockets, TNZ would have won. This comment is based on an article from the Economist stating that OR spent upwards of 70 mill in the last few months.

If RC hadn't pulled a dozen of the best yachting brains in the world together in the last month, TNZ would have won.

 

LIke I say, "if my Aunt had balls …...

 

OR won fair and square, but when you consider all the lead up, it was very close.

RC is a real battler and a bloody good brain, without which OR would be floundering.

Overall OR did a better job than TNZ and won.

 

Forget my Auntie.

She's not my Uncle, and TNZ did not win.

 

But why do so many de-cry TNZ and Dalts. They were bloody close, and the next series is going to be a helluva battle.

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I does not stop being surprised by all the comments about ETNZs failure and how bad GD is. OR did win in the end and they did win on knock out. Good for them

 

Still OR was so unbelievable close to get humiliated by ETNZ and was very close to loose in big style. I can not understand how so many people can say that ETNZs AC champagne was a total failure. All this talks about being serial loosers that can not win.

Couldn't agree more.

There is a lot of garbage thrown around here that I get to peruse when I can get wifi, and frankly not worth the paper that it isn't written on. As it were.

It is kinda repetitious, but TNZ were the first to foil, and their foils were a new design that were copied by OR.

If they had not been copied, they would not have won.

The new foil design is the way to go for foiling cats.

 

Life is full of "ifs". As my Mum used to say - Russell - if your Aunt had balls, she'd be your Uncle.

 

If OR had not copied, TNZ would have won.

If the wind had not died and the fluffy wind race cancelled, TNZ would have won.

If OR didn't have a Dude with deep pockets, TNZ would have won. This comment is based on an article from the Economist stating that OR spent upwards of 70 mill in the last few months.

If RC hadn't pulled a dozen of the best yachting brains in the world together in the last month, TNZ would have won.

 

LIke I say, "if my Aunt had balls …...

 

OR won fair and square, but when you consider all the lead up, it was very close.

RC is a real battler and a bloody good brain, without which OR would be floundering.

Overall OR did a better job than TNZ and won.

 

Forget my Auntie.

She's not my Uncle, and TNZ did not win.

 

But why do so many de-cry TNZ and Dalts. They were bloody close, and the next series is going to be a helluva battle.

All good points well made - but as they say, it's all history.

 

Question: Why are JS's Facebook pages obsessed with TNZ?

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I does not stop being surprised by all the comments about ETNZs failure and how bad GD is. OR did win in the end and they did win on knock out. Good for them

 

Still OR was so unbelievable close to get humiliated by ETNZ and was very close to loose in big style. I can not understand how so many people can say that ETNZs AC champagne was a total failure. All this talks about being serial loosers that can not win.

Couldn't agree more.

There is a lot of garbage thrown around here that I get to peruse when I can get wifi, and frankly not worth the paper that it isn't written on. As it were.

It is kinda repetitious, but TNZ were the first to foil, and their foils were a new design that were copied by OR.

If they had not been copied, they would not have won.

The new foil design is the way to go for foiling cats.

 

Life is full of "ifs". As my Mum used to say - Russell - if your Aunt had balls, she'd be your Uncle.

 

If OR had not copied, TNZ would have won.

If the wind had not died and the fluffy wind race cancelled, TNZ would have won.

If OR didn't have a Dude with deep pockets, TNZ would have won. This comment is based on an article from the Economist stating that OR spent upwards of 70 mill in the last few months.

If RC hadn't pulled a dozen of the best yachting brains in the world together in the last month, TNZ would have won.

 

LIke I say, "if my Aunt had balls …...

 

OR won fair and square, but when you consider all the lead up, it was very close.

RC is a real battler and a bloody good brain, without which OR would be floundering.

Overall OR did a better job than TNZ and won.

 

Forget my Auntie.

She's not my Uncle, and TNZ did not win.

 

But why do so many de-cry TNZ and Dalts. They were bloody close, and the next series is going to be a helluva battle.

Well said. Sir Clean will be here any minute now.

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TNZ were very close to winning the cup, that's a fact.

 

Here's a supposition that's hard to argue with as well: If OTUSA doesn't lose weeks of sailing time to the capsize, they reach form before the match starts and TNZ gets blown out of the water in humiliating fashion.

 

Hypotheticals go both ways.

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TNZ were very close to winning the cup, that's a fact.

 

Here's a supposition that's hard to argue with as well: If OTUSA doesn't lose weeks of sailing time to the capsize, they reach form before the match starts and TNZ gets blown out of the water in humiliating fashion.

 

Hypotheticals go both ways.

Except Oracle fucked up big time plus plus with their original floppy penis design - they were 180 degrees offcourse in stupidity/ineptitude. So your supposition is weak.

Interesting to hear that Larry threw 70 million at the boat by hiring hyper expertise in the last month to catch up.

It was a close run thing - and yes, Oracle came out winner ... but did I say? - close run thing.

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Geez, Groucho-still sitting on that UptiP?

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Question: Why are JS's Facebook pages obsessed with TNZ?

Because that's where the obsession is.

http://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/2014/06/24/americas-cup-new-zealand-soap-opera/

I'm fully aware of NZL's obsession.

 

Just wondering about JS's, is all. I guess he needs to keep a good close eye on his nemesis.

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TNZ were very close to winning the cup, that's a fact.

 

Here's a supposition that's hard to argue with as well: If OTUSA doesn't lose weeks of sailing time to the capsize, they reach form before the match starts and TNZ gets blown out of the water in humiliating fashion.

 

Hypotheticals go both ways.

Except Oracle fucked up big time plus plus with their original floppy penis design - they were 180 degrees offcourse in stupidity/ineptitude. So your supposition is weak.

Interesting to hear that Larry threw 70 million at the boat by hiring hyper expertise in the last month to catch up.

It was a close run thing - and yes, Oracle came out winner ... but did I say? - close run thing.

 

Yes, the capsize was Oracle's fault. As were a number of decisions along the way that cost TNZ the cup.

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The will and money of an entire nation with a single minded obsession versus ... wait for it...

 

 

The Larry.

 

 

You guys need help.

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The will and money of an entire nation with a single minded obsession versus ... wait for it...

 

 

The Larry.

 

 

You guys need help.

Just money thanks. We've got the rest pretty much covered. :)

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That old saw.

 

At the end of 34 the consensus was that the boat budgets of ET and OR were relatively egual with ET holding the edge in the number of designers.

 

As time passes and the Kiwi excuse machine ramps up and the OR budget balloons.

 

 

But admittedly Larry spent a small fortune staging the party.

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I don't get it. You countries top guy is gnashing his teeth over the salary of a professional sailor and funding a sporting event.

 

Is 30 million really that much of a burden for your nation?

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I don't get it. You countries top guy is gnashing his teeth over the salary of a professional sailor and funding a sporting event.

 

Is 30 million really that much of a burden for your nation?

No. On the contrary, it's proven money well spent. It's just that we have some folk here who thrive on the politics of envy. And, as you are aware, it's election year.

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30 million?

 

I just looked it up on the interweb, a sheep is worth between 300 and 500 USD.

 

That a lot of fuckin sheep.

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Question: Why are JS's Facebook pages obsessed with TNZ?

Because that's where the obsession is.

http://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/2014/06/24/americas-cup-new-zealand-soap-opera/

Interesting article - and yes, sailing has always been a pretty big thing in NZ.

I remember listening to 1/4 ton races when I was working in Christchurch (NZ to UK) in 1960 to so. Totally riveting stuff too.

But about JS's Facebook pages?????

Don't really know. There is enough gossip in here without getting more.

There are better things to do than monitor AC gossip full time….

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30 million?

 

I just looked it up on the interweb, a sheep is worth between 300 and 500 USD.

 

That a lot of fuckin sheep.

Keep up. NZL is a dairy producer.

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30 million?

 

I just looked it up on the interweb, a sheep is worth between 300 and 500 USD.

 

That a lot of fuckin sheep.

Keep up. NZL is a dairy producer.

hmmm. I guess you have to tell the wife something.

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Question: Why are JS's Facebook pages obsessed with TNZ?

Because that's where the obsession is.

http://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/2014/06/24/americas-cup-new-zealand-soap-opera/

Interesting article - and yes, sailing has always been a pretty big thing in NZ.

I remember listening to 1/4 ton races when I was working in Christchurch (NZ to UK) in 1960 to so. Totally riveting stuff too.

But about JS's Facebook pages?????

Don't really know. There is enough gossip in here without getting more.

There are better things to do than monitor AC gossip full time….

 

Were you with ta koodie back in the 60's ?

 

Regarding JS's FB pages over the past 30 days, were you here for grumpy's complaints over the past three years ? Apparently not.

 

With your limited wifi as a constant issue maybe you don't have to monitor AC gossip. Feel blessed and enjoy being off the grid.

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Question: Why are JS's Facebook pages obsessed with TNZ?

Because that's where the obsession is.

http://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/2014/06/24/americas-cup-new-zealand-soap-opera/

Interesting article - and yes, sailing has always been a pretty big thing in NZ.

I remember listening to 1/4 ton races when I was working in Christchurch (NZ to UK) in 1960 to so. Totally riveting stuff too.

But about JS's Facebook pages?????

Don't really know. There is enough gossip in here without getting more.

There are better things to do than monitor AC gossip full time….

 

Were you with ta koodie back in the 60's ?

 

For the case you wouldn't know, Kia Ora is the pseudo for TK, Indio, MSP and DTRB

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Question: Why are JS's Facebook pages obsessed with TNZ?

Because that's where the obsession is.

http://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/2014/06/24/americas-cup-new-zealand-soap-opera/

Interesting article - and yes, sailing has always been a pretty big thing in NZ.

I remember listening to 1/4 ton races when I was working in Christchurch (NZ to UK) in 1960 to so. Totally riveting stuff too.

But about JS's Facebook pages?????

Don't really know. There is enough gossip in here without getting more.

There are better things to do than monitor AC gossip full time….

 

Were you with ta koodie back in the 60's ?

 

For the case you wouldn't know, Kia Ora is the pseudo for TK, Indio, MSP and DTRB

 

Buzz off troll. Back under your bridge.

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Official statement from Team NZ

 

http://www.voxy.co.nz/sport/team-nz-secures-funding-next-americas-cup/5/194404

 

TEXT:

Emirates Team New Zealand chairman Dr Keith Turner says the team has now reached the point where it has the confidence to mount a challenge for the 35th America’s Cup.

 

The team has secured sufficient private and sponsorship funding to proceed to the next stage without needing Government funding during this period.

 

"Now, with the assistance of long-time supporters Sir Stephen Tindall, Matteo de Nora and other private Donors and Sponsors, we are delighted to be able to say that we are funded through to late this year.

 

CEO Grant Dalton said: "The team has been working towards this moment almost since the day of the last race in San Francisco.

"The funding support for the team that has coalesced over the past week means we can continue the design and engineering development, and keep racing, until main sponsorship funds begin to flow.

 

"To avoid falling behind the opposition, our design and engineering team has been working on the software tools they will need for the challenge."

 

This week sailing team members are competing in two regattas: Dean Barker, Glenn Ashby and Chris Nicholson are at the European A Class championships in France and Olympic 49er sailors Peter Burling and Blair Tuke with Jeremy Lomas, Ray Davies and Edwin DeLaat are in Russia for the Extreme Sailing Series which starts on Thursday."

 

"The Protocol and the design rule has been published so we know what we are working with and we are confident we can mount a challenge that has the potential to win.

 

"Amendments to the Protocol have removed some of the more contentious issues. If this Protocol follows the pattern of previous Cup cycles, more amendments will follow. The so called 2 boat rule for the defender is not the problem suggested by recent media reports."

 

"We now await the announcement of venue for the challengers’ preliminary series and then the venue for the challengers’ semi-finals, finals and the America’s Cup match, so that we can put the finishing touches to the team’s business plan and present it to our backers for approval."

 

Entries for the 35th America’s Cup close on August 8.

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That old saw.

 

At the end of 34 the consensus was that the boat budgets of ET and OR were relatively egual with ET holding the edge in the number of designers.

 

As time passes and the Kiwi excuse machine ramps up and the OR budget balloons.

 

 

But admittedly Larry spent a small fortune staging the party.

70 million in emergency funds at the last min ?

 

Really ???

 

Next we will here there was a chartered jet whisking 50 techs from NZ in the middle of the night to fix B2 in secret .

 

Oh that's right they already tried that rumor .

 

Next month the 70 will be 80 just watch and see.

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Interesting to hear that Larry threw 70 million at the boat by hiring hyper expertise in the last month to catch up.

 

Speak to anyone in the Oracle team and they will tell you that story is a complete fabrication. Unfortunately the Kiwi's love to cling to it as it give them some justification for fucking up what should have been an unassailable lead.

 

Just suck it up, you were beaten by a better team and a better boat. ETNZ wasn't nearly as good as they made out, and unfortunately I don't see them changing. The same management, the same groupthink in the design team.

 

ETNZ are a spent force now, unless they can chuck out some of the dead wood and re-invent themselves as a modern team with competent leadership, and designers that can think past the size of their cluster, they will be lucky to make the top 4 next time.

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Interesting to hear that Larry threw 70 million at the boat by hiring hyper expertise in the last month to catch up.

 

Speak to anyone in the Oracle team and they will tell you that story is a complete fabrication. Unfortunately the Kiwi's love to cling to it as it give them some justification for fucking up what should have been an unassailable lead.

 

Just suck it up, you were beaten by a better team and a better boat. ETNZ wasn't nearly as good as they made out, and unfortunately I don't see them changing. The same management, the same groupthink in the design team.

 

ETNZ are a spent force now, unless they can chuck out some of the dead wood and re-invent themselves as a modern team with competent leadership, and designers that can think past the size of their cluster, they will be lucky to make the top 4 next time.

What a croc.

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Interesting to hear that Larry threw 70 million at the boat by hiring hyper expertise in the last month to catch up.

 

Speak to anyone in the Oracle team and they will tell you that story is a complete fabrication. Unfortunately the Kiwi's love to cling to it as it give them some justification for fucking up what should have been an unassailable lead.

 

Just suck it up, you were beaten by a better team and a better boat. ETNZ wasn't nearly as good as they made out, and unfortunately I don't see them changing. The same management, the same groupthink in the design team.

 

ETNZ are a spent force now, unless they can chuck out some of the dead wood and re-invent themselves as a modern team with competent leadership, and designers that can think past the size of their cluster, they will be lucky to make the top 4 next time.

What a croc.

 

The whole of NZ is in denial. Maybe the way forward is to do some realistic appraisal of the mistakes made last time instead of the bullshit 'we were great because we nearly won and our design team are the best in the world (despite the fact that the boat was like a piece of agricultural machinery)' bullshit that Dalton spouts.

 

I'm not saying get rid of Dalton or Barker or anyone else, just start being realistic about why you lost instead of this head in the sand bullshit and bluster, and the ETNZ not-invented-here syndrome. Maybe ETNZ can learn something from how the other teams are approaching the problem.

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Good news - I for one am very happy to see the strongest possible dual attack from Australia and New Zealand on Oracle - given Ozzie and Kiwi influence on and public interest in the Cup we need to get it back in Oceania one way or another. ETNZ for one has unfinished business just like in '90, just like Australia would love to relive '83

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Aaaaaargh ---

70 mill is from the UK Economist

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First time I've seen a budget number from a reliable source. direct quote at http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/aap/article-2669503/Govt-weighs-Americas-Cup-challenge.html

 

--

The government has already put in $5 million and Economic Development Minister Steven Joyce says it will be taking a close look at Team NZ's sponsorship proposals.

 

"Initially we said we'd be prepared to maybe go as far as last time but it's too early to say at this point," he told reporters.

 

"Their total spend last time was around $180 million and taxpayers were sponsors to the tune of $36m of that."

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Aaarrghhhgrr, arrrrgh, oorgerrr in - who gives a shit about the spelling of your asinine name.

70 fucking mill.. think about that ... spent in a few weeks.

No, Kiwis could not compete. We lost fair and square.

But a quiet word in the Oracle fan boys' shell-like ears - that figure is insanity? Even half that figure is still far out hyper ego, desperation bonkers.

I think even Kiwis wanting desperately to win would consider this ... just a little on the imbalanced side. No?

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$ 180,000,000 million :)

 

Let that sink in for a bit :) :)

 

GD is going to have a tough time playing the David vs Goliath game again this time .

 

Who would believe him ?

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Aaaaaargh ---

70 mill is from the UK Economist

 

They weren't the same clowns that gave us the big scoop on the plane load of kiwi techs landing in the middle of the night to do some miracle mods to B2 are they ?

 

I guess if its in the paper it must be true :)

 

national_enquirer_606.jpg

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$ 180,000,000 million :)

 

Let that sink in for a bit :) :)

 

GD is going to have a tough time playing the David vs Goliath game again this time .

 

Who would believe him ?

 

He wasn't believable last time - merely earning his nickname all along.

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Aaarrghhhgrr, arrrrgh, oorgerrr in - who gives a shit about the spelling of your asinine name.

70 fucking mill.. think about that ... spent in a few weeks.

No, Kiwis could not compete. We lost fair and square.

But a quiet word in the Oracle fan boys' shell-like ears - that figure is insanity? Even half that figure is still far out hyper ego, desperation bonkers.

I think even Kiwis wanting desperately to win would consider this ... just a little on the imbalanced side. No?

 

Really ?

 

$70M in a few weeks ? Word had it that Herbie cost all of $5K. Where did the other $69,999,995.00 go ?

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Aaarrghhhgrr, arrrrgh, oorgerrr in - who gives a shit about the spelling of your asinine name.

70 fucking mill.. think about that ... spent in a few weeks.

No, Kiwis could not compete. We lost fair and square.

But a quiet word in the Oracle fan boys' shell-like ears - that figure is insanity? Even half that figure is still far out hyper ego, desperation bonkers.

I think even Kiwis wanting desperately to win would consider this ... just a little on the imbalanced side. No?

it doesn't make any sense - AFAIK no equipment changed during the entire course of the final. Same platform, same controls, same foils, same wing.

 

Maybe this represents BA's victory incentive?

 

Other than changing modes - the only change I know of was BA sub'ing in for JK.

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Aaarrghhhgrr, arrrrgh, oorgerrr in - who gives a shit about the spelling of your asinine name.

70 fucking mill.. think about that ... spent in a few weeks.

No, Kiwis could not compete. We lost fair and square.

But a quiet word in the Oracle fan boys' shell-like ears - that figure is insanity? Even half that figure is still far out hyper ego, desperation bonkers.

I think even Kiwis wanting desperately to win would consider this ... just a little on the imbalanced side. No?

Really ?

 

$70M in a few weeks ? Word had it that Herbie cost all of $5K. Where did the other $69,999,995.00 go ?

To the Truckers Union, to transport all those pallets of cash all over the place, in the middle of the night, on overtime..

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Aaarrghhhgrr, arrrrgh, oorgerrr in - who gives a shit about the spelling of your asinine name.

70 fucking mill.. think about that ... spent in a few weeks.

No, Kiwis could not compete. We lost fair and square.

But a quiet word in the Oracle fan boys' shell-like ears - that figure is insanity? Even half that figure is still far out hyper ego, desperation bonkers.

I think even Kiwis wanting desperately to win would consider this ... just a little on the imbalanced side. No?

Really ?

 

$70M in a few weeks ? Word had it that Herbie cost all of $5K. Where did the other $69,999,995.00 go ?

To the Truckers Union, to transport all those pallets of cash all over the place, in the middle of the night, on overtime..

 

Assuming the cost of an AC72 is $10M - that means they would have built the equivalent of 7 extra boats in a month.

 

Sure, I believe that figure.It just appears a bit browish in color and kind of smells.

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Leave the kiwi fan boys have their fantasy excuses.

 

If you take that away from them they'll have to accept the truth.

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$ 180,000,000 million :)

 

Let that sink in for a bit :) :)

 

GD is going to have a tough time playing the David vs Goliath game again this time .

 

Who would believe him ?

Joyce actually says $190M in the audio, twice.

http://www.radiolive.co.nz/AUDIO-Private-sponsors-back-Team-New-Zealand-for-the-next-Americas-Cup/tabid/506/articleID/48473/Default.aspx

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Aargh! you are a beautiful man.

 

and 100% correct. although, as you say, the Kiwis will deny it as a way to crasp on to any form of acceptance following the WORLDS BIGGEST SPORTING CHOKE.

 

as Russell said. they had the kit and knew it was fast, they just had to refine it.

 

but hey Kiwi's! don't let the truth get in the way of you embarrassment. :D

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$ 180,000,000 million :)

 

Let that sink in for a bit :) :)

 

GD is going to have a tough time playing the David vs Goliath game again this time .

 

Who would believe him ?

Joyce actually says $190M in the audio, twice.

http://www.radiolive.co.nz/AUDIO-Private-sponsors-back-Team-New-Zealand-for-the-next-Americas-Cup/tabid/506/articleID/48473/Default.aspx

 

But we know ET can't compete in a billionaires boat race, he told us about 1000 times. Maybe he was just kidding after all. What a jokester he is.

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Graco Marx....you are a complete "arse wipe"

 

show us the proof ya bug fuck wit!... any body can right stories.

 

Oracle spent money on a boat one re build.

 

Oracle spent money on Boat 2.

 

ETNZ have spent over 500million on failed campaigns since they (Barker) lost the cup 13 years ago.

 

ETNZ lost the cup in San Fran through stupidity at many levels.

 

bad design

 

evolving the wrong parts of the boats (PIE WARMERS)

 

allowing THE LAY DAY

 

BARKERS piss poor leadership

 

Tactical decisions

 

failing to see what the opposition were doing

 

sailing their boat poorly (WORKING OUT THE UPWIND HIGH AND LOW MODES)

 

TYPICAL OF KIWIS TO BLAME EVERYBODY ELSE BUT THEIR OWN TEAM FOR THEIR OWN TEAMS "BIG MASSIVE CHOKE'

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Graco Marx....you are a complete "arse wipe"

 

show us the proof ya bug fuck wit!... any body can right stories.

 

Oracle spent money on a boat one re build.

 

Oracle spent money on Boat 2.

 

ETNZ have spent over 500million on failed campaigns since they (Barker) lost the cup 13 years ago.

 

ETNZ lost the cup in San Fran through stupidity at many levels.

 

bad design

 

evolving the wrong parts of the boats (PIE WARMERS)

 

allowing THE LAY DAY

 

BARKERS piss poor leadership

 

Tactical decisions

 

failing to see what the opposition were doing

 

sailing their boat poorly (WORKING OUT THE UPWIND HIGH AND LOW MODES)

 

TYPICAL OF KIWIS TO BLAME EVERYBODY ELSE BUT THEIR OWN TEAM FOR THEIR OWN TEAMS "BIG MASSIVE CHOKE'

its write you dickhead

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Graco Marx....you are a complete "arse wipe"

 

show us the proof ya bug fuck wit!... any body can right stories.

 

Oracle spent money on a boat one re build.

 

Oracle spent money on Boat 2.

 

ETNZ have spent over 500million on failed campaigns since they (Barker) lost the cup 13 years ago.

 

ETNZ lost the cup in San Fran through stupidity at many levels.

 

bad design

 

evolving the wrong parts of the boats (PIE WARMERS)

 

allowing THE LAY DAY

 

BARKERS piss poor leadership

 

Tactical decisions

 

failing to see what the opposition were doing

 

sailing their boat poorly (WORKING OUT THE UPWIND HIGH AND LOW MODES)

 

TYPICAL OF KIWIS TO BLAME EVERYBODY ELSE BUT THEIR OWN TEAM FOR THEIR OWN TEAMS "BIG MASSIVE CHOKE'

You are such a tosser, Sir Clean. A fucking useless bigot.

 

We've heard all this dribble from you (and your aliases) a hundred times already.

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70 fucking mill.. think about that ... spent in a few weeks.

 

The fact that you think this ludicrous story has the remotest chance of being true is a sad testament to the average kiwi's gullibility and desire to believe in their team's infallibility.

 

The fact that some otherwise reputable members of the press reprinted it is even sadder.

 

If you want to have a go at Oracle, criticise them for -

a: designing a boat that wasn't stiff enough in the first place.

b: pitchpoling it in wind that was too strong and an ebb tide that was going to carry them out to sea

c: persevering with boards that were too far forward on B1

d: not figuring out how to gybe on foils earlier.

e: not figuring out how to tack earlier.

f: focussing on improving their downwind speed when it should have been clear that upwind was going to be important.

g: not figuring out that their VPP was crap at predicting upwind VMG angles

etc, etc.

 

But give them some kudos for finally pulling it all together in the nick of time, and for designing what, in the end, was an inherently superior boat

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SAIL ONYA DATE - don't take it so bad. they tried their best and were found to be "big fucking chokers' / out smarted / OUT SAILED / out manoeuvred...

 

Its OK, you still got your cricket team.... ooops they lost too!

well you have Barker at the European A class champs.... ooopps no! he's taking a dorking.

 

well times are tough for the Kiwis. ETNZ may be your only hope :lol: :lol: :lol:



Brilliant AAARRGH!

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XYZ1000 - it is write. :)

 

so I take it that was the only thing wrong in that post!

 

thanks for the approval. I can live with the spelling mistake :D

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SAIL ONYA DATE - don't take it so bad. they tried their best and were found to be "big fucking chokers' / out smarted / OUT SAILED / out manoeuvred...

 

Its OK, you still got your cricket team.... ooops they lost too!

 

well you have Barker at the European A class champs.... ooopps no! he's taking a dorking.

 

well times are tough for the Kiwis. ETNZ may be your only hope :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

 

Brilliant AAARRGH!

wind came up - Barker now in 5th.

 

Took second in last race of the day:

 

http://www.a-cat.org/?q=node/432

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First time I've seen a budget number from a reliable source. direct quote at http://www.dailymail.co.uk/wires/aap/article-2669503/Govt-weighs-Americas-Cup-challenge.html

 

--

The government has already put in $5 million and Economic Development Minister Steven Joyce says it will be taking a close look at Team NZ's sponsorship proposals.

 

"Initially we said we'd be prepared to maybe go as far as last time but it's too early to say at this point," he told reporters.

 

"Their total spend last time was around $180 million and taxpayers were sponsors to the tune of $36m of that."

 

According to figures reported in "Winging It: ORACLE TEAM USA's Incredible Comeback to Defend the America's Cup", OTUSA spent 50% more than ETNZ.

 

I guess that $180m is in NZD, so this would be about 135m USD using the average exchange rate between 2011 and 2013.

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Wow you kiwis must be fizzing.

 

Deans going great guns.

 

Wow! He's....

 

...wait for it....

 

5th. Gee you guys must be cracking "shame boners".

 

Meanwhile back in NZ...

http://tvnz.co.nz/national-news/poll-reveals-majority-kiwis-against-further-america-s-cup-funding-6013054

 

 

Yes indeed. In the most comprehensive" we hate these tosser ETNZ "gravy train'rs poll yet the Kiwis again reiterate the - fuck off dean and grant you had your chance result to date.

 

So.... to all you kiwis that support ETNz, beware! Most kiwis think you are tossers and most kiwis have no time for the AC, ETNZ, and sailing.

 

The truth hurt aye boys.

 

Standing by for all your hollow rhetoric...

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I guess that $180m is in NZD

Well it would be odd if a conversation between Kiwis on a Kiwi radio station didn't refer to Kiwi dollars.

 

NZ$180M = £90M and BA is suggesting an AC35 budget of £80M. The figures tie up.

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Wow you kiwis must be fizzing.

 

Deans going great guns.

 

Wow! He's....

 

...wait for it....

 

5th. Gee you guys must be cracking "shame boners".

 

Meanwhile back in NZ...

http://tvnz.co.nz/national-news/poll-reveals-majority-kiwis-against-further-america-s-cup-funding-6013054

 

 

Yes indeed. In the most comprehensive" we hate these tosser ETNZ "gravy train'rs poll yet the Kiwis again reiterate the - fuck off dean and grant you had your chance result to date.

 

So.... to all you kiwis that support ETNz, beware! Most kiwis think you are tossers and most kiwis have no time for the AC, ETNZ, and sailing.

 

The truth hurt aye boys.

 

Standing by for all your hollow rhetoric...

I'm standing by TNZ. Yes. And I'm confident lots of other Kiwis are too.

 

I believe they have the talent and the tools to win the AC again. I'm also confident the NZL fans will be back to support them when we are up against other challengers and hopefully, the defender.

 

Seems to me the only tosser around here is you, Sir Clean/America's Cup/Yankee Doodle/America's Cup.

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Mr Clean, get yourself an A class and go racing see if you can do better than 5th. My guess is no. Prove me wrong

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The 70 mil was used to turn the wind off in race whatever that timed out with ETNZ in site of the finish, and the Cup. That's the going rate to call in a favor from Mother Nature.

 

Money talk aside, ETNZ in for AC35 is great news. They are a quality AC team and after last cycles low turnout this cycle needs all the quality competitors it can get. And I expect ETNZ to come out fired up for AC35 like never before. With this cycle truly being win or else for ETNZ.

 

WetHog

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Mr Clean, get yourself an A class and go racing

AFAIK Mr Clean and Sir Clean are not two chips from the same block.

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I know that Sir Clean is simply a troll, but it is clear he has no idea about DB's abilities in the A's and just how impressive he has been. This is his second event in the class. He sailed his first event at the Oz nationals a few years ago in a fleet which was probably better than the one he is now sailing in.He had less than one month to practice, having never raced a cat before. From the first race, he was not only right up there but he dominated the starts and was first at the top mark most races. Anybody who has raced small cats knows that starting is one of the more difficult aspects and managing to win the pin time and again against some of the best cat sailors is pretty unreal. Compare this to Jimmy Spithill who was at his 3rd big A Class event and who had done other major cat events like the F18 worlds. JS was way off DB's pace and was struggling to stay in the top 10. DB slipped off the pace a bit downhill, due to lack of practice and being a bit too heavy for the conditions, but everybody at the event got to see that he was an exceptional sailor.

 

Compare this to Tom Slingsby and Nathan Outteridge. Yes, they had a few excuses but after a summer of training with one of the top sailors in the class, they didn't exactly feature in their first A Class worlds.So, looking at his peers in the AC, you would say that DB has out performed them by some margin. To suggest that he is anything other than one of the best sailors of his generation is to show a serious ignorance about what it takes at the top of this sport.

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Wow you kiwis must be fizzing.

 

Deans going great guns.

 

Wow! He's....

 

...wait for it....

 

5th. Gee you guys must be cracking "shame boners".

 

Meanwhile back in NZ...

http://tvnz.co.nz/national-news/poll-reveals-majority-kiwis-against-further-america-s-cup-funding-6013054

 

 

Yes indeed. In the most comprehensive" we hate these tosser ETNZ "gravy train'rs poll yet the Kiwis again reiterate the - fuck off dean and grant you had your chance result to date.

 

So.... to all you kiwis that support ETNz, beware! Most kiwis think you are tossers and most kiwis have no time for the AC, ETNZ, and sailing.

 

The truth hurt aye boys.

 

Standing by for all your hollow rhetoric...

 

My understanding is that the poll revealed that "A total of 62% of people surveyed in the poll believe that the Government shouldn't provide any more funds to the challenge, while fewer than one third say the team should get more money." I'm not sure that finding supports your claims.

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Didn't understand the ball busting JS got when he first started sailing A cats, and I do not understand the ball busting DB is getting now. Both have sailed at the literal ragged edge on those AC72's. They are at a level of sailing that few can claim to be at. They can sail anything they get on at a professional level, they just need a bit of practice. How many can say the same that frequent this site? Very few is my guess.

 

WetHog :ph34r:

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Aaarrghhhgrr, arrrrgh, oorgerrr in - who gives a shit about the spelling of your asinine name.

70 fucking mill.. think about that ... spent in a few weeks.

No, Kiwis could not compete. We lost fair and square.

But a quiet word in the Oracle fan boys' shell-like ears - that figure is insanity? Even half that figure is still far out hyper ego, desperation bonkers.

I think even Kiwis wanting desperately to win would consider this ... just a little on the imbalanced side. No?

 

Really ?

 

$70M in a few weeks ? Word had it that Herbie cost all of $5K. Where did the other $69,999,995.00 go ?

 

Hookers? (for the automated-ride-height review committee?)

 

Lead futures?

 

 

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Mr Clean, get yourself an A class and go racing see if you can do better than 5th. My guess is no. Prove me wrong

Do me a favor Bill, and don't confuse me with SIR CLEAN, an uber-troll that you guys are too stupid to ignore!

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I know that Sir Clean is simply a troll, but it is clear he has no idea about DB's abilities in the A's and just how impressive he has been. This is his second event in the class. He sailed his first event at the Oz nationals a few years ago in a fleet which was probably better than the one he is now sailing in.He had less than one month to practice, having never raced a cat before. From the first race, he was not only right up there but he dominated the starts and was first at the top mark most races. Anybody who has raced small cats knows that starting is one of the more difficult aspects and managing to win the pin time and again against some of the best cat sailors is pretty unreal. Compare this to Jimmy Spithill who was at his 3rd big A Class event and who had done other major cat events like the F18 worlds. JS was way off DB's pace and was struggling to stay in the top 10. DB slipped off the pace a bit downhill, due to lack of practice and being a bit too heavy for the conditions, but everybody at the event got to see that he was an exceptional sailor.

 

Compare this to Tom Slingsby and Nathan Outteridge. Yes, they had a few excuses but after a summer of training with one of the top sailors in the class, they didn't exactly feature in their first A Class worlds.So, looking at his peers in the AC, you would say that DB has out performed them by some margin. To suggest that he is anything other than one of the best sailors of his generation is to show a serious ignorance about what it takes at the top of this sport.

Barker shines - but Tuke and Burling?

 

Ashby is seemingly untouchable - but the two kids may got what it takes.

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Mr Clean, get yourself an A class and go racing see if you can do better than 5th. My guess is no. Prove me wrong

Do me a favor Bill, and don't confuse me with SIR CLEAN, an uber-troll that you guys are too stupid to ignore!

 

KISS! ...and do us all a favour - boot his ass out (plus anyone who has adopted another posters avatar) A 'Clean' Sweep so to speak!?

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Nav found something new to whine about,

 

How kiwi.

 

Interesting that ta koodie, kia ora and nav are the ones that have always lobbied as to who should be booted.

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I know that Sir Clean is simply a troll, but it is clear he has no idea about DB's abilities in the A's and just how impressive he has been. This is his second event in the class. He sailed his first event at the Oz nationals a few years ago in a fleet which was probably better than the one he is now sailing in.He had less than one month to practice, having never raced a cat before. From the first race, he was not only right up there but he dominated the starts and was first at the top mark most races. Anybody who has raced small cats knows that starting is one of the more difficult aspects and managing to win the pin time and again against some of the best cat sailors is pretty unreal. Compare this to Jimmy Spithill who was at his 3rd big A Class event and who had done other major cat events like the F18 worlds. JS was way off DB's pace and was struggling to stay in the top 10. DB slipped off the pace a bit downhill, due to lack of practice and being a bit too heavy for the conditions, but everybody at the event got to see that he was an exceptional sailor.

 

Compare this to Tom Slingsby and Nathan Outteridge. Yes, they had a few excuses but after a summer of training with one of the top sailors in the class, they didn't exactly feature in their first A Class worlds.So, looking at his peers in the AC, you would say that DB has out performed them by some margin. To suggest that he is anything other than one of the best sailors of his generation is to show a serious ignorance about what it takes at the top of this sport.

+1

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I know that Sir Clean is simply a troll, but it is clear he has no idea about DB's abilities in the A's and just how impressive he has been. This is his second event in the class. He sailed his first event at the Oz nationals a few years ago in a fleet which was probably better than the one he is now sailing in.He had less than one month to practice, having never raced a cat before. From the first race, he was not only right up there but he dominated the starts and was first at the top mark most races. Anybody who has raced small cats knows that starting is one of the more difficult aspects and managing to win the pin time and again against some of the best cat sailors is pretty unreal. Compare this to Jimmy Spithill who was at his 3rd big A Class event and who had done other major cat events like the F18 worlds. JS was way off DB's pace and was struggling to stay in the top 10. DB slipped off the pace a bit downhill, due to lack of practice and being a bit too heavy for the conditions, but everybody at the event got to see that he was an exceptional sailor.

 

Compare this to Tom Slingsby and Nathan Outteridge. Yes, they had a few excuses but after a summer of training with one of the top sailors in the class, they didn't exactly feature in their first A Class worlds.So, looking at his peers in the AC, you would say that DB has out performed them by some margin. To suggest that he is anything other than one of the best sailors of his generation is to show a serious ignorance about what it takes at the top of this sport.

Barker shines - but Tuke and Burling?

 

Ashby is seemingly untouchable - but the two kids may got what it takes.

An embrassement of riches for TNZ. Bodes well for AC35.

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All kidding aside and it's a honest question but what the hell is up with the NZ press ?

 

Reporting news is one thing but why the witch hunt ? Grants income , poll after poll ?

 

Talk about kicking a sheep when it's down half of all the threads dealing with Americas Cup news are negative to say the least .

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funny how people accept 5th placing's as success.

 

why do you defend such mediocrity? why do you defend years of mediocrity. have you no other sailor you can praise?... oh no you have NOT!

 

why set the bar so low.... unless you to are a loser.

 

ETNZ is an embarrassment to NZ sailing AND HAS TAINTED THE AVERAGE KIWIS PERSPECTIVE OF THE SPORT,

 

the polls and newspaper article plus letter to the editors show a real objection to these guys.

 

meanwhile the real art of sailing in NZ is lost behind the AC./ETNZ cloud.


look at Aussie and GBR sailing results at Olympics and world champs since they left the AC. they have risen to the top and are the best sailing nations in the world.

 

why... no AC bullshit fucking their sports profile.

 

Bill R - keeping taking the medication buddy. Sir Clean

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