• Announcements

    • UnderDawg

      A Few Simple Rules   05/22/2017

      Sailing Anarchy is a very lightly moderated site. This is by design, to afford a more free atmosphere for discussion. There are plenty of sailing forums you can go to where swearing isn't allowed, confrontation is squelched and, and you can have a moderator finger-wag at you for your attitude. SA tries to avoid that and allow for more adult behavior without moderators editing your posts and whacking knuckles with rulers. We don't have a long list of published "thou shalt nots" either, and this is by design. Too many absolute rules paints us into too many corners. So check the Terms of Service - there IS language there about certain types of behavior that is not permitted. We interpret that lightly and permit a lot of latitude, but we DO reserve the right to take action when something is too extreme to tolerate (too racist, graphic, violent, misogynistic, etc.). Yes, that is subjective, but it allows us discretion. Avoiding a laundry list of rules allows for freedom; don't abuse it. However there ARE a few basic rules that will earn you a suspension, and apparently a brief refresher is in order. 1) Allegations of pedophilia - there is no tolerance for this. So if you make allegations, jokes, innuendo or suggestions about child molestation, child pornography, abuse or inappropriate behavior with minors etc. about someone on this board you will get a time out. This is pretty much automatic; this behavior can have real world effect and is not acceptable. Obviously the subject is not banned when discussion of it is apropos, e.g. talking about an item in the news for instance. But allegations or references directed at or about another poster is verboten. 2) Outing people - providing real world identifiable information about users on the forums who prefer to remain anonymous. Yes, some of us post with our real names - not a problem to use them. However many do NOT, and if you find out someone's name keep it to yourself, first or last. This also goes for other identifying information too - employer information etc. You don't need too many pieces of data to figure out who someone really is these days. Depending on severity you might get anything from a scolding to a suspension - so don't do it. I know it can be confusing sometimes for newcomers, as SA has been around almost twenty years and there are some people that throw their real names around and their current Display Name may not match the name they have out in the public. But if in doubt, you don't want to accidentally out some one so use caution, even if it's a personal friend of yours in real life. 3) Posting While Suspended - If you've earned a timeout (these are fairly rare and hard to get), please observe the suspension. If you create a new account (a "Sock Puppet") and return to the forums to post with it before your suspension is up you WILL get more time added to your original suspension and lose your Socks. This behavior may result a permanent ban, since it shows you have zero respect for the few rules we have and the moderating team that is tasked with supporting them. Check the Terms of Service you agreed to; they apply to the individual agreeing, not the account you created, so don't try to Sea Lawyer us if you get caught. Just don't do it. Those are the three that will almost certainly get you into some trouble. IF YOU SEE SOMEONE DO ONE OF THESE THINGS, please do the following: Refrain from quoting the offending text, it makes the thread cleanup a pain in the rear Press the Report button; it is by far the best way to notify Admins as we will get e-mails. Calling out for Admins in the middle of threads, sending us PM's, etc. - there is no guarantee we will get those in a timely fashion. There are multiple Moderators in multiple time zones around the world, and anyone one of us can handle the Report and all of us will be notified about it. But if you PM one Mod directly and he's off line, the problem will get dealt with much more slowly. Other behaviors that you might want to think twice before doing include: Intentionally disrupting threads and discussions repeatedly. Off topic/content free trolling in threads to disrupt dialog Stalking users around the forums with the intent to disrupt content and discussion Repeated posting of overly graphic or scatological porn content. There are plenty web sites for you to get your freak on, don't do it here. And a brief note to Newbies... No, we will not ban people or censor them for dropping F-bombs on you, using foul language, etc. so please don't report it when one of our members gives you a greeting you may find shocking. We do our best not to censor content here and playing swearword police is not in our job descriptions. Sailing Anarchy is more like a bar than a classroom, so handle it like you would meeting someone a little coarse - don't look for the teacher. Thanks.

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

thetruth

Another incredibly bad AUS Challenge

360 posts in this topic

The world has the utmost respect for Bertrand etc but the new "Challenge" just lacks so many important things. Too many people doing Olympics. nothing going well on the initial sailing front (ESS) so who and what is this the "Challenger" doing

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Let me guess, they're just another syndicate that decided not hire you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I thought it had been a little quiet for the past fortnight

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Gee Mad that was yet another great reply from let me guess another AUS failure. So who are the major designers, did they take and pay for to[ design teams? Matt Belcher? The worlds best 470 sailor. And the rest? Where is Grant Simmer?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The world has the utmost respect for Bertrand etc but the new "Challenge" just lacks so many important things. Too many people doing Olympics. nothing going well on the initial sailing front (ESS) so who and what is this the "Challenger" doing

 

Guess what Tom Slingsby and Ben Ainslie were doing less than 18 months prior to the 34th AC. Besides, the real problem for Team Australia will be to fill the design side, not the sailors. (The Aussies owe the 1983 AC as much if not more to Ben Lexcen than to John Bertrand.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe a AUS AC website would work or is that the same as the Ricko show on a bow and stern change on the mighty OATS 11?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And the strengths of the Aust challenge are......

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fuck you Mad. Simple facts as usual. It is what it is and not matter who or what you are if you think AUS is serious then think again. It is the Oatley Challenge

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No design, no real management and a part time sailing team. Why not run with CLEAN in charge, Big Fella designing and Chas from Tas steering?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No design, no real management and a part time sailing team. Why not run with CLEAN in charge, Big Fella designing and Chas from Tas steering?

 

No, no, no - if we really want to lose, I need to be on tactics.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is there a link to info on this new AUS challenge? I thought the protocol made it tough for 2nd teams from a specific country (I am sure I am wrong about that interpretation though)?

 

Or is this Bertrand rumor BS?

 

WetHog :ph34r:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^ According to Article 15.3(d), "GGYC will only accept one (1) challenge for AC35 per country, unless GGYC at its sole discretion determines otherwise."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^ According to Article 15.3(d), "GGYC will only accept one (1) challenge for AC35 per country, unless GGYC at its sole discretion determines otherwise."

 

 

^^^^^ any 2nd team from a country already entered as a Challenger

 

Can enter as a Defender from Bermuda B)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The ability to design their own boat is also missing. They will be buying the design package from another team...

 

*posted this in the other thread before I was this one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Another incredibly bad AUS Challenge

 

 

Come on man, the writing was on the wall as soon as Sling and Spit turned them down. They will be non-competitive--its a developmental stepping stone challenge after all. Its also a "I can do this before I die", and a huge personal and commercial self interest move as well. To see it any other way is sportsfan-ism, just like a lot of nonsense that gets posted here.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The ability to design their own boat is also missing. They will be buying the design package from another team...

 

*posted this in the other thread before I was this one.

 

Is designing your own platform that big a deal? Ok it is important, but the wings are OD aren't they? So that leaves a start up team to focus on foil/rudder design and optimizing the design package platform aerodynamically once its is built. Modify up to 50% of the hulls after initially constructed right? Or am I way off base?

 

Absolutely.

 

WetHog :ph34r:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^ Wing control systems are still wide open. That difference played a quite big part in the AC34 Match races..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^ Wing control systems are still wide open. That difference played a quite big part in the AC34 Match races..

Indeed it was. That is a challenge to develop from scratch. Disregard my previous comment. ;)

 

WetHog

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

 

^ Wing control systems are still wide open. That difference played a quite big part in the AC34 Match races..

Indeed it was. That is a challenge to develop from scratch. Disregard my previous comment. ;)

 

WetHog

Was thinking primarily about OR's self-tacking wing. vs ETNZ's, who almost capsized and almost pitched, both on account of handling difficulty with their wing.

 

It's unfortunately not that visible, in the way that say IACC V5 bow shape differences were, but it's pretty interesting all the same. Nowadays the visibility difference is more about foil wickedness.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

The ability to design their own boat is also missing. They will be buying the design package from another team...

 

*posted this in the other thread before I was this one.

 

Is designing your own platform that big a deal? Ok it is important, but the wings are OD aren't they? So that leaves a start up team to focus on foil/rudder design and optimizing the design package platform aerodynamically once its is built. Modify up to 50% of the hulls after initially constructed right? Or am I way off base?

 

Absolutely.

 

WetHog :ph34r:

Don't have the designers to build the boat = Don't have the designers to optimise and refine the boat.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There are certainly plenty of gaps in the program for the idle speculators to fill with hot air and bs, but I can say they're out training on the harbour today with two AC45's in 17-30 knots of westerly pressure. Saw them both go tearing by on their way out at about 10:30am...

 

I've heard several senior Oracle Team USA members say in person that another Mascalzone Latino style COR fold would be an unacceptable result for all involved in AC35, and with the Oatley family forming the foundations of the challenge expect the Aussies to go the distance.

 

Will they win it first time out? Probably not. Will they keep the bastards honest? Here's hoping.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Will they win it first time out? Probably not. Will they keep the bastards honest? Here's hoping.

That's already a fail. No IJ. ACEA to choose venue on its own whim and its own sweet time. And so on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Will they win it first time out? Probably not. Will they keep the bastards honest? Here's hoping.

That's already a fail. No IJ. ACEA to choose venue on its own whim and its own sweet time. And so on.

 

I can not see any value add that the COR has added for the challenger group.

 

They appear to have been right royally rogered by RC

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

 

 

^ Wing control systems are still wide open. That difference played a quite big part in the AC34 Match races..

Indeed it was. That is a challenge to develop from scratch. Disregard my previous comment. ;)

 

WetHog

Was thinking primarily about OR's self-tacking wing. vs ETNZ's, who almost capsized and almost pitched, both on account of handling difficulty with their wing.

That self tacking wing really helped when OR ate shit with boat 1 didn't it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

^ Wing control systems are still wide open. That difference played a quite big part in the AC34 Match races..

 

Indeed it was. That is a challenge to develop from scratch. Disregard my previous comment. ;)

WetHog

Was thinking primarily about OR's self-tacking wing. vs ETNZ's, who almost capsized and almost pitched, both on account of handling difficulty with their wing.
That self tacking wing really helped when OR ate shit with boat 1 didn't it.

They sure did .

 

And then they won the cup with it :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hopefully keeps IM in a job for the next three years. Can't be all bad.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Geezus, is this for real??

--

 

https://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-stories/24500183/yachting-more-turmoil-for-the-americas-cup/

 

More turmoil for the America's Cup.

 

It's understood the Australian Challenger of record, the Hamilton Island Yacht Club, is withdrawing from the 35th edition of the race.

 

The syndicate says the new Protocols set by challengers Oracle are too hard to prepare for when no dates or venue have been confirmed for the event.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hopefully keeps IM in a job for the next three years. Can't be all bad.

Ah.....hold the phone on this one. Or, is NZL just having another 'herbie' moment?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^ WTF! Great scoop SR, if it is true. It was only a few months ago that Ian Murray was declaring that the AC35 protocol was the fairest ever.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Geezus, is this for real??

--

 

https://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-stories/24500183/yachting-more-turmoil-for-the-americas-cup/

 

More turmoil for the America's Cup.

 

It's understood the Australian Challenger of record, the Hamilton Island Yacht Club, is withdrawing from the 35th edition of the race.

 

The syndicate says the new Protocols set by challengers Oracle are too hard to prepare for when no dates or venue have been confirmed for the event.

Can this be true? Has Bob Oatley spat the dummy?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^ The same story is on Radio Sport's web site, Are Radio Sport and Newstalk ZB (the source for SR's post) in the same 'family?

 

Edit: A quick Wikipedia search confirms that Radio Sport and Newstalk ZB are sister stations.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

From the link, their source must be PJM, whose source in turn is likely ETNZ-associated. A certainty, or mis-communication somewhere along the link chain that exaggerated something less firm?

--

"Yachting commentator Peter Montgomery says it's another twist as another Challenger of Record bites the dust."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If true RC will do a deal with Artemis to be the next COR

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If true RC will do a deal with Artemis to be the next COR

Or BAR?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can't find anything on Queensland Radio stations to corroborate this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's now also listed on the NZ Herald's web site (and attributed to Radio Sport).

 

Then it must be true. These guys were only wrong once before.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

What's PJM's radio station? I doubt he stays quiet for long on this, it'd be quite the scoop.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Same article, in the NZ Herald

m.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11296083

 

--

Aussie challenge set to pull out

 

It's understood the Australian challenger of record, the Hamilton Island Yacht Club, is withdrawing from the 35th edition of the race.

 

The syndicate says the new protocols set by challengers Oracle are too hard to prepare for when no dates or venue have been confirmed for the event.

 

Yachting commentator Peter Montgomery says it's a further twist in the buildup for the next regatta as another challenger of record bites the dust.

 

- Radio Sport

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

If true RC will do a deal with Artemis to be the next COR

Or BAR?

Oracle China

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In the 9.30am Radio Sport news bulletin ETNZ were mentioned as saying it's news to them

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Holy shit! Just read this on the Herald and raced over to break the news ...... but Stingray beat me to it!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If this is true then Uncle Larry and Cousin Russ have a lot of egg on their face.

 

And no chance Artemis agrees to be the bail-out COR again. No chance.

 

WetHog :ph34r:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm going to go with it's true.

 

Any challenger other than OracleChina is going to be a serious problem for Coutts. You say Ainslie will be his puppet, well maybe Ainslie would, but Keith Mills sure wouldn't be. Turnquist already said he wanted San Fran. Luna Rossa? Good luck with that Russell. RNZYS might be his best option.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Has anyone else challenged? That would seem to be the interesting detail.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Am going with true too, it's not like people just make that kind of thing up - even PJM has a reputation.

 

The next CoR will be the Challenger who did, or will if none did yet, get their Challenge accepted. And that's out of RC's control.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If this is true then Uncle Larry and Cousin Russ have a lot of egg on their face.

 

And no chance Artemis agrees to be the bail-out COR again. No chance.

 

WetHog :ph34r:

If true, a total cock-up. And AC35 is to be sailed on Lake Flacid as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hmm this happened last time, Oracle picked a weak Italian COR who crumbled, now a weak AUS team. What a shitshow. RusselVision.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sport building is just as hard as nation building. And just as foolish of an undertaking.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Okay, everybody be safe out there: don't get between the lawyers and the court house.

 

I really hope it isn't true. I'd like to see these guys sailing and the lawyering thing gets old fast.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It's understood the Hamilton Island Yacht Club is withdrawing from the 35th edition of the race, due to it being too hard to prepare for when holders Oracle are yet to announce a date or venue.


Yachting commentator Peter Montgomery says it's another twist, with Prada and Artemis both having entered the race.


"They are asking now "What? What now?" and my sense is that Oracle will certainly be part of the blame game saying they havent had enough support from the australians and maybe the British challenger as well."


Team New Zealand has told our newsroom the development has come as news to them.


Earlier this week, British team boss Sir Ben Ainslie expressed disappointment that the venue was set to be moved from San Francisco.



Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If you go back to the enthusiasm for ACSF in their original presser about a week after AC34/ACSF ended, it'd be understandable if there being no confirmed SF return is the Oatleys' prime reason.

 

ACSF was huge for wind but, thinking conspiratorially, the Wine industry is king sized too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If LR and Artemis have challenged, one of them will soon become the challenger of record. I would suspect they are bound by the AC35 protocol. Are they brave enough to both withdraw and forfeit their entry fees? With no challengers, the protocol would be void, and they'd have to start over. I haven't had this much fun since 2009.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If LR and Artemis have challenged, one of them will soon become the challenger of record. I would suspect they are bound by the AC35 protocol. Are they brave enough to both withdraw and forfeit their entry fees? With no challengers, the protocol would be void, and they'd have to start over. I haven't had this much fun since 2009.

 

Are you thinking that this is a coordinated response by the challengers? I guess we will have to wait until it is confirmed before starting the conspiracy theories. If untrue, I would expect a quick response from Team Australia.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well they'll be forced to say soon about whether it's final or conditional. It can't just hang out there.

 

My guess is that the Oatleys decided already, and so that's it. Done and dusted.

 

Would have been a Friday night decision, Team AUS has been tweeting photos of their two AC45's training in Sydney as recently as yesterday.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

PJM interviewed for Radio Sport 11am news.

 

He seems absolutely sure that team Aus have withdrawn as it was "just too hard"

 

This will put in doubt France, BAR will struggle to get their sponsorship target to progress, no one knows about China so just down to AR, LR, TNZ (hey that's the same as last time.

 

Thanks a lot Russell!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Now on SailWorld

http://www.sail-world.com/USA/index.cfm?SEID=0&Nid=124645&SRCID=0&ntid=0&tickeruid=0&tickerCID=0

 

 

Although no public announcement has been made, several sources spoken to by Sail-World have confirmed that Hamilton Island Yacht Club have with drawn from the 35th America's Cup and relinquished their position as Challenger of Record.

No reasons for the move have been given which are expected in an official announcement early next week.

The move by Hamilton Island YC follows a Competitor Meeting called by them in Los Angeles last weekend.

A similar situation occurred in the 34th America's Cup, when Golden Gate YC accepted a Challenge from Yacht Club di Roma (Mascalzone Latino) on very favourable terms to the Defender. That club also pulled out, saying they could not find the financial sponsorship to continue.

There has been widespread opposition to the Protocol for the 35th America's Cup, with the Russell Coutts led negotiating team putting forward provisions that are unacceptable to almost all potential Challengers, and also eliminating the preferred venue of the Challengers, San Francisco.

by Richard Gladwell, Sail-World.com/nz

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Original link

http://www.radiosport.co.nz/news/spyac/1366954821-yachting--more-turmoil-for-the-america-s-cup

It's a little thin on information, also seem dubious that this comes out early on a Saturday morning in NZ and AUS. There's not likely to be anyone around from Team Australia to confirm or deny so why break it now?

 

Same reason why Politicians in the U.S. put out news that is negative to them on Friday's because those that care are making a break out of Washington for the weekend. And then when Monday rolls around, and people give a shit, things have died down.

 

Regardless, AC35 is not the building block on AC34 that the AC needed. 1st the Defender in the RR's, then no SF and its great wind, then delay after delay announcing a venue and now the COR bails. Total debacle.

 

WetHog :ph34r:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"eliminating the preferred venue of the Challengers, San Francisco"

 

I'm convinced that SF is what they had pressed for.

 

Next up? Same, probably..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

If LR and Artemis have challenged, one of them will soon become the challenger of record. I would suspect they are bound by the AC35 protocol. Are they brave enough to both withdraw and forfeit their entry fees? With no challengers, the protocol would be void, and they'd have to start over. I haven't had this much fun since 2009.

 

Are you thinking that this is a coordinated response by the challengers? I guess we will have to wait until it is confirmed before starting the conspiracy theories. If untrue, I would expect a quick response from Team Australia.

 

Considering that a surprise challenger meeting was held last weekend, it was followed by reports of general unrest and teeth gnashing by the challengers at the meeting in the British press, and then less than a week later, the COR backs out, the odds point to some interconnections.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I can see AR and LR as COR working much more closely with the challengers rather than RC.

 

RC may now have to accept some big compromising points

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Who'll be out of the blocks first with a DoG challenge?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well I have some shred of hope that the next protocol won't contain the word "playoffs".

 

They might try to put in the word "regatta" even.

 

Or look up the plain English meaning of the term "home waters".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Is all in the wording.

Withdrawing = I have the withdrawal letter in my hand, are you (Oracle) going to negotiate or accept the letter?

Withdrawn = All done.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^ pjh ^ Agreed. In hindsight that IM called a meeting even before the entries were official it looks like HIYC was looking to send a message; by the resulting report from Stuart A a message that was primarily venue-centered.

 

I hope LE gets this message loud and clear.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There will be no DoG challenge. No one can compete with Larry in that kind of fight.

 

I suspect the Oatleys simply had no idea what they had bitten off. They were the ones who signed off on a protocol that didn't require the defender to name a venue until the end of the year in the first place.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Aus challenge sunk already!

 

At least last time they got to the regatta before they sank! :rolleyes:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

^ pjh ^ Agreed. In hindsight that IM called a meeting even before the entries were official it looks like HIYC was looking to send a message; by the resulting report from Stuart A a message that was primarily venue-centered.

 

I hope LE gets this message loud and clear.

Hardly any point signing the proto and then trying to get tough after, surely?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There will be no DoG challenge. No one can compete with Larry in that kind of fight.

 

I suspect the Oatleys simply had no idea what they had bitten off. They were the ones who signed off on a protocol that didn't require the defender to name a venue until the end of the year in the first place.

Their Challenge always struck me as being an impulsive one. They even said about as much back-when.

 

They got caught in the moment, wanted to be part of a re-staging of that. On stage in San Francisco.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

There will be no DoG challenge. No one can compete with Larry in that kind of fight.

 

I suspect the Oatleys simply had no idea what they had bitten off. They were the ones who signed off on a protocol that didn't require the defender to name a venue until the end of the year in the first place.

Their Challenge always struck me as being an impulsive one. They even said about as much back-when.

Agreed. There's a reason experienced teams don't want to be CoR. It's a shit job that sets you up to get abused by both the challengers and the defender.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

14.2 Withdrawal of challenge: Unless GGYC has previously accepted at least one other challenge for AC35 pursuant to this Protocol and such other challenge has not been withdrawn (in which case, the provisions of Article 14.3 shall apply), the Challenger of Record must give to GGYC no less than ninety (90) days prior written notice of an intention to withdraw its challenge (or such shorter notice period as GGYC may accept). The Challenger of Record’s challenge shall remain valid until expiry of the notice period.

Withdrawal of the challenge without giving proper notice of an intention to withdraw the challenge in accordance with this Article shall be deemed to be a notice of intention to withdraw the challenge in compliance with this Article.

14.3. Replacement Challenger of Record: If at any time the Challenger of Record ceases to be a Challenger, the replacement Challenger of Record shall be the Challenger whose Notice of Challenge was received by GGYC first in time after the previous Challenger of Record and whose challenge is still current.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So AC experts, this throws 100% of what was agreed up in the air -- venue, choice of boat, nationality rule, ISAF involvement, all the pre-season ACWS AC45 stuff, etc? True?

 

What if the next CoR says, "We don't want to fuck around with this ACWS nonsense, big waste of effort and money, let's go straight to the show. In SF. Real estate deal or none, that's your problem."

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Who'll be out of the blocks first with a DoG challenge?

 

You can't be serious.

 

You saw what Larry did in the last DoG challenge right? WIth what is known now in foiling and wing design, the lawn ornament he used to win 33 would look pedestrian in comparison to any next DoG challenge boat he'd build.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Official Announcement

 

“But our focus going forward is with the teams that have already submitted challenges and the teams that have told us of their intent to do so before the entry deadline on August 8th.

In the meantime, ACEA is continuing its work to select a host venue for the America’s Cup in 2017. The selection process is progressing well with an aim to announce the final venue in October.

Ben Ainslie Racing (BAR), which revealed its America’s Cup team in a gala ceremony in London last month, had this comment:

We remain supportive of the Defender’s continued drive towards a more commercial event format, along with a more sustainable future for this historic trophy. BAR will be bidding to host two America’s Cup World Series events in 2015/16 at our new home in Portsmouth; as a key part of the road to the 35th America’s Cup. While the withdrawal of the Challenger of Record is regrettable, it is also not unusual and we will continue our own preparations for the 35th America’s Cup and look forward to an exciting future.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Who'll be out of the blocks first with a DoG challenge?

 

You can't be serious.

 

You saw what Larry did in the last DoG challenge right? WIth what is known now in foiling and wing design, the lawn ornament he used to win 33 would look pedestrian in comparison to any next DoG challenge boat he'd build.

So what's EB up to these days?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Stop it with the DoG nonsense.

 

Even if someone was interested (which no one is), the protocol is air tight on this. The next challenger in line takes over as Challenger of Record under the existing protocol.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When AR replaced ML they were basically signed to the same Protocol, since they had already entered under that Protocol.

 

And so the baby probably won't be thrown out with the bath water this time either.

 

But if either of BAR, AR or LR are already the next accepted then Yes, they likely have negotiating power and especially if they collaborate. ETNZ too, but I suspect they were a late application.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Official Announcement

 

“But our focus going forward is with the teams that have already submitted challenges and the teams that have told us of their intent to do so before the entry deadline on August 8th.

 

In the meantime, ACEA is continuing its work to select a host venue for the America’s Cup in 2017. The selection process is progressing well with an aim to announce the final venue in October.

 

Ben Ainslie Racing (BAR), which revealed its America’s Cup team in a gala ceremony in London last month, had this comment:

 

We remain supportive of the Defender’s continued drive towards a more commercial event format, along with a more sustainable future for this historic trophy. BAR will be bidding to host two America’s Cup World Series events in 2015/16 at our new home in Portsmouth; as a key part of the road to the 35th America’s Cup. While the withdrawal of the Challenger of Record is regrettable, it is also not unusual and we will continue our own preparations for the 35th America’s Cup and look forward to an exciting future.

 

 

BARF a poodle?

 

2lm7uky.jpg

 

We need to raise up as a community and speak out against this bull shit. AC35 should of been a positive evolution over AC34, instead it is a catastrophic 2 steps back.

 

Unacceptable.

 

WetHog :ph34r:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

BAR the only quoted Challenger, maybe a hint of things to come? And again, venue announcement in October? FFS.

Agreed. I bet BAR is the next CoR, will get the events they want, and possibly get more out of this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

 

BAR the only quoted Challenger, maybe a hint of things to come? And again, venue announcement in October? FFS.

Agreed. I bet BAR is the next CoR, will get the events they want, and possibly get more out of this.

LE might even help with their funding. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

 

 

 

BAR the only quoted Challenger, maybe a hint of things to come? And again, venue announcement in October? FFS.

Agreed. I bet BAR is the next CoR, will get the events they want, and possibly get more out of this.
LE might even help with their funding. :)
Might even be happiest to pass the baton to Britain instead of anyone else, if it comes to that. LE did already help the BAR effort.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

So who has entered already?

According to the protocol, ACEA doesn't have to say until after August 8th.

 

Well we will know for sure very soon at least 1 team that has officially entered when the new COR is announced. From that presser it sounds like BARF has stepped forward and "assumed the position".

 

23s85f9.jpg

 

Can someone photoshop BA's head over Kevin Bacon? Seems appropriate.

 

WetHog :ph34r:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Its obvious the Oakley's withdrew because they didn't want to upgrade their team inflatable dinghy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Its obvious the Oakley's withdrew because they didn't want to upgrade their team inflatable dinghy.

:D

Due credit to your prescience, Aldo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"We" on the FP are about as ignorant and wrong as they typically are in anything AC with this zinger

--

"If they indeed withdraw, this makes the protocol invalid. There is no succession plan that we are aware of.

--

but here is 'their' link, for posterior's sake

http://sailinganarchy.com/2014/07/18/43176/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think the australian challenge was based on some assumptions all of which proved false.

 

1. Etnz and/or artemis would fold releasing aussie talent.

2. Some or the oracle based pussies would jump ship.

3. The event would be in San Fran

 

Bermuda has negative marketing benefit for the Oatleys. They have two products to push. Hamilton Island and wine. Any Hamilton Island promotion would be lost against the bermuda background and to sell wine you want access to people so they'll taste it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"We" on the FP are about as ignorant and wrong as they typically are in anything AC with this zinger

--

"If they indeed withdraw, this makes the protocol invalid. There is no succession plan that we are aware of.

--

but here is 'their' link, for posterior's sake

http://sailinganarchy.com/2014/07/18/43176/

 

Too much - yet another major gaff on the front page.

 

Seems like their head is up their posterior.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Oatley sat down with a pencil and a bit of paper, wrote down the sums, and then realised it was beyond him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just announced on twitter

 

ADM CoR for AC-35 after dropping allagations against GGYC LINK

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

at http://www.radiosport.co.nz/news/spyac/1366954821-yachting--more-turmoil-for-the-america-s-cup

 

--

UPDATE 11:45am: The lack of clarity from holders Oracle around the next America's Cup looks to have cost the next event its Challenger of Record.

It's understood the Hamilton Island Yacht Club is withdrawing from the 35th edition of the race, due to it being too hard to prepare for when holders Oracle are yet to announce a date or venue.

Yachting commentator Peter Montgomery says it's another twist, with Prada and Artemis both having entered the race.

"They are asking now "What? What now?" and my sense is that Oracle will certainly be part of the blame game saying they havent had enough support from the australians and maybe the British challenger as well."

Montgomery says the uncertainty around a date or location appears to be a factor.

"The impression I get is that the Aussies have said the protocol is just too difficult, too hard, still no dates, still no venues etc. they've felt it is just enough so it is really quite another interesting twist in the America's Cup."

Team New Zealand has told our newsroom the development has come as news to them.

Earlier this week, British team boss Sir Ben Ainslie expressed disappointment that the venue was set to be moved from San Francisco.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites