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mad

sailor sues round the world legend Sir Robin Knox-Johnston

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A lawyer who paid £40,000 to take part in a round-the-world yacht race is suing organiser Sir Robin Knox-Johnston for alleged victimisation and harassment just months after she recorded him spoofing a “you’re fired” video.

Ruth Harvey, an employment law specialist, had “begged and borrowed” to raise the money for her once in a lifetime challenge to join one of the vessels on the Clipper Round the World Race.

 

Although she paid to join the event, which allows inexperienced sailors a chance to race around the globe for almost a year, she is now claiming she should be classed as an employee having been part of a crew.

 

Fucking lawyers <_<

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/11008858/Lawyer-turned-sailor-sues-round-the-world-legend-Sir-Robin-Knox-Johnston-after-paying-to-join-race.html

 

In a light-hearted YouTube video apparently from Ms Harvey just before she started the race last September, Sir Robin is seen imitating Sir Alan Sugar in the TV reality show The Apprentice and says: “Ruth, I have never seen such a potential disaster in all my life. You’re fired.”

:P :P

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<_< errr... I guess he should told the beeeeach Lawyer : due to the insurmountable inabilities of individual self performance in relation to seamanship and safety upon the aquatic environment. It is greatly recommended that termination of said duties in regards to any actions performed by said individual in the aquatic environment be terminated immediately.... Fuck'n Lawyers ...Word ..

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I just called her and left a message and sent an email. Might as well get some info before tearing her apart.

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I just called her and left a message and sent an email. Might as well get some info before tearing her apart.

Why should we break the habit of an SA lifetime?? :P

 

Good call though Clean, could this open up a class action? ;)

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I just called her and left a message and sent an email. Might as well get some info before tearing her apart.

Why should we break the habit of an SA lifetime?? :P

 

Good call though Clean, could this open up a class action? ;)

 

It's one of those issues that Sir Robin has dodged for a long, long time, and anyone who's ever chartered their boat or had paying crew knows that it's a hornets' nest. While this woman is probably just another piece of shit lawyer, we don't yet know what her complaint is. Though looking at her, I'm guessing it isn't date rape.

Screen Shot 2014-08-05 at 9.38.21 AM.png

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Clean,

 

Will throughly enjoy hearing more details especially from lawyer. My initial thought was what a thieving, grasping, pig of a woman who needs to get a life. But, I could be wrong.

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Hmmm.

I thought employers paid employees, not the other way around.

Don't tell people with McJobs for crissakes.

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From Clipper Comms Director Jonathan Levy:

 

We can confirm that a case is being made by Ms Harvey against the company which also names Sir Robin as Chairman, the skipper of her yacht and a number of fellow crew. The case is being made through an employment tribunal, but whether the case falls under employment law is yet to be determined at a hearing in November. I’m sure you appreciate that other than confirming this information our company policy is not to comment further upon ongoing legal proceedings.

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Fellow crew member: "Get up Ruth! Time for your watch!"

Ms. Harvey: "I'm still tired..."

Fellow crew member: "Get on deck. Do your share of the work."

Ms. Harvey: "But it's cold and wet up there..."

Fellow crew member: "God damn it, you fat cow! Move it!"

Ms. Harvey: "You're harassing me! I'm suing!"

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An ex-boss of mine was sued for harassment. One of the more supportive bosses I've had as it happens. Harassment consisted of asking her to do some work and later checking to see whether she'd done what she'd been asked to do. It was completely unbelievable that it got to a tribunal. I'm pleased to say the case fizzled out. There's not a lot of downside in the UK for "employees" to raise these cases and a reasonable chance of being offered a settlement to just go away.

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Is that a photo "before" or "after" the ugly stick attack on her?

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I just called her and left a message and sent an email. Might as well get some info before tearing her apart.

 

:lol: Ha. I think that is the funnest shit I have ever read.

 

Here is a great idea. Why don't you just call her a grifter first? That is the SA I know and disrespect.....

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I just called her and left a message and sent an email. Might as well get some info before tearing her apart.

Why should we break the habit of an SA lifetime?? :P

 

Good call though Clean, could this open up a class action? ;)

 

It's one of those issues that Sir Robin has dodged for a long, long time, and anyone who's ever chartered their boat or had paying crew knows that it's a hornets' nest. While this woman is probably just another piece of shit lawyer, we don't yet know what her complaint is. Though looking at her, I'm guessing it isn't date rape.

Atta boy...was starting to worry you'd gone soft.

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I just called her and left a message and sent an email. Might as well get some info before tearing her apart.

Why should we break the habit of an SA lifetime?? :P

 

Good call though Clean, could this open up a class action? ;)

 

It's one of those issues that Sir Robin has dodged for a long, long time, and anyone who's ever chartered their boat or had paying crew knows that it's a hornets' nest. While this woman is probably just another piece of shit lawyer, we don't yet know what her complaint is. Though looking at her, I'm guessing it isn't date rape.

Atta boy...was starting to worry you'd gone soft.

Nails, mate.

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But Ms Harvey now claims she was victimised and harassed while on board and wants a legal ruling that will delineate between paid participants and employees.

 

OK - you paid THEM to go. How in the hell are you an employee :huh:

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But Ms Harvey now claims she was victimised and harassed while on board and wants a legal ruling that will delineate between paid participants and employees.

 

OK - you paid THEM to go. How in the hell are you an employee :huh:

I've got a feeling she's trying to establish that RKJ was an employee of Clipper, so that she can sue Clipper (deeper pockets, less popular personality) and have them held vicariously liable for whatever action of RKJ she thinks was unlawful harassment in Clipper's workplace.

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But Ms Harvey now claims she was victimised and harassed while on board and wants a legal ruling that will delineate between paid participants and employees.

 

OK - you paid THEM to go. How in the hell are you an employee :huh:

I've got a feeling she's trying to establish that RKJ was an employee of Clipper, so that she can sue Clipper (deeper pockets, less popular personality) and have them held vicariously liable for whatever action of RKJ she thinks was unlawful harassment in Clipper's workplace.

 

no she really is trying to claim she is an employee, that's the only reason an employment tribunal could hear this case. She wants to apply workplace harassment laws to the way she was treated, in effect she wants this treated as a form of constructive dismissal. Only works if she is an employee.

 

if it was about RKJ being an employee this would have to be in a regular court and her suing the company and RKJ as a customer..... civil tort would apply. (even in the determination of whether RKJ was an employee of clipper).

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I feel that she would have a hard time with some sailor terminology. Like, hoist the sail you dog! or Ok, today your job is just to be "rail meat"... or even Step lively now, she's gonna be a rough one today.

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Is she Nicole Scott's relative? :D

Ohhh dear......Take cover, I fear incomming......danger close!

;)

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In some legal systems, employment can be construed as a relationship in which a person is submitted to another person's authority and is given specific tasks to perform. Being part of a crew under a skipper could also be described in the same way

 

So in that sense I can see where she's coming from.

 

I'm not aware of any specific legal definition of the relationship between a skipper and voluntary or paying crew, and in absence of that, the ultimate decision in this particular case could have some wide ranging ramifications...

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Sounds like she bit off more than she could chew. Probably thought she signed up for a Carnival cruise and then reality set in.

I'm going to resist the tempatation to make cheap shot comments about how much she can chew judging by the picture............................. :ph34r:

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So what if you go on one of those cruise ships that lets you sail the ship and the mate bitches at you for your crappy steering skills? Do you now work for the cruise line and get to sue them for being mean to you or are you an unhappy paying passenger?

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In some legal systems, employment can be construed as a relationship in which a person is submitted to another person's authority and is given specific tasks to perform.

 

Really? Which legal systems would those be? That's a broad enough definition to take in some people's idea of a sex life.

 

In the UK "employment" means a relationship governed by an employment contract. Since the UK has a legal minimum wage, it's tough to see how there's an employment contract without a wage. https://www.gov.uk/employment-contracts-and-conditions/contract-terms

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Is she Nicole Scott's relative? :D

Yep.

That's GODDAMN funny right there.

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A lawyer ... is suing ... for alleged victimisation and harassment...

Who could have seen that coming?!?!

 

 

Ruth Harvey, an employment law specialist...

Of course she it. She's just sticking with what she knows.

 

 

I hope the judge fines her for wasting the court's time.

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How many times do you think members of the crew used the word work?

 

article-2715299-203CC77800000578-153_306

How many times do your think her male crew-members showed her positive attention.

 

What other words can you imagine were used in her direction aboard the boat? How might those words have changed with any uncooperative or negative attitude on here side? Where would a person of her age and physique provide the greatest value to the crew of a racing sailboat?

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Not knowing much about this pay-to-play thing, is this like when Sherpas haul rich people up Everest, take their picture, and haul them down or are these passengers actually expected to do all the donkey work it takes to race a boat?

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is this like when Sherpas haul rich people up Everest, take their picture, and haul them down

 

They don't. Sherpas fix the ropes, carry the oxygen bottles, run the catering, pitch the tents and a million other things but nobody gets hauled up Everest.

 

I know people who've done this event and yes they sail the boat. There's a professional skipper, everyone else is pay-to-play.

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Not knowing much about this pay-to-play thing, is this like when Sherpas haul rich people up Everest, take their picture, and haul them down or are these passengers actually expected to do all the donkey work it takes to race a boat?

 

 

You have to get through this before you get a berth on even a single leg...

 

http://www.clipperroundtheworld.com/training

 

http://www.clipperroundtheworld.com/training

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is this like when Sherpas haul rich people up Everest, take their picture, and haul them down

 

They don't. Sherpas fix the ropes, carry the oxygen bottles, run the catering, pitch the tents and a million other things but nobody gets hauled up Everest.

 

I know people who've done this event and yes they sail the boat. There's a professional skipper, everyone else is pay-to-play.

Read "Into Thin Air" by Jon Krakauer. It's about Everest and a violent storm that claimed a number of lives. A US socialite was climbing and at least at one point was roped to a Sherpa who dragged her sorry ass up Everest.

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Ya know, the last thread on this the boats looked kind of douchey... These actually look good and like something your average racer could latch onto... The rebuilding of the fleet was a good decision IMHO.....

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Read "Into Thin Air" by Jon Krakauer. It's about Everest and a violent storm that claimed a number of lives. A US socialite was climbing and at least at one point was roped to a Sherpa who dragged her sorry ass up Everest.

 

I have read it & I know people who guide on Everest. You've misinterpreted. Nobody can drag anybody up Everest. Above 8000m it's at the limit of what anyone can do to put one foot in front of the other.

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Is it possible that one dark, stormy night, the skipper said to her "I know you don't want to go out on deck, but if you do I'll pay you $5". Could she then interperet that as being employed?

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^

 

To the point where you wonder whether they should have been taking her money for something of which she doesn't appear physically capable. However, that isn't "harassment" and I guess a lawyer knows the meaning of "caveat emptor".

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How many times do you think members of the crew used the word work?

 

article-2715299-203CC77800000578-153_306

 

How many times do your think her male crew-members showed her positive attention.

 

What other words can you imagine were used in her direction aboard the boat? How might those words have changed with any uncooperative or negative attitude on here side? Where would a person of her age and physique provide the greatest value to the crew of a racing sailboat?

On shore.

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I'd like to hear from her fellow crew. There have to be stories after stories and they will all come out. And lord help the one guy on board who poked that pig after a few pints.

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At first glance at this story, she appears to be one sorry-assed piece of humanity. The kind of person who gives lawyers a bad name.

 

Probably went into employment law after being fired a few times for being a whiney pain in the ass.

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How many times do you think members of the crew used the word ..............

 

article-2715299-203CC77800000578-153_306

 

Where would a person of her age and physique provide the greatest value to the crew of a racing sailboat?

On shore.

!!LMAO!! Oh She's gonna get pissed off and sue everybody now including the internet

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can you imagine how painful it would be to have a self centered arrogant know it all lawyer on board ?

 

 

I don't know....I've never sailed with Clean.....

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can you imagine how painful it would be to have a self centered arrogant know it all lawyer on board ?

 

 

I don't know....I've never sailed with Clean.....

 

Badda bing....

 

Actually the screening process that allowed this person aboard probably needs review, Robin. (And I know you're watching.)

 

Take the money, sure. But you really need to ensure that you have a genuine contributor to the group effort. For everyone's sake.

 

My $0.02

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can you imagine how painful it would be to have a self centered arrogant know it all lawyer on board ?

 

 

I don't know....I've never sailed with Clean.....

tumblr_n79gfbgU6i1trybquo1_400.gif

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How many times do you think members of the crew used the word work?

 

article-2715299-203CC77800000578-153_306

 

How many times do your think her male crew-members showed her positive attention.

 

What other words can you imagine were used in her direction aboard the boat? How might those words have changed with any uncooperative or negative attitude on here side? Where would a person of her age and physique provide the greatest value to the crew of a racing sailboat?

On shore.

 

That may be just what happened. The BIG lady was booked for all the legs. Someone with the passwords may just have transferred her to the "on shore" Team. Possibly after she refused an order to "get her fat @$$ to WORK"... Now she is putting them both together in the hope of getting some or a lot more money back.

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mad, on 06 Aug 2014 - 02:50, said:

 

 

Blitz, on 05 Aug 2014 - 22:09, said:

Sounds like she bit off more than she could chew. Probably thought she signed up for a Carnival cruise and then reality set in.

I'm going to resist the tempatation to make cheap shot comments about how much she can chew judging by the picture............................. :ph34r:

 

bang.

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Read "Into Thin Air" by Jon Krakauer. It's about Everest and a violent storm that claimed a number of lives. A US socialite was climbing and at least at one point was roped to a Sherpa who dragged her sorry ass up Everest.

I have read it & I know people who guide on Everest. You've misinterpreted. Nobody can drag anybody up Everest. Above 8000m it's at the limit of what anyone can do to put one foot in front of the other.

Actually you should read the book. That's exactly what happened. Sherpas aren't "anyone".

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Interesting that the details of the claim are not included. Makes one wonder who leaked this story and what actually happened on board. ANarchy......unless the case has merits I doubt a tribunal would bother with this...

 

No opinions from newbies until you show us tits. Unless you're Ruth Harvey, of course.

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Interesting that the details of the claim are not included. Makes one wonder who leaked this story and what actually happened on board. ANarchy......unless the case has merits I doubt a tribunal would bother with this...

 

No opinions from newbies until you show us tits. Unless you're Ruth Harvey, of coursebbw___extra_large_by_rendermojo-d64janq.

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Thrown out.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/11226810/Lawyer-turned-sailor-fails-in-bid-to-sue-Sir-Robin-Knox-Johnston-over-round-the-world-yacht-race.html

 

Lawyer turned sailor fails in bid to sue Sir Robin Knox-Johnston over round-the-world yacht race Ruth Harvey claimed sexual discrimination and harassment against organisers of gruelling race but had case thrown out

 

yacht_2994977b.jpg
Sir Robin Knox-Johnston in the spoof video and Ruth Harvey

A lawyer turned sailor who tried to sue Sir Robin Knox-Johnston and organisers of his round-the-world yacht race for alleged sexual discrimination and harassment has had her case thrown out.

Ruth Harvey, an employment law specialist, “begged and borrowed” to raise more than £40,000 to join the Clipper Round the World Race last year but dropped out after just two of the eight legs.

In a light – hearted YouTube video apparently from Ms Harvey just before she started the race from St Katharine Docks in London last September, Sir Robin was seen imitating Sir Alan Sugar in the television reality show The Apprentice and says: "Ruth, I have never seen such a potential disaster in all my life. You're fired."

But after dropping out, Ms Harvey took the organisers to an employment tribunal for alleged discrimination and harassment while on board, arguing she should be classed as an employee because she had been part of a crew.

Sir Robin, the first man to circumnavigate the globe solo and non – stop, set up the race in 1995 to allow people to experience the exhausting but fulfilling life of 11 months sailing the oceans.

He was named on the claim in his capacity as founder of the company and none of the allegations are directed at him personally.

However a tribunal judge in Havant dismissed the case this week after a preliminary hearing.

The case was rejected on the legal points of whether England and Wales has the jurisdiction to hear the claim, whether Ms Harvey could be classed as an employee and whether Sir Robin should be a named defendant.

A spokesman for Clipper Ventures said: “This case should never have been brought following Ms Harvey deciding to leave the race after completing only two of the eight legs around the world.

“It was totally vexatious and without foundation.”

During the race, Ms Harvey, 50, was on board the clipper Jamaica Get All Right, which won the second of eight legs when it raced into Rio de Janeiro in October.

But she pulled out at the end of that month.

In a statement, Ms Harvey said: “This ruling is a missed opportunity to consider the international law provisions that apply to these kinds of races, and to put in place much-needed protections for all Clipper crew.

“There is a real need to curb the excesses of this male-dominated sailing culture and it remains a non-inclusive sport.”

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'Ruth Harvey, an employment law specialist, “begged and borrowed” to raise more than £40,000 to join the Clipper Round the World Race last year but dropped out after just two of the eight legs.'

 

She can't have been much of a specialist if she had to beg and borrow 40k to do the race. That's pocket money for a good lawyer that clearly isn't sharing income with a partner or kids.

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Thrown out.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/11226810/Lawyer-turned-sailor-fails-in-bid-to-sue-Sir-Robin-Knox-Johnston-over-round-the-world-yacht-race.html

But she pulled out at the end of that month.

In a statement, Ms Harvey said: “This ruling is a missed opportunity to consider the international law provisions that apply to these kinds of races, and to put in place much-needed protections for all Clipper crew.

“There is a real need to curb the excesses of this male-dominated sailing culture and it remains a non-inclusive sport.”

Some people were never meant to be included, that's just how it is.

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She should marry *************.

Can you imagine the little Michelin Men they'd pump out?

 

Come to think of it, I don't think their genitals could get within a zip code of each other.

 

(postal code to you peoples of many lands)

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Ridiculous claim and she needs a thicker skin for sailing....

 

 

BUT

 

 

Sailing, racing particularly, often requires very thick skin. Misogynistic joking among male crew with only one female crew on board...? Normal. Screw up and you can have all manner of abuse hurled at you, the personal-ness and nastyness of the abuse just depends on a) what kind of mood the crew are in and B) how confident in their own ability the crew are.

 

Ya know, a fairly common problem is retaining kids in sailing. The drop out rate is huge, especially among young girls. What's seen by guys as a "male banter environment" can be HUGELY intimidating for girls. Just because it's normal doesn't mean it's right.

 

I think she's actually done sailing a lot of harm in taking that suit. Now people will potentially see the sport as more hostile than it is, without seeing that we're all great craic in the bar afterwards when all the screaming is done.

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The funny thing is that I have always felt the presence of the fairer sex on race boats to have a calming factor. Men just generally tend to act more cool headed around women for some reason. However I take it that that is not the case with this lass. That she was trying to get the crew defined as "employees" so that certain gender related work rules would be in effect. Just can't imagine what those rules would be as it pertains to her though.......

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"she" lawyer : "ya know being on deck isn't as much fun as I though it was"

Sailor: "Well, we do have a galley down below, why don't you go down there and gets us a sammich bitch"

 

 

Or she over heard this conversation

Skipper: "Hey do you guys know what 10,000 lawyers at the bottom of the ocean is?"

crew: "no"

Skipper: "a good start"

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...

 

What's seen by guys as a "male banter environment" can be HUGELY intimidating for girls. Just because it's normal doesn't mean it's right.

 

I think she's actually done sailing a lot of harm in taking that suit. Now people will potentially see the sport as more hostile than it is, without seeing that we're all great craic in the bar afterwards when all the screaming is done.

Wow.

That's quite some leap from the 'male banter environment being wrong' to 'she should be blamed for complaining,' yet you manage that in consecutive sentences.

 

Surely we must put the blame on those acting like arseholes and not those that feel bullied? Unless we want Dapper Laughs to be an ISAF spokesman. I think he's got some free time coming up...

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In 1972, I sailed the CBYRA season in MORC with an all-female crew (one of whom was my wife). Lost my regular crew to a job change and move out of town. Racing women were not unknown but were not all that common at that time. Mostly owner's wives or girl-friends (but not both at the same time). The gals in my crew (three or four of them) all had some sailing experience, a couple had been racing with their husbands. For that season, it worked pretty well, once they got me suitably trained.

  • No yelling. No matter what, no yelling. None. Ever. Thank you very much.
  • Instructions must be direct and explicit. No big picture instructions. Couldn't say "set up for a gybe set." Had to ask for the pole on the proper side, remind them that it would be a gybe set, remind them that the yarn ties couldn't be broken out until the genoa was gybed over and that the pole couldn't be trimmed back until the genoa was clear and the outboard end was raised - or at least being raised. (As they gained experience, they began to see the big picture and things improved.)
  • They can say "You know what I mean." I can't. They don't know what I mean.
  • Couldn't expect sailing terminology. We had the pole pull-up thingie and the pole down-pull thingie. (Apparently pole lift and foreguy were too obscure. Down-fucker was out of the question and hadn't even been coined then anyway.)
  • They couldn't handle every physical requirement on the boat. Not enough beef at times. OTOH, they were good at asking for help when they needed it and very quick to give each other help when they saw the need whether it was asked for or not. Unlike some of the macho crew i've sailed with at times.
  • No criticising crew. No matter what they screwed up, be positive, constructive, helpful with guidance for the next time. They were quite able to figure out that they had screwed up and could yell at themselves and each other.
  • Never notice tears. They will get very angry if you notice they are crying. Avert your eyes and sail the boat.
  • They were sometimes a bit slow, particularly in sporty conditions. But they were also very precise and accurate once they had a handle on an evolution, so there were very few crew errors. And they were very gentle with me when I sailed on the wrong side of the beat or got buried under a parade of spinnakers and lost time and places on our competition.

It turned out to be a rewarding season. I learned a lot, the gals learned a lot and we took home a pretty decent collection of pewter.

 

None of 'em would volunteer for an offshore race on a forty footer or bigger, then or now. It takes hard training and preparation for that, and the women who do so are impressive in the scope of their commitments. I think commiting a fat old bag like our favorite Brit lawyer to the effort was stupid and doomed to fail once reality struck. She apparently didn't know what she was getting herself into. But as they say, you pays your money and you takes your chances.

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