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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  
QBF

Micro-Cruiser Anarchy

335 posts in this topic

I've gotten interested in micro-cruisers, and thought a thread on this topic might be of interest.

 

Matt Layden's Paradox is my current favorite micro-cruiser, and it is all of 13' 10" long with a 4' beam. One version of this design was sailed engineless as far North as the Bay of Fundy in Canada, and as far South as the Exumas in the Bahamas. Yet another toured the island of Hawaii, and a Paradox sailed around Cape Leeuwin in Australia. Couples have even gone cruising in their Paradox.

Graduating to a Smaller Boat
http://daveskaife.wordpress.com

Skippers statement: "The boat is pretty much what I hoped it would be, fun, comfortable, and a totally new sailing experience."

"Oddly enough it may be the most comfortable boat to sail I have ever owned. ...the wind started to pick up and it started to rain. All the other boats out headed for moorings and got soaked, I closed the hatch, rolled up some sail and continued on cozy and dry."

20140612-094557-35157472.jpg?w=529

 

20140806-064628-24388869.jpg


My Paradox "Johanna"
http://www.freewebs.com/paradoxbuild

IMAG0345.jpg

IMG_2830.JPG

Geoff (Australia)
Scroll down to the heading "Then we had a visitor"
http://cruisingashiki.blogspot.co.nz/2014/05/shark-bay-shelter-bay-paradox.html

Geof started his adventure in Fremantle, and arrived in Shelter Bay five days later, a distance of 370 nautical miles!

Geoff also rounded Cape Leeuwin in his Paradox.

Sean Mulligan racing in the Texas 200 with his Paradox
http://www.youtube.com/user/nebwest2/videos

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Matt is an extemely gifted designer. And he has great sailing skills.

 

He wanted to do a race around the LP but for various reasons needed a portable boat. He did the race in a modified Sterns inflatable. See http://www.watertribe.com/magazine/y2003/m08/mattlayden.aspx

 

His designs are not exactly "tall person" boats, but definite head turners.

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I am sure they sail fine

 

 

and I sail a duck punt

 

 

but a paradox is my idea of hell on water

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I am sure they sail fine

 

 

and I sail a duck punt

 

 

but a paradox is my idea of hell on water

 

The Duck Punt looks like a nice boat, and your video was very enjoyable. However, the Duck Punt, and the Paradox were designed for two different tasks.

 

If I gave the impression that this thread should be only about Paradox's than that is my mistake.

 

As an aside, with all those ducks and geese flying over my head, I'd rather be in a Paradox where I can close the hatch, and not get "dropped on" if you will.

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Just so there is no misunderstanding, there are those voyaging on craft, even smaller than a Paradox, and I'd enjoy learning about all of them.

One man was Jack De Crow, who cruised from North Wales to the Black Sea in a Mirror Dinghy.

Here Dylan Winter reviews the book on Mr. De Crow's voyage "The Unlikely Voyage of Jack De Crow: A Mirror Odyssey from North Wales to the Black Sea"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H63-sQOcWDk

Mirror Dinghy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror_%28dinghy%29

mirror-dinghy-daydream-_picm3-333.jpg

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The SCAMP is my current fav, but I always like the smallest boat for any job.

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The eponym of the microcruiser is, of course, the Bolger Micro. This design was, and may still be, very popular. I don't think it's a stretch to say hundreds were built (though maybe only 200 or so). It's positively big and roomy compared to some of the others. Bolger designed out as much of the fussiness and detail in the construction as he could, so it's a very different boat to build than Paradox.

 

cricket2.jpg

 

SCAMP is the most popular John Welsford micro, but I think I like the slightly larger Tread Lightly better because it has an interior that you can (barely) squeeze into. The one in the picture has a bigger cockpit and smaller house than the original design.

 

tread-lightly-oar-ports.jpg

 

Jim Michalak has a number of designs that could be considered. I rather like Philsboat, which is about the same size as the Bolger Micro, but which has a glass house.

 

REND07T.jpg

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Hmmm. I think we need a Micro Rule and suggest we adopt the one used by Watertribe: it's a small boat if you can launch it from a beach, carrying with you any apparatus used to achieve the launch.

 

I think Bolger's Micro is not quite micro enough.

 

Tread Lightly is awesome. I'll make it my favorite for today.

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At 19 feet, this boat pushes the limits of a micro-cruiser, but it does show one doesn't need a large boat to go for a nice cruise.

 

This Scottish couple took a two week cruise on their Hunter 19 foot Europa, crossing the North Sea, from Scotland to Norway, and back.

"The homemade horizontal axis windvane self-steering worked a treat, the key seems to be the adjustment and securing of the tiller with slight lee helm or weather helm depending on the point of sail, while the trim tab on it's own steers the boat, just as on the David Blagdons 'Very Willing Griffin'."

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Here is Sven Yrvind, and his Yrvind 1/2, a 4.8 meter (15' 7") design inspired in part by Matt Layden's Paradox.

post-106106-0-24040000-1408970777_thumb.jpg

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At 19 feet, this boat pushes the limits of a micro-cruiser, but it does show one doesn't need a large boat to go for a nice cruise.

 

This Scottish couple took a two week cruise on their Hunter 19 foot Europa, crossing the North Sea, from Scotland to Norway, and back.

 

"The homemade horizontal axis windvane self-steering worked a treat, the key seems to be the adjustment and securing of the tiller with slight lee helm or weather helm depending on the point of sail, while the trim tab on it's own steers the boat, just as on the David Blagdons 'Very Willing Griffin'."

 

 

 

Fun!

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Hmmm. I think we need a Micro Rule and suggest we adopt the one used by Watertribe: it's a small boat if you can launch it from a beach, carrying with you any apparatus used to achieve the launch.

 

That is a pretty restrictive rule. Pretty much eliminates ballasted boats. After all, it was meant to discriminate in favor of canoes and against the common run of sailboats.

 

IIRC, Uffa Fox crossed the English Channel in a 2-man sailing canoe. Anyone have a picture? Question is, does that make it a "cruiser"?

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Hmmm. I think we need a Micro Rule and suggest we adopt the one used by Watertribe: it's a small boat if you can launch it from a beach, carrying with you any apparatus used to achieve the launch.

 

That is a pretty restrictive rule. Pretty much eliminates ballasted boats. After all, it was meant to discriminate in favor of canoes and against the common run of sailboats.

 

IIRC, Uffa Fox crossed the English Channel in a 2-man sailing canoe. Anyone have a picture? Question is, does that make it a "cruiser"?

 

I don't think it is.

 

Also, Alessandro di Benedetto and his father crossed the Atlantic on a 18 foot Hobie Cat. The Hobie is certainly not a cruiser.

http://www.wavetrain.net/news-a-views/42-that-crazy-italian-guy

 

I hope this thread doesn't turn into a stunt-type boat thread.

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At 19 feet, this boat pushes the limits of a micro-cruiser, but it does show one doesn't need a large boat to go for a nice cruise.

 

This Scottish couple took a two week cruise on their Hunter 19 foot Europa, crossing the North Sea, from Scotland to Norway, and back.

 

"The homemade horizontal axis windvane self-steering worked a treat, the key seems to be the adjustment and securing of the tiller with slight lee helm or weather helm depending on the point of sail, while the trim tab on it's own steers the boat, just as on the David Blagdons 'Very Willing Griffin'."

 

 

 

Fun!

 

 

that was great - loved it

 

the old go pro is a bit dominant but I love the pace and adventure

 

D

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Hey!! They are flying the Scots Naval Ensign! I fly that same flag on the FRANCIS LEE. (I need to get a bigger one!)

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At 19 feet, this boat pushes the limits of a micro-cruiser, but it does show one doesn't need a large boat to go for a nice cruise.

 

This Scottish couple took a two week cruise on their Hunter 19 foot Europa, crossing the North Sea, from Scotland to Norway, and back.

 

"The homemade horizontal axis windvane self-steering worked a treat, the key seems to be the adjustment and securing of the tiller with slight lee helm or weather helm depending on the point of sail, while the trim tab on it's own steers the boat, just as on the David Blagdons 'Very Willing Griffin'."

 

 

 

Fun!

 

 

that was great - loved it

 

the old go pro is a bit dominant but I love the pace and adventure

 

D

 

That was the most enjoyable cruising video I've watched in a long time.

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Go, Pudgy, Go!

 

 

I had forgotten about this video, and I still like that guys hat!

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Jay Benford designed a 14-footer for a guy who wanted the record for the smallest circumnavigator.

 

14-happy-bow-quarter-large.jpg

 

 

14happy.gif

 

Design displacement is 2240lbs. If you want to argue that she may be short, but she isn't small, I won't argue.

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Robert Manry's Tinkerbelle.

 

boat.jpg

 

A man in my area had a duplicate. She's a wee thing.

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Not a sailboat, but a real cruiser, John MacGregor's Rob Roy Canoe

 

robroy.gif

 

 

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Matt Leydon's Elusion:

 

matt.jpg

 

You can get an idea of the level of detail Matt works into his designs.

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Hmmm. I think we need a Micro Rule and suggest we adopt the one used by Watertribe: it's a small boat if you can launch it from a beach, carrying with you any apparatus used to achieve the launch.

 

That is a pretty restrictive rule. Pretty much eliminates ballasted boats. After all, it was meant to discriminate in favor of canoes and against the common run of sailboats.

 

IIRC, Uffa Fox crossed the English Channel in a 2-man sailing canoe. Anyone have a picture? Question is, does that make it a "cruiser"?

 

I don't think it is.

 

Also, Alessandro di Benedetto and his father crossed the Atlantic on a 18 foot Hobie Cat. The Hobie is certainly not a cruiser.

http://www.wavetrain.net/news-a-views/42-that-crazy-italian-guy

 

I hope this thread doesn't turn into a stunt-type boat thread.

Alessandro also did Japan to San Fran in a "modified" 18' cat:

 

Alessandro.jpg

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This thread is getting far afield from "cruising," and on to micro-record voyages.

 

Let's try and keep this thread to cruising.

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Robert Manry's Tinkerbelle.

 

boat.jpg

 

A man in my area had a duplicate. She's a wee thing.

 

Tinkerbelle would have made a fine micro-cruiser. However, it was build for the sole purpose of setting a record for a small boat crossing the Atlantic which is not the focus of this thread.

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it always makes me laugh when blokes try to steer a thread back on the course they had hoped to set it on by restricting what people can and cannot post about

 

look...... a squirrel

 

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Hmmm. I think we need a Micro Rule and suggest we adopt the one used by Watertribe: it's a small boat if you can launch it from a beach, carrying with you any apparatus used to achieve the launch.

 

That is a pretty restrictive rule. Pretty much eliminates ballasted boats. After all, it was meant to discriminate in favor of canoes and against the common run of sailboats.

 

IIRC, Uffa Fox crossed the English Channel in a 2-man sailing canoe. Anyone have a picture? Question is, does that make it a "cruiser"?

 

I don't think it is.

 

Also, Alessandro di Benedetto and his father crossed the Atlantic on a 18 foot Hobie Cat. The Hobie is certainly not a cruiser.

http://www.wavetrain.net/news-a-views/42-that-crazy-italian-guy

 

I hope this thread doesn't turn into a stunt-type boat thread.

 

Right, threads NEVER drift, can't let that happen!

 

I think a micro cruiser discussion should include the Peep Hen

http://www.shortypen.com/boats/peep-hen-sailboat-1/

 

Probably the Com-Pac 16 also, these boats also have a large following although not among SA'ers.

 

Where is the dividing line between micro cruiser and a mini cruiser? Obviously less that 21 ft because slightly over 21 ft LOA is officially a Mini. How about distinguishing between boats where you sleep ashore, or under a tent; and boats with a solid cabin roof over your head? I have cruised a number of mini-sized boats, fewer micros, and only one tent. I much prefer a solid lid and am working on an idea to carry along a removable hard top like an old sports car... tuck into the aft end of the cockpit while sailing, this space doesn't get used for anything else.

 

FB- Doug

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I thought this was a thread about very small kids bikes.

 

Everyone has happy memories of their bikes when they were kids. That would have made thia a happy thread.

 

Then I found a load of pictures of boat that would encourage piles. Piles, that wouldn't be a happy thread. And back pain, oh no, kids bikes would be a much better thread. Just say no to piles.

 

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=micro+cruiser+kids+bike&client=firefox-a&hs=9YI&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&channel=sb&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=_Ir8U5z2OLTNsQS0sIHQBw&ved=0CAgQ_AUoAQ&biw=987&bih=432#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=vx8kH0nOMwrgxM%253A%3Bad9QEDCB5pzu0M%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fcdn.shopify.com%252Fs%252Ffiles%252F1%252F0161%252F6426%252Fproducts%252Felectra_20_boys_cruiser_1024x1024.jpg%253Fv%253D1354492700%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.noosabikeshop.com.au%252Fcollections%252Fkids-bikes%3B400%3B266

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I thought this was a thread about very small kids bikes.

 

Everyone has happy memories of their bikes when they were kids. That would have made thia a happy thread.

 

Then I found a load of pictures of boat that would encourage piles. Piles, that wouldn't be a happy thread. And back pain, oh no, kids bikes would be a much better thread. Just say no to piles.

 

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=micro+cruiser+kids+bike&client=firefox-a&hs=9YI&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&channel=sb&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=_Ir8U5z2OLTNsQS0sIHQBw&ved=0CAgQ_AUoAQ&biw=987&bih=432#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=vx8kH0nOMwrgxM%253A%3Bad9QEDCB5pzu0M%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fcdn.shopify.com%252Fs%252Ffiles%252F1%252F0161%252F6426%252Fproducts%252Felectra_20_boys_cruiser_1024x1024.jpg%253Fv%253D1354492700%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.noosabikeshop.com.au%252Fcollections%252Fkids-bikes%3B400%3B266

 

that reminds me

 

Raleigh Chopper

 

brilliant

 

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I've been wondering what the smallest production micro-cruiser is. The first production boat that comes to mind is the Wayfarer.

Ian Proctor design. It's not too different from other British sailing dinghies of the same size, but at least it has a storage compartment with a hatch.

 

wayfar4.jpg

 

Note: there are several version, the latest being a "complete redesign."

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I've been wondering what the smallest production micro-cruiser is. The first production boat that comes to mind is the Wayfarer.

Ian Proctor design. It's not too different from other British sailing dinghies of the same size, but at least it has a storage compartment with a hatch.

 

wayfar4.jpg

 

Note: there are several version, the latest being a "complete redesign."

 

 

sealord 15 - as in feet

 

 

tess01.jpg

 

 

 

IMG_0493.jpg

 

had one for four years

 

cracking little yacht at just over 15 feet

 

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Someone who definitely deserves a mention is Nathaniel H. Bishop who sailed Barnegat Bay sneakbox down the Ohio and Mississippi Rivers, and beyond. I didn't find a picture of his sneakbox, the Centennial Republic, just pictures of generic ones:

 

B11D.GIF

 

 

More here: http://www.ibiblio.org/eldritch/nhb/BISHOP.HTM

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I made a mistake above. John MacGregor was an Englishman who wrote a book about his adventures sailing a yawl name rob-Roy. You can read his book about it here: http://www.gutenberg.org/files/27235/27235-h/27235-h.htm

 

p6b.jpg

 

 

 

I think that was the inspiration for naming the voyaging canoe Rob Roy, but I'm not sure.

 

 

http://www.thecheappages.com/yawl_rob_roy/yawl_rob_roy.jpg

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A lot of people fish out of a kayak. Apparently it's a "thing."

 

But not a new thing:

 

macgregorrobroy.jpg

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A lot of people fish out of a kayak. Apparently it's a "thing."

 

But not a new thing:

 

macgregorrobroy.jpg

Saw a couple a couple weeks back pulling crab traps while they were in a kayak. Awkward and slow pulling 75 feet of line up, but doable. Saw them the next week on a jetski doing the same thing. Oh well

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There is an older couple who tend their crab pots here in a canoe. They are out crabbing virtually every day crabbing is open.

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John Guzzwell's Trekka:

 

bwbfest9.jpg

But is it a ketch or yawl?

 

Production cruisers in this size should include a mention of the Precision 16. It is their only cabin boat with a fixed keel. Neat little boat.

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This might quality as a micro cruiser. It's abut 14' long and showed up at our club a few weeks ago. I'm curious if anyone knows what it is. Sure is cute.

post-37611-0-39057100-1409232621_thumb.jpg

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Hmmm. I think we need a Micro Rule and suggest we adopt the one used by Watertribe: it's a small boat if you can launch it from a beach, carrying with you any apparatus used to achieve the launch.

 

I posted pictures of Sopranino, Trekka, etc because they were small boats that actually did go somewhere, but there is a difference between a ballasted keel boat and an expedition kayak. I would say that's the difference between a mini-cruiser and a micro-cruiser. The minis have also been called tabloid cruisers and pocket cruisers.

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This might quality as a micro cruiser. It's abut 14' long and showed up at our club a few weeks ago. I'm curious if anyone knows what it is. Sure is cute.

attachicon.gifIMG_20140827_183003.jpg

 

Looks like a Nordica. I know they made a 16 ft'er; dunno if they ever built any 14 ft'ers.

 

 

 

Hmmm. I think we need a Micro Rule and suggest we adopt the one used by Watertribe: it's a small boat if you can launch it from a beach, carrying with you any apparatus used to achieve the launch.

 

I posted pictures of Sopranino, Trekka, etc because they were small boats that actually did go somewhere, but there is a difference between a ballasted keel boat and an expedition kayak. I would say that's the difference between a mini-cruiser and a micro-cruiser. The minis have also been called tabloid cruisers and pocket cruisers.

 

I think beach-launchable is a beach cruiser. The WaterTribe rules are quite frankly intended to discriminate against any boat that isn't a kayak. They can certainly be very capable and practical boats, however many of us are too spoiled, too soft, perhaps too effete, to brave hundreds of miles of wilderness & open sea without at least a hint of a solid roof overhead... especially me!

 

A kayak or canoe can be a beach cruiser, or a small sailboat with a tent enclosure, or one can have a solid cabin trunk. Obviously one can only have so much in the way external keels & ballast. I would suggest that the next step up, a boat that is NOT intended to be launched from a beach, would be a micro cruiser; obviously such a boat could be pretty easily trailerable even if it's not intended to be hauled up & down a shore by hand.

 

FB- Doug

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Steam Flyer hit the nail right on its head:

 

Here is a bit more info on this boat:

 

Nordica 16 - Design: Salty full keel, double ender with a Cuddy cabin and two 6’8” berths. Displacement - 925 lbs, Beam - 6’2”. Concrete ballast enclosed in fiberglass. Strengths: Very stable and kind motion in heavy seas. Can handle heavy weather. Easy to load/unload from a trailer due to its shallow draft (1’ 10”). Weaknesses: Cockpit is not self draining. Slow in light winds.

Much more here: http://www.nordicaboats.com/html/nordica-16.html

 

There is a trip report, about 2/3ds down of a trip to Main Duck on Lake Ontario.

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A lot of people fish out of a kayak. Apparently it's a "thing."

 

But not a new thing:

Quite an effective thing, it is very easy to get exactly where you want without disturbing the fish, up close to breakwaters, around jetties etc. The little peddle propeller thing hobie sells makes it even easier. My brother takes his out after work quite a bit in summer, just throws it in the back of the van in the morning and he can be trolling 5 minutes after knockoff. Catches some nice fish too

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Many companies, including Hobie and LL Bean (I think) sell kayaks designed for fishing. I think they are sit-on-tops, which give a bit more torso movement. Probably have rod holders, etc too.

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I have a few tricks up my sleeve to make this into a better small cruiser

post-22698-0-76085200-1409369471_thumb.jpg

post-22698-0-68599400-1409369537_thumb.jpg

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Go, Pudgy, Go!

 

that's a really fun video. Brings back memories. Makes that little boat look really good.

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Many companies, including Hobie and LL Bean (I think) sell kayaks designed for fishing. I think they are sit-on-tops, which give a bit more torso movement. Probably have rod holders, etc too.

I fish with kayak guys on Lake Ontario chasing salmon & trout all summer. They are getting more & more like cheap boats opposed to actual kayaks. Most of the plastic sit on tops paddle like barges, fine for bobbing around but not for going any distance. Guys still manage to get a few miles offshore though.

 

100_0836.jpg

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A lot of people fish out of a kayak. Apparently it's a "thing."

 

But not a new thing:

 

macgregorrobroy.jpg

That's not a kayak, but a decked sailing canoe. This is what they look like in modern composite, and my current ride. Paddles better than a sit on top, carries more than a proper sea kayak. Been on a few long weekend camping trips, a lot easier to fill with gear than a sea kayak.

 

 

 

100_1075_zpsb523c0d2.jpg

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A lot of people fish out of a kayak. Apparently it's a "thing."

 

But not a new thing:

macgregorrobroy.jpg

That's not a kayak, but a decked sailing canoe. This is what they look like in modern composite, and my current ride. Paddles better than a sit on top, carries more than a proper sea kayak. Been on a few long weekend camping trips, a lot easier to fill with gear than a sea kayak.100_1075_zpsb523c0d2.jpg

Sorry, I would have some major concerns- unless there is a way to secure that aft hatch.

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"Sorry, I would have some major concerns- unless there is a way to secure that aft hatch."

 

Think canoe, not kayak. Or for that matter, guide boat.

 

For any boat, you pick the conditions to go out in. Anyway, looks great to me.

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There are spray skirts for all three cockpits, but unless I am going on a multi-day trip or it's raining, the center & aft skirts stay off. The bow skirt is in place, I just don't ship water, even in a whitecap chop.

 

Sailing canoes caught on around the Adirondacks & England, but not really anywhere else. Still lot's of plans & kits out there for 13-18' ketches made out of glued lapstrake plywood hulls, with a hull weight well under 100lbs. But enough displacement for camping gear. Being pretty boats doesn't hurt either.

 

IMG_5781.JPG

 

IMGP1110.JPG

 

I used to read a blog about a guy who built a 16'er, then shipped it around the world for his vacations and spend a couple months island hopping. Bahamas, San Blas, even as far as Thailand.

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There is a man from Australia that has been cruising around Western Australia in his Paradox. Geoff is based in Perth, and has sailed his 13'10" sailboat 500 miles north to Shark Bay, and sailed 50 miles offshore into the Indian Ocean to visit the Abrolhos Islands. Geoff also rounded Cape Leeuwin in his Paradox.

Cape Leeuwin
Cape Leeuwin is the most south-westerly mainland point of the Australian Continent, in the state of Western Australia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cape_Leeuwin

Shark Bay
Shark Bay is a World Heritage Site in the Gascoyne region of Western Australia. The 2,200,902-hectare (5,438,550-acre) heritage–listed area is located approximately 800 kilometres (500 mi) north of Perth, on the westernmost point of the Australian continent.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shark_Bay

Abrolhos Islands
The Houtman Abrolhos (often informally called the Abrolhos Islands) is a chain of 122 islands, and associated coral reefs, in the Indian Ocean off the west coast of Australia. Nominally located at 28°43′S 113°47′ECoordinates: 28°43′S 113°47′E,[1] it lies about eighty kilometres (50 mi) west of Geraldton, Western Australia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Houtman_Abrolhos

 

Attached are two photo's of Geoff and his Paradox.

post-106106-0-36949300-1409673138.jpg

post-106106-0-80137900-1409673198_thumb.jpg

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I love the concept of a 'micro cruiser', but I'd have to name it s/v Barfolicious or Vomitus Maximus to sail it offshore.

 

It would clearly emphasize the fact that 'comfort' is very subjective.

 

I've always thought it would be awesome to have a small sailboat in the BWCWA (Boundary Waters Canoe Wilderness Area)

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There are a few Paradox guys who have written some great cruising trip stories fun to read and follow those guys.

 

I also really like the Swallow boats built in England

http://www.swallowboats.com/used-boats

 

If we down size I would be very tempted to make a trip maybe try to participate in a Raid on one of the Swallow boats like the Expedition, 20 or 23 with the idea I would consider ordering one and shipping it back to the US.

 

I like the Compac Cat the 17 and 20 are cool boats also the tip up rig like 5 min to go from road mode to splashed is a big WIN for me.

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I've always thought it would be awesome to have a small sailboat in the BWCWA (Boundary Waters Canoe Wilderness Area)

In most of the BWCA lakes, sailboats are banned because they are considered "motorized" (the sails generate power, so even a pram dinghy is a power boat).

 

I wish I was pulling that out of my ass.

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So if you deploy your beach umbrella while canoing to increase your speed downwind, you're violating the law? Do they enforce the rules from paddle powered canoes? Might be able to run and hide........

Most fun I've had in canoes was umbrella racing back to the campground after playing all day UPWIND from the campground.

Of course this is in California and we had to dodge the jetskis, skiboats and bass fishermen.....

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The Montgomery 17 is supposedly very seaworthy -- whatever that means!

 

m17-photo1-500x394.jpg

 

 

How low can you go? There's a Montgomery 15 too:


M15-photo-d-13-500x.jpg

 

 

Both of these seem to have a cult following. Asking prices are healthy and they're not on the market long.

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There are spray skirts for all three cockpits, but unless I am going on a multi-day trip or it's raining, the center & aft skirts stay off. The bow skirt is in place, I just don't ship water, even in a whitecap chop.

 

Sailing canoes caught on around the Adirondacks & England, but not really anywhere else. Still lot's of plans & kits out there for 13-18' ketches made out of glued lapstrake plywood hulls, with a hull weight well under 100lbs. But enough displacement for camping gear. Being pretty boats doesn't hurt either.

 

IMG_5781.JPG

 

IMGP1110.JPG

 

I used to read a blog about a guy who built a 16'er, then shipped it around the world for his vacations and spend a couple months island hopping. Bahamas, San Blas, even as far as Thailand.

 

 

Both of these are gorgeous.

 

I love the idea, and would love to try. I've seen plenty around BC.

 

I want something I can cartop and carry myself. Also, a lot of beaches and lakes allow only "hand-carried" boats.

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There are spray skirts for all three cockpits, but unless I am going on a multi-day trip or it's raining, the center & aft skirts stay off. The bow skirt is in place, I just don't ship water, even in a whitecap chop.

 

Sailing canoes caught on around the Adirondacks & England, but not really anywhere else. Still lot's of plans & kits out there for 13-18' ketches made out of glued lapstrake plywood hulls, with a hull weight well under 100lbs. But enough displacement for camping gear. Being pretty boats doesn't hurt either.

 

IMG_5781.JPG

 

IMGP1110.JPG

 

I used to read a blog about a guy who built a 16'er, then shipped it around the world for his vacations and spend a couple months island hopping. Bahamas, San Blas, even as far as Thailand.

 

 

Both of these are gorgeous.

 

I love the idea, and would love to try. I've seen plenty around BC.

 

I want something I can cartop and carry myself. Also, a lot of beaches and lakes allow only "hand-carried" boats.

 

 

you can always build a duck punt - sailing them is a subtle art

 

you can build one in 16 hours

 

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Robert Manry's Tinkerbelle.

 

boat.jpg

 

A man in my area had a duplicate. She's a wee thing.

Dad built one in the basement and garage in the late 60's. Learned to sail on it (poorly). A Briggs and Stratton 3 hp with a "hanndy-billy" centrigugal water pump in the aft compartment provided "jet boat" propulsion with an intake near the keel and outlet at the transom.

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I've always thought it would be awesome to have a small sailboat in the BWCWA (Boundary Waters Canoe Wilderness Area)

In most of the BWCA lakes, sailboats are banned because they are considered "motorized" (the sails generate power, so even a pram dinghy is a power boat).

 

I wish I was pulling that out of my ass.

 

jeezus... that's pretty pathetic

Though some areas of BWCA are motorized (ex. Saganaga). But stil...sheesh

 

 

The Montgomery 17 is supposedly very seaworthy -- whatever that means!

 

m17-photo1-500x394.jpg

 

 

How low can you go? There's a Montgomery 15 too:

 

M15-photo-d-13-500x.jpg

 

 

Both of these seem to have a cult following. Asking prices are healthy and they're not on the market long.

 

I've always liked the Montys. There was a 15 for sale on our street for $700. By the time I thought about checking it out it was gone.

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I love the concept of a 'micro cruiser', but I'd have to name it s/v Barfolicious or Vomitus Maximus to sail it offshore.

 

It would clearly emphasize the fact that 'comfort' is very subjective.

 

I've always thought it would be awesome to have a small sailboat in the BWCWA (Boundary Waters Canoe Wilderness Area)

 

Some people prefer smaller craft, and there are those who will never be able to afford anything larger than a micro-cruiser.

 

For those in the latter category, a Frances Lee, or a Hawk are the stuff dreams are made of, and unless they buy a winning lotto ticket, even a 30-foot Baba is well beyond their financial reach.

 

Micro-cruisers have made some unbelievable voyages, such as the Matt Layden Paradox prototype that to date has been as far north as Canada, and has voyaged to the Bahamas eight times with it's second owners, and at least once with Matt Layden at the helm.

 

There is the couple who sailed their 19-foot Hunter across the North Sea, from Scotland to Norway, and back, and the man in Australia who is sailing around the west coast of his country in his Paradox. Lastly the guy who is sailing around the Hawaiian Island chain in his micro-cruiser.

 

I think we've just started to see long voyages in micro-cruisers. Already there is "chatter" that a trans-ocean crossing in a Paradox would be possible. Now a Paradox would not be my first choice to cross on ocean in, but my lotto winnings haven't amounted to much either, and no, I'm not one of the people thinking about trying it.

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John Guzzwell's Trekka:

 

bwbfest9.jpg

But is it a ketch or yawl?
Guzzwell and Giles call it a yawl. Although the mizzen is fwd of the rudderpost (and aft the tillerpost), the proportions of the mizzen are yawl-like. A ketch would have a much larger mizzen.

BTW, I LOVE Trekka, and have a great deal of respect and admiration for John Guzzwell. His "style" is sadly missing among todays solo sailors (Abby Sunderland, Rimas, etc).

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Robert Manry's Tinkerbelle.

 

boat.jpg

 

A man in my area had a duplicate. She's a wee thing.

Dad built one in the basement and garage in the late 60's. Learned to sail on it (poorly). A Briggs and Stratton 3 hp with a "hanndy-billy" centrigugal water pump in the aft compartment provided "jet boat" propulsion with an intake near the keel and outlet at the transom.

 

I learned how to sail on this boat, an Old Town "Lapstrake Sailboat," on East Grand Lake in Maine. Manry added the cabin for his trip across the Atlantic--he wrote a good book about his adventures. Old Town were much better known for their canoes.

 

PAGE-24_zpsf39eed34.gif

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John Guzzwell's Trekka:

 

bwbfest9.jpg

But is it a ketch or yawl?
Guzzwell and Giles call it a yawl. Although the mizzen is fwd of the rudderpost (and aft the tillerpost), the proportions of the mizzen are yawl-like. A ketch would have a much larger mizzen.

BTW, I LOVE Trekka, and have a great deal of respect and admiration for John Guzzwell. His "style" is sadly missing among todays solo sailors (Abby Sunderland, Rimas, etc).

 

I figured that question would cause an endless discussion, but you're the only one who bit.

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John Guzzwell's Trekka:

 

bwbfest9.jpg

But is it a ketch or yawl?
Guzzwell and Giles call it a yawl. Although the mizzen is fwd of the rudderpost (and aft the tillerpost), the proportions of the mizzen are yawl-like. A ketch would have a much larger mizzen.

BTW, I LOVE Trekka, and have a great deal of respect and admiration for John Guzzwell. His "style" is sadly missing among todays solo sailors (Abby Sunderland, Rimas, etc).

 

I figured that question would cause an endless discussion, but you're the only one who bit.

 

I'd be more interested in the mizzen staysail(s) than whether it's termed a ketch or a yawl

 

FB- Doug

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So we've just picked up our new mini-cruiser! This is going to be a huge change from our 41' ketch, there's no oven, no fridge, no shower, no heat. The trade off is that we're extending our cruising range. Down below there's the 4 berths and a porta potty, so this is most certainly camp-cruising. We're planning a boom tent to cover the huge cockpit. I see this as an economical version of what http://anasaziracing.blogspot.ca/ are doing.

 

The boat is a 1983 Pocket Rocket 22.

2014-08-25%2017.36.34.jpg?dl=0

 

(so I can't seem to post a dropbox pic??)

 

:D

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So we've just picked up our new mini-cruiser! This is going to be a huge change from our 41' ketch, there's no oven, no fridge, no shower, no heat. The trade off is that we're extending our cruising range. Down below there's the 4 berths and a porta potty, so this is most certainly camp-cruising. We're planning a boom tent to cover the huge cockpit. I see this as an economical version of what http://anasaziracing.blogspot.ca/ are doing.

 

The boat is a 1983 Pocket Rocket 22.

2014-08-25%2017.36.34.jpg?dl=0

 

(so I can't seem to post a dropbox pic??)

 

:D

Nothing wrong with that!

We had a U20 for years took it all sorts of cool places. Did some mini cruising on it had a good time. We have the typical 28ft heavy big family RV on the water and to be honest we have not has as much fun with it as we did the small boat. The U20 was too basic for the cruising idea but something in that size range thats more cruisy would be very fun.

 

I really like this one- the right combo of interior cruisy bits, right weight for easy hauling, center board for easy shallow water work, water ballast to help get things more stable if the weather goes to hell. And best of all its actually designed to sit on its bottom when the tide goes out so less concern about messing it up if we end up grounded some place.

 

I like the little Baycruiser 20 too. The Bayraider Expedition is interesting but would be rough with two kids and trying to stay warm on a cold rainy or foggy morning at anchor.

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(so I can't seem to post a dropbox pic??)

 

Sure you can. Put it in your '/Dropbox/Public/' folder, right click on it there and use "Copy public link".

 

It's good practice to create sub-folders in that '/Public/' folder, such as one called '/Dropbox/Public/sa/'

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The admiral and I spent quire a few years cruising our Shark 24. After 1 vacation with a 1 year old, de decided we needed a bit more space. Sometimes I really miss the simplicity and the plain old fun of the Shark.

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The admiral and I spent quire a few years cruising our Shark 24. After 1 vacation with a 1 year old, de decided we needed a bit more space. Sometimes I really miss the simplicity and the plain old fun of the Shark.

I've looking at Sharks for a "summer cottage" next year. I am guessing they don't trailer that well.

Heh, certainly prettier than a San Juan 24! :D

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I had no issues trailering mine. I would trailer it about 100 miles each fall and spring to/from my parents place (free storage) and, sometimes would trailer the boat to go on vacation We actually launched and retrieved the boat quite a few times on a ramp.

 

You won't regret buying a Shark especially if you like to sail in a breeze.

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The eponym of the microcruiser is, of course, the Bolger Micro. This design was, and may still be, very popular. I don't think it's a stretch to say hundreds were built (though maybe only 200 or so). It's positively big and roomy compared to some of the others. Bolger designed out as much of the fussiness and detail in the construction as he could, so it's a very different boat to build than Paradox.

 

cricket2.jpg

 

 

 

Hmmm. I think we need a Micro Rule and suggest we adopt the one used by Watertribe: it's a small boat if you can launch it from a beach, carrying with you any apparatus used to achieve the launch.

 

That is a pretty restrictive rule. Pretty much eliminates ballasted boats. After all, it was meant to discriminate in favor of canoes and against the common run of sailboats.

 

 

 

 

Great thread. My knowledge of microcruisers is far from encyclopedic. I came across the Bolger Micro when researching designs to build in 1990. I'd never heard of a microcruiser before that, so Bolger's Micro will always be the quintessential example of the type for me. I ended up building a Bolger Jinni (which was originally designed by Bolger for Jim Michalak, one of the first boats he built I believe) which has about the same length as a Micro but a much larger cockpit for passengers, and was meant to be pulled onto the beach for camp-cruising. I don't consider it a microcruiser, so I'm on the side that says microcruisers don't have to be beach launchable.

 

My own bias out of this experience is that a microcruiser should ideally be built by the person doing the cruising. It's an extension of the 'I'm all alone in this big world' ethos that seems to underly the microcruising concept. Said another way, I thought my simple Bolger boat was beautiful, but a large part of that was because I built it. Like all mothers thinks their kids are beautiful. I don't know that I'd be too excited about sailing a Bolger Micro that I didn't build myself. Seems to miss half the point, although people looking to buy one regularly turn up on the bolger yahoo group.

 

Paradox is like a Micro on steroids. Neat boat, but I sure wouldn't want to build it, as pointed out earlier. Of course, I swore to never build another boat again so that's not saying much.

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The eponym of the microcruiser is, of course, the Bolger Micro. This design was, and may still be, very popular. I don't think it's a stretch to say hundreds were built (though maybe only 200 or so). It's positively big and roomy compared to some of the others. Bolger designed out as much of the fussiness and detail in the construction as he could, so it's a very different boat to build than Paradox.

 

cricket2.jpg

 

 

 

Hmmm. I think we need a Micro Rule and suggest we adopt the one used by Watertribe: it's a small boat if you can launch it from a beach, carrying with you any apparatus used to achieve the launch.

 

That is a pretty restrictive rule. Pretty much eliminates ballasted boats. After all, it was meant to discriminate in favor of canoes and against the common run of sailboats.

 

 

 

 

Great thread. My knowledge of microcruisers is far from encyclopedic. I came across the Bolger Micro when researching designs to build in 1990. I'd never heard of a microcruiser before that, so Bolger's Micro will always be the quintessential example of the type for me. I ended up building a Bolger Jinni (which was originally designed by Bolger for Jim Michalak, one of the first boats he built I believe) which has about the same length as a Micro but a much larger cockpit for passengers, and was meant to be pulled onto the beach for camp-cruising. I don't consider it a microcruiser, so I'm on the side that says microcruisers don't have to be beach launchable.

 

My own bias out of this experience is that a microcruiser should ideally be built by the person doing the cruising. It's an extension of the 'I'm all alone in this big world' ethos that seems to underly the microcruising concept. Said another way, I thought my simple Bolger boat was beautiful, but a large part of that was because I built it. Like all mothers thinks their kids are beautiful. I don't know that I'd be too excited about sailing a Bolger Micro that I didn't build myself. Seems to miss half the point, although people looking to buy one regularly turn up on the bolger yahoo group.

 

Paradox is like a Micro on steroids. Neat boat, but I sure wouldn't want to build it, as pointed out earlier. Of course, I swore to never build another boat again so that's not saying much.

 

If you have time to build and sail thats great!! Many people have very little free time and what time they do have typically would like to spend it sailing vs building. Nothing wrong with that also.

If we had more people see and hear that doing fun adventures on small boats is OK and possible sailing and just about any other boating type would be a bigger part of our society. Vs the standard view of boating being only a rich persons thing.

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.....

My own bias out of this experience is that a microcruiser should ideally be built by the person doing the cruising. It's an extension of the 'I'm all alone in this big world' ethos that seems to underly the microcruising concept.

... ...

 

Paradox is like a Micro on steroids. Neat boat, but I sure wouldn't want to build it, as pointed out earlier. Of course, I swore to never build another boat again so that's not saying much.

 

Personally I think that you, in swearing to not build another boat, show a high degree of common sense. There was a long interval of time in which buying a boat was expensive and difficult, and even now it consumes far more time than it should. However the current (likely long-term) economy dictating that buyers can find & buy 2nd-hand boats for pennies (or less) on the dollar has completely undermined the concept.

 

So what is simplicity and minimalism? Investing in the place and the tools and acquiring the expertise to BUILD a boat; or acquiring the boat at minimal investment? Obviously you have to learn enough to shop wisely.

 

FB- Doug

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Those small, interesting looking boats do it for me too.

 

I am currently working on a 'souped up' Phil Bolger, Roger MacGregor concept - it might qualify as a Micro-Cruiser perhaps ?

 

 

 

Trying to drum up a case for it at schoolroad.weebly.com

 

RG28 - running aspect

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If you have time to build and sail thats great!! Many people have very little free time and what time they do have typically would like to spend it sailing vs building. Nothing wrong with that also.

If we had more people see and hear that doing fun adventures on small boats is OK and possible sailing and just about any other boating type would be a bigger part of our society. Vs the standard view of boating being only a rich persons thing.

 

Yes, anything that gets more people on sailboats (especially small ones!) and having fun is good, and if actually cruising all the better. A you-must-build-it-yourself first attitude is of course the exact opposite of the easiest way to get people sailing in 2014. Man do I know it. I spent 1991-1996 building that little sharpie, countless weekends that I could have spent criss-crossing Biscayne Bay in an old used Hobie 16 bought for $900 and having a blast. Exactly as I did years later on Kaneohe Bay, Oahu. Much faster and easier way to get on the water.

 

 

 

.....

My own bias out of this experience is that a microcruiser should ideally be built by the person doing the cruising. It's an extension of the 'I'm all alone in this big world' ethos that seems to underly the microcruising concept.

... ...

 

Paradox is like a Micro on steroids. Neat boat, but I sure wouldn't want to build it, as pointed out earlier. Of course, I swore to never build another boat again so that's not saying much.

 

Personally I think that you, in swearing to not build another boat, show a high degree of common sense. There was a long interval of time in which buying a boat was expensive and difficult, and even now it consumes far more time than it should. However the current (likely long-term) economy dictating that buyers can find & buy 2nd-hand boats for pennies (or less) on the dollar has completely undermined the concept.

 

So what is simplicity and minimalism? Investing in the place and the tools and acquiring the expertise to BUILD a boat; or acquiring the boat at minimal investment? Obviously you have to learn enough to shop wisely.

 

FB- Doug

 

Well I definitely learned a lesson, but the Bolger build was just the end of my education on the subject. I watched my father spend the 80's beautifully rebuilding an old wooden 27' sloop (years longer than expected - stem replacement), immediately selling it to buy materials for building a cold-molded 35' John Marples trimaran, getting halfway done with that, and then dying before ever doing a single day of bluewater cruising with his family. After that, the experience of building my Bolger Jinni "Miss Inez" simply sealed the case that the way to go, for me anyway, is to go out and make some money in some kind of career, and buy a boat (or have one built).

 

So, ~20 years later, after sailing home-builts and cheap ancient beach cats, I'm buying an F24 Mark II. Only under contract right now, hope I'm not jinxing it. Corsairs have good build quality. I know a lot of Farrier designs are non-production built, but that doesn't make economic sense these days. Stoked! Shout out to Tom Ray for advice via pm.

 

I plan to sail this boat with my wife and 3 kids. Is a 24' tri with a crew of 5 microcruising?

 

What I am trying to get at on the builder-as-sailor idea has to do with the romance in the idea of solo sailing these little boats over great distances. Of course they can be, and maybe most are, just used for gunkholing. But it's the long passages in a microcruiser that really fascinate. And I think you can take it even farther in a Robinson Crusoe kind of way. The microcruiser is the answer to the following hypothetical:

 

Imagine yourself alone on a deserted island thousands of miles from nearest land with nothing but some sail cloth, a few sheets of marine ply, and a few gallons of West System. What boat do you build to sail yourself back to civilization?

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John Guzzwell's Trekka:

 

bwbfest9.jpg

But is it a ketch or yawl?
Guzzwell and Giles call it a yawl. Although the mizzen is fwd of the rudderpost (and aft the tillerpost), the proportions of the mizzen are yawl-like. A ketch would have a much larger mizzen.

BTW, I LOVE Trekka, and have a great deal of respect and admiration for John Guzzwell. His "style" is sadly missing among todays solo sailors (Abby Sunderland, Rimas, etc).

I figured that question would cause an endless discussion, but you're the only one who bit.

I'd be more interested in the mizzen staysail(s) than whether it's termed a ketch or a yawl

 

FB- Doug

AFAIK, he didn't have a mizzen staysail. The mizzen was fairly small, and essentially used to aid self-steering. This was before steering vanes were invented, and Guzzwell used a sheet to tiller method, as outlined in John Letcher's book. Twin boomed-out jibs downwind, though he set a spinnaker above them in light air. Hand-steered much of the daytime. If self-steering was troublesome, he'd leave just a jib up at night, strapped in, or drop sails and lie ahull. Made pretty good speed, even through the doldrums. Superb navigation.

AFAIK, his sail inventory was main, mizzen, working jib, storm jib, genoa (appeared to be a 150 or 160), twins, and a spinnaker.

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Back to the bigger boats, then.

 

John Welsford had a client who wanted a boat to single-hand on the south coast of Australia. The design is called Swaggie. The hull is somewhat Flicka-like. Huge carrying capacity, tiny cockpit, junk rig. The one in the picture was built in Uruguay.

 

swaggie-2007.jpg

 

A different client wanted a design for a contest (or other sort of plan, not sure) to sail 10-footers across oceans (don't remember which ones). JW did his usual careful analysis and decided 10 feet was not enough. He turned his research into a 13-footer called Fafnir. There are some under construction, but I haven't seen any pictures of boats in the water.

 

fafnir1.gif

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