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PaulinVictoria

Team Vestas grounded

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I understand the subtext - that there is a financial and PR silver lining to all this. But that is your world - not Nico's. He is a sailor, not a reporter or a PR specialist. His story, and resultant ROI, is supposed to be about winning the VOR. That's it. I don't think he gives a damn about that "silver lining" around what he clearly sees as a very tragic mistake that haunts him and will be with him forever. I'd offer that you should lighten up on the "exposure" angle. It's a bit seedy in light of things.

 

Might be seedy, but is real. I have sat in those very marketing meetings where the value of a capsized boat was analyzed; it's something that shouldn't be ignored.

 

Glad you liked the rest of it.

 

It's seedy in the same way you don't ask the loosing quarterback of the superbowl if he is glad his jersey sales are up...

 

thought you could use a football analogy...as you really didn't seem to pick up on Nico's body language (you were amused...he wasn't)

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I understand the subtext - that there is a financial and PR silver lining to all this. But that is your world - not Nico's. He is a sailor, not a reporter or a PR specialist. His story, and resultant ROI, is supposed to be about winning the VOR. That's it. I don't think he gives a damn about that "silver lining" around what he clearly sees as a very tragic mistake that haunts him and will be with him forever. I'd offer that you should lighten up on the "exposure" angle. It's a bit seedy in light of things.

 

Might be seedy, but is real. I have sat in those very marketing meetings where the value of a capsized boat was analyzed; it's something that shouldn't be ignored.

 

Glad you liked the rest of it.

 

 

" a capsized boat" is pretty vague

 

if you sat in on any meetings where the "analysis" concluded that team vestas running their boat on to well known reef was good for their sponsor.., then their analysis was wrong

 

it's really not very good for a sponsor to have their brand associated with incompetence - and the fact that millions of people know about the incompetence doesn't make it better!

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Yep, flat earth society believes any publicity is good publicity despite the elephant in the corner...

 

Still, this is SA after all and not just the Clean ape pre Asian sew sigh eighty?

 

As such, despite The Emperors New Clothes situation that prevails here on, a goodly number of pragmatists see the wood for the trees and do not speake in Ye tongues forsooth!

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Yep, flat earth society believes any publicity is good publicity despite the elephant in the corner...

Still, this is SA after all and not just the Clean ape pre Asian sew sigh eighty?

As such, despite The Emperors New Clothes situation that prevails here on, a goodly number of pragmatists see the wood for the trees and do not speake in Ye tongues forsooth!

Sorry, forgot to mention its that time of the year in the Suns progression in orbit around the earth called The Winter Solstice...

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Football? You mean to compare a sport where the team has ten layers of management, finance, and PR and the QB makes 15 million a year and has three people backing him up? Umm, ok.

 

As for body language, the whole point was to bring up something that non-French skippers have avoided acknowledging for a long time. The French understand that it is reality, and ordinarily have PR plans to deal with it. Ignore it and you are simply throwing away money, exposure, and goodwill. The smart sponsor knows exactly how much a disaster can be worth.

 

 

 

 

 

I understand the subtext - that there is a financial and PR silver lining to all this. But that is your world - not Nico's. He is a sailor, not a reporter or a PR specialist. His story, and resultant ROI, is supposed to be about winning the VOR. That's it. I don't think he gives a damn about that "silver lining" around what he clearly sees as a very tragic mistake that haunts him and will be with him forever. I'd offer that you should lighten up on the "exposure" angle. It's a bit seedy in light of things.

 

Might be seedy, but is real. I have sat in those very marketing meetings where the value of a capsized boat was analyzed; it's something that shouldn't be ignored.

 

Glad you liked the rest of it.

It's seedy in the same way you don't ask the loosing quarterback of the superbowl if he is glad his jersey sales are up...

 

thought you could use a football analogy...as you really didn't seem to pick up on Nico's body language (you were amused...he wasn't)

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I understand the subtext - that there is a financial and PR silver lining to all this. But that is your world - not Nico's. He is a sailor, not a reporter or a PR specialist. His story, and resultant ROI, is supposed to be about winning the VOR. That's it. I don't think he gives a damn about that "silver lining" around what he clearly sees as a very tragic mistake that haunts him and will be with him forever. I'd offer that you should lighten up on the "exposure" angle. It's a bit seedy in light of things.

 

Might be seedy, but is real. I have sat in those very marketing meetings where the value of a capsized boat was analyzed; it's something that shouldn't be ignored.

 

Glad you liked the rest of it.

 

" a capsized boat" is pretty vague

 

if you sat in on any meetings where the "analysis" concluded that team vestas running their boat on to well known reef was good for their sponsor.., then their analysis was wrong

 

it's really not very good for a sponsor to have their brand associated with incompetence - and the fact that millions of people know about the incompetence doesn't make it better!

Vague intentionally. What is your sponsorship background? You seem to be saying the opposite of all the activation experts I've spoken to over the past decade.

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As for body language, the whole point was to bring up something that non-French skippers have avoided acknowledging for a long time. The French understand that it is reality, and ordinarily have PR plans to deal with it. Ignore it and you are simply throwing away money, exposure, and goodwill. The smart sponsor knows exactly how much a disaster can be worth

Depends on the circumstances. For both personal and business reasons, Thomas Coville didn't seem too happy about hitting a container in the channel at the last route du rhum. I might even say he seemed much more depressed than Nico.

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I understand the subtext - that there is a financial and PR silver lining to all this. But that is your world - not Nico's. He is a sailor, not a reporter or a PR specialist. His story, and resultant ROI, is supposed to be about winning the VOR. That's it. I don't think he gives a damn about that "silver lining" around what he clearly sees as a very tragic mistake that haunts him and will be with him forever. I'd offer that you should lighten up on the "exposure" angle. It's a bit seedy in light of things.

 

Might be seedy, but is real. I have sat in those very marketing meetings where the value of a capsized boat was analyzed; it's something that shouldn't be ignored.

 

Glad you liked the rest of it.

 

 

" a capsized boat" is pretty vague

 

if you sat in on any meetings where the "analysis" concluded that team vestas running their boat on to well known reef was good for their sponsor.., then their analysis was wrong

 

it's really not very good for a sponsor to have their brand associated with incompetence - and the fact that millions of people know about the incompetence doesn't make it better!

I'm sure Vestas did not go into this placing any value on a disaster like this. FWIW, they are a stand up company that has dealt with ugly situations in the past by doing what is right, even if very painful from a monetary standpoint. Search for Horns Reef and Vestas to see what I'm referring to. They also take safety very seriously and know very well how to do a root cause analysis. I have negotiated deals with them on and off for the past 10 years and while they can be a pain to negotiate with, they are justifiably proud of their product and brand. I would love to see them get back in the race (but I'm not holding my breath).

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I understand the subtext - that there is a financial and PR silver lining to all this. But that is your world - not Nico's. He is a sailor, not a reporter or a PR specialist. His story, and resultant ROI, is supposed to be about winning the VOR. That's it. I don't think he gives a damn about that "silver lining" around what he clearly sees as a very tragic mistake that haunts him and will be with him forever. I'd offer that you should lighten up on the "exposure" angle. It's a bit seedy in light of things.

Might be seedy, but is real. I have sat in those very marketing meetings where the value of a capsized boat was analyzed; it's something that shouldn't be ignored.

 

Glad you liked the rest of it.

 

" a capsized boat" is pretty vague

 

if you sat in on any meetings where the "analysis" concluded that team vestas running their boat on to well known reef was good for their sponsor.., then their analysis was wrong

 

it's really not very good for a sponsor to have their brand associated with incompetence - and the fact that millions of people know about the incompetence doesn't make it better!

Vague intentionally. What is your sponsorship background? You seem to be saying the opposite of all the activation experts I've spoken to over the past decade.

I have been mixing with numerous friends from all around the sailing world at the Paris Boat show, at a big recent classic yacht club dinner, and at parties and pre-Christmas gatherings with many sailing friends present. The Vestas grounding was a subject much discussed and many people who, before this Vestas accident, had only a vague idea about what the VOR is, were now much interested, not just in this accident, but also in the Race itself. These are “ordinary sailors” and their families and not people strongly interested in this type of event. It is obvious to me that general interest in the event has increased by an order of magnitude entirely due to this accident and the accident has promoted the race, unintentionally, far more effectively than all the VOR publicity and that of all the sponsors put together.

Assuming the sponsors and the VOR do, for business reasons, actually want to promote interest in the race and their businesses, it would be very naïve to suggest this accident has not had a hugely positive effect. Far bigger than anything else. Indeed a real jackpot!

Clean is right.

Incidentally, no one I have talked with has had anything negative to say about Vestas. All I have noticed is an increased interest in what they are doing. Hardly anyone had even heard of the company before this. Now, among the people I refer to, everyone knows what they do.

I hope Vestas do manage to get back into the race, and with Nico, Wouter, and crew. This would clearly send out a message of determination to see a job completed, confidence in people, and responsibility, and this could only win them enormous public admiration.

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.

....^^......thanks 'staysail' for bringing a real world example of a real world occurrence.

 

...cool work on the gingerVestas...not sure what the 'dark humor' 'bout it though. :mellow:

 

 

I'm sure Vestas did not go into this placing any value on a disaster like this. FWIW, they are a stand up company that has dealt with ugly situations in the past by doing what is right, even if very painful from a monetary standpoint. Search for Horns Reef and Vestas to see what I'm referring to. They also take safety very seriously and know very well how to do a root cause analysis. I have negotiated deals with them on and off for the past 10 years and while they can be a pain to negotiate with, they are justifiably proud of their product and brand. I would love to see them get back in the race (but I'm not holding my breath).

.
That's an interesting read. I had no idea that Vestas provided the turbines for the first sizable offshore windfarm in the North Sea. Indeed,I would have not have known of this real world fact had it not been for the real world mishap of Nico and the boys :mellow: .
...I'm sure Vestas wasn't completely thrilled to re,re so many turbines, nor are they likely thrilled with the current situation, but as they say experience is expen$ive but priceless. It's not a question whether or not adversity rises in the real world,,but how we deal with it that is important. I wish Vestas all the best in rising to the current challenge.... indications so far indicate a very thorough and resourceful approach.

http://www.vestas.com/files/Filer/EN/Press_releases/VWS/2004/080704-UK.pdf

“Experience is expensive, but also precious. Being the first large offshore project,
Horns Reef must be a success. The project is important for Vestas’ continued
leadership in the offshore segment. It is my belief that Vestas will win the market in
this segment. Even though it has been at a high premium, it puts Vestas and our
suppliers into a unique position,” maintains Svend Sigaard, President and CEO and
he continues “Horns Reef represents a token of supplier reliability.”

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As for body language, the whole point was to bring up something that non-French skippers have avoided acknowledging for a long time. The French understand that it is reality, and ordinarily have PR plans to deal with it. Ignore it and you are simply throwing away money, exposure, and goodwill. The smart sponsor knows exactly how much a disaster can be worth

Depends on the circumstances. For both personal and business reasons, Thomas Coville didn't seem too happy about hitting a container in the channel at the last route du rhum. I might even say he seemed much more depressed than Nico.

 

Of course not, but hitting a container and limping home doesn't present any good opportunities, really. All obstacles are not the same, and creativity in how one responds to disasters can go an immensely long way.

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creativity in how one responds to disasters can go an immensely long way.

 

 

disaster = "bad star" it's more of an act of god.., or bad luck.., than it is just screwing up

 

i guess you think they are perceived by the public as the same thing, but i don't agree.

 

in any case, i'm pretty sure the management at Vestas know the difference.., and i think that their unhappiness about this will increase over time

 

but we'll see - i could be wrong

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I think you guys are missing the point about silver lining and opportunity. I don't think Clean is suggesting in anyway that the Vestas management thinks crashing on a reef is a better PR opportunity than completing the race intact. I think its just that there are plans to try to make the most out of a bad situation and that sometime adversity and disaster is its own PR bonus in itself. Kinda along the line of "if it bleeds, it leads". Again, I doubt anyone would rather the VO65 Vestas turned into a VO45 on the rocks. But I'm sure there are always corporate contingency plans to make lemonade out of lemons.

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I get Clean's point...I get the lemonade out of lemons. But that is a CORPORATE take on the balance sheet that is their investment in VOR. Nico is an employee, his reputation will follow him forever - his relationship with Vestas could end tomorrow. So how can he sit there and calmly and dispassionately appreciate the enhanced corporate ROI that this accident may have created.


If I'm the leading goal scorer and cpt. of an NHL team that tanks because I played a crap year.....do I smile and celebrate that at least our team gets a better draft pick cause of my poor play? If a reporter asked me if I'm glad my crap play has an upside in the draft market I'd probably be within my rights to hit him. (and if you review the film where Clean brings this marketing / ROI benefit up with Nico it looks like Nico wants to clock him too)


No doubt there is lemonade in this situation (for the corporation)....but that is a question to be put to a member of the company, and not a hired gun that contributed to an ugly event that could have really hurt someone and that will live with him forever. Nico will only know the taste of the bitterness of lemons.


So - good observation by Clean....way way wrong person to discuss it with in Nico.

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People at the Paris Boatyard Show not knowing what the VOR is about.

Bloody hell I thought the French were pretty au fai with ocean racing et. al?

As for Vestas and their area of expertise, I don't think the world of windpower has quite the marketing opportunities it used to have as people have become aware of its carbon footprint, let alone it's other footprints, not quite as green as some may believe.

A little play around www.windturbinesyndrome should dispel one or two myths in that direction, - clue Vestas moral compass!

But hey ho any port in a storm eh chaps?

Who gives a flying fig when it comes to money eh?

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People at the Paris Boatyard Show not knowing what the VOR is about.

Bloody hell I thought the French were pretty au fai with ocean racing et. al?

As for Vestas and their area of expertise, I don't think the world of windpower has quite the marketing opportunities it used to have as people have become aware of its carbon footprint, let alone it's other footprints, not quite as green as some may believe.

A little play around www.windturbinesyndrome should dispel one or two myths in that direction, - clue Vestas moral compass!

But hey ho any port in a storm eh chaps?

Who gives a flying fig when it comes to money eh?

Carbon footprint? I think you can't get much better than a wind turbine if you want to compare carbon footprints for power generation sources. I agree there are issues around them, sound being one of them (which is what your link is addressing), and they are not the "answer" due to operational realities (i.e., intermittency), but I've not encountered the argument that they are bad from a carbon standpoint.

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As for body language, the whole point was to bring up something that non-French skippers have avoided acknowledging for a long time. The French understand that it is reality, and ordinarily have PR plans to deal with it. Ignore it and you are simply throwing away money, exposure, and goodwill. The smart sponsor knows exactly how much a disaster can be worth

Depends on the circumstances. For both personal and business reasons, Thomas Coville didn't seem too happy about hitting a container in the channel at the last route du rhum. I might even say he seemed much more depressed than Nico.

 

Of course not, but hitting a container and limping home doesn't present any good opportunities, really. All obstacles are not the same, and creativity in how one responds to disasters can go an immensely long way.

Unless it was the boat full of chicks... then someone would pick up and run with the drama, as the scoop each cup of water out of the bilge.......

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As for body language, the whole point was to bring up something that non-French skippers have avoided acknowledging for a long time. The French understand that it is reality, and ordinarily have PR plans to deal with it. Ignore it and you are simply throwing away money, exposure, and goodwill. The smart sponsor knows exactly how much a disaster can be worth

Depends on the circumstances. For both personal and business reasons, Thomas Coville didn't seem too happy about hitting a container in the channel at the last route du rhum. I might even say he seemed much more depressed than Nico.

 

Of course not, but hitting a container and limping home doesn't present any good opportunities, really. All obstacles are not the same, and creativity in how one responds to disasters can go an immensely long way.

Unless it was the boat full of hot chicks... then someone would pick up and run with the drama, as the scoop each cup of water out of the bilge.......

Corrected.

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You're starting from the wrong spot. In fact that is not their contractual relationship at all.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Nico is an employee

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Should make the point

Hitting a container is one thing.... those things are hard to see even on technology

 

Hitting a ship loaded with containers... thats another all together.... thats a special kind of o shit!!

 

 


As for body language, the whole point was to bring up something that non-French skippers have avoided acknowledging for a long time. The French understand that it is reality, and ordinarily have PR plans to deal with it. Ignore it and you are simply throwing away money, exposure, and goodwill. The smart sponsor knows exactly how much a disaster can be worth


Depends on the circumstances. For both personal and business reasons, Thomas Coville didn't seem too happy about hitting a container in the channel at the last route du rhum. I might even say he seemed much more depressed than Nico.

 

Of course not, but hitting a container and limping home doesn't present any good opportunities, really. All obstacles are not the same, and creativity in how one responds to disasters can go an immensely long way.

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Vestas as a minimum will donate a wind generator to the locals that have provided so much support beyond the few dollars.

 

Every member of the Vestas crew is more accomplished than I will ever be, but in each distance race I ever did, I came on watch early and spent a minute chart-looking at our course/speed/etc. I doubt they are any different. Wouter has to own this one.

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Vestas as a minimum will donate a wind generator to the locals that have provided so much support beyond the few dollars.

 

Every member of the Vestas crew is more accomplished than I will ever be, but in each distance race I ever did, I came on watch early and spent a minute chart-looking at our course/speed/etc. I doubt they are any different. Wouter has to own this one.

 

What makes you think he hasn't???

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I worked with two navy crews 30yrs ago with F4s and our mission (scientific) over the baltic. We had them at 10K and slow and on their way home, they overflew a bunch of airports to find a military base that was open. When they finally landed, the lead jet made it the trailer flamed out on close final...no one was hurt. Hindsight is a great thing for a skipper, navigator, pilot (and I have more hours than you Jeff). I don't want to be that guy, but everyone on that boat could have avoided the mistake but didn't.

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looks like the boat is now on a freighter bound for Europe - well done to get the boat off in one piece

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:)~~~enough time has past..all are well...let the dark humor prevail~~~

forss, on 21 Dec 2014 - 10:20, said:

forss, on 21 Dec 2014 - 10:20, said:

885548_10152670969305677_605497535652549

 

Something sweet from blur.se

Baked by J/105 Team Javelin. Join the gingerbread boat competition at http://www.blur.se/2014/12/07/sweetaste-pepparkaksbaten-2014/

I liked the Baked Cake a lot. Gives an Christmas feeling about this race. Those swedish guys certainly have humor. I Just saw the dutch interview with Wouter Verbaak. Main Question was If he will be the navigator on the new Vesta's Boat. All he could say was: That's not up to me but it will be a team effort again. ... Duhh. Well, we will see. All is well that end well. But the loss of a vor 65 isn't exactly what I see as a good ending. I believe the navigator and the skipper are responsible for groundings. But that is personal.

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People at the Paris Boatyard Show not knowing what the VOR is about.

Bloody hell I thought the French were pretty au fai with ocean racing et. al?

As for Vestas and their area of expertise, I don't think the world of windpower has quite the marketing opportunities it used to have as people have become aware of its carbon footprint, let alone it's other footprints, not quite as green as some may believe.

A little play around www.windturbinesyndrome should dispel one or two myths in that direction, - clue Vestas moral compass!

But hey ho any port in a storm eh chaps?

Who gives a flying fig when it comes to money eh?

Carbon footprint? I think you can't get much better than a wind turbine if you want to compare carbon footprints for power generation sources. I agree there are issues around them, sound being one of them (which is what your link is addressing), and they are not the "answer" due to operational realities (i.e., intermittency), but I've not encountered the argument that they are bad from a carbon standpoint.

It's a whole life issue, not just what you see on the surface.

Whether the beasts are offshore (best place for them) or on dry land they have to be put in place and connected to the grid. Those that are ashore are usually placed on hilltops - not renowned for ease of access so access has to be created, where this is in areas of peat bog, frequent in Europe, then Massive amounts of CO2 are released as a result of peat bog destruction. Where the turbines are backed up of necessity by gas generators then the CO2 emissions increase per unit generated. This does not occur where there is no backup.

 

My vote would be for tidal power, but that would probably kill more cetaceans than offshore wind farms. Anyroads, point is, it is not quite as green as they would have you believe.

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People at the Paris Boatyard Show not knowing what the VOR is about.

Bloody hell I thought the French were pretty au fai with ocean racing et. al?

As for Vestas and their area of expertise, I don't think the world of windpower has quite the marketing opportunities it used to have as people have become aware of its carbon footprint, let alone it's other footprints, not quite as green as some may believe.

A little play around www.windturbinesyndrome should dispel one or two myths in that direction, - clue Vestas moral compass!

But hey ho any port in a storm eh chaps?

Who gives a flying fig when it comes to money eh?

In France the events which get the following are the Vendee Globe, the Solitaire du Figaro, the Mini-Transat and the Route du Rhum. The VOR does not seem to create anything like the same level of interest. No French boat entered this time. Compared with the French races, VOR is poorly covered on the web, dreadful tracker, dumbed down "reality show" news, etc. Web site which is frustrating, often inaccurate and counter-intuitive. You don't have those problems with the French races.

By the way the show is "Salon Nautique", or "Paris Boat Show".

Concerning wind turbines, one can debate the green merits, but you only have to sail around the east side of the North Sea, the Baltic, Atlantic coast of France, Spain, Portugal, etc. to notice that other European countries have been investing in them for years. The UK not so much, and the UK has no shortage of wind. A big windfarm is being built off East Anglia. Who by, Norwegian company, Statoil!

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People at the Paris Boatyard Show not knowing what the VOR is about.

Bloody hell I thought the French were pretty au fai with ocean racing et. al?

As for Vestas and their area of expertise, I don't think the world of windpower has quite the marketing opportunities it used to have as people have become aware of its carbon footprint, let alone it's other footprints, not quite as green as some may believe.

A little play around www.windturbinesyndrome should dispel one or two myths in that direction, - clue Vestas moral compass!

But hey ho any port in a storm eh chaps?

Who gives a flying fig when it comes to money eh?

In France the events which get the following are the Vendee Globe, the Solitaire du Figaro, the Mini-Transat and the Route du Rhum. The VOR does not seem to create anything like the same level of interest. No French boat entered this time. Compared with the French races, VOR is poorly covered on the web, dreadful tracker, dumbed down "reality show" news, etc. Web site which is frustrating, often inaccurate and counter-intuitive. You don't have those problems with the French races.

By the way the show is "Salon Nautique", or "Paris Boat Show".

Concerning wind turbines, one can debate the green merits, but you only have to sail around the east side of the North Sea, the Baltic, Atlantic coast of France, Spain, Portugal, etc. to notice that other European countries have been investing in them for years. The UK not so much, and the UK has no shortage of wind. A big windfarm is being built off East Anglia. Who by, Norwegian company, Statoil!

Thanks for that staysail. Yep, all credit to the French, just been watching the Route De Rhum on BBC in a 1/2 hr special on Robin Knox-Johnson. Some classic film of Suhali!!! What was of more impact though, besides the geezers age, were the huge crowds on the shore and afloat. Yep, the VOR may have a lot of money, but 7 boats? Route had 71 starters I think.

As for great sailors, obviously the French top the pot in terms of numbers.

 

Great to see that Vestas has now been recovered, whether all the pieces including continued sponsorship come together again for this race remains to be seen. My bucks would be on the next VOR if Vestas continue support as obviously a rushed entry has not had the expected outcome.

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looks like the boat is now on a freighter bound for Europe - well done to get the boat off in one piece

They first have to get to Mauritius, then to Malaysia and then to Europe. Still a HUGE logistical effort to put it mildly.

Antanov. Kuala lumpur to Europe. Easy. Back in the shed. New arse end /"cut and shut job". New keel. See you in Brazil. Rise you Phoenix.

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People at the Paris Boatyard Show not knowing what the VOR is about.

Bloody hell I thought the French were pretty au fai with ocean racing et. al?

As for Vestas and their area of expertise, I don't think the world of windpower has quite the marketing opportunities it used to have as people have become aware of its carbon footprint, let alone it's other footprints, not quite as green as some may believe.

A little play around www.windturbinesyndrome should dispel one or two myths in that direction, - clue Vestas moral compass!

But hey ho any port in a storm eh chaps?

Who gives a flying fig when it comes to money eh?

In France the events which get the following are the Vendee Globe, the Solitaire du Figaro, the Mini-Transat and the Route du Rhum. The VOR does not seem to create anything like the same level of interest. No French boat entered this time. Compared with the French races, VOR is poorly covered on the web, dreadful tracker, dumbed down "reality show" news, etc. Web site which is frustrating, often inaccurate and counter-intuitive. You don't have those problems with the French races.

By the way the show is "Salon Nautique", or "Paris Boat Show".

Concerning wind turbines, one can debate the green merits, but you only have to sail around the east side of the North Sea, the Baltic, Atlantic coast of France, Spain, Portugal, etc. to notice that other European countries have been investing in them for years. The UK not so much, and the UK has no shortage of wind. A big windfarm is being built off East Anglia. Who by, Norwegian company, Statoil!

Thanks for that staysail. Yep, all credit to the French, just been watching the Route De Rhum on BBC in a 1/2 hr special on Robin Knox-Johnson. Some classic film of Suhali!!! What was of more impact though, besides the geezers age, were the huge crowds on the shore and afloat. Yep, the VOR may have a lot of money, but 7 boats? Route had 71 starters I think.

As for great sailors, obviously the French top the pot in terms of numbers.

Great to see that Vestas has now been recovered, whether all the pieces including continued sponsorship come together again for this race remains to be seen. My bucks would be on the next VOR if Vestas continue support as obviously a rushed entry has not had the expected outcome.

91?

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Vestas A Career with Global Opportunities

Life at Vestas is many things – exciting, rewarding, fun and challenging.

Because we are part of a young industry there is a can-do, dynamic spirit, which inspires our people to keep pushing forward the boundaries commercially as well as technologically.

At Vestas, we offer a world of opportunities for people with a global mind-set and the desire to make a positive impact.

Working at Vestas you will meet people with a broad range of skills, from a variety of cultures and we are always on the lookout for more talented individuals. We currently are checking options on lively young persons with good navigation skills, ability to work long hours, who maintain a vigilant watch for important details.

 

 

 

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My old man is a television repairman, he's got this ultimate set of tools. I can fix it.

 

 

 

The new Vesta's boat

attachicon.gifVesta's new.jpg

 

My old man is a television repairman, he's got this ultimate set of tools. I can fix it.

 

 

 


The new Vesta's boat

attachicon.gifVesta's new.jpg

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Assume that box/weight on foredeck was to have it float bow down to keep the busted arse out of the water. Bloody fine effort doing all that considering where they were.

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People at the Paris Boatyard Show not knowing what the VOR is about.

Bloody hell I thought the French were pretty au fai with ocean racing et. al?

As for Vestas and their area of expertise, I don't think the world of windpower has quite the marketing opportunities it used to have as people have become aware of its carbon footprint, let alone it's other footprints, not quite as green as some may believe.

A little play around www.windturbinesyndrome should dispel one or two myths in that direction, - clue Vestas moral compass!

But hey ho any port in a storm eh chaps?

Who gives a flying fig when it comes to money eh?

In France the events which get the following are the Vendee Globe, the Solitaire du Figaro, the Mini-Transat and the Route du Rhum. The VOR does not seem to create anything like the same level of interest. No French boat entered this time. Compared with the French races, VOR is poorly covered on the web, dreadful tracker, dumbed down "reality show" news, etc. Web site which is frustrating, often inaccurate and counter-intuitive. You don't have those problems with the French races.

By the way the show is "Salon Nautique", or "Paris Boat Show".

Concerning wind turbines, one can debate the green merits, but you only have to sail around the east side of the North Sea, the Baltic, Atlantic coast of France, Spain, Portugal, etc. to notice that other European countries have been investing in them for years. The UK not so much, and the UK has no shortage of wind. A big windfarm is being built off East Anglia. Who by, Norwegian company, Statoil!

 

Love the false facts... UK not so much? Besides the largest offshore wind farm in the world (London Array) and the 6th largest installed capacity in the world and the second fastest growth in windpower in Europe behind Poland, I would agree with you. Hasn't caught on at all! Doh!

 

Marketing power that it used to? When was it ever big? It certainly hasn't gone down at anytime in recent history. Aware of it carbon footprint? Aware that it is very, very small? Public support of more windpower in countries with wind power installed is something like 80/20 globally. What other utility scale form of electricity production has a higher acceptance?

 

Are you suggesting there are no 'syndromes' or otherwise harmful side effects associated with coal, gas, or nuclear?

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Can you guys start a Socially responsible and Eco-friendly Euro - corporate thing in another thread? Thanks.

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Can you guys start a Socially responsible and Eco-friendly Euro - corporate thing in another thread? Thanks.

...no point in asking...in fact it's getting pretty clear that JZK and Celtic both get excited and accelerate their troll-posts if any attention is put their way. I wouldn't be surprised if they're one in the same.

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Can you guys start a Socially responsible and Eco-friendly Euro - corporate thing in another thread? Thanks.

...no point in asking...in fact it's getting pretty clear that JZK and Celtic both get excited and accelerate their troll-posts if any attention is put their way. I wouldn't be surprised if they're one in the same.

Hey Coach Potato, do you work in a pickle factory, must do, surrounded by gherkins!

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People at the Paris Boatyard Show not knowing what the VOR is about.

Bloody hell I thought the French were pretty au fai with ocean racing et. al?

As for Vestas and their area of expertise, I don't think the world of windpower has quite the marketing opportunities it used to have as people have become aware of its carbon footprint, let alone it's other footprints, not quite as green as some may believe.

A little play around www.windturbinesyndrome should dispel one or two myths in that direction, - clue Vestas moral compass!

But hey ho any port in a storm eh chaps?

Who gives a flying fig when it comes to money eh?

 

In France the events which get the following are the Vendee Globe, the Solitaire du Figaro, the Mini-Transat and the Route du Rhum. The VOR does not seem to create anything like the same level of interest. No French boat entered this time. Compared with the French races, VOR is poorly covered on the web, dreadful tracker, dumbed down "reality show" news, etc. Web site which is frustrating, often inaccurate and counter-intuitive. You don't have those problems with the French races.

By the way the show is "Salon Nautique", or "Paris Boat Show".

Concerning wind turbines, one can debate the green merits, but you only have to sail around the east side of the North Sea, the Baltic, Atlantic coast of France, Spain, Portugal, etc. to notice that other European countries have been investing in them for years. The UK not so much, and the UK has no shortage of wind. A big windfarm is being built off East Anglia. Who by, Norwegian company, Statoil!

Love the false facts... UK not so much? Besides the largest offshore wind farm in the world (London Array) and the 6th largest installed capacity in the world and the second fastest growth in windpower in Europe behind Poland, I would agree with you. Hasn't caught on at all! Doh!

 

Marketing power that it used to? When was it ever big? It certainly hasn't gone down at anytime in recent history. Aware of it carbon footprint? Aware that it is very, very small? Public support of more windpower in countries with wind power installed is something like 80/20 globally. What other utility scale form of electricity production has a higher acceptance?

 

Are you suggesting there are no 'syndromes' or otherwise harmful side effects associated with coal, gas, or nuclear?

Nope, all have their inherent dangers and paybacks, particularly the 100% safe nuclear option as evidenced by Fuckyoushima not so long ago. Not sure what the options are and would prefer more tidal power systems I think.

WRT wind power, part of the answer lies in government subsidies and tax breaks along with the usual offshore tax havens, it is not very viable when you factor our 'contributions' into it.

WRT transferring to an Eco thread, the bloody boat that hit the reef is sponsored by Vestas FFS, it's their corporate identity all over the media, so no, unless they change the boats name and sponsorship it's trial by association.

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WRT wind power, part of the answer lies in government subsidies and tax breaks along with the usual offshore tax havens, it is not very viable when you factor our 'contributions' into it.

WRT transferring to an Eco thread, the bloody boat that hit the reef is sponsored by Vestas FFS, it's their corporate identity all over the media, so no, unless they change the boats name and sponsorship it's trial by association.

 

Government subsidies and tax breaks have been part of electricity production long before wind power. If you factored in the negative contributions of fossil fuels (i.e. the true cost) it wouldn't appear viable either.

 

Tax breaks are a funny thing. Wind in the US is supported almost exclusively by tax breaks, however, the American Wind Energy Association supports a 3 year phase out of the tax breaks and the current tax breaks expire in 9 days. So, we are on the verge of an unlevel playing field because traditional production still receives tax breaks. The current renewable tax breaks are a credit on energy produced. Take away the credit, today, for new builds. Does the government make more money? No. The wind farms just don't get built and the gov't doesn't get to collect the tax at all. Actually, wind will survive after the government support is gone, just not at the same pace. Is that what the people want, or just what the deep pocket opponents trying to squash competition want?

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Can you guys start a Socially responsible and Eco-friendly Euro - corporate thing in another thread? Thanks.

You could also just put the Celtic idiot onto ignore and make everyones life easier as well.

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"if you factored in the negative contributions of fossil fuels.." Ha ha, that is a good one. If it weren't for fossil fuels, you would be foraging for berries and there would be no VOR.

Wind power might make you feel all warm and fuzzy like you are saving the world, but it is really useless. Except for, perhaps, helping to supplement power on a cruising sailboat.

 

 

 

 

WRT wind power, part of the answer lies in government subsidies and tax breaks along with the usual offshore tax havens, it is not very viable when you factor our 'contributions' into it.
WRT transferring to an Eco thread, the bloody boat that hit the reef is sponsored by Vestas FFS, it's their corporate identity all over the media, so no, unless they change the boats name and sponsorship it's trial by association.

 

Government subsidies and tax breaks have been part of electricity production long before wind power. If you factored in the negative contributions of fossil fuels (i.e. the true cost) it wouldn't appear viable either.

 

Tax breaks are a funny thing. Wind in the US is supported almost exclusively by tax breaks, however, the American Wind Energy Association supports a 3 year phase out of the tax breaks and the current tax breaks expire in 9 days. So, we are on the verge of an unlevel playing field because traditional production still receives tax breaks. The current renewable tax breaks are a credit on energy produced. Take away the credit, today, for new builds. Does the government make more money? No. The wind farms just don't get built and the gov't doesn't get to collect the tax at all. Actually, wind will survive after the government support is gone, just not at the same pace. Is that what the people want, or just what the deep pocket opponents trying to squash competition want?

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Oh fuck, I've even got the Mad bastard having a go now, still he is proficient at tittilating I suppose.

 

Tell you what, I will make a pact with you flat earth freaks, shut the fuck up and I promise to say no more about it, deal?

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People at the Paris Boatyard Show not knowing what the VOR is about.

Bloody hell I thought the French were pretty au fai with ocean racing et. al?

As for Vestas and their area of expertise, I don't think the world of windpower has quite the marketing opportunities it used to have as people have become aware of its carbon footprint, let alone it's other footprints, not quite as green as some may believe.

A little play around www.windturbinesyndrome should dispel one or two myths in that direction, - clue Vestas moral compass!

But hey ho any port in a storm eh chaps?

Who gives a flying fig when it comes to money eh?

In France the events which get the following are the Vendee Globe, the Solitaire du Figaro, the Mini-Transat and the Route du Rhum. The VOR does not seem to create anything like the same level of interest. No French boat entered this time. Compared with the French races, VOR is poorly covered on the web, dreadful tracker, dumbed down "reality show" news, etc. Web site which is frustrating, often inaccurate and counter-intuitive. You don't have those problems with the French races.

By the way the show is "Salon Nautique", or "Paris Boat Show".

Concerning wind turbines, one can debate the green merits, but you only have to sail around the east side of the North Sea, the Baltic, Atlantic coast of France, Spain, Portugal, etc. to notice that other European countries have been investing in them for years. The UK not so much, and the UK has no shortage of wind. A big windfarm is being built off East Anglia. Who by, Norwegian company, Statoil!

 

Love the false facts... UK not so much? Besides the largest offshore wind farm in the world (London Array) and the 6th largest installed capacity in the world and the second fastest growth in windpower in Europe behind Poland, I would agree with you. Hasn't caught on at all! Doh!

 

Marketing power that it used to? When was it ever big? It certainly hasn't gone down at anytime in recent history. Aware of it carbon footprint? Aware that it is very, very small? Public support of more windpower in countries with wind power installed is something like 80/20 globally. What other utility scale form of electricity production has a higher acceptance?

 

Are you suggesting there are no 'syndromes' or otherwise harmful side effects associated with coal, gas, or nuclear?

Sure at last we are seeing some projects in UK waters, and when you start from nothing, growth is bound to be big!

 

Is "the UK" really investing in it? London Array. 30% e.on (says its UK but seems to be managed from Dussledorf and is a "multinational" as far as I could see). Remaining 70% of the project is foreign. 25% Caisse of Quebec, 25% DONG (Danish Oil and Gas), 20% Masdar (Abu Dhabi).

 

It is a recent project, and only started producing electricity in 2012.

 

Not really "the UK" leading the world investing in wind power.

 

Don't get me wrong. I am all in favour of wind power, especially offshore; just curious why the UK is so many years behind the others when the UK has so much wind, and why the big UK projects are being run (and or funded) from out of the UK. I doubt that much profit or benefit from this will reach UK consumers or investors but maybe I'm wrong.

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Can you guys start a Socially responsible and Eco-friendly Euro - corporate thing in another thread? Thanks.

You could also just put the Celtic idiot onto ignore and make everyones life easier as well.

He got me with the peat bog argument. Just don't know what to say to that one ...

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Can you guys start a Socially responsible and Eco-friendly Euro - corporate thing in another thread? Thanks.

 

You could also just put the Celtic idiot onto ignore and make everyones life easier as well.

He got me with the peat bog argument. Just don't know what to say to that one ...

I'll take your word for it, I put him on ignore after about 20 posts and and him wanting to be my friend.

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People at the Paris Boatyard Show not knowing what the VOR is about.

Bloody hell I thought the French were pretty au fai with ocean racing et. al?

As for Vestas and their area of expertise, I don't think the world of windpower has quite the marketing opportunities it used to have as people have become aware of its carbon footprint, let alone it's other footprints, not quite as green as some may believe.

A little play around www.windturbinesyndrome should dispel one or two myths in that direction, - clue Vestas moral compass!

But hey ho any port in a storm eh chaps?

Who gives a flying fig when it comes to money eh?

In France the events which get the following are the Vendee Globe, the Solitaire du Figaro, the Mini-Transat and the Route du Rhum. The VOR does not seem to create anything like the same level of interest. No French boat entered this time. Compared with the French races, VOR is poorly covered on the web, dreadful tracker, dumbed down "reality show" news, etc. Web site which is frustrating, often inaccurate and counter-intuitive. You don't have those problems with the French races.

By the way the show is "Salon Nautique", or "Paris Boat Show".

Concerning wind turbines, one can debate the green merits, but you only have to sail around the east side of the North Sea, the Baltic, Atlantic coast of France, Spain, Portugal, etc. to notice that other European countries have been investing in them for years. The UK not so much, and the UK has no shortage of wind. A big windfarm is being built off East Anglia. Who by, Norwegian company, Statoil!

 

Love the false facts... UK not so much? Besides the largest offshore wind farm in the world (London Array) and the 6th largest installed capacity in the world and the second fastest growth in windpower in Europe behind Poland, I would agree with you. Hasn't caught on at all! Doh!

 

Marketing power that it used to? When was it ever big? It certainly hasn't gone down at anytime in recent history. Aware of it carbon footprint? Aware that it is very, very small? Public support of more windpower in countries with wind power installed is something like 80/20 globally. What other utility scale form of electricity production has a higher acceptance?

 

Are you suggesting there are no 'syndromes' or otherwise harmful side effects associated with coal, gas, or nuclear?

Sure at last we are seeing some projects in UK waters, and when you start from nothing, growth is bound to be big!

 

Is "the UK" really investing in it? London Array. 30% e.on (says its UK but seems to be managed from Dussledorf and is a "multinational" as far as I could see). Remaining 70% of the project is foreign. 25% Caisse of Quebec, 25% DONG (Danish Oil and Gas), 20% Masdar (Abu Dhabi).

 

It is a recent project, and only started producing electricity in 2012.

 

Not really "the UK" leading the world investing in wind power.

 

Don't get me wrong. I am all in favour of wind power, especially offshore; just curious why the UK is so many years behind the others when the UK has so much wind, and why the big UK projects are being run (and or funded) from out of the UK. I doubt that much profit or benefit from this will reach UK consumers or investors but maybe I'm wrong.

 

Countries don't invest in wind power, companies do, except maybe China. An offshore wind farm costs on the order of $1 billion to build, as a result there are very few companies that can afford to play that game. I think RES is a big UK developer, but they develop globally. Scottish & Southern is a big player onshore mostly. Mainstream Renewables is a big Irish developer.

 

I don't know what to say to the rest. The UK isn't behind. They are 6th in the world in installed capacity and one of the fastest growth countries, with a tiny, tiny amount of buildable area compared to places like the US, India, China, Germany, and Spain which are the 5 countries with greater installed capacity. Really only Denmark and Germany have embraced wind power to a greater degree than the UK in Europe and both of those countries are built out with new development only offshore. Countries and customers only benefit from wind power to the degree that you think wind power is a better source of electricity, particularly offshore. Onshore landowners can benefit big time as the land needed for a wind farm is typically leased from the land owners and royalties are paid as the electricity is generated. If you are a land owner with one big turbine it is like having an easy part time job. If you are a drought stricken rancher in the US with tens of thousands of acres you could be an overnight millionaire. Also, the taxes that wind farms pay go in part to school districts in the US. In remote areas (where big wind farms are built) the taxes received from a big wind farm could be a (new) majority of the tax base and ghost towns start building brand new schools. Offshore, the port that handles the turbine equipment benefits and the construction crew and operations crew are generally locals, but those are not large numbers of people.

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People at the Paris Boatyard Show not knowing what the VOR is about.

Bloody hell I thought the French were pretty au fai with ocean racing et. al?

As for Vestas and their area of expertise, I don't think the world of windpower has quite the marketing opportunities it used to have as people have become aware of its carbon footprint, let alone it's other footprints, not quite as green as some may believe.

A little play around www.windturbinesyndrome should dispel one or two myths in that direction, - clue Vestas moral compass!

But hey ho any port in a storm eh chaps?

Who gives a flying fig when it comes to money eh?

 

In France the events which get the following are the Vendee Globe, the Solitaire du Figaro, the Mini-Transat and the Route du Rhum. The VOR does not seem to create anything like the same level of interest. No French boat entered this time. Compared with the French races, VOR is poorly covered on the web, dreadful tracker, dumbed down "reality show" news, etc. Web site which is frustrating, often inaccurate and counter-intuitive. You don't have those problems with the French races.

By the way the show is "Salon Nautique", or "Paris Boat Show".

Concerning wind turbines, one can debate the green merits, but you only have to sail around the east side of the North Sea, the Baltic, Atlantic coast of France, Spain, Portugal, etc. to notice that other European countries have been investing in them for years. The UK not so much, and the UK has no shortage of wind. A big windfarm is being built off East Anglia. Who by, Norwegian company, Statoil!

Love the false facts... UK not so much? Besides the largest offshore wind farm in the world (London Array) and the 6th largest installed capacity in the world and the second fastest growth in windpower in Europe behind Poland, I would agree with you. Hasn't caught on at all! Doh!

 

Marketing power that it used to? When was it ever big? It certainly hasn't gone down at anytime in recent history. Aware of it carbon footprint? Aware that it is very, very small? Public support of more windpower in countries with wind power installed is something like 80/20 globally. What other utility scale form of electricity production has a higher acceptance?

 

Are you suggesting there are no 'syndromes' or otherwise harmful side effects associated with coal, gas, or nuclear?

Sure at last we are seeing some projects in UK waters, and when you start from nothing, growth is bound to be big!

Is "the UK" really investing in it? London Array. 30% e.on (says its UK but seems to be managed from Dussledorf and is a "multinational" as far as I could see). Remaining 70% of the project is foreign. 25% Caisse of Quebec, 25% DONG (Danish Oil and Gas), 20% Masdar (Abu Dhabi).

It is a recent project, and only started producing electricity in 2012.

Not really "the UK" leading the world investing in wind power.

 

Don't get me wrong. I am all in favour of wind power, especially offshore; just curious why the UK is so many years behind the others when the UK has so much wind, and why the big UK projects are being run (and or funded) from out of the UK. I doubt that much profit or benefit from this will reach UK consumers or investors but maybe I'm wrong.

Countries don't invest in wind power, companies do, except maybe China. An offshore wind farm costs on the order of $1 billion to build, as a result there are very few companies that can afford to play that game. I think RES is a big UK developer, but they develop globally. Scottish & Southern is a big player onshore mostly. Mainstream Renewables is a big Irish developer.

 

I don't know what to say to the rest. The UK isn't behind. They are 6th in the world in installed capacity and one of the fastest growth countries, with a tiny, tiny amount of buildable area compared to places like the US, India, China, Germany, and Spain which are the 5 countries with greater installed capacity. Really only Denmark and Germany have embraced wind power to a greater degree than the UK in Europe and both of those countries are built out with new development only offshore. Countries and customers only benefit from wind power to the degree that you think wind power is a better source of electricity, particularly offshore. Onshore landowners can benefit big time as the land needed for a wind farm is typically leased from the land owners and royalties are paid as the electricity is generated. If you are a land owner with one big turbine it is like having an easy part time job. If you are a drought stricken rancher in the US with tens of thousands of acres you could be an overnight millionaire. Also, the taxes that wind farms pay go in part to school districts in the US. In remote areas (where big wind farms are built) the taxes received from a big wind farm could be a (new) majority of the tax base and ghost towns start building brand new schools. Offshore, the port that handles the turbine equipment benefits and the construction crew and operations crew are generally locals, but those are not large numbers of people.

The tax situation is a bit more lenient to the "developers" than many might believe. Indeed, much of the cost of sponsorship may be a tax offset for all we know.

A large proportion of overseas start up costs can be written off against Corporation Tax or its equivalent, in this, Wind Turbine related global players are no different to any of the other non-payers either. It's part of the game where shareholders pocket their dividends while pretending to be morally and ethically investing in "green" projects supporting third world "development", it's smoke and mirrors.

Then there are the modern tax evasion methods termed avoidance because the legislation does not prohibit or actively encourages it, simply by going offshore or using a few other methods.

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To get back on topic;

 

On a belgian website a number of quotes from Wouter Verbraak were published that I hadn't seen before, or only parts of them. So I google-translated the quotes and turned them in to normal english.

Courtesy to Clubracer.be for the article (link);

 

 

"We had dealt with the tropical depression that day which kept us pretty busy. Then we chose the western route. Together with Chris Nicholson [skipper] I sat in the navigation area to go through this. We would encounter several shallows, which looked similar to submarine ridges we had already passed. "
"I was sleeping at the time of impact and was awakened by the sound of breaking carbon. The only time I've heard anything like that was when the mast went overboard in another round-the-world race. So at first I thought so we had broken the mast. The second thought was that we had hit a whale. I jumped up and then followed the communication from the deck: "There is a rock." In my navigation corner I saw that we had landed on a reef. "
"Both rudders and one daggerboard were broken. Our situation was very serious. As a navigator you off course feel responsible."
Then the situation was so serious with breaking waves over the deck without means of control, that the crew decided to call Race Control.
"They have the best network and means to provide assistance. We had the bad luck that it just got dark. After our Mayday call we were told that they could not come before the next morning. That message we only understood afterwards, because the Coast Guard has nothing there. They have no searchlights or spotlights. Therefore we had to stay on the boat all night. "
"It was clear that the leg was over. It's indescribable what happened during that night. 3 to 4 meter high waves which lifted the 9 ton boat up like a toy and smashed it on to the reef. The situation became more and more dire. I remember I sat in the nav station and tried to keep communication with Race Control afloat until we lost all power. Then we only had VHF and the satellite phone. Then the central part of the hull was punctured and the water flooded the boat knee high. Everything started floating, including the boxes of safety equipment. It was getting unsafe to be in the boat. "
Only on the second night after the incident was there time for Verbraak for reflection: "After I called my wife, I wanted time for myself. That's when things started to sink in. On the way back I ran in to Chris and I had a good conversation with him. I told him that I felt so responsible for what had happened and that I wanted to tell the rest of the crew. I did so the same evening, when we were together and had our first moment of rest. It was beautiful and what I will never forget is that Tony Rae then said, "Wouter, this is not something that you should bear alone. We did this as a team and we will go through this as a team. "
When asked what lessons he has drawn from the events Verbraak replied: "There is an independent investigation started by the Volvo Ocean Race orginasation, with a panel of very reputable people. We are iving them full cooperation. There are a lot of lessons to be learned, but I don't want to get ahead of their investigation. "
About his position on the team he is still in the unknown. "For no one," he adds. "Before we left Abu Dhabi to go home, Chris told us:" Our sponsors Vestas and Powerhouse, and the Volvo Ocean Race will do everything to bring us back in the race, but I will only say yes to that if I know that each of you is 100 percent committed. We all agreed. Whether I come back in the team, that's not my call. Chris is the skipper and decides. I hope I have made a first step in the right direction with admitting my mistake. "

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This is where it all started: The first Vestas wind "mill" prototypes - at least that's what the locals say.

Merry Christmas everyone, Glædelig jul!

 

post-20594-0-55781600-1419351688_thumb.jpg

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To get back on topic;

 

On a belgian website a number of quotes from Wouter Verbraak were published that I hadn't seen before, or only parts of them. So I google-translated the quotes and turned them in to normal english.

Courtesy to Clubracer.be for the article (link);

 

 

"We had dealt with the tropical depression that day which kept us pretty busy. Then we chose the western route. Together with Chris Nicholson [skipper] I sat in the navigation area to go through this. We would encounter several shallows, which looked similar to submarine ridges we had already passed. "

"I was sleeping at the time of impact and was awakened by the sound of breaking carbon. The only time I've heard anything like that was when the mast went overboard in another round-the-world race. So at first I thought so we had broken the mast. The second thought was that we had hit a whale. I jumped up and then followed the communication from the deck: "There is a rock." In my navigation corner I saw that we had landed on a reef. "

"Both rudders and one daggerboard were broken. Our situation was very serious. As a navigator you off course feel responsible."

 

Then the situation was so serious with breaking waves over the deck without means of control, that the crew decided to call Race Control.

"They have the best network and means to provide assistance. We had the bad luck that it just got dark. After our Mayday call we were told that they could not come before the next morning. That message we only understood afterwards, because the Coast Guard has nothing there. They have no searchlights or spotlights. Therefore we had to stay on the boat all night. "

"It was clear that the leg was over. It's indescribable what happened during that night. 3 to 4 meter high waves which lifted the 9 ton boat up like a toy and smashed it on to the reef. The situation became more and more dire. I remember I sat in the nav station and tried to keep communication with Race Control afloat until we lost all power. Then we only had VHF and the satellite phone. Then the central part of the hull was punctured and the water flooded the boat knee high. Everything started floating, including the boxes of safety equipment. It was getting unsafe to be in the boat. "

 

Only on the second night after the incident was there time for Verbraak for reflection: "After I called my wife, I wanted time for myself. That's when things started to sink in. On the way back I ran in to Chris and I had a good conversation with him. I told him that I felt so responsible for what had happened and that I wanted to tell the rest of the crew. I did so the same evening, when we were together and had our first moment of rest. It was beautiful and what I will never forget is that Tony Rae then said, "Wouter, this is not something that you should bear alone. We did this as a team and we will go through this as a team. "

 

When asked what lessons he has drawn from the events Verbraak replied: "There is an independent investigation started by the Volvo Ocean Race orginasation, with a panel of very reputable people. We are iving them full cooperation. There are a lot of lessons to be learned, but I don't want to get ahead of their investigation. "

About his position on the team he is still in the unknown. "For no one," he adds. "Before we left Abu Dhabi to go home, Chris told us:" Our sponsors Vestas and Powerhouse, and the Volvo Ocean Race will do everything to bring us back in the race, but I will only say yes to that if I know that each of you is 100 percent committed. We all agreed. Whether I come back in the team, that's not my call. Chris is the skipper and decides. I hope I have made a first step in the right direction with admitting my mistake. "

Wow, thank you for posting this. This entire saga is going to make a great book and/or movie someday.

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This is where it all started: The first Vestas wind "mill" prototypes - at least that's what the locals say.

 

Merry Christmas everyone, Glædelig jul!

 

attachicon.gifv1_IMG_1461.JPG

Merry Christmas & a Happy New Year, Renn.

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I heard nico likes his scotch like he likes his boats.......neat, not on the rocks. :lol:

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I heard nico likes his scotch like he likes his boats.......neat, not on the rocks. :lol:

JB, you're not doing "stand up" in your spare time over there are you? ;-)

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Timely. Article in Gizmag.

 

One thing that is guaranteed to put a naval ship commander in front of a court martial is running aground. Unfortunately, despite all the advances in satellite technology and other aids, navigation is still as much an art as a science and a very time-consuming one at that, with it taking days and sometimes weeks to chart out a mission. To free up captains and reduce their chances of having to answer awkward questions, the US Navy is introducing a new automated navigation planning system into its surface fleet that speeds up course planning and reduces the chance of human error.

 

Pull up any major news service and odds are that it will sooner or later include a story of some Navy officer whose ship has ended up on a sandbar or slammed into something that wasn't supposed to be there. Part of the reason for this is that many navigation aids are inaccurate and incomplete and it isn't surprising to learn that some charts haven't been updated since Captain Cook first drew them over two hundred years ago. The US Navy, for example, points out that in 2005 a Los Angeles-class nuclear attack submarine ran into an undersea mountain that wasn't on the chart because updated information hadn't been transferred from one source to the other. It's to avoid more costly and even life-threatening mistakes like this that the Navy started developing the Mission Planning Application.

 

http://www.gizmag.com/onr-us-navy-automated-mission-planning-application-system/35240/

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Timely. Article in Gizmag.

 

One thing that is guaranteed to put a naval ship commander in front of a court martial is running aground. Unfortunately, despite all the advances in satellite technology and other aids, navigation is still as much an art as a science and a very time-consuming one at that, with it taking days and sometimes weeks to chart out a mission. To free up captains and reduce their chances of having to answer awkward questions, the US Navy is introducing a new automated navigation planning system into its surface fleet that speeds up course planning and reduces the chance of human error.

 

Pull up any major news service and odds are that it will sooner or later include a story of some Navy officer whose ship has ended up on a sandbar or slammed into something that wasn't supposed to be there. Part of the reason for this is that many navigation aids are inaccurate and incomplete and it isn't surprising to learn that some charts haven't been updated since Captain Cook first drew them over two hundred years ago. The US Navy, for example, points out that in 2005 a Los Angeles-class nuclear attack submarine ran into an undersea mountain that wasn't on the chart because updated information hadn't been transferred from one source to the other. It's to avoid more costly and even life-threatening mistakes like this that the Navy started developing the Mission Planning Application.

 

http://www.gizmag.com/onr-us-navy-automated-mission-planning-application-system/35240/

.

.....can they make a variation that'll help me navigate christmas traffic? :mellow:

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"As a navigator you off course feel responsible"

 

Apt misspelling.

+1

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Had a browse around some alternative and less vested interest sites and there are some interesting comments out there away from SA comments.

No need to copy as those with an open mind can or will have sought out the alternative opinion themselves.

One is worth mentioning and relates to the VOR being less about sailing and more about marketing. This may seem to be stating the obvious to some keyboard warriors, but for many this may have been overlaid by the mass of additional information flying about and easily missed.

Vestas were lucky, very lucky, that no-one went over the side when they hit in the dark at speed. Many SA members and others will await the report outcomes with interest.

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Had a browse around some alternative and less vested interest sites and there are some interesting comments out there away from SA comments.

No need to copy as those with an open mind can or will have sought out the alternative opinion themselves.

One is worth mentioning and relates to the VOR being less about sailing and more about marketing. This may seem to be stating the obvious to some keyboard warriors, but for many this may have been overlaid by the mass of additional information flying about and easily missed.

Vestas were lucky, very lucky, that no-one went over the side when they hit in the dark at speed. Many SA members and others will await the report outcomes with interest.

Found a good quote online that applies;

 

"To finish first, first you have to finish."

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Found a good quote online that applies;

 

"To finish first, first you have to finish."

 

By Ron Dennis, Rick Mears, Juan Manuel Fangio, Jackie Stewart, Jack Brabham, Chrles Dickens or the Bible?

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Found a good quote online that applies;

"To finish first, first you have to finish."

By Ron Dennis, Rick Mears, Juan Manuel Fangio, Jackie Stewart, Jack Brabham, Chrles Dickens or the Bible?

Yep, take your pick...

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Very cool article/interview with Will Oxley talking about the use of paper charts and changes since Vestas' grounding, and more, e.g. DF's performance.

Looks like the navs and VOR org have picked up some ideas from here (ahem, maybe they had the ideas themselves...).

 

part 2: http://www.news.sail-world.com/Volvo_Ocean_Race__Will_Oxley___Part_2____Dongfeng_and_post_Vestas_Wind/131365

 

part 1 - for completeness: http://www.news.sail-world.com/Volvo_Ocean_Race___Will_Oxley_on_the_Race_so_far___Part_1/131328

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Interesting I noted that one of the things suggested here, i.e. a navigator's meeting to discuss hazards prior to each leg, has indeed been put in-place in an informal way.

 

Not that I think they got the idea here :)

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Thanks for the links--best review of leg 3 I've seen so far. Good to see the cooperation with teams and RC, especially the details about excluding the oilfields.

Since the Vestas Wind incident, there has been more of a safety first, race second attitude amongst the navigators.

'For the next leg I have sent a message out to the other navigators about a rock that wasn't on the charts. Dongfeng sent some comments out as well. So there is a lot of co-operation between the teams and the navigators. We understand the consequences of an error.'

'There is no organised navigational briefing as such, but the navigators have been quite proactive,’ he explains.

'Before this leg, we called a meeting, pulled out all the paper charts and said to the race committee – here is what we think is safe - using that term advisedly. We tell them that given that we have to go to a destination, here is how we want to do it.

'Then the Race Committee can firm up the Sailing Instructions. It is now quite co-operative in that respect.

'The navigators’ discussion doesn't affect the racing tactics too much. For instance, we blocked out the oilfields off Vietnam – to avoid a situation where the first yacht might get through, and the next one gets stopped by a Vietnamese patrol boat, because the oilfields are a prohibited area.

'We are bringing the seamanship/racing navigator pendulum back to the seamanship side,' he says, in conclusion.

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I found this other photo of the debris. You can see a serial number : VO65 700 101 01 A ???

 

From « Sud-Ouest » 11/08/15 : http://www.sudouest.fr/2015/08/11/disparition-du-vol-mh370-un-nouveau-debris-retrouve-a-la-reunion-2093889-4803.php

 

The article says : « Discovered by members of an association in charge of cleaning beaches, the piece measures 1.40 m high by 1 meter wide. It is composed of a part made of aluminum, stainless nuts, a carbon foot and a part made of unknown composite material. »

 

2093889_372_deb3-1200_800x533p.jpg?v=1

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Extracts from an article on Imazpress Réunion : http://www.ipreunion.com/debris-d-avion-a-saint-andre/reportage/2015/08/11/enquete-sur-le-vol-mh370-un-imposant-debris-retrouve-a-sainte-suzanne,32126.html

 

An expert in this inquiry says : « At first glance this piece seems a little too « clean » for having spent 16 months in water. I don’t see where this assembly could come from. Anyhow, not from the cargo bay or the landing gear (of a plane) » […] « If this piece probably does not come from an airplane, it could however be an element from a boat. Some Internet users feel that this is a rudder tube or a rudder wick » […]

 

« If this theory is confirmed, a parallel could be drawn with the accident of Team Vestas Wind in the Volvo Ocean Race. Last November 30th, the boat hit the Saint-Brandon (Mauritius) coral reef. The shape of the debris, its color and its location correspond to the racing sail boat that had tragically ended its leg there. »

 

Forum of Crash-aérien where they are discussing this : http://www.crash-aerien.aero/forum/malaysia-mh370-en-attendant-de-retrouver-l-avion-partie-2-t26973-9555.html

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