Bob Perry

Dave's perfect sailboat

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Stumble:

I have contacted Harken re: floating jib leads. We'll see what they have to say about any cost difference. I like the floating leads bu I'm not sure if they would be in Dave's best interest. One of my close sailmaker friends once lectured me on why cruisers should not have adjustable leads,"They will just insure that the lead is never in the right place." Something to think about.

Let's not forget that this is an old man's boat.

 

ecoute-trois-d.jpg

 

They are quite simple and work great on a reach.

 

 

 

One of the founding fathers, maybe LFH, said he stayed awake at night trying figure out how to removed lines from the rig of a boat he was designing. Whoever it was, I'm with him. I don't think I could tolerate a spider web like this.

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Understood. What kinda mileage on Francis Lee?

Beating with full main and jib into 28 knots AWS seemed to be no trouble.

The mast does not seem light to me, maybe I got one of the IRC masts because I think of it as heavy not light.

Jonathan McKee uses one on his DARK STAR which has the additional load of water ballast.

 

 

are you using the original spreaders?

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Understood. What kinda mileage on Francis Lee?

 

Beating with full main and jib into 28 knots AWS seemed to be no trouble.

The mast does not seem light to me, maybe I got one of the IRC masts because I think of it as heavy not light.

Jonathan McKee uses one on his DARK STAR which has the additional load of water ballast.

 

are you using the original spreaders?

Yes, shortened to accommodate the narrower beam. Never seen the rig pump.

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Understood. What kinda mileage on Francis Lee?

Beating with full main and jib into 28 knots AWS seemed to be no trouble.

The mast does not seem light to me, maybe I got one of the IRC masts because I think of it as heavy not light.

Jonathan McKee uses one on his DARK STAR which has the additional load of water ballast.

 

I was going to say that is exactly what Jonathan did on DARK STAR. I've only raced on the boat up to medium conditions but no issues/thoughts of a problem. They have done things lie VanIsle 360 etc in heavier conditions and offshore sea states.

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IStream:

The plan is to vent the engine through the cockpit coaming "pockets".

This is a common way to do it.

Right, Bob, I posted before I saw your note. As usual you are way ahead of me. I had not even thought of the coaming pockets. I was still stuck on the old sketch of the cockpit.

 

Thanks to you both for the clarification.[/quote

 

I was worried about noise and thinking it might be quieter if the air intake was on the transom. Otherwise I don't care.

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Understood. What kinda mileage on Francis Lee?

 

Beating with full main and jib into 28 knots AWS seemed to be no trouble.

The mast does not seem light to me, maybe I got one of the IRC masts because I think of it as heavy not light.

Jonathan McKee uses one on his DARK STAR which has the additional load of water ballast.

are you using the original spreaders?

Yes, shortened to accommodate the narrower beam. Never seen the rig pump.

Kimbottles thanks for the info on your rig. Sounds great.

 

I dug up a photo of AFR midnight rambler '98 that Rantifarian mentioned(not a f40)...very grainy...but looks like one of the offshore mods is some kind of baby stay presumably for mast support under heavily reefed sailplan.

 

IMG_0180.JPG

 

Was/is this a consideration with your set up?

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Sorry not sure how to upload JPEG off my phone

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Understood. What kinda mileage on Francis Lee?

Beating with full main and jib into 28 knots AWS seemed to be no trouble.

The mast does not seem light to me, maybe I got one of the IRC masts because I think of it as heavy not light.

Jonathan McKee uses one on his DARK STAR which has the additional load of water ballast.

 

Yours is a class spec rig.

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Stumble:

I have contacted Harken re: floating jib leads. We'll see what they have to say about any cost difference. I like the floating leads bu I'm not sure if they would be in Dave's best interest. One of my close sailmaker friends once lectured me on why cruisers should not have adjustable leads,"They will just insure that the lead is never in the right place." Something to think about.

Let's not forget that this is an old man's boat.

 

ecoute-trois-d.jpg

 

They are quite simple and work great on a reach.

 

 

 

One of the founding fathers, maybe LFH, said he stayed awake at night trying figure out how to removed lines from the rig of a boat he was designing. Whoever it was, I'm with him. I don't think I could tolerate a spider web like this.

 

Something to be said for this.

I sail mostly solo or with incompetent friends or family members. Clear access to all parts of the boat has always been something I considered as important. As I approach relic age with tinker-toy knees, fake hips, and narrow sidedecks, keeping easy access to that pointy end is important, even if I rarely need to go there.

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Ad:

We'll get to that in due time. I will leave that to Anthony at the yard. He's a wizz at that stuff., For now I am figuring two 3" maybe 4" dia holes somewhere. In the topsides? I think not. Best to hide them as I usually do.

 

I am being sold on how quiet the electric drive is. Noise then, should not be an issue. Dave's plan is to seldom run the boat on the gen set. We have massive battery banks. So noise is really not an issue. Not sure what "noise" Dave is referring to. The noise of en engine room bllower should be negligible.

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Sure Jody, blame me.

 

It's that day. I think I am going to kill my accountant. I was really not figuring paying the entire bill for the Muslim refugees. Color TV? No ;problem. Dish satellite service? No problem.

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My computer fan is probably louder when I'm doing those renders for you Bob.

For the kind of work you do, I thought you would have one of those water cooled setups on your computer!

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"You know you get the best stuff. Wait, you are getting all the stuff lately..."

 

And that is my plan. I reluctantly gave your name to another designer about a month ago. Broke my heart.

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Understood. What kinda mileage on Francis Lee?

Beating with full main and jib into 28 knots AWS seemed to be no trouble.

The mast does not seem light to me, maybe I got one of the IRC masts because I think of it as heavy not light.

Jonathan McKee uses one on his DARK STAR which has the additional load of water ballast.

are you using the original spreaders?

Yes, shortened to accommodate the narrower beam. Never seen the rig pump.

Kimbottles thanks for the info on your rig. Sounds great.

I dug up a photo of AFR midnight rambler '98 that Rantifarian mentioned(not a f40)...very grainy...but looks like one of the offshore mods is some kind of baby stay presumably for mast support under heavily reefed sailplan.

IMG_0180.JPG

Was/is this a consideration with your set up?

Nope, she is just a Daysailer.

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Soaked,

 

I need to check in on those water coolers, thought they were a joke when they first came out. I could toast a pop tart on my GPU when doing renders. I have the side of the case off and it would be real easy. I really need to upgrade the whole unit to keep up with the software advances. I just found that I could download some pretty heavy apps for doing flow analysis but don't think my 5 year old hardware could handle the loads.

 

I get by for now.

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Ad:

We'll get to that in due time. I will leave that to Anthony at the yard. He's a wizz at that stuff., For now I am figuring two 3" maybe 4" dia holes somewhere. In the topsides? I think not. Best to hide them as I usually do.

 

I am being sold on how quiet the electric drive is. Noise then, should not be an issue. Dave's plan is to seldom run the boat on the gen set. We have massive battery banks. So noise is really not an issue. Not sure what "noise" Dave is referring to. The noise of en engine room bllower should be negligible.

I was thinking of diesel induction noise.

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Soaked,

 

I need to check in on those water coolers, thought they were a joke when they first came out. I could toast a pop tart on my GPU when doing renders. I have the side of the case off and it would be real easy. I really need to upgrade the whole unit to keep up with the software advances. I just found that I could download some pretty heavy apps for doing flow analysis but don't think my 5 year old hardware could handle the loads.

 

I get by for now.

I have seen them on heavy duty gaming machines and some of the folks that mine Bitcoin use them.

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I had a water cooling system for a silicon graphics box about the size of a desk, back in the day. Whew, cranking out 1024 pixel cubes in two colors from a laser scanning microscope! We were really cooking then... It took about, what, 18 months? for a new Macintosh to come out that could do the same work for a tiny fraction of the price.

I called it "The machine that goes *ping*!"

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Not sure iv these are cost effective for this project but I just saw that Panda and Torqeedo are both offering hybrid systems. The Panda uses their enclosed sound shielded Gen sets while the Torqeedo system uses a 3 cyl Volvo generator. Torqeedo now makes several sail drive type units as well.

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another advantage of floating leads is easy adjustment of the sheeting angle - i'm not sure how much that's needed on a cruising boat

 

We definitely need to be able to adjust the sheeting angle while cruising. My boat has sheeting blocks on a track, but no easy way to adjust them under pressure. My crew will tell you that I am rather casual about sail trim, but I've rigged a line to a snatchblock on the jibsheet so I could adjust the lead from the cockpit when I was spending my night-watch roller-reefing up and down.

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You could always retrofit with these:

 

http://garhauermarine.com/catalog_process.cfm?cid=37

 

Me? Most of the time I really don't give a shit about sail trim, and would rather not add still more strings to pull. But on those few occasions when the seas and swells are up, it's 2:00 AM, and I'm on watch by myself that I give in and rig something so I don't have to keep crawling out to the side deck whenever I reed or un-reef.

 

Actually, I have considered adding adjustable cars, but I've been too lazy to get it done.

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You could always retrofit with these:

 

http://garhauermarine.com/catalog_process.cfm?cid=37

 

Me? Most of the time I really don't give a shit about sail trim, and would rather not add still more strings to pull. But on those few occasions when the seas and swells are up, it's 2:00 AM, and I'm on watch by myself that I give in and rig something so I don't have to keep crawling out to the side deck whenever I reed or un-reef.

 

Actually, I have considered adding adjustable cars, but I've been too lazy to get it done.

 

We almost always go with a second lazy sheet that is forward and outboard if we're going to be on one tack for a bit. It saves changing lead positions, we just load or unload a sheet to control athwart-ship trim and leach control.

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"Me? Most of the time I really don't give a shit about sail trim"

 

Says Valis who manages to do very well when he chooses to race his boat.

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You could always retrofit with these:

 

http://garhauermarine.com/catalog_process.cfm?cid=37

I have those on my cruising boat and they aren't bad. Pretty easy to move the car aft but you are unlikely to move it forward under load. Of course, even the high priced Harken setup needs to be winched forward on anything bigger than about 400 sq ft, even with a purchase. As it happens, you want to move the lead forward in lighter air to increase draft and aft in heavier air to add some twist. If you are going to "reef" a genoa, it's pretty easy to tug the lead forward a bit while you are rolling up a couple of turns. I give the Garhauer setup a thumbs up for cost effectiveness. If I were building new, no question that I would spec the Harken track and cars.

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For most cruising boats I don't see a real need for moving jib leads under load. Just luff the jib and move the car. You are not racing.

I love adjustable leads, I have used them nay times. But they add clutter to the deck and bring more lines back to the cockpit. I have never owned a boat with adjustable leads and I have survived just fine.

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Stumble:

I have contacted Harken re: floating jib leads. We'll see what they have to say about any cost difference. I like the floating leads bu I'm not sure if they would be in Dave's best interest. One of my close sailmaker friends once lectured me on why cruisers should not have adjustable leads,"They will just insure that the lead is never in the right place." Something to think about.

Let's not forget that this is an old man's boat.

ecoute-trois-d.jpg

 

They are quite simple and work great on a reach.

Theres alot of spaghetti there, now add a jackline to that pic.

 

I cant see working that hard on a cruising boat, guess I'm just a caveman now who likes keeping things simple.

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For most cruising boats I don't see a real need for moving jib leads under load. Just luff the jib and move the car. You are not racing.

 

I've tried that but the sheets whip around with the jib luffing. Is there a way to prevent this?

 

I have a padeye on a car forward of the jib lead that I use to take the load off by lashing from the padeye to the sheet with an icicle hitch. That frees the car so it can be moved.

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Sometimes it's easier to set the lazy side lead to the right position, tack and move the old lead, and tack back.

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The other alternative is to have one normal inboard track and use the spinnaker guy/sheet on a barber hauler as a short sheet, flexible especially if the hauler can be moved easily. It saves you one track and you can still reach using full power of the jib. That's a 4 strings set up but if you have a kite, the kite sheets + barber already exist. I can't stand the sight of a half powered twisted jib, on a reach it is easy to loose 1 knot like this, doesn't really matter on an afternoon round the bay sail but it can add up, on a passage that's 24NM (3 to 4 hours) per day.

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Pano:

I'm with you on the twisted jib. Drives me crazy. We will first need to know what Dave's initial sail inventory will be. I suspect it will not include a chute or light air genoa right away. That will have a bearing on where I put the outboard track.

 

kdh:

No. The only way to avoid that is to do it Ish's way and tack over, make the change and tack back. I'd prefer to let the sheets whip around for 30 seconds. I'm suggesting you keep the jib sheeted in and head the boat up s the jib luffs. That minimizes the amount of sheet you have whipping. I guess in the end it may depend upon the conditions and your mood.

 

Hobs:

I think you are right.

 

Tomorrow Dave and I meet with Jim Betts for THE BIG MEETING to get things started. That should be fun. The idea of having both Dave's boat and the carbon cutters underway in the same yard makes me happy. I am trying to target future builds on the Betts yard. It's so convenient for me and I can act as owner's rep to a large degree given my frequency at the yard. Hell, maybe I'll have to go up even more. Damn!

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For most cruising boats I don't see a real need for moving jib leads under load. Just luff the jib and move the car. You are not racing.

 

I've tried that but the sheets whip around with the jib luffing. Is there a way to prevent this?

 

I have a padeye on a car forward of the jib lead that I use to take the load off by lashing from the padeye to the sheet with an icicle hitch. That frees the car so it can be moved.

 

KDH, best way to reposition a pinned lead is with another set of tracks and a lazy sheet. Load the lazy sheet, ease the primary sheet, move the primary pinned lead, reload the primary sheet and unload the lazy sheet. This is how it was done forever before Harken introduced adjustable lead systems.

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Ish:

But you have the advantage of the alu toe rail and all those convenient holes. I do not want to drill a bunch of holes in Dave 's pristine, seamless, hull to deck joint. We could do it with pad eyes but I like having an outboard track.

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Ish:

But you have the advantage of the alu toe rail and all those convenient holes. I do not want to drill a bunch of holes in Dave 's pristine, seamless, hull to deck joint. We could do it with pad eyes but I like having an outboard track.

 

Yes, the toe rail is handy. No reason not to have an outboard track instead.

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i like this sort of thing to replace that darn toe-rail.....

 

of course, you could also just drop in one of this soft pad-eyes

 

But no reason a 2nd track wouldn't work just fine

 

IMG_2308.jpg

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Cheap and cheerful.

 

approaching%20Merry.jpg

Holy Phuquoly Ish. Your boat? C&C right? I'm gunna wager a 36? If so mine's a little bigger. More in common eh? Friggin' scary!

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Here is another thought about jib leads. On my old boat my 130% working jib sheeted way back like Ish's photo and I could reach the pin on the car from the cockpit. On the new boat with a modern rig, big main and working 110% jib it is way forward so I would have to leave the cockpit and walk 10 feet down the deck to adjust it. The adjustable harken system does add more lines to fuss with, but works great. Like a lot of things in life if it easier to do, we are more likely to use it and I find I adjust the cars more than I thought I would.

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On my Dad's boat, we had a block and a line with a fifi hook on the end. When an outboard lead was required, we would clip the block to a car on the toe-rail track, run the line outboard of the lifelines and hook the clew with the fifi hook. It was simple, quick, and gave the best possible lead.

 

Dang Maxx, you get to sail in a beautiful place.

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Shu:

What is a "fifi" hook? That's a new one on me. I'm imagining a woman pirate with one hand and a fifi hook on the other arm.

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Hinckley integrate attachment points for a snatch block into the stanchion bases so I can use Ish's trick to get the lead outboard.

 

103618_1_zoom.jpg

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Usually we just reposition the lazy block on the track and then tack (eventually, or immediately, depending on stuff). When we *need* to adjust the loaded sheet lead and I don't have a brave, strong, crewmember volunteer to force things into place (sometimes that volunteer is me, usually not), I rig that snatchblock around the sheet and run the barberhauler (?) lead through the spinnaker guy block that usually lives at the forward end of the outboard track. I run the lead back to a secondary cockpit winch. With this setup I usually don't even need to slide the sheet block on the track.

 

There's no compelling reason not to use a snap shackle like Ish does, but I have a bunch of snatch blocks that need to earn their keep. If I plan to leave it in place the block is probably kinder to the sheet.

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Cheap and cheerful.

 

approaching%20Merry.jpg

Holy Phuquoly Ish. Your boat? C&C right? I'm gunna wager a 36? If so mine's a little bigger. More in common eh? Friggin' scary!

 

 

35-3.

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Sorry guys; it's a climbing term. I mixed my vernaculars. I was thinking of this. Valis showed a true climbing fifi hook.

post-13071-0-06055000-1460658585_thumb.jpg

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Shu:

That's what I figured it was.

Knock off that vernacular mixing!

 

kdh:

Our stanchions are not going to have bases. They will come out of pipes glassed into the inside of the hull. Those eyes you show are very useful but I'm not sure I'd put a sheet lead block on them.

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Bob,

Woman pirate hook. I like that (or maybe not; I don't think I like what she would do with it). The image in my mind is of someone guiding a herd of poodles with one of these. Hence a "Fifi" hook.

 

Check spelling. Check grammar. Check attachments are included. Check vernaculars are unmixed. OK, post.

post-13071-0-79866200-1460658965_thumb.jpg

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Cheap and cheerful.

 

approaching%20Merry.jpg

I love it, Ish. The holey rail earns its keep again. There are more snatch blocks in my future.

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better than a snatch block for many applications - the Antal hook

 

definitely stronger than the typical snatch block and lighter too

 

 

image_2332.jpg

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Stumble:

I have contacted Harken re: floating jib leads. We'll see what they have to say about any cost difference. I like the floating leads bu I'm not sure if they would be in Dave's best interest. One of my close sailmaker friends once lectured me on why cruisers should not have adjustable leads,"They will just insure that the lead is never in the right place." Something to think about.

 

Let's not forget that this is an old man's boat.

ecoute-trois-d.jpg

 

They are quite simple and work great on a reach.

 

One of the founding fathers, maybe LFH, said he stayed awake at night trying figure out how to removed lines from the rig of a boat he was designing. Whoever it was, I'm with him. I don't think I could tolerate a spider web like this.

I was thinking the same thing.

My jib sheets are currently ran through my shrouds which is admittedly a stupid way to do things but that is how the PO did it for racing. I have little desire to bolt a track on to the cabin top for a sail we use three times a year.

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Hinckley integrate attachment points for a snatch block into the stanchion bases so I can use Ish's trick to get the lead outboard.

 

103618_1_zoom.jpg

KDH

 

I have similar stanchions to yours and rebedded most of my deck fittings a couple of years ago . You can check, but I'm betting yours have no backing plates and are not up to the load especially at an extreme sheeting angle.

 

As Bob mentioned the eyes at the stanchion base are still useful.

 

For me the only use has been for lashing bumpers while at the dock.

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I could be wrong but I have a recollection of shackling a vang to one of those once with success. They are so damned convenient.

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I have the same stanchion bases on my boat. I agree with others, not the place for a high load. They do make really strong bases, though.

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Cheap and cheerful.

 

approaching%20Merry.jpg

 

I'd replace the SS hook. IME, they're susceptible to crevice corrosion and brittle failure and they can snag stuff. I've removed all of them from my boats. There are lots of better options. Some of them both better and cheaper (eg. locking "revolver" carabiners).

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Cheap and cheerful.

 

approaching%20Merry.jpg

 

I'd replace the SS hook. IME, they're susceptible to crevice corrosion and brittle failure and they can snag stuff. I've removed all of them from my boats. There are lots of better options. Some of them both better and cheaper (eg. locking "revolver" carabiners).

 

Rule,

 

I've got pretty much the same rig on my boat, which is incidentally a 2' larger version of Ish's. Are you suggesting climbing locking carabiners? ETA: as in REI?

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Hobs:

I hear "Chingadera" at the boat yard all the time.

Watch out then, as next you'll be eating lunch warmed up on a hot plate and listening to incredibly fast talking DJ's on a tinny sounding AM radio!

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better than a snatch block for many applications - the Antal hook

 

definitely stronger than the typical snatch block and lighter too

 

 

image_2332.jpg

This might be getting off topic in terms of Daves boat but here's another approach to sheeting a non overlapping headsail. It still uses jibcar tracks but with a strop and ring set up...or something like this Antal unit...for fine tuning. Pretty clean.

 

 

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Cheap and cheerful.

 

approaching%20Merry.jpg

 

I'd replace the SS hook. IME, they're susceptible to crevice corrosion and brittle failure and they can snag stuff. I've removed all of them from my boats. There are lots of better options. Some of them both better and cheaper (eg. locking "revolver" carabiners).

 

 

Well, after ten years they still look and operate like new and I have never snagged stuff (knock on wood). So far so good.

 

Edit: the turning block on the rail is the most likely failure spot, being tiny Harken bullet blocks. Everything is hand-tensioned, so it's not like there is a lot of pressure. Deflecting a line is much less work than running a new one to a winch.

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Cheap and cheerful.

 

approaching%20Merry.jpg

 

I'd replace the SS hook. IME, they're susceptible to crevice corrosion and brittle failure and they can snag stuff. I've removed all of them from my boats. There are lots of better options. Some of them both better and cheaper (eg. locking "revolver" carabiners).

 

Rule,

 

I've got pretty much the same rig on my boat, which is incidentally a 2' larger version of Ish's. Are you suggesting climbing locking carabiners? ETA: as in REI?

 

Yes, a locking carabiner would be a better option -- less likely to fail, less likely to fail catastrophically, less likely to snag something, lighter and cheaper... YMMV, of course :)... REI has good prices on them. There are lots of other good options. The simplest, if you have a free winch, might be to just do away with the hook and bend the line on as an outboard sheet. You can use a rolling hitch to attach it to the existing sheet. That setup gives good control but you need to work both sheets. In any case, I would not use one of those SS hooks for ~~any~~ work where a failure could hurt someone.

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Be careful with the locking REI-type carabiners. Generally, they are made of aluminum with press-fit and possibly peened-ended carbon steel pins. The aluminum will do fine in a marine environment, the little steel pins -- not so much.

 

Also, the locking mechanism is no guarantee they will not open. I have personally witnessed a single locking carabiner unlock and open by being dragged across the rock, while it was the only thing between my friend and the ground. Fortunately, the rope stayed in the open carabiner, at which point it was acting more like a fifi hook (ooh I got to say that again).

 

Then again, a jib barber hauler isn't a life-or-death piece of equipment; I'll crawl back in my cave now.

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It's only when I get a drawing posted here that I notice what is missing.

 

Cooper%20deck%204-14-16_zpshdwt8dwg.jpg

The keel?

 

 

I don't see a vang listed...

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The easiest course I took in college was called "Statics." It was an 11:00 class. The professor used to talk about how much he loved lunch, which he'd eat after class. I always imagined he went home to eat soup and a sandwich.

 

Anyway, I used to go to class but I skipped the homework and just took the tests. Sum of the forces = 0 was all anyone had to know.

 

Ish is completely right. There's little load on that block.

 

And, the good people at Hinckley attach those bases to be sufficient for almost anything.

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Semi has it! The keel. You win a weekend at the shack Semi. It would be my pleasure.

 

Ish:

I would not spec the vang on the deck plan. That would be part of the rig spec. But if you look carefully you will see a line indicating a vang.

 

I forgot the roller furling drum. That's part of the rig too but the lead blocks to bring the furling line aft should be on this drawing.

My dog is supposed to check the drawings for this stuff.

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The easiest course I took in college was called "Statics." It was an 11:00 class. The professor used to talk about how much he loved lunch, which he'd eat after class. I always imagined he went home to eat soup and a sandwich.

 

Anyway, I used to go to class but I skipped the homework and just took the tests. Sum of the forces = 0 was all anyone had to know.

 

Ish is completely right. There's little load on that block.

 

And, the good people at Hinckley attach those bases to be sufficient for almost anything.

Go for it then. Call the good people at Hinckley, or if they don't pick up, call your professor when/if your sheeting angle gets too extreme and you rip your stanchion out of the deck.

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Be careful with the locking REI-type carabiners. Generally, they are made of aluminum with press-fit and possibly peened-ended carbon steel pins. The aluminum will do fine in a marine environment, the little steel pins -- not so much.

 

Also, the locking mechanism is no guarantee they will not open. I have personally witnessed a single locking carabiner unlock and open by being dragged across the rock, while it was the only thing between my friend and the ground. Fortunately, the rope stayed in the open carabiner, at which point it was acting more like a fifi hook (ooh I got to say that again).

 

Then again, a jib barber hauler isn't a life-or-death piece of equipment; I'll crawl back in my cave now.

Shu,

Thanks for that. I was concerned about the "bits" in a climbing carabiner in a marine environment. Yes, if it lets go probably not too big a deal.

 

Ish,

Using a rolling hitch is probably a bit too much fussing for me for the short legs that I do in our sailing area but a good idea nonetheless.

 

Apologies for dragging the the thread slightly off-topic of Bob's beautiful design.

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The easiest course I took in college was called "Statics." It was an 11:00 class. The professor used to talk about how much he loved lunch, which he'd eat after class. I always imagined he went home to eat soup and a sandwich.

 

Anyway, I used to go to class but I skipped the homework and just took the tests. Sum of the forces = 0 was all anyone had to know.

 

Ish is completely right. There's little load on that block.

 

And, the good people at Hinckley attach those bases to be sufficient for almost anything.

Go for it then. Call the good people at Hinckley, or if they don't pick up, call your professor when/if your sheeting angle gets too extreme and you rip your stanchion out of the deck.

 

 

Why would it do that? The idea is to ease out what I call a twing as you sheet in, so the loads are kept manageable. I don't usually bring it in to play unless the sheet is eased already. This is a tool for adjusting the lead for reaching, not for fine-tuning upwind adjustments.

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The easiest course I took in college was called "Statics." It was an 11:00 class. The professor used to talk about how much he loved lunch, which he'd eat after class. I always imagined he went home to eat soup and a sandwich.

 

Anyway, I used to go to class but I skipped the homework and just took the tests. Sum of the forces = 0 was all anyone had to know.

 

Ish is completely right. There's little load on that block.

 

And, the good people at Hinckley attach those bases to be sufficient for almost anything.

 

you should have also taken the dynamics class - but it's a lot harder...

 

i have seen huge snatch blocks explode in that application.

 

it's not really a statics problem, at least not once you leave the dock

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Don't use a carabiner if you don't know it's origins. I've seen some that wouldn't hold the weight of a man which were manufactured just to be "technical" decoration.

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I wish I could remember the Statics professor's name. He convinced me I didn't want to be a professor.

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Don't use a carabiner if you don't know it's origins. I've seen some that wouldn't hold the weight of a man which were manufactured just to be "technical" decoration.

 

I use the "genius" carabiner made by Kong in Italy.

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Don't use a carabiner if you don't know it's origins. I've seen some that wouldn't hold the weight of a man which were manufactured just to be "technical" decoration.

Good point.

 

FWIW, according to the West Marine catalogue the 2 3/4" version of the stainless carabiner has a breaking strength of ~66~ lbs. The 3 1/8" goes up to 450 lbs force (similar to a single strand of lash-it). The 5" version (which is pretty hefty) has a "breaking strength" listed at 1124 which is still a lot less than the typical 7ish kilonewton AL biner. The thing is I've had two marine SS carabiners break into bits as a result of crevice corrosion. Shards of metal is not a nice failure mode. I don' t think that style of marine SS biner is seaworthy.

 

http://www.westmarine.com/buy/west-marine--stainless-steel-carabiners--P002_060_002_002

 

Apologies for the diversion. Back to the cool boat.

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Don't use a carabiner if you don't know it's origins. I've seen some that wouldn't hold the weight of a man which were manufactured just to be "technical" decoration.

I use the "genius" carabiner made by Kong in Italy.

I use those too. The 3" model is good for 1800 lbs tension, the 4" for 2700.

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Don't use a carabiner if you don't know it's origins. I've seen some that wouldn't hold the weight of a man which were manufactured just to be "technical" decoration.

Good point.

 

FWIW, according to the West Marine catalogue the 2 3/4" version of the stainless carabiner has a breaking strength of ~66~ lbs. The 3 1/8" goes up to 450 lbs force (similar to a single strand of lash-it). The 5" version (which is pretty hefty) has a "breaking strength" listed at 1124 which is still a lot less than the typical 7ish kilonewton AL biner. The thing is I've had two marine SS carabiners break into bits as a result of crevice corrosion. Shards of metal is not a nice failure mode. I don' t think the marine SS biners are seaworthy.

 

http://www.westmarine.com/buy/west-marine--stainless-steel-carabiners--P002_060_002_002

 

Apologies for the diversion. Back to the cool boat.

 

 

Absolutely you have to know what kind of gear you are working with. WM has once again sourced the minimum spec.

The carabiners I use are rated for a SWL of 750 lbs. I know they aren't perfect, but they do the job for me. This is Cruising, after all.

 

Life is thread drift.

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If you're not breaking stuff, you're not pushing hard enough.

But breaking stuff is slow.

I guess there's a fine line between clever and stupid.

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If you're not breaking stuff, you're not pushing hard enough.

But breaking stuff is slow.

I guess there's a fine line between clever and stupid.

 

And I keep pushing it. The fine line, that is.

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If you're not breaking stuff, you're not pushing hard enough.

But breaking stuff is slow.

I guess there's a fine line between clever and stupid.

I'm guessing your being facetious. I'm with you on this one in a cruising/daysailing context...move the jib car on the next tack if it's that big a deal. Keep it simple and don't break it.

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I ended up with a dozen caribiners; Diamond brand, actual climbing hardware.

 

Really useful all around, anchor kellet, among other things. Hadn't thought of them for barber haulers, but that would work - they are made for passing rope.

 

None of them last more than about 6 months for me before the aluminum corrosion gums up the works.

 

I do have one Kong brand that is holding up better; the stainless 'bail' type gate seems untouched after several years.

 

The 'kayak paddle' version has a big opening, snaps on to stanchions.

 

432378.jpg

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I think the ability to adjust is important and worth the effort.

 

Probably the most often you will use it is two sail reach passage making on a set course with a shifting breeze where you don't really want to tack.

 

I hate seeing the top 3rd of a headsail flogging itself to death because the lead angle is wrong.

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