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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  
Bob Perry

My newest project

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Bob, if the engine needs a crane-out ever, is there clearance in the commander's hatch to simply go straight up and out.

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On 5/25/2017 at 11:24 AM, fastyacht said:

WOW BRENT SWAIN YOU ARE TRULY A DOOSHER.
JUST KEEP IT UP.  POLLUTING EVERY THREAD YOU CAN WITH GROUNDLESS ACCUSATIONS NOW? RUN OUT OF ICE CREAM? OR MONEY TO BUY ICE CREAM? DID THE CANADIAN WELFARE AGENCY CUT YOU OFF? OR DID YOUR SISTER CHANGE THE LOCKS? IS YOUR MUDSKIPPER TIPPED OVER ON THE FLATS AND ALL FULL OF MUD AND UNINHABITABLE? WHATEVER IT IS, YOU REALLY LOOK LIKE AN IDIOTIC FOOLISH LITTLE PETULANT TWIT WITH NOT ONE BUT TWO POSTINGS OF THAT ACCUSATION.

 

captured.PNG

BS needs to get hit with the Ban Hammer.

 

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Imagine the response...

"That's a typical overpriced type of hammer used by marina queen admins driving to the treadmill each day in their plastic death traps . Real cruisers collect nephrolithites from whales to pound halfwits flat. But they wouldn't understand that because they haven't been a halfwit for nearly as many years as a true 'swain. Schadenfreude on the rocks!"

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43 minutes ago, MauiPunter said:

BS needs to get hit with the Ban Hammer.

 

I banned him, he is on ignore .

one day he will post and no one will notice

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HFC:

Interesting question and ironically there is clearance. The engine would go straight up and out the opening for the fly bridge! Brilliant accident of design.

Thanks.

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I dislike this project. Where are the two 1000hp Mercrusers and centerline gas turbine?  I see no mention of a furry trimmed suedo leather interior.  Has anyone ordered all of miles of gold chain for the owners neck?  What model agency are you using for the bikini babes for the all important Designer at the helm, babes on the sunpad shot...... where is the sunpad?  New dog is needed and lets forget about the cat.  Bob needs a Pit bull with gold chain around the neck.

This boat will never cut it in Miami.  Lots of rework to be done here. 

 

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Kent I've looked in vain for photos of those motor boats I rememer at the winter boat shows as a kid. Yo urememer them: sparlky purple or green metallic paint with LARGE metal flakes, and under the forepeak there was this intoxicsating styrene odour and shag carpet everywhere that the bed wasn't.

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8 hours ago, Kent H said:

I dislike this project. Where are the two 1000hp Mercrusers and centerline gas turbine?  I see no mention of a furry trimmed suedo leather interior.  Has anyone ordered all of miles of gold chain for the owners neck?  What model agency are you using for the bikini babes for the all important Designer at the helm, babes on the sunpad shot...... where is the sunpad?  New dog is needed and lets forget about the cat.  Bob needs a Pit bull with gold chain around the neck.

This boat will never cut it in Miami.  Lots of rework to be done here. 

 

https://g.co/kgs/4Fgg2a

 

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On May 27, 2017 at 8:38 PM, fastyacht said:

Kent I've looked in vain for photos of those motor boats I rememer at the winter boat shows as a kid. Yo urememer them: sparlky purple or green metallic paint with LARGE metal flakes, and under the forepeak there was this intoxicsating styrene odour and shag carpet everywhere that the bed wasn't.

Any boat painted metal flake has to be named ending with '...ator'... Terminator, Devastator, Intimidator, etc. I think it's a law.

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3 minutes ago, RKoch said:

Any boat painted metal flake has to be named ending with '...ator'... Terminator, Devastator, Intimidator, etc. I think it's a law.

...Masturbator...

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not if you spell it: N SYNCerator

 

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IA theme!  I forgot about a theme song as well.  The lifespan of gasoline powered go fasts in salt water is short.  I was in either Texas or Oklahoma and went by a junk yard that took powerboats and RVs. They had alot of those Miami Vice crazy colored boats. Cut them up and take all the metal parts. 

Bob"s non-commercial power projects usually have a healthy dose of engineering and style. Like his 44 foot double ender which can be your picnic boat yet have insane range, protected prop and still do 25 knots....Try getting all that from a Hinckley. Bob were you ever involved in one of those Miami Vice style go fast projects?  

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2 hours ago, Kent H said:

IA theme!  I forgot about a theme song as well.  The lifespan of gasoline powered go fasts in salt water is short.  I was in either Texas or Oklahoma and went by a junk yard that took powerboats and RVs. They had alot of those Miami Vice crazy colored boats. Cut them up and take all the metal parts. 

Bob"s non-commercial power projects usually have a healthy dose of engineering and style. Like his 44 foot double ender which can be your picnic boat yet have insane range, protected prop and still do 25 knots....Try getting all that from a Hinckley. Bob were you ever involved in one of those Miami Vice style go fast projects?  

I'm not sure about currently, but in the past they were largely designed and built in the SE Florida area. I think there was an Italian guy designing some, also. Bahamas is just a couple of hours away for those guys, although mostly they just run up and down the ICW and bays.

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58 minutes ago, Tom Scott said:

 SPHINCTOR

You could do some interesting artwork with the "O".

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I remember back when Bob used to post pictures of his weekly visits to the shop in this thread. C'mon Bob....we want to see the progress on the boats! Please!!

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33 minutes ago, il1395 said:

I remember back when Bob used to post pictures of his weekly visits to the shop in this thread. C'mon Bob....we want to see the progress on the boats! Please!!

I'd even take "ugly" photos of a hull in yellow vomit colored primer.

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1395 & RedRyder:

I am just back from the yard. I should go water the front garden first but then I'll post some photos of the cutter project. Not a lot to see today. Hull No. 1 is totally tented over.

I'll post what I have. Thanks for asking.

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Fast:

We have had a run of dry days here. Wife tore a muscle in her back. Now she just gives me orders. Fact is I enjoy watering.

 

Here are some pics from the yard today as promised. I think they are self explanatory but I'll answer any questions.

026_zpsqufuzaqu.jpg

008_zpsdlft4xxy.jpg

017_zpsrndqcasq.jpg

014_zpsdt6nvsf3.jpg

001_zpsdxc2ursv.jpg

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Fast:

Yes, Hull No. 2 is partially tented while they paint the interior. But I was taken by how cool it looked with the almost pilot house like tent in place. Short pilot house, long flush deck forward, long deep cockpit cuddy cabin style aft cabin? Could be fun to draw up.

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16 minutes ago, Bob Perry said:

SDSF:

Yes, they are both waterlines. The lower one being the DWL and the upper one being the upper one. I'd guess it's the 24" AWL.

AWL????

Unlikely to be any of the meanings i found at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Awl: Academic Word List // Aircraft warning light // Alliance for Workers' Liberty // Arizona Winter League

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Leggs:

I have always used "AWL" to indicate waterlines "Above the Water Line".

"BWL" meaning Below the Water Line.

It's very common. At least in my little world.

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10 minutes ago, Bob Perry said:

I have always used "AWL" to indicate waterlines "Above the Water Line".

"BWL" meaning Below the Water Line.

It's very common. At least in my little world.

Thanks, Bob.  Specialist terminology, which I like learning.  Makes perfect sense once you know, but I was getting nowhere guessing the A

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4 hours ago, TwoLegged said:

Thanks, Bob.  Specialist terminology, which I like learning.  Makes perfect sense once you know, but I was getting nowhere guessing the A

There are so many nooks and crannies in this business.
I like the AWL thing.
BWL for me is waterline beam.
We reference to baseline not waterline in my work (commercial). So ABL for above baseline and OCL for off center line.

My first design was goofy. For some reason the 3" BWL became the BL in that one and my offsets table was all referenced from that, so some were below and others above. Back in the hand drawn days it was a pain to change stuff after you started or at least I think that is my excuse. But I wish I'd thought of AWL and BWL. Would have simplified terminology!

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12 hours ago, fastyacht said:

Back in the hand drawn days it was a pain to change stuff after you started or at least I think that is my excuse.

I once drew an entire inboard profile with the sole at the wrong height, I stared at that drawing for an hour trying to figure out an easy way to correct it. Had to redraw it.

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Whoa, that is one hell of an electronics panel, that thing has more switches than a 727... ok maybe a Cessna. Is it common to have redundant radios mounted together like that? Is the purpose for one to be a backup, or so that you can monitor multiple channels simultaneously. Finally what is that design on the computer screen? It looks related to that titanium artwork you teased us with a while back.

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4 minutes ago, Mizzmo said:

Whoa, that is one hell of an electronics panel, that thing has more switches than a 727... ok maybe a Cessna. Is it common to have redundant radios mounted together like that? Is the purpose for one to be a backup, or so that you can monitor multiple channels simultaneously. Finally what is that design on the computer screen? It looks related to that titanium artwork you teased us with a while back.

Pet peeve: mic' left lying on the chart table rather than its holster. Grrr. :)

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Mizzy:

We have back ups for our back ups.

The yard is starting a 60' titanium beach cat for Hawaii. Will is working on that project nesting all the framing pieces for CNC cutting. It might be water jet cutting I'm not sure.

Will is proving to be very good at the job.

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13 hours ago, fastyacht said:

There are so many nooks and crannies in this business.
I like the AWL thing.
BWL for me is waterline beam.
We reference to baseline not waterline in my work (commercial). So ABL for above baseline and OCL for off center line.

That's what we use too.

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Stopped by to see the cutters today, #1 is truly a work of art, they were masking off to put the non skid on the deck, digging into the bones of the boat the systems execution is flawless, met the young Will Porter and had a great tour from Neal.  If any of you anarchists have a chance to get to Anacortes and stop by Betts' shop do it, boat 2 is coming along well and 3 is looking like an upside down beached whale.  Seeing the progress and seeing the sophistication of design and build is amazing.  As a side note, to see the progress from concept to reality puts design and experience into perspective.  At the risk of being politically incorrect how can an amateur backyard wanta be lying POS steel boat jerk off criticize the actual process of yacht design and build.

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Nice to see Wall Street Duck is going to be revived, Heart of Gold (Schumacher 50) is getting ready to launch and lordy, lordy, Cassiopeia took a major hit in Alaska, will be quite a structural rebuild before they hang the dented keel back on her.  Really great to see quality boat builders flourishing in our little corner of the US of A.  I love hanging around boat yards and quality builders...

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Is that what happened to Cassiopeia?

I have some pics I took of it somewhere of her pretty much sitting in the dirt at the MarineService Center yard with no keel and the hull all beat up.

Was one hell of a race boat back in the day.

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On 6/7/2017 at 5:17 PM, Bob Perry said:

Fast:

Yes, Hull No. 2 is partially tented while they paint the interior. But I was taken by how cool it looked with the almost pilot house like tent in place. Short pilot house, long flush deck forward, long deep cockpit cuddy cabin style aft cabin? Could be fun to draw up.

Would love to see that version...!

Looking good Bob!!

fs

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Mizzy:

One thing for sure on this project, we have back ups. 

Sitting here with Will Porter mucking around with boat designs. Will is making a 3D model of Kim's powerboat. Nice way to spend a Saturday. If you like designing boats.

willyy%202_zpsgpcbjhd8.jpg

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I think Will P. should grow out those mutton chops.  Add a pipe and the picture would be complete. 

Steve

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Leave the kid alone - stop trying to turn him into an old fart. ;)

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Yeah, He's fine the way he is. He ate a huge T bone steak last night. I nibbled at a New York. He's made very good progress on Kim's P boat today.He's very good at anticipating what I am after. That makes working together enjoyable.

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2 hours ago, SloopJonB said:

Leave the kid alone - stop trying to turn him into an old fart. ;)

Nothing wrong with that ...

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7 hours ago, olaf hart said:

Nothing wrong with that ...

In the fullness of time. Another 40 or so years of life experience and he'll be getting close.

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True, but imagine how it would be to start out knowing the lessons that forty years teaches you.

Nothing like a good mentor ....

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On 5/9/2017 at 8:55 AM, kimbottles said:

Right, but piping is more my style.

Which blows the bottom out of the Colregs; All vessels will willingly (eagerly!) give way to one bearing a piper, regardless of means of propulsion, post haste.

 

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46 minutes ago, olaf hart said:

True, but imagine how it would be to start out knowing the lessons that forty years teaches you.

Nothing like a good mentor ....

Especially with women....

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7 hours ago, Whisper said:

Especially with women....

That's his father's job.

did you know boys get most of their intelligence from their mothers?

marry the smart ones, the others are just for practice .....

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Bob and I have been hard at work this weekend on making a model for his new 60' powerboat design. Here's one of the first images. We are planning to make some renderings of the boat over the next few days. 

2.JPG

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That's a fine looking craft. Just to pick a nit, that arch needs to do more than hold a radome to justify its existence.

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Good. I think the arch looks out of place as it is.

I had an idea (uh oh) and it doesn't *necessarily* break the simplicity rule. You know the backup cameras on cars? What if it had a forward looking camera along the same lines as the auto backup cameras? My boss's F150 has one that can show a 360 overhead. It's not aftermarket - it's factory. I can't tell you how envious I am of that feature.

Since it's usually just me out at the farm, I tend to 'feel' for trailers when I hook up. Because of that, my rear bumper is trashed and sometimes in tight corners, it gets a little hairy. Having that display would eliminate a lot of issues.

Hell, some of the new trucks have systems where you touch the screen for where you want to back stuff up and the truck does it for you! I like backing equipment though. It took a lot to get really good at it, but my friends tend to have me back their boats in at the ramp because it's one thing I can do like a pro.

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That arch looks like something you picked up cheap from a garage sale and the sticker on the base reads " Arches 'R Us Tucumcari NM ".

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If I paid attention to what the rabble wanted there never would have been a Valiant 40.

Yes, in 3D it's apparent that with the added rake of the house sides and it's echoed effect on the support posts aft the arch as drawn will not work.

I will try a more traditional approach to the mast. Well,,,,sorta ,kinda traditional.

I will never "design by majority".

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Bob, please humor me with a minute of your time for a short bit of thread drift.

My wife just came down with frozen shoulder, a nasty, painful muscle condition. The Dr. wrote an Rx but told her to put castor oil on a piece of cotton, apply to the sore area and wrap with saran wrap or similar. Over night she was able to use her arm again and the vast majority of the pain was gone. Freakin' amazing. 

Possibly your wife would be willing to give it a whirl with her back.

Good luck.

 

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11 hours ago, Bob Perry said:

If I paid attention to what the rabble wanted there never would have been a Valiant 40.

.....

I will never "design by majority".

Thanks for sticking to your ideas. There are too many examples of group thinking leading to all looking the same. 

A typical car of today looks like

vw.jpg.5e4901c297d891843ccebafc6a9e805e.jpg

(bland & boring, nearly all sedans of today looks like this. ) 

 

and nobody dares to do something like this any more:

593e8877b6d74_CitroenDS21Pallas.thumb.jpg.53a65c670de81addfa6a540387fa5942.jpg

 

I sporadically folllow this thread is it gives some insight in boat design, reasoning, decisions and speculations.  

The Arch? I like it, it gives a statement / signature. At the same time, wouldn't be surprised if it will be changed. 

 

//J

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Frozen shoulder? Thaw it on the kitchen bench. Rub with salt, pepper, rosemary. Stab-stuff garlic cloves into it. Annoying with vin rouge. Slooooooooow cook that thing while basting regularly. Allow to rest for ages, and then some - and carve with a big knife.

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Anointing is better than annoying. Damn spell Czech. Especially with red wine and a good shoulder roast.

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37 minutes ago, Jaramaz said:

Thanks for sticking to your ideas. There are too many examples of group thinking leading to all looking the same. 

A typical car of today looks like

vw.jpg.5e4901c297d891843ccebafc6a9e805e.jpg

(bland & boring, nearly all sedans of today looks like this. ) 

 

and nobody dares to do something like this any more:

593e8877b6d74_CitroenDS21Pallas.thumb.jpg.53a65c670de81addfa6a540387fa5942.jpg

 

 

I believe it was Gordon Buehrig who said - back in the 30's - "Take the wind tunnels away from designers or all cars will look the same" (or words to that effect).

He was right.

Quick quiz - when was that Citroen designed?

 

 

 

Answer - early 1950's. It went on the market in 1955.

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Not to try to turn this into a PA topic, but it's CAFE limits that are driving all cars to look the same...

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It's laziness and cowardice, not CAFE. Being creative within limits is one of the hallmarks of talent.

It would be interesting to see a histogram of cars ordered by Cd. Many would be similar but there'd be interesting outliers in every bin.

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The Saab 93f and the Lotus Europa were very sleek and even today hold up visually.  When you mandate results you kill vision.

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2 hours ago, Jaramaz said:

Thanks for sticking to your ideas. There are too many examples of group thinking leading to all looking the same. 

A typical car of today looks like

vw.jpg.5e4901c297d891843ccebafc6a9e805e.jpg

(bland & boring, nearly all sedans of today looks like this. ) 

 

and nobody dares to do something like this any more:

593e8877b6d74_CitroenDS21Pallas.thumb.jpg.53a65c670de81addfa6a540387fa5942.jpg

 

I sporadically folllow this thread is it gives some insight in boat design, reasoning, decisions and speculations.  

The Arch? I like it, it gives a statement / signature. At the same time, wouldn't be surprised if it will be changed. 

 

//J

Plenty of examples of "different" designs.  Some are less appealing.

AR-150909877.jpg

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Hey I own one of those VW Passats. At least half a dozen times I've tried to open somebody else's Toyota or Honda  thinking it was my ride. If you don't look closely, it's hard to distinguish one from another. :wacko:

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HI, haven't been following,  see some  cars...when are we launching one of these ?

Can we Get Coker out to help with everything?  

All four sets of sails the same,,or can Coker refine the designs?   Think that would be best for the client.                    Narrow panels       yeh  

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8 hours ago, Crash said:

Not to try to turn this into a PA topic, but it's CAFE limits that are driving all cars to look the same...

It's amazing to look at the classics. There's a car show every Tuesday here in town. Super fun to look at them. Most modern cars look like a variation of the tennis shoe unless you're willing to drop some big coin.

It's not just CAFE. It's the eggshell safety effect too.

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I love my Subaru Crosstrek but sometmes I come out of the supermarket, stare at the parking lot and think, "What does my car look like?" If there is a black dog with a white chest in the driver's seat it's mine.

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