Bob Perry

My newest project

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1 hour ago, Bob Perry said:

Thanks VJM. I'm still waiting for no. 1 to be finished before passing judgement. There are some small things I want changed and I have let Jim know. I never imagined for a moment we'd build for boats without some evolution and refinement from one boat t the next.

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Looking quite nice.  I think it is cool that each boat will be a little different.  From the practical side, why not make improvements or change decisions as the process goes on.  The other aspect is each one will be just a little different so the 'carbon cutters' won't be 'carbon copies'.  Each one will have it's own little quirks and personality.  I like that.

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Great White: Any time you like. My plan is to be there on Wednesday mornings. But you don't need me to be there. It's fun though.

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Yigael:

I think  we have assumed that in the area of systems there will be quite a bit of evolution.  But in terms of the rig and the layout not much change. I think the deck layout might see some changes after we sail no. 1. I am all in favor of letting the original design evolve. For me, four identical boats is boring.

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^ Haven't been here for a bit. Cutter # 1 is looking great, Bob.

Must be getting close to a splash soon.

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Yay four weeks!!!!

Will Mr Lucky grant us a similar level of follow up during the launch and subsequent sea trials?

I'd hate to have to say goodbye to this wonderful project without getting a good look at the boats in their natural environment - but I realise in the end we must be totally respectful of said Mr Lucky's desire for privacy...

I know there are still 3 boats to come, but the excitement will surely wane once the first one is on its way to the far horizons... Which leads me to another thought, what a sight it would be to see all four together in the water - any chance of this happening, or will Boat 1 be delivered before the rest is done?

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alpha:

I just don't know at this time. I agree it would be great to be able to sail the four boats against each other. I'm sure that finding crew will not be too hard. I think there is a very good chance we will see at least three of the four on the water together. We have not started no.4 yet.

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It'll look like some sort of dealership.

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You nailed the sheer as expected

Can't bear to see bad ones

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Thanks Beer. There have been a few times in the project I have been concerned about the sheer. It's not planar and being non planar there can be surprises from some angles. This is exaggerated when you are looking up at the sheer from the shop floor. But I am happy now. I think in most cases the sheer defines the boat. At least it should define the boat.

KB PB 7-23-17

 

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I saw sheer. 

Signature appearance

Soul agreed with eye

The cabin trunk.............;)

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OK, it's Thursday here, which means that it is Wednesday there, which means I am currently waiting my next photo fix. Please....

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i still can't quite come to grips with the notion of needing four of these...

but, if it's what he wants.., that's what he should have!

i just think that logistically.., it will be a pain. the boats aren't really big enough to have a captain.., although one captain/manager for all of them might work. no matter how simple they are.., while maintaining one is possible for an owner-operator.., maintaining four.., scattered around the globe will require some help.

 

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Just back from the yard with a lot of photos.

7070:

I totally understand. Relax, you don't have to come to grips with it. Things that would be inconvenient for you my client can take care of with a phone call. No sweat.

He has a well thought out plan for how the boats will be placed and used. I'm afraid I am not at liberty to divulge that plan.

As I have tried to communicate from the very start. This is a most unusual project.

Photos to follow! Hang in there Stu.

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With the help of Mars from the yard I got some really good photos. I have difficulty taking shots when I am on the scaffolding. I have Ruby on a lead and she insists on hanging over every edge while I need two hands to steady the camera. And there's no way I can let Ruby below. Would not be kosher. So today I enlisted Mars to help me. He did a great job. Thanks you Mars! At this stage I don't think the pics require explanations. Of course there is one guy here who wouldn't understand if I spent the afternoon trying to explain. DOLT!

I'm not going to do much explaining but I'm happy to try to answer questions.

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That satin or blasted finish on the hardware is really starting to grow on me.

I still say the ports should have been round or elliptical though. :P

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Jon:

I agree with you. I was skeptical about the sand blasted look but now that pieces are being put on the boat I am a believer. It's a very expensive process. Each piece of s.s. gear has to be disassembled and reassembled after blasting.

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I have more photos Whisper but I think this should hold the peanut gallery for today.

Ruby watches Neil fiddle with trav hardware.

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Tom: You know me. I'm proud of what I do and I enjoy parading it to the public, especially here where so many of you do understand.

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I love Wednesdays around here, amazing progress, Bob! 

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If you are not careful, you boys might just have a boat on your hands...

 

Looking good.

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Thanks Bob,

That will tide me over for another week.

The boat is really starting to come together beautifully, and it looks fantastic (to my eye). I really do like the timber trim on top of the gunwale. 

Cheers,

Stu

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Stu:

Yes, but I want 1.25" not 1". It also appears that the teak eyebrow on the cabin trunks will not make it into the build. Mostly a time issue now. "Hell wit the aesthetic details, let's get'er in the water!" I understand and I can live with it fine without the eyebrow. But,,,,,,,,,,,

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21 minutes ago, cbs said:

If you are not careful, you boys might just have a boat on your hands...

 

Looking good.

Shitski cbs, then we'd have to go sailing!

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and get cold wet and damp.

 

my own boat is under repair right now too... think all four of yours might beat me to the water....

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Again,

All I can manage is WOW...

Love the sandblasting!!!

fs

PS/ wow

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37 minutes ago, Bob Perry said:

Not a chance cbs. W e have to launch no. 1 to make room to start no. 4.

Well maybe the first three will beat me.  Doing the work yourself on weekends makes it a slow process.

 

I'd invite you to help out, but I recall you and tools don't seem to mix.  I don't mind the dust, its still boats and a change working on everyone elses during the week on the computer.

 

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appears  genoa track doesn't allow for a hi clew yankee  /  overlapping headsail,  another to be installed outboard / further aft?  

 

track to be on rail also?                       Again  you need Coker  guy out there,  NOT  TOO LATE 

 

 

 

 

 

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number 2 and on ...  i respectfully suggest  stanchion bases just inboard of rail,    genoa track on rail,  perhaps starting  3 feet aft  chain plates for uppers,  extending aft  

at least to cockpit.  High clew Yankee  /  genoa the way to go,  my opinion.    

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There already is genoa track on the rail. It's just not installed yet. Fack! We do not want stanchions on the deck. Fack!

I know this is a long thread but,,,,. If you had kept up with the thread you would have seen genoa track on the rail on every deck plan I posted.

Sorry for the rant Dave but I do my best to present the information but I can't make people look at the drawings I post.

Never cared for high clewed yankees and I have designed more cutters than any other living designer.

I think I had better go for a swim.

 

Semi:

I am liking it just fine, always have. If I hadn't I would have changed it in the design stage.

 

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Looks stunning, Bob.

And the satin hardware is wonderful.  Way easier on the eye than shiny stainless

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Damn, that's just beautiful.  The old saying about time, talent, and money, and you need any two of the three.  When you have all three, this is what you get.  Absolutely breathtaking!

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+1 on the satin hardware. It's super classy while being understated. I'm not a fan of the sprit but, not my boat(s)!

Looking super nice though. The Betts yard should be proud. Those things are gonna be sleepers in a race vs. Kim's boat that says, "I'm built to sail faster than you, and I'm doing it in style."

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Nice looking boat. Two questions: how are the cabin top handrails made? Glassed over carbon tubes?

And does the Andersen winch motor inside the cabin have some sort of cover and will it somewhat block that stern cabin window?

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Bob,

 

I am wondering if you did anything to protect the stainless from corrosion? Bead blasted stainless has some serious problems with pitting corrosion due to the surface irregularities and that it is rarely passivated after being blasted.

 

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/maco.200403846/abstract

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Zonks:

Handrails are bonded to the cabin top and have grp ends and carbon tubes left bright. We have similar hand rails inside. We are using bright CF details to make up for the lack of teak on deck.

Stumble: Yes all blasted s.s. parts are pacivated by me personally. I pick up each piece, cradle it in my arms and rock slowly back and forth while whispering "Everything's gonna be alright" in my best Bob Marley voice.

Thanks all for the comments. It's a series of unique boats in many ways. It has been a blast so far. I'm very keen to do more bats with Jim Betts.

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The eyebrow delete stings with me. In the big scheme of things it's hard to understand. Here's Adele on Quill disapproving.

aeDRLnm.jpg

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kdh: me too for now but my hope is that with the clear coat carbon high lights on the deck all will be forgiven and in the end we will have a look that is unique.

 

Nice shot of Adele. Say hi for me please.

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8 hours ago, Bob Perry said:

Zonks:

Handrails are bonded to the cabin top and have grp ends and carbon tubes left bright. We have similar hand rails inside. We are using bright CF details to make up for the lack of teak on deck.

Stumble: Yes all blasted s.s. parts are pacivated by me personally. I pick up each piece, cradle it in my arms and rock slowly back and forth while whispering "Everything's gonna be alright" in my best Bob Marley voice.

Thanks all for the comments. It's a series of unique boats in many ways. It has been a blast so far. I'm very keen to do more bats with Jim Betts.

Bob,

 

I hope I am wrong, but I really expect a substantial amount of rusting on all that bead blasted stainless. 

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We'll see.

Some parts are pacivated and others not. We should know by no.2.

There has been a lot of "you can't do that" on this project. So far we have done it.

If there is a rust problem we will reblast and pacivate. Easy as that.

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Why not take one winch for boat three or four and put it up on the roof for a few weeks.  Hit it with a bucket of salt water every few days.

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Hull no. 1 will be in the water in a month. Hull no. 2 is probably at least 9 months behind. We should have a good idea by then. They have the chemicals for pacivating but chose not to do it. Like I said, we'll see. I prefer shiny s.s. myself.

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22 hours ago, Bob Perry said:

Nice shot of Adele. Say hi for me please.

Will do, Bob. Adele will be 14 this next month.

Edit: Just did. Adele asked if I would say "hi back." She appreciates your making her feel special in the past.

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Really looking good, Bob. On a boat with detail that rivals Versailles, I'm not surprised she still has a few weeks to go before launching.

I'm glad I didn't miss the launch. I've been offline after a brush with, well let's say it was a close one, but I'm back. Not as good as new, but good.

Ok, now over to check on Kim's powerboat.

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1 minute ago, lasal22 said:

Really looking good, Bob. On a boat with detail that rivals Versailles, I'm not surprised she still has a few weeks to go before launching.

Huh?

 

Chateau_Versailles.jpg

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Different kind of detail, Sloop, but detail nontheless. Glad to see you're ornery as ever.

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Thanks Lasal. You know, I look at the boat and see where we could have improved the detailing. It's just my way. I always want better. But better costs money and It's not mine to spend. I am grateful to the client for his generosity towards this project.

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By detail, I'm referring to the thought through and extensive systems, not just teak cap rails, etc. Lot's going on in forty four feet. Lot's of, "this is the best way to build a cutter." I'm looking forward to seeing the masking tape come off.

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Me too Lasal. I can't take any credit for the systems. Those were left to the boys at the yard. They are very good.

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On 7/26/2017 at 4:54 PM, SloopJonB said:

That satin or blasted finish on the hardware is really starting to grow on me.

I still say the ports should have been round or elliptical though. :P

Then ol' Nat Herreshoff would have winced at the sight ;)

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It will be interesting to see if there's any subtle changes to the systems by the time they get to hull number 4.

Bob, is hull number three layed up yet?

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3 minutes ago, hobot said:

It will be interesting to see if there's any subtle changes to the systems by the time they get to hull number 4.

Bob, is hull number three layed up yet?

I agree--dying to see the changes in No. 4

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Blitz:

I thnk 3M 4200 for most of it. I'll ask on Wednesday and get back to you.

Hobs:

Hul n.3 is still upside down but ready t be turned over just as soon as the last bhds are installed. All the floor structure is already in the boat.

As for changes. In almost all cases hardware and fittings for four boats was ordered at the start. But it has always been assumed that there may be changes in the systems as we get to know them. Considering no. 1 has yet to be launched we don't have any changes in mind at this time. The changes we have seen are almost all build sequence changes in order to speed up the work. I'm pretty sure the deck will go on no. 2 this week. It's been dry fit a couple of times and now it's ready.

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Blitz:

Checked at the yard today about bedding and most of it is Boat Life polysulphide sealant. Some of it is 4200 adhesive.

 

Here is today's haul of pics.Note:

reaching jib track on cap rail

Butterfly hatch with custom Hood hatches

Bits and pieces of blasted hardware

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024035037

 

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Stu: Still lots of wiring work to be done below. I stay out of their way. Next week II'll try to get some good systems shots. When I come around they stop and talk to me and right now we can't have any stops. I think they feel obliged to entertain me, nice guys.

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I think this is the first time we've seen the pulpit/pushpit.  Was there any consideration to doing those in the satin / sandblasted stainless, instead of polished?

Looks great!

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Beer:

No, I don't recall that ever being discussed now you mention it. Makes sense to me. I'll ask. Both pieces have been in the shop for almost a year.

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Their shininess looks very out-of-place, and pulpits are very prominent items.

It would be a pity to spoil the ship for a ha'porth of tar

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I disagree. Pulpits are round shape without defining edges. To my eye they tend to disappear. Unless they are bugger all ugly.

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2 hours ago, Bob Perry said:

I disagree. Pulpits are round shape without defining edges. To my eye they tend to disappear. Unless they are bugger all ugly.

From a distance, yes, they disappear.  From the dockside or a neighbouring mooring or from the boat's deck, less so.  It was the view from the foredeck which caught my eye: soft, satiny look to everything, then contrast with a very shiny pulpit.

Even tho I know you'd not have designed any pulpits which have been anywhere near an ugly stick, you can't make them invisible in all conditions.

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Bottom line is the pulpits and their finishes were discussed. Owner wanted them shiny not sand blasted. And that's why they call him the "owner".

Relax guys, this boat will look spectacular.

On another note. It has been brought up that we will have problem with non pacivated blasted s.s.. The Anderson winches are sand blasted. That is a option they have offered for years on their winches. The Anderson winches are not pacivated. They have had zero problems.

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Bob,

Anderson winches are all made with 316L stainless, most deck hardware is 304 or 300 stainless. I would argue that neither are really suitable for bead blasting in the marine environment, but of the two 316L is going to be far better off it is it. 

 

I really hope I am just overreacting, and metallurgy is not my area of expertise, but this would be a real concern to me. If anything I would just hold off on blasting the gear for boats 2+ until you see how the first one does. 

 

As for passivating... The shop could do it in house pretty easily, without any real investment, all it takes is maybe $100 in materials.

 

1) A 10 gallon crawfish pot

2) A hot plate from Target

3) A few pounds of citric acid (Beer supply or restaurant supply stores about $0.50/lb)

 

a) put the pot on the hot plate

b ) Fill with 5 gallons of water

c) Add 4.1lbs of citric acid

d) Heat the solution to 150F

e) Drop the parts in for 30 minutes.

f) rinse with fresh water.

 

 

The boat looks amazing btw. I actually really like the way it looks. 

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Stumble:

Once again, We have used 316 deck fittings. This was a client requirement not a "request" in the choice of all the gear. The client has had blasted gear sitting on his dock for over 6 mos with no sign of problems. The yard has all the required materials for pacivating. They yard and owner chose not to do it. My suspicion is that two years from now we will be saying "What problem?" (Fingers are crossed)

 

Thanks for the kind words.

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3 hours ago, Bob Perry said:

Bottom line is the pulpits and their finishes were discussed. Owner wanted them shiny not sand blasted. And that's why they call him the "owner".

Sure, if that is what the owner wants, it is what the owner gets.  I still think shiny is out of place, but it is not my boat :)

Love the photos.  Thanks for posting them

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3 hours ago, Bob Perry said:

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Nice sharp pics, Bob. Wonderful craftmanship evident all over that boat.

Really looking forward to seeing her splash. 

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Leggs:

Look at it my way for a moment, if you will. The knee jerk solution to the styling question would demand all sand blasted s.s.. Of course. It must all match. However, many times, I do it frequently, it's more fun for the eye if you throw in components that contrast with what the eye expects. In music the composer Robert Schumann called them "Sphinxes" i.e. riddles for the ears. I want riddles for the eyes. I want someone to look at the boat and say, "I would not have thought of doing it like that." 

Ever notice how some guys wear matching tie and pocket square? Boring. The pocket square should always contrast with the tie.

Just wait until it's all done and then see. 

Note that the non skid is not the same color as the rest of the deck. It's slightly darker. Bet you didn't notice.

Of course some guys like matching tie and pocket square.

In this case I want the contrast. I want some excitement in the finish of the boat.

In the end if it looks like shit we won't do it on the other three boats. Or we will remove the offending pieces and blast them.

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Sailbye:

I quit fucking with my cameras. I just put them on "automatic" and shoot. Don't think, just shoot. I have also gravitated to one lens that seems to work best for these shots.

Still learning. Thanks.

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My experience with stainless. During the planning for my build I wanted shiny metal, no black anodized or otherwise. Hinckley, from many years of experience, know how to do shiny. The stainless, 12 years later, glistens. I do literally nothing to maintain it. Everyone notices. There were a few bits that weren't up to the 316 or whatever it is. They didn't last long.

Needless to say. If you want something and are willing to pay for it, well, you'll get it. 

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kdh: 

It was the clients idea to go sand blasted after he saw the Anderson winches.

I thought it was a shame to blast all that shiny s.s. away.  But the look has grown on me and I'll be happy to take the credit. If I dare. I think in the end we will have a boat with a very subtly distinct look. Positively subtle is my hope.

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The GPS antenna is super subtle. That's clean.

I've gotta say that I consider the bulkhead mounted compasses a nice benefit of tiller steering. Binnacle mounted compasses are hard to see when you settle in to hand steer for a long leg, and I like getting comfortable and steering a compass heading once in a while.

The flip side of the equation is finding the right spot for a plotter. Pilots use iPads velcroed to their legs now for approach plates, something like that could work for sailing I think.

 

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Lasal:

Thanks. We spent a lot of time looking at potential compass locations. I favored a big one central on the bridge deck. That would look cool. I was out voted! Imagine that.

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13 minutes ago, Bob Perry said:

We spent a lot of time looking at potential compass locations. I favored a big one central on the bridge deck. That would look cool. I was out voted! Imagine that.

Bulkhead compasses are lovely.  In the line of sight, like a heads-up display.

But there's a special place in hell for people who fit a single bulkhead compass, on only one side of the companionway :(

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56 minutes ago, TwoLegged said:

Bulkhead compasses are lovely.  In the line of sight, like a heads-up display.

But there's a special place in hell for people who fit a single bulkhead compass, on only one side of the companionway :(

Nothing a little line of tape on the dome can't fix.  ;)

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Regarding the bulkhead compass location. With the compasses that far outboard, doesn't the torso of anyone sitting on the cockpit seat block the view of the compass? I guess you could look at the leeward one.

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