Bob Perry

My newest project

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13 hours ago, Paul-Romain said:

Are we all done here?

Still waiting to see some pics of the finished interior...

And any group pictures with hull no 2 (and 3 by now?) would be good!

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I was wondering how the other hulls are doing too!

fs

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11 hours ago, Sail4beer said:

Can’t wait. Time to follow you on FB. I still dream of Catari

With the storm damage ND's house project in the BVIs got a lot more complicated.

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That’s the part of the dream I don’t like.

Some things become more important.

I’m still rebuilding my home from Superstorm Sandy (Thanks FEMA!) and when people ask how some of my sidelined projects are going, I tell them to have patience. Plastic, metal and wood wait more patiently than enthusiastic fans of beautiful boats.

Luckily I have an understanding wife, so when I disappear for the day, she knows I’m working on one and not in a bar drinking

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Went to the yard Thursday and took these pics of the drop leaf table for the carbon cutter No. 1. It's solid teak and cored carbon. It is beautiful, as nice a DL table as I have ever seen. There is a trip wire that runs around the perimeter of the leaf to release it to lower. That was Steve's work as was the rest of the table. The design is mine.

38664641195_1ed9314bf8_z.jpg001 by robert perry, on Flickr

38664696445_5898a9e34c_k.jpg003 by robert perry, on Flickr

38851976054_36db911b43_k.jpg005 by robert perry, on Flickr

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That's a beauty Bob.  Unfortunately, the table alone is probably isn't within my budget, let alone one of the cutters.

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2 hours ago, Liquid said:

^ if you have to ask.......

That table is gorgeous. I have a forecast though. Bare carbon fiber has become all the rage. Ferrari owners go nuts over it, want it everywhere they can put it.

Give it 5 or 10 years. People will say, "bare carbon fiber, so 2010s--needs an update."

The carbon fiber mast and boom on my early 80s designed boat are painted. The overhead is Formica--dated, of course, but even in 2005 it was the most practical material.

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Keith:

There is a skilled model maker on FB who has been building a model of QUAIL. It's a full model. He's about 95% done with hull and deck. It looks great. He loves the design and asked me if he could have drawings to build the model. Why not?

You should check it out. Not sure what he'll do with it when its done.

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5 minutes ago, kdh said:

That table is gorgeous. I have a forecast though. Bare carbon fiber has become all the rage. Ferrari owners go nuts over it, want it everywhere they can put it.

Give it 5 or 10 years. People will say, "bare carbon fiber, so 2010s--needs an update."

The carbon fiber mast and boom on my early 80s designed boat is painted. The overhead is Formica--dated, of course, but even in 2005 it was the most practical material.

In all fairness to Formica, it's come a long way since I remember it in the '50s/'60s.

We had this very pattern on the kitchen counter tops at my parents house, except a little less hideous color.

 

Formica.jpg

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4 minutes ago, Bob Perry said:

Keith:

There is a skilled model maker on FB who has been building a model of QUAIL. It's a full model. He's about 95% done with hull and deck. It looks great. He loves the design and asked me if he could have drawings to build the model. Why not?

You should check it out. Not sure what he'll do with it when its done.

Peter is very skilled indeed.  His models are gorgeous.  

Bob, maybe you could talk Peter into coming here and posting his work. I'm sure many here would be interested.

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14 minutes ago, kdh said:

That table is gorgeous. I have a forecast though. Bare carbon fiber has become all the rage. Ferrari owners go nuts over it, want it everywhere they can put it.

Give it 5 or 10 years. People will say, "bare carbon fiber, so 2010s--needs an update."

The carbon fiber mast and boom on my early 80s designed boat are painted. The overhead is Formica--dated, of course, but even in 2005 it was the most practical material.

The carbon can always be painted. A nice faux woodgrain would look nice. :ph34r:

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5 minutes ago, Bob Perry said:

Keith:

There is a skilled model maker on FB who has been building a model of QUAIL. It's a full model. He's about 95% done with hull and deck. It looks great. He loves the design and asked me if he could have drawings to build the model. Why not?

You should check it out. Not sure what he'll do with it when its done.

Bob, I heard of that effort. I can only say "I'm sorry" for not building Quail full scale (yet). As you've eloquently described I like my current boat. And my family are disposed to leaving our money to charity rather than to building stuff we see as limited in its relative utility as a percent of the monetary outlay involved. But who knows, our perspective might become more like your four-carbon-cutters client's.

I'd love to have that model, or a copy.

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Ed:

I remember the little formica boomerangs.

 

I think Peter gets a ton of response on FB. He keeps quite busy. Maybe I'll get some of his pics posted here.

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Hull No. 2 of the cutters is being readied for painting and is not very photogenic at this stage. Lots of plastic sheeting in place.

Hull No. 3 is still upside down, interior structure installed and waiting for a space to open up.

Hull No. 4 has yet to be begun.

I'll post interior photos when they have some cushions on the boat. You may want to keep a weather eye on FB. I post frequently there.

Biggest news is that with No 2 we are going all Lithium batteries.

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10 minutes ago, Bob Perry said:

Hull No. 2 of the cutters is being readied for painting and is not very photogenic at this stage. Lots of plastic sheeting in place.

Hull No. 3 is still upside down, interior structure installed and waiting for a space to open up.

Hull No. 4 has yet to be begun.

I'll post interior photos when they have some cushions on the boat. You may want to keep a weather eye on FB. I post frequently there.

Biggest news is that with No 2 we are going all Lithium batteries.

I'm sure many of us would like to know the lithium-battery details, Bob. Mastervolt?

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I'm thinking the model would look great sitting on top of the piano I have in the office.

Best way to find out the battery system details is to buy a Perry/Betts boat. Can't just give away all the hard work. This is far from an "off the shelf" system.

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Happy New Year Bob!

Thanks for the update...  The DL Table looks great!

fs

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On 1/5/2018 at 4:10 AM, py26129 said:

That reminded me of a video of a Maersk container ship flexing in rough weather.  Pretty impressive,.  That comments at the end of the vid pretty much sum it up 

 

Cool video, steel was such a great invention!

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On 1/4/2018 at 10:10 PM, py26129 said:

That reminded me of a video of a Maersk container ship flexing in rough weather.  Pretty impressive,.  That comments at the end of the vid pretty much sum it up 

 

Thanks for posting that video.  Got a daughter at USNA who is a Mech E and hating life. Especially hated materials class last semester.  Got to send her thisvideo and say "this is why that stuff you learned in materials class matters to keeping folks alive and ships afloat."  Given its her 21st I am guess I get a response along the lines of "that is so last semester" or "Ohhhh my aching head... shut up with that materials crap!"  LOL it will still be fun to tweak her with it.  Tx!

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On 1/7/2018 at 6:14 PM, Bob Perry said:

I'm thinking the model would look great sitting on top of the piano I have in the office.

Best way to find out the battery system details is to buy a Perry/Betts boat. Can't just give away all the hard work. This is far from an "off the shelf" system.

Bob, most practical lithium systems seem to be far from off the shelf, at least for now. The charge and storage methods are vastly different from lead acid systems. Stan Honey has a great guide on-line.

http://honeynav.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/LFP-battery-Stan-Honey-notes.pdf

 

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kdh:

The Betts crew has been looking at Honey's work.

They were a couple of hours away from having the mock up system up and running today but I did not stay. Jim seemed fine with me taking photos of the system as it's all laid out nicely on a table in the shop. He just wants me to hold off posting any pics until they know it works. I'll get something next week.

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4 hours ago, kdh said:

 

Hi kdh ,

Thank-you for that link , lead me to Stan's blog which is a fun read pack full of info .

Stan Honey and Sally Lindsay Honey's files

possibly useful stuff from Sally and Stan

Quote

We asked our Naval Architect friends why SS is commonly used for chainplates when bronze is stronger, lasts forever, and the extra cost isn’t significant given the labor.  The answer was that sailors like things to be shiny. 

 

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On 1/10/2018 at 9:56 AM, Wess said:

Thanks for posting that video.  Got a daughter at USNA who is a Mech E and hating life. Especially hated materials class last semester.  Got to send her thisvideo and say "this is why that stuff you learned in materials class matters to keeping folks alive and ships afloat."  Given its her 21st I am guess I get a response along the lines of "that is so last semester" or "Ohhhh my aching head... shut up with that materials crap!"  LOL it will still be fun to tweak her with it.  Tx!

My mentor was a chief mate on Cities Service tankers. A long time ago. The old fashioned ones--T2 etc with a bridgedeck, and a catwalk going aft to the accomodations block and fwd to the f'csl'e.

When they got in bad weather, they would back it off when the catwalk started to hit the bhd where there was normally a gap.

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On 1/7/2018 at 4:08 PM, Ed Lada said:

In all fairness to Formica, it's come a long way since I remember it in the '50s/'60s.

We had this very pattern on the kitchen counter tops at my parents house, except a little less hideous color.

 

Formica.jpg

That was the pattern at the dry cleaners when I was a kid. Except it was a gray background. I liked how it was worn off where the clothes had slid across it for 2 decades.

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8 minutes ago, fastyacht said:

That was the pattern at the dry cleaners when I was a kid. Except it was a gray background. I liked how it was worn off where the clothes had slid across it for 2 decades.

I am pretty sure almost anyone in the US of a certain age has seen that Formica pattern in one color or another.  It must have been one of their best sellers.

Indeed, I don't know about the modern Formica but that the pattern would wear quickly on the old stuff, it didn't need 2 decades of heavy use to do that.

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On 1/17/2018 at 2:24 PM, fastyacht said:

My mentor was a chief mate on Cities Service tankers. A long time ago. The old fashioned ones--T2 etc with a bridgedeck, and a catwalk going aft to the accomodations block and fwd to the f'csl'e.

When they got in bad weather, they would back it off when the catwalk started to hit the bhd where there was normally a gap.

Amazing how much flex those ships have.  And it looks like I have another video to send her.  Apparently fiberglass done right can hold up as well.  Stunning this thing didn't sink and the shockingly didn't even get holed.  Go Ss (I think) designer and builder.

Don't tell Bob or Brent or that ruckus will start back up again LOL.

 

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Don't know for sure.  Was not there.  But AFAIK it slid off on a reach and then was towed.  If it had an engine it was lost but the rudder is still attached and mostly whole but the post is bent badly.  There are some "after" pics up on the web and in the thread about this.  Stunning that nobody died and the boat is intact.  Fiberglass... then new old steel???

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No worries Wess. BS is long gone and will stay gone. I too was surprised at the beating that little boat took. Looks to me like they could have sheeted the jib and sailed off the breakwater, but I was not there so it's just my speculation. Can't imagine how the rudder survived intact. Is that an S2 build? They built some very good boats.

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1 hour ago, Bob Perry said:

No worries Wess. BS is long gone and will stay gone. I too was surprised at the beating that little boat took. Looks to me like they could have sheeted the jib and sailed off the breakwater, but I was not there so it's just my speculation. Can't imagine how the rudder survived intact. Is that an S2 build? They built some very good boats.

The rudder is "intact" but not very useful. No way they could have sailed off with that so mangled. The OB mount is a little worse for wear as well. S2 built good boats.

05195647-9A0D-4155-B589-6CC23CAD1C43.jpeg

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Hey, Bob. Happy 2018 to you. A bit late sorry, but I've been distracted.

Anything new on your board, or coming up you're happy to share?

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Sailbye:

Things are busy here all of a sudden. Working on several new things with Rasper now. Expecting new clients at the shack next week. I'll post what I can when I think the time is right.

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1 hour ago, Bob Perry said:

Sailbye:

Things are busy here all of a sudden. Working on several new things with Rasper now. Expecting new clients at the shack next week. I'll post what I can when I think the time is right.

Great to hear you're busy, Bob. Look forward to seeing your ideas, as and when.

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42 minutes ago, Rasputin22 said:

Bob, you guys are going to need a lot of this stuff for that system, but at least it is lightweight.

Image result for replacement smoke

 

 

That's Lucas only - exclusive to tar top lead acid batteries.

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I hope they have the lithium battery issues sorted.  I know of two boats that have eventually torched when they switched over to lithium.  No idea of the quality of the conversion which could have been a factor.

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So.., is the owner happy with hull #1? He must have a few miles on it by now...

Is he cruising it in some exotic location?

Does he still think he needs four of them?

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On 1/8/2018 at 10:08 AM, Ed Lada said:

In all fairness to Formica, it's come a long way since I remember it in the '50s/'60s.

We had this very pattern on the kitchen counter tops at my parents house, except a little less hideous color.

 

Formica.jpg

Classic Kiwi linoleum and formica.

https://www.trademe.co.nz/property/residential-property-for-sale/auction-1467061535.htm?rsqid=07cf563cfb414b37a08cdbac2014088b4pgJmPG.jpg

 

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6 minutes ago, Priscilla said:

Wow. Flashback to a yellow formica top on our dining room table, with chrome bent legs and edges, like the counter above.

No way would I want to revisit that '70's era.

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I remember the schools built here for the Baby Boom all had lino that looked like those yellow squares - it looked like compressed vomit.

Totally indestructible too.

That kitchen looks like it was done by one of those "End Of The Roll" places.

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That looks a lot like the kitchen in a house we just bought, maybe I should restore it rather than throw it out.

did you notice the linoleum “ terrazzo” swordfish?

and matching “birds eyes” in cheap pine ply ply as a decorating feature.

Q, why do they call it Pinus Radiata?

A. because it’s a prick of a wood...

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I'm actually groovin on that kitchen.  B)

One day, I spent a lot of time in the hardware store, trying to find the best match for the relatively boring formica  that came in my galley.  I have the sample chip right here, so I can buy  bits for little projects that come up.  I should probably hang it inside a cabinet on the boat.

31R6gpEBQiL.jpg  *Yawn.*

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3 minutes ago, SloopJonB said:

I remember the schools built here for the Baby Boom all had lino that looked like those yellow squares - it looked like compressed vomit.

Totally indestructible too.

it was probably https://www.armstrongflooring.com/commercial/en-us/products/vinyl-composition-tile.html VCT tile, it still gets used in schools and commercial applications.  I have used it in my previous and current house  and am planning on using MORE of it it in our house.  I like that is colourful and tough.  it seems to me that residential flooring is wood, tile or engineeried stuff that LOOKS like wood or tile...boring.

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4 hours ago, Rasputin22 said:

Bob, you guys are going to need a lot of this stuff for that system, but at least it is lightweight.

Image result for replacement smoke

That is frickin' hilarious. You know why the English never had the electric chair? They didn't believe it would work.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Ishmael said:

That would be hell on earth on acid.

Or fucking fantastic! We once lost a guy from a party in the winter. Found him under a streetlight touching snowflakes.

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2 hours ago, chester said:

Or fucking fantastic! We once lost a guy from a party in the winter. Found him under a streetlight touching snowflakes.

Oh man, that brings back some memories.  Snowflakes on the grass, I mean like giant snowflakes, about 1 1/2 feet across.  Just beautiful, with the grass poking up through the holes in the snowflake pattern.

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7070:

Not my concern. There is only so much the designer can do. I suspect so. I know that at least one will be sailing to New Zealand. Perhaps two of them. We have already sailed no. 1 so it is already "getting used".

Back to the formica.

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16 hours ago, Ed Lada said:

Oh man, that brings back some memories.  Snowflakes on the grass, I mean like giant snowflakes, about 1 1/2 feet across.  Just beautiful, with the grass poking up through the holes in the snowflake pattern.

Flashback?

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The funny thing is, when that formica was installed, someone actually thought that looked good.

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Damn, I wqish I had something as exciting to talk about as formica.I like that vintage look a lot. That's what I wanted for the new shack but my wife and the contractor over ruled me. Peasants!

 

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On 15/09/2017 at 6:43 PM, ProaSailor said:

 

Boomer_vid_0-58.jpg.aad8e73b82f61d3443a68259e035347c.jpg

What I don’t understand is the interaction between bobstay and anchor chain when the boat is at anchor. Is the bobstay somehow easily removable? Don’t seem so. If not, then the anchor chain might well rip it off, isn’t it?

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I have designed countless boats with bowsprits and bobstays. On the lower bobstay fitting there are two holes, one above the other. Ones for the bobstay. The other is for a "snubber". If bobstay/anchor chain interaction is a problem then use a snubber. Do you, Francois, really think I invented the bowsprit? Do you think it is an innovative experiment? You really do need to get out more. Maybe buy a copy of ROYCE'S.

 

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6 minutes ago, Bob Perry said:

I have designed countless boats with bowsprits and bobstays. On the lower bobstay fitting there are two holes, one above the other. Ones for the bobstay. The other is for a "snubber". If bobstay/anchor chain interaction is a problem then use a snubber. Do you, Francois, really think I invented the bowsprit? Do you think it is an innovative experiment? You really do need to get out more. Maybe buy a copy of ROYCE'S.

 

I simply asked a genuine question. Thanks for the answer. Never seen a ‘snubber’ in action but it makes sense.

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Francois:

Look back a couple hundred years, probably a few more hundred. Bowsprits have been around a long time. If there were a problem with sprits, bobstays and anchor chain do you really think there would be so many boats rigged that way? I have 600 Tayana 37's with bobstays and anchors and no conflicts. I have many other designs with sprits and anchors. I could list them for you but that would take a long time. System works on the Westsail 32 if you want proof from another designer. Works on TICONDEROGA and many other LFH designs.  There again, I could go on with many more boats but it would be silly.

 

 

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Bowsprits went out of fashion in France in the 60s, so those of us who haven't sailed old gaffers or one of the few exceptions like an evasion 32 (google it, these weren't pretty) aren't really used to them....

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In our case the anchor/sprit system was mocked up and left intact while various anchor options were studied awaiting on the owner's decision on anchors.

As to why there is a sprit. It has everything to do with the short bow overhang and the need to get the headsail tack forward and provide decent sail area. Imagine a Concordia Yawl or a Rhodes Bounty both with long bow overhangs. In those cases the bow overhang itself acts like a sprit allowing the jib tack to go forward,  allowing for correct rig balance for a docile helm. Also, on a heavy boat like a Baba 40, CT54 or the carbon cutters, the sprit gives a longer "J' to help get the sail area required for good performance. Of course you can move the mast forward to get rig balance and we see that on almost all modern boats with plumb stems. Frac rig becomes the norm. Nothing wrong with that. But they are not cutters. Many of my clients want cutters. I have done many. If I want sufficient fore triangle dims so that a jib and staysail can both be carried I need a long "J". I need "breathing room" for the staysail. It's foolish to equate a modern, plumb or plumb-ish design with a traditional cutter rg. They are apples and oranges. I work in a design world where traditional types have their appeal. I like that. It gives me creative freedom and a wide range of design output. For many of those more traditional design a bowsprit is the only answer if you want a good performing boat.

There is nothing arbitrary about a bowsprit. None of these boats would have worked without a sprit.

26338356859_bf41145a2d_b.jpgNIGHT RUNNER jan 1 by robert perry, on Flickr

37764707772_873fa07b21_b.jpgBrigadoon race 1 by robert perry, on Flickr

36851831853_055ea4a0dc_k.jpgBo 3 by robert perry, on Flickr

28301255609_cda49608d0_k.jpganch by robert perry, on Flickr

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1 hour ago, IStream said:

That's some first-rate French shade right there.

Come on....

I just explained why the answer was not obvious to François, it is just cultural.

While you guys were manufacturing Valiant 40, we were manufacturing Ginn Fizz, different boats and different skillsets at the end.

7268fd59e28ca51af0e92340acfd5124.jpg

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