• Announcements

    • UnderDawg

      A Few Simple Rules   05/22/2017

      Sailing Anarchy is a very lightly moderated site. This is by design, to afford a more free atmosphere for discussion. There are plenty of sailing forums you can go to where swearing isn't allowed, confrontation is squelched and, and you can have a moderator finger-wag at you for your attitude. SA tries to avoid that and allow for more adult behavior without moderators editing your posts and whacking knuckles with rulers. We don't have a long list of published "thou shalt nots" either, and this is by design. Too many absolute rules paints us into too many corners. So check the Terms of Service - there IS language there about certain types of behavior that is not permitted. We interpret that lightly and permit a lot of latitude, but we DO reserve the right to take action when something is too extreme to tolerate (too racist, graphic, violent, misogynistic, etc.). Yes, that is subjective, but it allows us discretion. Avoiding a laundry list of rules allows for freedom; don't abuse it. However there ARE a few basic rules that will earn you a suspension, and apparently a brief refresher is in order. 1) Allegations of pedophilia - there is no tolerance for this. So if you make allegations, jokes, innuendo or suggestions about child molestation, child pornography, abuse or inappropriate behavior with minors etc. about someone on this board you will get a time out. This is pretty much automatic; this behavior can have real world effect and is not acceptable. Obviously the subject is not banned when discussion of it is apropos, e.g. talking about an item in the news for instance. But allegations or references directed at or about another poster is verboten. 2) Outing people - providing real world identifiable information about users on the forums who prefer to remain anonymous. Yes, some of us post with our real names - not a problem to use them. However many do NOT, and if you find out someone's name keep it to yourself, first or last. This also goes for other identifying information too - employer information etc. You don't need too many pieces of data to figure out who someone really is these days. Depending on severity you might get anything from a scolding to a suspension - so don't do it. I know it can be confusing sometimes for newcomers, as SA has been around almost twenty years and there are some people that throw their real names around and their current Display Name may not match the name they have out in the public. But if in doubt, you don't want to accidentally out some one so use caution, even if it's a personal friend of yours in real life. 3) Posting While Suspended - If you've earned a timeout (these are fairly rare and hard to get), please observe the suspension. If you create a new account (a "Sock Puppet") and return to the forums to post with it before your suspension is up you WILL get more time added to your original suspension and lose your Socks. This behavior may result a permanent ban, since it shows you have zero respect for the few rules we have and the moderating team that is tasked with supporting them. Check the Terms of Service you agreed to; they apply to the individual agreeing, not the account you created, so don't try to Sea Lawyer us if you get caught. Just don't do it. Those are the three that will almost certainly get you into some trouble. IF YOU SEE SOMEONE DO ONE OF THESE THINGS, please do the following: Refrain from quoting the offending text, it makes the thread cleanup a pain in the rear Press the Report button; it is by far the best way to notify Admins as we will get e-mails. Calling out for Admins in the middle of threads, sending us PM's, etc. - there is no guarantee we will get those in a timely fashion. There are multiple Moderators in multiple time zones around the world, and anyone one of us can handle the Report and all of us will be notified about it. But if you PM one Mod directly and he's off line, the problem will get dealt with much more slowly. Other behaviors that you might want to think twice before doing include: Intentionally disrupting threads and discussions repeatedly. Off topic/content free trolling in threads to disrupt dialog Stalking users around the forums with the intent to disrupt content and discussion Repeated posting of overly graphic or scatological porn content. There are plenty web sites for you to get your freak on, don't do it here. And a brief note to Newbies... No, we will not ban people or censor them for dropping F-bombs on you, using foul language, etc. so please don't report it when one of our members gives you a greeting you may find shocking. We do our best not to censor content here and playing swearword police is not in our job descriptions. Sailing Anarchy is more like a bar than a classroom, so handle it like you would meeting someone a little coarse - don't look for the teacher. Thanks.

44 posts in this topic

So there is a big debate going on around the northeast regarding the Pixel and the RS Feva. What are your thoughts?.. ready GO!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here's what I think. Bearing in mind that my experience of the boats is that I've plenty experience of Feva's- sailed them a fair bit in my youth and know a lot about them.

With the pixel I've only really seen pictures and read about them, so I couldn't really make a call on which is the better boat.

 

The Feva has a few good points, mostly the fact that it's absolutely bombproof.

It's pretty ok to sail too, and especially with the kite it prepares you for some of the more high performance classes out there.

 

To me the Pixel looks a tad sedate

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Feva has a few good points, mostly the fact that it's absolutely bombproof.

Except (I hear) a batch a few years ago that a number of sailors were putting their feet through.

 

Both look like reasonable boats. What is the debate about in particular? Or is it just a general discussion?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One boat has a class of ~6000 boats being used worldwide for youth racing.

 

The other has ~200 boats with symmetrical spinnakers being used in one part of New England.

 

--

What was the question again?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are people still really sailing the Pixel? Why teach kids on a boat with a symmetric spinnaker? That's so old school.

 

The RS Feva is the ideal boat for kids transitioning from the Optimist. No question.

 

So all you junior sailing organizers need to decide. Train your kids in 21st century skills? Or teach them to be dodos? Your call.

 

More importantly, is the US ever going to get serious about developing kids who can be future Olympic champions?

 

Go Feva!!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Feva is a fun boat for kids

 

it's even ok for two adults as long as they're light

 

never sailed a pixel - they look kind of boring. i heard the pixel needed constant upkeep because the build wasn't that great

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Top 10 reasons why the RS Feva is good for US junior sailors

 

 

10. It gives kids a modern, exciting incentive to keep sailing

 

 

9. Boys especially age 11-15 can be a pain, they need strong incentives

 

 

8. Two video game charged pre-teens can make a Feva plane

 

 

7. Mom, dad or coaches can make a Feva plane, single-handed or with junior

 

 

6. Asymmetric kites aren't just fun and fast, they are cool gadgets for discoveries

 

 

5. Einstein enjoyed apparent wind sailing before he figured out E=mc2

 

 

4. US Olympic Sailing, see #5 above. STEM, see #6 above,

 

 

3. Enormous class in Europe, 20 countries, 180 teams at Worlds

 

2. Consistently over 40% female sailors in regattas, teen boys tend to find this very interesting.

 

 

1. Kids can take their friends sailing, it's self-draining, they won't need a babysitter

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are people still really sailing the Pixel? Why teach kids on a boat with a symmetric spinnaker? That's so old school.

 

The RS Feva is the ideal boat for kids transitioning from the Optimist. No question.

 

So all you junior sailing organizers need to decide. Train your kids in 21st century skills? Or teach them to be dodos? Your call.

 

More importantly, is the US ever going to get serious about developing kids who can be future Olympic champions?

 

Go Feva!!!

If you want to teach kids to be Olympians, first requirement is to teach them to be born into an exceptionally wealthy family or learn how to raise $1 million every four years.

 

Better goal is to simply teach kids to enjoy the experience of sailing and the life adventures to which it can lead.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I used to service the JSA, deal and service Pixels, and deal and service Fevas. I can say without qualification that the Feva would provide a better experience for kids. The list of things that go wrong with a Pixel is VERY long. This is compounded by the fact that many of the parts are entirely custom and unique to the pixel. Wes, who owns the distribution of Pixel doesn't always have parts. This is natural for a low volume builder. If a storm takes out 10 masts, there aren't going to be 10 spares until next summer. This isn't saying Wes doesn't run his business well. It is simply a reflection on the economics of a low volume builder. No matter what, Feva parts can be had in a reasonable amount of time. Worst case, there is a fast shipment from Europe. RS is top notch when dealing with warranty issues. For me, the answer is quite clear. The economics of the Pixel makes it unsustainable. Feva all the way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It took forever to get the whole US on board for the 420 while the feva is nice because it has an asym but it lacks a trapeze which is an important skill the 420 can teach and can be done with a small crew coming out of Optis. But if you add a trapeze to a feva you might as well sail a 29er.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It took forever to get the whole US on board for the 420 while the feva is nice because it has an asym but it lacks a trapeze which is an important skill the 420 can teach and can be done with a small crew coming out of Optis. But if you add a trapeze to a feva you might as well sail a 29er.

I don't think the lack of trapeze is an issue particularly; 420s will stay as the dominant class in highschool/college sailing. Bit of a squeeze for a full size HS team, but that's not to say the feva wouldn't be a fantastic summer program learner or younger teen racing craft if the US ever feels the need to catch up.

 

Not fragile ships but I have fallen out the back, however that may have been my fatness being too much for the toe straps rather than poor build quality...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Information on the JSA of Long Island can be found here:

https://jsalis.securespsites.com/default.aspx

 

Not sure why the comparisons to HS/College boats came up.

For what it's worth, the FJs/420s/Larks/Fireflies/Z420s that are used for HS and College sailing don't use trapezes or spinnakers anyway.

 

--

I'm biased, since I sell RS boats (amogst all the other big brands of dinghies in the US).

The Feva is used worldwide as a youth training and racing boat.

 

I've only seen a pixel a couple of times, and, it looks nice enough, but why fight the rest of the world?

The JSA could be training kids in boats that would allow their sailors to go around the world for races and competitions.

And they might even have some fun on a modern durable plastic boat with a modern spinnaker setup....

Also, I'm told Feva Worlds will actually be hosted in the US in 2017 (I'm sure the east coast) .

Those kids in Long Island could be training for international competition instead of a specialty boat used only in their neck of the woods.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

For those who are arguing that a 420 is the right boat, I don't disagree, but JSA has (or used to have) a two year age window where kids are required to sail the Pixel (or Feva). These are smaller and less powerful than a 420. Without that changing, the Pixel vs Feva debate will live on for some time. It is my understanding that some clubs have ditched the Pixel in favor of the Feva. I personnally like the owner of Pixel more than the upper management of RS, but I can say without qualification that I think the Feva is a better boat for this age window in the JSA.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
... ...

 

I've only seen a pixel a couple of times, and, it looks nice enough, but why fight the rest of the world?

The JSA could be training kids in boats that would allow their sailors to go around the world for races and competitions.

And they might even have some fun on a modern durable plastic boat with a modern spinnaker setup....

Also, I'm told Feva Worlds will actually be hosted in the US in 2017 (I'm sure the east coast) .

Those kids in Long Island could be training for international competition instead of a specialty boat used only in their neck of the woods.

 

Well, the Pixel was conceived long before the Feva came on the scene. LIS youth programs sailed the Blue Jay for decades, and it is better suited to smaller kids than the 420 or FJ. Many programs that could not keep their aged Blue Jays sailing went to the US Sailing model of keeping kids in Optis until they grew tall & strong enough to sail 420s... they noticed a huge drop in participation and began clamoring for a replacement boat.

 

IIRC Bruce Kirby designed the boat to some specific dimensions and characteristics. The Pixel is a very cool little boat and has been a success in this niche. It's certainly not a case of JLIS trying to "fight the rest of the world" more like they got a clue before the rest of the world was willing to listen. The situation is -very- different now.

 

FB- Doug

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

Well, the Pixel was conceived long before the Feva came on the scene.

 

FB- Doug

 

 

The Feva was designed in 2002

The Pixel was designed in 2003 or 2004 (their website says 2003, but I don't recall the boat being really readily available till 2005...)

 

--

 

The world is a bit different now, everyone loves polyethelene. When compared to even 5-6 years ago, this is radically different thinking.

Perhaps the forward thinking that tried the Pixel will also be willing to try a more proven and popular boat in 2015.

Sailing is more global than ever, it's kinda interesting to think of worldwide competition with small kids racing the same boats.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

 

Well, the Pixel was conceived long before the Feva came on the scene.

 

FB- Doug

 

 

The Feva was designed in 2002

The Pixel was designed in 2003 or 2004 (their website says 2003, but I don't recall the boat being really readily available till 2005...)

 

--

 

The world is a bit different now, everyone loves polyethelene. When compared to even 5-6 years ago, this is radically different thinking.

Perhaps the forward thinking that tried the Pixel will also be willing to try a more proven and popular boat in 2015.

Sailing is more global than ever, it's kinda interesting to think of worldwide competition with small kids racing the same boats.

 

 

OK... when was the first Feva brought to the US?

Two main points- 1: the Feva was not available to the folks who commissioned the Pixel 2: if they knew about it at all, they probably figured they'd give Bruce Kirby a chance to design a better mousetrap for them.

 

It may also be that if they knew about the Feva, they wanted to continue teaching kids with a symmetric spinnaker (a point of view I don't particularly agree with, but if you want to get kids into the track of racing 420s with spinnakers, then there you go).

 

FB- Doug

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Feva is so successful in Europe because it captures the hearts and minds of 11 year olds.

This is the largest age segment where kids in the US stop sailing.

 

One big difference in Europe is historically a greater variety of boats for youth.

No boat in decades has moved the game forward like the Feva.

Technically advanced, but user friendly and affordable.

 

 

The US has been relatively locked in to boats that define the boundaries of junior sailing.

Every other aspect of our lives is "modernized," yet we want youth to sail antique designs.

It's a huge pile of ships to steer and doesn't change course easily.

 

But based on low female to male retention ratios, overall participation data (what there is), and Olympic results, our programs need to do much more than revise lesson plans.

 

At 200lbs hull weight and 94sq ft sail area plus a small symmetrical spinnaker, the Pixel looks chunky.

 

I'll bet they are not using the kites much.

Probably for the same reasons US high school and collegiate sailing mostly don't:

 

Burden to train crew

Increasing relevance of asymmetrical

Extra gear to manage (lost / damaged poles)

 

 

The Feva is 139lbs hull weight, 90sq ft of sail, and a 73sq ft asymmetric with integral retracting bowsprit.

 

 

I weigh 175 pounds and recently crewed for a 10 year old with the kite in 12 knots and we were able to plane.

How inspiring is that? This little guy is hooked because it was challenging, fast and easy.

 

 

Get your Feva running

Head out on the seaway!

 

 

 

.

 

 

 

 

 

post-35406-0-66071000-1427394191_thumb.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Isn't the question more Topper Topaz vs RS Feva? I didn't even know Pixels still existed

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Isn't the question more Topper Topaz vs RS Feva? I didn't even know Pixels still existed

 

That question is better answered by how much boat you want vs. how much you want to spend. The Topper is much simpler and less "boat-y" including it's overall shape & look. However my group trialed one extensively and it sails pretty well, IMHO easily well enough to be a good trainer. And we paid approx half what Fevas would cost. Right now the kids are still getting used to them, after sailing Optis for a few years they have difficulty remembering to check the drain plug instead of airbags, and how the rudder kicks up.

 

Due to cost constraints we did not get the asym spinnakers but that is an option which can be added on any time in the future. Right now I want to focus on getting the kids oriented to doing their jobs as crew and as skipper, working together in the boat, and not arguing.

;)

 

FB- Doug

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

In the Northeast the Pixel was brought out by Bruce Kirby to replace the Bluejay(which is a scaled down Lightning). I learned to sail in Bluejays and they were great boats. Not perfect. The Lightning is a great boat as well. However all of these boats are old. Most of the Bluejays were wood and too tired to be truly competetive. Several of my friends who won the Blue Jay Nationals went on to be International level saiors by the Bluejay>Int. 420>college sailing>college coaches, Olympic campaigns(470 & Star) & several World Championships. Multiple big boat World Championships as well. That is out of 2 small yacht clubs on Fisher's Island Sound in Connecticut.

 

We didn't have Optis back then. The Blue Jays taught skills that we all needed later on. In the other boats. Not all big boats have gone to the easy kite. The symmetric require a huge amount of teamwork. Saiing with a symmetric over 25 knots on most boats is challenging in the least. Replacing them all with large light genoas removes massive amounts of teamwork.

 

I don't see the Etchells, J-22, J-24 fleets disappearing any time in the future. The youth sailors ideally need a bit of symmetric kite practice before getting on the big boats. The 420's provide that, but the trap often makes it more difficult than it should be.

 

As a race coach and Learn to Sail instructor I would start kids at 7/8 in Optis till 10. Then make an educated decision based upon height weight ability and temperament. Either keep them in Optis till 13 or move them into Open Bics(they have 2 sails that no one knows about (ie 3.8 dacron & 4.5 mylar). Bics are switching at this year Europeans to the 3.8m sail for under 13 and the 4.5m will be the under 16 sail.

 

The suitable double handed boat is still the big unanswered question. There are at least 20 classes around the planet that serve the purpose. But all have various limitations.

 

The Blue Jays were the go back in the day in Long Island sound. They are mostly wood and/or old and tired. Besides being a regional class.

 

International Cadets are really nice boats, but alittle on the small size. The cool thing is they are a well run class. They still encourage amatuer builders. Glass and wood/glass boats. You can build an epoxy biaxial glass skinned cedar cored hull yourself to compete in the worlds with a licensed builders polyester/matt/roving foam core boat. Yes, the wood ones do win. They even let you do 505 style split end boom sheeting or 420 style center boom. They do restrict the sails. One of each. You can have anyone make them, but you only get one of each.

 

We have fleets down here in AU, and I can build killer wood like boats. My kids are growning into the limbo age of 10-13.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Isn't the question more Topper Topaz vs RS Feva? I didn't even know Pixels still existed

 

Pixels are still going pretty strong, I hear.

 

But now that our summer camps have been running, I can report a little more about the Topaz Uno+ (why Topper decided to name several very different models "Topaz" is difficult to figure out).

 

Assembling them from the factory shipping wrap... we had to figure out how to take the swivel cleats off, which was a PITA. Also, we were missing some stuff but had extras of stuff for other boats... go figure

post-30927-0-19117800-1437396220_thumb.jpg

 

They're heavy, but it teaches the kids teamwork getting rigged & launched

post-30927-0-63169900-1437396463_thumb.jpg

 

Our smaller-sized girls can handle them well (given that they have the appropriate skill) and they scoot right along in light air

post-30927-0-70038100-1437396333_thumb.jpg

 

No spinnaker excitement, but learning starts is always fun

post-30927-0-24041100-1437396490_thumb.jpg

 

Some teething issues, but we like these boats so well that we are getting more (as funding comes up).

 

FB- Doug

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Learning to sail with asymmetric kites, before trapeze is a good strategy!

 

 

 

post-35406-0-76868600-1437414660_thumb.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

JSA of LIS did compare the Pixel against the Feva during a long process. I wish they went with the Feva but the powers that be did not.

 

My personal thinking is that the people making the selection wanted a pole boat since that is what they knew. Also Bruce Kirby has a following around these parts and I think that may have also had something to do with it. There was a long process and reading the documents the pixel did come out on top but cost did not seem to be discussed much.

 

At the time the Feva was $1000 (15%) less than the Pixel.

 

Note these links show up the same due to truncation in the forums but they point to different documents.

https://jsalis.securespsites.com/JSA%20Pixel%20library/JSA_Boat_Review_Survey_Summary_verOct2005.pdf

 

https://jsalis.securespsites.com/JSA%20Pixel%20library/JSA_Article_Pixel_News_and_Questions_verOct2005.pdf

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

JSA of LIS did compare the Pixel against the Feva during a long process. I wish they went with the Feva but the powers that be did not.

 

My personal thinking is that the people making the selection wanted a pole boat since that is what they knew. Also Bruce Kirby has a following around these parts and I think that may have also had something to do with it. There was a long process and reading the documents the pixel did come out on top but cost did not seem to be discussed much.

 

At the time the Feva was $1000 (15%) less than the Pixel.

 

Note these links show up the same due to truncation in the forums but they point to different documents.

https://jsalis.securespsites.com/JSA%20Pixel%20library/JSA_Boat_Review_Survey_Summary_verOct2005.pdf

 

https://jsalis.securespsites.com/JSA%20Pixel%20library/JSA_Article_Pixel_News_and_Questions_verOct2005.pdf

 

Hmm, the documents make it look like it wasn't a whitewash but the only reason the Pixel came into existence was being commissioned by JS-LIS... at least, that's how I understand the story. I also heard some of the people involved say that they had never heard of the Feva when setting up for the Pixel, but it looks like at least some of the other leaders had. They were definitely committed to a conventional spinnaker pole, but I would think a Feva could be fitted with one fairly easily.

 

Our group has a lot less money to spend. We looked at a number of options for small sloops including the ever-popular A: do nothing. It's my firm belief that putting Opti-sized kids in a 420 is not only not good, it's a disaster waiting to happen, and experience increasingly confirms that. We have a Hobie 405 which is a cool little boat but it's tender and rare in the US, no chance of putting together a fleet. We also trialed a Puffer which would have been our choice until one of the parents found such a great deal on the Topaz.

 

Why doesn't somebody produce a scaled-down 420? There should be a GREAT market for it. For that matter, a scaled-up 420 ain't a bad idea

 

B)

 

FB- Doug

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You are 100% correct regarding how the Pixel was born. If it was not for JSA of LIS it would not have happened.

 

JSA of LIS did compare the Pixel against the Feva during a long process. I wish they went with the Feva but the powers that be did not.

 

My personal thinking is that the people making the selection wanted a pole boat since that is what they knew. Also Bruce Kirby has a following around these parts and I think that may have also had something to do with it. There was a long process and reading the documents the pixel did come out on top but cost did not seem to be discussed much.

 

At the time the Feva was $1000 (15%) less than the Pixel.

 

Note these links show up the same due to truncation in the forums but they point to different documents.

https://jsalis.securespsites.com/JSA%20Pixel%20library/JSA_Boat_Review_Survey_Summary_verOct2005.pdf

 

https://jsalis.securespsites.com/JSA%20Pixel%20library/JSA_Article_Pixel_News_and_Questions_verOct2005.pdf

 

Hmm, the documents make it look like it wasn't a whitewash but the only reason the Pixel came into existence was being commissioned by JS-LIS... at least, that's how I understand the story. I also heard some of the people involved say that they had never heard of the Feva when setting up for the Pixel, but it looks like at least some of the other leaders had. They were definitely committed to a conventional spinnaker pole, but I would think a Feva could be fitted with one fairly easily.

 

Our group has a lot less money to spend. We looked at a number of options for small sloops including the ever-popular A: do nothing. It's my firm belief that putting Opti-sized kids in a 420 is not only not good, it's a disaster waiting to happen, and experience increasingly confirms that. We have a Hobie 405 which is a cool little boat but it's tender and rare in the US, no chance of putting together a fleet. We also trialed a Puffer which would have been our choice until one of the parents found such a great deal on the Topaz.

 

Why doesn't somebody produce a scaled-down 420? There should be a GREAT market for it. For that matter, a scaled-up 420 ain't a bad idea

 

B)

 

FB- Doug

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Howard Johnson (and Doug + Robalex) is right!

Also, the Pixel is Chinese built pure crap. ( Didn't they take back the first dozen made and chainsaw them?)

But it was a better and more exciting than a Blue Jay at the time.

 

If I recall, the JSA is not supporting Feva regattas this year, but some progressive clubs

went ahead with them anyway. Other clubs have investments in Pixels and are afraid to bring in

Fevas to render them obsolete. Our club has a 50 optis in the program. Some club owned Pixels. No Fevas.

 

If you do a search on 'Feva' on the JSA site, you get one hit for an instructor job at HYC.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Edith,

Sort of correct regarding the chain saw. First dozen were fine. But then the china men in the wisdom decided to change the layup for the next 40 or so boats without telling anybody. Turned out one little bump and you had a 2' hole in the boat, think egg shell. That batch got the dumpster. Still fragile boats and masts that won't last forever like aluminum. They do sail nice in the light air of LIS but there are maintenance nightmares and eventually they will disappear. Nobody is buying them anymore. Most people just lease.

 

(Getting back to the china thing. That company that was contracted to build only had experience building crew shells where light is good and no need to engineer for impact. So they actually thought they were doing a good thing by changing the layup and making them lighter. But sailboats are not crew shells as they now know. Expensive lesson for many.)

 

 

Howard Johnson (and Doug + Robalex) is right!
Also, the Pixel is Chinese built pure crap. ( Didn't they take back the first dozen made and chainsaw them?)
But it was a better and more exciting than a Blue Jay at the time.

If I recall, the JSA is not supporting Feva regattas this year, but some progressive clubs
went ahead with them anyway. Other clubs have investments in Pixels and are afraid to bring in
Fevas to render them obsolete. Our club has a 50 optis in the program. Some club owned Pixels. No Fevas.

If you do a search on 'Feva' on the JSA site, you get one hit for an instructor job at HYC.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Why doesn't somebody produce a scaled-down 420? There should be a GREAT market for it. For that matter, a scaled-up 420 ain't a bad idea

 

B)

 

FB- Doug

There was a scaled down 505 dinghy kicking around my club for a few years, called a 303, which sounds a lot like what you want. It is hard to find much about them online, as the access 303 is a much more popular boat and dominates the googles.

This Binks marine page is about all I can find from my mobile

 

http://binksmarine.com.au/services/boats/boats-available

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Edith,

Sort of correct regarding the chain saw. First dozen were fine. But then the china men in the wisdom decided to change the layup for the next 40 or so boats without telling anybody. Turned out one little bump and you had a 2' hole in the boat, think egg shell. That batch got the dumpster. Still fragile boats and masts that won't last forever like aluminum. They do sail nice in the light air of LIS but there are maintenance nightmares and eventually they will disappear. Nobody is buying them anymore. Most people just lease.

 

(Getting back to the china thing. That company that was contracted to build only had experience building crew shells where light is good and no need to engineer for impact. So they actually thought they were doing a good thing by changing the layup and making them lighter. But sailboats are not crew shells as they now know. Expensive lesson for many.)

 

 

 

Let me guess--was it happy lucky dragon boatbuilding company limited that builds the Winklevoss shells?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The 505 is simply awesome and the 303 is very interesting. If you built an international 420 with epoxy instead of polyester you might have longer life and great performance. The club 420 is just not anywhere near as lively as the international one. The international is trickier to sail than a 505 -- it is very quick reacting -- but small and light and easy for small kids to recover. Some of the newer designs float too high when they flip.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Two weeks ago, these kids never sailed.

Here they are, on a Feva flying a kite.

Asymmetric is so easy and fun.

 

post-35406-0-87637600-1438232679_thumb.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Two weeks ago, these kids never sailed.

Here they are, on a Feva flying a flying jib.

Asymmetric is so easy and fun.

 

 

fixed it for you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ok, gennaker

Both of my kids were steering a 505 in 15 knots with a kite up--10 minutes after getting in the boat for the first time. I admit it is a great thrill to have someone doing that early. Years ago I sailed up the river in a J27 and picked up my then aged 14 505 skipper from the dock. He hadn't sailed a keelboat before. I hand him the tiller and go forward. "Um, what are you doing?" "I'm putting up the spinnaker." I looked back and he had that expression on his face--you know the one--the same one the kids in your photo had when they got that feva going that day and the same one my kids had in the 505.

 

Whatever happened to that word, "gennaker?" I kind of liked it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are people still really sailing the Pixel? Why teach kids on a boat with a symmetric spinnaker? That's so old school.

 

The RS Feva is the ideal boat for kids transitioning from the Optimist. No question.

 

So all you junior sailing organizers need to decide. Train your kids in 21st century skills? Or teach them to be dodos? Your call.

 

More importantly, is the US ever going to get serious about developing kids who can be future Olympic champions?

 

Go Feva!!!

US sailing started the Olympic Development Program lead by Leandro Spina. Being part of it, I can say they are dedicated to prepare us for the 2020 and 2024 games (US sailing sponsored so clinics are free). Classes of focus are 29er(skiffs rule), lasers and international 4-twinkies. When they aren't sending us to clinics they're getting us into oakcliffs 49ers. So to answer your question yes :) the US is finally getting serious.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fast forward two years and the Junior Sailing Association of Long Island Sound now has 8 RS Feva regattas this season.

JSA-LIS-RS_Feva regattas.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Both boats are great boats for learning to sail a double handed boat

I've sailed both. I did one season in a pixel, and I am going into my second season in a feva.

Pixel: This was my first double handed boat, and it definitely served its purpose. It's good for learning, and there's lots of room for multiple kids to enjoy. The symmetrical kite is hard, and even though you might not need the skill on modern boats, the more different skills you have, the better sailor you'll be. My complaint however, is that it's not very "high performance" and it has too many parts. The boat takes longer to rig and just understand all together.

RS Feva:

Now this is a great first double handed boat. It's very fast, so it's good for racing, and  it has much less parts then the pixel so it's much easier to rig and sail. It's very light weight, so it's much easier to get back up after capsizing. The design is cool, and it's kite is perfect for the current boats being built.

Both boats are fun and great learning boats. However, with experience in both, I must say that the RS Feva is better.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, Caitlin W. said:

Both boats are great boats for learning to sail a double handed boat

I've sailed both. I did one season in a pixel, and I am going into my second season in a feva.

Pixel: This was my first double handed boat, and it definitely served its purpose. It's good for learning, and there's lots of room for multiple kids to enjoy. The symmetrical kite is hard, and even though you might not need the skill on modern boats, the more different skills you have, the better sailor you'll be. My complaint however, is that it's not very "high performance" and it has too many parts. The boat takes longer to rig and just understand all together.

RS Feva:

Now this is a great first double handed boat. It's very fast, so it's good for racing, and  it has much less parts then the pixel so it's much easier to rig and sail. It's very light weight, so it's much easier to get back up after capsizing. The design is cool, and it's kite is perfect for the current boats being built.

Both boats are fun and great learning boats. However, with experience in both, I must say that the RS Feva is better.

I appreciate your perspective as having experience with both. Thank you!

FB- Doug

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Feva Worlds will be in Florida April 2018.
Imagine there will be 60-80 Fevas available for sale after the event at discounted prices.

 

So far this year, we've sold around 20 Fevas to racing programs out here. 
It's growing nice and steadily.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now