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For those knowing of AIS workings, at some point will they or can they change the name of the boat?  We have at least three boats that are different names and it is a pain to keep translating and it would seem confusing to other vessels.

 

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The MMSIs are assigned to the boats - they can either rename them with the registration authority, or delist the existing MMSI and get a new one. Probably just a little behind in getting the paperwork done - they're still working on getting all the registration stuff ready for Fastnet. 

http://www.rolexfastnetrace.com/downloads/images/2017_news/2017-RFR-Entry-List-All-Classes-290717.pdf

 

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re "most of".  Unless airlifted, it would seem impossible to get #8 on the line in time.  I so want to cling to Jack's painful release of information, but his credibility...I dunno.   I can see VOR waving the leg 0 requirement if in between now and them the mystery team takes a flyer across the pond and back or at least to the Azores.  I don't really see where racing in a large fleet of boats is any more viable training then a cruise to there and back again.

I keep pounding out the point that this little mystery can be broken in a moment if a camera is pointed at fSCA and at some point it goes into the shop a white boat and comes out colorful.

Just for fun, a little google maps shows this below.  Not certain exactly where the Boatyard is located, I snagged those where it said VOR.  Not sure if that is a VO70 sitting there or a tarted up 65, but I could not see any VO style hulls along the water line.  Where is SCA parked and if it would be around that section, where is the hull?  MarineTraffic last recorded it in that location back in 2015.

Hmmmm.......

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That's just the VOR museum in Alicante. 

My understanding is a team can also qualify by doing the 2,000 sea mile qualification. Not insubstantial considering the obligations required re getting yacht master certification and other mandatory training. There isn't going to be an intentional effort to subterfuge team #8 until the last minute - no one is going to hide participation. The reality is simply that it has taken this long and nothing solid has materialized yet. 

Boat 1 is sunk cost ready for team 8, but team 8 has not been offered at the right price. Could VOR waive it altogether for a bare bones team? Maybe. But it isn't by design.

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43 minutes ago, Miffy said:

 

I struggle to understand how what I said above is male. Have you ever stepped abroad a VOR65 and seen how high the handholds are? Or how little visibility a smaller person has at the helm even with the elevated platforms? Like I said above, I hope the next gen boats address this issue because while the first OD effort involved a lot of good veterans to make the boats functional, they appeared to have designed them around someone who is 185cm. 

 

Thank you :)

Yes I have, and neither seem to be a problem to me, and neither Liz nor Sam (two of the smaller ones on SCA) seem to have had any difficulty handling that boat or seeing where they are going. Maybe they are a bit tougher/cleverer than you think! Don't forget they won the tough upwind leg to Lorient. You do not have to be a big person to be a top ocean racer.

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Shrug. You seem hell bent on trying to frame what I said as saying height dictates sailing ability. When I keep trying to highlight the difficulty of making ergonomics work on a VOR65 when you're not as tall as a standard northern European. Like I said, it is a height issue presented by this class of boats - smaller men have the same difficulty as smaller women. And again - I hope they address this for the VO60s.


Based on what I recall in discussions re margin of safety in VO and what you've previously termed as "not true sailing" - I think you just like to dig in a pretend argument and keep at it. Fortunately it takes 2 and I'll just ignore it now.

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30 minutes ago, Miffy said:

That's just the VOR museum in Alicante. 

My understanding is a team can also qualify by doing the 2,000 sea mile qualification. Not insubstantial considering the obligations required re getting yacht master certification and other mandatory training. There isn't going to be an intentional effort to subterfuge team #8 until the last minute - no one is going to hide participation. The reality is simply that it has taken this long and nothing solid has materialized yet. 

Boat 1 is sunk cost ready for team 8, but team 8 has not been offered at the right price. Could VOR waive it altogether for a bare bones team? Maybe. But it isn't by design.

Your last sentence is not quite clear, but I think I get the jist.

If that is the museum, where is the Boatyard?  Nothing stood out, nor could I seem to find another VOR hull.

Well a trip to the Azores and back would take care of that.  Hiding participation could be a real thing which is why I find it curious that sailing reporters bloggers  or fans around Alicante could not monitor or check in just to see if there is movement.  Is there still a white hull in the same spot as before?  Making Fastnet is over, but Oct is two months away and plenty of time to get a qualifier in.

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3 minutes ago, Miffy said:

The perm boatyard is in Lisbon. 38.695,-9.23

Yes, I found the spot and your numbers confirm it.

Where is it now? and where is fSCA?  I'm guessing the Boatyard is in Portsmouth, because it sure as heck in not in Lisbon, at least parked where it was.  as to fSCA,I figure they got a new MMSI number on that boat which is why my Marine traffic has it in it's last place from 2015.  

There are 7 boats in the water in the commodore yachting marina, but not current enough Sat images to see where the BY is set up, because that would be where I'd put fSCA since it was not left back in Lisbon.

Where is that 8th boat now?

Just for fun I sent a message off to the boatyard.  Not sure if they will answer, but what the heck.

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2 hours ago, MR.CLEAN said:

George Peet is one of the best trimmers anywhere, and pound for pound one of the strongest, but at about Liz's height he could not get a ride after ABN2 entirely because of his diminutive size.  He won several world championships, was one of the top US Moth sailors, and crushes it in big boats, but because of the crew number requirements, size is always at a premium.

Well, Liz has a ride so what does that say about what your opinion is worth?

... or are you tryiong to say Liz has only got a ride because she is a girl?

... or what exactly is the point you are so laboriously trying to make?

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4 hours ago, MR.CLEAN said:

George Peet is one of the best trimmers anywhere, and pound for pound one of the strongest, but at about Liz's height he could not get a ride after ABN2 entirely because of his diminutive size.

3 hours ago, staysail said:

neither Liz nor Sam (two of the smaller ones on SCA) seem to have had any difficulty handling that boat or seeing where they are going. Maybe they are a bit tougher/cleverer than you think! Don't forget they won the tough upwind leg to Lorient. You do not have to be a big person to be a top ocean racer.

 

Trimmers don't have to be tall today, they only have to be able to reach the winch drum and hold the sheet and call "grind", and once the grinder sees the sheet being eased, the grinder stops grinding, if he/she has any sense. Maybe on ABN2 it was different, but I was a trimmer long before then, and before that there was a time long long ago when one trimmed with a winch handle in the other hand, even on a 44ft! And I agree with staysail about 'shorter' people being able to handle boats and see where they are going. The SCA photos show that clearly. The VOR65 has two wheels and both have clear sight along the side deck.  Someone not tall enough to see above the hub of the wheel would be in trouble, but nobody else.

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No such position as a trimmer only on these boats... which being on their ear all the time your better off tall with one leg shorter than the other. They are a grinding platform nightmare.

 

 

 

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20 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

No such position as a trimmer only on these boats... which being on their ear all the time your better off tall with one leg shorter than the other. They are a grinding platform nightmare.

 

 

 

 ... boat for a welsh sheep?

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51 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

No such position as a trimmer only on these boats... which being on their ear all the time your better off tall with one leg shorter than the other.

Sorry Jack, they grind athwartship on a VOR65, i.e. one high and one low, and my post included trimmer, helm and by inference going up the f---g mast, As for staysail that's a real old UK joke like about 70 years plus.

Still pleased that Liz got a ride and that AkzoNobel now has two women.

So Team Eight is MICA (missing in current action) not MIA or DOA. Pity nobody on this forum appears to know what the actaul qualification requirements for this race are. Maybe there's some small print at the bottom of the sponsor application form that says " we reserve the right to change every and all rules and requirements as we see fit"?

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So would you rather have Boat 8 sit in the shed just because it hasn't done Fastnet or a trip across the Atlantic?

Given the likely crew a 2000 mile shakedown will be plenty and I would expect some will have sailed the VO65 before.

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2 hours ago, Retired Sailor said:

Trimmers don't have to be tall today, they only have to be able to reach the winch drum and hold the sheet and call "grind", and once the grinder sees the sheet being eased, the grinder stops grinding, if he/she has any sense. Maybe on ABN2 it was different, but I was a trimmer long before then, and before that there was a time long long ago when one trimmed with a winch handle in the other hand, even on a 44ft! And I agree with staysail about 'shorter' people being able to handle boats and see where they are going. The SCA photos show that clearly. The VOR65 has two wheels and both have clear sight along the side deck.  Someone not tall enough to see above the hub of the wheel would be in trouble, but nobody else.

That's nice in theory, but doesn't always work. You'd be right if all you ever had to do was trim or steer. But what about those awkward moments?  I've never been on a VO65, but have had to reef an SC 70 many times. At 6'2", it can be hard to reach what you need to. At 5 feet and change, it'd be hilarious. 

That's not a slight on women. The vast majority of boats I've raced on were mixed crew, and many of the women were better sailors than I'll ever be. However...  the world's best five foot ladder isn't very useful if you need a six foot one to do the job. 

This is professional racing. Someone's body type (guy or girl), very much factors into the equation. 

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28 minutes ago, DtM said:

So would you rather have Boat 8 sit in the shed just because it hasn't done Fastnet or a trip across the Atlantic?

I don't have 'would rathers', but like most people I prefer always to see fair play. Even if sponsors are prepared to accept open ended contracts, I'm disappointed that professional sailors might be. VOR made such a fuss about Leg Zero. It should have been quite simple for VOR to put the last boat on the start line for the Fastnet, (hell it was ready weeks ago) and go on from there, i.e. have the boat complete at least the first leg of Leg Zero, and then switcharoo.  In my opinion, not being on that start line is an insult to all the sponsors and crews that did make it, even if some crew are still auditioning. If it's in the small print of the sponsor contract so be it, but if VOR wants an honorable reputation then it better well earn it!!! Right now it stinks to high heaven!

14 minutes ago, Monkey said:

but have had to reef an SC 70 many times. At 6'2", it can be hard to reach what you need to. At 5 feet and change, it'd be hilarious.

I have no knowledge of an SC 70, but on the majority of 65ft and smaller boats built within the last 35 years you can help reef if you can at lest reach the forward end of the boom, and on many I don't believe that you even have to do that any more.  

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Do you seriously think that VOR would not have Boat 8 at Fastnet if it had a team? Really.

Honourable reputation!! What a load of sanctimonious crap.

 

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Listen, I'll freely accept I'm wearing a tinfoil hat, but when I google maps the spot were the BY is suppose to be, it ain't there and google says it took the picture in 2017.  They tell me they are there so a camera shot tomorrow would prove that out.  Anyone live in or know someone in Lisbon who can walk (boat) and take a photo.  If they are not there then where is fSCA.  

CLEAN is too busy getting of on his foils so I doubt he'd do any kind of research, but it would not take much effort from someone near Lisbon to put to rest if fSCA is dry docked in Lisbon, wet docked in Lisbon, or not.  Hell, if I spoke Spanish I'd even try calling a local newspaper, just to see if they'd investigate.

If not....where is she? 

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25 minutes ago, DtM said:

Do you seriously think that VOR would not have Boat 8 at Fastnet if it had a team? Really.

If VOR wants to protect 'its brand', then, yes I do believe that it should have had the, as yet, unassigned boat on the start line for the Fastnet. In my opinion, it is just a question of commitment, or the small print in the sponsor contract. Hell, couldn't the boat yard and a whole host of others have formed a work's team to keep it 'honest'? I haven't the faintest idea what a 'brand' is worth, but that is what VOR is asking sponsors to do, step up and pay the price of 'your brand'.

As to sanctimonious, that's your 'brand', not mine!

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21 minutes ago, bucc5062 said:

Listen, I'll freely accept I'm wearing a tinfoil hat, but when I google maps the spot were the BY is suppose to be, it ain't there and google says it took the picture in 2017.  They tell me they are there so a camera shot tomorrow would prove that out.  Anyone live in or know someone in Lisbon who can walk (boat) and take a photo.  If they are not there then where is fSCA.  

CLEAN is too busy getting of on his foils so I doubt he'd do any kind of research, but it would not take much effort from someone near Lisbon to put to rest if fSCA is dry docked in Lisbon, wet docked in Lisbon, or not.  Hell, if I spoke Spanish I'd even try calling a local newspaper, just to see if they'd investigate.

If not....where is she? 

 

The boat yard is right where I showed you. They refurbished all the boats and fitted out new boat 8 out of two fish warehouses and a tent. There's even a tent with the word boat yard. 

 

No one is screwing with you. Boat 1, formerly SCA is inLisbon . 

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12 minutes ago, bucc5062 said:

 

50 minutes ago, DtM said:

Do you seriously think that VOR would not have Boat 8 at Fastnet if it had a team? Really.

Honourable reputation!! What a load of sanctimonious crap.

 

When did being honorable become sanctimonious.  Let's look at it simply.  Last round, did VOR have 7 or 8 boats built?  If eight then perhaps there is an argument that the have no need to push 8 on the line.  However, if only 7 were built and they put 7, then they honored the effort to get all boats racing.

Now we have 8 (it we didn't before).  I've been on the path of where is the 8th boat and not a one seems to care (which is sad), because where it is would say a lot about what would happen to it.  Is it in Lisbon?  Is it in Portsmouth?  We, meaning the VOR fans have a missing boat and at this point, that is more intriguing than if a 5'5 sailor can handle a position on a VO65 (really?  we're arguing height?  Question,  average sailor that stands 6' or very experienced 5'5" Salt that can react before the shit flies...choose)
 

CLEAN is pimping AC35 models, but heaven forbid he attempts to figure out if VOR is dishing out "fake news" or even trying to find a 65' boat.  You're right CLEAN, maybe I do need to be your editor.  Hire me.  You try to talk to Mark, your best bud, like he'd tell you something instead of actually investigating something.

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2 minutes ago, Miffy said:

 

The boat yard is right where I showed you. They refurbished all the boats and fitted out new boat 8 out of two fish warehouses and a tent. There's even a tent with the word boat yard. 

 

No one is screwing with you. Boat 1, formerly SCA is inLisbon . 

Fine...give me a picture.  I understand no one is screwing with me...the point is, no one is able to show something as simple as a boat on stilts, in a yard.  If I lived there I'd do it myself, but surely all these seasoned blue water sailors have a friend in Lisbon that can take a picture.

Technically, new boat 8 is old formally SCA. 

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For Christ's sake, it is not the boat that needs to do the shakedown sail  and/or the Fastnet it is the crew.  ExSCA we already know can sail around the world.  So having a works crew that is not the VOR crew sail Fastnet  does not fix anything.

There is a previous photo of the unbranded Boat 8 in this thread ( I can't be bothered to find it) sitting on the hard next to the just painted Brunel (I think).

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2 hours ago, DtM said:

For Christ's sake, it is not the boat that needs to do the shakedown sail  and/or the Fastnet it is the crew.

No need for that, nor is anyone saying the boat needs a shakedown sail. The point of the current absence of an eighth team and its corresponding boat is that I, and I believe many others on this forum, understood that to do the forthcoming VOR race, boats had to complete Leg Zero and the Prologue to qualify. I say boats because we know that at least one team is still selecting crew and Bouwe is also being very coy, so crew isn't the criterion. The criterion was understood to be the boat doing Leg Zero and the Prologue . If that is not the case, and you know that categorically, then say so, but you're about a month too late doing it!

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Notice of Race.

8. QUALIFICATIONS TO RACE.

8.1 Prior to the Assembly Date, each Boat entered in the Race must complete open

qualification races as required and approved by the OA. Crews for qualification races

shall be at least 60% (rounded up) of the Crew Members for Leg 1 The 60% shall

contain at least the Person in Charge, a Reserve Person in Charge and the navigator.

The qualification races are:

(i) Leg Zero August 2017- incorporating a Round the Isle of Wight Race for

VO65 yachts during Cowes Week, the Rolex Fastnet Race and a race for

VO65 yachts from Plymouth to Lisbon with a Pit stop in St Malo.

(ii) Prologue - for Volvo Ocean 65 Class Boats October 2017 Lisbon to

Alicante.

8.2 These qualification races may contain the following: a dock-out ceremony and arrivals

ceremony, fitting and sailing with the emergency steering the rescue kite, complete a

man overboard recovery, and other tasks as may be specified by the RC, these shall

be recorded on video and other forms of media and transmitted back to race control.

Full testing of all communications equipment through race control.

8.3 Should a Boat entered in the Race be unable to complete any one of the qualification

races or passages in NOR 8.1 or 8.2 or any of their requirements she shall complete

a race or passage or fulfil the requirements as directed by the OA before she starts in

the Race.

8.4 The Team shall supply a crew list to the OA for the qualification race(s) or passage(s)

in NOR 8.1 and 8.2 at least 48 hours before they start each event.

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2 hours ago, Retired Sailor said:

No need for that, nor is anyone saying the boat needs a shakedown sail. The point of the current absence of an eighth team and its corresponding boat is that I, and I believe many others on this forum, understood that to do the forthcoming VOR race, boats had to complete Leg Zero and the Prologue to qualify. I say boats because we know that at least one team is still selecting crew and Bouwe is also being very coy, so crew isn't the criterion. The criterion was understood to be the boat doing Leg Zero and the Prologue . If that is not the case, and you know that categorically, then say so, but you're about a month too late doing it!

Firstly, just read through the NOR, and you will see that the leg zero qualification can be a movable feast.

Secondly, the Fastnet is also able to change their qualification criteria, it is not unusual for an OA to allow for unusual circumstances. 

Thirdly, a photo of the unbranded boat 8 at the boatyard in Lisbon has already been posted in this thread.

Boat 8 is not currently in Gosport, will not be doing the Fastnet, and I hope they have a team that can get on it and do some suitable qualifying miles in the next month or so.

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4 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

This thread will shortly require a "I admit I'm Insane" as a qualifier to post. 

This is a new thing?

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I am being driven insane by the endless conspiracy theories of Bucc and RS and their inability to read the Notice of Race and the SI's and posts on this thread.

So, I admit I am insane or at least well on the way !!!

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1 hour ago, DtM said:

8.3 Should a Boat entered in the Race be unable to complete any one of the qualification

races or passages in NOR 8.1 or 8.2 or any of their requirements she shall complete

a race or passage or fulfil the requirements as directed by the OA before she starts in

the Race.

This so-called rule, is the organisers "joker".

It simply means that there are no actual mandatory qualification requirements for sailing the boat, regardless of how it is crewed, and the organisers can decide at any time to allow any boat to sail with any crew without any pre-race sailing qualification whatsoever if it suits their objectives. As I see it the objectives now are simply to put on a profitable reality show, and this "rule" is just one example of how this can no longer be considered a serious sporting event.

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47 minutes ago, staysail said:

This so-called rule, is the organisers "joker".

It simply means that there are no actual mandatory qualification requirements for sailing the boat, regardless of how it is crewed, and the organisers can decide at any time to allow any boat to sail with any crew without any pre-race sailing qualification whatsoever if it suits their objectives. As I see it the objectives now are simply to put on a profitable reality show, and this "rule" is just one example of how this can no longer be considered a serious sporting event.

Why? That rule exists in the NOR for the Fastnet, the Middle Sea Race, the Vendee Globe and many other offshore races. Possibly the Sydney Hobart, but I am less sure about that one.

It allows the organisers to get a boat into the Fleet without completing all qualifications; whilst at the same time enforces the requirements on any team they think need more experience.  It puts a lot of onus on the organisers, but that is their choice.

Why close the door to entry, when you can open it? If a team rocks up with no prior experience but a ton of cash then I am 100% certain Phil Lawrence would put a heavy alternative qualification process on them, if he allowed them to enter at all.

The whole leg zero process is surely what people here want, but why turn away a team with suitable experience, just because they took longer to raise the funds?

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Can I add Staysail to the list of those that have driven me insane please?

What is the problem with you. Surely we all want 8 boats on the start line in October if that is possible.  How can that compromise it being a "serious sporting event". It is hardly likely that the organisers are going to allow complete novices with no training and a skipper with no qualifications.  But if a suitably qualified group of sailors (again try reading the NOR to find out what the very significant list of requirements is) with a sponsor roll up then let's get them racing. As Potter says keep the door open rather than shutting it.

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7 hours ago, bucc5062 said:

Listen, I'll freely accept I'm wearing a tinfoil hat, but when I google maps the spot were the BY is suppose to be, it ain't there and google says it took the picture in 2017.  They tell me they are there so a camera shot tomorrow would prove that out.  Anyone live in or know someone in Lisbon who can walk (boat) and take a photo.  If they are not there then where is fSCA.  

CLEAN is too busy getting of on his foils so I doubt he'd do any kind of research, but it would not take much effort from someone near Lisbon to put to rest if fSCA is dry docked in Lisbon, wet docked in Lisbon, or not.  Hell, if I spoke Spanish I'd even try calling a local newspaper, just to see if they'd investigate.

If not....where is she? 

So, lets's play the Satellite Anarchy joker in this game of Who Wants to Be a VOR sailor?.

Is it this lonely boat?

59818b4dc6106_Lisbontheboatyardenhanced2crop.png.9c26510f5e0f2c70ddc6e63e6299eb20.png
No, that is in July 2015. Size checks out though. (It's ADOR.)

Continued in next post.

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32 minutes ago, Potter said:

Why? That rule exists in the NOR for the Fastnet, the Middle Sea Race, the Vendee Globe and many other offshore races. Possibly the Sydney Hobart, but I am less sure about that one.

It allows the organisers to get a boat into the Fleet without completing all qualifications; whilst at the same time enforces the requirements on any team they think need more experience.  It puts a lot of onus on the organisers, but that is their choice.

Why close the door to entry, when you can open it? If a team rocks up with no prior experience but a ton of cash then I am 100% certain Phil Lawrence would put a heavy alternative qualification process on them, if he allowed them to enter at all.

The whole leg zero process is surely what people here want, but why turn away a team with suitable experience, just because they took longer to raise the funds?

In the races you quote, even if exactly the same "get out clause" rule exists (I haven't checked), the organisers are not building and renting out the boats. None of it is an issue once you accept this is a "managed show" and not a level playing field sporting competition.

Really what is the point in having all the carefully worded clauses in 8.1, 8.2 and 8.4 if in reality they can be made to appply to one crew, but at the whim of the organiser, they can all be swept magically aside for another? These rules are nothing more than the kind of spin one would expect from a politician..

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How does it look now? No idea, the Satellite Anarchy joker which comes with a time delay at no charge. The most recent pic is from early June:59818c10de0d4_Lisbontheboatyard2017-06-05crop.png.f148129f20f1e2d8e2048b886c7b9dc7.png

 

The Boatyard observations after looking at too many images: A single old design Boatyard appears in April 2016. Change to new design ("VOR") in January 2017, extension with a 2nd, shorter tent branded "The Boatyard" in April 2017.

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8 minutes ago, staysail said:

In the races you quote, even if exactly the same "get out clause" rule exists (I haven't checked), the organisers are not building and renting out the boats. None of it is an issue once you accept this is a "managed show" and not a level playing field sporting competition.

Really what is the point in having all the carefully worded clauses in 8.1, 8.2 and 8.4 if in reality they can be made to appply to one crew, but at the whim of the organiser, they can all be swept magically aside for another? These rules are nothing more than the kind of spin one would expect from a politician..

None of NOR 8 reduces the other crew requirements (which you might take the time to read). In any event, surely it is more likely that a new (but suitably qualified) crew on a refurbished xSCA will start "behind" the rest of the fleet so any "imbalance" in the system works against them rather than the other 7.

How is it a managed show rather than a level playing field competition?

Do you want 8 entries or not?   I do if it is possible. Keep the door open.

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7 minutes ago, Potter said:

Be careful, even Matt was corrected for indicating the race was "Around the isle of Wight" not the Round the island...

Interesting to see that the reefed TTOP seemed to be catching scallywag quickly after a fairly slow start...

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Half way point (ish) and Mapfre lead from DFRT, then Brunel, Akzo, TTTTOP, Scally, Vestas 11.

Looks like all of them are ahead of CQR...who started 10 minutes before them, but seemed to go wide at the Needles.

halfway around.jpg-large

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11 hours ago, bucc5062 said:

Listen, I'll freely accept I'm wearing a tinfoil hat, but when I google maps the spot were the BY is suppose to be, it ain't there and google says it took the picture in 2017.  They tell me they are there so a camera shot tomorrow would prove that out.  Anyone live in or know someone in Lisbon who can walk (boat) and take a photo.  If they are not there then where is fSCA.  

CLEAN is too busy getting of on his foils so I doubt he'd do any kind of research, but it would not take much effort from someone near Lisbon to put to rest if fSCA is dry docked in Lisbon, wet docked in Lisbon, or not.  Hell, if I spoke Spanish I'd even try calling a local newspaper, just to see if they'd investigate.

If not....where is she? 

You'd get better results speaking Portuguese 

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13 minutes ago, mad said:

You'd get better results speaking Portuguese 

Touche'

Insane?  Sure.  I think anyone is who'd follow a race for over 9 months for it does take a level of passion to stay committed.  Would love to know where those preview product Sat images came from; that was pretty cool.

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God bless  marinetraffic.  Looks like a tight battle between Brunnel and Dongfeng.  Loving Dee's position and they are screaming out there.

Watching this live makes me see what kind of desert is the US for promoting sailing. 

 

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12 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

Xabi and Sophie...I think there is around half a dozen gold medals on this boat.

 

It sure us showing.  Mapfre putting a hurt on the fleet today.  Nicely done.  Looks like Dee and crew did well for a first time out.

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So a boat that many complain is slow takes 30 minutes off the Round the Island Record - mmm!

well Done Xiabi & the guy's on Mapfre

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Round the Island race result:
1. MAPFRE
2. Brunel
3. AkzoNobel
4. Dongfeng
5. TurnTidePlastic
6. Vestas
7. Scallywag

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45 minutes ago, shanghaisailor said:

So a boat that many complain is slow takes 30 minutes off the Round the Island Record - mmm!

Out there on it's lonesome in conditions perfect for a record....and it is a dog ...S2H finished 10 hrs behind Loyal, and behind a 100',  a slow Botin 80 and 3 V70'S and lucky to just beat a RP66 that got bogged.

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37 minutes ago, shanghaisailor said:

So a boat that many complain is slow takes 30 minutes off the Round the Island Record - mmm!

well Done Xiabi & the guy's guy's and gal's on Mapfre

ftfy

It looks like they lead start to finish.  Brunel and Dongfeng had a fairly tight race and like how Clean Seas held a good position with supposedly a green team.  Fastnet should prove to be interesting though current forecast (weather underground and windyty) shows lightish winds throughout much of the course.

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6 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

Out there on it's lonesome in conditions perfect for a record....and it is a dog ...S2H finished 10 hrs behind Loyal, and behind a 100',  a slow Botin 80 and 3 V70'S and lucky to just beat a RP66.

Talk about insanity, you just won't let that dog lie.  I may create conspiracy theories for fun, but you keep whacking the same old thing.  You and CLEAN would make a perfect couple.

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5 minutes ago, bucc5062 said:

Talk about insanity, you just won't let that dog lie.  I may create conspiracy theories for fun, but you keep whacking the same old thing.  You and CLEAN would make a perfect couple.

Same old thing...what the fuck are you talking about??? I was talking CQ ...which is a mistake anyway as  Shang was referring to Mapfre.

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9 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

Same old thing...what the fuck are you talking about???

willy-wonka-thats-very-interesting-you-a

I think you need to calm down and rest.  All this excitement is upsetting you Jack and you're forgetting things.

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11 hours ago, DtM said:

I am being driven insane by the endless conspiracy theories of Bucc and RS and their inability to read the Notice of Race and the SI's and posts on this thread.

Now that I have wiped the egg of my face, I apologize for driving anyone insane, but the uncertainty of whether or not Leg Zero counted as a mandatory entry requirement has been around on this forum for months. The best medication to avoid insanity would have been to for someone such as yourself, Potter, Jack etc. to clarify that it was and never has been mandatory, which you have now done. Thank you all.

And what a great race today! The Round the Island race can be a real bitch in light air, and a tough go in strong, as today.  All VOR65 deserve credit.  

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thoughts about the lifevests all crews are wearing now?? I guess Skip Novak won't be happy. Honestly, it will start looking silly or just like the Clipper Race if they are required to wear them with fair weather... time will tell. 

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32 minutes ago, JeronimoII said:

Honestly, it will start looking silly or just like the Clipper Race if they are required to wear them with fair weather... time will tell. 

I hardly think today would count as 'fair weather', and where I live if you're not wearing a life vest on a boat, then you're liable and punishable if the CG see you, not to mention probably being in convention of the sailing instructions. I'm more interested in who the guy is to windward of Dee at the stern??

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33 minutes ago, JeronimoII said:

thoughts about the lifevests all crews are wearing now?? I guess Skip Novak won't be happy. Honestly, it will start looking silly or just like the Clipper Race if they are required to wear them with fair weather... time will tell. 

You did notice it was blowing today and they all had reefs.  I caught the bowman holding one handed to the boat for a moment, I bet he was glad he had a lifevest, just in case. 

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7 hours ago, jack_sparrow said:

Same old thing...what the fuck are you talking about??? I was talking CQ ...which is a mistake anyway as  Shang was referring to Mapfre.

Well to be fair Jack, when first posted....you didn't say.  Editing, it's a beautiful thing.  Turns out three VO65s bested the previous recorded and Mapfre was the best of them.  Well done! 

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14 minutes ago, Retired Sailor said:

I hardly think today would count as 'fair weather', and where I live if you're not wearing a life vest on a boat, then you're liable and punishable if the CG see you, not to mention probably being in convention of the sailing instructions. I'm more interested in who the guy is to windward of Dee at the stern??

Probably Ian Walker. Not doing VOR since he's RYA now.

 

41 minutes ago, JeronimoII said:

thoughts about the lifevests all crews are wearing now?? I guess Skip Novak won't be happy. Honestly, it will start looking silly or just like the Clipper Race if they are required to wear them with fair weather... time will tell. 

 

Probably also a good opportunity to highlight a sponsor. 

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21 minutes ago, Retired Sailor said:

I hardly think today would count as 'fair weather', and where I live if you're not wearing a life vest on a boat, then you're liable and punishable if the CG see you, not to mention probably being in convention of the sailing instructions. I'm more interested in who the guy is to windward of Dee at the stern??

it looks to me like Ian Walker. It could be him with his Abu Dhabi gear on. It would make sense to have him on board for 3 hours of coaching Dee.

on the lifevests, Mapfre had also all wearing them... which was never the case before. Must be a new Volvo safety requirement thing. As we all know, safety is one of the core values of Volvo. 

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They should probably have chase boats follow them through the whole course as well - just in case.  More advertising opportunities as well.

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An observation on life vests, the ones shown in Dee's photo do not pass muster in Canada, nor possibly in the US. Why? They do not have crotch straps!

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Lifejackets were mandatory. Nothing to do with VOR, Cowes Week Race Committee were flying flag Yankee for all competitors.

 

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4 hours ago, Miffy said:

 

https://twitter.com/volvooceanrace/status/892788201227771905

 

Someone is learning how to eat the humble pie with blokes you want to go into a bar fight with. 

 

Shit, he must have forgotten to give his rousing speech about the guys in the red shirts before this race.

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2 minutes ago, Gorn FRANTIC!! said:

Shit, he must have forgotten to give his rousing speech about the guys in the red shirts before this race.


40 knots gusts for 4 hours and they're struggling. Now throw in that effort for leg 4 and 6. Never rooted against a team in VOR but there's a first time for everything - he's going to get a bloody mutiny when one bloke gets sick or too tired and they can barely sail the boat.

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5 hours ago, Miffy said:

 

Someone is learning how to eat the humble pie with blokes you want to go into a bar fight with. 

I don't know anything about Witt, but he doesn't strike me as a humble kind of guy.  Somewhat similar to someone who we are facing in NA these days. I would hazard a guess that Witt's unspoken motto is 'whatever it takes to win'. Question is win what? Accolades or humiliation? Since he doesn't apparently understand the meaning of the latter, it has to be accolades, so at least one woman coming right up! But if she's a true Sheila, she'll do alright, and two Sheilas will put  him in his place. Come on ladies, bring it on. 

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The Witt has suddenly found out that stepping off a powered 100' onto something unpowered with less arms and legs is easier said than done. I can see some personal changes happening to be competitive.

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1 hour ago, bucc5062 said:

Well to be fair Jack, when first posted....you didn't say.  Editing, it's a beautiful thing.  Turns out three VO65s bested the previous recorded and Mapfre was the best of them.  Well done! 

I didn't edit the original post that caused you to go into a apocalyptic rant and still have no idea what your talking about????? Read the label, beer is not just for breakfast anymore.

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24 minutes ago, jack_sparrow said:

The Witt has suddenly found out that stepping off a powered 100' onto something unpowered with less arms and legs is easier said than done. I can see some personal changes happening to be competitive.

Scallywag need a sailing coach. They'll be exposed in the Volvo race IMO. This Volvo doesn't interest me too much as I'm not excited about the boats. The VO70's were a better boat. I'm used to seeing Scallywag fall behind Oats because they don't sail the boat well. I'd like to see them do well in this and on Scallywag just wish they could get their act together. Yes it's early days in the Volvo and I know I'm jumping the gun but if you compete in a one design class you only have your sailing ability on display.

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2 hours ago, Alinghi4ever said:

MAPFRE has definitly some wheels in these kind of conditions. That does not bode well for Dongers when we reach the Southern Ocean in November/December this year. They seem to have better Helmsman. Hopefully Charles/Pascal have some tricks up their sleeve.

Are you really comparing a day with breeze sailing round the island to the Southern ocean?

 

You're even more of an idiot than I realised. 

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14 minutes ago, mad said:

I wonder much humble pie he'll being eating after a couple of legs?

 

I think leg 4 and 6 from Aust to China, China to NZ will be the roughest leg for the crew. While the southern ocean is physically harsh, going from southern hemisphere to north and back thru that region will just be brutal for navigation and avoiding garbage and becalmed conditions. Not exactly downwind trades either so it'll be brutal. 

Assuming they do the usual skipper and navigator are floating - 5 people split between watch is just hell. 

He's going to either have to swallow the humble pie now and hope good women are willing to sail with a fuckwit that calls them a social experiment, or be a joke during the race. 

Personally I wish all the experienced qualified women, a small community that talks, sign with other teams or are too busy and let him eat his own medicine for being a prick. 

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13 hours ago, jack_sparrow said:

 

tumblr_ou1xtnqmcy1vscj99o1_1280.jpg

 

.......''dang,,, surely there's anudder f###ing reefpoint!''

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Can someone link to me Witt's comments regarding mixed crews plz? Not doubting that he made them just haven't read the full piece.

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2 hours ago, jack_sparrow said:

I didn't edit the original post that caused you to go into a apocalyptic rant and still have no idea what your talking about????? Read the label, beer is not just for breakfast anymore.

Jack, I love ya.  Don't ever change.  I am just going to love you to death this round.  Fuck beer, Vodka or go home.

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1 hour ago, mad said:

Are you really comparing a day with breeze sailing round the island to the Southern ocean?

 

You're even more of an idiot than I realised. 

And so it begins....Let's accept that in this face off, DF did not deliver.  bad start, and they did not show the same speed options up front.  Maybe they dogged it, or maybe Mapfre did their homework and got the right crew and brains on board.  No sane person will compare a couple of hours in the mixer to the SO as a clear test, but Mapfre showed speed from the start and if I were in that fleet, I'd be wanting to know why.  Like it or not, but in a OD fleet, even for a 7000 mile leg, starts matter.

Here's a poser.  Clean Seas, mainly out for a test run, starts with a reef, DC wants to just finish and she does so in 5th, with a green crew.  I'd watch out for this team for if she's got Ian Whispering in her ear, that's pouring platinum over gold.  Clean Seas may be the sleeper, but Mapfre clearly is wanting to come out of the blocks very strong.  Scallywag has a huge uphill climb and putting token women on board will not help their cause.  This ain't Sidney Hobard dude, and after 4000 miles of pounding, how well will seven cope against 9...I look forward to that class.

Fastnet is the first real test and if teams still look at it as "testing", shame on them for now is the time to start the first push.  No quarter anymore and the fact the Mapfre and Dongfeng may trial test after this series...even more important to make a statement.

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Ugh, what I get from the interview is Witt is an amateur amongst pros, and lacks the cleverness of social skills to figure out how to have women on the team even though there is a consensus that larger mixed crews will be faster. His thoughts on crews in general seem properly old school, valuing commitment over competency. Talking about loyalty and respect is lovely,  but in the great teams  in any human enterprise, loyalty and respect arise naturally out of the competence of the leadership. If you have to mention them you're doing it wrong. 

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6 hours ago, bucc5062 said:

Jack, I love ya.  Don't ever change.  I am just going to love you to death this round.  Fuck beer, Vodka or go home.

For a man who has relatively speaking only been following this show, or anything RTW for that matter for all of 5 minutes...let alone got out of your own lake...you are a FFOK (Fuckin Font of Knowledge) Bucmeister.

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2 hours ago, Foiling Optimist said:

Ugh, what I get from the interview is Witt is an amateur amongst pros, and lacks the cleverness of social skills to figure out how to have women on the team even though there is a consensus that larger mixed crews will be faster. His thoughts on crews in general seem properly old school, valuing commitment over competency. Talking about loyalty and respect is lovely,  but in the great teams  in any human enterprise, loyalty and respect arise naturally out of the competence of the leadership. If you have to mention them you're doing it wrong. 

Think you maybe over complicating it with the women bit. Witt is a wanker but a very talented one on a lot of fronts, but with limited RTW experience and most of his offshore experience is in his own pond, and whilst 90/100' the last few years, Syd's was not big a budget show, yet Witt made it happen. 

However he has got RTW experience on board to counter all that.

That said he will be shattered by this Race Zero outcome and the best thing that should have happened to this team. He will respond to this speedbump...he is not an idiot and is certainly not an amateur. Don't forget this team has  some very serious money behind it, probably more than any other and has two stopovers in a corporate backing sense (Aust and HK) to boot.

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13 hours ago, Potter said:

Lifejackets were mandatory. Nothing to do with VOR, Cowes Week Race Committee were flying flag Yankee for all competitors.

And very sensible too, given just how gusty it was. Bramblemet must have been massively under reading for some reason. The stronger gusts must have been about 27 ish knots, and with the ebb as well. 

 

Big boats only today. Round the Nab, AIUI. 

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4 hours ago, jack_sparrow said:

For a man who has relatively speaking only been following this show, or anything RTW for that matter for all of 5 minutes...let alone got out of your own lake...you are a FFOK (Fuckin Font of Knowledge) Bucmeister.

You really know how to sour the milk Jack, but that's okay.  It must have been your childhood.

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13 hours ago, Miffy said:

 

I think leg 4 and 6 from Aust to China, China to NZ will be the roughest leg for the crew. While the southern ocean is physically harsh, going from southern hemisphere to north and back thru that region will just be brutal for navigation and avoiding garbage and becalmed conditions. Not exactly downwind trades either so it'll be brutal. 

Assuming they do the usual skipper and navigator are floating - 5 people split between watch is just hell. 

He's going to either have to swallow the humble pie now and hope good women are willing to sail with a fuckwit that calls them a social experiment, or be a joke during the race. 

Personally I wish all the experienced qualified women, a small community that talks, sign with other teams or are too busy and let him eat his own medicine for being a prick. 

I think I have worked out who you are Miffy!!

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