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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  

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DtM

VOR Leg 9 Lorient to Gothenburg via The Hague

665 posts in this topic

I wish the male commentator at the race village knew what he was looking at re the graphic on dtf - he thinks the 10 next to Alvi is their lead...it's not it's their dtf. He's made the same mistake twice in last 20 mins.

 

Edit: This guy is an idiot saying he thinks Mapfre realised Brunel went around the lighthouse so they had to drastically change their direction. FFS it's a mark of the course, they were sailing below it, tack before the port layline then tacked back on to starboard to get around the mark. You sir are my "Idiot of the Day"

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Did the live show stop.. Genny saying thank you and goodbye???... so no images of the arrival?

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Ita289, yeah, that is ridiculous, hopefully someone will tell him soon.. I'm down at the village now, but haven't seen the commentators yet:-P

 

Lot's of people here though, soon time to take up a spot at the pier were the line is :)

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Live show for the arrival is this one:

 

Alvi in safe first

Brunel in almost safe second

DF (looks like wrong side of mark, took time to notice)

MAPFRE (looks like wrong side of mark, took even more time to notice)

..

ADOR

...

Vestas

SCA

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holy shite...... it will come down to who can drift over the line the quickest. :mellow:

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RA2AK got it right, add human propulsion.

 

With all the exciting drifting contests that should make the VOR much faster.

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ALVI is kickin' the tires right now with a strong lead shown in marinetraffic. I couldn't watch via VE and the spinning boats.

 

SCA and TBRU are giving me heartburn the way they are shifting positions. Bursts of speed from tide, swirlies? I am curious why the all choose to sail in the wind shadow of Guernsey instead of going outside. Photo Ops? :ph34r:

 

Now we are all lined up with little for passing lanes other than speed or luck.

 

Tidal stream is stronger by at least a couple of knots and pushing them.

 

 

According to my Tidesplanner app, currents are strongest on the outside (4 kts) of Alderney, and half as strong (2 kts) inside at 2300.

 

I was away, but between alderney and pointe de la Hague, there is no arrows on your screen grab whereas the stream is really strong there.

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Whoops. Oxley missed a mark. Jeebus.

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Live show for the arrival is this one:

 

Alvi in safe first

Brunel in almost safe second

DF (looks like wrong side of mark, took time to notice)

MAPFRE (looks like wrong side of mark, took even more time to notice)

..

ADOR

...

Vestas

SCA

 

Will Oxley is making sure it is close by missing a mark on the course!!

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Fleet drifting @ 2 kts. Flapping sails everywhere. VOR has 3 possible finish lines, not marked on the tracker. First is by the race village in Frihamnen, second is Älvsborg bridge, third Älvsborg Gate.

 

Oxley missed a waypoint, ALVI had to tack back!

post-49019-0-54945500-1434964651_thumb.jpg

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Or maybe more like they were sailing for pressure and once they got that pressure and moving the boat they made the gybe towards the mark. In light pressure I was taught the mantra is "keep the boat moving even if it's taking you away from the mark somewhat" At the end of the day moving at 3 knots at 90 degrees to your path is quicker than moving at 1knot directly at the mark. It's all about VMG.

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.....Oxley missed a waypoint, ALVI had to tack back!

No they haven't. Don't listen to the male talking head...he is a complete Muppet. Oxley just made a great call to keep Alvi going.

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Finish line will be at Älvsborg Gate, the first finish line. Or "start line" as the male muppet just said.

post-49019-0-77403700-1434965609_thumb.jpg

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Finish line will be at Älvsborg Gate, the first finish line. Or "start line" as the male muppet just said.

That means Alvi has this.

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Finish line will be at Älvsborg Gate, the first finish line. Or "start line" as the male muppet just said.

That means Alvi has this.

 

Yep, 2.7 nm left for ALVI. TBRU 2 nm DTL.

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And now said muppet idiot doesn't know the difference between a gybe & a tack. Thankfully Dee was there to call him up on it!

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Congratulations, Team Alvimedica.

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Why are we not seeing the fight for second???

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Mapfre just passed Dongfeng. Mapfre fighting for 4th overall by taking 3rd in this race. Amazing stuff.

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What did iker said in his interview ?

Saw something about him dissing the boat in the YouTube chat

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I only heard like 5 seconds, he said he wanted simpler rules, he is definitely not happy with the penalties they got...

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I only heard like 5 seconds, he said he wanted simpler rules, he is definitely not happy with the penalties they got...

He was upset with the penalties and put a lot of their mistakes down to Volvo organizers.

 

He didn't really like the boat- said it was slow and thought the 70s were 'machines'

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Thanks for the info

(I guess maybe possible to rewind the live)

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4th place for Alvi will only be secured after Saturday's inport race

At this stage they are 2 points ahead of the Spaniards

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Good comments from Sam about the race. Sounds like she'll be back.

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And now Clean can get those questions to the VOR: about the hopes for tracker improvements, live tracking, rules clarity, and who will be in for the next round.

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Anyone have questions for skippers? Press conf now

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- Is Charles over his disappointment not being on the podium for leg 9?

- What will Charles be doing next? Go on with DFRT/bring-sailing-to-China campaign or not?

- What is for Bouwe his biggest achievement in this edition of the VOR (his 7th) and what did he still learn after the 6 previous ones?

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Anyone have questions for skippers? Press conf now

Would an extended satellite AIS bubble (no 8 mile VHF limit) be better?

Are sponsors happy and now eager to continue?

Would a crew weight total limit be better than a gender limit?

Has Iker given up on the VOR politics?

How will the teams better manage their contacts with the fan(atics) in the future? Mark Turner style with Twitter and Periscope and openness?

What would be the easiest boat improvement? Better reaching struts, sail choice, or . . . ?

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Will see if I can squeeze some in

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Will see if I can squeeze some in

Link to the presser? Periscope?

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Not a question for the presser, too much of a cheap shot, but perhaps something to investigate later.

Why do the last two TVW arrivals remind me of SoH?

 

Not that there is anything wrong with having your family waiting but IIRC (I did not check) the arrival in CT had much more people waiting for TVW on the dock.

To me it seems like the level of commitment dropped out of the campaign.

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I only heard like 5 seconds, he said he wanted simpler rules, he is definitely not happy with the penalties they got...

He was upset with the penalties and put a lot of their mistakes down to Volvo organizers.

 

He didn't really like the boat- said it was slow and thought the 70s were 'machines'

 

Iker, censured?

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Clean, as you probably have guessed, the hotel is named after the lighthouse ;-) I should know, me and my boss designed the hotel :-)

 

Well, we love it!

 

Will see if I can squeeze some in

Link to the presser? Periscope?

 

shiould be online soon. I asked about four questions I think, including one of yours.

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I only heard like 5 seconds, he said he wanted simpler rules, he is definitely not happy with the penalties they got...

He was upset with the penalties and put a lot of their mistakes down to Volvo organizers.

He didn't really like the boat- said it was slow and thought the 70s were 'machines'

Slow! Perhaps the 65s are slower than the 70s, but, frankly, to my ear it makes him sound like a spoiled brat. "Daddy didn't buy me the toy I wanted."

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I only heard like 5 seconds, he said he wanted simpler rules, he is definitely not happy with the penalties they got...

He was upset with the penalties and put a lot of their mistakes down to Volvo organizers.

He didn't really like the boat- said it was slow and thought the 70s were 'machines'

Slow! Perhaps the 65s are slower than the 70s, but, frankly, to my ear it makes him sound like a spoiled brat. "Daddy didn't buy me the toy I wanted."

 

So he's not allowed to give his honest opinion? He clearly liked the 70s better and so do a lot of us. (my personal opinion is that the OD concept was a good one but it should have OD VO70s)

 

His comments with regards to the protest/points penalties sound more to me like that than did the comments regards to the boat. You are the one that made the mistake, so don't get bad at the OA cause you got busted.

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Will see if I can squeeze some in

Link to the presser? Periscope?

 

shiould be online soon. I asked about four questions I think, including one of yours.

 

 

 

VOR vs. getting a presser available online. - Right after they fix the tracker. ;)

 

I even looked on their media server.

Man, I thought the VOR tracker was bad. I was so wrong. You can't find your own ass with a map, headlamp and both hands on that server... - And they pay money for that!

 

Unless it's really well hidden you can't even do simple stuff, like searching with date limits. Or a date. Yuck!

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I'd say the countries with the greatest involvement have been the NED, SWE and NZL. I'd love to see AUS represented more.

Would you? Forgotten that GBR started it all?

 

As for this race, 10 crew each from AUS, GBR and FRA, 9 from USA, 8 from ESP, based on http://www.volvooceanrace.com/en/presszone/en/36_The-race-by-countries.html.

 

Antigua 1

Argentina 1

Australia 10

Belgium 1

China 6

Denmark 4

France 10

Ireland 3

Italy 1

Lithuania 1

New Zealand 6

Spain 8

Sweden 2

Switzerland 2

Netherlands 4

UAE 1

UK 10

USA 9

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think Sailbydate was referring to boats not individual crew members...GBR might have started it (WB) but interest in boat entry through to today has been sustained by other countries not GBR.

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think Sailbydate was referring to boats not individual crew members...GBR might have started it (WB) but interest in boat entry through to today has been sustained by other countries not GBR.

That's correct thanks, Jack. Sailers, not sailors.

Race winners:

NED x 3 ('78, '82 and 2006)

SWE x 2 ('98 and 2009)

NZL x 2 ('90 and '94)

FRA x 2 ('86 and 2012)

GER x 1 (2002)

MEX x 1 ('74)

 

Funnily enough, although GBR started the whole thing, they have never won a race (much like the AC).

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think Sailbydate was referring to boats not individual crew members...GBR might have started it (WB) but interest in boat entry through to today has been sustained by other countries not GBR.

That's correct thanks, Jack. Sailers, not sailors.

Race winners:

NED x 3 ('78, '82 and 2006)

SWE x 2 ('98 and 2009)

NZL x 2 ('90 and '94)

FRA x 2 ('86 and 2012)

GER x 1 (2002)

MEX x 1 ('74)

 

Funnily enough, although GBR started the whole thing, they have never won a race (much like the AC).

 

what's a sailer?

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think Sailbydate was referring to boats not individual crew members...GBR might have started it (WB) but interest in boat entry through to today has been sustained by other countries not GBR.

That's correct thanks, Jack. Sailers, not sailors.

Race winners:

NED x 3 ('78, '82 and 2006)

SWE x 2 ('98 and 2009)

NZL x 2 ('90 and '94)

FRA x 2 ('86 and 2012)

GER x 1 (2002)

MEX x 1 ('74)

 

Funnily enough, although GBR started the whole thing, they have never won a race (much like the AC).

 

what's a sailer?

 

A boat that sails.

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I was surprised to read that ian walker was the first brit to win it as skipper. Think he put a great campaign out there. Considering his last two have been less than stellar (blame the boat) he really grabbed the opportunity of early funding and one design to take the win.

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I only heard like 5 seconds, he said he wanted simpler rules, he is definitely not happy with the penalties they got...

He was upset with the penalties and put a lot of their mistakes down to Volvo organizers.

He didn't really like the boat- said it was slow and thought the 70s were 'machines'

Slow! Perhaps the 65s are slower than the 70s, but, frankly, to my ear it makes him sound like a spoiled brat. "Daddy didn't buy me the toy I wanted."

 

 

So he's not allowed to give his honest opinion? He clearly liked the 70s better and so do a lot of us. (my personal opinion is that the OD concept was a good one but it should have OD VO70s)

 

 

I dunno what a OD VO70 would have brought to the game that a OD VO65 couldn't or didn't. When its OD, small speed gains are inconsequential. It was all about keeping costs down to allow for more entries and making the boat more robust so that they could actually finish legs. In the last go around, how many boats dropped out of how many legs? This time we had a total of one boat drop out of one leg due to a breakage. TVW doesn't count because they fucked up - that wasn't the boat's fault.

 

I personally would rather have all the boats finish in a tight race than half the fleet finish spread out by days. This iteration to me was FAR more exciting than when one boat usually dominated a leg due to design choices. If I want to see a de$ign battle where the size of the owners wallet, rather than the skill of the crew matters - I'll watch the AC circus.

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I only heard like 5 seconds, he said he wanted simpler rules, he is definitely not happy with the penalties they got...

He was upset with the penalties and put a lot of their mistakes down to Volvo organizers.

He didn't really like the boat- said it was slow and thought the 70s were 'machines'

Slow! Perhaps the 65s are slower than the 70s, but, frankly, to my ear it makes him sound like a spoiled brat. "Daddy didn't buy me the toy I wanted."

 

 

So he's not allowed to give his honest opinion? He clearly liked the 70s better and so do a lot of us. (my personal opinion is that the OD concept was a good one but it should have OD VO70s)

 

 

I dunno what a OD VO70 would have brought to the game that a OD VO65 couldn't or didn't. When its OD, small speed gains are inconsequential. It was all about keeping costs down to allow for more entries and making the boat more robust so that they could actually finish legs. In the last go around, how many boats dropped out of how many legs? This time we had a total of one boat drop out of one leg due to a breakage. TVW doesn't count because they fucked up - that wasn't the boat's fault.

 

I personally would rather have all the boats finish in a tight race than half the fleet finish spread out by days. This iteration to me was FAR more exciting than when one boat usually dominated a leg due to design choices. If I want to see a de$ign battle where the size of the owners wallet, rather than the skill of the crew matters - I'll watch the AC circus.

 

You've not been watching lately then?

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The skipper who just failed to make the podium is still blaming the boats even though they are strict One Design???

 

Quelle surprise!

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Was he blaming them, or saying he doesn't like them? 'Cause I got news for ya - no one I've spoken to enjoys sailing them much. The whole crazy heel angles thing is too annoying, but then again they stay more or less in one piece and they do look good at the dock. But it was a great race, and with a few exceptions, Knut and team did a very good job turning the VOR into the biggest event in the sport, dwarfing the AC/Olympics/French events in every countable way except for single-day turnout, which the Route Du Rhum still owns.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The skipper who just failed to make the podium is still blaming the boats even though they are strict One Design???

 

Quelle surprise!

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press conference is being encoded now, maybe another three or four hours til it is up. it is decent.

 

Tomorrow at 1030 is media roundtable with Knut. Should I start another thread?

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Was he blaming them, or saying he doesn't like them? 'Cause I got news for ya - no one I've spoken to enjoys sailing them much. The whole crazy heel angles thing is too annoying, but then again they stay more or less in one piece and they do look good at the dock. But it was a great race, and with a few exceptions, Knut and team did a very good job turning the VOR into the biggest event in the sport, dwarfing the AC/Olympics/French events in every countable way except for single-day turnout, which the Route Du Rhum still owns.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The skipper who just failed to make the podium is still blaming the boats even though they are strict One Design???

 

Quelle surprise!

 

Why don't we all face it? The VO65 is a dog.

 

It's not impossible to design and build a fast boat that is fun to sail and doesn't fall apart.

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Was he blaming them, or saying he doesn't like them? 'Cause I got news for ya - no one I've spoken to enjoys sailing them much. The whole crazy heel angles thing is too annoying, but then again they stay more or less in one piece and they do look good at the dock. But it was a great race, and with a few exceptions, Knut and team did a very good job turning the VOR into the biggest event in the sport, dwarfing the AC/Olympics/French events in every countable way except for single-day turnout, which the Route Du Rhum still owns.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The skipper who just failed to make the podium is still blaming the boats even though they are strict One Design???

 

Quelle surprise!

 

From what I heard and you can all go back and listen for yourselves was was simply stating that he didn't like the boats and that flat out he thought the 70's were better. As far as I'm concerned they could have gone OD70's with record breaking possibilities without compromising their cost restraints.

 

What he did blame VOR Organizers for was the rules infringments he got dinged for. Which I thought was poor.

 

That being said it was nice that he was honest right/wrong or otherwise. There was zero PC corporate babble which I hate.

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details coming in about a fistfight and resisting arrest last night...two MAPFRE allegedly sailors ended up in the slammer after a fistfight with an outsider and then resisting arrest

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Think you will find that slammers in Scandi countries are not that bad...

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yeah they probably got herring and schnapps!

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yeah they probably got herring and schnapps!

:) (I would deem the prior bordering on torture, just made bearable by the latter)

 

And their own TV of course...

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having spent a full midsommar with a big family, i agree 100%

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According to a Gothenburg newspaper has Fabian Bengtsson from Volvo confirmed that two sailors were involved and they were arrested after a bust up with some security guards, one of which was sent to hospital. Bengtsson would not comment on whether any of the sailors were Swedish or whether this would have any impact on the inport race...

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via Goteborg daily (English)

Sailors arrested after race village fight

Ben Kendall 2015-06-23

Two sailors in the Volvo Ocean Race have been arrested following a fight where two security guards were injured.

When the Volvo Ocean Race finished in Gothenburg on Monday, large celebrations at the race village at Frihamnen followed. The competitors had spent the last nine months at sea and covered nearly 39,000 nautical miles.

According to news broadcaster SVT Väst, at around 8pm on Monday a fight started in the VIP lounge at Frihamnen.

It reportedly started after a discussion between bar personnel on service of alcohol. Security guards were also involved.

The incident ended with two of the guards being taken to hospital. One of them was reportedly kicked in the head and chest, while the second man was bitten on the thumb, according to the broadcaster.

The event’s press spokesperson Fabian Bengtsson confirmed to SVT that it concerned two of the race competitors.

They have been arrested suspected of assaulting an official.

 


via Göteborgs-Posten (Swedish, google translate)

Two Ocean Race sailors detained

Published June 22, 2015 Updated 13:37



GOTHENBURG

Two security guards were injured in a brawl at an afterparty for the Volvo Ocean Race on Monday evening.Two sailors have been arrested for assaulting a police officer.



In connection with the party arrested two people suspected of assaulting a police officer.
Fabian Bengtsson, press officer for the VOR, confirms to the GP that the two suspicious men are sailors who Sail To See also reported from the boats that participated in världsomseglingen.
- That's right, it's about two foreign participants about the now arrested on suspicion of assaulting a police officer. We are now cooperating with police but would not otherwise comment on the matter, he says.

According to a witness, which the GP had been in contact with, the tumult began at 20 o'clock at an afterparty for the sailing competition at the Southern Frihamnspiren, Banana pier, in Gothenburg. At least two persons have begun to fight with security guards inside a restaurant at the event area.

 

Police were alerted to the scene 20.15.
- Three to four persons are involved according to the alarm, says Jenny Widen, spokesperson for the police Western Region.

Two security guards were injured in the fight, according to police.One of them was taken to hospital with injuries unclear.
- We have also arrested two people on suspicion of assaulting a police officer, says Jenny Widen.

The cause of the fraction is unknown. How many people who participated may Jenny Widén not answer.
- I just know that there are two wounded and two arrested. Since there may have been more involved, but it did not feel to, she says.

According to Fabian Bengtsson continue the event in the free port as planned. If the two sailors will participate in Saturday's so-called in-port race in the port of Gothenburg is not clear.
- I do not want to comment on the matter, says Bengtsson.

 

Read also: The sun shone on the sailing party
Read also: See the best of the finish of the Volvo Ocean Race

 

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Was he blaming them, or saying he doesn't like them? 'Cause I got news for ya - no one I've spoken to enjoys sailing them much. The whole crazy heel angles thing is too annoying, but then again they stay more or less in one piece and they do look good at the dock. But it was a great race, and with a few exceptions, Knut and team did a very good job turning the VOR into the biggest event in the sport, dwarfing the AC/Olympics/French events in every countable way except for single-day turnout, which the Route Du Rhum still owns.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The skipper who just failed to make the podium is still blaming the boats even though they are strict One Design???

 

Quelle surprise!

 

Why don't we all face it? The VO65 is a dog.

 

It's not impossible to design and build a fast boat that is fun to sail and doesn't fall apart.

 

Judging by Tracy Edwards comments on the 70s that depends you want the event to be accessible for females.

 

Didn't like the boats he didn't do as well in? No way!

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Was he blaming them, or saying he doesn't like them? 'Cause I got news for ya - no one I've spoken to enjoys sailing them much. The whole crazy heel angles thing is too annoying, but then again they stay more or less in one piece and they do look good at the dock. But it was a great race, and with a few exceptions, Knut and team did a very good job turning the VOR into the biggest event in the sport, dwarfing the AC/Olympics/French events in every countable way except for single-day turnout, which the Route Du Rhum still owns.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The skipper who just failed to make the podium is still blaming the boats even though they are strict One Design???

 

Quelle surprise!

 

Why don't we all face it? The VO65 is a dog.

 

It's not impossible to design and build a fast boat that is fun to sail and doesn't fall apart.

 

I feel that standard response here is "Why do you feel it is a dog" and "please explain how you would design such a fast boat that does not fall about yet still remains affordable. You and Loopy should hook up and get that design going for somehow the boys at Farrmust have missed the boat. (sorry).

 

Like JBSF, I liked the boat from a viewing standpoint, really loved the tight racing it produced. One off racing against each other may be a designer's wet dream, but it makes for poor boat on boat racing. So the VOR transition from a navigator/designer race to a sailor/skipper tactics race...I like it. Give the next crew over the horizon AIS (or just actual Sat Pos) and let them go.

 

All things change and some will like the new, some won't and they will move on. That happened with me and the AC. Watched from 83 till the day SC flew a hull. Watched it go from sailing by the Deed to Corporate whore mongering. I stopped caring. As much as I loved Ocean sailing, I could not get into ocean racing as a fan, even by 2012 because of the splits in time. I followed Kingfisher in her first Vendee and it was cool, but not so much from racing, just the effort.

 

This VOR sucked me into a competition, because of those VO65s, the media marketing, and the ability to following (close to) real time. Perhaps CLEAN gets his multi's in a few years and if so, like the AC I can close that book for multi's are dragsters, and I find them boring. The circle of life in boats I guess.

 

(I'd still go for true Clipper ships racing around the world. four stops. Portsmouth (start) to Sydney .(1) Sydney to Shanghai,(2) Shanghai to Cape Town,(3) Cape Town to New York City (4), NYC to Portsmouth (finish).

 

Maybe Dona Tortellini could fund it, she has some billions to spare and may want to get out of Multihulls).

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bucc, serious data collection question: how old are you?

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bucc, serious data collection question: how old are you?

Not sure you're my type CLEAN :wub: I like em younger, European, and female (respects to my current partner). However, getting rides on Meridans?...I could come to love you...in that take me with you kind of way :lol: /k

 

Sent PM.

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^^^Come on... its not just the 70's they are slower than. They are slower off the wind than IMOCAs and "Life at the Extreme" wasn't meant to mean "life at an extreme angle of heel even when not sailing upwind". IMOCAs go faster single handed!

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Unfortunately the sailors had their chance with the 70s and things didn't work out as planned. The costs spiralled and the class didn't mature and improve as was expected. Instead of sorting out the gremlins they seemed to find more. The result was that the guys with the purse strings had enough and the outcome was a cheaper one design that had input from all of the teams last race, and whilst they couldn't get all they wanted for the price tag, they got equal boats and budgets that the sponsors said would work.

No it isn't as quick or fragile, but I doubt a 70 would have set any records in the weather they have had this race either. The sponsors are happy and more likely to pay the sailors their wages for another cycle than they would have been otherwise. I think the sailors should be pretty happy with that. And I honestly can't see the difference between 7.5 and 8.5 knots or between 16 and 18 knots when looking at my computer screen. It doesn't really matter.

The other problem is that if the boats were quicker then the race would be in trouble. They start as late as they can in the European summer/autumn and get to the Southern Ocean as late as they can, but they still get back in the Northern hemisphere too early in the spring. Imagine quicker boats. They would either have to leave Europe in November and get to Newport in April, or have long stopovers, which eats money faster than anything and doesn't meet what the sponsors want.

Also, where would you put 8 MOD70 size boats in a race village? You would end up moving the race village to commercial ports around the world. Sponsors don't like that for their corporate entertainment.

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^^^Come on... its not just the 70's they are slower than. They are slower off the wind than IMOCAs and "Life at the Extreme" wasn't meant to mean "life at an extreme angle of heel even when not sailing upwind". IMOCAs go faster single handed!

 

I don't get the complaint about the angle of heel. It seems like it's mostly for low wetted surface in light air. In a breeze, they heel less at 35 kt than my boat does a 15kt.

 

VOR_150609_asanchez_8651.jpg

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^^^Come on... its not just the 70's they are slower than. They are slower off the wind than IMOCAs and "Life at the Extreme" wasn't meant to mean "life at an extreme angle of heel even when not sailing upwind". IMOCAs go faster single handed!

The thing is, speed is relative. Daddy's comment below sounds similiar to my own thought as a voyeur in this race. I'm not on the boat, just tracking an icon across a screen so seeing speed is just a number to factor into the overall race number crunching. End of the day it is about choice and those that don't like the VO65 don't need to race on it. Looking at IMOCA boats, they seem designed for solo or short handed crew which does not fit the VOR "team" model so while it is faster, it is not a large crewed yacht.

 

No boat is perfect and everyone has their personal likes/dislikes so no one will be completely pleased by a boat picked for a class, but from a spectator standpoint, the ROs need something people can relate too and it seems VOR found that in this 65. You ma thing they are the station wagon of ocean racing, but it is a wagon that shown it can cross multiple oceans, handle intense weather and bring a fleet home in pretty much one piece (mast breakage considered manufacturing defect, not designed weakness).

 

I like my station wagon, just as I loved my truck of the water (God bless you Blackaller). I guess I'm not a speed junkie, love team racing, and grace in well designed monohulls. At my level, Lightnings, Buccaneers...its still all sailing.

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Who cares about the angle of heel apart from the guys being paid the big bucks to put up with it?

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Video of the Gothenburg arrival presser is also up

 

 

 

The audio version is ~10 minutes longer, I did not check contents against each other yet.

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Unfortunately the sailors had their chance with the 70s and things didn't work out as planned. The costs spiralled and the class didn't mature and improve as was expected. Instead of sorting out the gremlins they seemed to find more. The result was that the guys with the purse strings had enough and the outcome was a cheaper one design that had input from all of the teams last race, and whilst they couldn't get all they wanted for the price tag, they got equal boats and budgets that the sponsors said would work.

No it isn't as quick or fragile, but I doubt a 70 would have set any records in the weather they have had this race either. The sponsors are happy and more likely to pay the sailors their wages for another cycle than they would have been otherwise. I think the sailors should be pretty happy with that. And I honestly can't see the difference between 7.5 and 8.5 knots or between 16 and 18 knots when looking at my computer screen. It doesn't really matter.

The other problem is that if the boats were quicker then the race would be in trouble. They start as late as they can in the European summer/autumn and get to the Southern Ocean as late as they can, but they still get back in the Northern hemisphere too early in the spring. Imagine quicker boats. They would either have to leave Europe in November and get to Newport in April, or have long stopovers, which eats money faster than anything and doesn't meet what the sponsors want.

Also, where would you put 8 MOD70 size boats in a race village? You would end up moving the race village to commercial ports around the world. Sponsors don't like that for their corporate entertainment.

If you only look at computer screens and can't tell the difference between 7.5 knots and 8.5 knots, then you can't have done much ocean sailing!

Can't see that your comments have much value in this debate if that's the case.

I would take much more heed of the folk I have spoken to who have sailed these boats and the 70s and IMOCAs, all of who say the same thing.

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How many team sponsors are back for the next race WYD? My questions give me the following guesses:

 

ALVI: Out

SCA: They won't say in or out, but they did say they are satisfied with their branding exercise.

Brunel: Likely not title

Mapfre: I'll be shocked

Vestas: >50% likely in

ADOR: Unlikely

DFRT: No idea

 

The good news is that the boats are already out there, so the barriers to entry are quite minor, and I expect the following new ones:

 

African team

American team

Swedish team

Dutch Team

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Unfortunately the sailors had their chance with the 70s and things didn't work out as planned. The costs spiralled and the class didn't mature and improve as was expected. Instead of sorting out the gremlins they seemed to find more. The result was that the guys with the purse strings had enough and the outcome was a cheaper one design that had input from all of the teams last race, and whilst they couldn't get all they wanted for the price tag, they got equal boats and budgets that the sponsors said would work.

No it isn't as quick or fragile, but I doubt a 70 would have set any records in the weather they have had this race either. The sponsors are happy and more likely to pay the sailors their wages for another cycle than they would have been otherwise. I think the sailors should be pretty happy with that. And I honestly can't see the difference between 7.5 and 8.5 knots or between 16 and 18 knots when looking at my computer screen. It doesn't really matter.

The other problem is that if the boats were quicker then the race would be in trouble. They start as late as they can in the European summer/autumn and get to the Southern Ocean as late as they can, but they still get back in the Northern hemisphere too early in the spring. Imagine quicker boats. They would either have to leave Europe in November and get to Newport in April, or have long stopovers, which eats money faster than anything and doesn't meet what the sponsors want.

Also, where would you put 8 MOD70 size boats in a race village? You would end up moving the race village to commercial ports around the world. Sponsors don't like that for their corporate entertainment.

If you only look at computer screens and can't tell the difference between 7.5 knots and 8.5 knots, then you can't have done much ocean sailing!

Can't see that your comments have much value in this debate if that's the case.

I would take much more heed of the folk I have spoken to who have sailed these boats and the 70s and IMOCAs, all of who say the same thing.

 

Wait what?

 

Come on, that's getting somewhat below the salt. Whether or not I, Daddy, or others have or have not done ocean sailing, our viewpoint as a spectator does have value, because without a large enough body of people watching...there is no VOR. The number of people who have sailed on the VO65 and/or the VOD70 is a pretty small number in the sailing community as a whole. If only those people are qualified to talk about this race, you are going to have a fairly small party and a fairly incestuous approach to the race overall. Short of insults, people's insights do have value.

 

I've never sailed a VO65. I never will, but if one was put in my hand I damn well would know the difference between 7.5 and 8.5 knots if standing on the deck. I don't need ocean racing to know that feeling so let's put condescension back in the pantry. My point (and I think Daddy's) is that when one is following a race as long as and as varied in conditions, looking at a speed number on the screen is just that, a number. Whether the number is 7.5 vs 8.5, it only represents speed in the moment and from the armchair, that difference could be boat, weather, garbage, who the fuck really knows for they are thousands of miles away. The difference makes no difference other than how it relates to the other racers.

 

Staysail, you miss the idea that no matter what your sailors say about the boat, unless they are funding a new race and or a new boat their opinion provides as little value to an existing boat as does mine. They don't like the VO65? Fine, Then. Don't. Sail. It. Problem solved and Knut and company can and will find sailors who will. If VOR help me get a job after 9 months at sea, hell I'd skipper a VO65 in a heart beat.

 

Do not dismiss voices, for they represent a potentially larger crowd than the elite ones you swim in and it is that crowd that ultimately provides the foundation for those elite sailors to build on.

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Video of the Gothenburg arrival presser is also up

 

 

 

The audio version is ~10 minutes longer, I did not check contents against each other yet.

 

Jo's questions at the beginning drag on for a while. Mine are all after hers, including a couple that you guys asked for.

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I'm not a huge fan of the boats either, but +1 on this statement. And if I'm offered a chance to live at 30 degrees of heel in 2 years as an OBR, I'll jump on it.

 

 

They don't like the VO65? Fine, Then. Don't. Sail. It. Problem solved and Knut and company can and will find sailors who will.

 

 

 

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How many team sponsors are back for the next race WYD? My questions give me the following guesses:

 

ALVI: Out

SCA: They won't say in or out, but they did say they are satisfied with their branding exercise.

Brunel: Likely not title

Mapfre: I'll be shocked

Vestas: >50% likely in

ADOR: Unlikely

DFRT: No idea

 

The good news is that the boats are already out there, so the barriers to entry are quite minor, and I expect the following new ones:

 

African team

American team

Swedish team

Dutch Team

Were I able to be a whisper in Larry Page's ear, I'd try to get Google to sponsor an American Team. With the VOR being a B2B platform for companies, Google could just enhance its presence via a VOR team globally and maybe in new markets. CLEAN, want to make a pitch?

 

It is hard to imagine a base for an African team in part, from the size of the continent, and which country/corporation would have the funding to promote a VOR team. I think it would be fantastic to see, but a long row to hoe. With the success of DFRT, it seems improbable that China, either via DFRT or some other entity would not want to sponsor a team. China wants/needs good imagery as it attempts to expand influence in Asia and Africa.

 

The bigger question, will there be ten competent skippers available to take on the commitment of the VOR. Will anyone from this event look to step up to that role? What will the experience level be next time around since it seems (according to some) that current skippers don't like this boat.

 

Interesting times.

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I'm not a huge fan of the boats either, but +1 on this statement. And if I'm offered a chance to live at 30 degrees of heel in 2 years as an OBR, I'll jump on it.

 

 

They don't like the VO65? Fine, Then. Don't. Sail. It. Problem solved and Knut and company can and will find sailors who will.

 

 

 

 

 

:unsure::rolleyes: you? an OBR? :lol::lol::lol:

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About the fist fight, is the one who was said to be getting drunk at the press conference (forgot the name, but from mapfre)

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I'm not a huge fan of the boats either, but +1 on this statement. And if I'm offered a chance to live at 30 degrees of heel in 2 years as an OBR, I'll jump on it.

 

 

They don't like the VO65? Fine, Then. Don't. Sail. It. Problem solved and Knut and company can and will find sailors who will.

 

 

 

 

 

:unsure::rolleyes: you? an OBR? :lol:

 

There ya go. Knut's got a OBR and skipper, now to fill the other 90+ positions :lol:

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Regarding that fist fight, and I'm getting a bit to political here, but yeah, since they didn't rape or murder anyone, they probably haven't been offered a job and an apartment in Stockholm, but they surely didn't suffer much in the slammer, that much I can guarantee :-)

 

Must say it was funny to read Google translated Swedish to English for the first time!

 

Clean, great to hear you enjoyed the hotel :-)

 

I watched the finish from the pier in Frihamnen, it was great,but of course a bit disappointing that the changed to the outermost line. I fully understand the desicion, but would have been fun to see that battle go on, even if it would have taken to long time :-P

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If I remember correctly the 65s were built with 2 VORs in mind, after which the option is open whether to continue with these or do something else. Looks to me that the 1st VOR was a huge trial run of these boats and now that the feedback is in, they can carefully start working towards V2 of the 65s, not for the next VOR, but for the one after. Having this amount of time vs the ridiculous short timeframe they had the 1st time around would give them the chance to develop something way better. This would mean that the VOR boats could get better in every single way. I hope this is what they'll do.

 

As for the 65 vs 70s performance - personally I couldn't care less as long as they look as impressive as they do! I've followed this race since the 08/09 one (had registered a VOR specific twitter account for that race to push all VOR news automatically thru it, which I later passed on to VOR themselves once they figured out their online marketing). Fell in love with Puma's 1st boat and the followed with bated breath their 2nd crazy trip to the most remote island on earth, and finally rooted for Groupama. This time around I have been glued to the YT channel and watched all the 2h+ live coverages to my SO's dismay. All of this to say that I, as a fan of the race, can't tell the difference between the 65 and 70 apart. They're plenty fast, they can still do 500+ miles per day. The biggest difference comes from them being glued together throughout the race - and that's something that puts every person on the edge of their seat - and I LOVED IT!

 

I think this VOR edition was a proof of concept - it's about getting the fans to watch it on an ongoing basis because you NEVER know when something happens on the water, while allowing more casual viewers to come and go, since there is always tight racing taking place and the details of a particular team don't make such a big impact to the racing action overall. You can have the proverbial cake and eat it, too, so to speak.

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The good news is that the boats are already out there, so the barriers to entry are quite minor, and I expect the following new ones:

 

African team

American team

Swedish team

Dutch Team

 

Norwegian team

These guys are pretty serious, even got hold of old Camper to train on

https://www.facebook.com/wolfpackracingteam

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^^^Come on... its not just the 70's they are slower than. They are slower off the wind than IMOCAs and "Life at the Extreme" wasn't meant to mean "life at an extreme angle of heel even when not sailing upwind". IMOCAs go faster single handed!

that should not happen. The 65s are not upto it so

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How many team sponsors are back for the next race WYD? My questions give me the following guesses:

 

ALVI: Out

SCA: They won't say in or out, but they did say they are satisfied with their branding exercise.

Brunel: Likely not title

Mapfre: I'll be shocked

Vestas: >50% likely in

ADOR: Unlikely

DFRT: No idea

 

The good news is that the boats are already out there, so the barriers to entry are quite minor, and I expect the following new ones:

 

African team

American team

Swedish team

Dutch Team

Were I able to be a whisper in Larry Page's ear, I'd try to get Google to sponsor an American Team. With the VOR being a B2B platform for companies, Google could just enhance its presence via a VOR team globally and maybe in new markets. CLEAN, want to make a pitch?

 

It is hard to imagine a base for an African team in part, from the size of the continent, and which country/corporation would have the funding to promote a VOR team. I think it would be fantastic to see, but a long row to hoe. With the success of DFRT, it seems improbable that China, either via DFRT or some other entity would not want to sponsor a team. China wants/needs good imagery as it attempts to expand influence in Asia and Africa.

 

The bigger question, will there be ten competent skippers available to take on the commitment of the VOR. Will anyone from this event look to step up to that role? What will the experience level be next time around since it seems (according to some) that current skippers don't like this boat.

 

Interesting times.

 

 

Re. African team: Saw them in Den Haag: https://www.facebook.com/GhanaOceanRacing

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How many team sponsors are back for the next race WYD? My questions give me the following guesses:

 

ALVI: Out

SCA: They won't say in or out, but they did say they are satisfied with their branding exercise.

Brunel: Likely not title

Mapfre: I'll be shocked

Vestas: >50% likely in

ADOR: Unlikely

DFRT: No idea

 

The good news is that the boats are already out there, so the barriers to entry are quite minor, and I expect the following new ones:

 

African team

American team

Swedish team

Dutch Team

Were I able to be a whisper in Larry Page's ear, I'd try to get Google to sponsor an American Team. With the VOR being a B2B platform for companies, Google could just enhance its presence via a VOR team globally and maybe in new markets. CLEAN, want to make a pitch?

 

It is hard to imagine a base for an African team in part, from the size of the continent, and which country/corporation would have the funding to promote a VOR team. I think it would be fantastic to see, but a long row to hoe. With the success of DFRT, it seems improbable that China, either via DFRT or some other entity would not want to sponsor a team. China wants/needs good imagery as it attempts to expand influence in Asia and Africa.

 

The bigger question, will there be ten competent skippers available to take on the commitment of the VOR. Will anyone from this event look to step up to that role? What will the experience level be next time around since it seems (according to some) that current skippers don't like this boat.

 

Interesting times.

 

 

Re. African team: Saw them in Den Haag: https://www.facebook.com/GhanaOceanRacing

 

I stand corrected. Checked out the site. A little light at the moment, but I like their mission and goal. In terms of experience and crew

 

 

Team Ghana will be the FIRST African based crew to set sail on a 40,000 nautical mile round-the world adventure. Currently, we are working to enter the Amateur Clipper World Race in 2015-16 to prepare our team for the Volvo Ocean Race in 2017-18 and the IMOCA race series.

Curious if anyone knows who may make up the team and any background. Seems like they could rival ALVI for young, low experience start to the VOR.

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How many team sponsors are back for the next race WYD? My questions give me the following guesses:

 

ALVI: Out

SCA: They won't say in or out, but they did say they are satisfied with their branding exercise.

Brunel: Likely not title

Mapfre: I'll be shocked

Vestas: >50% likely in

ADOR: Unlikely

DFRT: No idea

 

The good news is that the boats are already out there, so the barriers to entry are quite minor, and I expect the following new ones:

 

African team

American team

Swedish team

Dutch Team

Were I able to be a whisper in Larry Page's ear, I'd try to get Google to sponsor an American Team. With the VOR being a B2B platform for companies, Google could just enhance its presence via a VOR team globally and maybe in new markets. CLEAN, want to make a pitch?

 

It is hard to imagine a base for an African team in part, from the size of the continent, and which country/corporation would have the funding to promote a VOR team. I think it would be fantastic to see, but a long row to hoe. With the success of DFRT, it seems improbable that China, either via DFRT or some other entity would not want to sponsor a team. China wants/needs good imagery as it attempts to expand influence in Asia and Africa.

 

The bigger question, will there be ten competent skippers available to take on the commitment of the VOR. Will anyone from this event look to step up to that role? What will the experience level be next time around since it seems (according to some) that current skippers don't like this boat.

 

Interesting times.

 

 

Re. African team: Saw them in Den Haag: https://www.facebook.com/GhanaOceanRacing

 

I stand corrected. Checked out the site. A little light at the moment, but I like their mission and goal. In terms of experience and crew

 

 

Team Ghana will be the FIRST African based crew to set sail on a 40,000 nautical mile round-the world adventure. Currently, we are working to enter the Amateur Clipper World Race in 2015-16 to prepare our team for the Volvo Ocean Race in 2017-18 and the IMOCA race series.

Curious if anyone knows who may make up the team and any background. Seems like they could rival ALVI for young, low experience start to the VOR.

 

 

They've been around at least since the last edition of the race. Shortly afterwards it looked as if they prepare for 2014-15, but later it became silent again, or me less interested.

 

Seems there's not much team ATM, but more here: http://www.ghanaoceanracing.org/

and http://www.takebackourroutes.org/

 

Anyway, it's a cool dream, hopefully coming true for the next VOR.

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I only heard like 5 seconds, he said he wanted simpler rules, he is definitely not happy with the penalties they got...

He was upset with the penalties and put a lot of their mistakes down to Volvo organizers.

He didn't really like the boat- said it was slow and thought the 70s were 'machines'

Slow! Perhaps the 65s are slower than the 70s, but, frankly, to my ear it makes him sound like a spoiled brat. "Daddy didn't buy me the toy I wanted."

 

they are slow, heavy with keel bulbs that barely cut it. We

Well that is opinion, can you be specific? Slow compared to what? Heavy compared to what? Why does the bulb not "cut it" and if you put more weight in the bulb, would that not make it heavier?

 

Please don't compare to multi's, apples oranges and we already know they took up 15% performance hit from the VOD70, but in generally performed close to their numbers. SO I'm looking to read your analysis of what is wrong with the VO65.

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Re: "Two security guards were injured in the fight, according to police.One of them was taken to hospital with injuries unclear."

Impressively quick reaction time there by Mr Clean to be able to duck that fast, twice..

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I'm not a huge fan of the boats either, but +1 on this statement. And if I'm offered a chance to live at 30 degrees of heel in 2 years as an OBR, I'll jump on it.

 

 

They don't like the VO65? Fine, Then. Don't. Sail. It. Problem solved and Knut and company can and will find sailors who will.

 

 

 

 

I seem to have ruffled a few feathers with my comments about the boats being slow. Sure a lot of sailors who want to earn a living and want to "do a Volvo" will be more than happy if its still a viable race next time, and if bean counting is what matters most, maybe it will. However my impression is that top skippers who have a choice, like exciting sailing, and have sailed this boat, will go for something much more fun if they get the offer, and this year's guys were disappointed with the boats performance. That can't be good.

 

When the accountants get ahead of the adventurers, I begin to think things are gong downhill fast.

You have got to admit this year's race wasn't exactly "Life at the Extreme" however many time Knut tells us it was.

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I'm not a huge fan of the boats either, but +1 on this statement. And if I'm offered a chance to live at 30 degrees of heel in 2 years as an OBR, I'll jump on it.

 

 

They don't like the VO65? Fine, Then. Don't. Sail. It. Problem solved and Knut and company can and will find sailors who will.

 

 

 

 

I seem to have ruffled a few feathers with my comments about the boats being slow. Sure a lot of sailors who want to earn a living and want to "do a Volvo" will be more than happy if its still a viable race next time, and if bean counting is what matters most, maybe it will. However my impression is that top skippers who have a choice, like exciting sailing, and have sailed this boat, will go for something much more fun if they get the offer, and this year's guys were disappointed with the boats performance. That can't be good.

 

When the accountants get ahead of the adventurers, I begin to think things are gong downhill fast.

You have got to admit this year's race wasn't exactly "Life at the Extreme" however many time Knut tells us it was.

 

I don't remember if it was CLEAN or Jo who asked a related question, but Ian commented that the weather overall was not as "extreme" this round so I don't think you have a fair comparison. Knut cannot (yet) control the weather so if you have more light than heavy air...do you blame the boat? Would you be saying this if they had something like the SO, Cape Town, Cape Fast winds most the trip?

 

A Tri Maxi, a VOD70, and a VO65 drift into the ITCZ and Gods says "What'll ya have?"

The Tri says "We need wind, lots of wind to go really fast so we can even turn"

The VOD70 says "We need wind, lots of wind to go really fast, because it's the only way we look good"

The VO65 says "Fuck if I care, we look good drifting. Let those two suffer"

 

Gathered from reading, I'd rather be on that "slow" 65 when blowing a stink for my percentage of survival is better compared to the somewhat fragile 70 and a Tri that cannot rotate if blown over.

 

As to accountants...you do want to see some kind of race...yes? Otherwise we get the Corinthian Race of yesteryear with rich ego's at play. I like my blue collar Ocean Racing thank you.

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I'm not a huge fan of the boats either, but +1 on this statement. And if I'm offered a chance to live at 30 degrees of heel in 2 years as an OBR, I'll jump on it.

 

 

They don't like the VO65? Fine, Then. Don't. Sail. It. Problem solved and Knut and company can and will find sailors who will.

 

 

 

 

I seem to have ruffled a few feathers with my comments about the boats being slow. Sure a lot of sailors who want to earn a living and want to "do a Volvo" will be more than happy if its still a viable race next time, and if bean counting is what matters most, maybe it will. However my impression is that top skippers who have a choice, like exciting sailing, and have sailed this boat, will go for something much more fun if they get the offer, and this year's guys were disappointed with the boats performance. That can't be good.

 

When the accountants get ahead of the adventurers, I begin to think things are gong downhill fast.

You have got to admit this year's race wasn't exactly "Life at the Extreme" however many time Knut tells us it was.

 

Agreed, but that I think is more due to the route than the actual boats. Too many nanny/safety I mean ice gates to get them to extremes. 500 mile days aren't really that special lots of boats can do that. I want the chance to see the mono 24 hour record broken during the course of this event. These boats won't do that.

 

That being said I also don't think live 24/7 tracking is necessary. In the deep ocean on long legs the 3 hourly reports are just fine as far as I'm concerned

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65 foot race boat (draught 4.5m) sailing slowly up the river in Gothenburg city, there is a puff of wind, what do you think will happen?

1) boat goes faster

2) boat almost broaches and nearly comes to a halt

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For the first edition of a boat - the boys at Farr did a nice conservative job to ensure that they get around in one piece.

 

There were a couple of lessons learned that bit some people in the butt - ie. angled keel pin and longer fin in the southern ocean meets wave trough and tends to send the boat rotating into a chinese gybe as the bulb is so far away from the center of the boat.

 

And the boats were designed to be tippy as bashing into waves on the chine = much easier on the boat than bashing into waves at a low angle on the flatter panel sections ahead of the mast bulkhead.

 

If the boats & rigs were designed to handle a little less safety factor, they may increase the bulb size next time and speed them up. If not, it is another lap of life at the extreme.... heeling angle.

 

There is likely a crew debrief about the boats already on the calendar and they will release an updated class rule with whatever those updates are going to be.

 

Overall, the business got its media exposure, the sponsor got its couple good stories and nobody died. I still think it would have been much more interesting if they cut them loose from NZ a little earlier, but that is easy to say from my couch.

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If the VOR wants to make the next quantum leap it would surely have to be multihull. A fleet of round the world capable MOD 70's would be some spectacle.

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I found this race about as interesting as the last one.

 

I think OD is probably a good thing overall, but then again, the differences between the boats last time was very interesting. The fact that the boats lasted much better this time is also good, but then again, the stories of Puma in the Atlantic and Groupama sailing to Brazil jury-rigged and short-handed were pretty epic and very memorable. But having boats that didn't just fall apart is nice (I'm sure the sailors appreciated it).

 

The racing was very close, but I think that made it less interesting to me. The fleet tended to sail with each other, there weren't many big splits where you had to wait a few days to see who went the right way. It was often just a bunch of boats sailing along, maybe a few slowly falling off the back, and then in the last day or so you could start to tell what the finish would be like. There wasn't often a whole lot of change day-to-day, the group of boats are, next day the group of boats are here. It was cool to see how close the finishes were (but last time there were still some good finishes).

 

I thought the daily video content on youtube was a lot worse than last time, partly due to the fact that the fleet were always so close (there wasn't the story of "which choice will end up working best?", just who is currently leading the pack), and partly because it felt more like a reality TV show pitched at non-sailors, than a serious recount of what was going on. Maybe it is rose-tinted glasses, but I watched everything from the last race, but didn't bother with a lot of the daily updates this time, they just weren't that interesting.

 

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If the VOR wants to make the next quantum leap it would surely have to be multihull. A fleet of round the world capable MOD 70's would be some spectacle.

There are plenty of events out there to give us a multi fix. VOR has a long multinational mono history that gives it authenticity. It doesn't need to increase spectacle in the form of boat platform to secure its future. To the contrary ditching mono's would probably see it wither and die to be a french only event.

 

PS. I agreed with davidnumerouno. Ditch mandatory AIS transmission to unshackle them and reward naviguessing. The absence of technical info in the OBR's VOR feeds made them as boring as bat shit. Vestus crash and Dongs mast crunch the last ones I watched.

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I only heard like 5 seconds, he said he wanted simpler rules, he is definitely not happy with the penalties they got...

He was upset with the penalties and put a lot of their mistakes down to Volvo organizers.

He didn't really like the boat- said it was slow and thought the 70s were 'machines'

Slow! Perhaps the 65s are slower than the 70s, but, frankly, to my ear it makes him sound like a spoiled brat. "Daddy didn't buy me the toy I wanted."

 

they are slow, heavy with keel bulbs that barely cut it. We

Well that is opinion, can you be specific? Slow compared to what? Heavy compared to what? Why does the bulb not "cut it" and if you put more weight in the bulb, would that not make it heavier?

 

Please don't compare to multi's, apples oranges and we already know they took up 15% performance hit from the VOD70, but in generally performed close to their numbers. SO I'm looking to read your analysis of what is wrong with the VO65.

 

compared to a vo70 and open60. hulls are overbuilt (but nice n strong), bulbs are small, boats are tippy, should be able to power them up more, shouldn't have to sail with so much heel. thought it was a good race this time around, just think the boats are a little too kind and gentle for big name pro sailors, and the VOR. but, wtf do I know?

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Front page talked of a good fight with a link that led me here. WTF? Where's the fight?

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