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Boatzilla

Dynex Dux vs. New England STS

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I've done plenty of splicing and mucking around with 12-strand but I've not handled or spliced Dynex Dux or STS. Both are heat stretched dyneema and both have very similar specs. I'm approaching a wire replacement project. Any meaningful differences in these two products?

 

Thanks.

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Great topic. I hope this results in some real world review. I have to choose very soon which way to go and I have been leaning towards Dux. Please lets hear from users on both sides.

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We have used both for standing rigging, halyards and lifelines. Excellent results and durable ropes.

When adding a cover if you need to make it a double braid, may need to work quite hard on the core to core splice to finish the bury, but it can be done.

DUX is slightly stronger, but if you stay within the safety range based on the application, it should be fine to go either way. As single braids, they work similar to Amsteel, Endura 12 (STS) and Marlow D12.

The coating is not sticky and the main physical difference you'll find is that the are a little more stiffer than the standard DSK single braids and, therefore, you may want to have a larger bearing point when using the splice, such as a thimble, low friction ring, etc.

More people may elaborate more. Bam Miller, Mark Vannote?

Our 0.02

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OK cool. Thanks for the replies. So no huge differences between Dux and New England STS-HSR.

 

Breaking/tensile strength by brand:

 

7mm 18,690 New England STS-HSR Heat-Set Dynnema

7mm 16,500 Dynex Dux

7mm 8,937 Marlow Max 99

 

I'll likely go with New England for personal ease of availability. I'll use a large ring to distribute the load of the splice.

 

Cheers.

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OK cool. Thanks for the replies. So no huge differences between Dux and New England STS-HSR.

 

Breaking/tensile strength by brand:

 

7mm 18,690 New England STS-HSR Heat-Set Dynnema

7mm 16,500 Dynex Dux

7mm 8,937 Marlow Max 99

 

I'll likely go with New England for personal ease of availability. I'll use a large ring to distribute the load of the splice.

 

Cheers.

The number you listed for the Marlow is kg not pounds so 19706 lb

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I would say that the Marlow Max99 is by far the best line, and the most expensive. The Max99 is the newest of the varieties of dyneema.

 

All dyneema lines are heat-set. Have never understood why does DynexDux claim better performance than all others, GM, NE, you name them (nor believed it, either)

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I have been using sts as a replacement for a wire jibe halyard for the last year or so. Works great.

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I use the Marlow Max99 for a headstay and shrouds and it has much more creep than we expected, close to 5% now after 6 months. So I will go to EC6 for the headstay. John Franta claims the DynaDux has less creep so I would talk to him. Where creep isn't an issue Max99 is the greatest. Very happy with it. All our halyards are Max99. Marlow's Grand Prix line is able to put in hoist marks, diameter increases and all kind of trick details that are much appreciated. The ability to size down diameter due to strength makes the Max99 competitive in pricing; sometimes cheaper. Using less of a stronger material is always good and often economical.

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I use the Marlow Max99 for a headstay and shrouds and it has much more creep than we expected, close to 5% now after 6 months. So I will go to EC6 for the headstay. John Franta claims the DynaDux has less creep so I would talk to him. Where creep isn't an issue Max99 is the greatest. Very happy with it. All our halyards are Max99. Marlow's Grand Prix line is able to put in hoist marks, diameter increases and all kind of trick details that are much appreciated. The ability to size down diameter due to strength makes the Max99 competitive in pricing; sometimes cheaper. Using less of a stronger material is always good and often economical.

agree with the Maxx 99// we did a backstay// way too much creep// going back to the original rod.

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I had Dux (by Précourt) shrouds on my ex-trimaran.

 

I did find they had initially a lot of movement, which is 'constructional stretch.' CS is when load is applied to the line, and the braided fibres nest together. It appears to be creep, but is not, as the CS will desist over time. Took a few months for me, but then I didn't leave my stick up. I do, though, run a very tight rig, and my shrouds did quit needing to be readjusted.

 

Dux is prestretched and heat set. I don't know about the other brands. I liked the Dux, and will use it for martingales for a sprit I'm installing in my cat. Anyone have a source other than Colligo?

 

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Things may have changed but when I bought Dux a couple years ago Colligo gave me the

best price when I called and spoke to them directly. I'm able to buy spool ends of Endura 12

in various diameters for a steep discount at Hamilton Marine in Maine (store price better than

catalog). For whatever reason the Dux feels stiffer than the Endura. Should the shrouds need replacement I'll

probably go with the Dux again but I prefer the Endura for everything else.

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I use the Marlow Max99 for a headstay and shrouds and it has much more creep than we expected, close to 5% now after 6 months. So I will go to EC6 for the headstay. John Franta claims the DynaDux has less creep so I would talk to him. Where creep isn't an issue Max99 is the greatest. Very happy with it. All our halyards are Max99. Marlow's Grand Prix line is able to put in hoist marks, diameter increases and all kind of trick details that are much appreciated. The ability to size down diameter due to strength makes the Max99 competitive in pricing; sometimes cheaper. Using less of a stronger material is always good and often economical.

Five percent stretch /creep??

That's nearly two feet on a thirty foot shroud

Two feet??

Where do you get turnbuckles with that much adjustment??

In twenty days of sailing you are experiencing an inch of sag on every shroud each time out??

That's nuts!!

No way anybody would replace wire with shit performing materials like that

Five percent??

Really??

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Sorry, my mistake. I meant to type .5%. But now that I check my math it is more like 1% as the headstay is 70' and it has crept close to 14" in 4 months. We don't have turnbuckles, the line terminates on Colligo fittings at both ends with the top on a loop around a dog bone in the mast and the bottom lashed.

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I had Dynex Dux for 7 years and made a new set of cap shrouds and forestay for my Tri from New England STS over last winter. I can t detect a difference, and didn't have to retune after stretching them after splicing.

 

When West Marine has a 40% of bulk rope sale, it is very reasonably priced.

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I feel better now. As I don't know squat about creep I was thinking all the boats with spectra shrouds were nearly impossible to sail

Which made me feel like a really incompetent sailor

 

I know I still suck but not as bad as I had thought after reading five percent

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Dynex dux is finished as a brand name, Hampidjan now calls it "Dynice Dux".

During the last two years I did an extensive orientation on the different dyneema variants for the use of shrouds. I live int the Netherlands, where dyneema is invented and manufactured.

I ended up with using DSM's DM20. This is a dyneema specifically made with the lowest creep, with accepting a (somewhat) smaller breaking strength. The Dux technology is in my opinion a high performance dyneema type (I think mostly SK75) which is heat-annealed an compressed in its diameter. You can check this: 6mm "normal" dyneema weights some 23 gram per meter, the Dux some 32grams per meter: you simply get some more weight in the same diameter.

Dyneema has three sorts of stretch: 1. "construction", 2. "Normal", and 3 " creep". Construction stretch is simply caused by the way the rope is constructed, the "weave" of the rope: if the rope consisted of all and only parallel fibers there would be none of this. Normal stretch is the (very low) elastic like stretch of the fiber. Creep is not real stretch but a slow elongation of the fibers on a molecular level occurring from above around 30% of the breaking strength.

These three sorts of stretch have to be taken into account when deciding for the use of shrouds: breaking strength is in fact no issue, not even if you swap same diameter steel cable for dyneema. What is key is the creep. In that the DM20 excels: by far the lowest creep of all variants of dyneema.

Herewith some pictures of my project which I finished last March. I used 7mm dyneema DM20 for all my shrouds, fore and back stay. Forestry got a cover of dyneema for protection, as did the shrouds at the spreader ends.

I used tackles for adjusting for construction an "normal" stretch, and turnbuckles for finetuning. After some adjustment during the first days of sailing this summer (and thus adjusting for all stretch but the creep) I did not need to make more adjustments which might have been caused by creep.

 

My forestay (lower end of protection not net finished):

IMG_1214.JPG

 

IMG_2065.JPG

 

All soft hanks, i made some 40 of them:

IMG_1274.JPG

 

In use:

IMG_1320.JPG

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Looks good, like the simple terminations as long as bending radius is not an issue

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We have used both for standing rigging, halyards and lifelines. Excellent results and durable ropes.

 

When adding a cover if you need to make it a double braid, may need to work quite hard on the core to core splice to finish the bury, but it can be done.

 

DUX is slightly stronger, but if you stay within the safety range based on the application, it should be fine to go either way. As single braids, they work similar to Amsteel, Endura 12 (STS) and Marlow D12.

 

The coating is not sticky and the main physical difference you'll find is that the are a little more stiffer than the standard DSK single braids and, therefore, you may want to have a larger bearing point when using the splice, such as a thimble, low friction ring, etc.

More people may elaborate more. Bam Miller, Mark Vannote?

 

Our 0.02

Hey Rod,

 

I was just checking the forums out and saw this. Got myself a different job. I am still happy to help out with any rigging questions but am not on here as much as before.

 

Good luck.

 

Mark

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When you guys are talking about creep, are you stretching the stays, post splicing, prior to mounting them on the spars? Because from what I understand about this stuff, doing such is key, in terms of reducing creep. And the post splice length added by the pre-mounting stretch, needs to be accounted for when splicing the rigging initially. Or you may be abck splicing it again, only a bit shorter the 2nd time around.

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I hooked one end of the spliced setups to my trailer hitch on a small incline the other end to the trailer with the wheels blocked.

 

Trailblazer in neutral than in light gear stretched out a couple inches in 30 ft. I haven't noted any creep since then. 7mm STS. 24' Corsair.

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locking Brummell splice. It takes me about 15minutes/splice.

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@ SySunday The toggles you use with the eye welded on, where do you find these? I have not been able to locate them because I have no idea what the common name or trade name is. When I go looking all I find is the swage style for wire terminations.

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@ SySunday The toggles you use with the eye welded on, where do you find these? I have not been able to locate them because I have no idea what the common name or trade name is. When I go looking all I find is the swage style for wire terminations.

They are often called "running backstay t-balls"

 

http://www.fisheriessupply.com/alexander-roberts-t-ring-t-ball-running-backstay-trb8

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So I'm wrestling with going with Colligo mast terminators with the larger radius, or if I can use the T-Ball fittings with the ring for shrouds and forestay.  Is the bend radius of these 'running back' fittings adequate not to degrade the 7mm Dux? The T-Ball fittings seem simpler, lighter, and less windage...

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i'm doing a similar type of shroud, though with much smaller line. I decided I didn't like the luggage tag loss of strength, so decided to terminate the upper end of shroud in a nylon thimble. The T-ball fitting is lashed to the thimble. The smaller line does better with the smaller radii.

The other end terminates in a LFR, through which a cascade of another LFR and then a Practice Laser vang (3:1) setup tensions. Figure around 10:1 total purchase, since the LFR add a bit more friction than blocks. 

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