Panope

Anchor Geekdom

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Thread title credit: Bob Perry.

 

This thread is a continuation of the discussion we were having over on the CA Raft Up Thread. http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?showtopic=167755&st=0

 

I had posted some videos of various anchors setting and Alex W offered to let me use his Fortress anchor to test.

 

Here is the result:

Here are the other 6 videos that I have already posted:

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Here is the camera/float lashup used for the first 6 videos:

 

Anchor%20Test%20033_zps2j4rkja3.jpg

 

 

It was pointed out to me that the buoyancy of the camera float could affect the setting performance of an anchor. I do not believe this was a factor previously as the camera float was very small. That said, for the recent, Fortress anchor test I removed some material from the float to further reduce buoyancy.

 

Steve

 

Camera%20Float%20004_zpsgpxj64gl.jpg

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DRIFTW00D, The camera was only connected to the anchor. No surface line.

 

Steve

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Kim, It is my pleasure to make the videos. Next time you come up to Port Townsend, bring some of your "porch art" and we can put it to the test.

 

Steve

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Kim, It is my pleasure to make the videos. Next time you come up to Port Townsend, bring some of your "porch art" and we can put it to the test.

 

Steve

My buddy Paul Jenkins gave me a FX-16 earlier this year, your video gives me a lot of confidence in it when used in that kind of bottom.

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God dammit Driftw00d. stop polluting every fucking thread I think is interesting. Ignore ignore ignore!

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It's these kinds of threads that makes SA/CA worth coming to. Thanks, Panope!

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It's these kinds of threads that makes SA/CA worth coming to. Thanks, Panope!

 

Yopp! Thanks Panope and keep up the good work!

 

(I have a little fortress anchor for my little boat and it instantly holds like a 16 ton weight in that mud/sand/slime bottom you tested it in. Now I know I don't make this up in my mind.)

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Thanks, that was great. I've been looking forward to this video since hearing that you did the test. I got a smaller Fortress FX-11 (the FX-16 is a bit large and didn't fit into my boat's anchor locker) and will feel confident using that as my "always available" anchor, leaving the Manson Supreme for cruising purposes. I always wondered how the Fortress would do under resets.

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Thanks everyone,

 

Alex W, was kind enough to lend me the Fortress but after the test I ended up buying it from him (Alex, did you get my check in the mail?).

 

Today I bought 12 feet of 5/16" chain and some 9/16" nylon and I am splicing it up right now. Tomorrow I will try and re-test the Fortress with this mixed (mostly rope) rode and see if the anchor behaves differently. This smaller sized, mixed rode will likely represent what most people are using with this Fortress anchor.

 

Another test I want to do with the fortress is to set it up on the stern rail and deploy it (throw it overboard) while under-way and see if it will hook up and crash-stop the boat. That test might be very difficult to video as the motion may have the camera pointing every which way but at the anchor.

 

Steve

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Steve, where are you doing this testing? Water is pretty clear, or maybe the GoPro is just good enough to pick up light anyway.

 

BTW, nice picture of Panope in your avatar :D .

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DDW,testing area is just to the South West of the big marina at Port Townsend. I have no reason to believe this area has water that is any clearer than other Puget sound waters. But I am not a diver so I really do not know. I will say that it makes absolutely no difference weather the sun is shining or if overcast.

 

I owe the avatar photographer a beer.

 

Steve

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Yup, the check arrived on Saturday. Testing with that rode makes a lot of sense, the rode that I use with my Fortress is 15' of 3/8" and 150' of 1/2". Pretty short and light for around here, but good for a stern anchor or my emergency anchor.

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Today I bought 12 feet of 5/16" chain and some 9/16" nylon and I am splicing it up right now. Tomorrow I will try and re-test the Fortress with this mixed (mostly rope) rode and see if the anchor behaves differently. This smaller sized, mixed rode will likely represent what most people are using with this Fortress anchor.

 

Another test I want to do with the fortress is to set it up on the stern rail and deploy it (throw it overboard) while under-way and see if it will hook up and crash-stop the boat. That test might be very difficult to video as the motion may have the camera pointing every which way but at the anchor.

 

Looking forward to seeing this. I've been working on this technique for singlehanding, with mixed results. And yes, most Fortress users would have mostly rope, especially in smaller boats.

 

Thanks for the great tests! I watched them all.

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Today I bought 12 feet of 5/16" chain and some 9/16" nylon and I am splicing it up right now. Tomorrow I will try and re-test the Fortress with this mixed (mostly rope) rode and see if the anchor behaves differently. This smaller sized, mixed rode will likely represent what most people are using with this Fortress anchor.

 

Another test I want to do with the fortress is to set it up on the stern rail and deploy it (throw it overboard) while under-way and see if it will hook up and crash-stop the boat. That test might be very difficult to video as the motion may have the camera pointing every which way but at the anchor.

 

Looking forward to seeing this. I've been working on this technique for singlehanding, with mixed results. And yes, most Fortress users would have mostly rope, especially in smaller boats.

 

Thanks for the great tests! I watched them all.

 

 

You need to get out more. ;)

 

 

 

 

To be fair, so did I, but I did skip a lot of the basic "anchor sitting in the mud" with some judicious jumps to bits with subtitles.

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Ish, I hear ya on the "anchor sitting in mud" thing. Being new to these public anchor discussions/debates/quagmires/shit fights, I was worried about credibility - hence the lack of editing (I did not want to hear someone say that I clipped or spliced the videos to sway the outcomes). I'm a lot less concerned about that now so in the future I will cut out the boring parts.

 

Here is my latest offering from today's test of the Fortress. This time I used a rode consisting of 12 feet of 5/16" chain, spliced to a length of 9/16" nylon rope. I deployed this from the stern of the boat while underway at a steady 3.6 knots. The Idea was to simulate an emergency stop using the anchor only.

 

Steve

 

The video is only 3 minutes, 8 seconds long so it should require little fast forwarding:

 

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That was excellent, the GoPro approach to researching this kind of thing really shows it like it is.

Maybe try some different combinations if you have the various models to test - soft mud, rocky stuff, pure sand etc etc ......

Very keen to follow this thread, keep it up

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Overbend, good idea. I'll try and locate an area with a different substrate for some future tests.

 

So far I have conducted all these tests within about 200 feet of each other in order to give the anchors similar treatment.

 

Steve

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Steve, this is great work. I'd love to see some anchors trying to penetrate brown kelp. It's the only thing that's foiled my Mantus.

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IStream, I have the same experience with my Manson and the kelp. It should not be too hard to find some. Seems like every time I sneak into a nice shallow spot away from the other boats, I end up with gigantic wads of kelp that completely entomb the entire anchor.

 

Today's test of the fortress (above) went well enough that I had time to re-test the Manson Supreme at short scope.

This time I used even shorter scope at 2.5 to 1. Also, unlike the previous short scope test (Video #2, 2.8 to 1) I was very careful to conduct the "pulls" exactly parallel to the bottom contour lines.

Steve

 

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IStream, I have the same experience with my Manson and the kelp. It should not be too hard to find some. Seems like every time I sneak into a nice shallow spot away from the other boats, I end up with gigantic wads of kelp that completely entomb the entire anchor.

 

Today's test of the fortress (above) went well enough that I had time to re-test the Manson Supreme at short scope.

This time I used even shorter scope at 2.5 to 1. Also, unlike the previous short scope test (Video #2, 2.8 to 1) I was very careful to conduct the "pulls" exactly parallel to the bottom contour lines.

 

Steve

 

Interesting. I wonder how many reversals involve such high boat speed. I wonder if it'd re-set better with a slow build in force opposite the initial set or whether the mud was the dominant issue. Also, that crab reminded me of this:

 

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Panope - thanks for sharing these. Really great idea with the camera.

 

I agree, would be interesting to see in different bottom types. Another idea would be if you have some notoriously difficult anchoring spots near you that you could test. Great Salt Pond on Block Island comes to mind around here...where the afternoon's entertainment is watching the anchor dragging contest.

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IStream, No doubt that my violent reversal technique is not what mother nature would typically do in a wind or current shift. I have been more interested in watching these anchors at the limits. But I wonder the same as yourself - with a slow reversal the anchor may not have not released at all. Certainly, with the high speed reversal, more of the chain catenary is eliminated than if pulled slowly.

 

SailAR, I'll definitely explore some other anchorages. However, I have a few more tests to conduct in this same spot as it is important to give the different anchor types the same treatment. Spade Anchor USA is shipping me a 44 pounder for testing. Stay tuned......

 

Steve

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I'm interested in the Spade test since that is what I am using for the bower. Also interested in the Rocna Vulcan, as it seems to be a copy of the Spade design but cast (?) in one piece. Those of us with bow rollers can't accommodate a roll bar anchor. Maybe you can hit up Rocna for a sample. If you run out of room to store them, I understand Kim's deck is available :).

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I'm interested in the Spade test since that is what I am using for the bower. Also interested in the Rocna Vulcan, as it seems to be a copy of the Spade design but cast (?) in one piece. Those of us with bow rollers can't accommodate a roll bar anchor. Maybe you can hit up Rocna for a sample. If you run out of room to store them, I understand Kim's deck Ish's boat is available :).

 

Fixed. Kim already has a ton of anchors and people keep giving him more. Nobody gives me squat.

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very cool, thanks. agree with DDW and would love to see performance of the newer designs without roll bar (Vulcan). Rocna should pony up for one for you, as seeing is believing and this vids are very telling.

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I'm interested in the Spade test since that is what I am using for the bower. Also interested in the Rocna Vulcan, as it seems to be a copy of the Spade design but cast (?) in one piece. Those of us with bow rollers can't accommodate a roll bar anchor. Maybe you can hit up Rocna for a sample. If you run out of room to store them, I understand Kim's deck Ish's boat is available :).

 

Fixed. Kim already has a ton of anchors and people keep giving him more. Nobody gives me squat.

 

Ish, You can have my piece-of-shit Danforth Copy (the one that did not set at all).

 

Steve

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I'm interested in the Spade test since that is what I am using for the bower. Also interested in the Rocna Vulcan, as it seems to be a copy of the Spade design but cast (?) in one piece. Those of us with bow rollers can't accommodate a roll bar anchor. Maybe you can hit up Rocna for a sample. If you run out of room to store them, I understand Kim's deck Ish's boat is available :).

 

Fixed. Kim already has a ton of anchors and people keep giving him more. Nobody gives me squat.

 

Ish, You can have my piece-of-shit Danforth Copy (the one that did not set at all).

 

Steve

 

 

Geez, thanks Steve. Generosity is not dead.

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Ish, I hear ya on the "anchor sitting in mud" thing. Being new to these public anchor discussions/debates/quagmires/shit fights, I was worried about credibility - hence the lack of editing (I did not want to hear someone say that I clipped or spliced the videos to sway the outcomes). I'm a lot less concerned about that now so in the future I will cut out the boring parts.

 

Here is my latest offering from today's test of the Fortress. This time I used a rode consisting of 12 feet of 5/16" chain, spliced to a length of 9/16" nylon rope. I deployed this from the stern of the boat while underway at a steady 3.6 knots. The Idea was to simulate an emergency stop using the anchor only.

 

Steve

 

The video is only 3 minutes, 8 seconds long so it should require little fast forwarding:

 

 

Amazing stuff. That is really cool, Steve. Nicely done!

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Thanks Black, Spade Anchor came through and sent a 45 pounder for testing. I have also gathered up a 20# genuine Danforth, a 33# pound Bruce copy and a 20# Northhill. Should be an interesting week. Stay tuned........

 

Steve

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Here's a link to an anchor study from about 20 years ago, done in Puget Sound and in various locations chosen for the variety of bottom conditions. This might shorten your research for where to find other places for testing.

 

 

http://www.ussailing.org/wp-content/uploads/DARoot/Offshore/SAS%20Studies/anchor%20study.pdf

 

I've always remembered the comment that choice of bottom is probably more important than choice of anchor.

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Here's a link to an anchor study from about 20 years ago, done in Puget Sound and in various locations chosen for the variety of bottom conditions. This might shorten your research for where to find other places for testing.

 

 

http://www.ussailing.org/wp-content/uploads/DARoot/Offshore/SAS%20Studies/anchor%20study.pdf

 

I've always remembered the comment that choice of bottom is probably more important than choice of anchor.

 

Yes, I like it to be Quik-Set at night, and light broth when it comes to retrieval.

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Sam, Thanks for the link for the anchor study. Good stuff.

 

I will eventually venture to different sea-bed types but for now I will continue with what I started - I comparison of various anchors under similar conditions.

 

Today, the gales finally abated and I was able to test 5 new (to me) anchors and a re-test of 2 of the previous anchors.

 

First up is a 50 pound CQR (copy). This anchor belongs to a dock mate and is in decent condition (hinge is not loose).

 

Steve

 

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Hey Steve, what is your rode? Chain, nylon? How much of each?

 

Can you do a Rocna?

 

Cheers,

 

Kim

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Kim, my primary rode is all chain, 3/8" BBB galvanized. I did do a couple tests with mixed rodes: Namely, the Forfjord and the "emergency stop" of the Fortress.

 

I'd love to test a Rocna if I could get my hands on one. However, everything I read says the Rocna and the Manson Supreme perform virtually the same.

 

Here the CQR (copy) trying to set at 2.5 to 1.

 

Steve

 

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Spade Anchor USA confidently sent to me, a 44 pound, steel Spade Anchor (S100) for testing with the agreement that I either return or purchase the anchor.


Today, I gave the anchor a good testing. Here is the first go at 3.5 to 1 scope


Steve



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Here is the Spade at the very short scope of 2.5 to 1.


I have to say that the setting and re-setting performance of this anchor is exceptional. The Manson Supreme normally sets I little bit faster than the Spade but the Manson has a very hard time coping with the 2.5 to 1 reverse wind/current test.


The Spade handles it with ease. Amazing.


Steve



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Dismal failure of a 33 pound Bruce (COPY) anchor. This anchor belongs to my next door neighbor and has been gathering dust in his garage for many years (he uses a Rocna on his boat).


My neighbor reported that the anchor originally would not set at all before he improved it by sharpening the toe.


I think it needs a bit more improvement.


Steve



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Good performance of a 20 pound Danforth (GENUINE).


This is in stark contrast to the complete failure of the Danforth Copy that I tested previously.


I am beginning to see a pattern here. It has to do with Genuine anchors (they work) and Copies (they do not work).


Steve



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12 Pound Northill Anchor (Genuine). These anchors were used in WW2 Navy Seaplanes as they are collapsible and fit into a small space.


My father found this anchor on the bottom of Puget Sound many years ago and he uses it very successfully in his 18 foot fishing boat of heavy construction.


Steve



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I re-tested the Genuine Bruce (33 pounds) at the scope of 2.5 to 1.


The anchor performed brilliantly at higher scope but at this very short scope the anchor struggled but did eventually set.


Steve



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Since the other top performing anchors got the short scope treatment (2.5 to 1), I figured I had better re-test the Fortress as well.


The anchor was exceptional at longer scopes but like all the rest (except the Spade), the fortress had problems with 2.5 to 1. It did eventually set and re-set.


I should stress that 2.5 to 1 scope is much shorter than what was ever intended by the anchor makers to be used. I chose to test with this scope so as to explore the limits.


Steve



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Great info, Steve. I plan to have my boat on the hard for some (extensive) glass work in the next 12 months or so and will happily lend you my 85# Mantus if you want to test it.

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Great info, Steve. I plan to have my boat on the hard for some (extensive) glass work in the next 12 months or so and will happily lend you my 85# Mantus if you want to test it.

I am considereing a mantus so that would be great, have you had good luck with it? I did notice that their recomended anchor is 10-15 lbs heavyer than the Rocna or Manson, but the mantus looks like it will fit my roller better.

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There sure are a lot of "anchor tests" on the Internet. Interesting that they do not always agree with each other.

 

But many seem to show genuine Danforth anchors have lots of holding power in the right bottom, so not surprising that Fortress does well.

 

Rocna anchors seem to always perform well in the tests. The Spade test was interesting, clearly better than CQR in that bottom.

 

Great to have Steve's videos so we can see ourselves which anchor does what.

 

Please keep them coming Steve.

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Thanks once again Steve. You guys realize he only has a manual anchor windlass right?

 

I have been using a Spade for 6 years now. I have found it to work very well in all bottoms, even at short scope. The nice yellow color gets mud stained pretty quickly, becoming black. In mud it will come up with quite a load typically, and must be dragged or washed off. In sand it comes up clean (as do all anchors pretty much).

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Great stuff, thanks for sharing! (and for hauling all that chain [170 pounds worth] up over and over again)

Watching that CQR go for a sleigh ride helps me understand why my Delta is so hard to set.

One day after 3 failed attempts, my nephew looked back at me from the bow and said "what else you got?" We slept on a Danforth that night.

I really miss my Rocna, but Poseidon just wouldn't give it up.

 

Keep 'em coming!

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Great info, Steve. I plan to have my boat on the hard for some (extensive) glass work in the next 12 months or so and will happily lend you my 85# Mantus if you want to test it.

I am considereing a mantus so that would be great, have you had good luck with it? I did notice that their recomended anchor is 10-15 lbs heavyer than the Rocna or Manson, but the mantus looks like it will fit my roller better.

I've had great luck with it so far (two seasons). It's only failed to set once, in thick brown kelp, but it's never dragged once set. That said, I've never put it to the test with winds over 20kts.

 

Other caveats:

1. It's Chinese-made and it looks it.

2. It often brings up a shovel full of mud so make sure your windlass can handle it and you've got a decent washdown since the bolted construction makes it harder to clean.

3. The company is new and small so keep in mind that its "lifetime" guarantee could be significantly shorter than your lifetime.

 

The above notwithstanding, I think it's a good value at 2/3 the price of the Rocna or Mantus at the time I bought it. That said, if money isn't tight and you don't need the ability to disassemble it for storage, I'd probably go with a Rocna if I were to do it over again. They look to be much higher quality and I don't have any fit issues.

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Good performance of a 20 pound Danforth (GENUINE).

 

This is in stark contrast to the complete failure of the Danforth Copy that I tested previously.

 

I am beginning to see a pattern here. It has to do with Genuine anchors (they work) and Copies (they do not work).

 

Steve

 

 

 

My experience completely. A CQR copy on a previous boat was almost useless, but we have a big genuine one on the current ship and it's better (I think) than our Manson in mud. The Manson (why did they name it after a mass murderer?) is amazing in kelp, just burrows in like a ferret down a rabbit hole.

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14 and a 1/2 minutes of rambling anchor babble. Fair warning.

 

Steve

 

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Thanks, Steve.

I lost my Lewmar this last summer of all places, Newcastle Island, wrapped up in an old mooring with a large underwater ball marked "Viking". So many boats there sometimes it seems like everyone is on 2.5 to 1. The motorboats are surely guilty of starting it. The Lewmar was supposed to be a new gen anchor when it came out and really seems to be around only due to being kit on new Hunters and others. It was like setting the hook in a trout , sometimes.

From your tests,with my bow roller, I would have to pick the S-100 this winter as my next primary. My Danforth backup has not handled wind and current resets well on my 12,000lb boat, even at low drag rates.

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Great info, Steve. I plan to have my boat on the hard for some (extensive) glass work in the next 12 months or so and will happily lend you my 85# Mantus if you want to test it.

Thanks Istream. I am very interested in testing your Mantus. Panope will be going on the hard as well for a few months so we had better act fast (before Thanksgiving) unless we wait until spring.

 

Your Mantus is so large and high holding power that Panope may be unable to properly set the anchor. Some theorize that this is a problem so a test would be good.

 

 

Steve

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Norse, I guess it was a Lewmar "Delta" that you lost? I'd like to test one as they do have a less than stellar reputation.

 

Steve

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Norse, I guess it was a Lewmar "Delta" that you lost? I'd like to test one as they do have a less than stellar reputation.

 

Steve

Yes, this one here.

 

I also read that Mark Bay in Nanaimo is closed to anchoring to protect the seabed, Pacific Yachting reported that. Seems more like people preferring to anchor rather than sit on a mooring 50 ft from the next mooring, or pay 12.50.

Delta_Galv1-900x450.jpg

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Great info, Steve. I plan to have my boat on the hard for some (extensive) glass work in the next 12 months or so and will happily lend you my 85# Mantus if you want to test it.

Thanks Istream. I am very interested in testing your Mantus. Panope will be going on the hard as well for a few months so we had better act fast (before Thanksgiving) unless we wait until spring.

 

Your Mantus is so large and high holding power that Panope may be unable to properly set the anchor. Some theorize that this is a problem so a test would be good.

 

 

Steve

Hi Steve,

My girl's not going on the hard before year-end, I'm thinking closer to next Thanksgiving. I'd be surprised if Panope had trouble getting a good set with my Mantus but there's no substitute for data so we shall see...

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Norse, I guess it was a Lewmar "Delta" that you lost? I'd like to test one as they do have a less than stellar reputation.

 

Steve

 

I have been using Deltas with no problem for a couple of decades. They might not have the instant set of a newer design, but mine have been very dependable. I'd be interested to see the tests if you can find one.

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Steve, invaluable work here. I notice you use 3000 rpm on the backdown to determine that a test anchor is truly holding ( boat no longer moving). What do you think the equivalent windspeed would be?

 

I imagine the equivalent it would be different for each boat because of displacement, freeboard etc but it would be comforting to contemplate when lying awake while laying to anchor that for example, at 25 kts true one is only testing the set to the equivalent of 2000 rpms, and therefore there is still half of the successful holding power 'remaining'.

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IIRC, you can get about 10lbs of thrust per horsepower. I don't know the HP of Steves motor, or the size of his boat, but as a wild guess I'd say the 3000 rpm might be equivilent to 10-12 knots of wind. The force on an anchor and rode increases as the square of the wind velocity....thus, when it breezes up you need some serious ground tackle.

This is a pretty informative thread, thanks, Steve, for the great videos.

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IIRC, you can get about 10lbs of thrust per horsepower. I don't know the HP of Steves motor, or the size of his boat, but as a wild guess I'd say the 3000 rpm might be equivilent to 10-12 knots of wind. The force on an anchor and rode increases as the square of the wind velocity....thus, when it breezes up you need some serious ground tackle.

This is a pretty informative thread, thanks, Steve, for the great videos.

Steve has 39hp in Panope

 

Edit: 40hp

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Cwinsor,

 

I recently had the opportunity to test the engines ability to "back" into strong wind in a recent gale. It was blowing steadily in the upper 30's and with a 3 foot chop (couple miles of fetch) I was able to hold the boat stationary at about 3000 RPM. The engine redlines at 3,800 RPM (it will achieve that) and is rated at 40 horsepower. I use a 18" diameter, fixed pitch three blade propeller and like all fixed props, it makes only about half as much thrust in reverse as when in forward gear.

 

The limited ability of our modestly powered sailboats to back down on the anchor, is a big reason why I like to give the anchor some "momentum based" yanking. It is only a short duration pull but I have to believe that the forces are much higher than what the engine alone can produce.

 

Steve

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I'll add that when turned around and facing into that same gale force wind, the boat was able to bash along at just under 5 knots at 3,000 RPM.

 

Steve

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IIRC, you can get about 10lbs of thrust per horsepower. I don't know the HP of Steves motor, or the size of his boat, but as a wild guess I'd say the 3000 rpm might be equivilent to 10-12 knots of wind. The force on an anchor and rode increases as the square of the wind velocity....thus, when it breezes up you need some serious ground tackle.

This is a pretty informative thread, thanks, Steve, for the great videos.

Steve has 39hp in Panope

 

Edit: 40hp

OK. That equals about 400 lbs of thrust, which would be about 20-25 knots of wind, assuming his boat is about 40'. If the wind doubled, the load on anchor will quadruple...1600 lbs.

 

Here is an interesting formula I found in an old book:

Lbs of pull = k AV^2

V is the wind velocity in MPH, A is the frontal area of the boat (beam times height of cabintop), and k is a shape factor... .0055 for an average sloop, .0035 for an average powerboat. More masts and rigging use a higher constant, more streamlining use a lower one. If the boat tends to tack at anchor, might want to use LOA times cabin height for A to account for the greater load.

A couple other tidbits in the book... The holding power of an anchor is proportional to the area of the flukes, and to the depth they bury. This is a cubic function, same as weight. Thus, when comparing similar anchors of different weights the holding power is proportional to the weight...ie: a 20lb Danforth will hold twice the load of a 10 lb Danforth. This can't be used to compare differing anchor types.

Also, the holding power of a traditional yachtsmans anchor (Herreshoff or Luke) is only about 7 times the weight. Modern burying anchors hold far more per pound. I don't think a Luke type anchor as a storm hook is worth the weight necessary to hold in a blow. It would require a massive anchor.

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I will try and find load cell equipment and conduct dockside bollard pull tests.

 

Steve

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I was drooling over the S100 tonight and wondered how the aluminum version would be at 26 lbs.https://www.spadeanchorusa.com/product/spade-a-aluminum-a100

 

I gave my Lewmar some real workouts and it held me all night so I should say some nice things about it too.

I tried anchoring it east of Potlatch in Howe Sound in what amounted to underwater talus. After 3 tries I got it to hook in the large marbles and spent the night there, well protected from the night's outflows. Given proper scope, it was dependable but in a tight anchorage with 15-20 winds and some real tide shifts, like Mark Bay, it does not sit well on a short scope without an all chain rode.

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I have a 20KG Lewmar delta on my boat down in Seattle you would be welcome to borrow for a test... I would love to see a Rocna vs Manson test as well. We had a 20KG Rocna on our 35' boat while we cruised from Seattle to NZ and were very happy with it. I have lots of anecdotal evidence of where we had problems, though of of those cases would be hard to recreate.

 

Your abrupt direction change with force is a good test though as one of the times we had an issue was when we were anchored with about 4.x:1 in about 75' of water with a nice normal 10-15 kt trades predicted a unpredicted storm came though and blew 55+ for a few hours about 120 degrees different than what was predicted. So gentle direction change due to a wind shift or current is not the only use case... :)

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thanks for the videos!

 

interesting to see that anchor "flying" in the stern emergency brake test

 

have read that smaller bruce anchors are heavy and hydro-dynamically stable enough to work as drouges when trying to slow down a little in deep water gale force winds

 

if you do end up with a load cell it would be interesting to see if that's true and/or how effective they are

 

though i guess i could simply toss mine off the stern and seen what happens to boat speed

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I was drooling over the S100 tonight and wondered how the aluminum version would be at 26 lbs.https://www.spadeanchorusa.com/product/spade-a-aluminum-a100

 

 

We twisted the shank off of an aluminum one with a mild jerk out in Carriacuo. As people have said, the shanks are fabricated from three pieces of plate. In this case the welds failed, and examination of the welding showed incomplete penetration. I would stay away from the aluminum one, or treat it carefully.

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I have a 20KG Lewmar delta on my boat down in Seattle you would be welcome to borrow for a test... I would love to see a Rocna vs Manson test as well. We had a 20KG Rocna on our 35' boat while we cruised from Seattle to NZ and were very happy with it. I have lots of anecdotal evidence of where we had problems, though of of those cases would be hard to recreate.

 

Your abrupt direction change with force is a good test though as one of the times we had an issue was when we were anchored with about 4.x:1 in about 75' of water with a nice normal 10-15 kt trades predicted a unpredicted storm came though and blew 55+ for a few hours about 120 degrees different than what was predicted. So gentle direction change due to a wind shift or current is not the only use case... :)

buchhla, Thanks. I would very much like to test a Delta. I had been planning on storing the boat on the hard for couple months but this testing is ramping up to the point that I may not haul. It looks like Anchor Right of Australia will be sending a SARCA.

 

My work brings me to Boeing field frequently by airplane. I keep a car there so perhaps we can meet for an anchor hand-off.

 

Steve

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I have found two new testing areas that have seabeds with different composition than the previous area.


Let's call the first location "Point Hudson". The tidal current runs at least 3 knots here and the resulting seabed is a sandy/rock combination. The navigation chart shows the symbol "RKY" here.


I attached the rode to the "Rock Slot" of the 45 pound Manson Supreme as I was not sure of the size of the rock and was worried the anchor may become lodged between larger rock. As it turned out, no large rock was present.


However, the chain did travel to the "tripping" position of the rock slot twice during the following set with somewhat unfavorable consequences.


Steve



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Same area as yesterdays test area (Point Hudson - a sand and rock combination).


The Manson's rode was attached to the normal position and it dug in and stayed dug in through multiple "reversals"


The Spade leaped into the seabed and stayed deeply buried. Because a strong current was running, I had to retrieve the anchor incrementally as I was alone and could not operate the boat and the windlass simultaneously.


This provided a look at four different (decreasing) scopes. Even at as little as 1.7 to 1, the anchor was still making some holding power.


I was so impressed by this performance, I sent Spade Anchor a check. I am now a Spade owner.


Steve



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Impressive results. I wonder what % of Manson users actually employ the rock slot, and under what conditions. If in practice it is almost always being used at the single point of attachment then it would appear to be a toss up between it and the spade. Related question - what windlass are you using? I understand it is manual, so you have gotten a good workout over the last 21 tests. I am seeking to upgrade and am torn between the simplicity of reinstalling another manual vs the ability to quickly up anchor short-handed with a powered windlass, either to re-do a failed set or because conditions require.

 

The dragging of the spade in the current/wind conditions you experienced while you had to belay and return to the helm and drive the boat forward multiple times to relieve strain gives me pause... But maybe that is a nice problem to have because it indicates such a good holding anchor?

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Cwinsor, I agree that the two anchors are very close in overall performance. I suppose it was just my inner anchor geek that needed to own the spade.

 

I am using a Simpson Lawrence 555 windlass. Yep, good work out. Especially last week when I did 9 tests in a 3 hour period.

 

I have little desire to switch to a powered windlass. Then again, I have not been "spoiled" by one. Yet.......

 

Steve

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Cwinsor, I agree that the two anchors are very close in overall performance. I suppose it was just my inner anchor geek that needed to own the spade.

 

I am using a Simpson Lawrence 555 windlass. Yep, good work out. Especially last week when I did 9 tests in a 3 hour period.

 

I have little desire to switch to a powered windlass. Then again, I have not been "spoiled" by one. Yet.......

 

Steve

 

Steve, if you decide you really don't need two spade style anchors, I will buy the Spade from you. Kim

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Kim, you are first on the list if I sell the Spade. But do not hold your breath. The thing even fits my bow roller and hull gaurd plate like a glove.

 

Steve

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This is turning into an expensive set of videos for you to produce Steve, first you bought my FX-16 and now it is a Spade. Thanks for continuing to work on them!

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Alex, I'm ashamed to say that I will be buying one of Kim's deck art pieces as well.

 

I figure the money I am saving on gym membership will buy a few anchors.

 

Steve

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Steve is buying my 20kg (44 pound) Bruce. I only charge $2 a pound for my Bruce anchors.

 

So Steve is getting a bit of a bargain compared to other Bruce anchors on Craigslist.

 

I might keep my little 5kg just because it is cute.

 

The 15kg (33 pounds) is still available if Steve wants a selection.

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The test is a compromise. The boat's engine lacks the thrust needed to fully rotate the larger anchors so I use momentum instead.

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Can you tell us about your boat, P? You gave us a hint in the background of one of your vids.

Ed, Boat is a Tom Colvin design, Saugeen Witch. 34' on deck, 15,000 lbs. She was originally built to Colvin plans as a poop deck, gaff schooner. I modified the boat by adding the pilot house and re-rigging as a sloop.

 

Steve

 

2014%20June%20lopez%20004A_zpstoiskkqa.j

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Can you tell us about your boat, P? You gave us a hint in the background of one of your vids.

 

Ed, Boat is a Tom Colvin design, Saugeen Witch. 34' on deck, 15,000 lbs. She was originally built to Colvin plans as a poop deck, gaff schooner. I modified the boat by adding the pilot house and re-rigging as a sloop.

 

Steve

 

2014%20June%20lopez%20004A_zpstoiskkqa.j

And Steve will be too modest to tell you that his modification workmanship is outstanding. He is a very clever and skilled craftsman whose work is top drawer all the way. If you ever get the chance to tour Panope, jump at the chance!

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She's even prettier under sail.

Especially when he sails into an anchorage and roars around a bit under sail before he anchors.

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Nice. What a small foretriangle. Is that the original foremast location? I envy you being out of the rain in the pilot house.

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