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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  
WCB

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On 3/23/2018 at 6:06 AM, BobBill said:

God, finally a 110. Looks to be a woodie too. $1000.

FWIW:

My first rig was a "tenner." Pics below to note subtlies...

My hull number, as I recall was in 500s and had to replace center 8-feet including oak ribs...and way Hunt designed, not so hard.

Glassed exterior, kept bridgedeck but removed bronze snubber winch and added Harkins (Hexes) to handle 125% Dacron jib and put dual flat Clamcleat replace snubber. Also added traveler and trap. The Harkens and trap got nothing but disdain from organization, then located in Michigan, so never really "joined." Outside of notes, all "Hunt tenner."

Today, lifting keels, traps and Harkens rule. Fast fast keelboat. Would plane, if that makes sense and kick scows in a chop. Safe and crew is so close to water sailing is a blast. I used spinnaker once...never seemed to need...was silk too, Shoulda kept that and the snubber, when I sold her. 

Depending on mast/boom and sails...is different than my rig in how it is put together...with perm keel and metal trailer...might be decent deal.  

Broke from mooring during a storm, ended up beached...mile away...no damage...fun 

110_15SA.jpg

110_18SA.jpg

110GroundedExcelsior.jpg

110_14SA.jpg

110_6.jpg

110's plane rather easily.  I think modern sailcloth and running rigging makes this more of a reality these days than when you were sailing them.  I've planed DDW with just the main and jib.  With an Asymmetric spinnaker the boat takes off, especially with the masthead setup that we have for non class racing.  The 110 is a special boat. 

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On 3/16/2018 at 10:41 AM, Looper said:

Unless the boat has become an absolute noodle, I think the seller is missing a zero perhaps. 

For Sale Star Sailboat #7014
Sail Ready, first $1,000.00 buys a very fun and fast sailboat.
Comes with:
3 Spar Tech Masts 
2 Spar Tech Booms
1 Quantum Main
4 North Mains 
4 Jib sails
Wisker Pole
Hiking Vest
Lifting Lanyard
Other Parts and Accesories

Balbi Trailer, Tows Well
New Tires
New Led Lights

I

About the right price for a boat that age. Stars are surprisingly cheap, especially pre-epoxy days. Although not as sturdy as a newer boat, you cannot see the difference on small lake flat water. Awesome boat to race, great class.  

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On March 23, 2018 at 7:12 PM, dgmckim said:

at least when it comes to sailboats, the Tempest is not easily mistaken for a Skylark. Or so says my cousin, who's a lawyer.........

Best Tempest story ever...

 https://bangshift.com/bangshiftapex/thundering-bastard-the-day-a-super-duty-pontiac-tempest-destroyed-the-worlds-best-sports-cars/

12 cars were built, 6 wagons and 6 coupes.  All went to the drag strip except the car in story above. 4 of the coupes ended up destroyed, including the one in story. One was recently found missing all the parts. This is the only surviving complete coupe left. It sold back in 2010 for $455,000. It's worth considerably more now, perhaps close to seven figures.

 

image.jpeg

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15 hours ago, Plumber said:

About the right price for a boat that age. Stars are surprisingly cheap, especially pre-epoxy days. Although not as sturdy as a newer boat, you cannot see the difference on small lake flat water. Awesome boat to race, great class.  

I think it is a steal...

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10 hours ago, WCB said:

Oh snap...they're proud of that boat.  

Like the $15k Etchells that's from the seventies '74 Etchells

+1 I have to agree. Never really like Douglass' Scot, though he did hit the mother lode with it...something about it...Now that Echells tickled me timbers and always get me dreaming about the Yngling, which for some crazy reason I have coveted. Maybe cuz it is like a 110 or Luders 16. 

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I think that it's a dingaling (Yngling) on Ebay but they don't say the right name.  Maybe you recognize it better than I do.

Yngling??  $1,300 doesn't seem so bad.

Don't get me wrong, I love Etchells but $15,500 for a 1974 is not reasonable.

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WCB, Dig! Yngs are kind of plain Janes and were once lady boat in the phony Olympics...cheap, but need place to keep on buoy or fast dry sail put ins. Almost as simple as the Scot, but a little classier...and lots less moola than Etchells, especially its motors. I will look the rig up on eBay sounds inviting.

There is Etchells for $5250 blue I saw.

No find Yngling...I think the Prince was sailing a Dragon...not sure. But that Etchells...I dream of boats like an adolescent dreams of poon!

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4 hours ago, BobBill said:

WCB, Dig! Yngs are kind of plain Janes and were once lady boat in the phony Olympics...cheap, but need place to keep on buoy or fast dry sail put ins. Almost as simple as the Scot, but a little classier...and lots less moola than Etchells, especially its motors. I will look the rig up on eBay sounds inviting.

There is Etchells for $5250 blue I saw.

No find Yngling...I think the Prince was sailing a Dragon...not sure. But that Etchells...I dream of boats like an adolescent dreams of poon!

Check out my post above yours.  Where it says, Yngling??, that is the hyperlink to the eBay auction.  

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23 hours ago, il1395 said:

Quite possibly the world’s most expensive 1992 Flying Sidewalk. I bet it didn’t cost that much new. 

 

https://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/d/1992-flying-scot/6546373122.html

Not all that much out of line...a 45 year old Scot in decent condition might sell for $5K. They hold their value pretty well. 

I suspect in that case the seller added the roller furler and OB, and added the cost to what he paid for the boat. Still, with no furler or OB that's about a $7+K boat.

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2 hours ago, WCB said:

Check out my post above yours.  Where it says, Yngling??, that is the hyperlink to the eBay auction.  

Mea culpa, I clicked after I reply, and forgot. Par for me...sorry. Looks decent, indeed. Trick is dockage/buoy etc. got me going...thanks. Now, to dream...bet not as fast as my old 110

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I sailed an Yngling a few times many many years ago. They sail very nice...good balance. Not as fast as one might think, a J-22 or old mini tonner is probably faster. 

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They certainly look like fun boats to sail. I remember checking them out when the women's keelboat medal was in them and there were a few around Newport, RI back when I lived there. 

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5 hours ago, RKoch said:

I sailed an Yngling a few times many many years ago. Maybe They sail very nice...good balance. Not as fast as one might think, a J-22 or old mini tonner is probably faster. 

Makes sense to me. Always figured a 110 was faster...though older. Thing is, when sailing, maybe they are all "fast" enough?

Maybe rig needs larger foresail, but slick and can sail alone. it is a simple rig, easy to care for...sail, etc.

J22 likely better choice and your implication is why rig sort of hung up. Still decent deal, to me!

Thanks.

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How about a 110 with an I14 rig? I have the hull here, I need to finish the recore. The rig is sitting in my warehouse.  I can't wait to marry the two on the lake here.

Modern_110.jpg

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15 hours ago, WCB said:

How about a 110 with an I14 rig? I have the hull here, I need to finish the recore. The rig is sitting in my warehouse.  I can't wait to marry the two on the lake here.

Modern_110.jpg

That looks hot...like this file pic from Nationals I ripped some years back. A "turbo'd 110...with lifting keel. Be so hot...is lake large enough?

Can do so much, can't do on Yngling...like plane....The drawing is exquisite!

Turbo110.jpg

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On 3/29/2018 at 11:27 PM, WCB said:

Oh snap...they're proud of that boat.  

Like the $15k Etchells that's from the seventies '74 Etchells

Blue spar and motor bracket?!? So that's why he's asking $15K...

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2 hours ago, Plumber said:

Blue spar and motor bracket?!? So that's why he's asking $15K...

Thought I saw one above someplace for $1500...? Likely too much rum!

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59 minutes ago, WCB said:

BobBill here's another Yngling for you.  Red...in Ithaca NY.  

NY Yngling - arrest me red

That is a nice boat...I painted my rig red...old superstition about red hulls loosing races...but that is very nice boat. I would if I could...dreamer that I are.

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2 hours ago, BobBill said:

Thought I saw one above someplace for $1500...? Likely too much rum!

$1,500 would be closer to the correct number but yes, they have another zero added on there.  $15k!!

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1 hour ago, WCB said:

$1,500 would be closer to the correct number but yes, they have another zero added on there.  $15k!!

W. righto...the rig was  74 on eBay, For 5250, and got email it was bought or pulled...looked good. Love all these keelers, but the tenner is simpest of all to keep anmd run, IMHO. 

 

 

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2 hours ago, BobBill said:

W. righto...the rig was  74 on eBay, For 5250, and got email it was bought or pulled...looked good. Love all these keelers, but the tenner is simpest of all to keep anmd run, IMHO. 

 

 

Agreed.  The 110 is so small on its trailer.  It's amazing how different it is.  I've sailed Etchells a bunch, and love the boats, but in those six feet there is a lot of growth but in height, beam, and length.  Oh, and weight.  I saw that blue one, southeast if memory serves.  Much better price.

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13 hours ago, WCB said:

Agreed.  The 110 is so small on its trailer.  It's amazing how different it is.  I've sailed Etchells a bunch, and love the boats, but in those six feet there is a lot of growth but in height, beam, and length.  Oh, and weight.  I saw that blue one, southeast if memory serves.  Much better price.

You know, couple years back I saw one on road, one with the rising keel. It took me a bit to realize what I saw and now wish I could have taken pics...only reason I figured it out, slowly, was the stern...seems to make sense...the lifting keel...but complicated. Even then, and with simple 3/4 rig, boat is best on buoy or in slip or dry sailed as mast is not easy to step with two...each time.

Still, the Tenner above shows different rigging and looks if keel can be cranked...I think they use center post for either large main or jenny block, maybe both...the above does not show the larger jib...main was always, to me, handled with single Harken. The above looks like it boasts a mid-boom traveler, which mine did not sport...all set up to fit hull style. I still think the Tenners are wonderments. They are narrow, but that makes sailing more seat of pants...fun.

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There is a new movement afoot in the 110 class to get rid of the genoa and to go with a small overlapping jib.  A couple are being made by Ullman sails in California and North is making some 3DI jibs.  I'm determined to avoid the genoa which would allow me to have smaller crew and be safer, to have better visibility.  The I14 rig is part of that move.

 

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2 hours ago, WCB said:

There is a new movement afoot in the 110 class to get rid of the genoa and to go with a small overlapping jib.  A couple are being made by Ullman sails in California and North is making some 3DI jibs.  I'm determined to avoid the genoa which would allow me to have smaller crew and be safer, to have better visibility.  The I14 rig is part of that move.

 

That's interesting. I ran with the 125 with and alone and loved it...even if visibility was less. Only trouble was with wire, but that was not de rigor then and Bay City slapped me. (Saginaw Bay was home fleet.) And they poohed the Hexes as well. PMO...and never looked back or went to Saginaw. Used to run alone lots and was miffed by rounding (lost it to windward) if gusty...with the 125...always. Interesting. Like to hear the logic out of curiosity. Interesting, thanks.

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Who would try something so dim??? Am with Gouv and feel zero pull!

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The (someone stole it) part could be referring to the stuff for sale haha

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11 minutes ago, dgmckim said:

The (someone stole it) part could be referring to the stuff for sale haha

That's what WCB was suggesting.  I emailed him and asked what type of Moth it was and he said he didn't know.  I'm sorry, but if you're sailing a foiling moth you damn well know what type of moth you have.  I'm headed up there on the 13th.  If anyone can figure out a way to get him to reveal the location I would be happy to go check it out.

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1 hour ago, Carbon said:

That's what WCB was suggesting.  I emailed him and asked what type of Moth it was and he said he didn't know.  I'm sorry, but if you're sailing a foiling moth you damn well know what type of moth you have.  I'm headed up there on the 13th.  If anyone can figure out a way to get him to reveal the location I would be happy to go check it out.

And he didn't send you pics either, right?

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Funny...I can see dork pushig camera or gun on CL, but a sailboat, much less a foiled Moth...wacko...

Fool2.jpg

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Tells me maybe two things, he is bullroar; maybe in jai,l and (one more) he don't swill demon-rum!.

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9 hours ago, BobBill said:

Tells me maybe two things, he is bullroar; maybe in jai,l and (one more) he don't swill demon-rum!.

Is this the blue etchells you were talking about?  Dropped $1k it looks like.

Blue Etchells $4k

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5 hours ago, WCB said:

Is this the blue etchells you were talking about?  Dropped $1k it looks like.

Blue Etchells $4k

Aye! 

Looks like it. But, I did not note the seller. I guessed it sold. Was 5250 or so and I had it wrong. I think I still have the link...

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18 hours ago, BobBill said:

Aye! 

Looks like it. But, I did not note the seller. I guessed it sold. Was 5250 or so and I had it wrong. I think I still have the link...

I think that's the same one, a grand cheaper so it might sell.

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A Flying Scot in Fairview PA... that is a tiny town near Erie. 

 

We had a cross country meet at Fairview my senior year. The course went through a bunch of weeds in the bottom of a ravine and I made a wrong turn. 

Their guys all started yelling “CUT CUT CUT!!”  I finally figured out it was me they were yelling about so I went back and went the right way. 

If course I lost a few guys but their team sucked so I managed to catch all of them before the  finish and by finishing fifth complete our teams’s one through five sweep.

The finish line guy wouldn’t give me a place card. As I was exhausted and totally feeling screwed I complained that I had gone back and then passed the other guys one by one and everybody in the race knew I went back, “Ask them!!”

Our Coach quietly told me “we won anyway and there is no point complaining.” 

so... I ended up running up and down the big hill a few times as punishment for shooting off my big mouth.

49 years later I am still pissed off at Fairview !! 

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15 hours ago, WCB said:

I'll be in Charleston in a month or so and I am tempted to go look at that.  My brother was interested in a Moth like that to play with.

There is a small but active group called the Classic Moth Boat Association. They're on FB. Several regattas during the year up and down the East Coast from NJ to FL. They sail under the 60s rules...no wings, original 75 ft^2 low aspect sail. That boat is a Shelly design, it looks to me. It would be fairly competitive in the Generation 1 division. Price isn't bad if in reasonable condition and close to 75 lb minimum weight. Keep in mind that the major cost is going to be rig and sail...up to $2000 new, and $500 to $1000 used. They are a lot of fun to sail, pretty sporty, and the small size makes them easy to transport and store.

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15 hours ago, WCB said:

$200 Flying Scot on Ebay. Says it's a 2002.  Could be a steal.

Flying Scot on Ebay

That's just the opening price. It will sell for much more, even though it needs a fair bit of work. 

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30 minutes ago, Locus said:

I like that its described as a Yawl. 

It's a sloop, yawl...

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1 minute ago, bill4 said:

It's a sloop, yawl...

HA! I was thinking the same thing . 

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You would have posted it schooner or later. (sorry...)

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Alan, That Banshee is a beauty from here but, alas, out of my area...aaarrrgggghhhh!

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Looks like that Moth has been too close to one too many bright lights!

Mid-winter conditions continue to prevail in SW Montana. Lot's of sailing cross training on the frozen version of water....

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10 hours ago, Dex Sawash said:

Wonder why it is so soft in the quarters ?

picclasscup16101b.jpg

 

Whoa..Like Dex,I have to admit new to me...a wee keel boat...spendy sucker too...have to check this class out...thought the Wylie17 foot was the smallest keeler.

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9 hours ago, Dex Sawash said:

I suppose the answer to the soft quarters is so you can sail it like this...

picclasscup16101a.jpg

 

 

Check it out, not lifting the rudder out hardly at all. Nice. Not much quarter wave either.

That's a cool boat but I don't feel the need for a ballast keel on a small boat like that, it's just extra weight to keep you from planing..... come to think of it, this boat might not benefit all that much from wide flat aft sections.

FB- Doug

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12 hours ago, bplipschitz said:

Centerboard is wrong.

Blip...yes saw it...but the beautiful rudder and hull got me going...just a bit far for me, though wondered, is worth it....

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On 4/14/2018 at 1:11 PM, WCB said:

This Star has been in this thread before.  Now it's on Ebay instead of Craigslist.  Stars seem like such a steal. 

Star on Ebay

it's so tempting! I love Stars. Too bad I don't have anywhere to keep it.

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On 4/16/2018 at 3:52 PM, dgmckim said:

it's so tempting! I love Stars. Too bad I don't have anywhere to keep it.

I know...same here.  I booked a dry sail spot so I could buy a Star but then I bought a different Craigslist find...a Mako 241.

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1 hour ago, ortegakid said:

just needs deck hydroturf and some white paint

Looking good!  I'm jonesing to get my 505 out of Winter storage so I can get to work on it.

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26 minutes ago, WCB said:
3 hours ago, Alan Crawford said:

I've been looking at this one because it has a float off trailer.  I'll be in the Boston area in a couple of weeks...hmmm.

That's an above-average trailer but it's not really a float-off (or more importantly, a float-on). Needs bunks and either buddy bars or a keel guide. Easy enough to fix up, but still.

-DSK

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1 hour ago, Steam Flyer said:

That's an above-average trailer but it's not really a float-off (or more importantly, a float-on). Needs bunks and either buddy bars or a keel guide. Easy enough to fix up, but still.

-DSK

Agreed.  Not sure how they modified it to be float off but if it's slightly better than a lift-off, that could work.

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10 hours ago, WCB said:

Agreed.  Not sure how they modified it to be float off but if it's slightly better than a lift-off, that could work.

That's the exact same trailer my Star has and I can tell you for certain it's not a float-on/float-off.  That's a recipe for keel damage.

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