albatross

Rapido 60' Trimaran, Morelli and Melvin design, launched!

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awsome boat!!!

(a monohulls for this kind of money will be very fast & unsinkable (if that's the object) too btw...)

 

really........... which ones are they that share the same level of comfort and speed?? Not the one below I guess that cost four times as much?

 

http://www.yachtingworld.com/news/oyster-yacht-sinking-five-crew-rescued-66677

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...charging upwind through a 35-knot night my head would rest uneasier on this tri than on say a pogo 50-type mono...

How often is that? 'Cause the other 999 days I'd prefer to be on the tri...

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...charging upwind through a 35-knot night my head would rest uneasier on this tri than on say a pogo 50-type mono...

Obviously you are going to have a reef in , totally happy to go upwind in Rapido 60 anytime !

 

What happens when you hit something on your Pogo 50 in the middle of the night ??

 

I know which boat I would sleep better on !

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Ya fuck that. If it's blowing 35kn I'm turning around and having a balls out blast sailing down wind. I'll figure out where I am afterwords.

 

 

In reality, I would rather be on the tri. Worst case you drop the sails and go make some tea until the weather moderates.

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Sean Langmans ORMA 60 does 18 knots upwind in 20 knots of wind tacking through 90 deg.

 

I reckon the Rapido would frighten 100Ft racing monohulls upwind in 35

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"What happens when you hit something on your Pogo 50 in the middle of the night ??"

you might hit something in the middle of the night in a lifetime of sailing - but sure as hell you're going to sail through umpteen hundreds of nighttime squalls during the same timespan...

hardly anybody will contest that on a multihull like Rapido a 2 person-crew will ahve to be in a total different universe of alertness conmpared to a monohull for the same money.

the rapido would not only frighten 100ft racing monos upwind, but also a helluva lot of crews!

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"What happens when you hit something on your Pogo 50 in the middle of the night ??"

you might hit something in the middle of the night in a lifetime of sailing - but sure as hell you're going to sail through umpteen hundreds of nighttime squalls during the same timespan...

hardly anybody will contest that on a multihull like Rapido a 2 person-crew will ahve to be in a total different universe of alertness conmpared to a monohull for the same money.

the rapido would not only frighten 100ft racing monos upwind, but also a helluva lot of crews!

 

I once had to beat against 40kts double handed on a high performance 56' tri for a couple of days while on the wrong side of a hurricane. Scaredest I've ever been, but we lived to tell the tale. What really scared me was when I got in irons and ended up on the wrong tack and couldn't get her to tack back. Ended up wearing ship (jibing around) and thought we might capsize while bearing off,

but it was surprisingly easy. I was under storm jib and rotated wing mast. Had to hand steer the whole time.

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What is the motion like on a big tri heading into a seaway? I haven't been terribly impressed by the jerky motion of cruising cats in swell.

I think the biggest selling point a good trimaran has over a Cat is the vastly improved motion upwind over virtually all catamarans .

 

To quote the customer of hull number 2 , a forty year veteran of monohull sailing

 

 

"We’ve been fortunate enough to have some time away with friends on a very nice 55ft Cruising cat
and loved the social and private spaces, not to mention the amount of gear that could be carried. But
the sea motion seemed kinda cork-screwish and left us feeling a bit green about the Cat option."
This was on one of the better performing French cats !
He has written a very nice article about the why he bought the Rapido 60 for boating NZ which you will see in time , love to put it here but don't want to steal their thunder .
The Rapido 60 is a pleasure to sail up wind , so much so that we dont care which way the wind is blowing !

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What is the motion like on a big tri heading into a seaway? I haven't been terribly impressed by the jerky motion of cruising cats in swell.

I think the biggest selling point a good trimaran has over a Cat is the vastly improved motion upwind over virtually all catamarans .

 

To quote the customer of hull number 2 , a forty year veteran of monohull sailing

 

 

"We’ve been fortunate enough to have some time away with friends on a very nice 55ft Cruising cat
and loved the social and private spaces, not to mention the amount of gear that could be carried. But
the sea motion seemed kinda cork-screwish and left us feeling a bit green about the Cat option."
This was on one of the better performing French cats !
He has written a very nice article about the why he bought the Rapido 60 for boating NZ which you will see in time , love to put it here but don't want to steal their thunder .
The Rapido 60 is a pleasure to sail up wind , so much so that we dont care which way the wind is blowing !

 

 

Now thats funny.

 

Pot meet Kettle.

 

We are talking a comfortable cruiser here?

 

 

The Tri configuration is probably the most uncomfortable slamming whacking jerking motion one can be exposed to,

and thats just at anchor , with any sort of wind against tide or a swell wrapping around a headland. Life can be miserable on the pick but sailing in a developed seaway doesn"t get any better with the three hulls taking turns in shouldering the burden.

:lol::lol:

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I disagree wholeheartedly. If you sail it "right" the leeward hull presses down and you float the main hull over the trough. We sent it on Paradox in the C600 in 22-26g30 upwind and I was amazed how not bad it was.

 

http://www.yachtworld.co.uk/boat-content/files/2013/04/FLYING-A-HULL.jpg

 

I remember the helicopter overhead and the wave in the photo. I was amazed how dramatic it looked in the photo and how not intersting it felt aboard.

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I've been fortunate enough (or had smart enough crews around me) to avoid being caught pounding upwind in big breeze and sea state offshore. Not so fortunate in beach cats sometimes, though rarely over 35kts and generally short lived so relatively mild sea state. In those conditions, we've found that under jib alone, even with just the wing mast, we couldn't manage going upwind. Different boat, different conditions, I'm sure you had experienced crew onboard but I was wondering if you thought about or have tried a triple reefed main or storm trysail and possibly a very small storm jib? Without the main I would think control would be troublesome?

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What is the motion like on a big tri heading into a seaway? I haven't been terribly impressed by the jerky motion of cruising cats in swell.

I think the biggest selling point a good trimaran has over a Cat is the vastly improved motion upwind over virtually all catamarans .

 

To quote the customer of hull number 2 , a forty year veteran of monohull sailing

 

 

"We’ve been fortunate enough to have some time away with friends on a very nice 55ft Cruising cat
and loved the social and private spaces, not to mention the amount of gear that could be carried. But
the sea motion seemed kinda cork-screwish and left us feeling a bit green about the Cat option."
This was on one of the better performing French cats !
He has written a very nice article about the why he bought the Rapido 60 for boating NZ which you will see in time , love to put it here but don't want to steal their thunder .
The Rapido 60 is a pleasure to sail up wind , so much so that we dont care which way the wind is blowing !

 

 

Now thats funny.

 

Pot meet Kettle.

 

We are talking a comfortable cruiser here?

 

 

The Tri configuration is probably the most uncomfortable slamming whacking jerking motion one can be exposed to,

and thats just at anchor , with any sort of wind against tide or a swell wrapping around a headland. Life can be miserable on the pick but sailing in a developed seaway doesn"t get any better with the three hulls taking turns in shouldering the burden.

:lol::lol:

 

Overlay can you give more details to what type of trimaran and where this experience comes from?

 

I disagree wholeheartedly. If you sail it "right" the leeward hull presses down and you float the main hull over the trough. We sent it on Paradox in the C600 in 22-26g30 upwind and I was amazed how not bad it was.

 

http://www.yachtworld.co.uk/boat-content/files/2013/04/FLYING-A-HULL.jpg

 

I remember the helicopter overhead and the wave in the photo. I was amazed how dramatic it looked in the photo and how not intersting it felt aboard.

 

You nailed it on the head Soma the only time Spirit is uncomfortable is when she's not being sailed correctly, mainly underpowered. When we have the correct amount of power the main hull glides over the wave tops and the windward ama is well above the wave tops. The motion going into weather is incredible as the main hull slices the wave tops and leeward ama takes the loading there's nothing like it!

This is based on experience sailing a formula 40 not so sure how the older heavier designs go but I bet the light weight Rapido is an awesome experience. More to the point anyone who wants to punch into 25kts + needs their heads read. After sailing more than 25,000 nm on a trimaran we have rarely sailed to weather and when we do we make sure it's light and pleasant. When your cruising there's no need to be stressing yourself or your boat and if you are your doing it wrong.

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Anyone else read Kurt Huges blog? By my interpretation he seems to hate kevlar and raves about how shithouse it is because it offers piss poor structural performance in stiffness and there is always something better that can be used. Here is just one snippet of him on kevlar http://multihullblog.com/page/25/ And found another http://multihullblog.com/2014/04/kevlar/

 

Seems the glass is on the outside of a Rapido and most designers seem to use kevlar on the inside if they use it at all, like Shuttleworth in my link above.

 

 

 

I got this note from someone reading a posting on Steamradio.

“Interestingly Shuttleworth recently posted on Steam radio re. Kevlar as follows:”
“We put Kevlar inside. It is partly because it is significantly better in tension than compression, but also when water penetrates the resin fibre matrix it acts like a wick and the water will migrate into the laminate – not something you want in a material that is very close to the water all the time. Small areas of damage that are not attended to can make this a problem. The third reason is that in an impact the outer skin will rupture – the foam will distort It is is either Airex R63.80 or Corecell A500 and the inside skin will stay intact even if the resin starts to fracture. The idea is that the foam and outer skin absorb a lot of the energy before it gets to the inner skin – which is ultra strong in tension. this combination has proved very successful in a number of cases of grounding or high impact on the hull.

Kevlar does need to be laid in a combination with glass, because the resin does not stick to the fibres very well. For the bigger boats we use a unidirectional fabric with alternate tows of kevlar and glass 50:50 by volume. This means that each layer is 660 gms/m2 Aramid/Glass – 237 gms/m2 Aramid, 422 Glass Unidirectional.”

Regards

John Shuttleworth
for Shuttleworth Design Ltd.

 

At first I thought, doesn’t he know? So many things wrong as I see it. Those all seemed like reasons to never use Kevlar. A grounding or impact is usually bow or keel line. I cannot see tension strength helping against basically shear load.
The multihull will not sink so holing is not the worst of worlds. The disadvantage of tensile strength across in interior panel is that a small impact can make a huge delamination inside. Especially since the Kevlar is not bonding to anything else.
The Kevlar in combination with glass seemed to be a bad solution for a couple of reasons. Even if the glass is a good laminate, the poorly bonded Kevlar between glass lams means very poor shear transfer between layers. So why bother with the Kevlar at all?
Finally if the Kevlar is for impact, a woven fabric is much better than a uni or a knitted fabric.
Then I recalled my earlier comment that the only use for Kevlar is as a yuppie magnet, for boat sales. I realized that the way he uses Kevlar is brilliant. He puts it in the place on a hull where it can do the least harm. Then the boat sellers can attract yuppies with it. Like the carbon fiber cleat pads on Gunboats. Utterly wrong material, but it confirms to yuppies that they are indeed high tech. And that tiny bit of fabric visible is the evidence. Brilliant.

 

Ps, the boat pictured in my avatar has a lot of kevlar in it. I always wondered how much heavier it was due to it possibly being soaked up with water.

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So what is the story with these beasties (any tri over 40ft really) when you rock into a marina and want a berth? They don't quite fit into a single or even double slot. Do you have to moor off? How much would that constrain your cruising destinations?

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So what is the story with these beasties (any tri over 40ft really) when you rock into a marina and want a berth? They don't quite fit into a single or even double slot. Do you have to moor off? How much would that constrain your cruising destinations?

Halfway around the world with a 36ft beam and never had a problem. Most the time they'll give you the T head at the end of the dock and honestly when your cruising your flexible, can give notice and don't really want to be spending time or money in a marina anyway. Owning a trimaran or catamaran with a large beam doesn't mean your forever going to have trouble getting into a marina and there's some places around the world that actually welcome them and have certain areas dedicated and set up for them such as The Boat Works on the Gold Coast. http://www.theboatworks.com.au

We spent three years around Oz and was in Brisbane, Rosslyn Bay, Mackay, Airlie Beach, Cairns, and even Cooktown how many do you want to go into? I could mention those throughout the Pacific, Caribbean, Central America and Asia if you'd like ;-)

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Been a while but we just threw together this little video showing self tacking while sailing in a decent breeze with a reef in the main , reef was not needed when the video was shot !

 

Ain't perfect but will give the nit pickers something to talk about :mellow:

 

 

 

We will be at the La Rochelle and Annapolis Boat Shows if anyone wants to meet up for a chat !

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Storage in the amas would be the kiss of death on such a boat. Weight in the amas was strictly verboten in the Dick Newick designs to the degree that he only designed three screw in 6" inspection ports in each separate compartment on most of his tris. Just big enough to look into for water and get a hand pump hose down to the bilge. I sailed from New Orleans to the VI with a Yamaha 175 Enduro in the port ama of my Cross 42R not to mention lots of other gear and it really messes up the motion and put undue strain on the beams. Port side was a careful consideration since that was the favored tack when reaching the trades.

 

I'm sure the Rapido would be strong enough and light stuff such as kiteboard and kites might not hurt, but if you make a hatch big enough, people will fill that space up with not telling what.

 

I did a cruise in a French design that had private cabins in the amas and it was a bit scary to be sleeping to windward and at about 17 kts windspeed the hull would leave the water and not come back down for long periods which would wake you from the deepest sleep. At 20 knots it just stayed up and you could get back to sleep.

 

Here is the tri with all the accomodations. Its name translated to 'Sea Monster' and it lived up to that moniker. Believe it or not the owner pulled the Mercedes diesel and entered the TransAt with surprisingly successful result.

 

7243046920_9627c4f7d4_b.jpg

 

7243048278_ec876a3062_b.jpg

 

I found this from Richard Woods about the boat. The son Eric he refers to was born mid-Atlantic passage and was about 4 months old during my voyage with the Pesty family. His older sister was about three and she was just learning to ride her little 'Big Wheel' in the 30 foot wide cockpit. She would mount the trike and push backwards up to the windward bulwark and then wait for the boat to heel to an approaching swell and when it was at its steepest she would pick up her feet and shoot all the way to leeward and crash into the waist high bulwark and nearly somersault over the rail! Scared the shit out of me but her Mom and Dad just thought it was cute...

 

Here is a look at that big cockpit but from an aluminum replica of the plywood Pesty boat. Some serious acreage on that boat. Gerard and that trip was what led to my long multihull career.

 

Gerard Pesty sailed the 55ft Architeuthis in the 1972 OSTAR and finished 6th. I sailed with his son last year. Eric said he learnt to ride his bike in Architeuthis' cockpit!

 

 

Gerard was sort of like Jim Brown and Steve Dashew for the growing French multihull movement and wrote a whole series of books on his sailing adventures. I consider him the Godfather of every successful French offshore multihuller, probably more so than Tabarly.

 

Books here

 

http://www.abebooks.fr/rechercher-livre/auteur/gerard-pesty/

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Respect what you say about adding weight but have to disagree. There are light things (fenders, lines, sails, sail bags, gear etc sure when weighed in aggregate it all matters) that I started putting in my amas, makes a huge difference given how little space there is in the main hull and bridgedeck. Yes have to be disciplined, most aren't, yes; also adds enormous cross ventilation and light in tween decks/cabin. There was redundant structure (I reckon) as when they did the bridgedeck conversion in '84 they left the original ama decks in place and just bolted on new decks. Could use a bit more reinforcement here and there probably but adding the ama hatches made the boat much better, may have lightened up a bit and increased the cruising capacity hugely. But that was actually a byproduct as the original intent was for access on a 36 yr old boat which had had sealed compartments until someone foolishly and brutally interconnected everything. Hard to work through a 4 or 6" port.

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Storage in the amas would be the kiss of death on such a boat. Weight in the amas was strictly verboten in the Dick Newick designs to the degree that he only designed three screw in 6" inspection ports in each separate compartment on most of his tris. Just big enough to look into for water and get a hand pump hose down to the bilge. I sailed from New Orleans to the VI with a Yamaha 175 Enduro in the port ama of my Cross 42R not to mention lots of other gear and it really messes up the motion and put undue strain on the beams. Port side was a careful consideration since that was the favored tack when reaching the trades.

 

I'm sure the Rapido would be strong enough and light stuff such as kiteboard and kites might not hurt, but if you make a hatch big enough, people will fill that space up with not telling what.

 

I did a cruise in a French design that had private cabins in the amas and it was a bit scary to be sleeping to windward and at about 17 kts windspeed the hull would leave the water and not come back down for long periods which would wake you from the deepest sleep. At 20 knots it just stayed up and you could get back to sleep.

 

Here is the tri with all the accomodations. Its name translated to 'Sea Monster' and it lived up to that moniker. Believe it or not the owner pulled the Mercedes diesel and entered the TransAt with surprisingly successful result.

 

7243046920_9627c4f7d4_b.jpg

 

7243048278_ec876a3062_b.jpg

 

I found this from Richard Woods about the boat. The son Eric he refers to was born mid-Atlantic passage and was about 4 months old during my voyage with the Pesty family. His older sister was about three and she was just learning to ride her little 'Big Wheel' in the 30 foot wide cockpit. She would mount the trike and push backwards up to the windward bulwark and then wait for the boat to heel to an approaching swell and when it was at its steepest she would pick up her feet and shoot all the way to leeward and crash into the waist high bulwark and nearly somersault over the rail! Scared the shit out of me but her Mom and Dad just thought it was cute...

 

Here is a look at that big cockpit but from an aluminum replica of the plywood Pesty boat. Some serious acreage on that boat. Gerard and that trip was what led to my long multihull career.

 

Gerard Pesty sailed the 55ft Architeuthis in the 1972 OSTAR and finished 6th. I sailed with his son last year. Eric said he learnt to ride his bike in Architeuthis' cockpit!

 

 

Gerard was sort of like Jim Brown and Steve Dashew for the growing French multihull movement and wrote a whole series of books on his sailing adventures. I consider him the Godfather of every successful French offshore multihuller, probably more so than Tabarly.

 

Books here

 

http://www.abebooks.fr/rechercher-livre/auteur/gerard-pesty/

 

There are a couple factual inaccuracies here that I could should clarify, it's excusable as it was a few years ago...

 

The boat was actually a designed by Louis Macouillard and Paul Weychan and built in Bristol in 1969 so as much as I am supposed to resent the English (being French and all) there wasn't anything French about it...

I never found sleeping in the windward ama to be a problem as it was generally no more bouncy than a typical V-berth (I say less). The leeward side however tended to be more of an issue is some conditions, as the bunk was above the water the slamming would literally kick your butt, with the really bad ones getting you almost airborne, making it pretty hard to sleep! It had to be pretty rough for it to be a problem (like 20 to 30 on the nose) and it would get better really quick as the boat got lighter towards the end of the season when we didn't have 6 month worth of supplies for 10 on board!

 

Also, I wasn't actually born on board but I did get back when I was 7weeks old... I also can confirm that my sister and I both learned, walking, biking and rollerskating in the cockpit. Which, if we want to be accurate, was "only" about 24' wide (and about 10' long) because the ama hull line did rise above the cockpit floor thus reducing the width by about 2' at each end form the 28' overall beam. The bulwark was also really high in that area and the railing had netting installed to prevent us from shooting through so it would have taken a lot to get overboard. Incidentally with the right wave period it would be always "downhill" if you turned around at the crest, which is much better than on land if you ask me... although I do remember a couple instances of crashing into the pile of 15 dive-tanks that were quite painful...

 

Going back to the Rapido, I think the amas would be perfect for storing large but light items like fenders, and kiteboards/windsurfs etc... If you think of the relative weight of these items it really shouldn't make any significant difference. I'm pretty sure you could even through a kayak in there with no issues (but you want to strap things down so they don't bounce around).

You would not want to put things like dive-tanks and spare anchors and crap like this though!

 

Also, Architeuthis is the Latin name for the giant squid, so to be pedantic, it's a specific species of sea monster. There was also a centerboard installed for the OSTAR which was removed in the later years as it was taking up a lot of space and maintenance, and the Mercedes did a better job at minimizing leeway when going to windward anyway...

 

Back to the regular programming...

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Looking at the Rapido galleries, can someone explain how the door between the cockpit and saloon works? Doesn't appear to be one...

Amazingly I can't find a photo at the moment but the door is double door , hinged in the middle vertically that is also hinged at the top so it folds up under the roof section over the cockpit . Works extremely well and is unnoticeable when open but secures the cabin completely when closed . The aft windows are also easily removable .

 

Makes for a massive living area when open , which is most of the time !

 

Similar but much lighter weight , due to carbon sandwich construction to a Seawind 1160 .

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Paul ,

 

A very nice boat. Both it and Extreme H2O the much tweaked GB66 now for sale for $5.25MM come out of M&M.

 

Do you reckon Rapido can beat them to the WW mark in 15 knots of breeze? To the LW mark?

 

Both seem to be 1X plus wind speed boats so curious your thoughts.

 

Wess

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Paul ,

 

A very nice boat. Both it and Extreme H2O the much tweaked GB66 now for sale for $5.25MM come out of M&M.

 

Do you reckon Rapido can beat them to the WW mark in 15 knots of breeze? To the LW mark?

 

Both seem to be 1X plus wind speed boats so curious your thoughts.

 

Wess

Probably a question best put to the designer of both boats and the earlier gunboats ! But the Rapido should be more than competitive considering it has the same sail area of a Gunboat 60 , is a trimaran with a very deep daggerboard , and a good deal lighter than any Gunboat but with at least the accommodations equivalent to a 55 , I think my money would ( is )be on a well sailed Rapido 60 !

 

Time will tell , we are hoping to have 1 or 2 Rapido's doing the Carrabien race circuit in 2017

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Here's a tri that sleeps 8 in the Ama's!

https://www.ozsail.com.au/the-avatar-sailing-whitsundays/

Probably an entry for the "Nicknames" thread but I remember this boat being referred to as Abattoir. I remember it coming into Tutukaka marana on the way back from a Coastal Classic race, and it couldn't turn around or find a berth in there, so had to very carefully reverse all the way out, I ended up on board when it finally anchored in the bay for quite a big party. At the time it was quite the weapon.

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R60 launched and gorgeous: (pix from R60 facebook page)

uvqk0.jpg

Wow, that looks much better than the earlier renderings...

 

Congrats to Paul!

 

Bye, Paul.

 

WOW! That's an amazing looking boat. I like the graphics, too. The boat deserves something very special like that.

 

Is there somewhere where it is described more fully? Everyone else seems to know all about it.

(Web link above not loading. Facebook page not found?)

What's the rough cost of one of these.

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What's the rough cost of one of these.

 

 

If I have this right and I think(?) I do, Rapido at $1.3 is twice the price of a very nice RTW capable live aboard cruising monohull such as Outbound 46 (at ~ $0.6), but Rapido is only about half the cost the bottom of the GB or HH line... all while Paul thinks its as fast as to the WW mark as the top (speed wise) of the GB and HH lines (Extreme H2O modified GB66 at $5.25).

 

Interesting times...

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Paul ,

 

A very nice boat. Both it and Extreme H2O the much tweaked GB66 now for sale for $5.25MM come out of M&M.

 

Do you reckon Rapido can beat them to the WW mark in 15 knots of breeze? To the LW mark?

 

Both seem to be 1X plus wind speed boats so curious your thoughts.

 

Wess

Probably a question best put to the designer of both boats and the earlier gunboats ! But the Rapido should be more than competitive considering it has the same sail area of a Gunboat 60 , is a trimaran with a very deep daggerboard , and a good deal lighter than any Gunboat but with at least the accommodations equivalent to a 55 , I think my money would ( is )be on a well sailed Rapido 60 !

Time will tell , we are hoping to have 1 or 2 Rapido's doing the Carrabien race circuit in 2017

Using specs off the multihull-world website:

http://www.multihulls-world.com/us/technical-specifications-catamaran-trimaran/011101-858-Gunboat-60-Gunboat.html

http://www.multihulls-world.com/us/technical-specifications-catamaran-trimaran/011101-1350-Rapido-60-day-chater-RAPIDO-TRIMARANS.html

 

Base Speeds are 14.9 and 16.0 knots respectively, so the Rapido 60 should definitely be faster all round.

 

As for the Outbound 46, the base speed is 9.8 knots, a little more if it had a Code Zero type lightweather upwind sail, and will spend most of its time sailing on its ear to get a half decent speed up.

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I get that there are differing opinions of safety & comfort in the multi vs. mono debate. I'm undecided myself, though in a position to soon see & learn things from 'the other side' first hand...

 

BUT there is a massive tradeoff here with the Rapido that I can't get past - the living and storage space is so much smaller than a comparable mono or catamaran. If it is true (as far as I can tell from the comments) that there is no storage of any significant payload or systems in the armas, then that's going to be a helluva cramped main hull to go around the world in.

 

I'm curious as to how the Rapido stacks up to the similarly priced GB55 (or now 57 - same price, i think?) performance wise because it just cant be as comfortable or spacious as the GB, and it sure isn't gonna be happy carrying a 15' center console tender with a 40hp on the back! Nor will it be fun to stack the tramps up with surfboards, kite gear, paddle boards, spare sails, etc if you cant stow them in the armas (all of which easily lived on the GB55)

 

So clearly if performance is your huge priority certainly go with the tri - its a sweet boat really and I get the appeal - but I think its a bit of a stretch to call an RTW cruise on it comparable to a mono or cat of similar price/performance, because you'll be sacrificing quite a bit of space and comfort for that added speed. And, percentage wise, exactly how much faster will your passages be on this vs a passage on a GB55/57 anyways? Probably moreso if you're last name is Thompson and can safely push it to the max for 18 days, but an owner/operator who just stepped up from an Oyster 45..?

 

And on that note, is this aimed at the same group of buyers as the GB55/57? Independent cruising sans-professional crew? Is there an argument to be made that the learning curve on a trimaran of this caliber is significantly higher than the already (debatably) high curve on something like a GB55 (for most potential owners)? I've been sailing professionally for 8 years and I still have a lot to learn about "fast cats" in every aspect from performance to maintenance to offshore/big weather tactics, so how many buyers out there are ready to jump on a trimaran and rip across the Pacific at 25 knots, safely?

 

Not a reproach at all and not trying to be a negative Nancy - I love the boat and the concept of rapid cruising, and I think that in my lifetime 'monoslugs' will be considered archaic for anyone buying a cruising boat - just curious as to how big the market is right now for such a radical boat? At least the liveaboard/owner-operator/longterm cruising market...?

 

Thanks!

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P--

I seriously doubt that the market for a 7 figure, performance multihull consists of a liveabord/owner-operator who carries everything he/she owns all the time as they cruise the world for 7, or 10 years or longer. Offshore passage making, cruising in different areas of the globe? Yes. If space is the criterion, it's all relative. There's far more 'space' on a Rapido than a Cal 34 MkIII, yet folks spend years cruising the seas on a Cal. If one 'needs' a thousand square feet plus of living space, then they won't buy a Rapido. It's different, so it won't be like a similarly priced GB. Is it 'bad' that for the same x number of dollars, the space available for stuff is more or less?

 

How big is the market? Not likely ever going to be more than a dozen or so of these running around--and that's being generous. These high end boats are playthings for the very well to do. I'd even go out on a limb and say that I seriously doubt there's a single owner of a million dollar performance multihull that doesn't also have a very nice home or homes already to keep their stuff in. Need something? Ship it Global Fed Ex and you'll have it in a week. The mindset of the owner of one of these boats just isn't the same as that of the type of owner that you seem to be referencing. They're not the same market...

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I believe the list price for a Rapido is considerably less than a GB55/57. Don't know how that will change with the new GB.

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How big is the market? Not likely ever going to be more than a dozen or so of these running around--and that's being generous.

Full credit to Paul and M&M for building a great boat. I met Paul last week and he was a really nice guy and obviously M&M are awesome designers. With that said, I've realized that we aren't competing with Rapido (or HH for that matter). We are competing with Swan and Oyster and Southern Wind and Wally and all of those brand name 70'-100' monohulls (which is a BIG market). It's been a slow process to gain acceptance but I think we (Gunboat) are there. Why anyone would pay $5m for a 12 year old Swan 100 is totally beyond me. You can have more luxury, more performance, more comfort, more cabins, a HUGE salon with panoramic views, with the same curb appeal AND fantastic brand recognition. I don't see us drinking Rapido's milkshake. It's a great boat that serves a niche market. Instead, I see us drinking the big boys milkshake.

 

If someone wants a niche product like a Rapido more power to them. I LOVED sailing on Paradox (it's my dream boat...if I didn't have a wife and child). A Rapido is a great buy for $1.5M. I wish them the best of luck.

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I get that there are differing opinions of safety & comfort in the multi vs. mono debate. I'm undecided myself, though in a position to soon see & learn things from 'the other side' first hand...

 

BUT there is a massive tradeoff here with the Rapido that I can't get past - the living and storage space is so much smaller than a comparable mono or catamaran. If it is true (as far as I can tell from the comments) that there is no storage of any significant payload or systems in the armas, then that's going to be a helluva cramped main hull to go around the world in.

 

I'm curious as to how the Rapido stacks up to the similarly priced GB55 (or now 57 - same price, i think?) performance wise because it just cant be as comfortable or spacious as the GB, and it sure isn't gonna be happy carrying a 15' center console tender with a 40hp on the back! Nor will it be fun to stack the tramps up with surfboards, kite gear, paddle boards, spare sails, etc if you cant stow them in the armas (all of which easily lived on the GB55)

 

So clearly if performance is your huge priority certainly go with the tri - its a sweet boat really and I get the appeal - but I think its a bit of a stretch to call an RTW cruise on it comparable to a mono or cat of similar price/performance, because you'll be sacrificing quite a bit of space and comfort for that added speed. And, percentage wise, exactly how much faster will your passages be on this vs a passage on a GB55/57 anyways? Probably moreso if you're last name is Thompson and can safely push it to the max for 18 days, but an owner/operator who just stepped up from an Oyster 45..?

 

And on that note, is this aimed at the same group of buyers as the GB55/57? Independent cruising sans-professional crew? Is there an argument to be made that the learning curve on a trimaran of this caliber is significantly higher than the already (debatably) high curve on something like a GB55 (for most potential owners)? I've been sailing professionally for 8 years and I still have a lot to learn about "fast cats" in every aspect from performance to maintenance to offshore/big weather tactics, so how many buyers out there are ready to jump on a trimaran and rip across the Pacific at 25 knots, safely?

 

Not a reproach at all and not trying to be a negative Nancy - I love the boat and the concept of rapid cruising, and I think that in my lifetime 'monoslugs' will be considered archaic for anyone buying a cruising boat - just curious as to how big the market is right now for such a radical boat? At least the liveaboard/owner-operator/longterm cruising market...?

 

Thanks!

 

Interesting post but I think it and others are making assumptions - both about who buys these types of boats (and by that I mean both Gunboat and Rapido) and what they do with them - that that might (?) not hold up.

 

On the owners, I am not sure they are all the same. Maybe most are and its not for me to tell but my impression is this is not so. I will say the wife and I are considering the segment and we are nothing like what folks describe as "typical GB owners." No judgment intended or implied with that statement. Vive la difference!

 

As for what the boats do - and I stress I am SPECULATING based on LIMITED INFORMATION - but I would guess and be willing to place a small wager that more GB do the coastal cruising and winter Carib racing scene than do the RTW full time cruising thing. For that, you might argue the Rapido is a really interesting choice.

 

Having sailed both tris and cats, I love the tris. As Soma noted you can get into a Rapido for $1.3 - $1.8 from what I am hearing. That is well below the price of any GB and I am going to speculate that the Rapido will be faster than any stock GB or HH around the race course for the Carib winter racing scene. Not as comfortable on the hook or back at the marina after racing where GB and HH win the party for certain - and that matters - but I suspect the Rapido is faster sailing and much more affordable. Now could you find an even faster and better sailing tri for $1.5? Pretty sure you can but it would not be as comfortable after racing was done as Rapido.

 

No intent to throw stones here at anybody and its one opinion that is worth what you paid, but I would describe the Rapido as fitting into the luxury multihull segment offering a faster, more affordable, and still very comfortable but somewhat less "gracious living" boat than others.

 

Curious if Paul or Soma would disagree or revise that (and feel free as either would know better than I).

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I get that there are differing opinions of safety & comfort in the multi vs. mono debate. I'm undecided myself, though in a position to soon see & learn things from 'the other side' first hand...

 

BUT there is a massive tradeoff here with the Rapido that I can't get past - the living and storage space is so much smaller than a comparable mono or catamaran. If it is true (as far as I can tell from the comments) that there is no storage of any significant payload or systems in the armas, then that's going to be a helluva cramped main hull to go around the world in.

 

I'm curious as to how the Rapido stacks up to the similarly priced GB55 (or now 57 - same price, i think?) performance wise because it just cant be as comfortable or spacious as the GB, and it sure isn't gonna be happy carrying a 15' center console tender with a 40hp on the back! Nor will it be fun to stack the tramps up with surfboards, kite gear, paddle boards, spare sails, etc if you cant stow them in the armas (all of which easily lived on the GB55)

 

So clearly if performance is your huge priority certainly go with the tri - its a sweet boat really and I get the appeal - but I think its a bit of a stretch to call an RTW cruise on it comparable to a mono or cat of similar price/performance, because you'll be sacrificing quite a bit of space and comfort for that added speed. And, percentage wise, exactly how much faster will your passages be on this vs a passage on a GB55/57 anyways? Probably moreso if you're last name is Thompson and can safely push it to the max for 18 days, but an owner/operator who just stepped up from an Oyster 45..?

 

And on that note, is this aimed at the same group of buyers as the GB55/57? Independent cruising sans-professional crew? Is there an argument to be made that the learning curve on a trimaran of this caliber is significantly higher than the already (debatably) high curve on something like a GB55 (for most potential owners)? I've been sailing professionally for 8 years and I still have a lot to learn about "fast cats" in every aspect from performance to maintenance to offshore/big weather tactics, so how many buyers out there are ready to jump on a trimaran and rip across the Pacific at 25 knots, safely?

 

Not a reproach at all and not trying to be a negative Nancy - I love the boat and the concept of rapid cruising, and I think that in my lifetime 'monoslugs' will be considered archaic for anyone buying a cruising boat - just curious as to how big the market is right now for such a radical boat? At least the liveaboard/owner-operator/longterm cruising market...?

 

Thanks!

 

Interesting post but I think it and others are making assumptions - both about who buys these types of boats (and by that I mean both Gunboat and Rapido) and what they do with them - that that might (?) not hold up.

 

On the owners, I am not sure they are all the same. Maybe most are and its not for me to tell but my impression is this is not so. I will say the wife and I are considering the segment and we are nothing like what folks describe as "typical GB owners." No judgment intended or implied with that statement. Vive la difference!

 

As for what the boats do - and I stress I am SPECULATING based on LIMITED INFORMATION - but I would guess and be willing to place a small wager that more GB do the coastal cruising and winter Carib racing scene than do the RTW full time cruising thing. For that, you might argue the Rapido is a really interesting choice.

 

Having sailed both tris and cats, I love the tris. As Soma noted you can get into a Rapido for $1.3 - $1.8 from what I am hearing. That is well below the price of any GB and I am going to speculate that the Rapido will be faster than any stock GB or HH around the race course for the Carib winter racing scene. Not as comfortable on the hook or back at the marina after racing where GB and HH win the party for certain - and that matters - but I suspect the Rapido is faster sailing and much more affordable. Now could you find an even faster and better sailing tri for $1.5? Pretty sure you can but it would not be as comfortable after racing was done as Rapido.

 

No intent to throw stones here at anybody and its one opinion that is worth what you paid, but I would describe the Rapido as fitting into the luxury multihull segment offering a faster, more affordable, and still very comfortable but somewhat less "gracious living" boat than others.

 

Curious if Paul or Soma would disagree or revise that (and feel free as either would know better than I).

 

I think that's all fair to say overall.

 

I don't think any brand has a majority of their boats doing RTW trips, though there are >15% of GB's sailing RTW right now. That's probably about as many as any manufacturer.

 

I would never pretend to say that a GB would beat a Rapido to the weather mark. Maybe Elvis or Extreme will beat them, but I wouldn't be shocked if they didn't.

 

I think the Rapido would be a great RTW platform for an owner/operator.

 

I don't know if I'd agree that a Rapido is a "luxury" multihull, though. You can't compare a 2-cabin boat with a 5-cabin boat with crew. It's also a tough sell for the average wife. I guess you can compare the Rapido to the Gunboat 57 for accommodations (though there are 3 & 4 cabin versions of the 57) but the Rapido will win on the course for sure.

 

It's interesting how little traction there is in the big tri arena. As I said, I think Paradox is the ultimate cruiser (and for sale for 2+ years now?). I think Virgin Fire is a WICKED boat at 1/6th the cost of Paradox or Rapido, and it's been for sale for 5 years+. I LOVE the Banuls 53 and there's only one built. The little tris have had awesome success, from the Corsair/Farriers, to Dragonflys (also nice guys), to Diams, and on and on. I'm surprised none of the little tri guys have stepped up into something bigger and more elegant, like the Rapido. I think this whole market segment can only grow from here, so fingers crossed for all of us!

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Wess, I was going to mention VIRGIN FIRE to you but now that Soma has brought it up you might want to take a closer look. It might tick all you checkmarks at this stage of the game. It is very simple but surprisingly comfortable and would appeal to you greatly I think. Give you time to knock around a bit until the dream cat comes along?

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Rasputin22 - Thanks; but we know of it (VF) and no way. Great ~one trick pony but I'm not interested in that trick. Birds (TLBs) is for sale at about the same price as VF I think and might be more up our alley but even that - when we put emotion aside (we love tris) - just does not seem to compare well overall as a cruising platform (for us... one opinion) if we put the same money into a performance cruising cat.

 

Soma - LOL, anything over $1 million I call luxury. Or at least it better be able to live up to that billing at that price (unless its a high tech racing machine ala Paradox)! Have not been aboard Rapido (Miami maybe) but my impression is that Paul has stepped up the luxury and "livability" for lack of a better term with the Rapido compared to what you get in Paradox (almost pure racing... fair?) or the Banuls N53 trimaran. Paradox is at a similar price point (over $1 mill). No clue on where the Banuls N53 trimaran is priced. Actually surprisingly little info at all on the Banuls tri out there. Priced right the Banuls might have been a fun boat for us in our 40s. For a Mom and Pop owner operator in our 60s, something a bit more mellow might be in order. Damn, my kids are right... I'm boring!! I am embarrassed to admit since I stopped racing and instead my wife and I are cruising/daysailing our F27, I find myself throttling back to slow the boat for comfort more than I am looking for more power.

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One of the 'dirty little secrets' regarding sailing fast is that Fast is Wet! When you're cruising, you don't want either yourself or your boat to be salt-encrusted. It's just not fun. The advantage of most cats over tris, is that there is plenty of space inside, but with a view where the missus and your guests can enjoy the experience without having to live in foulies, gloves and dampness. I'm not sure that the Rapido quite overcomes this challenge although it is by far the best I've seen at minimizing it. (for a tri)

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One of the 'dirty little secrets' regarding sailing fast is that Fast is Wet! When you're cruising, you don't want either yourself or your boat to be salt-encrusted. It's just not fun. The advantage of most cats over tris, is that there is plenty of space inside, but with a view where the missus and your guests can enjoy the experience without having to live in foulies, gloves and dampness. I'm not sure that the Rapido quite overcomes this challenge although it is by far the best I've seen at minimizing it. (for a tri)

Exactly. Soooo true. Describes our last sail precisely.

 

Went out for quick sunset/moonrise sail. Full main and double slotted with jib and screecher. Doing 7 in 10 out the river in flat water. We are taking turns driving with the long tiller extension, both of us on the high side float, one on the forward beam and the other driving from between the check stays. This quiets the stern wake, maximizes speed and all we hear is the main and leeward bows ripping through the water and all we feel is the breeze on our face. Life is good. We love our tri. Then we enter the bay and free of the lee we had 15 knots of breeze and some chop. Now doing 12s and taking on spray close reaching. Bear off to beam reach and we do almost wind speed in that breeze with that sail combo and get even wetter. Great if racing. Wrong for moonrise sail. Immediately furled the screecher, and twisted off the top of the main and working jib continuing on doing 8 in 15 with no spray. Watched the moon rise, surfed a departing Carnival cruise ship wake, tacked around and headed back home on a broad reach eventually unfurling the screecher to replace the jib when back in the lee and the flatter water of the river.

 

Comfort matters when not racing and while tris are fun, tris can be wet (but so can forward cockpit cats!). Give me inside steering and line handling for comfort and outside tillers for fun!! Paul, Soma an every other multihull (and a few monohull) representative are sick of hearing me say this.

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Good to hear the news Lat! I'd love to sail with you again. Image the dreaming and scheming that would take place if you, Soma, and I sat up late sharing a bottle of rum!

 

Cheers

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Thanks for the plug Soma and Rasp. I'll be splashing the Fire in a couple of weeks in St Maarten and saiing back to St John if anyone wants a ride.

 

If only I was younger!

 

Cool boat and so nice for the path we were on back in the day.

 

Different path for us now but wish you all the best with her.

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Thanks for the plug Soma and Rasp. I'll be splashing the Fire in a couple of weeks in St Maarten and saiing back to St John if anyone wants a ride.

I don't like mentioning that your boat is for sale because I'm afraid someone will buy it!

 

One day I hope to have the time and money to ask you if we're worthy. Like a favorite pet, VF can't go to just any home...

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I get that there are differing opinions of safety & comfort in the multi vs. mono debate. I'm undecided myself, though in a position to soon see & learn things from 'the other side' first hand...

 

BUT there is a massive tradeoff here with the Rapido that I can't get past - the living and storage space is so much smaller than a comparable mono or catamaran. If it is true (as far as I can tell from the comments) that there is no storage of any significant payload or systems in the armas, then that's going to be a helluva cramped main hull to go around the world in.

 

I'm curious as to how the Rapido stacks up to the similarly priced GB55 (or now 57 - same price, i think?) performance wise because it just cant be as comfortable or spacious as the GB, and it sure isn't gonna be happy carrying a 15' center console tender with a 40hp on the back! Nor will it be fun to stack the tramps up with surfboards, kite gear, paddle boards, spare sails, etc if you cant stow them in the armas (all of which easily lived on the GB55)

 

So clearly if performance is your huge priority certainly go with the tri - its a sweet boat really and I get the appeal - but I think its a bit of a stretch to call an RTW cruise on it comparable to a mono or cat of similar price/performance, because you'll be sacrificing quite a bit of space and comfort for that added speed. And, percentage wise, exactly how much faster will your passages be on this vs a passage on a GB55/57 anyways? Probably moreso if you're last name is Thompson and can safely push it to the max for 18 days, but an owner/operator who just stepped up from an Oyster 45..?

 

And on that note, is this aimed at the same group of buyers as the GB55/57? Independent cruising sans-professional crew? Is there an argument to be made that the learning curve on a trimaran of this caliber is significantly higher than the already (debatably) high curve on something like a GB55 (for most potential owners)? I've been sailing professionally for 8 years and I still have a lot to learn about "fast cats" in every aspect from performance to maintenance to offshore/big weather tactics, so how many buyers out there are ready to jump on a trimaran and rip across the Pacific at 25 knots, safely?

 

Not a reproach at all and not trying to be a negative Nancy - I love the boat and the concept of rapid cruising, and I think that in my lifetime 'monoslugs' will be considered archaic for anyone buying a cruising boat - just curious as to how big the market is right now for such a radical boat? At least the liveaboard/owner-operator/longterm cruising market...?

 

Thanks!

 

Rapido 60 saloon

Rapido 60 aft Cabin

Rapido 60 fwd cabin looking aft

Rapido 60 Galley

Hi All ,

 

There seems to be the perception that a Rapido 60 is a small boat accommodation wise when compared to similar performance Cats !

 

This is understandable because in the past most performance orientated tris had very little space , and very few people have actually seen a Rapido 60 in real life ! Hopefully this will change soon with the 2017 Miami boat show likely to be it’s boat show debut!

 

It amazes me that some people think that modified Orma 60 tri Paradox is comparable in accommodation to a Rapido 60!

 

I would guess that a Rapido has 3 times the usable space inside of Paradox.

 

I would think , having been on the Gunboat 57 last week , guess that there is equal or more usable space and definitely way more storage space on a Rapido 60 than a Gunboat 55 /57!

 

For instance, there are two lockers, one in each float that are 4.8 M ( 15 ft 9 “ ) x 1.3M (4ft 3”) x 1.2 M ( 4ft ) , massive locker pantry under the cockpit , plus storage under seats , up in the bow , huge area under both double bunks , hanging lockers and multiple cupboards in each cabin and all over the boat .

 

We easily carry a 12 ft hard bottom inflatable dinghy with a 20 hp Outboard , which is plenty big and fast enough for 4 people , plus mountain bikes, paddle boards , surf boards , 8 huge fenders , etc etc .

 

It is easy to sail and I regularly sail it two up with my big strong crew ( 45 kg girl ) without any issues including getting in and out of a marina with the wind blowing me on to the dock and up to 3 knots of tide racing past , the boat is set up for short handed sailing and is the easiest handling tri to sail that I have ever had the good fortune to sail on , including every Corsair Model ever made .

 

With it’s self tacking jib , when doing 12 to 14 knots upwind , it does not drop below about 8 knots in the tacks , so look out any cat who wants to take us on in a tacking duel .

 

The galley has about 12ft of counter top and is as well set up as any house kitchen , the saloon and adjoining cockpit on the same level is approximately 20 ft long x 13 ft wide so it is hardly small , and that doesn’t count the 10ft x 7ft aft deck area with 2 large lounging seats .

 

As for ripping across oceans , yes the Rapido has shown the potential to sail at 30 knots when racing , but when in cruising mode we tend to reef early and keep speeds below 20 knots depending on the sea state !

 

20 knots in flat water is a walk in the park whilst 20 knots in a nasty sea state is a lot more stressful on any crew and boat , the real trick is having the ability to sail at higher than normal average speeds on a long crossing .

 

I'm not trying to pick a fight with Soma , Gunboat or any Cat guys as I think we are appealing to a different market , the Rapido 60 is a genuine alternative for those cruising sailors including monohull guys who actually enjoy sailing !

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I get that there are differing opinions of safety & comfort in the multi vs. mono debate. I'm undecided myself, though in a position to soon see & learn things from 'the other side' first hand...

 

BUT there is a massive tradeoff here with the Rapido that I can't get past - the living and storage space is so much smaller than a comparable mono or catamaran. If it is true (as far as I can tell from the comments) that there is no storage of any significant payload or systems in the armas, then that's going to be a helluva cramped main hull to go around the world in.

 

I'm curious as to how the Rapido stacks up to the similarly priced GB55 (or now 57 - same price, i think?) performance wise because it just cant be as comfortable or spacious as the GB, and it sure isn't gonna be happy carrying a 15' center console tender with a 40hp on the back! Nor will it be fun to stack the tramps up with surfboards, kite gear, paddle boards, spare sails, etc if you cant stow them in the armas (all of which easily lived on the GB55)

 

So clearly if performance is your huge priority certainly go with the tri - its a sweet boat really and I get the appeal - but I think its a bit of a stretch to call an RTW cruise on it comparable to a mono or cat of similar price/performance, because you'll be sacrificing quite a bit of space and comfort for that added speed. And, percentage wise, exactly how much faster will your passages be on this vs a passage on a GB55/57 anyways? Probably moreso if you're last name is Thompson and can safely push it to the max for 18 days, but an owner/operator who just stepped up from an Oyster 45..?

 

And on that note, is this aimed at the same group of buyers as the GB55/57? Independent cruising sans-professional crew? Is there an argument to be made that the learning curve on a trimaran of this caliber is significantly higher than the already (debatably) high curve on something like a GB55 (for most potential owners)? I've been sailing professionally for 8 years and I still have a lot to learn about "fast cats" in every aspect from performance to maintenance to offshore/big weather tactics, so how many buyers out there are ready to jump on a trimaran and rip across the Pacific at 25 knots, safely?

 

Not a reproach at all and not trying to be a negative Nancy - I love the boat and the concept of rapid cruising, and I think that in my lifetime 'monoslugs' will be considered archaic for anyone buying a cruising boat - just curious as to how big the market is right now for such a radical boat? At least the liveaboard/owner-operator/longterm cruising market...?

 

Thanks!

Well said Paul. Great boat.

 

 

 

 

 

Hi All ,

 

There seems to be the perception that a Rapido 60 is a small boat accommodation wise when compared to similar performance Cats !

 

This is understandable because in the past most performance orientated tris had very little space , and very few people have actually seen a Rapido 60 in real life ! Hopefully this will change soon with the 2017 Miami boat show likely to be its boat show debut!

 

It amazes me that some people think that modified Orma 60 tri Paradox is comparable in accommodation to a Rapido 60!

 

I would guess that a Rapido has 3 times the usable space inside of Paradox.

 

I would think , having been on the Gunboat 57 last week , guess that there is equal or more usable space and definitely way more storage space on a Rapido 60 than a Gunboat 55 /57!

 

For instance, there are two lockers, one in each float that are 4.8 M ( 15 ft 9 ) x 1.3M (4ft 3) x 1.2 M ( 4ft ) , massive locker pantry under the cockpit , plus storage under seats , up in the bow , huge area under both double bunks , hanging lockers and multiple cupboards in each cabin and all over the boat .

 

We easily carry a 12 ft hard bottom inflatable dinghy with a 20 hp Outboard , which is plenty big and fast enough for 4 people , plus mountain bikes, paddle boards , surf boards , 8 huge fenders , etc etc .

 

It is easy to sail and I regularly sail it two up with my big strong crew ( 45 kg girl ) without any issues including getting in and out of a marina with the wind blowing me on to the dock and up to 3 knots of tide racing past , the boat is set up for short handed sailing and is the easiest handling tri to sail that I have ever had the good fortune to sail on , including every Corsair Model ever made .

 

With its self tacking jib , when doing 12 to 14 knots upwind , it does not drop below about 8 knots in the tacks , so look out any cat who wants to take us on in a tacking duel .

 

The galley has about 12ft of counter top and is as well set up as any house kitchen , the saloon and adjoining cockpit on the same level is approximately 20 ft long x 13 ft wide so it is hardly small , and that doesnt count the 10ft x 7ft aft deck area with 2 large lounging seats .

 

As for ripping across oceans , yes the Rapido has shown the potential to sail at 30 knots when racing , but when in cruising mode we tend to reef early and keep speeds below 20 knots depending on the sea state !

 

20 knots in flat water is a walk in the park whilst 20 knots in a nasty sea state is a lot more stressful on any crew and boat , the real trick is having the ability to sail at higher than normal average speeds on a long crossing .

 

I'm not trying to pick a fight with Soma , Gunboat or any Cat guys as I think we are appealing to a different market , the Rapido 60 is a genuine alternative for those cruising sailors including monohull guys who actually enjoy sailing !

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Not sure if it's right for this thread, but an observation from a small tri owner - a Dragonfly 920 ( 30 ft) - which I adore. Designed in the 90s. Its replacement, designed in the late '00s is 2 foot shorter, but the length is irrelevant in that mine has an enclosed cockpit and the DF 28 has an open ended cockpit.

 

I'd reckon the DF28 has 40% more volume in the main hull than mine. The trick is, as far as I saw, pushing out the hull space a foot or so above the waterline level, substantially, and carrying that through the boat. The main hull immersed profile of the 28 is probably a bit bigger, with greater width in the arse in particular, but I'd suspect much, much less than the increased volume of the main hull. In any event, I think this goes a bit against buying older generation tris, if you're looking at liveability unless the price/affordability is compelling.

 

I'd suppose there are performance consequences that arise out of a bigger main hull ( all else being the same ) such as less R/M . I've never had a 28 go past us upwind, but au point, I'd reckon that at 60ft, you're going to be able to develop internal accommodation close to 2 ( in comparison ) narrow(er) hulls. What you won't get though is the sheer expanse of living area through to the cockpit, and the cockpit itself. So then the question is how much do you need or want?

 

Without being pejorative I'd reckon most of us would be happy with 10 in the ' living area' or the cockpit, and there's a nearby tramp if there are more. Perhaps I should get more friends though.

 

I see the Nel, admire the ambition, think it ugly and not my solution, admire enormously Outremers, and some other French designs, also mentioning Dazcat - v good performance, cruising cats - in the west country here in England, which will be ( £ will remain bolloxed for a while yet ) very competitive - and most of all would like to see a DF 45/50 tri.

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Bit of Phuket Kings Cup Action , really nice to sail higher and faster than TP 52's upwind and still hit 15 knots in the gusts !

 

Top speed 26 knots reaching with Main and self tacking jib !

 

Not bad for a cruising boat .

 

Kings Cup Upwind Port Fwd shot

Rapido 60 Taking off !

Rapido Crew action

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Thats terrific, Paul-congratulations!

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Bit of Phuket Kings Cup Action , really nice to sail higher and faster than TP 52's upwind and still hit 15 knots in the gusts !

 

Top speed 26 knots reaching with Main and self tacking jib !

 

Not bad for a cruising boat .

 

 

 

Can't wait to see some more videos of this well thought out trimaran.

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I would think , having been on the Gunboat 57 last week , guess that there is equal or more usable space and definitely way more storage space on a Rapido 60 than a Gunboat 55 /57!

 

i think the rapido is a very cool boat...

 

but isn't the gunboat 57 just a 55 with transom extension?

 

doesn't it have the same interior as a GB 55?

 

anyway, if the comparsion is 60ft to 60ft.., I think The GB 60 will have a lot more interior volume than the Rapido 60.

 

I've been on both the GB 55 and the GB 60 - the 60 is a _much_ larger boat than the 55

 

obviously the Rapido is still a huge boat with a very comfortable interior

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I would think , having been on the Gunboat 57 last week , guess that there is equal or more usable space and definitely way more storage space on a Rapido 60 than a Gunboat 55 /57!

i think the rapido is a very cool boat...

 

but isn't the gunboat 57 just a 55 with transom extension?

 

doesn't it have the same interior as a GB 55?

 

anyway, if the comparsion is 60ft to 60ft.., I think The GB 60 will have a lot more interior volume than the Rapido 60.

 

I've been on both the GB 55 and the GB 60 - the 60 is a _much_ larger boat than the 55

 

obviously the Rapido is still a huge boat with a very comfortable interior

Sure! The interior of the Gunboat 60 is roomier---duh! The goal of a Rapido buyer is performance, not room. The goal of a G 60 buyer is room AND improved performance over whatever else is generally available. That improved performance is not necessarily ultimate performance. Buying a boat is finding the best blend of your priorities within your price range. The rapido vs Gunboat equation is an apples /oranges equation.

 

I really like the Rapido, but wouldn't want the headaches of a large trimaran, no matter the budget. So.....

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I would think , having been on the Gunboat 57 last week , guess that there is equal or more usable space and definitely way more storage space on a Rapido 60 than a Gunboat 55 /57!

i think the rapido is a very cool boat...

 

but isn't the gunboat 57 just a 55 with transom extension?

 

doesn't it have the same interior as a GB 55?

 

anyway, if the comparsion is 60ft to 60ft.., I think The GB 60 will have a lot more interior volume than the Rapido 60.

 

I've been on both the GB 55 and the GB 60 - the 60 is a _much_ larger boat than the 55

 

obviously the Rapido is still a huge boat with a very comfortable interior

Sure! The interior of the Gunboat 60 is roomier---duh! The goal of a Rapido buyer is performance, not room. The goal of a G 60 buyer is room AND improved performance over whatever else is generally available. That improved performance is not necessarily ultimate performance. Buying a boat is finding the best blend of your priorities within your price range. The rapido vs Gunboat equation is an apples /oranges equation.

 

I really like the Rapido, but wouldn't want the headaches of a large trimaran, no matter the budget. So.....

 

Just Curious , apart from having a beam of 38 ft , Gunboat 60 beam 28.2 ft , what headaches does a large trimaran give you ?

 

Beam of the Rapido can be greatly reduced to 13 to 17 ft depending on the configuration for shipping .

 

The main goal of the Rapido 60 was to create a Safe , seaworthy, fast , long distance offshore cruising yacht , incredible performance especially upwind is a bonus !

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I've seen in some races Rapido was faster than the seacart and vice versa. Can you tell something about the different conditons during the races at Kings Cup?

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I've seen in some races Rapido was faster than the seacart and vice versa. Can you tell something about the different conditons during the races at Kings Cup?

In the Kings Cup there were a mixture of conditions and race lengths . Upwind basically the Rapido was always quicker and pointed higher than every one in the fleet even in the light winds and was was much quicker as soon as the breeze was over 10 to 12 knots .

 

The Seacart and 3 Itch had us downwind in the light stuff but in the longer race with 15 + knots of wind the Rapido was significantly faster than all the boats in the fleet . In the lighter shorter races , 1 to 2 mile windward leeward courses it was a battle between Rapido , Thor ( Seacart 30 ) and 3 Itch a light weight 38 ft Tri .

 

Having said that we got line honours in the last short race in light shifty conditions due to some good calls and a bit of luck .

 

Offshore long distance give me a Rapido every day !

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I would think , having been on the Gunboat 57 last week , guess that there is equal or more usable space and definitely way more storage space on a Rapido 60 than a Gunboat 55 /57!

i think the rapido is a very cool boat...

 

but isn't the gunboat 57 just a 55 with transom extension?

 

doesn't it have the same interior as a GB 55?

 

anyway, if the comparsion is 60ft to 60ft.., I think The GB 60 will have a lot more interior volume than the Rapido 60.

 

I've been on both the GB 55 and the GB 60 - the 60 is a _much_ larger boat than the 55

 

obviously the Rapido is still a huge boat with a very comfortable interior

Sure! The interior of the Gunboat 60 is roomier---duh! The goal of a Rapido buyer is performance, not room. The goal of a G 60 buyer is room AND improved performance over whatever else is generally available. That improved performance is not necessarily ultimate performance. Buying a boat is finding the best blend of your priorities within your price range. The rapido vs Gunboat equation is an apples /oranges equation.

 

I really like the Rapido, but wouldn't want the headaches of a large trimaran, no matter the budget. So.....

 

Just Curious , apart from having a beam of 38 ft , Gunboat 60 beam 28.2 ft , what headaches does a large trimaran give you ?

 

Beam of the Rapido can be greatly reduced to 13 to 17 ft depending on the configuration for shipping .

 

The main goal of the Rapido 60 was to create a Safe , seaworthy, fast , long distance offshore cruising yacht , incredible performance especially upwind is a bonus !

 

 

 

Paul, don't get me wrong. I LIKE the Rapido 60 and were I in the market for a boat that large in general, I'd seriously consider it. In many ways, I prefer a tri over a cat. But 38' is just that much more 'headache' than 28 or, in my case 21' width. Multihull width is a headache in general. I also much prefer a smaller boat just to be able to easily handle it myself and because everything costs so much more when it gets bigger.

 

For me, the headaches are similar regardless of tri vs cat: beam and overall size/loads/costs. I just downsized to less than half my previous multihull in terms of displacement. (now I can get a 57' slip that permits a 21.5' beam for my 21' wide, 38' cat--lucky me)

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So I'm curious about a practical matter: where and how do you store your dinghy, please? a) at night while at anchor; b ) while island hopping; and c) while on long passages?

 

And if I may ask, how is the ride in unsettled seas? For example, in short, steep chop after a front has passed?

 

Yes, clearly a remarkable boat. Yes, I lust over it :-)

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I would think , having been on the Gunboat 57 last week , guess that there is equal or more usable space and definitely way more storage space on a Rapido 60 than a Gunboat 55 /57!

 

i think the rapido is a very cool boat...

 

but isn't the gunboat 57 just a 55 with transom extension?

 

doesn't it have the same interior as a GB 55?

 

anyway, if the comparsion is 60ft to 60ft.., I think The GB 60 will have a lot more interior volume than the Rapido 60.

 

I've been on both the GB 55 and the GB 60 - the 60 is a _much_ larger boat than the 55

 

obviously the Rapido is still a huge boat with a very comfortable interior

 

 

I haven't seen or sailed a Rapido, but from what I've observed in this thread, I think comparing her to a GB60 is Apples-to-Eggplant.

 

-The GB60 is a much heavier, roomier, more luxurious cruiser. She will be infinitely more convenient and comfortable than a Rapido for pleasure sailing and live-aboard (Paul - you can argue your case against a GB55/57 fair enough!!)

 

-BUT a Rapido will be a bit faster around a race course (assuming both boats are sailed to their polars)

 

-As for offshore passage-making, I suspect that both boats would probably hold similar daily averages, assuming the same captain.

 

And before you crucify me for that, read below:

 

--->Of course you can argue that one has more speed potential than the other, but if the same crew with the same safety vs speed vs comfort philosophy (and parameters) sailed both boats across the Atlantics (esp. W-E), I'm not convinced that you'd see a massive difference between the two boats.

 

------>>>Most GB60's, 62's, 66's are sailed conservatively offshore by pro crew - partially because safety partially because we have work to do on the other end and aren't masochists, and partially because they don't belong to us and we don't want to break shit and give ourselves more work. I would guess that most crewed Gunboats sail at about 80% of their true speed potential, for about 80% of their sea miles. Of the remaining 20%, half of that is sailed uber-conservatively, and the remaining (elusive) 10% is sailed close to the max (those 'magic carpet ride' days...). Most passage plans on the crewed Gunboats are done with assuming 250-280nm/day.

 

----->>SO if you put a non-pro, middle age, liveaboard, cruising couple on a Rapido, do you think they're banging out 300nm+ days offshore every day? Maybe so, I don't know, but I will be impressed for sure if that's the case. Not sure how safe and cozy a trimaran feels at 20+ knots in a mid-Atlantic seaway, but I know a (comparatively heavy/stable) GB60 feels pretty fucking intense at that speed. It's loud and violent and the crew is all on alert, and thinking about slowing the boat down. Any data yet from any big passages?

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I would think , having been on the Gunboat 57 last week , guess that there is equal or more usable space and definitely way more storage space on a Rapido 60 than a Gunboat 55 /57!

 

i think the rapido is a very cool boat...

 

but isn't the gunboat 57 just a 55 with transom extension?

 

doesn't it have the same interior as a GB 55?

 

anyway, if the comparsion is 60ft to 60ft.., I think The GB 60 will have a lot more interior volume than the Rapido 60.

 

I've been on both the GB 55 and the GB 60 - the 60 is a _much_ larger boat than the 55

 

obviously the Rapido is still a huge boat with a very comfortable interior

 

 

I haven't seen or sailed a Rapido, but from what I've observed in this thread, I think comparing her to a GB60 is Apples-to-Eggplant.

 

-The GB60 is a much heavier, roomier, more luxurious cruiser. She will be infinitely more convenient and comfortable than a Rapido for pleasure sailing and live-aboard (Paul - you can argue your case against a GB55/57 fair enough!!)

 

-BUT a Rapido will be a bit faster around a race course (assuming both boats are sailed to their polars)

 

-As for offshore passage-making, I suspect that both boats would probably hold similar daily averages, assuming the same captain.

 

And before you crucify me for that, read below:

 

--->Of course you can argue that one has more speed potential than the other, but if the same crew with the same safety vs speed vs comfort philosophy (and parameters) sailed both boats across the Atlantics (esp. W-E), I'm not convinced that you'd see a massive difference between the two boats.

 

------>>>Most GB60's, 62's, 66's are sailed conservatively offshore by pro crew - partially because safety partially because we have work to do on the other end and aren't masochists, and partially because they don't belong to us and we don't want to break shit and give ourselves more work. I would guess that most crewed Gunboats sail at about 80% of their true speed potential, for about 80% of their sea miles. Of the remaining 20%, half of that is sailed uber-conservatively, and the remaining (elusive) 10% is sailed close to the max (those 'magic carpet ride' days...). Most passage plans on the crewed Gunboats are done with assuming 250-280nm/day.

 

----->>SO if you put a non-pro, middle age, liveaboard, cruising couple on a Rapido, do you think they're banging out 300nm+ days offshore every day? Maybe so, I don't know, but I will be impressed for sure if that's the case. Not sure how safe and cozy a trimaran feels at 20+ knots in a mid-Atlantic seaway, but I know a (comparatively heavy/stable) GB60 feels pretty fucking intense at that speed. It's loud and violent and the crew is all on alert, and thinking about slowing the boat down. Any data yet from any big passages?

 

 

So as a non-pro, senior, liveaboard cruising couple we would not be expecting to be banging out 300nm+ offshore everyday. That wouldn't be the point of getting a Rapido.

 

We have sailed at 15+ kts offshore mid-Atlantic at 15 kts in 20+/- app. Not a problem, no panic or anxiety, but I was paying attention. Then the wind drops off a bit and we're going 12 kts. While having a 30kt top end is interesting, having the ability to sail 15 in a wider range is very appealing. It's getting more 200nm days vs trying for 300nm days. We're simply too old and small to sail any boat to its potential in 30kts true upwind. We'll be throttled way back. For us it's a matter of getting more out of the middle and low end, and a Rapido should do that.

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