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      Abbreviated rules   07/28/2017

      Underdawg did an excellent job of explaining the rules.  Here's the simplified version: Don't insinuate Pedo.  Warning and or timeout for a first offense.  PermaFlick for any subsequent offenses Don't out members.  See above for penalties.  Caveat:  if you have ever used your own real name or personal information here on the forums since, like, ever - it doesn't count and you are fair game. If you see spam posts, report it to the mods.  We do not hang out in every thread 24/7 If you see any of the above, report it to the mods by hitting the Report button in the offending post.   We do not take action for foul language, off-subject content, or abusive behavior unless it escalates to persistent stalking.  There may be times that we might warn someone or flick someone for something particularly egregious.  There is no standard, we will know it when we see it.  If you continually report things that do not fall into rules #1 or 2 above, you may very well get a timeout yourself for annoying the Mods with repeated whining.  Use your best judgement. Warnings, timeouts, suspensions and flicks are arbitrary and capricious.  Deal with it.  Welcome to anarchy.   If you are a newbie, there are unwritten rules to adhere to.  They will be explained to you soon enough.  
Ajax

The Discarded- Rescuing a Tartan 33

818 posts in this topic

Congratulations Ajax. Looks like a great boat to have fun in. I think the jib sheets are fine for at least half of any sail - the returning to port portion (red right returning).

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P. Johnson:

Sounds like you will be fine. Drilling under the creek should be interesting. Are they planning on drilling under the entire 1 mile of the swamp?

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3X because it's fuggin' disgusting. I'm a 20 year Navy man and scrubbed my share of nasty shitters and this is bad.

 

My ex-father-in-law was quite a character. One time I went with him to the chandlery to get a new Y-valve for the head. He took the old one in with him and asked a clerk for a replacement. When the clerk reached out for the valve he handed it to him and said, "Careful, there's a turd in it."

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The sole failed because the cockpit flooded, then water ran down into the cabin, eventually filled the bilge and sogged up the sole. Luckily, it was stopped before reaching the engine.

It seems fairly straightforward except for a small, curved section up near the head door. Probably (hopefully?) just some kerfs cut in the underside.

Congrats on getting your boat in the water!! I'm doing my floor now. Grrrrrrr.

I have Lucas Electrics on my Perkins. So far no...I will not type, say, or think about that anymore.

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P. Johnson:

Sounds like you will be fine. Drilling under the creek should be interesting. Are they planning on drilling under the entire 1 mile of the swamp?

 

That's the way I understand the plan. Depending on where they land on the far side, it probably won't be quite a mile. A few thousand feet.

 

Sorry for the hijack, now back to disgusting, old toilets and sparky Lucas wires.

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The sole failed because the cockpit flooded, then water ran down into the cabin, eventually filled the bilge and sogged up the sole. Luckily, it was stopped before reaching the engine.

It seems fairly straightforward except for a small, curved section up near the head door. Probably (hopefully?) just some kerfs cut in the underside.

Congrats on getting your boat in the water!! I'm doing my floor now. Grrrrrrr.

I have Lucas Electrics on my Perkins. So far no...I will not type, say, or think about that anymore.

 

 

Does your cabin sole have any curves that you're having to deal with?

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No curves like you are dealing with. Just a ton of wood framing on the stringers that the boards lay on. Not a straight surface on this boat. Using plenty of shims.

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I am beginning to suspect that the Tartan was the victim of a near-strike from lightning.

I peeked into every single cubby that allowed an internal view of the hull and certainly there was no external visible damage on the exterior, so a direct strike probably did not happen, but I've discovered that several electronics are simply dead even though they are wired correctly. The wiring is shoddy workmanship but there are no shorts and nothing that should cause the indications that I'm seeing. The PO seemed confused and surprised that these items were so completely dead.

-VHF doesn't transmit
-Knot meter does not power up.
-Depth finder blew in-line fuses, refused to power up at all, then stopped blowing fuses and was totally dead.
-Stereo murders a Group 27 deepcycle battery via the "clock" power lead in 5 days, yet refuses to power up or provide any indicators at all.

My knot and depth meters are the old Datamarine Corinthian series. I just happened to have a spare depth gauge head so I swapped it in, and it works perfectly. This also indicates that the transducer is still working properly. I'll continue to use my spare depth finder while I decide if I want to purchase DMI replacement instruments or upgrade to a totally different system. I can live without a knotmeter for awhile.

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I have seen a few gadgets die like that when +12V was applied to their ground. It's a long boring story, the only point of which is, "keep all of your grounding straps in good condition!"

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If what Todsrer is saying is a possibility you may want to check the heavy copper (bonding?) wire that goes from the rudder to the chain plates. Mine goes past the lift pump, starter and through the battery compartment.

 

All candidates for a mess-up.

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Nope, sorry. Posted TMI - those symptoms happened on an old Suburban. High amp device + poor grounding => +12V to chassis. Chassis-grounded devices went up in smoke.

i.e. More than one way to kill a bunch of gadgets.

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Ajax, I don't know if you can get it anymore, but I've been happy with my RayMarine ST-40 series instruments. I have depth/speed (+water temp) & compass. They use Airmar transducers. I even think the newer (very fancy, color LCD $$$) ST-60s will work with the same, but I cannot confirm that. The ST-40s will do Seatalk, but I have nothing for them to talk to. :rolleyes:

 

Glad you got the new boat up the Bay. B)

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If what Todsrer is saying is a possibility you may want to check the heavy copper (bonding?) wire that goes from the rudder to the chain plates. Mine goes past the lift pump, starter and through the battery compartment.

 

All candidates for a mess-up.

 

All of the bonding seems undisturbed and in good shape. Looks like it all eventually goes to the keel. Like I said, the wiring is shoddy so it's entirely possible that someone did what Toddster is describing. They let the smoke out and "oops" then put the wires back the right way...who knows?

 

You know, a stereo seems like an unessential, trivial thing but mine was pretty handy on the Pearson. I'd plug an aux cable into the headphone jack on the phone and the aux port on the stereo and "bam!" you have the "boat-o-phone!" I could set the phone down and have a conversation and the other person could be heard on the stereo which is much better than the speaker on the smartphone. I guess I'll look for a similar model when I decide to replace the dead unit.

 

Yesterday, I completed the sale of the Mighty Pearson 30. She won't be going anywhere though, because a fellow in my neighborhood bought it. I took him for a test-sail, showed him the good, the bad and the ugly (there wasn't much ugly). He has prior sailing experience, having lived aboard a wooden ketch in New England for a few years, sailing it up and down the coast.

 

As we sealed the deal, I said "My main advice to you, is to watch the engine gauges like a hawk when you're motoring. The engine has no safeties whatsoever. No overtemp alarm, no oil pressure alarm, and no safety cutouts. It'll run itself into the ground if something goes wrong." Then I informed him that Moyer Marine sells oil pressure cutout switches and alarm kits if he wanted to install them. He really seemed to like the boat during the test sail, the autopilot in particular. Later in the evening, I transferred my personal effects and gear from the Pearson to the Tartan which was a little strange and bittersweet. Selling boats is never the 2nd happiest day of my life.

 

I'm pretty damned excited about the Tartan. That boat is well built and very thoughtfully laid out and equipped. I'm going sailing today as soon as I get home from work. The weather is perfect.

 

The next stage work list goes something like this:

 

Replace transmission fluid.

Make the toilet operational.

Clean out fresh water tanks, get potable water system operational.

Clean decks and cabin top (again).

Clean out the cabin (again).

Clean out the bilge.

Clean out the icebox.

Install bilge pump float switch.

Get estimate from sail loft to repair the kevlar genoa.

Replace boom vang.

Replace more running rigging.

Apply for PHRF cert.

Clean up the 12v wiring.

 

As you can see, it's all nickel-and-dime stuff, nothing major and nothing that keeps me from sailing. The mainsail is really pretty decent. The jibs don't have any UV covers sewn on them though, so I'll need to do something about that or I'll be bagging the jibs everytime which kind of defeats the purpose of upgrading to roller furling.

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I am beginning to suspect that the Tartan was the victim of a near-strike from lightning.

 

I peeked into every single cubby that allowed an internal view of the hull and certainly there was no external visible damage on the exterior, so a direct strike probably did not happen...

 

I was on board a powerboat that took a strike to an antenna. The antenna exploded and we found most of it on the bottom the next morning. Other than that, the only visible damage consisted of a bit of scorching around the interior side of the antenna mount. You had to be upside down and looking hard to see it. It killed everything on the boat except handheld devices.

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Ajax, I don't know if you can get it anymore, but I've been happy with my RayMarine ST-40 series instruments. I have depth/speed (+water temp) & compass. They use Airmar transducers. I even think the newer (very fancy, color LCD $$$) ST-60s will work with the same, but I cannot confirm that. The ST-40s will do Seatalk, but I have nothing for them to talk to. :rolleyes:

 

Glad you got the new boat up the Bay. B)

 

 

I think the ST40's are still around, but they've changed the name to something else. i40 maybe? According to the ad copy, they're supposed to be "for motorboats," but like a lot of people, I have them for reasons of economy. The only real problem is the wind instrument. It's kind of a bulky thing to have screwed to the top of the mast, ads a foot of air draft, and because it uses a weighted cup to deduce the wind angle, rather than a vane, may not be sufficiently accurate or responsive to guide the autotiller in "wind trim" mode.

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+1 on the radio. The phone part is nice, you can hear when a call is coming in. But the real good part is having Pandora or RNR playing on those long days when you're doing some work on the boat, or when you're anchored somewhere. Music makes life nicer. I am not sure if it is ESSENTIAL but it is essential.

 

On the lightning strikes... A friend has a Catalina 30 she keeps up in the north part of the bay. A couple years ago, it got hit by lightning in the marina, scorched part of the boat, killed all the electronics, and blew a bunch of the metal bits apart. The insurance company totaled it, so she took the check, went through the boat completely herself on the rebuild, fixed everything, and went sailing on it again. The fixes took several months but the boat was better than new and appraised out that way, and at a higher value since she installed a few upgrades while fixing the lightning damage.

 

Fast forward two years. Lightning again hit the boat, frying everything and setting it on fire in the marina. It was as salvageable as it had been previously. The new insurance company surveyed it, totaled the boat, and cut her a check.

 

Which she used as the down payment on a new Beneteau. The first time was luck, the second time was a message.

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I have one of these:

 

51qCs%2BuzlnL._SY300_.jpg

 

After about two years, it had to go back to the factory for 6 months because the display failed. It was covered by a West Marine extended warranty. I don't usually buy extended warranties, but my observation is that the failure rate on marine instrument is very high.

 

I see the current instrument is called an i50, and has a different-looking display.

 

14155915.jpg

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Gotta weigh the options. If you are going to get an AP it will be NMEA 2000 or RayNG/2000 compliant and probably not Seatalk1 compliant. A Seatalk1display (depth/speed) WILL connect to a RaymaineNG display, but the data is not on the backbone. So why is that important?

 

If you plan on doing long trips or races, having a second data station at the nav table is a Huge feature. Going 2000 in steps and at some point a 2000-wifi (i.e. Vesper AIS) will eventually let you use an iPad or some other device running OpenCpn or QTVLM at the second data station below. It will then display all the data, no more gopher peaking to see the heading, etc.

 

Starting with a blank slate gives you way too many option$.

 

Stick around here I am sure we can design a $10k instrument bundle for ya.

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As you can see, it's all nickel-and-dime stuff, nothing major and nothing that keeps me from sailing. The mainsail is really pretty decent. The jibs don't have any UV covers sewn on them though, so I'll need to do something about that or I'll be bagging the jibs everytime which kind of defeats the purpose of upgrading to roller furling.

 

Depending on how many jibs you have and how often you think you'll change them, a single sleeve could be an option as opposed to having UV covers on all of them.

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I have the Ray Marine i50 "Tri-data". The instructions that came with it are ridiculously complicated - but once you figure out how to set it up, you shouldn't have to deal with too many of the calibration and adjustment issues. I swapped out the thru-hull depth transducer for the kind that shoots the through the hull - and that unit was a little finicky on positioning. There is a gasket on the transducer unit that needs to be lubricated to keep it water tight - mine leaked when the boat was heeled over (...yeah, I know. <_< ). I do not like that I can't read the display with my polarized sunglasses on - but I guess this is common with all these types of displays. The unit has maintained calibration very well - both speed and depth have remained accurate when I have checked them. The depth meter does not read the bottom very well when the bottom is covered in grass - but in sand and mud, no problem. There is a trip log that erases every time the unit is switched off, and a total distance log (odometer) that keeps track of total miles covered over the life of the instrument. There is also a water temperature readout that is quite accurate (...it matches my pool thermometer anyway!) as well. I can read it in full sunlight from anywhere in the cockpit, and it is reasonably water resistant. I have had it installed for about ten months now, and it has been a good unit. I do not have integrated instruments, repeaters, or other complexities - this is a "stand-alone" unit that provides basic information. With it next to my GPS, I have a lot of great info easily accessible. I am happy with it - your mileage may vary.

 

14155915.jpg

 

gallery_75266_1131_208947.jpg

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Our current boat has a Raytheon ST60 Tridata, came with the boat 10+ years ago. Previous boat had the same thing, we owned the boat for 9 years. Neither unit gave us any grief. I don't know how so many people have problems with Raymarine gear, except most of those with problems seem to have self-installed the units.

After selling marine electronics for over 6 years, I was amazed at how many people don't have the foggiest idea about basic electricity, let alone complicated voodoo like reading the manual..

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I can't stand on a soapbox and scream 'Composter!" but you'd be doing yourself a disservice if you don't consider it. PM me if you want. Mine's been in a couple weeks so I'm no expert but a few people I consider extremely persnickety sing the praises.

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The prior owner on my boat installed Ray i70 displays and they have been good for our use. On Defender they are priced about midway between the i50 single use version and the tri-data. They are fully configurable and can display up to 6 or 8 diferent data fields, analog images, AIS targets graphs etc. Becasue they are so flexible you could start with one and switch between big numbers or use the smaller fields, then add more as buget allows. At three years they work without problems.

 

IMG_1433_zpshwwqugof.jpg

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As you can see, it's all nickel-and-dime stuff, nothing major and nothing that keeps me from sailing. The mainsail is really pretty decent. The jibs don't have any UV covers sewn on them though, so I'll need to do something about that or I'll be bagging the jibs everytime which kind of defeats the purpose of upgrading to roller furling.

 

Depending on how many jibs you have and how often you think you'll change them, a single sleeve could be an option as opposed to having UV covers on all of them.

 

 

+1

 

Sleeve will protect the jib from wind storms, too.

 

FB- Doug

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+1 on the radio. The phone part is nice, you can hear when a call is coming in. But the real good part is having Pandora or RNR playing on those long days when you're doing some work on the boat, or when you're anchored somewhere. Music makes life nicer. I am not sure if it is ESSENTIAL but it is essential.

 

On the lightning strikes... A friend has a Catalina 30 she keeps up in the north part of the bay. A couple years ago, it got hit by lightning in the marina, scorched part of the boat, killed all the electronics, and blew a bunch of the metal bits apart. The insurance company totaled it, so she took the check, went through the boat completely herself on the rebuild, fixed everything, and went sailing on it again. The fixes took several months but the boat was better than new and appraised out that way, and at a higher value since she installed a few upgrades while fixing the lightning damage.

 

Fast forward two years. Lightning again hit the boat, frying everything and setting it on fire in the marina. It was as salvageable as it had been previously. The new insurance company surveyed it, totaled the boat, and cut her a check.

 

Which she used as the down payment on a new Beneteau. The first time was luck, the second time was a message.

 

The boat I was on has since been struck again a couple of times. What are the odds? After the first strike, they upgraded the grounding system in the boat quite a bit.

 

There are people to whom lightning seems unnaturally attracted too.

 

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We could start another whole separate set of threads over these instruments. But just for the record, adding the Shipmodul mux gives you two (or five) separate command stations with ST40 and NMEA 0183 stuff. Laptop on USB at the nav station, and tablets and phones galore all over the boat via wifi. (I'm still not sure if there's a way to lock out GIlligan's phone from changing waypoints...)

 

Of course, I would totally dump all that and get all the newest stuff, if it wouldn't cost more than my boat.

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The dead electrics could be a jump start to a totally dead battery with reversed polarity. Ask me how I know.

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Anyone informed know why instruments still cost so much?

In these days of kids using apps, some std tablet or phone hardware and some basic transducers or senders to function as satellites or control drones or perve on the girl next door, the whole gauge thing on yachts feels more and more of an arse-tear. Reading a few different numbers by pushing a button? Oooohhhh - how 21st century?!

Marine environ blah blah... So it needs a bead of 3M and better sealed connections - but 5 figures gets a lot of "better" built in?

And they don't cook French Toast yet.

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I agree, the stuff is pricey. These guys may put themselves out of business.

 

As for a UV sleeve for all my jibs, that's a no-go. Chesapeake PHRF requires a UV cover sewn onto the jibs.

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Only if taking the RF credit. Also means no changing jibs during a race or regatta. So were you ever to do a two day regatta (think Screwpile or SBRW) and it was light air on one day and heavy the next, you would not be able to change Genoa for a jib...

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I know mine are sewn, I just had a few seams re-sewn. Replacing the sacrificial cloth every few years is necessary, it would be close to impossible if it was glued on.

Of course, there are some people who just buy a new one...

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Only if taking the RF credit. Also means no changing jibs during a race or regatta. So were you ever to do a two day regatta (think Screwpile or SBRW) and it was light air on one day and heavy the next, you would not be able to change Genoa for a jib...

 

I've never done a multi-day W/L sausage fest and I'm not ever likely to. I have no crew. My racing is limited to distance races and sometimes, Wednesday nights around the cans, though thanks to the asshole behavior at PCRC, I'm not likely to race in their Wednesday night series again.

 

According to what I'm reading in the Ches PHRF rules, it's true that you can't change sails during a race, but it's less clear that you can't change them between days on a regatta.

Where are you seeing that part?

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I agree, the stuff is pricey. These guys may put themselves out of business.

 

As for a UV sleeve for all my jibs, that's a no-go. Chesapeake PHRF requires a UV cover sewn onto the jibs.

 

No, they don't. THey just hand you a penalty if you don't play by their stupid set of desired behaviors.

 

Ultraconformist pea-brains form the majority on any rating committee. Many many examples, most of whom have a very fixed set of ideas about what a "racing sailboat" should be like. Instead of producing fair racing, they want to encourag everyone to get the kind of boat they like. You don't have to play that game. Set up your boat so it is practical and sails well, join in races if you like (and tell 'em what fuckin' pinheads they are... tactfully of course).

 

FB- Doug

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Only if taking the RF credit. Also means no changing jibs during a race or regatta. So were you ever to do a two day regatta (think Screwpile or SBRW) and it was light air on one day and heavy the next, you would not be able to change Genoa for a jib...

I've never done a multi-day W/L sausage fest and I'm not ever likely to. I have no crew. My racing is limited to distance races and sometimes, Wednesday nights around the cans, though thanks to the asshole behavior at PCRC, I'm not likely to race in their Wednesday night series again.

 

According to what I'm reading in the Ches PHRF rules, it's true that you can't change sails during a race, but it's less clear that you can't change them between days on a regatta.

Where are you seeing that part?

It's in 17.c.

 

17. Requirements for Roller Furler (RF) Credit

A. The RF genoa/jib must be tacked above the RF drum and have the head (or pennant) secured to the bottom of the upper swivel at all times while racing except while changing the genoa/jib.

B. RF headsails may be constructed of any material, but laminated sails must be protected by continuous woven taffeta skins on both sides, and all RF sails must have a 4.0 oz minimum woven UV cover present on both the leech and foot.

C. The roller furling headsail, once hoisted, shall not be changed during a day, race, series, or regatta, unless conditions warrant use of heavy weather sail, as defined by section 4.26 of the special regulations for safety requirements. If conditions during a race have warranted the use of a heavy weather sail, as defined by section 4.26 of the special regulations for safety requirements, and during the course of the race these conditions have abated, it is permissible to hoist the standard RF headsail for that sailboat.

D. If second jib or genoa is flown, it need not conform to 17B, but shall never be flown without the roller furling jib or genoa also set.

E. The RF mainsail must be furled on a drum and spindle mechanism mounted within the mast or boom extrusion. RF mainsails with full-length battens that furl within the boom will receive a reduced credit. RF mizzen sails shall comply to the same requirements as the mainsail. RF mainsails equipped with air battens shall not have their pressure adjusted during the race.

F. No credit will be given for roller reefing booms, where the mainsail is rolled around the boom.

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Ah, ok. Thanks.

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Anyone informed know why instruments still cost so much?

In these days of kids using apps, some std tablet or phone hardware and some basic transducers or senders to function as satellites or control drones or perve on the girl next door, the whole gauge thing on yachts feels more and more of an arse-tear. Reading a few different numbers by pushing a button? Oooohhhh - how 21st century?!

Marine environ blah blah... So it needs a bead of 3M and better sealed connections - but 5 figures gets a lot of "better" built in?

And they don't cook French Toast yet.

 

Mostly because their sales are measured in thousands, not 10's of millions like the phones & apps you compare them to.

 

Specialized stuff is always expensive, even when it's very similar to mass market stuff.

 

You can use a phone GPS app to navigate but a big, dedicated, sunlight viewable plotter is a hell of a lot better - and only 3 times the cost of an I-Phone.

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But shouldn't I just write a web page that pulls data from the laptop running OpenCRM and display it on sunlight-visible e-paper nooks or kindles at <$99/ea. (Running over the wifi)?

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But shouldn't I just write a web page that pulls data from the laptop running OpenCRM and display it on sunlight-visible e-paper nooks or kindles at <$99/ea. (Running over the wifi)?

 

If you can make Nooks or Kindles that will tolerate the salt air corrosion on their charging ports and splash-proof them, sure!

Same goes for the laptop. Actually, laptops are rather quaint. It should be a stick computer running some thin version of windows or Android Marshmallow.

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Gusting to the 30's yesterday and my reefing lines aren't fully rigged yet so I spent the day cleaning and organizing.

 

Swapped in my own Manson Supreme and anchor rode from the "toy" racing anchor and rode. (Hey, I can always put it back for racing)

Removed 5 large, dead wasp nests the size of your palm. 2 of them were re-inhabited by a couple of wasps.

Simple Green'd and shop vac'd the bilge.

Spent a lot of time removing old gear and optimizing the storage of my gear. I like tools to be readily available and not buried under stuff but also not taking up prime real estate for other things.

 

I have a new SOS Danbuoy but the Lifesling that came with the boat is a rotted piece of junk. Oh- I found the Cunningham tackle. Just need to reeve a line and install it.

I got a Standard Horizon GX2200 VHF for my birthday. Looking forward to installing that. In a few months I'll get a DMK-11 yacht box to pump the AIS data to my iPad chartplotter. (Thanks, Illegal Smile!)

 

Still ever more cleaning to do. I might run a reefing line and go sailing after work. This ain't a museum restoration, ya know.

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Thread drift alert!

 

Talking museum restorations...Hawker Hurricane (WWII British Battle of Britain Fighter), aft section of fuselage was wood, and bolted together. Design called for WWII version of nylock nuts, so vibration wouldn't loosen the bolts holding the aft fuse together. Due to wartime shortages, not enough nuts, so instead, end of bolts were peened/mushroomed over so nuts couldn't loosen. This was what was done on Smithsonian's example. Smithsonian mandate is to use as many original pieces as possible. So volunteer restorers spent 100s of hours filing the ends of the bolts back to reverse the mushrooming, so fuse could be taken apart and restored. After wood sections were restored old nuts and bolts went back in, and were re-mushroomed. All this of course is not observable, as it is under the fabric skin of the aircraft...

 

That's the standard we expect Ajax!

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I try to adhere to a high standard. I don't always make it, though.

 

Instead of sailing yesterday, I ended up doing more cleaning and repairs. The wind was still up a bit and I still didn't have a cunningham or reefing line run yet so I finally took care of those, but I had to waste time driving to town for some line. Now that these items are rigged, winds will be less than 10kts for the next 4 months. :rolleyes:

 

I de-installed and removed the wiring for the old, dead Davis "Weather Commander" wind instruments.

Replaced the dead, corroded Aqua Signal red/green nav light.

Removed the dead stereo and bought a cheap, drop-in replacement, on sale.

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Sounds like you're still in the 80/20 sweet spot. That's a nice place to be.

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But shouldn't I just write a web page that pulls data from the laptop running OpenCRM and display it on sunlight-visible e-paper nooks or kindles at <$99/ea. (Running over the wifi)?

 

If you can make Nooks or Kindles that will tolerate the salt air corrosion on their charging ports and splash-proof them, sure!

Same goes for the laptop. Actually, laptops are rather quaint. It should be a stick computer running some thin version of windows or Android Marshmallow.

 

 

Was going to put the nooks/kindles in some kind of totally sealed box (except for rubber-grommetted charging port). They are cheap enough and big enough I think I can skip buttons to switch the display.

 

I assumed everyone keeps a normal laptop below for OpenCPN and whatever other stuff.

 

Looking around at sub-$100 anemometers. Will keep the class up to date as this progresses. I already have a spare nook so planning for very low initial investment.

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Yep, keep us informed. I'm curious.

 

I tried to keep a laptop onboard, but one broke free and smashed itself and the other literally baked itself to death in the Chesapeake summer heat.

I'd need a Toughbook or something.

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Toughbooks are the way to go. I rescued one from the "to be discarded" heap where I used to work and it has been earning its living on the boat ever since. It seems to do fin in the heat and does not mind getting spashed it it's out in the cockpit on a rough day.

 

Re. anemometers: you can always do your own. Take 3 tablespoon measuring spoons, a cap form a rattle can, a bearing (e. from an old VCR) and a $10 Bike speedometer from Walmart. Cut some slots into the rattle can cap and hot glue the measuring spoon into the cap so the look like a set of anemometer cups. Glue the bearing into the center of the cap. Find a pole of suitable length (I used an old sawed off stanchion) and glue the cap & bearing to the top of that. Stick the magnet from the bike speedo into the cap and tie wrap the sensor from the speedo to the pole so it "sees the the magnet go by. Calibrate the until with your wife's hair dryer and a borrowed anemometer. Done, for $20 or less.

post-37611-0-90881200-1465828151_thumb.jpg

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That is incredibly "production" looking. Did you actually mount that on your masthead, or is it on the aft pulpit somewhere?

How long has yours been running? I feel like hot glue wouldn't last very long.

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Re. anemometers: you can always do your own. Take 3 tablespoon measuring spoons, a cap form a rattle can, a bearing (e. from an old VCR) and a $10 Bike speedometer from Walmart. Cut some slots into the rattle can cap and hot glue the measuring spoon into the cap so the look like a set of anemometer cups. Glue the bearing into the center of the cap. Find a pole of suitable length (I used an old sawed off stanchion) and glue the cap & bearing to the top of that. Stick the magnet from the bike speedo into the cap and tie wrap the sensor from the speedo to the pole so it "sees the the magnet go by. Calibrate the until with your wife's hair dryer and a borrowed anemometer. Done, for $20 or less.

attachicon.gif062.jpg

 

MADE MY DAY

 

+++++++++LOTS

 

Take that Raymarine.

 

Py if you come to Ottawa in the last week of August I will buy you a beer.

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Ajax, I did not mount it at the mast hear but at the aft end of the boat (I had a installed a small set of davits for the kayak) as high as I could. It worked great unless the wind was right on the nose when the dodger disturbed the wind too much. I had it running for three years without any issue other than replacing the battery in the bike speedo, once / year. The hot glue held up without an issue. What also surprised me was that the rattle can lid did not seem to be affected by the UV at all. When we bought the new boat it came with a mast head unit and McGyver job has lived in the basement ever since.

 

Zedder, a visit to Ottawa can be arranged. It;s a great excuse to drop by Lee Valley!

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Yep, keep us informed. I'm curious.

 

I tried to keep a laptop onboard, but one broke free and smashed itself and the other literally baked itself to death in the Chesapeake summer heat.

I'd need a Toughbook or something.

A lot of manufacturers make education spec laptops too, which are designed for people actively trying to destroy a computer and avoid doing work. they tend to be cheaper, lower spec and longer battery than many other toughbooks

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PY, that's awesome. You may have just saved some of my old electronics from the trash truck.

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Ok, got some battens in the mainsail to replace the two that got flogged out in a strong breeze. I'll still need to sew the pockets shut. I noted that the velcro is quite worn on some of the pockets.

I also scrubbed out the stbd water tank (hooray for clean-out ports!) and recommissioned the pressure water system. It works!
I made a mess of the process though. The water heater tank valves were open, so I ended up pumping the water tank contents straight through the water heater and into the bilge before I figured out what the hell was going on. This also introduced a lot of air into the system which required me to run the pump for a long time to burp it all out.

The water heater has no electric connection and uses engine coolant for heat. I really have no intention of using the water heater so I shut the valves, drained the tank into the bilge and now it's a "dead head" as far as the pump is concerned. To test for leaks, I shut the system off for several minutes and then flipped the breaker back on and the pump did not run unless I opened a cold water faucet, so everything seems to be in order.

After 7 years of "camping" with hand pumps in the Coronado and then the Pearson, I did marvel open-mouthed at the water running from the faucets. I'm glad no one was around to witness. The thought of glorious, refreshing showers at anchor after a hot, sticky day on the Chesapeake makes me cheerful. Even a brief "submarine shower" will be better than what I had. The water pump is an old but very solid looking ITT Jabsco belt-driven diaphram pump. Looks like a 36660 or 36680, which is pricey but still available.

 

Filling the bilge with fresh water gave me the opportunity to test out the emergency manual pump in the cockpit. Works like a champ, dual-action, moves lots of water.

My new, 2000 gph Rule pump was another story. It pumps, but it seems kind of slow and output at the hull discharge was not what I expected. I'm going to have to investigate this and perhaps replace the hose. It seems to be pumping against something. The drain hose to the hull skin fitting is brand-new, so that's not the problem. It's got to be the run from the bilge to the engine compartment where it T's in with the manual pump.

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May I also suggest a solar shower? We used one last year cruusing to Baltimore around labor day and it was glorious.

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May I also suggest a solar shower? We used one last year cruusing to Baltimore around labor day and it was glorious.

For hot water? I have one.

Labor Day? Whew, the last thing I want on Labor Day weekend is a *hot* shower. During the transitional periods between warm and cool, sure they're great.

 

What's with people around here? Whenever I'd use the solar shower for a rinse in the cockpit, people in the anchorage stare in an obnoxious manner (and yes, I had a swimsuit on!)

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May I also suggest a solar shower? We used one last year cruusing to Baltimore around labor day and it was glorious.

For hot water? I have one.

Labor Day? Whew, the last thing I want on Labor Day weekend is a *hot* shower. During the transitional periods between warm and cool, sure they're great.

 

What's with people around here? Whenever I'd use the solar shower for a rinse in the cockpit, people in the anchorage stare in an obnoxious manner (and yes, I had a swimsuit on!)

 

 

Were you shaving your back in public again?

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LOL, no. I don't have Captain Obvious' physique though.

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Ajax

 

Confused. Why not use the hot water heater? Even in FLA, the decadence of a shower with warm water is delightful.

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First, it's rusty inside. The nasty water that came out makes me think it's not long for this world.

B. It's not wired up electrically and heating it by running an unloaded diesel is hard on the engine and takes forever.

IV. I personally prefer cool showers when it's hot as hell out. The tank water is going to be around 80-85 degrees. That's not cold.

 

For washing up dishes I could see the utility but I can also use an electric kettle driven by an inverter.

It has been pointed out to me that the engine would effectively heat water while I'm motoring into an anchorage or the last leg towards a marina, while it's loaded vs. unloaded after I'm anchored.

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I love the creative numbering of each of your points Ajax:

 

First.

B.

IV.

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First, it's rusty inside. The nasty water that came out makes me think it's not long for this world.

B. It's not wired up electrically and heating it by running an unloaded diesel is hard on the engine and takes forever.

IV. I personally prefer cool showers when it's hot as hell out. The tank water is going to be around 80-85 degrees. That's not cold.

 

...

 

That's true, but close. 79 degrees is where cold starts.

 

I'm curious about a submarine shower. I figured modern ones have a bigass water maker and the crew could shower as long as they wanted. No?

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Let me check Clinton.com for that. Be right back

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First, it's rusty inside. The nasty water that came out makes me think it's not long for this world.

B. It's not wired up electrically and heating it by running an unloaded diesel is hard on the engine and takes forever.

IV. I personally prefer cool showers when it's hot as hell out. The tank water is going to be around 80-85 degrees. That's not cold.

 

...

 

That's true, but close. 79 degrees is where cold starts.

 

I'm curious about a submarine shower. I figured modern ones have a bigass water maker and the crew could shower as long as they wanted. No?

 

 

No.

 

Even today, the reactor has priority over humans for fresh water needs. To my knowledge, the submarine fleet has not changed their stance that a shower consists of wetting down, shutting off the water, lathering up, shampoo in your hair, and then turning the water back on and rinsing off as quickly as possible and getting the hell out of the booth so the next guy can take his turn.

 

The LA class has 2k/day distilleries and most of that is used by the engineering dept. and the cooks. The VA class probably has a bigger 'still but the policy is still in place.

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Alright, after much sweat and cash we are heading out for our first weekend of cruising on the new boat.

 

-The boat is (mostly) clean and stowed.

-We got fresh water.

-We got a working toilet.

-The engine is reliable (such as they are considered to be reliable)

- Patched up the other jib (genoa) for Sunday's light breezes.

- I've gone over the standing rigging (again) and there are no visible defects, no missing pins or rings.

 

We just need to load some food, booze and condoms and we'll have a blast.

 

Ok, I'm kidding about the condoms. I've been snipped.

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May I also suggest a solar shower? We used one last year cruusing to Baltimore around labor day and it was glorious.

For hot water? I have one.

Labor Day? Whew, the last thing I want on Labor Day weekend is a *hot* shower. During the transitional periods between warm and cool, sure they're great.

 

What's with people around here? Whenever I'd use the solar shower for a rinse in the cockpit, people in the anchorage stare in an obnoxious manner (and yes, I had a swimsuit on!)

 

 

That's what weather cloths are for

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^^ I've seen them in videos but I don't think I've seen a single boat on the Chesapeake use them. On the Pearson, they wouldn't be high enough to hide anything anyway.

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Alright, after much sweat and cash we are heading out for our first weekend of cruising on the new boat.

 

-The boat is (mostly) clean and stowed.

-We got fresh water.

-We got a working toilet.

-The engine is reliable (such as they are considered to be reliable)

- Patched up the other jib (genoa) for Sunday's light breezes.

- I've gone over the standing rigging (again) and there are no visible defects, no missing pins or rings.

 

We just need to load some food, booze and condoms and we'll have a blast.

 

Ok, I'm kidding about the condoms. I've been snipped.

 

New battens?

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^^ Ah, good point! Yes indeedy, put 'em in the day before yesterday. I still need to sew the pockets shut but forecast for the weekend is gentle, so I doubt I'll flog 'em out.

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I also just use the solar shower in the cockpit with swim trunks. I have seen sailors use a hula-hoop hung from a halyard and tyvek curtain for privacy, my wife is pushing for something similar.

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I like clever solutions like that, I just hate how all those clever little solutions to various problems end up becoming a jumble of "stuff" on the boat that you need to find stowage for.

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I like clever solutions like that, I just hate how all those clever little solutions to various problems end up becoming a jumble of "stuff" on the boat that you need to find stowage for.

http://www.duckworksbbs.com/gear/shower/index.htm

 

We use a non solar version, just a repurposed garden sprayer, heat some water on the stove and add cold water to taste ...

 

With a RWC engine, a engine heater water tank isn't much use, our engine thermostat is 140 degrees F.

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Also, pretty slick.

 

You bring up another good point- Although FWC, my engine never seems to heat up beyond 155F degrees and usually lives between 140-150F degrees.

I don't see that doing much in a hot water heater. The engine temperature might go up as the summer progresses but as summer progresses, my need for a hot shower diminishes.

 

Meh.

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Ajax, methinks you need a new thermostat of the correct temperature. An engine should heat the coolant to operating temp in a very few minutes, even idling. 150 is too low - that's the temp a raw cooled engine runs at to help prevent deposits forming in the coolant passages.

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Also, pretty slick.

 

You bring up another good point- Although FWC, my engine never seems to heat up beyond 155F degrees and usually lives between 140-150F degrees.

I don't see that doing much in a hot water heater. The engine temperature might go up as the summer progresses but as summer progresses, my need for a hot shower diminishes.

 

Meh.

My 33 stays at 150 even motoring in FLA during the summer. At that engine temp the water is hot enough to need blending with the cold to comfortable.

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Ajax,

We need pictures of the cruise:

Pics sailing

Pics motoring

Pics reading on the lee side leaning against the aft end of the cabin

Pics of the boat at anchor from the dinghy.

 

Not needed:

Pics of you changing the water pump impeller

Pics of the shower in use

Pics of the head in use (we'll take your word for it).

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Also, pretty slick.

 

You bring up another good point- Although FWC, my engine never seems to heat up beyond 155F degrees and usually lives between 140-150F degrees.

I don't see that doing much in a hot water heater. The engine temperature might go up as the summer progresses but as summer progresses, my need for a hot shower diminishes.

 

Meh.

My 33 stays at 150 even motoring in FLA during the summer. At that engine temp the water is hot enough to need blending with the cold to comfortable.
My M 25 runs at 165. Fresh water cooled.

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Ajax,

We need pictures of the cruise:

Pics sailing

Pics motoring

Pics reading on the lee side leaning against the aft end of the cabin

Pics of the boat at anchor from the dinghy.

 

Not needed:

Pics of you changing the water pump impeller

Pics of the shower in use

Pics of the head in use (we'll take your word for it).

If we can coordinate our departure from Naptown with your arrival we can get some pics of you under sail from my boat. One of my buddies has a really nice camera aboard.

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Alright, after much sweat and cash we are heading out for our first weekend of cruising on the new boat.

 

-The boat is (mostly) clean and stowed.

-We got fresh water.

-We got a working toilet.

-The engine is reliable (such as they are considered to be reliable)

- Patched up the other jib (genoa) for Sunday's light breezes.

- I've gone over the standing rigging (again) and there are no visible defects, no missing pins or rings.

 

We just need to load some food, booze and condoms and we'll have a blast.

 

Ok, I'm kidding about the condoms. I've been snipped.

Genoa sheets on the correct side?

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^^ Lol, Yes!

Our chainsaw wielding kiwi will be happier now!

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Man, you know you're sailing-deprived when a piddly overnight in the Annapolis south anchorage seems like a delightful, exotic vacation.

It was great. Of course, the company made it even better.

 

All those preparations and I forgot one critical item:

 

 

All-in-all, it was a great weekend. Anchored with no problems, motored with no problems, the fridge worked, the water and shower worked. Food was great.

We had an absolutely perfect sail home. I swapped in my other, untested headsail- a 140-ish% kevlar genoa. I had to patch it, but it seems great. The boat was speedy and smooth in pretty light breezes ranging from 7-12kts. The boat's a cruiser, but it's no pig. It gets along pretty well.

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Ajax! Where did Sponge Bob get that Bag-O-Wind??? ..Can you send some down here? :D

Glad you and the boat are getting along well. I see this as the beginning of a beautiful relationship between you two.

 

Sail On! :)

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^^ Lol, Yes!

Our chainsaw wielding kiwi will be happier now!

You know I am.

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Replaced the over-bored, failing raw water pump with a new, M-502 by Moyer Marine yesterday. This thing pumps gobs of water.

It's a load off my mind. I was expecting the ancient impeller in the old pump to throw a fin any time now.

 

Today's task- rebuild the toilet. Ewww

Tomorrow will be more fun- replace more running rigging. New lines make the boat look snappy!

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Unless you already have the parts price out a whole new unit, usually the cost of the rebuild kit is pretty close to a new head, and a lot less trouble.

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True that, but only if you have a lower end of the price list head. It usually is cheaper to rebuild a higher end until than to replace it.

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A rebuild kit is $70 at Defender. A replacement pump assembly is $160. An identical replacement toilet is not available. Thetford killed most of the Wilcox Crittenden line when they bought them out.

A $70 rebuild will buy me a year or two while I figure out if I want to install a desiccating toilet or a Lavac vacu-flush or just put another cheap Jabsco in.

 

Supposedly, a Lavac uses a fraction of the water and increases the intervals between pump outs. Of course, a desiccating toilet eliminates pump-outs altogether...

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Supposedly, a Lavac uses a fraction of the water and increases the intervals between pump outs. .

 

 

That coin has two sides: you do not want your holding tank to be too dry ....

Owners of electrical heads need to pump some water now and then, as they too use less water.

 

/J

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So, I "did the deed" yesterday and rebuilt the toilet. It was every bit as wretched as I expected. Gloves, goggles, sponges, catch-clothes, it didn't matter. By the time I got done wrestling with everything, I was poop-ified and sweaty. I pumped gallons of bleach water first, and it didn't matter. The toilet area of the T33 is very cramped, cramped enough that it earned this distinction in magazine reviews. This made undoing certain fasteners difficult and made me get extremely intimate with the toilet. I discovered one reason why the toilet didn't work very well- There was a huge wasp nest clogging the discharge pipe! (prior to the hose to the holding tank)

I am still chasing wasps out of the boat on a regular basis. These are local wasps though, not transported from the boatyard. We've watched them fly over and land on the boat. They simply seek any dark, cool hole to crawl into and they always find the drain holes in my dorade boxes which lead into the cabin if you crawl far enough.

Anyway, the toilet pumps like a champ now, and doesn't spray pee on you from the pump handle shaft seal. It'll last until I decide on something better.
The job was so disgusting that after I went home and disinfected myself, I returned to the boat to play with running rigging as sort of a mental reward. I got the backstay adjuster block lubricated and free running and replaced the nasty control line. I also replaced the entire boom vang with a good used one that I found at Bacon's. The only running rigging still to be replaced is the spinnaker halyard and the pole topping lift. I still need to actually install the new jib and main halyards but they are ready.

 

My temporary butane cooker has arrived. I priced out the cost to overhaul the propane system and it'll run me at least half a boat buck. Everything gets replaced except for the stove itself.

Still plenty of cleaning to do in the meantime...

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I forgot to tell you something I learned in the Be-All-You-Can-Be.mil.

 

That is if you have to do something that is going to be truly horrific, odious beyond all human measure, and you don't need your sense of smell to be working, and if it doesn't matter if you yourself will reek - break out the Vicks. Smear some of that stuff on your throat and chest, and pack a little up the edge of your nostrils.

 

There are some smells that cannot be unsmelled, but the Vicks help. I also know a few people who swear by adding a couple of those small cotton plugs you use for a bloody nose, then mouthbreathing.

 

Cleaning a horrific shitter isn't the end of the world smell wise, but it has the potential like a lot of other smells to stick in your nose for a while. The Vicks tricks help with that. Yeah, I know - *now* I tell you.

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For me, it's not the smell so much as the ick. I ripped an old head out of my boat that hadn't been used in at least three years. The lines were filled with old urine and a big turd. Of course, despite my best efforts, I got that juice all over myself. Somehow, the fact that the waste wasn't my own made it that much worse. I grit my teeth, finished the job, and took a rape shower afterwards.

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For me, it's not the smell so much as the ick. I ripped an old head out of my boat that hadn't been used in at least three years. The lines were filled with old urine and a big turd. Of course, despite my best efforts, I got that juice all over myself. Somehow, the fact that the waste wasn't my own made it that much worse. I grit my teeth, finished the job, and took a rape shower afterwards.

 

Exactly. I give you the "win" for actually having a turd still in the line. I didn't have that. I'm resilient. The job is over and I'm going cruising this weekend, taking along a young lad who wants to go sailing. Hopefully we don't bore him to death.

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You won't if you do it right!

 

The weather is perfect for the weekend- Sunshine, low 80's and 10-12kts. Sunday looks a bit lighter but still sailable.

We can play his music through the stereo, we're bringing stuff to make s'mores over the grill and packing some games but I worry that might not be enough.

 

Should I throw in some rum and porn?

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Rum and porn are good for boys of any age but I find that spray in the face and wind in the hair is just as effective.

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I've been advised to give him an important task so I'll let him take a turn behind the wheel and post him at the chart plotter as "navigator."

This is a club organized cruise with a "race" to the destination anchorage. I use the term extremely loosely. It's just who can get to the beer the fastest without expending an ungentlemanly level of effort. ;)

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I imagine the chart plotter will keep him busy. Kinda like a video game. The chart plotter may assist the transition from the screen world to the real world.

 

Good on ya for taking him aboard.

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Pffft...I'd never tell a little boy "No, you can't go sailing" unless the conditions were hazardous or something.

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The B plan if the winds are lousy is always to park the boat in a jellyfish free area bay and go for a swim. My son is always down for that, he's 12 now but has been since he was half that age. We did keep him in a PFD at first - he's a swim team kid but man, that cloudy water is scary for NooBs. Including NooB parents.

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Come to think of it, I haven't seen a single nettle so far this season.

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