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Shootist Jeff

The serious transgender bathroom issue discussion

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Why do you consider it a tragedy and horrendous if your daughter sees a dick? I'm having a hard time seeing the harm.

People feel more comfortable separating the sexes, that's why it has been a widely accepted practice for a very long time and across the globe. I'll ask you the question I asked PS...

Should we just have one big facility and everyone showers together?

 

No.

 

Since we're in the answering questions mode, perhaps you can answer the tough one.

 

How many times have school children been traumatized by seeing girl dicks and girl balls dangling around girls' locker rooms, and does the number exceed the number of times that kids were traumatized by seeing classmates killed in schools due to the acts of mass shooters?

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one big shower is probably more efficient than two. Just put up a schedule.

 

Great, we'll schedule you for ass-clown night.. :ph34r:

 

That's a good one.

Here's a sample schedule....

On the hour

 

00 to 10 - Homophobic women and girls (no tranny's please)

10 to 20 - Homophobic men and boys (no tranny's please)

20 - 59 - The rest of Americans

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Why do people keep confusing transgenderism with homosexuality? It is people on both sides of this argument who do it, constantly. They are two different issues.

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I don't expect a straight answer out of you, eddy - but what about you BJ? Do you think its cool? What about you razr or you Sol? A "girl's" hairy (or shaved) dick dangling next to your young daughter is all good?

 

I gave you an answer to your specious questions in the form of a clarifying question.

 

I don't accept your scenario that a tranny would dangle their balls in the face of girls. And even if they did, they would face the same justice as dangling their balls in the face of a boy.

I also don't accept your scenario that a girl seeing a dick will assault her anymore than a boy seeing a dick.

 

You are the one dodging the question.

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You are the one dodging the question.

 

Someone is going to answer my question any day now.

 

 

I am not sure how one is relevant to the other. School shootings are illegal and nobody is talking about making it legal. It is illegal to have a gun on school property, let alone to shoot someone. The issue of transgendered students using the same common shower and changing areas is fairly new, with the suggestion from some now being that this should be accepted as normal. In the past it was not, and even now as learning_j24 said, the way schools typically handle it is by providing private facilities for transgendered students. I don't expect an epidemic of traumatized girls from seeing a transgendered person in their shower or changing area, but I do suspect there will be a number of unintended consequences from this, many of which are not going to be liked by anyone including the folks supporting it now.

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Sorry, but I am confused on a basic issue.

 

How is seeing a penis going to hurt young girls? If there is inappropriate contact, I'd be furious, but there is way too much internet access for the sight of a penis on a person who self identifies as female to cause injury.

 

Unless your daughter has been locked away without a phone or Internet all her life, it seems like much ado about nada. If you have a religious exception, I guess that would qualify, but I'm not sure which way the courts would rule.

 

I think many people are just intolerant of alternative lifestyles, and this is the issue du jour to get them excited to watch FOX and vote Republican. If bathrooms get you out to the polls, then their focus groups have worked.

So in your view separating the sexes is pointless. Should we just have one big facility and everyone showers together?

 

 

It seems like that is where we end up at some point if the argument becomes separate but equal facilities is unacceptable. We won't end up with some convoluted set of unenforcable rules that try to define what makes one a true transgender who can use the showers and locker rooms of people with differing anatomy. It would of necessity be that anyone can use any facility, which will likely mean that the use of common showers and changing areas will greatly diminish over time. I don't think it is the end of the world, we would adjust, but I think it is silly to think that people are bigots or neanderthals for not being comfortable with the idea of a grown adult anatomical male showering next to a thirteen year old girl. We have cultural norms that have existed for centuries, which are at one level or another part of nearly every major religion. Modesty when in the presence of members of the opposite sex is the norm for religious people, for religious Jews and Muslims it means not showing arms and legs, Christians can show a bit more, but full nudity is generally frowned upon. Are all the Muslims, Jews, and Christians ignorant bigoted neanderthals? I don't think so.

 

 

I really don't see this slippery slope you guys think we're on.

 

Sorry Jeff, there's no answer to your question as it's a ridiculous question.

 

If there was a transgender at my YC, and given mine is in Nor Cal I would say the "risk" is highest here, I'd deal with it on a case basis.

 

It's frankly stupid to react as if there's an onslaught of Trans people out there dangling frank and beans in front of little girls.

 

I thought this was the serious thread?

 

Serious is: Is it ok for a state to remove court access for a group of people bases on no evidence of any of the feared behavior?

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You are the one dodging the question.

 

Someone is going to answer my question any day now.

I am not sure how one is relevant to the other. School shootings are illegal and nobody is talking about making it legal. It is illegal to have a gun on school property, let alone to shoot someone. The issue of transgendered students using the same common shower and changing areas is fairly new, with the suggestion from some now being that this should be accepted as normal. In the past it was not, and even now as learning_j24 said, the way schools typically handle it is by providing private facilities for transgendered students. I don't expect an epidemic of traumatized girls from seeing a transgendered person in their shower or changing area, but I do suspect there will be a number of unintended consequences from this, many of which are not going to be liked by anyone including the folks supporting it now.

Skip the shooting part.

 

How many cases of girls traumatized by flopping girl weenies in girl locker rooms have we heard about?

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Sol -

 

There's never been a point at which probable outcomes warrant concern? We have to wait 'til damage is done? Referring back to the IL case, it seems that the majority of the female students at that school felt as though their privacy had been violated.

 

It's OK to force that upon young girls, but, someone in a college having to hear something they dislike and disagree with is actionable, and warrants a clamor for dismissal of school leadership? It's OK for those students to be outraged for having seen/heard an opinion they didn't like, but, the idea that I'm aggravated because some gender confused twit could force my daughters to feel like their personal privacy had been violated is wrong?

 

Not sure I can ever see myself agreeing with this.

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Sol -

 

There's never been a point at which probable outcomes warrant concern? We have to wait 'til damage is done? Referring back to the IL case, it seems that the majority of the female students at that school felt as though their privacy had been violated.

 

It's OK to force that upon young girls, but, someone in a college having to hear something they dislike and disagree with is actionable, and warrants a clamor for dismissal of school leadership? It's OK for those students to be outraged for having seen/heard an opinion they didn't like, but, the idea that I'm aggravated because some gender confused twit could force my daughters to feel like their personal privacy had been violated is wrong?

 

Not sure I can ever see myself agreeing with this.

My point is that transgender people have been around about as long as there have been people. Somehow we have managed to avoid the doomsday scenario for all this great long while. Perhaps transgender people are not in a hurry to run around flashing their genitalia at others, and just want to be left alone to go about their business. The Department of Education seemed to think that when they nixed the separate but equal plan, which definitely identifies the outsider for all to see and mock.

 

We all accepted it for the length of our lives, until just the last few months, whether we knew it or not. Chances are we used the same locker room as someone not quite like us. I wouldn't know, because I never felt the need to run around checking under towels, and if anyone ever ran around waving his junk around, he'd be getting a quick trip to the infirmary. We pretty much just wanted to be left alone to go about our business. I suspect that any transgender students did and do too.

 

This whole thing is just a not-so-elaborate slippery slope argument for a problem that never existed. We have real problems to address in this country. This ain't one of them.

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Sol -

 

There's never been a point at which probable outcomes warrant concern? We have to wait 'til damage is done? Referring back to the IL case, it seems that the majority of the female students at that school felt as though their privacy had been violated.

 

It's OK to force that upon young girls, but, someone in a college having to hear something they dislike and disagree with is actionable, and warrants a clamor for dismissal of school leadership? It's OK for those students to be outraged for having seen/heard an opinion they didn't like, but, the idea that I'm aggravated because some gender confused twit could force my daughters to feel like their personal privacy had been violated is wrong?

 

Not sure I can ever see myself agreeing with this.

My point is that transgender people have been around about as long as there have been people. Somehow we have managed to avoid the doomsday scenario for all this great long while. Perhaps transgender people are not in a hurry to run around flashing their genitalia at others, and just want to be left alone to go about their business. The Department of Education seemed to think that when they nixed the separate but equal plan, which definitely identifies the outsider for all to see and mock.

 

We all accepted it for the length of our lives, until just the last few months, whether we knew it or not. Chances are we used the same locker room as someone not quite like us. I wouldn't know, because I never felt the need to run around checking under towels, and if anyone ever ran around waving his junk around, he'd be getting a quick trip to the infirmary. We pretty much just wanted to be left alone to go about our business. I suspect that any transgender students did and do too.

 

This whole thing is just a not-so-elaborate slippery slope argument for a problem that never existed. We have real problems to address in this country. This ain't one of them.

 

 

I sincerely doubt that there were ever girls changing in the boys locker room, or vice versa. That kids with gender confusion existed? I'd suspect so.

 

I think that kids STILL want to be left alone to go about their business, but, forcing gender integration upon kids in places like locker rooms, to the discomfort of the majority of the kids just so that the gender confused kid doesn't get his/her feelings hurt is the antithesis of that.

 

Whether some folks want to accept it or not - some things simply are what they are, and someone having an issue accepting how they were born that means that that individual has an issue, not everyone else around them. A goat can wish he was a bird all he wants, but, he won't ever grow wings and fly.

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Serious question. Do you think that transgender kids (in school or anywhere else) are a new phenomenon?

 

Define new? There were none that I was aware of when I went to HS school in the early 80s. I'm sure there are some now. I still think its likely a very small %. I'm not sure how's that relevant to my original question though. Are you suggesting that its common place and acceptable for an adult trans with a penis to be toweling his balls off in front of a young girl in the sailing club changing room?

 

Why are you and others avoiding the question?

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one big shower is probably more efficient than two. Just put up a schedule.

 

Why would you need a schedule? Its a free for all.

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I don't expect a straight answer out of you, eddy - but what about you BJ? Do you think its cool? What about you razr or you Sol? A "girl's" hairy (or shaved) dick dangling next to your young daughter is all good?

 

I gave you an answer to your specious questions in the form of a clarifying question.

 

I don't accept your scenario that a tranny would dangle their balls in the face of girls. And even if they did, they would face the same justice as dangling their balls in the face of a boy.

I also don't accept your scenario that a girl seeing a dick will assault her anymore than a boy seeing a dick.

 

You are the one dodging the question.

 

 

I never mentioned assault, fukwad.

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I don't expect a straight answer out of you, eddy - but what about you BJ? Do you think its cool? What about you razr or you Sol? A "girl's" hairy (or shaved) dick dangling next to your young daughter is all good?

 

I gave you an answer to your specious questions in the form of a clarifying question.

 

I don't accept your scenario that a tranny would dangle their balls in the face of girls. And even if they did, they would face the same justice as dangling their balls in the face of a boy.

I also don't accept your scenario that a girl seeing a dick will assault her anymore than a boy seeing a dick.

 

You are the one dodging the question.

 

 

I never mentioned assault, fukwad.

 

You never mentioned if it was ok for a guy to free ball his wedding tackle in front a boy either. Why the dodge Jeff? Hitting a bit close to home is it?

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Sorry, but I am confused on a basic issue.

 

How is seeing a penis going to hurt young girls? If there is inappropriate contact, I'd be furious, but there is way too much internet access for the sight of a penis on a person who self identifies as female to cause injury.

 

Unless your daughter has been locked away without a phone or Internet all her life, it seems like much ado about nada. If you have a religious exception, I guess that would qualify, but I'm not sure which way the courts would rule.

 

I think many people are just intolerant of alternative lifestyles, and this is the issue du jour to get them excited to watch FOX and vote Republican. If bathrooms get you out to the polls, then their focus groups have worked.

So in your view separating the sexes is pointless. Should we just have one big facility and everyone showers together?

 

 

It seems like that is where we end up at some point if the argument becomes separate but equal facilities is unacceptable. We won't end up with some convoluted set of unenforcable rules that try to define what makes one a true transgender who can use the showers and locker rooms of people with differing anatomy. It would of necessity be that anyone can use any facility, which will likely mean that the use of common showers and changing areas will greatly diminish over time. I don't think it is the end of the world, we would adjust, but I think it is silly to think that people are bigots or neanderthals for not being comfortable with the idea of a grown adult anatomical male showering next to a thirteen year old girl. We have cultural norms that have existed for centuries, which are at one level or another part of nearly every major religion. Modesty when in the presence of members of the opposite sex is the norm for religious people, for religious Jews and Muslims it means not showing arms and legs, Christians can show a bit more, but full nudity is generally frowned upon. Are all the Muslims, Jews, and Christians ignorant bigoted neanderthals? I don't think so.

 

 

I really don't see this slippery slope you guys think we're on.

 

Sorry Jeff, there's no answer to your question as it's a ridiculous question.

 

If there was a transgender at my YC, and given mine is in Nor Cal I would say the "risk" is highest here, I'd deal with it on a case basis.

 

It's frankly stupid to react as if there's an onslaught of Trans people out there dangling frank and beans in front of little girls.

 

I thought this was the serious thread?

 

Serious is: Is it ok for a state to remove court access for a group of people bases on no evidence of any of the feared behavior?

 

 

Its absolutely NOT a ridiculous question. I'm not making this shit up about the facilities and the crowded nature of the changing rooms. Ask derek grebe if you don't believe me. I'm simply saying that currently, adult women and young girls as young as 5-6 are drying off after showering in pretty close quarters. Same with the men's shower facilities. Add a transgender male into the women's shower room. Are you fucking OK with that? Its a simple yes or no question. And again, I'm not talking about the shemale dick-slapping the little girls. I'm talking about absolutely normal behavior of being naked in front of strangers. I don't care if you are the girlyest girls with a girl dick and girl balls - those are going to be on show at some point as you are wiping them off after being in the shower. Especially in a humid climate like this.

 

Calling it a re-dickulous question is a cop out to avoid answering it.

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Jeff has a real problem with male hygiene. Did you see something as a child that still haunts you?

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I don't expect a straight answer out of you, eddy - but what about you BJ? Do you think its cool? What about you razr or you Sol? A "girl's" hairy (or shaved) dick dangling next to your young daughter is all good?

 

I gave you an answer to your specious questions in the form of a clarifying question.

 

I don't accept your scenario that a tranny would dangle their balls in the face of girls. And even if they did, they would face the same justice as dangling their balls in the face of a boy.

I also don't accept your scenario that a girl seeing a dick will assault her anymore than a boy seeing a dick.

 

You are the one dodging the question.

 

 

I never mentioned assault, fukwad.

 

You never mentioned if it was ok for a guy to free ball his wedding tackle in front a boy either. Why the dodge Jeff? Hitting a bit close to home is it?

 

 

there is no dodge there. But your response is.

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Serious question. Do you think that transgender kids (in school or anywhere else) are a new phenomenon?

 

Define new? There were none that I was aware of when I went to HS school in the early 80s. I'm sure there are some now. I still think its likely a very small %. I'm not sure how's that relevant to my original question though. Are you suggesting that its common place and acceptable for an adult trans with a penis to be toweling his balls off in front of a young girl in the sailing club changing room?

 

Why are you and others avoiding the question?

 

 

Because it's a stupid question. the rarity of the event makes it so. the only people for who the question is relevant is to the IMAGINE! crowd.

 

They've answered. "The world will end as we know it." Again.

 

Me: "ZFG"

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Can't stand to face the possibility that I may be right. Your silence on answering the question speaks fucking volumes!

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Serious question. Do you think that transgender kids (in school or anywhere else) are a new phenomenon?

Define new? There were none that I was aware of when I went to HS school in the early 80s. I'm sure there are some now. I still think its likely a very small %. I'm not sure how's that relevant to my original question though. Are you suggesting that its common place and acceptable for an adult trans with a penis to be toweling his balls off in front of a young girl in the sailing club changing room?

 

Why are you and others avoiding the question?

How many times do you need me to answer it before you win a prize? Can I just repeat it in the same post so that you get me to answer it enough times?

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Sorry, but I am confused on a basic issue.

 

How is seeing a penis going to hurt young girls? If there is inappropriate contact, I'd be furious, but there is way too much internet access for the sight of a penis on a person who self identifies as female to cause injury.

 

Unless your daughter has been locked away without a phone or Internet all her life, it seems like much ado about nada. If you have a religious exception, I guess that would qualify, but I'm not sure which way the courts would rule.

 

I think many people are just intolerant of alternative lifestyles, and this is the issue du jour to get them excited to watch FOX and vote Republican. If bathrooms get you out to the polls, then their focus groups have worked.

So in your view separating the sexes is pointless. Should we just have one big facility and everyone showers together?

 

 

It seems like that is where we end up at some point if the argument becomes separate but equal facilities is unacceptable. We won't end up with some convoluted set of unenforcable rules that try to define what makes one a true transgender who can use the showers and locker rooms of people with differing anatomy. It would of necessity be that anyone can use any facility, which will likely mean that the use of common showers and changing areas will greatly diminish over time. I don't think it is the end of the world, we would adjust, but I think it is silly to think that people are bigots or neanderthals for not being comfortable with the idea of a grown adult anatomical male showering next to a thirteen year old girl. We have cultural norms that have existed for centuries, which are at one level or another part of nearly every major religion. Modesty when in the presence of members of the opposite sex is the norm for religious people, for religious Jews and Muslims it means not showing arms and legs, Christians can show a bit more, but full nudity is generally frowned upon. Are all the Muslims, Jews, and Christians ignorant bigoted neanderthals? I don't think so.

 

 

I really don't see this slippery slope you guys think we're on.

 

Sorry Jeff, there's no answer to your question as it's a ridiculous question.

 

If there was a transgender at my YC, and given mine is in Nor Cal I would say the "risk" is highest here, I'd deal with it on a case basis.

 

It's frankly stupid to react as if there's an onslaught of Trans people out there dangling frank and beans in front of little girls.

 

I thought this was the serious thread?

 

Serious is: Is it ok for a state to remove court access for a group of people bases on no evidence of any of the feared behavior?

 

 

Its absolutely NOT a ridiculous question. I'm not making this shit up about the facilities and the crowded nature of the changing rooms. Ask derek grebe if you don't believe me. I'm simply saying that currently, adult women and young girls as young as 5-6 are drying off after showering in pretty close quarters. Same with the men's shower facilities. Add a transgender male into the women's shower room. Are you fucking OK with that? Its a simple yes or no question. And again, I'm not talking about the shemale dick-slapping the little girls. I'm talking about absolutely normal behavior of being naked in front of strangers. I don't care if you are the girlyest girls with a girl dick and girl balls - those are going to be on show at some point as you are wiping them off after being in the shower. Especially in a humid climate like this.

 

Calling it a re-dickulous question is a cop out to avoid answering it.

 

 

Nope - it's a BS question to get the mouth breathers all up in arms. If it ever happens, I'll deal with it. The nuance of the situation would likely be very subtle. Who's the girl? Do I know the girl? Has there ever been an issue with that girl? What do my kids think? Are there ways my YC could deal with it (Yes, we have 2 ladies bathrooms, one for the women with stalls, one for the juniors with shared space) etc. etc. etc.

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Serious question. Do you think that transgender kids (in school or anywhere else) are a new phenomenon?

Define new? There were none that I was aware of when I went to HS school in the early 80s. I'm sure there are some now. I still think its likely a very small %. I'm not sure how's that relevant to my original question though. Are you suggesting that its common place and acceptable for an adult trans with a penis to be toweling his balls off in front of a young girl in the sailing club changing room?

 

Why are you and others avoiding the question?

How many times do you need me to answer it before you win a prize? Can I just repeat it in the same post so that you get me to answer it enough times?

 

 

But you haven't answered it. You dodge into the "worst case assault" BS. You know damn well that's not what I'm talking about.

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Serious question. Do you think that transgender kids (in school or anywhere else) are a new phenomenon?

Define new? There were none that I was aware of when I went to HS school in the early 80s. I'm sure there are some now. I still think its likely a very small %. I'm not sure how's that relevant to my original question though. Are you suggesting that its common place and acceptable for an adult trans with a penis to be toweling his balls off in front of a young girl in the sailing club changing room?

 

Why are you and others avoiding the question?

How many times do you need me to answer it before you win a prize? Can I just repeat it in the same post so that you get me to answer it enough times?

 

 

But you haven't answered it. You dodge into the "worst case assault" BS. You know damn well that's not what I'm talking about.

 

 

It's simple really, let the local groups deal with it. Now, if you need a law out in the desert cause there are a bunch of she-males, I'm sure they'll deal with it in a nice, progressive way. Maybe beheading?

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Can't stand to face the possibility that I may be right. Your silence on answering the question speaks fucking volumes!

I can't answer you until you provide clarification to your query. I need to know if you find it equally disturbing to have a man wave his twig and berries in front of a boy.

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Can't stand to face the possibility that I may be right. Your silence on answering the question speaks fucking volumes!

I can't answer you until you provide clarification to your query. I need to know if you find it equally disturbing to have a man wave his twig and berries in front of a boy.

 

I apologize Jeff, I know its a sensitive subject for you.

 

Here is my response to your question.

 

If the drying of genitalia is done in front of the girl in a manner that would not offend me if it were done in front of a boy, I'm OK with it. That's as direct of an answer I can give you.

I don't prescribe to the notion that the sight of genitalia is damaging to either sexes.

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Serious question. Do you think that transgender kids (in school or anywhere else) are a new phenomenon?

Define new? There were none that I was aware of when I went to HS school in the early 80s. I'm sure there are some now. I still think its likely a very small %. I'm not sure how's that relevant to my original question though. Are you suggesting that its common place and acceptable for an adult trans with a penis to be toweling his balls off in front of a young girl in the sailing club changing room?

 

Why are you and others avoiding the question?

How many times do you need me to answer it before you win a prize? Can I just repeat it in the same post so that you get me to answer it enough times?

But you haven't answered it. You dodge into the "worst case assault" BS. You know damn well that's not what I'm talking about.

Forget about the assault. Your worst case scenario is girl ween flopping around in the locker room. I would not be comfortable with my kid seeing that, as I have repeatedly said.

 

Now. How many times has that circumstance come to pass?

 

Do transgender people choose to be that way?

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Can't stand to face the possibility that I may be right. Your silence on answering the question speaks fucking volumes!

I can't answer you until you provide clarification to your query. I need to know if you find it equally disturbing to have a man wave his twig and berries in front of a boy.

 

I apologize Jeff, I know its a sensitive subject for you.

 

Here is my response to your question.

 

If the drying of genitalia is done in front of the girl in a manner that would not offend me if it were done in front of a boy, I'm OK with it. That's as direct of an answer I can give you.

I don't prescribe to the notion that the sight of genitalia is damaging to either sexes.

 

 

See, how hard was that to give a straight answer? Thanks.

 

But I didn't ask if YOU would be offended. I asked if it was in front of your young daughter, would you have a problem with it as a parent? If your answer is the same, then fine.

 

Do you even have a daughter, btw?

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Can't stand to face the possibility that I may be right. Your silence on answering the question speaks fucking volumes!

I can't answer you until you provide clarification to your query. I need to know if you find it equally disturbing to have a man wave his twig and berries in front of a boy.

 

I apologize Jeff, I know its a sensitive subject for you.

 

Here is my response to your question.

 

If the drying of genitalia is done in front of the girl in a manner that would not offend me if it were done in front of a boy, I'm OK with it. That's as direct of an answer I can give you.

I don't prescribe to the notion that the sight of genitalia is damaging to either sexes.

 

 

See, how hard was that to give a straight answer? Thanks.

 

But I didn't ask if YOU would be offended. I asked if it was in front of your young daughter, would you have a problem with it as a parent? If your answer is the same, then fine.

 

Do you even have a daughter, btw?

 

 

I have 2, and "It Depends"

 

but the likelihood of me having to deal with that is on par with me winning the Lotto and signing you up to be the driver of my AC catamaran.

 

 

edit: Jeff, your chain has been yanked, and yanked hard, by the Daily Outrage Machine

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Can't stand to face the possibility that I may be right. Your silence on answering the question speaks fucking volumes!

I can't answer you until you provide clarification to your query. I need to know if you find it equally disturbing to have a man wave his twig and berries in front of a boy.

 

I apologize Jeff, I know its a sensitive subject for you.

 

Here is my response to your question.

 

If the drying of genitalia is done in front of the girl in a manner that would not offend me if it were done in front of a boy, I'm OK with it. That's as direct of an answer I can give you.

I don't prescribe to the notion that the sight of genitalia is damaging to either sexes.

 

 

See, how hard was that to give a straight answer? Thanks.

 

But I didn't ask if YOU would be offended. I asked if it was in front of your young daughter, would you have a problem with it as a parent? If your answer is the same, then fine.

 

Do you even have a daughter, btw?

 

Yes I have one. If the event was as you described and the tranny was swinging his dick in my daughters face, I'd have a problem with it, just as I would if he was swinging his dick in my son's face. No more, no less. You seem to be ok with one and not the other. That tells me you might like having a dick in your face.

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Jeffy, Jeffy, Jeffy, Jeffy, Jeff.

 

Your post are inane as someone else's.

 

 

Put your fear aside and understand this first concept, there is a huge difference between gender and sexuality.

I am well aware of the difference. But what you wake up one day and feel your gender is that day should in no way impact my privacy or my daughter's privacy to not shower in a shower room full of tranny dicks. If its important enough to feel the need to shower in the women's locker room, go have your cock removed. Simple as that.

And here yiu show your ignorance.

 

Trans isn't some impulse you decide on for the day like adoing a splash of color to your outfit with your scarf.

How does one determine a naked male in the locker room is a trans vs. A non trans?

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Why are you so enamored by it?

 

Your fascination is creepy.

 

 

Fascist/Fascination

 

Same root word? Interesting.

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I didn't see in the Bill of Rights the right to shower only with your own sex. Did they miss that?

I also don't see in the bill of rights to right to shower with members of the opposite sex if it makes them uncomfortable.

 

I actually look forward to the day if this kind of shit becomes the norm, i.e. the liberals force this shit on the schools - that the HS football jocks all decide to go shower in the girls locker room with the cheerleaders because they woke up that morning and felt their identity for that day was female. But then of course on Friday they decided to be make for the big football game. Hey if gender identity is that fluid and we have to accommodate everything, I say fucking go for it boys!

Its not that fluid, and you're coming across like a bigoted ignoramus in this discussion.

 

There is a reason the suicide rate among transsexuals is so high. And it's NOT because the can't make up their mind what gender they are. They know.

 

Quit pretending this is an issue of straight boys pretending to be girls or about sexuality or sex url orientation.

 

A trans-woman; a genetic male who gender identifies as female, is no more risk to a girl in the bathroom as a lesbian.

 

This is a non issue; trans people (quit using 'tranny' too, it's the wrong word. A transvestite is NOT a transsexual) have been using the bathrooms the ID with for years.

 

It's only recently that bigots lost the gay marriage battle and religious nutters that list the abortion battle (but are winning it back slowly via unconstitutional legislative subversion) deciDed to make another wedge issue to get the haters out to vote.

 

Don't fall for their bullshit.

Have trans boys been using girls locker rooms and showers at schools for years? I've only heard of one.

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How does one determine a naked male in the locker room is a trans vs. A non trans?

 

They tuck their package between their butt cheeks.

200_s.gif

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There is no issue of discrimination involved here. Everyone can potty. It's just you use the facilities which corresponds to your equipment. I don't see a problem with that.

That's because you never saw a potty law you didn't like. Always advocating for government solutions to non problems. That's the Nanny way.

It actually became a problem when the government got involved in the first place (forcing school aged girls to take their clothes off with a boy in their locker room).

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There is no issue of discrimination involved here. Everyone can potty. It's just you use the facilities which corresponds to your equipment. I don't see a problem with that.

That's because you never saw a potty law you didn't like. Always advocating for government solutions to non problems. That's the Nanny way.

It actually became a problem when the government got involved in the first place (forcing school aged girls to take their clothes off with a boy in their locker room).

 

Really? You have to make up shit to make your point? Nobody forced anyone to take their clothes off. Nobody. Stop lying.

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There is no issue of discrimination involved here. Everyone can potty. It's just you use the facilities which corresponds to your equipment. I don't see a problem with that.

That's because you never saw a potty law you didn't like. Always advocating for government solutions to non problems. That's the Nanny way.
Let's keep the federal gubmint out of our bathrooms.

But state "gubmint" should be in there checking genitalia? Careful, you might be accused of supporting a nanny government police state for such thoughts.

The other solution would be to let locals handle the issue their own way. Worked for many years.

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There is no issue of discrimination involved here. Everyone can potty. It's just you use the facilities which corresponds to your equipment. I don't see a problem with that.

 

That's because you never saw a potty law you didn't like. Always advocating for government solutions to non problems. That's the Nanny way.
Let's keep the federal gubmint out of our bathrooms.

But state "gubmint" should be in there checking genitalia? Careful, you might be accused of supporting a nanny government police state for such thoughts.

The other solution would be to let locals handle the issue their own way. Worked for many years.

Right up to 1964.

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I've noticed that neither specious ed nor anyone else has bothered to answer what should be done in my very real scenario above.

I would speculate that parents have had that concern for quite some time. This is not a new phenomenon that came about after 1/20/09 when some evil scientist went to work in a lab to cook up something that creation couldn't possibly fathom. Likewise it isn't some fad that kids decided to put themselves through because they wanted to be up on the latest trends. It's been going on for a good long while now. How many times has that scenario happened?

Great diversion. Do you not want to answer the question?

Just because you don't like the answer doesn't mean the question wasn't answered. Switch socks and come back again bitch.

Where do you answer the question?

 

I'm not a sock, nor do I have any socks but those which I wear on my feat.

 

Bitch? Whatever. I won't stoop to a sixteen year old mentality.

Yeah, that was uncalled for, I'm sorry.

 

I answered in post 44. Parents have faced that fear for as long as they have been sending kids out into the wild crazy world where not everybody looks, acts or identifies exactly as we do. This is not a new phenomenon, yet nobody can provide an example of the type of deviant misbehavior the question asks about. It's bullshit for bigots who want to pick on the weak kid.

 

Who is the 'weak kis' you are referring to?

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Bathrooms and showers are not about "association". Its about taking a shit or a shower with some modicum of privacy and dignity for some. As I said, I don't care. But I think some parents of some young children would care if it was their kid that had to be subjected to it.

 

Ed, tell you what - stop being your usual argumentative douchefuck self for a minute and answer me this question: at my sailing club we have two shower facilities - male and female. It gets HOT AS FUCK here when out on the water and not showering is really not an option after sailing. We have a very active youth sailing program here and even very young opti kids are using the shower rooms at the same time as the adults. The showers themselves are enclosed and private, but the changing room is not. So there are adults and kids showering and changing at the same time most weekends. How would YOU as a parent of say a 5 year old daughter or even a 13 yr old teen daughter feel about her changing and being naked right next to some adult dude who thinks he's a chick with his dick swinging in your daughter's face as he's drying his ballsack in front of her? That cool with you?

 

Serious question.

 

I've noticed that neither specious ed nor anyone else has bothered to answer what should be done in my very real scenario above.

Sorry, I was away all day. I'm really not ignoring you.

Do guys swing their dicks and dry their ball sacks in boys faces at your club? Why would you think a tranny would do the same to a girl?

You ever been in a crowded locker room?

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There is no issue of discrimination involved here. Everyone can potty. It's just you use the facilities which corresponds to your equipment. I don't see a problem with that.

That's because you never saw a potty law you didn't like. Always advocating for government solutions to non problems. That's the Nanny way.
Let's keep the federal gubmint out of our bathrooms.

But state "gubmint" should be in there checking genitalia? Careful, you might be accused of supporting a nanny government police state for such thoughts.

The other solution would be to let locals handle the issue their own way. Worked for many years.

 

If that's the case, the state "gumbmint" shouldn't have stepped in against a city ordinance. After all, what else is a city ordinance but the city "locals handling the issue their own way".

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Bathrooms and showers are not about "association". Its about taking a shit or a shower with some modicum of privacy and dignity for some. As I said, I don't care. But I think some parents of some young children would care if it was their kid that had to be subjected to it.

 

Ed, tell you what - stop being your usual argumentative douchefuck self for a minute and answer me this question: at my sailing club we have two shower facilities - male and female. It gets HOT AS FUCK here when out on the water and not showering is really not an option after sailing. We have a very active youth sailing program here and even very young opti kids are using the shower rooms at the same time as the adults. The showers themselves are enclosed and private, but the changing room is not. So there are adults and kids showering and changing at the same time most weekends. How would YOU as a parent of say a 5 year old daughter or even a 13 yr old teen daughter feel about her changing and being naked right next to some adult dude who thinks he's a chick with his dick swinging in your daughter's face as he's drying his ballsack in front of her? That cool with you?

 

Serious question.

I've noticed that neither specious ed nor anyone else has bothered to answer what should be done in my very real scenario above.

Sorry, I was away all day. I'm really not ignoring you.

Do guys swing their dicks and dry their ball sacks in boys faces at your club? Why would you think a tranny would do the same to a girl?

You ever been in a crowded locker room?

Does a steam bath count?

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Who wants this guy walking into your daughter's locker room? Be honest.

 

2cmptkz.jpg

You want this man in the same bathroom as your 12 year old boy?

 

tumblr_mjq8necswd1r93q1ho1_500.jpg

If that's a man wouldn't want him near ANY children.

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Sorry, but I am confused on a basic issue.

 

How is seeing a penis going to hurt young girls? If there is inappropriate contact, I'd be furious, but there is way too much internet access for the sight of a penis on a person who self identifies as female to cause injury.

 

Unless your daughter has been locked away without a phone or Internet all her life, it seems like much ado about nada. If you have a religious exception, I guess that would qualify, but I'm not sure which way the courts would rule.

 

I think many people are just intolerant of alternative lifestyles, and this is the issue du jour to get them excited to watch FOX and vote Republican. If bathrooms get you out to the polls, then their focus groups have worked.

Why is it illegal to whip your dick out in public? Maybe it should be legal only for those who say they are trans' or trannys as their dicks are apparently different from the rest.

 

What, exactly, is the difference between a trans' or Trannys dick? I've assumed all along they were the same as the rest.

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Why do you consider it a tragedy and horrendous if your daughter sees a dick? I'm having a hard time seeing the harm.

As said by some one else here - go use a Ladies locker room and shower. You'll see the harm.

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Why do you consider it a tragedy and horrendous if your daughter sees a dick? I'm having a hard time seeing the harm.

 

People feel more comfortable separating the sexes, that's why it has been a widely accepted practice for a very long time and across the globe. I'll ask you the question I asked PS...

Should we just have one big facility and everyone showers together?

I don't think the government should dictate it or protect you from seeing someone else's junk.

Flashing young children should be legal? That's kinda weird Special.

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What, exactly, is the difference between a trans' or Trannys dick? I've assumed all along they were the same as the rest.

 

They are the same as the rest. The laws about their genitalia being shown were the same as everyone else's until the nanny government decided to make a special exception about bathroom use based on one's genitals. Genitals being shown in a public park is verboten regardless of one's gender identity. Genitals being shown in a change room is not, regardless of gender identity.

 

You & NC are the ones that seem to think that their genitals have special powers. I don't.

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I don't expect a straight answer out of you, eddy - but what about you BJ? Do you think its cool? What about you razr or you Sol? A "girl's" hairy (or shaved) dick dangling next to your young daughter is all good?

 

I gave you an answer to your specious questions in the form of a clarifying question.

 

I don't accept your scenario that a tranny would dangle their balls in the face of girls. And even if they did, they would face the same justice as dangling their balls in the face of a boy.

I also don't accept your scenario that a girl seeing a dick will assault her anymore than a boy seeing a dick.

 

You are the one dodging the question.

Define 'in the face of'.

 

In sight of = 'in the face of' to me.

 

My dad took us to the YMCA when we were kids. When you're three and a half feet tall every swinging dick seemed like it was in your face.

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What, exactly, is the difference between a trans' or Trannys dick? I've assumed all along they were the same as the rest.

 

They are the same as the rest. The laws about their genitalia being shown were the same as everyone else's until the nanny government decided to make a special exception about bathroom use based on one's genitals. Genitals being shown in a public park is verboten regardless of one's gender identity. Genitals being shown in a change room is not, regardless of gender identity.

 

You & NC are the ones that seem to think that their genitals have special powers. I don't.

 

 

 

I think you need to read up on your laws before you comment on them

 

http://www.gendercentre.org.au/resources/fact-sheets/old/transgender-discrimination-your-rights.htm

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I didn't see in the Bill of Rights the right to shower only with your own sex. Did they miss that?

I also don't see in the bill of rights to right to shower with members of the opposite sex if it makes them uncomfortable.

 

I actually look forward to the day if this kind of shit becomes the norm, i.e. the liberals force this shit on the schools - that the HS football jocks all decide to go shower in the girls locker room with the cheerleaders because they woke up that morning and felt their identity for that day was female. But then of course on Friday they decided to be make for the big football game. Hey if gender identity is that fluid and we have to accommodate everything, I say fucking go for it boys!

Its not that fluid, and you're coming across like a bigoted ignoramus in this discussion.

 

There is a reason the suicide rate among transsexuals is so high. And it's NOT because the can't make up their mind what gender they are. They know.

 

Quit pretending this is an issue of straight boys pretending to be girls or about sexuality or sex url orientation.

 

A trans-woman; a genetic male who gender identifies as female, is no more risk to a girl in the bathroom as a lesbian.

 

This is a non issue; trans people (quit using 'tranny' too, it's the wrong word. A transvestite is NOT a transsexual) have been using the bathrooms the ID with for years.

 

It's only recently that bigots lost the gay marriage battle and religious nutters that list the abortion battle (but are winning it back slowly via unconstitutional legislative subversion) deciDed to make another wedge issue to get the haters out to vote.

 

Don't fall for their bullshit.

 

 

I am being a bit glib, BJ. Don't be so humorless. But I think there is a bit of fluidity in some trans folks. Bruce may have struggled with it for his whole life, but overnight he decided to come out as a woman. Same with Bradley manning who suddenly decided to become Chelsea overnight while in jail.

 

Regardless if they know their whole life or not or woke up one morning and decided to be a chick - that is irrelevant to the discussion. The discussion is if its appropriate for the genitals of a male to be on display in a girls locker room or vice versa? I personally have no issue with it either way, but as Len said - I don't think most of America is ready for it and this sudden push by the trans/queeer community is going to backfire on them.

 

This wedge issue was driven in by the LGBT side, not by the other side. As has been stated, accommodations have been made and attempted by schools and other facilities but were deemed not good enough. Rather than accept the accommodation for the tiny % of trans/queers, instead they want the rest of the population to conform to their needs. I think you have fell for their bullshit, personally.

 

 

Glibness doesn't help the discussion, because the fucktards that are driving this actually think that way.

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What, exactly, is the difference between a trans' or Trannys dick? I've assumed all along they were the same as the rest.

 

They are the same as the rest. The laws about their genitalia being shown were the same as everyone else's until the nanny government decided to make a special exception about bathroom use based on one's genitals. Genitals being shown in a public park is verboten regardless of one's gender identity. Genitals being shown in a change room is not, regardless of gender identity.

 

You & NC are the ones that seem to think that their genitals have special powers. I don't.

 

 

I think you need to read up on your laws before you comment on them

 

http://www.gendercentre.org.au/resources/fact-sheets/old/transgender-discrimination-your-rights.htm

 

Please point to where in your link the genitals give people special powers. Take your time, you might actually have to read your source for once ;)

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What, exactly, is the difference between a trans' or Trannys dick? I've assumed all along they were the same as the rest.

 

They are the same as the rest. The laws about their genitalia being shown were the same as everyone else's until the nanny government decided to make a special exception about bathroom use based on one's genitals. Genitals being shown in a public park is verboten regardless of one's gender identity. Genitals being shown in a change room is not, regardless of gender identity.

 

You & NC are the ones that seem to think that their genitals have special powers. I don't.

 

 

I think you need to read up on your laws before you comment on them

 

http://www.gendercentre.org.au/resources/fact-sheets/old/transgender-discrimination-your-rights.htm

 

Please point to where in your link the genitals give people special powers. Take your time, you might actually have to read your source for once ;)

 

 

 

dont give a fuck about duh laws in "you're" country.

 

You should find some sort of hobby. might do u sum sum good

start here

http://www.artofmanliness.com/2016/01/25/the-ultimate-list-of-hobbies-for-men-75-ideas-for-your-free-time/

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edit: Jeff, your chain has been yanked, and yanked hard, by the Daily Outrage Machine

 

 

NO actually it hasn't. I haven't seen a single fox news, CNN, drudge, breitbart, etc article on this subject. Unless you think NPR and PBS are "the outrage machine". I think for myself. Also, I am not outraged in the least. I will never have to be faced with this as my daughter is grown. I, however, was just thinking that as a parent - how I would I feel about this in a very real situation and I look at all the parents around me at the sailing club with small children I just think it would not go down well. Maybe I'm over-assuming it would bother them, I dunno.

 

I steadfastly maintain that this is actually a manufactured wedge issue by the LGBT side. Primarily the T's, because all the others got their win and the T's feel left out. So I believe they are pushing this thinking the mood of the country has swung after the gay marriage wins. I think they are wrong. The current status quo was working fine wrt to which bathroom you shit in or showered in and the very tiny few who were affected were reasonably accommodated.

 

Yes, NC WAAY over-reacted to the Charlotte ordinance. But I think the sentiment in NC more accurately reflects the current mood of the country about this issue than the T's think. I think they will regret poking the sleeping bear.....

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I asked my oldest girl what she thought. "They can use the disabled bathroom"

 

We laughed.

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My dad took us to the YMCA when we were kids. When you're three and a half feet tall every swinging dick seemed like it was in your face.

 

 

My dad never took me places where other men's cocks were swung into my face.

 

Still I turned out OK.

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dont give a fuck about duh laws in "you're" country.

 

And yet you keep bringing them up when they aren't relevant to what I say. Odd.

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edit: Jeff, your chain has been yanked, and yanked hard, by the Daily Outrage Machine

 

 

NO actually it hasn't. I haven't seen a single fox news, CNN, drudge, breitbart, etc article on this subject. Unless you think NPR and PBS are "the outrage machine". I think for myself. Also, I am not outraged in the least. I will never have to be faced with this as my daughter is grown. I, however, was just thinking that as a parent - how I would I feel about this in a very real situation and I look at all the parents around me at the sailing club with small children I just think it would not go down well. Maybe I'm over-assuming it would bother them, I dunno.

 

I steadfastly maintain that this is actually a manufactured wedge issue by the LGBT side. Primarily the T's, because all the others got their win and the T's feel left out. So I believe they are pushing this thinking the mood of the country has swung after the gay marriage wins. I think they are wrong. The current status quo was working fine wrt to which bathroom you shit in or showered in and the very tiny few who were affected were reasonably accommodated.

 

Yes, NC WAAY over-reacted to the Charlotte ordinance. But I think the sentiment in NC more accurately reflects the current mood of the country about this issue than the T's think. I think they will regret poking the sleeping bear.....

 

So if I understand you correctly, you think the LGBT activists created this as a wedge issue even though it was NC that over-reacted to a city ordinance. How the fuck does that work?

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edit: Jeff, your chain has been yanked, and yanked hard, by the Daily Outrage Machine

 

 

NO actually it hasn't. I haven't seen a single fox news, CNN, drudge, breitbart, etc article on this subject. Unless you think NPR and PBS are "the outrage machine". I think for myself. Also, I am not outraged in the least. I will never have to be faced with this as my daughter is grown. I, however, was just thinking that as a parent - how I would I feel about this in a very real situation and I look at all the parents around me at the sailing club with small children I just think it would not go down well. Maybe I'm over-assuming it would bother them, I dunno.

 

I steadfastly maintain that this is actually a manufactured wedge issue by the LGBT side. Primarily the T's, because all the others got their win and the T's feel left out. So I believe they are pushing this thinking the mood of the country has swung after the gay marriage wins. I think they are wrong. The current status quo was working fine wrt to which bathroom you shit in or showered in and the very tiny few who were affected were reasonably accommodated.

 

Yes, NC WAAY over-reacted to the Charlotte ordinance. But I think the sentiment in NC more accurately reflects the current mood of the country about this issue than the T's think. I think they will regret poking the sleeping bear.....

 

So if I understand you correctly, you think the LGBT activists created this as a wedge issue even though it was NC that over-reacted to a city ordinance. How the fuck does that work?

 

 

Because the city ordinance was not required in the first place. What problem were they trying to correct?

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edit: Jeff, your chain has been yanked, and yanked hard, by the Daily Outrage Machine

 

 

NO actually it hasn't. I haven't seen a single fox news, CNN, drudge, breitbart, etc article on this subject. Unless you think NPR and PBS are "the outrage machine". I think for myself. Also, I am not outraged in the least. I will never have to be faced with this as my daughter is grown. I, however, was just thinking that as a parent - how I would I feel about this in a very real situation and I look at all the parents around me at the sailing club with small children I just think it would not go down well. Maybe I'm over-assuming it would bother them, I dunno.

 

I steadfastly maintain that this is actually a manufactured wedge issue by the LGBT side. Primarily the T's, because all the others got their win and the T's feel left out. So I believe they are pushing this thinking the mood of the country has swung after the gay marriage wins. I think they are wrong. The current status quo was working fine wrt to which bathroom you shit in or showered in and the very tiny few who were affected were reasonably accommodated.

 

Yes, NC WAAY over-reacted to the Charlotte ordinance. But I think the sentiment in NC more accurately reflects the current mood of the country about this issue than the T's think. I think they will regret poking the sleeping bear.....

 

So if I understand you correctly, you think the LGBT activists created this as a wedge issue even though it was NC that over-reacted to a city ordinance. How the fuck does that work?

 

 

Because the city ordinance was not required in the first place. What problem were they trying to correct?

 

Have you actually read the city ordinance in question? It was passed to prevent business discrimination against LGBT persons. The problem they were trying to correct was the fact that businesses can & do discriminate against persons of that persuasion.

 

As the ordinance was passed in a 7 - 4 vote, the persons voting on it were not LGBT (at least publicly), and the issue was settled as far as the city council was concerned - I still don't see how this is a wedge issue created by the LGBT activists. The vote was already in and the result soon to be nothing more than "locals dealing with a local issue the way they saw fit"... until the Republicans in the state legislature decided to make an issue of it.

 

You seem to be approaching the bathroom issue reasonably well for someone that disagrees with the decision Charlotte made... but blaming the creation of a political wedge issue on the LGBT folks who had already accomplished what they wanted (the ordinance passed) is ridiculous.

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edit: Jeff, your chain has been yanked, and yanked hard, by the Daily Outrage Machine

 

 

NO actually it hasn't. I haven't seen a single fox news, CNN, drudge, breitbart, etc article on this subject. Unless you think NPR and PBS are "the outrage machine". I think for myself. Also, I am not outraged in the least. I will never have to be faced with this as my daughter is grown. I, however, was just thinking that as a parent - how I would I feel about this in a very real situation and I look at all the parents around me at the sailing club with small children I just think it would not go down well. Maybe I'm over-assuming it would bother them, I dunno.

 

I steadfastly maintain that this is actually a manufactured wedge issue by the LGBT side. Primarily the T's, because all the others got their win and the T's feel left out. So I believe they are pushing this thinking the mood of the country has swung after the gay marriage wins. I think they are wrong. The current status quo was working fine wrt to which bathroom you shit in or showered in and the very tiny few who were affected were reasonably accommodated.

 

Yes, NC WAAY over-reacted to the Charlotte ordinance. But I think the sentiment in NC more accurately reflects the current mood of the country about this issue than the T's think. I think they will regret poking the sleeping bear.....

 

So if I understand you correctly, you think the LGBT activists created this as a wedge issue even though it was NC that over-reacted to a city ordinance. How the fuck does that work?

 

 

Because the city ordinance was not required in the first place. What problem were they trying to correct?

 

Have you actually read the city ordinance in question? It was passed to prevent business discrimination against LGBT persons. The problem they were trying to correct was the fact that businesses can & do discriminate against persons of that persuasion.

 

As the ordinance was passed in a 7 - 4 vote, the persons voting on it were not LGBT (at least publicly), and the issue was settled as far as the city council was concerned - I still don't see how this is a wedge issue created by the LGBT activists. The vote was already in and the result soon to be nothing more than "locals dealing with a local issue the way they saw fit"... until the Republicans in the state legislature decided to make an issue of it.

 

You seem to be approaching the bathroom issue reasonably well for someone that disagrees with the decision Charlotte made... but blaming the creation of a political wedge issue on the LGBT folks who had already accomplished what they wanted (the ordinance passed) is ridiculous.

 

 

Do you have a cite that businesses in CLT WERE indeed discriminating against trannies? Because razr, Sol and others seem to think that there is no point of a law unless something is actually happening in great numbers to warrant it. I don't recall anything like that going on in CLT, so it seems that they manufactured an issue to pass an ordinance against that wasn't an issue. Who created this wedge?

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I posted the link earlier, I think in this thread, to the site discussing addition of gender identity and expression and sexual preference to the Charlotte non discrimination ordinance, and the reason it is needed.

 

As to the local solution question, the school locker room aspect of this is certainly best solved at the local level, rather than by a group of paid whores in the legislature. Schools prepare individualized education plans every damn day, to accommodate kids. They are in the best position to know the child and accommodate the child's needs without ostracizing the kid.

 

The larger concept of non discrimination lends itself to a statewide solution. NC and Liberty Counsel get this backwards, naturally, with a statewide solution to a local issue. And now it will be a national answer.

 

The Court will not be kind to this foolishness. They must be getting tired of people still having to ask them for their basic civil rights, methinks.

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So if I understand you correctly, you think the LGBT activists created this as a wedge issue even though it was NC that over-reacted to a city ordinance. How the fuck does that work?

 

 

Because the city ordinance was not required in the first place. What problem were they trying to correct?

 

Have you actually read the city ordinance in question? It was passed to prevent business discrimination against LGBT persons. The problem they were trying to correct was the fact that businesses can & do discriminate against persons of that persuasion.

 

As the ordinance was passed in a 7 - 4 vote, the persons voting on it were not LGBT (at least publicly), and the issue was settled as far as the city council was concerned - I still don't see how this is a wedge issue created by the LGBT activists. The vote was already in and the result soon to be nothing more than "locals dealing with a local issue the way they saw fit"... until the Republicans in the state legislature decided to make an issue of it.

 

You seem to be approaching the bathroom issue reasonably well for someone that disagrees with the decision Charlotte made... but blaming the creation of a political wedge issue on the LGBT folks who had already accomplished what they wanted (the ordinance passed) is ridiculous.

 

 

Do you have a cite that businesses in CLT WERE indeed discriminating against trannies? Because razr, Sol and others seem to think that there is no point of a law unless something is actually happening in great numbers to warrant it. I don't recall anything like that going on in CLT, so it seems that they manufactured an issue to pass an ordinance against that wasn't an issue. Who created this wedge?

 

 

In 2015 the same ordinance came to a vote in Charlotte. Duiring discussion, it was obvious that the ordinance would pass if the bathroom provision were eliminated. The revised ordinance was rejected by the LGBT friendly precisely because it did not include the bathroom wording.

 

MeckPAC then campaigned on it and two sitting councilmen were replaced and the bathroom wording was included when the ordinance was passed.

 

It looks like two things went on here and one was to get a couple of councilors replaced in town and the other to get some attention for a non-existent problem.

 

In spite of repeated requests, nobody has shown any evidence of a problem in Charlotte. NC does seem to have an indecent exposure problem though. Maybe this is the beginning of demands for a 'flashers charter'. Flashers need a safe space, you know.

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edit: Jeff, your chain has been yanked, and yanked hard, by the Daily Outrage Machine

 

 

NO actually it hasn't. I haven't seen a single fox news, CNN, drudge, breitbart, etc article on this subject. Unless you think NPR and PBS are "the outrage machine". I think for myself. Also, I am not outraged in the least. I will never have to be faced with this as my daughter is grown. I, however, was just thinking that as a parent - how I would I feel about this in a very real situation and I look at all the parents around me at the sailing club with small children I just think it would not go down well. Maybe I'm over-assuming it would bother them, I dunno.

 

I steadfastly maintain that this is actually a manufactured wedge issue by the LGBT side. Primarily the T's, because all the others got their win and the T's feel left out. So I believe they are pushing this thinking the mood of the country has swung after the gay marriage wins. I think they are wrong. The current status quo was working fine wrt to which bathroom you shit in or showered in and the very tiny few who were affected were reasonably accommodated.

 

Yes, NC WAAY over-reacted to the Charlotte ordinance. But I think the sentiment in NC more accurately reflects the current mood of the country about this issue than the T's think. I think they will regret poking the sleeping bear.....

 

Perhaps among our generation but the kids I talk to don't really care. When I asked about the locker room issue, they just looked at each other and shrugged. It's a non-issue. For all the other problems these kids deal with, it's really heartening tohear their attitudes toward race, gender and sexuality. We may live to see a time where people won't scream at each other over these issues.

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Do you have a cite that businesses in CLT WERE indeed discriminating against trannies? Because razr, Sol and others seem to think that there is no point of a law unless something is actually happening in great numbers to warrant it.

 

That's great; and when *I* argue that in justice must be happening "in great numbers" before justifying a law, I'll be sure to provide examples of such. I'm not someone that thinks things need to be out of hand before addressing an issue.

 

I don't recall anything like that going on in CLT, so it seems that they manufactured an issue to pass an ordinance against that wasn't an issue.

 

Your recollection is not necessary. During the debate, the advocates claimed to have recorded over 140 incidents of discrimination based on LGBT status. I don't see any reason to believe they're lying about something they could be called on and have their ordinance advocacy shown as a sham.

 

Are you claiming them to have lied about the matter?

 

Who created this wedge?

On all available evidence, that would be the Republican State legislature that couldn't stand the locals dealing with their local issues. After all, if local Charlotte residents wanted the ordinance changed, they can avail themselves of the democractic powers invested in them as residents of the city, vote out the council members they don't agree with and vote in the ones they do. Instead, the state "gubmint" has decided that locals aren't qualified to do that. Funny how small government is a good thing for right-wingers right up until the social issues they don't like become acceptable to the public. :rolleyes:

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My dad took us to the YMCA when we were kids. When you're three and a half feet tall every swinging dick seemed like it was in your face.

 

My dad never took me places where other men's cocks were swung into my face.

 

Still I turned out OK.

YMCA was a great disco hit in the 70s.

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edit: Jeff, your chain has been yanked, and yanked hard, by the Daily Outrage Machine

 

NO actually it hasn't. I haven't seen a single fox news, CNN, drudge, breitbart, etc article on this subject. Unless you think NPR and PBS are "the outrage machine". I think for myself. Also, I am not outraged in the least. I will never have to be faced with this as my daughter is grown. I, however, was just thinking that as a parent - how I would I feel about this in a very real situation and I look at all the parents around me at the sailing club with small children I just think it would not go down well. Maybe I'm over-assuming it would bother them, I dunno.

 

I steadfastly maintain that this is actually a manufactured wedge issue by the LGBT side. Primarily the T's, because all the others got their win and the T's feel left out. So I believe they are pushing this thinking the mood of the country has swung after the gay marriage wins. I think they are wrong. The current status quo was working fine wrt to which bathroom you shit in or showered in and the very tiny few who were affected were reasonably accommodated.

 

Yes, NC WAAY over-reacted to the Charlotte ordinance. But I think the sentiment in NC more accurately reflects the current mood of the country about this issue than the T's think. I think they will regret poking the sleeping bear.....

 

Perhaps among our generation but the kids I talk to don't really care. When I asked about the locker room issue, they just looked at each other and shrugged. It's a non-issue. For all the other problems these kids deal with, it's really heartening tohear their attitudes toward race, gender and sexuality. We may live to see a time where people won't scream at each other over these issues.That would be nice. It would seem that we are running out of groups to treat differently, but then I look at the campaign and see lots of new ways to divide the country. Let's hope the next generation is indeed smart enough not to fall for the wedge issues.

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Why stop with bathrooms. Where does this nonsense end?

 

How about sports? What is to prevent a biological male from claiming female identity now and competing in a women's sport? Tennis anyone?

 

59029.jpg

 

pearl-harbor.jpg

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Why do you consider it a tragedy and horrendous if your daughter sees a dick? I'm having a hard time seeing the harm.

People feel more comfortable separating the sexes, that's why it has been a widely accepted practice for a very long time and across the globe. I'll ask you the question I asked PS...

Should we just have one big facility and everyone showers together?

I don't think the government should dictate it or protect you from seeing someone else's junk.

Flashing young children should be legal? That's kinda weird Special.

 

Drying off your package is now considered flashing? Should this flashing be banned in all locker rooms? You really are stretching to find something to be outraged by.

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Why stop with bathrooms. Where does this nonsense end?

 

How about sports? What is to prevent a biological male from claiming female identity now and competing in a women's sport? Tennis anyone?

 

59029.jpg

 

pearl-harbor.jpg

 

The Charlotte non discrimination ordinance is not just about bathrooms. Folks just chose to focus on bathrooms for some reason.

 

Ever hear of Klinefelder's Syndrome, Doc? 1 in every 500 births.

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Why stop with bathrooms. Where does this nonsense end?

 

How about sports? What is to prevent a biological male from claiming female identity now and competing in a women's sport? Tennis anyone?

 

59029.jpg

 

pearl-harbor.jpg

 

The Charlotte non discrimination ordinance is not just about bathrooms. Folks just chose to focus on bathrooms for some reason.

 

Ever hear of Klinefelder's Syndrome, Doc? 1 in every 500 births.

 

 

 

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Sol, you sorta ignored his question. Should males that self-ID as females be allowed to play women's sports in HS, college, or the Olympics?

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Sol, you sorta ignored his question. Should males that self-ID as females be allowed to play women's sports in HS, college, or the Olympics?

 

Is this related to the topic because transgender women might have a competitive edge in using the bathroom?

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On all available evidence, that would be the Republican State legislature that couldn't stand the locals dealing with their local issues. After all, if local Charlotte residents wanted the ordinance changed, they can avail themselves of the democractic powers invested in them as residents of the city, vote out the council members they don't agree with and vote in the ones they do. Instead, the state "gubmint" has decided that locals aren't qualified to do that. Funny how small government is a good thing for right-wingers right up until the social issues they don't like become acceptable to the public. :rolleyes:

 

This is a fair point. I do generally favor more local control and would prefer locals to respond to a city council passing a law to address what the leftists here argue is a non-existent problem. And now the federal gubmit has decided that state officials aren't qualified so they want to stick their noses into it too.

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Sol, you sorta ignored his question. Should males that self-ID as females be allowed to play women's sports in HS, college, or the Olympics?

Tell you what. I'[ll go back and waste time with whatever you are on about now, if you will answer the one I've been asking about. Or is answering questions only a one way street?

 

How many times have we had the problem of dangly girl dicks swinging free in little girls' locker rooms?

 

 

Edit. I see. I only answered the first one, and not the change of topic. Biological males are males. My question about Klinefelder's addresses the false notion that chromosomal gender is binary. It is not. You should read up on it, as should Dr. Nanny.

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Sol, you sorta ignored his question. Should males that self-ID as females be allowed to play women's sports in HS, college, or the Olympics?

 

Is this related to the topic because transgender women might have a competitive edge in using the bathroom?

 

 

Yeah, I think so. We've gotten to the point in this discussion where the trenches have been dug and no one is moving on this issue. A legitimate question was raised about where then do you draw the line? Trannies want to be treated equally and have access to everything they "self-ID wit